Thread 60893975

Post normie financial advice. Whatever you find the most amusing, annoying, retarded, whatever.

I'll start:
>You need to save up for a down payment and buy a house!

Does there exist any advice more basic than this? The 100IQ normtard simply proclaims that purchasing a house is the best investment and is applauded as a genius. It doesn't matter how much more expensive it is to own than to rent. Where I live, apartments are ~$2000 per month or ~$500k to buy. Buying works out to about ~$4000 per month with everything like HOA, insurance, and maintenance included.

Normsharts don't care. They see that housing is their biggest expense and decide a house is their best investment. It doesn't matter if it is literally twice as expensive, because "muh equity" o algo.

On the other side of the coin... Crypto gamblers
I overheard some sort of podcast or video that my dad was listening to a while ago. The guy was saying that housing was a ponzi scheme because "you can just build more housing" and that you should buy bitcoin instead.
Real life people think like this, it blows my mind

>>60893975 (OP)
Everything is market dependent. In my area a house that goes for 900k-1M will rent for $4500-5200. I’ve been thinking a lot about selling my townhouse with a locked in 2.25% rate to buy a single family.

To bring the total payment if buying down to the same level of renting, I’d have to put down 40% and have a 600k loan at 6.5%. Interest the first year would be 48k or $4000/mo, plus $500/mo for property tax and insurance. This means my “rent equivalent” is $4500 which is amount I throw away on these items. The house appreciates on average by 3% a year which is 30k on a 1M. But my 400k down payment leads to an opportunity cost of ~10% a year from not being invested in the S&P 500. I can deduct certain things like mortgage interest which could save several hundred a month in income taxes at my bracket if buying so that’s a plus. Also I could get lucky and interest rates could decrease in the next 5-10 years which would let me refi. Also, in my situation I would be pulling out 200k in equity from my current home to finance the 400k down payment so the real opportunity cost is only about 200k which I have in liquid investments currently.

Ultimately it’s kind of a wash with maybe a slight favor to buying if I stay put for the long term. Buying a house should be seen as a bit of a lifestyle choice and not just a purely financial choice.

>>60893975 (OP)
Also if I were you I wouldn’t buy an apartment, I’d keep renting. It makes more sense to buy when you have kids and want to give them stability and know you’ll be there for 10-20 years. Renting is way more unstable of a housing situation (landlords can jack up rent, decide to sell, neglect the property, etc) which is great if you’re young and mobile but as you get older you often want to stay put for the long term

>>60894042
All of the people telling you to just get a hecking mortgage just got one at <3% during ZIRP, which is an opportunity you will never get again, and was really only possible in the US because of fixed rates.
And your price appreciation is substantially reduced by maintenance. That 3% becomes 2% or less real quick when you consider all the repairs and maintenance you have to do.
Its really that simple, most people normies or not think works on my machine = works for everybody for eternity.

>>60894086
Yeah often times you’re better off investing in the market than taking out a 6.5% mortgage. Like I said it’s a lifestyle decision in this case. Do you want to be stuck renting your entire life and be at the mercy of a landlord? Stocks usually appreciate more than RE but you have to live somewhere. RE can be a headache with maintenance but it’s often not 2% a year. 0.5-1% more like it. With a house you also get more tax breaks and deductions and you can sell tax free when it comes time to downsize unless you have a crazy expensive multi million dollar home

>>60894459
Thats the thing, you are letting yourself get swayed by them making it an emotional decision.
Being at the mercy of the bank is a way worse situation than at the mercy of a landlord, because the worst thing he can do is kick you out, while the bank kick you out AND bankrupt you.
Most people make decision first and THEN look for arguments to justifiy their decision, instead of looking at the facts FIRST and then basing their decision on that.
And being able to sell the house you are living in tax free is just meant to enable you to move, you aren't making any money out of this.
In 2005 q1, the average house price in the us was 288k, now its 512k 20 years later.
Lets say you sell that house now. Now the average house is worth just the same as all other average houses, 512k and you still have to live somewhere, so what did you really achieve?
Meanwhile the NASDAQ went from 2k to 21k in that same timeframe, meaning if you had invested your down payment into it, you could just buy your house in full now.

>>60893975 (OP)
You are low iq normie :D kek

>>60894042
Kek
Real normie shit thinking you get 10% on sp500. That is most retarded shit i have seen for a while.

>>60894562
whats your point?

>>60893975 (OP)
>Buying works out to about ~$4000 per month
Not if you have a DOWN PAYMENT, Retard-kun!
>HOA
Oh, so you're terminally retard.

>>60894487
the thing is getting a mortgage/loan for the equity. No bank is giving me 288k to put in tqq

>>60894607
I explicitly said down payment. And if your going to be extra skimpy on the down payment your just going to have to pay an more interest and for longer too.
And I explicitly showed you vanilla nasdaq, not degenerate TQQ shit, and aren't asking the bank to loan you that either, just like you aren't asking the bank to loan you the money for a down payment lol.
Like you aren't going to get around fronting a large initial either way.

