>What you have to fear the most is Britain turning into a catholic dictatorship!

>>149127708 (OP)
Yeah, that book aged poorly. Nothing like the hell of Anarcho-tyranny.

>>149127708 (OP)
I really need to read this in full at some point. Believe it or not, I actually kind of liked the movie and thought it was rather decent

Was not expecting the Guy Fawkes mask to take off as some neckbeard protest face covering. Also surprised that Mr. Robot got away with using a "TOTALLY DIFFERENT" version of it

>>149127708 (OP)
Roight wut eff

>>149127708 (OP)
This shit was good. When crazy writers believe their own bullshit, even for a moment, you get good stuff.
>>149127963
Heh.

>>149127708 (OP)
Actually Norsefire isn't the scary thing, it's HOW Norsefire took over, as far as Moore having a moment of post-nut clarity about how commie/SJW bullshit leads to hell on earth

>>VFV takes place in a world where commie Labor Party leader Michael Foot, became Prime Minister after the Labor Party runs the table and forces out Thatcher and the Torries in the 1983 election

>>Labor and Foot enact Militant (IE hardcore commie freaks)'s dream wish list of commie shit onto England, even as Foot declares England 100% neutral and kicks out the US and basically tells Russia that they won't do a thing to help the US if WW3 happens. Which it does.

>>England survives WW3 intact but the commie shit of Militant and Foot being a huge craven fuck up means England is a shit show after the war even if it was left unmolested.

>>Everyone is sick of Labor and the commie Militant fuckers, so they vote in Norsefire to fix shit, even though they are racist fascists. Because Foot and the Militant infested Labor Party fucked up THAT bad.

>>149128189
That's not "post-nut clarity". That's the Weimar republic followed by the Nazi party's rise into power.

>>149127963
I used to like the movie before I read the comic and realized how much of a hatchet job they did to it to make it another tired Bush allegory. Just like the Watchmen movie a lot of the nuance was lost as well.

>>149128759
Examples of the nuance lost in the Watchmen film?

>>149129452
Pretty much anything with Rorschach. The flashback scene in particular.

>>149129466
Jog my memory been a while since I watched the film

>>149129485
Movieshcach is just too emotional, instead of a muted, cold rage he's constantly flipping out. It's especially apparent in the flashback where in the comic when Rorschach snaps he slowly and methodically burns the suspected pedo alive without saying much of anything, in the movie he's frothing with rage and says a stupid one-liner as he hacks him to death on top of the suspected pedo mocking him the whole time to make his death seem even more justified.

>>149129452
Is…is this bait? Am I being trolled?

>>149127708 (OP)
Now it's turning into an Islamic anarcho-tyranny.

>>149129452
Snyder should, unironically, make anime. Sucker Punch, Rebel Moon, all of these things have anime sensibilities and would be better as such. He isn't a good director. Snyder desperately wants to be like a Christopher Nolan, someone with mainstream appeal who blends visuals and melodrama in a way to make people feel clever. Snyder fans desperately insist they are intellectual (just look at the DC fans) but who painfully aren't.

Watchmen to many feels "faithful" as if it just tore panels out the comic book but in actuality it feels inhuman and pours too much into visuals and spectacle over anything else. It misses the point in so many little and grand ways. It is almost like the satire paradox, how when something satirises something but uses the aesthetical markers of a thing, people who are fans of the thing cling on to the aesthetics and forget about the satire.

I fear half the problem is people read something like Watchmen and like the aesthetics over any depth. Watchmen is on recommended lists and constantly reprinted and fans hold up Watchmen as a life raft to cling on to so they can claim their medium is mature. But most of the people reading Watchmen aren't really having that debate over the nature of heroes or anything else present because they start the same retarded debates over it. They like the feeling of feeling clever rather than being.

Actually sit down and re-read the comic, don't rush it, actually take it in. There are plenty of subtly in the art and elsewhere that people can miss. Then go and watch the movie and see that reduced to nothing.

One of the few comics that I have both the completed ten issue run and the trade that seen better days.

>>149127708 (OP)
you know there's been entire wars fought over that exact premise irl right

literally riots during the American war due to the decriminalization of Catholicism in England, like do you niggers even know who George Gordon was, the man who was so far off the deep end that "Mad" King George III thought he was balls deep in cashews

>>149131521
Snyder's best film is animated so it's not like he's unfamiliar with directing animation. Legend of the Guardians still looks amazing

>>149131521
Considering his animation forays have been mid as hell too I don't necessarily think going into anime would be much of an improvement for him.

