Thread 149134148

why do people hate tom king?

>>149134148 (OP)
Hot take, I'd rather read any King book than any Taylor book.

glowie so terrible at his job they fired him, now he's doing the same at DC so it's only a matter of time

>>149134148 (OP)
/co/ hates him because he gets his hands on some of their favorite characters and performs CIA character assassinations.
I dislike his comics because he's a subpar writer who constantly uses writing crutches, writes unfunny humor, and is quite bad at dialogue and inner monologue.
>>149134179
I rather read neither.

I'm surprised he still had a job at DC after HiC

He takes obscure but well defined characters and warps them to fit his aimless stories, most of which have a weird, demoralizing tone to them.

Pic related sums it up pretty well.

>>149134246
HiC was an inside job by Editorial and Didio. It’d have turned out the same under any other writer. Might have had less ‘story about therapy written by someone very clearly terrified of the idea of therapy,’ but Wally getting character assassinated would have happened regardless.

>>149134246
He's the son of a WB executive and he styles himself as a wounded war veteran (sat in an air conditoned compound). DC will always push him forever.

because he can't write

>>149134148 (OP)
He was partial to instigating the illegal war against Saddam Hussein (rest in peace) and nation of Iraq under false pretenses.
His comics also suck

are we excusing King for Heroes in Crisis by pulling the editorial card now? same thing happened with Spencer on Secret Empire btw

>>149134342
Nah, it’s still mostly King’s fault and it’s still a bad story, but it’s dumb to pin character assassinating Wally entirely on King when Didio and Editorial had it out for Wally since Day 1.

>>149134361
thats fair, I know Diddyio had this planned sooner or later but I dont want to let King go scot-free

>>149134394
>let King go scot-free
He did, literally and figuratively.

>>149134148 (OP)
He's a terrible writers who often substitutes wordy nothingness for actual competent writing and often just mischaracterized everyone he writes. He's also a war criminal with a weird obsession with America, like most of his shit is basically the moral equivalent of a trauma post but his trauma is him bombing wedding in the middle east.

>>149134148 (OP)
He's a terrible writers who often substitutes wordy nothingness for actual competent writing and often just mischaracterized everyone he writes. He's also a war criminal with a weird obsession with America, like most of his shit is basically the moral equivalent a writer who makes everything about "their trauma" but his trauma is that he bombed weddings in the middle east.

>>149134148 (OP)
The CIA traffic kids.

>>149134148 (OP)
ask Yasuhiko Asaka man idk

>>149134179
One is inoffensively mediocre and the other is aggressively bad and destructive.
You'd rather read Tom King Batman over Tom Taylor Nightwing?
You'd rather read Tom King Heroes in Crisis over Tom Taylor Beast World?

>>149134148 (OP)
>>149134569

>>149134148 (OP)
I liked Sheriff of Babylon but most of his superhero stuff has felt like that but in a lazily slapped on superhero coat of paint, often missing the tone or voice of some characters and their history by a mile in a way that just isn't great.

>>149134148 (OP)
I think a book like Human Target is a good example. I enjoyed it. But it features a bunch of mischaracterizations that you have to gloss over if you want any hope of enjoying it. The art is lovely and carries it hard. It was overly praised for what it was.

Tom King is in the same realm as a Bendis where they did make popular things that sold well. Slop lovers blindly love them and they double down on their weaknesses whilst getting given bigger and bigger profiles, given more and more books and events to cut their teeth on. It's clear they have their favourites and interests and they also play the "U mad, fanboy" type games on occasion.

People on /co/ and certain parts of the internet however will argue that they are completely irredeemable trash. The truth is most writers, in a similar way to actors playing themselves, are just repeating the same themes slapped onto each thing they are working on.

He's a mid mainstream guy that doesn't deserve the extreme hate or extreme praise.

>>149134148 (OP)
>Bat
>Cat
>Bat
>Cat
>Bat
>Cat
>Bat
>Cat
>Bat
>Cat
>Bat
>Cat
>I am Gotham. I am Murder or something.
>Bat
>Cat

>>149135799
>You'd rather read Tom King Batman over Tom Taylor Nightwing?
>You'd rather read Tom King Heroes in Crisis over Tom Taylor Beast World?
Yeah probably at least I can get a good chuckle out of Batman and HiC. DC treats Nightwing and Beastworld like they're big deals when in actuality it's the most boring comics that had ever been published by DC. And God forbid you critique the work of a man that only gets praise for faggifying straight characters.