>>60893975 (OP)
> Buy low sell high
> Never invest more than you can afford to lose
> Don't try catching a falling knife
> Buy a house, renting is throwing money away

I'm a quant in finance, whenever I hear normies say sth like this it makes my blood boil

>>60893995
Bitcoin has drastically out-performed real estate.

>>60894562
10% is extremely conservative because it includes pre-covid psyop numbers. We are deep in clownworld financial territory, the printing is going to accelerate.

I always feel like such a chad when I come onto this site lol. the scoreboard is simple: 20 years renting = nothing. 20 years owning = equity, control, optionality.

You’re either the bull (owner) or you’re the cuck (renter).

Just sold the house my grandmother gave me, owned it for 10 years and it tripled in value, now I’m using that money to put a down payment on the most valuable house I can find.
Why you may ask? Because the dollar is dying and I expect to pay the new house off easily, meanwhile rentoids will just have their rents increase 1000x to keep up with inflation

>>60894712
Nothing says "chad" like a 6 figure debt and 100$ disposable income every month

>>60893975 (OP)
>max out your 401k, it's free money!
>that you can only use when you're 60
>that you can't buy what you want
>that's tied to your employer and a hassle to move
>that you can't choose your brokerage

>>60894768
this is the worst one actually. my mom who is an accountant tried to get me to do this; then she bitches a week later about the rules the IRS put on her money

>>60894722
the housing market is on track for recovery, aka going back to precovid pricing

>>60894768
401ks are good if your employer matches or puts money in too because that's literally free money but they're worse than pensions or just investing how you want.
Otherwise they're meant for those who can't manage their money to have something when they're too old to work

>>60894774
This, my mom is on social security. Broke as a joke 24/7. But tells everyone to do it as if it's working for her. Boomers have a bizarre mindset and I remind her that it caused the world we live in now every single chance I get.

>>60894793
It's not free money you retard, it's money with the most strings possible. A 3% match with a hard cap is completely negligible for how many strings are required.

>>60894830
3% is dogshit, my employer does 10% and it is a self directed plan through fidelity. I can invest in whatever, currently holding bitcoin and chinese mid cap corps

>>60893975 (OP)
>buy low, sell high!

>>60893975 (OP)
Sorry Schlomo but I'm not renting your shoebox appartment for $2000 a month, I'm just not lol. I'll buy/build a house and you can't do anything about it. I'll decorate it with loli images and grafittis so the neighbourhood already manipulated prices goes down and you jew boomers seethe even further

>>60893975 (OP)
You just need to spend $30 to get your hair cut why don't you want a hecking style!?!?!?

>>60894562
100 year average is 10.5%

>>60894959
Yes goy, buy a house. Pay property tax, goy.

>>60894712
Reality:
20 years of renting = 20 years of compounding asset growth on money you would've wasted on a down-payment while not having to pay repairs or maintenance.

20 years of mortgage payments= your monthly payment is finally mostly principal instead of interest, you've been paying maintenance, taxes and repairs while your unrealized gains of "home equity" make you think you're a genius

>>60893975 (OP)
renting is more expensive almost by definition
depending on your lease but most people have a landlord that pays all that stuff + interest for housing your bum ass
it's normie advice for a reason (it's true and glaringly obvious)
reverse mortgages on the other hand...

>>60894668
really? shouldn't you be happy that they're reinforcing demand for autismos like you

>>60893975 (OP)
>You should save 50% of your salary to buy a house, anon, house prices will keep going up forever, you know!
>Anon, this tv celebrity bought a plot of land and it went up 1000% in the first year, why don't you do the same?
>Anon, buy a house in the beach, you can rent it for easy income!
Yeah, i'm quite tired of normies.

>>60895953
>just pay rent goy
>just live with your parents and never get married and reproduce goy

I guess you can’t win

>>60895975
I put down 60k on my first house including closing costs. Rn that would be about 140k if I invested in the S&P 500. But the house I bought went up by 150k and my monthly payment is lower than a 1BR apartments rents for now. I’ve only spent about $150/month on maintenance the entire time if averaging things out over 6 years. Kek

>>60893975 (OP)
my mom advised me to buy a house when I went off to college instead of staying at the dorms. She even said she'll pay for my down payment.
I should've listened to her.

>>60896053
Thinking that your landlord AUTOMATICALLY profits from renting out to you is peak normgroid.

There’s zero guarantee you can rent out any house for a profit. If I buy a house now I’m competing with other landlords who bought 20 years ago with a 2.5% interest rate, while I’m paying 4x as much with 3x the interest.

if I try to rent that shit out they can always undercut me in a tight market and I will be forced to reduce my rent or else be vacant the whole time. It doesn’t matter in the slightest if my mortgage is $4000 because boomer Billy next door has a $1500 mortgage and rents his for $2500

Tons of landlords are losing money every month and are holding out for property appreciation to save them.

>>60896486
Try to access your home equity. It's not a liquid investment so its not real. Every other OSB walled goybox in the country also went up by $150k, you could take a home equity loan borrowing against it and start paying even more interest than you've already been paying for the privilege of renting your house from the bank.

