DB is the worst written show ever.
>bad guy shows up
>unlock new transformation to beat him
>repeat infinitely
>ton of power scaling inconsistencies
For example here is what raditz could do. First form frieza could blow up planets without breaking a sweat. Power scaling nerds have determined mecha frieza is literally over a thousand time stronger than his first form. By the time buu saga comes around they should be blowing up the planet accidentally. Yet their stay blasts barely kick up dust like a grenade.

>a show about fighting stronger enemies has too much stronger enemies
animetard having shit opinions again
keep your tranime plots to yourself animetard

NAH, not a joke, it's not the worst written, at least they give you clues about the transformations.
the super saiyan since the first saga they give us to understand that there is a legend of a supposed super saiyan who defeats frieza, in the cell saga when goku and gohan went to the time room goku planted the idea that the super saiyan could be surpassed despite the fact that the only one who could do it is his son gohan, in the buu saga there I have no way to defend phase 3 more than that he spent 7 years training it would be very disappointing if he did not reach a new transformation, although not even phase 3 was enough to defeat him.

In the battle of the gods from the first minute of the movie we are told that there is a supposed Saiyan god that, surprisingly, not even with that transformation could Bills be defeated XD, Frieza's resurrection is the same story, in the universe tournament there was no new transformation and the Kaioken x20 is not canon.

Black Saga also had no transformation and they couldn't even defeat Zamasu, Zeno had to intervene to solve it, in the tournament of power in this case it's not a transformation it's a state, Migatte no Gokui that or gosh, not even with that could defeat Jiren, Frieza and Goku had to sacrifice themselves for the team, and they couldn't defeat Moro and Granola with their new phases either xd

>>281155328 (OP)
DBZ*
Dragon Ball is amazing.

>>281155328 (OP)
You're absolutely right that the feats hardly match what the series tells you to believe. Roshi blew up a mountain in his introduction, and the whole moon not much later.
But I'll try to excuse it anyway: Powerlevel scouter values were programmed to display in logarithmic scale because Freeza wanted to stoke his ego and scare his underlings with a bigger number. Really the change from 1,000 to 100,000 is the same as the difference between 10,000 and 1,000,000

>>281155328 (OP)

>>281155328 (OP)
you and this whole anime community is so retard its unreal
power in dragon ball is vague and on top of that they can control their power these two things are enough to understand that power can be both destroying planet and just toying with enemie
holy shit you are so lack of imagination
you probably need everything explained through words

>>281156245
real, they cant leave things unexplained

>>281155328 (OP)
>pillaf...barely a transformation as it is entirely uncontrollable and never used again
>red ribbon...no new transformation
>piccolo...no new transformation
>piccolo jr...no new transformation
>raditz...no new transformation
>countless mini bosses and fodder of freeza...no new transformation
oh hey, freeza himself, finally transformation
>cyborgs and robots...no new transformation
oh hey, cell too, look at that, we got 2, we're on a roll
>buu...only new transformation is entirely useless
but hey, I guess 2 is the same as "repeat infinitely"

>>281155328 (OP)
I'd forgive it for being bad if I didn't have to see people worshipping it every day of my life.

it went stupid after Goku unlocked Super Saiyan. both the saiyan saga and demon king piccolo sagas were well written. namek was well written until it wasn't.

>>281155328 (OP)
>someone tries to criticize Dragon Ball
>they just sound like an illiterate moron that barely remembers what happened in it
Why is this so common? It's a simple show, far from flawless, but it's very rare for me to see any criticism worth reading.

>>281155328 (OP)
>DB is the worst written show ever.

Dragon Ball is great. Dragon Ball Z has hiccups.
The thing with DBZ though is that it has all the content, material, and setting, to be really great. People love the Saiyans, they love the Androids, Cell, Frieza, Namekians, but they also love all the stuff from DB like the Red Ribbon Army, the Demons, the focus on martial arts, magic, techniques, fuckin' Tao Pai Pai.

I think if you scaled back everything in Dragon Ball Z, gave more of the supporting cast power ups and shit to do, and rearranged most of the arcs, you'd have something spectacular.
Maybe something like Raditz Arc < Training Gap < Saiyan Arc < 1st Android Saga < Garlic Jr < Frieza < Tournament Gap < 2nd Android Saga & Cell < Majin Buu < Other World Tournament/Adult Gohan Gap < Perfect Cell

>>281156245
You are retarded.
If you fire off a full power blast to destroy your enemy that is close in power to you, but he dodges - then that blast, if it hits a planets and you are planet buster+ should destroy the planet

Every excuse you spout is nothing more than senseless cope. Even if you could control the power of your blaster AFTER you fired it, if the one who fired it is an evil villain who doesn't give a s** about Earth, why would he dial it down?

