Thread 281565098

>Highest rated anime of all time
It was good, but it wasn't THAT good

if it was released in 2014, it would have become only half as popular imo

>>281565098 (OP)
It's serialization as a shounen manga was a mistake. It should have been seinen.

>>281565182
Yea and if fmab gintama one piece Logth etc were released today they wouldn't even be top 100.

>>281565098 (OP)
It was average, 8/10

It was that good. Way better than low tier trash like dbz, jjk and one piece of shit.

>>281565098 (OP)
What would you say deserves a better rating than frieren?

I've wondered this in more than one hobby of mine: why would you give any credence to aggregated ratings by random normalfags who've probably experienced 5 - 10 examples from thousands within a medium? I don't let even experienced people color my opinion too much, but I could better understand taking seriously the opinion of one person who has seen 500+ anime over the aggregated opinions of people who have seen far fewer. How can the opinion of someone who has not even experienced a work count for anything? All aggregated user ratings are weighted by number of votes, so Mr. Seen-10-Anime is implicitly pulling all the greats of the medium toward a tepid 5/10 with his ill-informed opinion. This has to be connected to the public's quasi-religious democracy fetishism. It's irrational.

>>281565098 (OP)
>mogged by solo leveling at the awards
kek, it was always shit.

>>281565468
Any anime that actually attempts to have a message, or doesn't shy away from uncommon tropes. Frieren is beyond derivative and doesn't deserve the amount of attention it gets, if it had production values of a typical isekai show it would've been forgotten entirely after a year

>>281565494
>Mr. Seen-10-Anime is implicitly pulling all the greats of the medium toward a tepid 5/10 with his ill-informed opinion
Your assumption is that the greatest animes cannot be appreciated unless you have seen hundreds of garbages ones. This is a completely incorrect and absurd assumption. You don't need to be a literature graduate to appreciate how good Dostoevsky is. Both an expert in literature and a casual reader will rate him among the best of the best, because his work is the best of the best. Good storytelling is something intrinsically understandable because its based on the human experience, which everyone has lived IRL.

Obviously an informed opinion is better, but if your anime can only be appreciated if you have numbed yourself with hundreds of more mediocre ones, perhaps its not great storytelling at all, its just above average and will thus be rated highly only if you are so used to the average you are suprised by it being slightly above that.

>>281565494
Because you've got to go on something. I watch at least an episode of practically everything, but it's silly to expect that of casuals ie most people. Reviews from "experts" relies on those experts not being retarded and having tastes that are compatible with yours.
Audience scores are terrible, but "most people liked this" is useful for most people, almost by definition.

>>281565683
So, for example?
> actually attempts to have a message
It has many, I guess you can claim they are a bit derivative but this is the case in 99.9% of stories which is why I want to ask what you rate higher.

For me Frieren is able to pack its episodes with what it wants to show the audience so well and so tastefully its far better than most other things I've seen at delivering its messages, which is why I rate it high. I can hardly think of a modern story that I would not be able to call derivative, that's just the nature of having thousands of years of stories preceding you.

>>281565632
Only people with autism have an issue with this. Autistic people need hyper exaggerated visual cues to tell them what to feel. It's why they're attracted to anime to begin with. Warriors shouldn't be putting on goofy and retarded expressions in serious moments of battle. They should be calm and collected at all times.

>>281565632
I wish we had subtitled for emotions

>>281566087
Fern: [Pouting]

>>281565683
>it would have been better if it was any other Westaboo fantasy anime

>>281565554
>mogged by the show that mogged all the other shows
what did you think this proved?

>>281565720
what happens when the "most people liked it" is astroturfed by companies buying reviews and clicks to generate interest?

>>281565707
Literature rankings aren't comparable, because they're informed by serious literary criticism. Those critics had to be experienced with other great works of literature, or they wouldn't be able to recognize if the work is derivative.

There is no serious anime criticism (or very little and obscure). You don't need to have wide experience to recognize good from garbage, but you need to have wide experience to pick the greatest of all time from the good.

>>281565720
It's not like I didn't offer an alternative. You'd even be better off just finding a random oldfag profile on MAL who's watched a lot of anime, who's clearly not a bot, and treating his rankings as gospel, as silly as that might be it's less silly than treating aggregated, poorly-informed opinions as gospel.