>>149134148 (OP)
>why do people hate tom king?
he does the same thing ever my menta issues ALSO:
>KILLING ALFRED
ALSO:
MULTIVERSA THOMAS WAYNER FROM ANOTHER DIMIENSON IS NOT BRUCE WAYNE'S FATHER

Mainly those 3 issues, they are quite big, I guess DC forced him to do that AWFUL staff either DC or DIDIO.

>>149136115
I don't know. King has written some pretty bad shit.

How can I hate the man who gave us and the world THIS?

>>149137987
That wasn't King in the slightest
>>149134148 (OP)
King has the "omelette du fromage" problem, where the first time you read his work it sounds interesting and exotic but you quickly realize he's saying the same thing over and over again and it's just "cheese omelet"

Every story he writes is about a PTSD-afflicted sadboy who has a dommy mommy gf/wife, absolutely no range. It was novel when he did with Omega Men (even though it fucked over Kyle Rayner) and Vision, became tiresome when he kept doing it.

>>149134148 (OP)
CIA Jew that helped destabilize the middle east, with a mom that was an executive at Warner Bros that got him the job. He gets the prime job of writing batman, and proceeds to make it about catwoman while ridiculing Batman.

Pretty easy to hate. Hes a marginally more talented Max Landis.

>>149138324
That explains why people liked Mr miracle, sad boy with Dom wife describes him pretty well.

His wife also a CIA jew.

>>149138286
>That wasn't King in the slightest
No?

>>149138535
Tynion words, Jimenez design, Tom King perhaps in the building at the time

>>149138586
Oh, I see now. Thank you anon.

>>149137987
terrible, like all tynion characters

>>149134148 (OP)
He turned Guy Gardener into a wife beating psychopath..

>>149134342
>>149134361
King for all his many faults admits that Wally wasn't his pick for the villain and it was way too short for what he set up (iirc it was gonna be 9 issues but got cut) but that's the only breaks he gets

>>149138628
Yeah the only thing good about her is her design which isn't even any good thematically, it's just an easily cosplayed nice-looking outfit worn by an attractive woman.

>>149136975
>I can get a good chuckle out of Batman and HiC
>Cripples Dick
>Murders Roy
>Torpedoes Wally
>Murders Alfred
>I AM GOTHAM
>I AM SUICIDE
>I AM BANE
>I AM BAT CAT BAT CAT BAT CAT BAT CAT CAT BAT

You're either Tom King trying to keep your residuals coming from the TPB sales (respect) or you have absolutely no taste.

>>149138380
You mean his mom.

>>149134148 (OP)
I found his writing painfully repetitive.
>Repetitive?
Repetitive.
>Painfully.
Painfully.
>And you dislike it?
I dislike it.
>Because you're the reader.
I'm the reader.
>And he's the writer.
(Narration box) [And he's the writer.]

On a similar note, how come /co/ hates Jason Aaron so much?

>>149138352
I don’t think he’s a jew

>>149138324
I read his Vision first back when sucked his dick and thought it was awful. You fuckers gave me shit even though I was in the right.

>>149138324
I read his Vision first, back when /co/ sucked his dick, and thought it was awful. You fuckers gave me shit even though I was in the right.

>>149134148 (OP)
he constantly emasculates straight white male characters to push some bizzare feminist agenda
>>149134179
that like chosing between pest and cholera

>>149139234
He writes like a fag and his shit is all retarded.

>>149139234
He's a southern lib who loathes the people he's surrounded by and does the most embarrassing self-flagellation in his work about it.

>>149134148 (OP)
probably all the shitty things he's written

>>149139245
He openly talks about it dude. Use google ffs.

>>149139072
her too, probably, but also his wife.

>>149139234
/co/ fucking hates everyone

>>149140401

Good point.