TLDR - shows like DBZ are garbage and so is the fanbase

>>281156960
>people love

You mean "Some stupid people love.."
It's a silly kids show, and you never grew up. That's it.

Why does CHADgon CHAD make autistic losers so angry?

>>281157060
>>281157072
Imagine acting pretentious over chinese cartoons lol. If I caught myself doing this I would kill myself immediately.

>x is the worst thing ever
So unbelievably boring, regardless of what you're talking about

>>281155328 (OP)
truth nuke

>>281155328 (OP)
not to mention vegeta could casually blow up an alien planet and it's moon with one finger from the very beginning

>>281157060
>If you fire off a full power
you so damn retarded lack of imagination its unreal
frieza did the destroy planet move and its still has 5 minutes before it explode

>>281157060
Planets only explode in Dragon Ball if the core is destroyed. The attacks they throw around all detonate at the surface.

>>281157060
> if the one who fired it is an evil villain who doesn't give a s** about Earth, why would he dial it down?
Kid buu did that. Some villain doesn’t just randomly blow up the planet probably be user they can’t breath in space and it is a pain to travel around without a space ship.

>>281157060
>if the one who fired it is an evil villain who doesn't give a s** about Earth, why would he dial it down
Because the planet would be blowing up with them on it. But then also let's see the list.
>Vegeta
Saiyan autism made him crave a battle, once he was tired of it he went straight to destroying the planet
>Frieza
Egoistic. Wanted to personally beat his superiority into anyone who pissed him off, then blew up planets as a fuck you get-away-free card whenever he was losing
>Androids
Wouldn't survive the blast, also they only want to kill Goku, not everything on earth.
>Cell
See: Vegeta
>Buu
Not even a saiyan but Toriyama gave up and only wrote the same villain for half the series so see: Vegeta
>Beerus
See: Buu
>Frieza in RoF
See: Frieza

>>281155328 (OP)
All tranime has absolutely abysmal writing

>>281155328 (OP)
It’s the best

>>281155531
The complaint isn't about strong enemies. It's about a new transformation being the answer to every one. It's lazy writing.

>>281156245
>they control their power
I hate this retarded argument so much. If they hold back then there's no point in attacking him because it's not gonna hurt him.

>>281155328 (OP)
> Power scaling nerds have determined mecha frieza is literally over a thousand time stronger than his first form. By the time buu saga comes around they should be blowing up the planet accidentally. Yet their stay blasts barely kick up dust like a grenade.
This bothered me so much in Super. They’re all a gorillion times stronger yet the fights are less damaging and impactful than before

>>281157214
That was filler, but still probably possible since they blue up the moon before saiyan saga.

>>281156202
Based and high iq.

>>281155328 (OP)
The worst written is Naruto.

>>281156739
That's because toriyama wanted it to end there, but people told him to keep going for money.
>I wanna be a super saiyan I wanna I wanna

>>281155328 (OP)
Autistic faggot "powerscalers" are the worst.

>bad guy shows up
>unlock new transformation to beat him
>repeat infinitely
This never happened. Every single arc is full of plot and most chapters involve turns and twists usually rather than just fighting. The Saiyan arc is one of the few where fighting is the main thing.

You pick a chapter from the Cell arc? Chances are it's going to be about people talking about the androids or Cell or some other twist.
Buu arc? Same.
Namek? It's a whole 3 factions guerilla.

>>281156739
Namek is easily the best Dragon Ball arc, maybe with Saiyans or 23rd but it's clearly up there in so many ways.
In contrast the Piccolo Daimao arc is not that strong. It has a few writing issues, even if it gets carried by how heavy the arc is in tone and how ruthless Piccolo is.

>>281157645
It happened twice, and each time it was integrated to the plot and part of something much bigger (the Super Saiyan legend and Goku embracing his heritage, Goku passing on the baton to his son).

People who say "DBZ is all about getting mad and getting a new transformation" haven't read Dragon Ball and only parrot memes. Hell, just calling it "DBZ" instead of DB shows they're filthy animefags at best.

>>281157825
The writing was okay until madara showed up.
Other than that my main complaint is how gay it is.
>nard is an overly emotional obnoxious faggot (left winger)
>haha wouldn't it be funny if there was gay kissing in the first episode? haha
>an actual tranny is in the first villain arc
>I'm supposed to think guys who paint their nails are cool

>>281157899
What was the purpose for ss3, and all the fusions, and ultimate gohan?

