The tranny dares to talk about "grounded in reality"

>>149166684 (OP)
Troonworx BTFO

>>149166684 (OP)

>>149166741

>>149166804

>>149166684 (OP)
>is that... a male penis in my groin area?
>AHHHH IM GOING INSANE
why are trannies like this?

>>149166814
She must be squirting

>>149166684 (OP)
>He thinks zoob is the allegory

>>149166818
Too much porn

>>149166818
>>149166861
This

>>149166684 (OP)
>boy do I not like being a dude
>oh look, medication that makes you physically less of a dude and more of a chick
>wow still having a penis isnt ideal but golly I feel better with these boobs. It is a real fact of reality I was born a dude, didn't like it, tried to be more of a chick & and got some of the way there.
"RAAAAAAAGGGHGGHGHHGH THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE ABLE TO DECIDE YOUR SEX NOT YOU, YOU'RE NOT AN OFFICIALLY ELECTED HUMAN REEEEEEEEEEE YOU CANT EXPRESS FREE WILL OR ADJUST YOUR OWN BODY'S CHEMISTRY NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DADDY-STATE PLEASE TAX ME UNTIL THEYRE GONE"

>>149166684 (OP)
Maybe it's because they're FAGGOTS!

>>149166818
>why are trannies like this?

>>149167362
They can't groom autist men anymore because they caught on now and are racist and homophobic now.
Even autists don't wanna be associated with them.

>>149167356
I don't understand why you keep posting this adorable baby in TADC threads.

>>149167362
Im just curious, like I'm too old and such for this website anymore so I just want to ask from one generation to the other; do you actually believe that? Or do you know it's a joke? Or is it like, you don't care enough to look into the subject so a joke is as good as reality? Not trying to be a dick, I want to understand you guys for when I teach.

>>149167416
It's some bot some autist programed to post in these threads that have Pomni or Ragatha in the image

>>149167420
people have been doing the "taking a joke as reality" thing since the Carlos Mencia era on TV, maybe even further back

>>149167441
This thread was made by a bot, so makes sense

>>149167416
Birchy is an avatarfagging pedo

>>149167420
*sigh* Yes, boomer-kun, we really do believe that. Now go tell the kids about us.

>>149167362

>>149167457
Anyways enough about yourself.
Also who?

>>149167457
DON'T fuck up this thread too retard

>>149167457
Welp threads ruined, the namefag schizo is here, I'll hop over to the Ragatha thread if you need me.

>>149166684 (OP)
Zooble is a Girl, you mess up faggots

>>149167338
>be autistic man with porn addiction
>develop autogynephilia
>transform yourself into your ideal waifu
>demand the world plays pretend with you
>get told to fuck off and 41%
>REEEEEEE DADDY GOVERNMENT ARREST THEM FOR HATE CRIMES!!!! THIS HECKING TRANS GENOCIDE!!!

>>149167338
This but unironically.

>>149167457
shut the fuck up nobody cares about a made up anon I keep seeing you in every thread

I have no idea what the audience for this show is. It's so kiddy at it's core but it's obviously made for lorefag adults.

>>149167462
Damn blud thats on fleek, mucho cap for letting me cop that knowledge. Sussy literacy rates make me big sad fr str8 up unalive myself if ts doesnt get GOATED soon. On God's deadass, we cant flush the skibidis with the toilets.

>>149167338
What's wrong with just being a cute sweet pretty guy with a benis?

>>149167540
Bro youre just straight fucking retarded and easy to scam if you think the government is now or has ever been arresting more transphobes than trans people; like my god these prisons don't V-code themselves. And sex workers always get screwed over. US government has demanded a steady stream of trans imprisonment for *at least* a hundred years and it's only recently been told to knock it off with all the kidnapping.

>>149167625
Literally 100% nothing if thats what you want to do. But its not your place, or the place of the state, to attempt to legislate the sex and biology of others. At what point do we just start abducting everyone with unprofitable hormonal profiles and jacking them up full of testosterone so they're good workers and soldiers? Its nonsense imho. People should be responsible for their own damn selves.

>>149167575
the creator says it 18+ just so kids don't warp their minds by accident, but the studio is marketing it towards a 13+ audience

>>149167660
Isn't men just shaving and using skin, nail and hair beauty products good enough?
And just let woman workout more and grow out their body hair?
No slicing of tits and dick needed just to embrace their other side

>>149167356
> Maybe it's because they're FAGGOTS!
Says the pedo faggot who’s into anime for little girls.

