Thread 280229682

why can't anime studios handdraw moving cars anymore?
It's always CGI

>>280229682 (OP)
The answer is always the same
>time constrains (bad production organisation)
>lack of talent
Animation is a specialized craft; there are animators who jut draw special effect and if you need a good special effect animator for one episode and nobody among those are available? You'll have to make up and use anything else, either CGI or some lesser (shittier) outsourced third rater
Cars are under mecha animation and there are very few 2D mecha animators nowadays
Also
You're making an anime and something goes wrong in the production and now you're lacking time/staff due to a sudden change in the script/broadcast? You better make up in some way (read above)

First post pretty much covered it. Can we just post cool car animation now?

>>280229682 (OP)
why draw something by hand that doesnt flex or deform

I remember when ninja kamui was airing an anon said it should be anime of the year because the cars didn't look like cgi

>>280229967
An animated car can flex and deform

>>280230382
Everything in reality flexes and deform under stress because that's how matter works, and animation (good animation) exaggerates reality's physics for the sake visual clarity and expression
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkB81u5IM3I&ab_channel=MarkHaycock

With the exception of lupin gunsmith cats you're under arrest they never drew moving cars
The cars were static with a moving background

Initial D was cool with the cg car gimmick I won't complain too much. It made the cars stand out

The best looking race was still the rainy day race where they had hand drawn scenes tho
https://youtu.be/uSEvCUSAxdI?si=6qiSYoR43shFUE2a

>>280229889
based scholar

The answer is mostly economics. Even though it's dirt cheap to animate cars, it's even cheaper to make a single render of the hero car and move it around on screen

The issue is that hand drawing is expensive and you need to justify the expense (since this is a business).
Furthermore there's things that are easy to cg animate, like cars, and things that are hard to animate (like putting on a t shirt).

Stands to reason a studio would rather make hand drawn characters because these deform and it reduces the animators strain while opening up freedom of possibilities in posing characters, while rigid objects will be cg almost 100% of the time

These days they could use AI cg filters to make the cg car look more hand drawn

>>280230562
This is so false I'm flabbergasted nobody has yet called you a retard
https://youtu.be/Onl928Qc1Y0?si=M2t-PRcUngHUk49b&t=1067

>>280230725
>hand drawing is expensive
Making a decent CGI model and working around it with the compositing etc is much more expensive than hadn drawing the same scene
But a good CGI model can be made (or bought) in a couple of days while you may need two months to animate the same scene by hand
If all anime were made with zero CGI they would cost a less than half, but it's impossibile to have that kind of production with the sheer amount of anime produced, there just aren't enough people around to animate decently, so expensive CGI will use, which will inflate the cost of production, which will make production more controlled and harder to micromanage
If anime production dropped to 1/10 of what we have today CGI would disappear

I don't have much issue with CGI use, but the camera work for some of these fast driving scene always made it look awkward. They just don't know how to hold the camera still to capture the action on a wide shot. It's always zoomed in and out, swing unnecessarily. Also the weight of the movement is always off.

>>280231316
What I'm saying is that you only need to make a model once. After the initial investment it's very cheap, which is why car centric shows use cg

>>280229682 (OP)
Same reason they don't draw horses (god have mercy on Steel Ball Run).

Moving car are actually hard to draw on model.

>>280229682 (OP)
I believe in Shirobako there was a part where there was conflict about if a scene should be done in 2D or 3D and you had a die hard 2D chad who (correctly) believed that everything would be better if done in 2D, but he was ultimately swayed with the argument that there passionate people who want to make anime but can't draw for shit but they can do 3D.
So the reason why they use 3D is even though 2D might be better is about resource management, if you can fill certain gaps and get 'good enough' results with 3D animators that lets you spend your limited 2D animators in better places.

>>280229682 (OP)
The only anime i can think of that had hand draw moving cars was Gunsmith Cats so i dont know what you mean by
>anymore

Even Initial D had extreme amounts of hideous CGI

Someone post multiple gifs or webms of handrawn cars actually animating that is neither doing looney tunes shit nor is a movie or financial failure like Redline, and do it without searching sakugabooru, otherwise OP is talking shit.

>>280229682 (OP)
The only benefit* of hand draw solid objects is that unstable look, so it has a little sense if it's not an intentional style. Also printed cg renders in were used 99%

>>280229682 (OP)
it's not that they "can't", but "don't want to"
look at the camera movement, even though the direction is all shit, this is the stuff they want to.
Doing stuff like that in handdrawn is simply not feasible

>>280232535
>without searching sakugabooru
???
Where do you think I download the webms from, Twitter?

>>280232569
>The only benefit* of hand draw solid objects is that unstable look
This might be the most retarded statement on /a/ today

>>280229682 (OP)
because no one is interested in drawing mechanics

>>280232646
>1 second of animation
>7 seconds of still frames
>>280232691
>looney tunes action
>sliding static frames

>>280232675
Well, the award of most assblasted reply of the day goes to you, didn't see so much of pathetic arrogance of pseuds since forum days

>>280232724
Ooh you wanna play with me?