>>281157943
>SS3
Super Saiyan supercharged. Basically the "fuck it we ball" of the Super Saiyan, or maybe the Kaioken. It's satisfying in that it shows how far Goku went by training in the afterlife. Storywise, it's used intelligently, because it doesn't defeat Buu, which would be incredibly lame after Super Saiyan 1 defeated Freeza and 2 (well, it wasn't 2, it was "Gohan's power", which made it better at the time) defeated Cell. Instead, Goku uses it to stall and they try to get Kid Buu with it but it fails, leading to other developments.

>fusions
They're funny and cool. The Buu arc is all about comedy (dark comedy actually, pic related)

>ultimate Gohan
Another plot development. It opens the door for the Buutenks and Vegeto situation. I don't see what "purpose" it should have, it's one attempt made by the heroes to get further and it creates drama and twists with the waiting, the absorptions, stalling against Buutenks...

>>281157922
>The writing was okay until madara showed up.
I would say the writing was always quite interesting and it felt like a big world but the writing as always full of holes and didn't stand up to scrutiny. At least Madara was a spectacle on his own.

Dragon ball was only fun in its very first arc where it's an irreverent quest to travel the earth and find the dragon balls the first time. Everything after that is a bunch of 6 year olds in a playground arguing over the results of a pretend fight.
>I'm the strongest
>no, I'm stronger than you
>well I have a special attack that defeats your strength
>nuh uh, I have an invincibility shield
>well I have a magic power the defeats invincibility shields
>well I have a special attack that kills you both
>well I double kill you
>nuh uh, you're deader than me
...and so on.

>>281157672
>If they hold back then there's no point in attacking him because it's not gonna hurt him.
do you watch fighting sport?

>>281157922
It was trash from the first chapter.

>>281158033
You haven't read Dragon Ball. The Pilaf arc is alright but not much more. Red Ribbon beats it in both adventure and action.

>>281155328 (OP)
you're not wrong OP. you're not wrong.

>>281157860
>This never happened. Every single arc is full of plot and most chapters involve turns and twists usually rather than just fighting. The Saiyan arc is one of the few where fighting is the main thing.
kek literally every dispute in dragonball is solved by a fight. name literally one major arc that isn't about fighting and power scaling.

>>281158121
>every dispute in dragonball is solved by a fight
Yes, because it's a fighting manga where characters do kung fu and shit. That's an incredibly silly complaint to make. That doesn't mean the entire story is "dude gets mad, gets stronger, beats up another guy"

Even the Namek arc, the one that is the closest to what you're describing, has a lot more variables going on during its final stretch and requires Kaio, Kami and Guru to discuss Dragon Ball technicalities to find a way to revive and save everyone.

When people actually read Dragon Ball they's surprised at how few W Goku has, because a lot of arc villains get taken out by collective effort (at least in Z, 3/4).

>>281158157
moving the goalposts

original argument was
>this never happens
>literally happens: Androids show up, Vegeta transforms beats lower-level android with SSJ; new androids show up and curbstomp vegeta; piccolo gets a power-up and is matched with the new androids; cell shows up and saiyans get a bunch of new transformations (BIG BULKIER version, Goku's low-energy always-on version, Gohan's SSJ2) to beat him.
and that's just the arc i watched, i bet they're all like this. i watched enough of buu to see this happening every week with all the different versions of the villain, esp if you count the fake-out with Majin Vegeta, an arc that barely achieves lift-off before the big bad guy changes.
it's no coincidence DBZ fans are primarily DBZ fans and they're usually meatheads IRL as well. it's all about the fighting and overcoming physical adversity with some warrior poet shit thrown in, but only a little because too much is gay.

>>281158278
Original goalpost was
>bad guy shows up
>unlock new transformation to beat him
Which is wrong

I'll just examine your post more than this because it highlights some bigger issues though.

>that's just the arc i watched
You're judging a story disconnected from larger context
>i watched
You're watching Dragon Ball instead of reading it, which is a huge issue in itself

The Cell arc actually has a bit of an issue with its structure. It starts with interesting ideas and subplots. The androids that show up aren't the good ones. The androids can hide their ki and absorb yours. Android 20 is actually Gero, and they have to find his lab. Why is 16 deemed a failure and what's with his personality? More important than any of that, what's with this new time machine that came from 3 years after Trunks' timeline? Can they catch Cell before he can eat more people?
All interesting things. But then it's traded for powerup ping pong in the middle of the arc, which is kinda lame. It still doesn't fit what you're describing but there are issues with this arc.
The Namek arc is handled a lot better since the characters can actually achieve things that aren't defeating the main bad guy. It's easily one of the best arcs in shonen period.