>>149134148 (OP)
Here is why

>Tom King : this is the first time Batman got heartbroken by someone he loves
The robins' death, Shondra losing herself and become a child minded for curing him,Jezebel is undercover Black Glove agent, Sasha being framed for murder and Tortured, Zatanna's betrayal, Talia's madness and now that the phantom mask is canon Andrea's leaving.
I didn't have any feeling for Catwoman or the bat/cat. But thanks to Tom King I hated her.
Tom wanted to show how great Catwoman is, how pure is the bat/cat love, but he did it in the most disgusting, repulsive way.
>Catwoman is the only one who understands Batman
What about Alfred and the family, the ones whos stick by his side through all of the Crises (knightfall, no man's land, being accused of murder, war games, .....etc)
>Catwoman is the ultimate badass who beat everyone (Talia, ivy, 3 Flashs, some worrier who's friend with Diana, Bane, Joker) and Batman is a sissy who gets beaten by everyone (Bane, Talia, Ivy, Harley, Joker, some punks in the mountains, HOLLY ROBINSON)
Batman trained for years in the hands of great masters, he stands shoulder to shoulder with gods and superpowers being and beaten gods and monsters, Catwoman is an acrobatic thief.
>Isolates Batman from his family and friend, taking down the oldest and pushing the closest just to manifest how unique his Relationship with Catwoman is
you can write a love story without distortion the other relationships.
Don't get me started on Thomas Wayne, the man is pushing 70, drunk, has no proper training, and magically defeats the whole Batfamily. It’s not even about Catwoman or Thomas's way, it's about turning Batman into an emasculated cuck. I asked King if Catwoman pegs Batman and he blocked me. Lots of people did.

>>149134148 (OP)
He "deconstructs" heroes even if no fans asked for that.
Especially when it's white male characters.

Also his more "serious" work (if we can "serious" stories about super heroes) are boring as fuck, too long, with lazy "9 cases" pages.
Pretentious too.

>>149134148 (OP)
>why do people hate Multiple Eisner Award Winner Tim King℠?

tom queen lol

>>149134148 (OP)
Was he actually in the CIA or was that a lie?

>>149134569
I'm repeating myself from another thread but while Up in Sky wasn't an unemployable read you can cut the pretentiousness and desire to be the next Grant Morrison with a knife.

>>149142616
I haven't read the whole thing, but every page I've seen has been tryhard trash like this one.

reminder that he's using his shitty wonder woman daughter comic to revisit the marriage

>>149142547
Him being in the CIA, not a lie

The extent of what he claims to have been involved may be vastly overblown, as in less Jack Ryan and more Jim from the Office

>>149138628
>>149138917
How is it possible to have such shit taste?

>>149139234
I think hating him really took off with his Thor run when the female Thor took over and Aaron stayed on the book far too long, Then his Avengers run where he was just retconning the hell out of Marvel history with his Caveman Avengers, and a lot of the run was Multiverse Slop vs Mephisto Slop.

>>149134148 (OP)
King saved DC comics and the fans are ungrateful cunts about it.

>>149142975
yeah man punchline and ghost-maker, real cream of the crop right there. gimme a break

why do people hate bendis ? he wrote a lot of good shit early on

>>149139283
The few of us on /co/ who actually like Vision were right there with you. This anon talking about one of King's other books nails the same problem his Vision book had: >>149136115
>But it features a bunch of mischaracterizations that you have to gloss over if you want any hope of enjoying it.
The problem is most readers wouldn't have been noticing issues like this until King was writing higher-profile characters like Batman. He could get away with mangling characterization of lower-tier heroes with small fanbases.

The Vision book likely only even existed as part of Brevoort's efforts to fight MCU synergy, it was Marvel's second attempt within a year to give Vision a robot family to keep him away from Wanda, and has since locked him in the role of being a single dad grieving for a dead wife and son. The flashback issue delivers some nasty retcons to try and make it look like Vision and Wanda were always doomed, and it was timed for the month the Civil War movie was released, the moment where the MCU was obviously making them a couple.

>>149142705
It's only six issues and it won't kill you, but you really get the the impression he's hoping his lines will be SUPER EPIC. Like in the last issue he just keeps having Superman repeat some variation of "No sir, [It won't do that thing you said"] like he really things he's doing something ground breaking powerful.

>>149143252
Bendis's early work has exactly the same problems as his later work

>>149143252
No he didn't and a pox on all the retards who fell for it

>>149142616
Forcing a child to relive a traumatic event while she's still in the hospital seems out of character

>>149144564
Ultimate Spider-Man was fun until Bagley left.

>>149144609
It was drawn out annoying teen drama crap.

>>149144667
Yeah. That's always been about 50% of what Spider-Man is.