>>280232675
he's right in a way you know
although i would hardly call that the only positive aspect of hand drawn

>>280232791
>47 frames of a scooter spread across 3 seperate shots with the vehicle out of frame half the time with the focus on character animation all the time
>also not a car

>>280232831
>he's right in a way you know
>The only benefit of drawing something by hand is that it looks unstable
???
Please explain to me

>>280232846
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHGDGLMpXAg&ab_channel=BlazebeatRacing

>>280232895
Yeah, Gunsmith Cats has been pointed out by the thread of being the only real example of this, and is therefore not the trend implied by OP. Also only really possible when there are only 3 25 minute episodes total over 6 months devoted to each installment with a movie budget.

>>280229682 (OP)
Mecha is pretty much ruined

>>280232978
>Also only really possible when there are only 3 25 minute episodes total over 6 months devoted to each installment with a movie budget.
A thing that takes weeks or months to animate cannot be made in a weekly TV production?
Wow what a surprise

>>280233017
now this is a real issue
CGI gundam is so fucking ugly

>>280231318
This seems to be a basic problem whenever CGI is used (not just driving scenes), especially with certain studios like Toei. The moment they have a CGI scene they can't resist rotating the camera around just because they can.

>>280232978
You didn't watch Ghost in the Shell 1995?

I still can't believe they put this much effort in a gag in the middle of a CGI mecha show

>>280233300
For some reason he excludes movies and is very specific about the kind of car animation he wants
(it's just moving goalposts)

>>280232864
The subtle frame-to-frame inconsistencies of form and outline caused by human error are not present in CGI mecha, as a result the latter tend to feel too stiff and "perfect"

>>280233389
Watch Majestic Prince

>>280233389
Aah, okay, now I get what he was alluding to, and I can agree, even if calling that THE ONLY BENEFIT of hand drawn animation is absurd

>>280233455
tendou-ke no metsubou made

>>280229682 (OP)
>why can't anime studios handdraw moving cars anymore?
They can but it's very time consuming. Any mechanical things are time consuming to draw the more realistic they are. One mistake and your car, robot or jet will look like quality. You must obey perspective rules very accurately. With humans you don't notice distortion. It's why 2d mechs in TV shows looks more human like and stylized. Same for planes in old anime. In old movies when it was golden age for showing off animation skill and sell VHS some studios can afford to draw great mechanical animations you see on webms reposted up to this day

>>280230562
even old mecha shows like Zeta just panned their background and reused animations, it's easy to draw cars but it is a pain to correct them

>>280233341
>excludes movies
And he's right for this because saying
>movies and ova have higher production values than tv broadcasts!
is not much of an argument

>>280233802
It's not production vales in themselves, it's time and a less strict management
You can give weeks or months to a specialized animators for a solo work scene for a movie or an ova, that kind of luxury is an extreme rarity for TV broadcasts

>>280232535
I've got just the thing!

>>280233929
This is the golden age of car animation OP would have you believe.

>>280229682 (OP)
What's wrong with it?

>>280233929
Even the transformers G1 cartoon has better cars. A toy commercial!

>>280229682 (OP)
Because the SOUL and the PASSION for the CRAFT is gone, nobody is doing ART anymore, all they care about MONEY. Fuck CAPITALISM and the WEST

>>280231597
>passionate people who want to make anime but can't draw for shit
then they should take their passion elsewhere.

>>280229682 (OP)
The industry is filled with talentless hacks.
>b-but muh sakuga!
Flashing lights and colors with excessive amounts of post processing and the spliced in 3 frames of animation every other 2 seconds is not impressive.

Because most of the time they look terrible. Look at Spirited Away's A4

>>280229682 (OP)
because it's difficult and tedious even if you're an expert at it
hope this answers your question

>>280229682 (OP)
Do they make more money hand drawing cars? Would more people watch? I don't think so. No one dropped an anime because of CGI cars

>>280236087
>No one dropped an anime because of CGI cars
I did and I could have paid more than all of slop consumers combined
They're missing out

>>280236314
>I did
You're not Japanese and you don't buy BD.

>>280235824
retad
rd

>>280229929
You mean the 5 whole examples?

>>280237020
I'm from Saudi Arabia

>>280229682 (OP)
watch more anime

>>280239604
is someone gonna tell him?

>>280229889
>now you're lacking time/staff due to a sudden change in the script/broadcast?
Why would there be a change in the script when we're just animating?

>>280232724
>back then animators could casually draw cars even for short scenes of no importance
>now they can't

>>280229682 (OP)
making that same shot hand drawn would have been ridicolously expensive, there's a reason western animation has basically moved fully to 3D and japan will soon follow once cel shaded anime style is better looking (studio orange is pretty close)

>>280229682 (OP)
>is that... 1 second of CG???
>AYEEEEEEEEEE

>>280243837
>cel shaded anime style
What is that?

>>280242973
>Why would there be a change in the script when we're just animating?
Because now you can't make a scene work and you may have to write it out.