>>149132341
I know some of his animation has been mid but Sucker Punch and Rebel Moon would make better anime than live action. I would argue the same for some of his other movies.

>>149132680
I don't know about that, the main problem with those movies are the really shitty writing so a change in medium would be a lateral move at best.

>>149128021
charlie brooker prays to jewish demons wishing he had an idea as good as alan moore.

>As a homosexual, I keep preciously a quran at home
>no, I don't understand a word of arabic, but I like its poetry!

>>149133327
its a good joke, but i cant tell if you understood that or said it to act edgy

>>149128759
Eh, honestly the comic meanders quite a bit. The adaptation loses a couple of things I like, but it's ultimately the tighter and better structured story of the two. Of course there's nothing wrong with enjoying either.

>>149128189
>commie Labor Party
Kek

>>149133392
I couldn't disagree more. Watchmen is as tight as story you can tell in a 12 issue format, so many layers going on and every panel is tightly packed with detail and that's on top of all the deliberate setup and payoff. The movie excises so much of the little human moments that it ends up feeling sterile and lifeless which completely misses the point of the entire story. This is a story about how larger than life superheroes are actually human beings with all their flaws and it gets rid of the majority of the stuff that achieves that so they can be forced into a standard superhero mold. And don't get me started on how retarded changing the squid to Manhattan was. I see so many people praise this dumb change and it's infuriating because if you think about it for more than a minute it makes almost no thematic or logical sense. It was a change meant to sidestep all the setup the squid needed but it just leads to way more questions.

>>149133496
I was talking about V, not Watchmen.

The V adaptation is, I would argue, a slight improvement over the comic. The Watchmen adaptation, on the other hand, is a complete goddamned mess.

>>149131521
The best thing about Suckerpunch is its real women and not an anime how fucking dense can you be holy shit man. Anyone can make an anime like that. Only he did it with real hot women.

>>149130002
Wrong.
The pedo doesn't mock him, he begs for mercy and claims that he's sick and needs help. The movie made roarschach look edgier and more deranged because Snyder was afraid people would see him as a hero (they did. They always will)

>>149129452
I like how nobody could present a single correct example

>>149133700
I still disagree, not as vehemently but still. V isn't my favorite story of Moore's but I feel like the comic's characters are far more engrossing, the movie sanitizes them a little too much for my liking. Norsefire in particular suffers the worst of it because like I said before they turned something that was more 1984 into a really played out Bush allegory. It's not nearly as bad as the Watchmen movie but I feel like it lost a lot in translation and this is coming from someone that actually liked the movie at first so I had zero biases going in.

>>149133781
Fair enough.

>>149133774
Every single example is correct.

>>149133849
There was one example given (roarshach flashback) and it was by a poster who misremembered the movie

>>149133765
Yes he does, he confesses to the crime with a shit eating grin and demands to be arrested. That's also after he tried to shoot Rorschach. Just contrast that particular scene with the comic, the pedo lives in a simple dingy house not some Tim Burton haunted house and he never attacks Rorschach or confesses to his crime. Rorschach also gives him a very quick death instead of relishing in watching him burn to death SAW style. The movie goes out its way to give Rorschach every justification to snap, like the vast majority of people would have reacted the same way in that situation. Even their demeanors are completely different, movie Rorschach is understandably exploding with rage while comic Rorschach is unnervingly silent.

>>149133907
>>149133765
Also the monologue directly after the flashback in the movie is completely fucking neutered, just utterly limp. Now compare it to this page and it's like night and day, THIS is something I can conceivably see Malcom getting unnerved by.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J03LsclqPUU

>>149133907
I don't know how anybody could find the comic version of the pedo (is he even a pedo in the comic?) anymore sympathetic than the movie version, but I agree that the way the scene plays out is totally different, and the snyder version is worse. Though I don't think that roarschach hacking the guy apart in the movie makes him look LESS deranged than him calmly lighting the dude on fire. The average person thinks putting child killers in woodchippers is justified, much less burning them alive.

>>149131521
Ok but the 300 movie is still kino

>>149134031
It's all a matter how he reacts to the situation. In the movie his reaction is entirely out of impulsive rage, this is a normal person's reaction to finding a murdering nonce. In the comic he truly snaps and becomes something else, he's cold and calculating and looking to inflict as much pain as possible on him but not showing an ounce of reaction. Even in the present he's recounting all this heavy shit in an almost robotic tone with a completely blank expression, Haley doesn't even come close to that level though I don't blame him much he was probably given terrible direction and was likely told to play up the emotion.