>>281155328 (OP)
Why would they be blowing up planets accidentally. Do they have no ki control?

>>281155328 (OP)
>AAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEEE BRORY IT HUUUUUUUUURTS AUAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>281158349
idk why you keep saying it's wrong when every major problem is about fighting a guy and often beating him involves getting to an even higher level of power.
the OP is about the show and i can only comment on the show, i haven't and won't read the manga. but i've seen enough dbz on toonami to discuss the android and cell arcs and it's literally a sequence of beating guys with powerups. the emotional climax about gohan exploiting his unlocked power.

>>281158431
this would probably hurt quite a lot
idk man i think the reason i don't want to fight anyone is because i don't like pain.

>>281158445
>idk why you keep saying it's wrong when every major problem is about fighting a guy
Nobody said Dragon Ball wasn't a manga about fighting. We're saying it's not a caricature of "bad guy shows up, good guy gets angry, beats bad guy". There's a story to this, there are themes, twists and a lot of the chapters are just plain dialogues. The fights are rather short compared to almost all of the modern battle shonen.

Just some harmless lasers

>>281158476
it feels like the show is massively padded, i was watching the cell saga, not the whole thing but bits and pieces. first thing i noticed is i misremembered how many episodes these fights encompass. i thought it was way less. it's such a slow show, barely any shit happens in a given episode. one episode is about gohan walking towards cell and being very fucking stoic. that's really like the whole episode. it takes 20 minutes for gohan to show us just how little fucks he gives now that he's the next level of super saiyan. he's having a moment! teenage me loved that shit. adult me in surprised the show is as slow as it is.
compare that to some shit like idk, frieren. fights are contained to an episode, they're over in a reasonable timeframe, if they're any longer than that it's because they're padding things out with backstory. it's not gratuitous the way old DBZ is.

>>281155328 (OP)
this is why I like HxH, the strongest in the verse is episode 1 of DBZ Goku at best, but at the same time, his speed and destructive power feats are consistent with each other

>>281158522
>it feels like the show is massively padded
Because it is. That's why I'm telling you the anime is trash and telling you that's the big issue here

I'm a big Dragon Ball fan but the anime is just not good. Some isolated scenes or episodes are alright but it's just not watchable as a whole

>>281158480
Ki blasts blow up as soon as they touch rock, or anything really. So why would you think that could go to the earth’s core without upkeep or being specialised for penetration of god knows how many kms?

>>281158548
damn that is some indictment from a dragonball fan. you're the only one who i've seen to dismiss the show out of hand.

>>281157899
as I said, Namek was good until Frieza started changing forms.

>>281158553
>>281158480
It's not perfectly consistent but the manga tried to keep escalating the level of destruction. Starting from the Cell arc they have to worry about their blasts destroying the planet if they touch the ground. Goku can't fire a Kamehameha against Cell because of that. In the Buu arc, small blasts are destroying parts of the entire planet and the final fight is explicitly taking place in the Kaioshin realm where "they can go all out without risking to blow it up".

Of course Super is much dumber in that regard.

>>281158600
The anime did some things really well like https://youtu.be/SyMeAo9kgsY?t=79 but generally speaking it goes against everything that makes the manga good. The manga has razor sharp pacing, things happen all the time, fights never overstay their welcome or waste time, and the characters don't feel like cartoon personalities. Meanwhile the anime is incredibly slow, has multiple episodes of filler where nothing happens, and makes the characters act like flanderized versions of themselves. It's not just slower, it feels stupid and written exclusively for low attention span children.

it was never about asspull forms solving the arcs. after frieza the fights just became a bore because they all became one-sided. either the villain got a level-up and was effortlessly kicking everybody's ass or one of the z-fighters got a level up and was kicking the villain's ass (until they unlocked a new form or got beat). it was just lazy writing. how many fights were there were the two opponents were at equal levels after SS1 got introduced? (even goku vs vegeta doesn't count because of SS3)

>>281158653
You're describing the Cell arc, Buu was full of even fights.

>>281158653
goku-cell is pretty evenly matched. doesn't goku lose on a technicality or something? and he only fought to give gohan a chance to study cell.

>>281158682
nah, Goku knew he had no chance against Cell, but only fought him to make sure Gohan can handle him. Goku just quits before he gets his ass beat.