>>149143252
He was just around for too long and got retarded. Daredevil and USM were both good.
It's a very similar situation to Loeb except Loeb lost his son to caner and went crazy from the grief. Bendis just got retarded for no good reason.

Sidenote: Who are some writers that have been around for a long time and are pretty much universally loved? I've not seen anyone say anything mean about the Ruckateer and I'm a pretty big fan of Giffen, Dini, and Cooke fan but I've seen people criticize the last two a couple of times.
I miss when people appreciated Johns for being a Michael Bay type 'big explosions and epic moments with no real substance' writer.

>>149144768
Rucka's return to Wonder Woman after Azzarello was pretty retarded

>>149144777
Damn. I have never given a shit about WW and have largely ignored mainstream comics for a long time so I was unaware of this. That's a shame.

>>149134148 (OP)
For me, its that webm where he's making a joke with a bunch of writers (including Frank Miller) around and he goes
>well in Miller's book, when Batman hangs a criminal upside down and threatens to throw him off the building, he gets scared and starts laughing
>but in real life, thats not how it goes
>akward pause
>akward laugh
Comedy gold

>laughing
Talking*

>>149139234
They read his comics, you goddamn fucking retard.

>>149144316
Being written by bendis?

>>149143085
>cavengers
I get the impression we were already hating his shit, just not him directly. Did he write X-Men: Schism, by any chance?
And let's not forget Punisher later on.

>>149144730
Yes, except with Bendis it's drawn out to a torturous degree. Any other previous writer would sum up what he did in a page.

>>149145669
Benis somehow managed to turn the first issue of Amazing Spider-Man into a six-issue arc

>>149144828
it's not that retarded, but it's basically fanfic to push his characters from the first run

>>149145697
it's retarded in that his response to all the big changes Azzarello made was "yeah none of that happened, fuck you"

>>149145683
God I can't believe it took 5 issues to kill Uncle Ben.

>>149145716
Rebirth was a de facto reboot but they didn't want anyone calling it that
I only judge based on the quality of any story and don't care about timeline and canon bullshit, which applies to both the New 52 and Rebirth.
It was mediocre and a far cry from his first run anyway.

>>149145716
Sounds based actually

>>149144147
This is the reason why people hate Superman.

>>149144918
kek

>>149146272
Let's call rebirth what it is. A mulligan.

>>149143252
I've only recently tried to read his Daredevil and Alias, and they're both awful.

>>149134148 (OP)
His wonder woman stuff is offensively bad

>>149148125
The Wonder Woman comic against Christianity has to be the worst thing the CIA has ever done, by far.

>>149143252
/co/ culture, he's written a bunch of duds but isn't nearly as bad as retards on this board make him to be. most of it is screeching about Miles' existence tho
>>149144768
does JMS count? considering he's returning for another Spider-Man book

>>149148096
Bad taste

>>149148347
Kek

>>149134148 (OP)
He is king of writing shit comics.

>>149145683
Amazing Fantasy #15 was incredibly compressed and no one would write an issue like that in the past 20 years.
Bendis's stories read just fine in trades, which was the intended reading format.

>>149150022
>no one would write an issue like that in the past 20 years
Skill issue.
Coincidentally starting around the time Marvel started to push the "writing for trades" meme.

>>149148315
No. Try reading them right now.

>>149134148 (OP)
I don't mind a lot of his stuff honestly

>>149152431
Most people don't. This is comics, they're meant to be garbage.

>>149146307
Not really. It's both a case of him burning off unused scripts from his first run and him trying to retcon out everything that happened in between his two runs. The problem is that that was a decade and half between his runs and there were things he couldn't retcon out. So you kept getting plot points you didn't care about because the setup was back when you were in high school and characters showing up when they don't make sense because they no longer have the status quo or backstory to be there. On top of that he was also using it to burn off his All-Star Wonder Woman scripts, which meant the pacing was fucked because every other issue was yet another Diana origin story despite DC simultaneously publishing a standalone Diana origin story by a different author. And then, after all that, he starts actively retconning shit from his original run and before. Rucka's second run is, politely, self-indulgent, and more accurately what normally happens when you let an obsessive fanboy have complete control over a character.

>>149134283
What C-listers has he made miniseries for like this?

>>149154598
Vision, Human Target, Strange Adventures, Mister Miracle

>>149154787
Thanks

>>149151306
When Bill Jemas was running Marvel, he was literally ordering writers to do decompressed stories, to plot for the trade, to write like Bendis.