No shit a 1BR apartment costs more than your house, those are usually in walkable areas and therefore desirable, not some soulless HOA suburb that's a 20 minute drive everywhere.

>>60896947
Nobody is forcing you to buy another house you can sell yours after it went up by $1mil and rent.

>>60896947
Down payment buys control of a large asset. Modest appreciation on a big asset beats modest returns on a small brokerage. You still need a roof either way; owners convert part of that cost into equity, renters convert it into their landlord’s equity. Optionality > liquidity worship.

>>60897103
This concept escapes renters 100% of the time no matter how often we have these threads.
They seem to think landlords are taking a loss on their tenants or something.

>>60894712
>nothing
numb digger

>>60894674
What does the historical performance of bitcoin have to do with me finding it retarded that a crypto proponent called housing a ponzi scheme?

>>60894606
Yes, with a down payment. Go play with this calculator. In my area, renting ALWAYS costs less, even after 30 years.
I wouldn't personally buy in an HOA, but something like 60-80% of new homes have one, so it makes sense to include it in the cost.
https://www.nerdwallet.com/calculator/rent-vs-buy-calculator

>>60897129
>>60897103
>muh equity
Landlords definitely profit off of renters, however typically they bought their property long ago before property values exploded and interest rates went up. Their mortgage is way less than what I would pay if I bought the same place now. With 6.6% interest rates, it's cheaper to rent at the moment.
More or less 50% cheaper, even. You can shovel that money into stocks and earn a compounding return immediately instead of PAYING interest on an enormous loan because "muh equity". 6.452% over 30 years essentially doubles the price of the home because of interest.

Not to say that buying a home doesn't have personal value, I definitely will do it one day. It's just normie financial advice. There's value in renting. You get stock equity instead of home equity.

>>60894959
hahahhahahaha

The federal reserve provides home owners with free equity via inflation induced debt destruction. Put another way, if you take out an interest-only loan for your house, as time approaches infinity, your equity stake in the house approaches 100%, without paying down any principle. Meanwhile, the renter is faced with minimum 5% rent increases every year while their wages remain stagnant.

>>60898148
>You get stock equity instead of home equity.
Those two are not mutually exclusive. Your suggestion to hold an undiversified portfolio (only stocks) is very foolish. The prudent investor holds a diversified portfolio, including both real estate and stock, among other asset classes.

>>60898781
>The federal reserve provides home owners with free equity via inflation induced debt destruction. Put another way, if you take out an interest-only loan for your house, as time approaches infinity, your equity stake in the house approaches 100%, without paying down any principle. Meanwhile, the renter is faced with minimum 5% rent increases every year while their wages remain stagnant.
This. Real estate appreciates vs fiat the same way as bitcoin for similar reasons, can't print it out of thin air. Taking on a big loan to buy an asset that will appreciate by virtue of said infinite money printing is literally free money. Imagine getting to take out a $500k loan to buy bitcoin at 3% interest locked in, where the lender basically can't and doesn't want to margin call you. And you can live in it to avoid paying rent.

I built a house for $30k in the Philippines. Fiber internet, comfy neighborhood, 7/11 and shops and restos 5 minute walk away.

It's not perfect but it is mine and it was affordable. The only thing is here the land is leased not owned. I have a 50 year lease on the plot. I'll probably be dead by then or this country will be under water, so no biggie.

I live here 6-8 months out of the year and travel in Asia for the rest of it.

>>60898901
Damn that sounds nice. Are foreigners allowed to own houses there? Shit's so expensive in Australia rn

gramps recommended me to go all in Gold in 2019

>normie
buy a house and pile money into index funds has worked great for me. you can't lose money in the stock market, the .gov will step in and print everyone's dollar into worthlessness because they let the bajillionaires go bankrupt. the US system is completely rigged, privatize the gains socialize the losses. it has been since 2008, we're not every going back to fundamentals, as a quick look at P\E tells you.

The AI revolution poses some interesting questions. What do we do with all these useless plebs who want to use resources and are no longer needed?

>>60899457
Gramps probably remembers when they didn't allow you to buy gold.

>>60898781
They're not mutually exclusive, but you can definitely get a whole lot more stock equity if you are paying less in housing. I'm also not suggesting a portfolio of only stock equity, I'm only pointing out how the common advice of "save for a house" is not always the best advice or particularly profound.

REITs are also interesting, they're similar to owning actual property (at least exposure wise). I might buy some in my roth next year

>>60896467
>living with your parents is cringe and no woman want to fuck a namby pamby mama baby boy
Say thank you jews.

>>60894797
boomers love misery and company

>>60893975 (OP)
If you buy a house, you can sell it and get money back. If you rent, the money is gone forever. Even if the house doesn’t raise in price, you still get something back. That’s all.

>>60893975 (OP)
I would stick my member in the mom on the far left if you know what I mean

>>60900850
>muh equity
So close! You almost said something original.