>>281158713
Yeah, it's pretty even because Cell is running at 50% or something.

>>281158445
>i haven't and won't read the manga.
Average critic on /a/

>>281158548
>>281158600
Both wrong, Dragon Ball is about finding ways to get stronger and it's great precisely because of this, your entire life as a human being is also about becoming a better version of yourself to overcome the challenges life throws at you, but since the characters are fighters, they solve problems by fighting.

When Gohan becomes SS2 is because he needed to let go of his personal trauma about fighting to protect the people he loved, fighting was never his thing, since he was a toddler, he was pushed in these situations and always got hurt, which made him not enjoy fighting like the other warriors, but he needed to go beyond that, his ego and personal issues are not as important as the safety of his loved ones.

It's not a perfect series, we could do with less villain transformations and inconsistent power scalling, but this doesn't ruin the series at all.

Also, yeah, the anime has shit pacing, read the manga or watch Kai.

Since I shat on the anime I'll show one of the best examples of why it's such a betrayal of the manga

Pic related is the first Gotenks vs Buu gag. It's a simple, but effective joke, which relies entirely on the instant loss in the second page.
The anime showed Gotenks fighting Buu and getting beaten up, then had him come back. Joke is ruined, just so they could milk more content and avoid catching up to the manga.

>>281155967
3pbp. Dragon Ball is a fun adventure story, DBZ is where it gets boring and formulaic

>>281157140
>most popular (One Piece)
>most influential (Dragon Ball)
>best written (Hunter x Hunter)
It's sour grapes. Knowing that your favorite series will be surpassed by one of these in a minimum of one of these categories.

>>281155328 (OP)
>Still unsurpassed as the best DB antagonist
How did he do it?

>>281155328 (OP)
>>bad guy shows up
>>unlock new transformation to beat him
>>repeat infinitely
This happens like two times over the entire course of the show.

>>281158931
>Dragon Ball is a fun adventure story, DBZ is where it gets boring and formulaic
Dragon Ball is arguably far more formulaic than DBZ.
>Hunt for the dragon balls arc
>Tournament arc
>Hunt for the dragon balls arc AGAIN but 5x as long
>Tournament arc again
>Hunt for the Dragon Balls arc AGAIN but also it's an asspull circus training arc
>Tournament arc again
Meanwhile, the section retards (You) term as Z:
>Big fight where everyone teams up to defeat aliens
>Hunt for the dragon balls on another planet with three competing factions
>Cat and Mouse game that becomes a tournament at the very end
Honestly, I can't even describe the Boo arc in such a short way because it's so varied and unique.
The only unifying factor is that all these arcs have "strong guys" as the antagonist, and if that was your issue, you would hate every arc of Dragon Ball except the first and third one.

>>281155328 (OP)
holy kino
picked

>>281155328 (OP)
Honestly, power scaling that goes as far as destroying planets is just ridiculous.
Take One Punch Man, for example — the final boss goes all out with a massive, life-risking energy blast meant to wipe out the Earth’s surface, and even that feels like the upper limit of reasonable power scaling. That’s the sweet spot.

>>281158826
They do change things a bit, since there's a sudden cut from the battle to Gotenks landing on the rooftop (very quickly unlike his flying in the manga), then pulling it as a surprise reveal that he lost and was all beaten up. It is kind of dumb so since he clearly was losing the battle by the time they cut away.

Dragon Ball is the most overhyped and deified series in existence.
Boomers grew up without the internet, so it became this sacred nostalgia-fueled memory they’ll defend no matter what.
But let’s be real — if that same half-assed writing debuted as a new Jump series today, /a/ would destroy it within a week.

>>281159713
Zoomers with no testosterone don’t get it. All their hero’s are twinks who live in their head and are scared of women. Shows like DB are straight to the lizard brain entertainment, it’s all about the basics of masculinity. Be strong, fearless, kind, have wife and kids.

They wouldn’t allow such a show nowadays.

>>281156655
I think he's counting Kaioken as a transformation. And then after Buu comes Super Saiyan God, Super Saiyan Blue, and Ultra Instinct.

>>281155328 (OP)
Only trannies and sóyboys would say DB was bad

>>281155328 (OP)
But it's for modern Shonen like Kimetsu No Yaiba where the hero gets a fucking flashback in the middle of the fight and suddenly remembers some Uber technique that allowed him to defeat some giga demon?

Fuck off. At least dragon ball isn't pretending to be deep with billions flashbacks

>>281155328 (OP)
Its story is literally an excuse to animate fight scenes how have you not figured this out?