Before the 2000s, outside of the Masterworks line, Marvel's trade game was pretty bad, a few evergreen books, some random collections, and a lot of classic, important storylines that had never been collected, but suddenly EVERYTHING was getting reprinted less than a year down the line, whether it warranted it or not, and the whole industry followed suit ever since.

>>149148298
JMS's Spider-Man has some bad associations between Sins Past and Morlun, plus, you know, One More Day (which obviously he wasn't entirely responsible for but his name is still on the story).

>>149139234
Leo goes soul-searching journey, and he want softshell turtles kill him and eat him.

Mikey has become a celebrity in Japan, but he isn't happy because he just been caught up in family soap opera plot, he felt empty, and blame his brothers for abandon him.

Casey was shot and into a coma/hospital because Aaron want April to take his place.

>>149134148 (OP)
He gave Colin Powell faulty info that put us in a 20 years war that cost American soliders their lives and taxpayers $8 trillion dollars

>>149148298
JMS is garbage.

>>149156438
Fuck you, man, he made Babylon 5.

>>149154895
Thanks for elaborating my point?

based bendis booty blasting niggas in this thread simply for existing

i honestly cant think of a single writer that /co/ actually likes

>>149157819
Dennis O'Neil

>>149157819
Mike Carey

>>149158234
Not me. I respect him, but he's not a great writer.

>>149157819
Charles Schulz

>>149150022
>Bendis's stories read just fine in trades, which was the intended reading format.

Except they were SOLD in floppies you monumental sped. Trades didn't come out till much later. And forcing books to be written for trades is part of why so many books suck.

>>149142816
Yea, that quote pretty much encapsulates Tom King's overall writing style; pompous, arrogant, and completely unaware of reality.

>>149142816
Wow, whoever Frankie Boyle is, he does a great impression of Tom King's dogshit retarded slop writing style. That's a great piece of satire, hopefully.

>>149134148 (OP)
He killed my dog

>>149159098
He kicked your dog?

>>149148315
>defending Bendis
>>149159051
He's a Scottish comedian.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGhOmO8mZUM

>>149158961
I never bought a single Ultimate Spider-Man floppy. I did buy all the trades where Bagley was on art.

>>149144147
he always does this catchphrase bullshit
with Wonder Woman it's "no thank you"

>>149143212
there are fates worse than death

>>149143212
DC hasn't produced a single worthwhile comic since Tom King joined.

He does this

>>149156453
Fuck Babylon 5.

A lot of his stories are essentially about how everyone is too mean to him and don't understand how torturing and killing people in the Middle East is very important work.

>>149156438
>I must be contrarian and different from everyone reeeeee

>>149163263
Just stating a fact. Facts aren't contrarian.

>>149160745
Absolute DC is great shut up
but Tom King is retarded that's true

>>149163517
sure you are pablo

>>149134148 (OP)
There’s quite a few reasons he’s very disliked.

>not a good writer, he genuinely tells the same kind of story over and over with slight variations or he will literally rip off scripts whole cloth and think no one will notice
>uses fan favorite characters and botches their characterizations to the point said characters are unrecognizable
>pretends to be a decent person but is actually a piece of shit that destroys lives
>mocks people who are grieving
>overplays his background to make his life sound more interesting
>his mom is a WB executive and literally fails upwards

>>149134148 (OP)
Because he’s popular and he sells well

It's like everything is therapeutic for him.
And we pay to be his therapist.

>>149163806
It's Paco.

>>149163798
>great
No.

>>149163798
>Absolute DC is great shut up
It's just DC updated to writer's twitter sensibilities

>>149134148 (OP)
>>149157702
>>149157776
>This writer is trash and getting gigs to write your favorite characters, why would you be mad?

>>149158279
Can't hate him if nobody read him.

>>149134148 (OP)
>people hate
Only idiots fully on-line with nothing else going on in their lives 'hate' King, he's a waste of space and time, and a largely unimaginative and creative 'talent.'

Hack would be too kind for him.
I'm all for pointing out what is wrong about him and I will take time out of my day to do so or chime in and agree with others doing so.
But I have more self-respect than to waste time and energy 'hating' on someone whose entire career is PTSD angst.

>>149168706
Based.

>>149153858
bait

>>149134231
so terrible that he was hired for the DCU. Curious what Gunn meant by that

>>149134271
This.