>>281566479
Then you have an award ceremony.
>>281566488
>It's not like I didn't offer an alternative
I don't see it.
>You'd even be better off just finding a random oldfag profile on MAL who's watched a lot of anime, who's clearly not a bot, and treating his rankings as gospel
I completely disagree. A specific person will have specific tastes. Which is useful if you know what those tastes are and how they correlate with yours, but is terrible if you don't. Plus a random oldfag that's watched a ton of anime is an awful proxy for the taste of the average casual.

Do you count anime you dropped midway among your watched? If so, I have watched over 2000. And I consider Frieren to be the best.

It's the Shawshank Redemption of anime.

>>281566641
>I completely disagree. A specific person will have specific tastes. Which is useful if you know what those tastes are and how they correlate with yours, but is terrible if you don't.
I was staking out a strong claim by being as simplistic as possible. Obviously if you know your taste you can adjust which people's opinions you heed accordingly. The point is: what kind of taste is expressed by *people who haven't even seen the work you're considering*? My central premise was that you are allowing yourself to be influenced by people who *didn't watch the show* because they're affecting the weighted average. Someone with dissimilar taste? Yes, suboptimal, but how can it be worse than someone who didn't watch it? What kind of taste is expressed when Joe's rating affects the rank of anime he has not only never seen but never even heard of? How can any informed opinion be worse than that? I think on an epistemological level it can't be.

>Plus a random oldfag that's watched a ton of anime is an awful proxy for the taste of the average casual.
You're assuming that people shouldn't seek to cultivate good taste. Anime is, for most viewers, a foreign cultural product. Shouldn't one at least try to understand anime culture and broader Japanese culture through the medium and develop a more sophisticated opinion?

>>281565632
The thing is, I'm 100% okay with this being true for mages, Freiren and Fern especially. Mana is controlled with visualization and thought. If you panic in the middle of a fight playing by those rules, you have already lost because you can't use your magic effectively.
Freiren and Fern especially have the thing where they can't afford to let their control over their mana lapse EVER, not even in a fight to the death, or they tip their hand and the ruse of their true powerlevel gets revealed and the game is up. They've trained specifically to always have total control, so I'm willing to believe that Fern can get speared through the shoulder and still have a pokerface about it because that's what Freiren drilled into her.

But we need to be TOLD that its this approach to spellcasting that results in the blank expressions. Warriors and other fighters should still be very emotional in a fight, and we should see mages that START a fight with a pokerface and then that mask breaks in the middle of the fight and from that point on the fight is just completely out of their control.

>>281565098 (OP)
Doesn't even have an ending.

>>281566789
I've seen over 1000 and think it's a 7.5 / 10 show. One of the best in its high fantasy isekai genre but not as good as Mushoku Tensei is so far, even with the S2 C1 hiccups.

>>281567361
*isekai-esque, meaning dragonquest / D&D inspired high-fantasy

>>281565468
Mushoku Tensei although not the anime.
If its source vs source then MT for sure.

>>281566933
>Joe's rating affects the rank of anime he has not only never seen but never even heard of?
What? Unless there's something very strange about MAL's rating system (admittedly not impossible) I don't see how that's the case.
>You're assuming that people shouldn't seek to cultivate good taste
I'm assuming they don't. Whether they should or not is irrelevant.

>>281565249
He's not trying to say old good new bad. The hype machine simply worked differently back then.

>>281565216
spbp

>>281566087
i don't think artists should pander to Asperger's fags

>>281567361
>not as good as MT
you watched 1000 anime and you unironically shill this? I think this hobby isn't for you.

>>281565216
like umaru-chan, right?

>>281565457
>It's not good because it's good, it's good because it's not X
Frierenfags are pathetic.

>>281567805
I believe him. I'll take MT over Frieren any day

>>281565098 (OP)
>highest rated
Does it really matter if its not even the show with the highest members and highest count of ratings? It doesn't even break in the Top 100 of Most Popular Anime.

>>281568294
MAL is dead, Frieren is the only anime to be added by more than 1million members for several years

>>281565340
>average, 8/10
According to the MAL definition, average would be 5/10. Which brings me to an interesting point: People don't use the rating scale equally and the same score might have different meanings to different people. From my observation, most people rate on a compressed scale and don't use the bottom half or even two-thirds of the scale much, anime they dislike get an instant 1/10 and everything else a 6-7+.