>>149134031
>>149134097
Also I don't think it's a matter of sympathy for the pedo (I think that's heavily the implication that he is one in the comic) it's a matter of how one is passive and how the other is active. One makes it much, much easier for Rorschach to cross the line so much so that it isn't really a line at all. The other requires Rorschach to go in a much darker place, he's straight up executing a guy in a really gruesome death who the entire time has been pathetic and sniveling towards him.

>>149129452
>>149133774
It's been a long time since I read Watchmen but just off the top of my head:
> Rorschach didn't care about "someone knocking off masks" and "wanting to get justice" he was just powering through an investigation because that's his job. Almost like the Terminator
> There's some emphasis placed on Rorschach being awkward at shaking hands because he's so autistic he doesn't know how to do even the simplest of human interactions which informs a significant portion of his character
> Almost 100% of his morality & drive for being a superhero comes from a one-off comment his prostitute Mother made about thinking his Dad was a Truman supporter and in his autism hyper-focused on that and built his entire worldview around deifying Truman as a Superhero that his Dad respected
> Much more time given to Silk Spectre and the Comedian's relationship both Mother and Daughter
> Much more screentime given to Silk Spectre 2 and Dr. Manhattan's relationship with the revelation of her Father being a rare moment that breaks his fugue state
> The metaphor of the comic book panels being how Dr. Manhattan perceives time (the entirety of existence being a comic book for him) with him being able to pick up the book and open it to any page and look at any panel and see that moment happening in real time and each panel existing simultaneously for him
> The pirate story the kid in the comic is reading being a metaphor for the Watchmen story and their world and it progressing in ways that mirror the story. Also the subtle detail that superhero comics aren't popular in a world of superheros
> The relationship between the newstand guy and kid reading the comic gradually growing over the course of the story and being affected by the news
> The alien plot being a bit more nuanced than blaming it on Dr. Manhattan
> The implication that The Comedian assassinated a majority of the "missing/retired" heroes, with two possibly appearing in the background under assumed identities

>>149133723
There are better things to coom to, gooner anon

>>149128189
No thats dumb. Militant weren't modern soi commies and would have had no problem using martial law to get there way. If Foot objects he gets removed. And the rest of the world is ruined so you have to have a command economy even if you don't like them. Norsefire would have all been shot before they got started

>>149128189
It kinda is Batman but 1984.

>>149128700
>>149128189
>Living under socdems is so fucking terrible that you need to vote fascists in because literally anything else is better than socdem retards
Bravo Moore.

>>149136138
I don't think leftists like socdems.

>>149134526
Roarschach mistakenly investigating Comedian's death as a "mask killing" while the Comedian was probably a legit Mask Killer is a fun little irony.

>>149136075
Yeah, it's great. I'd like more comics that do that kinda stuff.

>>149137493
I have no problem with getting inspired. But Moores behaviour like others using his or older idea are very weird. He basically just take old concepts or “what if but…“.
So he is like a hypocrite here. The difference is just he is a good writer and evolves the concept further than the original stuff.

>>149128189
What the hell is Militant?

>>149127708 (OP)
I don't think there's a single catholic person in London any more.

>>149138484
Militant was the hardcore communist wing of the Labour party. In the 1970s, they staged a coup against the center-right moderates through the fact that Militant was filled with young unemployed Marxists who could spend all their time to protesting and political meetings. Foot was their useful idiot because Foot hated the US and was hyper obsessed with turning the UK into a neutral nation ala Switzerland and wanted total disarmament of the nation, thinking of they play dead, then Russia would leave them alone in the event of nuclear war.

Militant famously seized control over local governments in cities big and small, engaging in open blacklisting of anyone not right of Stalin as far as denying work via government programs to help the unemployed/giving themselves and their friends cushy do nothing jobs, and going into massive debt, bankrupting major cities and towns with their communist inspired programs and graft. And when Labour big whigs called them on that and refused to demand on their behalf that Thatcher bail them out, they used their lack of lives to change Labour Party rules to basically make it so rank and file party members could impeach Labour politicians from their offices.

Foot's disastrous 1983 run was only allowed to happen because the moderates finally had enough and decided to prove that Foot and Militant were out of touch with reality and combined with several high profile corruption scandals involving Militant blackballing) embezzlement schemes, basically purged them from Labour via blackballing the blackballers.