>>281565707
>You don't need to be a literature graduate to appreciate how good Dostoevsky is. Both an expert in literature and a casual reader will rate him among the best of the best
Delusional, give a Dostoevsky book to random folks and a large number or even the majority will rate it lower than Harry Potter (or not even read beyond a few pages, lol).

>>281568553
>or not even read beyond a few pages, lol
WTF is book? t. everyone aged 40 or younger.

>>281568399
it's because the quality of anime has risen over time. modern anime are all around 10~7. go back two decades and they're around 6~4. go back further and they're 4~1 by modern standards.

>>281568344
That's not an excuse. Even Mushoku Tensei has more members than Frieren which advertised and glazed everywhere to the mainstream all the time.

>>281568660
That came out years before, and as I said MAL is a dying website.
Frieren is the only one to have over 1million members add it for years, there may not be another anime which break 1million on that site ever again

>>281568294
Nisekoi's placement is kinda impressive when you know it doesn't have an english dub.
Looking at the top 179 (anime with a million+ members) only 4 don't have dubs
#97 Bakemonogatari
#128 Nisekoi
#143 Tonari no Kaibutsu-kun
#177 Plastic Memories

>>281568645
You actually believe this? I don't even rate anime, but Frieren won't even be in my Top 20 or so. For example, I'll take stuff like Soul Eater or Needless over Frieren and that aired almost 2 decades ago
Anime like Frieren nowadays just tries to pander to the west and become the #1 anime on MAL or whatever because its more palatable to normalpeeps, but still, it doesn't make them right. That's the thing with opinions, no one is correct or wrong over it

>>281568694
Wrong. Other anime that released in the last few years and have more than 1 million members are Spy x Family, Chainsaw Man, My Dress up Darling, Jujutsu Kaisen (both seasons), Attack on Titan The Final Season, Demon Slayer season 2 and Mushoku Tensei.

>>281565098 (OP)
Is really good, but I like Kinomi Master much more.

>>281568344
>>281568294
In this picture you can see Re:Zero, My Dress up Darling, Jujutsu Kaisen and Dr. Stone, all of which released in the last few years. What are you even talking about.

>>281568852
Literally all of those came out before Frieren smoothbrain
As I am going to tell you for a third time, traffic for MAL has been going downhill for years, people are just not using it like they used to.
The last anime to have over 1million members is Frieren and there is a very good chance there will not be another one to hit 1m+ ever again

>>281568941
>The last anime to have over 1million members is Frieren and there is a very good chance there will not be another one to hit 1m+ ever again
Actually it is Solo Leveling that came out a season after Frieren.

>>281568993
Oof. Imagine being BTFOd by Solo Leveling

>>281565098 (OP)
Anime of the decade, will be manga of the decade too

>>281568993
Nope, not even close

>>281569151
I'm pretty sure Kimetsu no Yaiba sold better in 2020+
It climbed up from 150 million to 220 million recently

Sung Jin Woo would actually kill Frieren in a 1v1 and it isn't even close.

>>281569237
Try season 1 you dweeb.

>>281569242
Maybe they mean manga that started in the 2020s?

>>281569237
that's the second season, retardbro

>>281569326
Yea, that makes more sense

>>281569242
Kimetsu is a 2010s series, it's just looking at titles which began publishing this decade

>>281565468
Those armpits, holy fuck!!!
>>281565892
>autists
So you're saying that many autists who love this anime for being relatable to their disability are actually not autists, because their spectrum is different than your view on it? Are you retarded, or severely autistic?

>>281569856
>your view on it
I'm speaking strictly in terms of facts. There's been studies that showcase people with autism like anime because the exaggerated facial expressions help them recognize emotions. The only people who get mad about there being less expressive characters are people too autistic to understand feelings to begin with.

>>281565098 (OP)
MAL opinions are entirely created by how much the voters feel like the anime owes their posting on social media for its success.

>>281565098 (OP)

Pretty much. I love it but it´s certainly not the best anime of all time.

>>281568399
If it's something from 1-5 range I usually just drop it without rating.

>>281565683
>If the show was bad, it'd be forgotten
Fascinating insight.

>>281565098 (OP)
Millions of people agree, yes

>>281567638
>The hype machine simply worked differently back then.
because there wasnt one. no fag spouting the words hype hype hype kino kino

>>281568294
>Does it really matter if its not even the show with the highest members and highest count
yes. Millions of people saying a show is mid, and 900 saying a show is top tier means more people wanted to say how mid a show was

To get really popular, you have to be at least decent quality. To get top 10 of all time, the main thing you need to be is inoffensive.

>>281565098 (OP)
>>Highest rated anime of all time
according to a bunch of normalfags, because it contains comparatively less tits and ass fanservice. it's nothing revolutionary, it just doesn't suck as much as its contemporary isekai/fantasy anime

>>281571351
Frieren offended half the internet by making demons not redeemable

>>281571669
thankfully, deranged troons you're talking with on x dot com are not actually half of the internet

>>281565098 (OP)
I love this show.

>>281565098 (OP)
fern is hot

>>281565683
>if it had production values of a typical isekai show it would've been forgotten entirely after a year
But it doesn't have shit production values so it deserves to be well received.

>>281565098 (OP)
It's far better than Steins;Gate and that trash is top 3.

>>281571173
Yes, if it didn't have a large budget then nobody would care.

>>281565468
Most everything

>>281565468
Delicious pit.

>>281568880
Daratena was hot but don't be silly.

>>281574502
IT'S TIME TO GOON

>>281574560
such a fine girl

>>281565098 (OP)
I agree. What is the best then? My money's on K-On

>>281566488
>It's not like I didn't offer an alternative. You'd even be better off just finding a random oldfag profile on MAL who's watched a lot of anime, who's clearly not a bot, and treating his rankings as gospel

Definitely wouldn't trust a random person's ratings there. I've seen way too many old profiles with thousands of shows finished and an average rating below 2, makes you wonder why they even continue watching anime if everything's so shit to them

>>281565098 (OP)
It's better than most of what's in the top 100 on mal now, anyway.(at least visually)

>>281574560
Her arc with Lena was kino

>>281565098 (OP)
>highest rated
where? by who? why do we care? how does this invoke anime discussion rather than meta discussion? if you want to discuss frieren's quality, you can just say so without making these bait threads, but I know that's not your intentions, so instead just kill yourself.

>>281574340
S;G shouldn't even be rated higher than Re:Zero. It's normalfag garbage.

>>281571299
Or it may also mean that the other million don't even want to bother with the show unlike the 900

>>281574560
Luscious.

>>281565098 (OP)
It's normie tier good. That's it.

>>281565098 (OP)
she's so silly and beautiful

respect elves

>>281576710
>normie
go back

>>281565098 (OP)
>Highest rated anime of all time
I thought that was Solo Leveling.

>>281577829
You go back. That's been a term in otaku culture since before you were born.

>>281565468
Made in Abyss

>>281577942
kill yourself retard

karma farming: the anime

>>281565098 (OP)
Who the fuck unironically cares about ratings? They are all fucking retarded. But yeah, Frieren is a good anime. Very good anime, in my opinion.

>>281565468
Out of the top of my head: Sonny Boy, Shigurui, Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu. I could name some more if I really think about it.

I still think Frieren is an exceptional anime in many ways and I'm not shitting on it in the slightest.

>>281570695
He's actually right though, I've been diagnosed with autism and watching Frieren has been satisfying because of how relatable she is. I'm not even the only one who shares this opinion and feel that way.

>>281567361
>but not as good as Mushoku Tensei is so far
This is my daily reminder that I cannot take /a/ seriously nowadays. I'm sharing a forum with anons that unironically believe this.

>>281575073
I know you're being facetious, but you really shouldn't. K-On was and still in many respects is a very noteworthy anime with some excellent qualities. Both Frieren and K-On are great anime in their respective fields and there is nothing wrong with that. It's absurd to rank everything in one list to rule them all. Aggregate scores from normalfag webzones like MAL are utterly meaningless and are not meant to inform in the slightest. You might as will pull the absolute schizophrenia that is the AniDB aggregate.

>>281578866
Don't you feel silly for using reddit language for no real reason and completely out of context in this site?

>>281576543
The problem with Steins;Gate isn't that it's normalfag garbage. It is, but that really isn't the problem, because popular things can still be good. The real problem is that it's just not that great of an anime. It's not written compellingly and we have to pretend that the cast is more interesting than they really are.

>>281579840
nice job outing yourself fag