>>149138788
Reading this made me look them up to learn about them, and, it's kind of hilarious how bad their modern logo is.

>>149131879
>do you niggers even know who George Gordon was, the man who was so far off the deep end that "Mad" King George III thought he was balls deep in cashews
let's see
>made anti-catholic army
>over several days, destroyed several Roman Catholic chapels, pillaged the private dwellings of Catholics, set fire to Newgate Prison, broke open all the other prisons, and attacked the Bank of England and several other public buildings
>converted to judaism afterwards
breh
could attacks on catholics be even more interesting ?

>>149138411
No, there's a disconnect here. He's not the most original writer ever, but what he does is wear his influences on his sleeve. His detractors use this to try to discredit him. But if you're familiar with the writing game, you'll realize how pretty much everything has been done already.
Moore's problem with people revisiting his ideas is that DC is making money off his name. It's not really hypocrisy, more like a personal problem he's outspoken about.

>>149136138
He wasn't saying that, he was saying that left wing tyranny can lead to people wanting a right wing tyranny. For your interpretation to be correct, he would have to make Norsefire the good guys. They are the bad guys of the comic, why would he endorse them?

Jesus Christ.

>>149138788
do you have a source for this because it sounds too stupid in my opinion, even for Communists, even ones as petty as British politicians i.e. the sort of people who brand a group terrorists for spraypainting a knob on a fighter jet, and make support for them illegal up to and including protesting against that law.

>>149140012
>They are the bad guys
Except V isn't a "good guy". This wasn't that kind of story. It was an ideological argument of fascism vs anarchy.

>>149133774
I think there have been plenty examples

>>149133490
It made more sense before Blair.

>>149138788
>center-right moderates
Do you mean center-left?

>>149140082
V would've hated Norsefire just as much if they were tankies. Or do you think he'd just sit there idly if far-left authoritarian rule in Britain had survived?

>>149140067
Watch Labour the Wilderness Years on YouTube. It's a documentary on the Labour party's struggle in the 1980s and goes into graphic detail about Militant and how they play a key role in kneecapping any attempt by Labour to stop Thatcher in the 80s with their bullshit

>>149127708 (OP)
The movie's plot point about the government knowingly killing their own citizens with a viral outbreak and using the resulting panic as an excuse to institute a surveilance state dictatorship sure aged poorly.

>>149139891
You are right, his critic is that DC is mostly using old stuff over and over again.

>>149138975
George Gordon was very clear that he had nothing to do with any of that tho

he just literally met the King thinking the middle of riots was a time he'd get listened to, and he was right, and the King heard him and thought he was a fuckwit

>>149128759
V was more villainous in the comic too.

>>149140696
Far left authoritian rule isn't Anarchy so he'd try to kill them all as well. Like the Joker in the Dark Knight, he wants anarchy. It is the position he believes the world should go into.

That's why they had the scene where V is talking to the statue where he points out that his way makes no promises. This isn't about "good guys" or "bad guys" cause if someone decides to put people in ovens under Anarchy, V won't give a shit. He knows full well how bad thing can (and will) go under what is essentially mob rule.

>>149128189
>save Britain from certain annihilation in a nuclear war
>get voted out anyway

>>149143278
Britain was left maimed. The living suffer more than the dead when it comes to this.

>>149143278
It was their incompetence and retardation that cause the nuclear war in the first place. It was Norsefire that picked up the pieces and made sure civilization still existed.

>>149127708 (OP)
A communist would fear that the most.

>>149143278
Not the first time they'd have done it.

>>149146082
Nah Churchill was a right bastard, there is a reason his ass got kicked the fuck out right after.

>>149136075
I wish there was a 1984 comic, I've tried to read it before but found it very dry and hard to sift through. Maybe I'll have to force myself to do it.

>>149138411
>>149139891
There's a bit of a nuance to the issue. I could get really into Moore's penchant for that sort of thing and examine it as a means of reinvigorating English culture by utilizing it's folklore staples the same as I could argue that it was a bit of a one-off for him to use the characters he did for what became Watchmen, but I think what it really boils down to is the people who touch his stuff usually just screw it up and aren't very good at it on top of screwing him out of the money for it.

>>149146451
The book is good and not hard to read. Work your way up to it by reading easier books.

>>149146508
It seems like he only trusted Jamie Delano and Rick Veitch to succeed him, as both did on more than one occasion.