>>149167766
You're not going to find a lot of trans people who disagree; people can be as gender conforming as they like. You're a macho guy? A soft fella? A girls' girl? A tomboy? Thats just you. Do it up. Gender dysphoria isnt being uncomfortable with your assigned role, its being uncomfortable with your body in a way that can be altered. Most people are 100% happy with their assigned happy, its maybe 1% of people who are trans. And for trans people no it is not sufficient to be gender nonconforming alone. You cant even really identify closeted trans people by gender nonconformity, I was fairly macho myself before transitioning.

>>149167472
>>149167506
>>149167529
>>149167567
Samefag.

>>149167842
42% yourself dude holy shit.

>>149167755
Son of a bitch. So long as Kinger doesn’t have these issues too

>>149167865
Isnt it 41%? Like attempted suicide rates pre transition? I think i will continue to 58-59% actually. And its pathetic to request others commit suicide imho.

>>149166684 (OP)
>complains about trannies while watching show made by a tranny
Why can't rightoids make some good animated show as well? I would like see some politically incorrect humor but there's nothing except shartjak slop.

>>149168004
>Why can't rightoids make some good animated sh-

>>149168004
Honestly the funny conservatives I can think of are funny in ways that dont easily translate to animation. Norm Macdonald is the gold standard funny right winger imho and he's done good voice acting but I can't see him sitting down to write a whole animated script. Doug Stanhope has a similar deal, these guys are funny off the cuff interpersonally not like from a distance writting characters; they're already characters.

I'd like more conservative made art too even as a lefty. When I saw the FNAF movie I kept thinking about how it was refreshingly christian. The antagonist wants to play god and be immortal, he's cruel to his creations and disdains innocence. The children are never shown to be willfully evil just tortured innocents. Redemption even exists for them as animatronics when they rebel against Afton. Its nice to see another culture's nightmare, and as a Christian horror story FNAF goes pretty hard. Compare it to like idk the therapeutic horror branch like Smile & I just think it's more original and frightening. Monsters like the one from Smile are so rules based and humanistic in origin it's hard to not imagine besting them. Afton as a monster is less easily dispelled because he's just an unrepentant sinner, we see those everyday, we'll never be rid of them.

Horror is the better genre for right wingers in general imho, they scare easily and thats not meant as an insult. Theyre in tune with fear.

>>149168106
Judge is a libertarian but I'll allow it

>>149168004
>Why can't rightoids make some good animated show as well?

>>149168145
>Judge is a [headcanon]

Delusional troon

>>149167420
What's not to believe about it? You have to crazy to be a tranny in the first place, so naturally autists make a fine target.

>>149168004
>being left wing or even moderate means you need to accept my delusional fantasies
You are the cancer that killed the left.

>>149167631
What are your thoughts on John Money?

>>149168184
Oh well even on the face of it the timelines don't line up. You can be as conservative as you like with the timeline of when trans people first popped up and it's still no dice. The Nazis burned the research of Magnus Hirschfield for his work on transcare for instance. And much much earlier than that you've got things like the salzikrum in The Code of Hammurabi and long oral history of multiple seperated indigineous peoples. There's also not enough trans people overall to really make this cost effective, although even if there were it's like what brainwash the population vs hire some cis women? A lot of trans people work in tech but not many tech workers are trans, again 1% of the population. It'd also be unrealistic because trans people still exist in transphobic regions & cultures.

You know who I respect? A christian girl I knew once who acknowledged all this history about trans people and what hrt really does; but still saw it as a sin. She didnt twist facts or make them up, trans "people exist and have existed for a long time. You can alter your sex but you shouldnt mess with God's design."

Maybe be more like her, shw had strength of character and mind.

>>149168210
The man who tried to prove that gender identity wasn't innate as part of a broader sociological movement to cast trans people as "corrupted gay people"? He was a piece of garbage. What is there to say? The man thought you could take a man and tell him he's a woman without consequence, ask female to male trans person how they feel about their childhood and you'll hear why that's a rotten thesis. This is setting aside all the freak pedo stuff because we can all agree thats heinous.

>>149168189
just come be a natsoc groyper with the rest of us. that's the closest you're ever getting to socialism now

>>149168380
>What is there to say?
His ideas formed the basis of your gender ideology. Like, he literally invented the concept of "gender" as you yourselves describe it.

>>149168392
>dick-sucking spic fuentes
>natsoc
lmao

>>149168443
>His ideas formed the basis of your gender ideology
That's wrong, look up his mentors and the movement he was part of. Money was against trans care and wanted to prove nobody had an innate gender identity. Gender as a term was in use before Money but he did popularize it's modern usage in an effort to curtail trans care. I'd compare this to how the man who coined the term Racism was also the fellow who wanted to "kill the Indian and save the man" by committing cultural genocide against native americans. There's a lot of this is in history desu.

>>149167842
You Woke defender of the Unnatural Body-horrors.

>>149168443
Also again the timelinew dont line up re: magnus hirschfield

>>149168516
Neuroscientists, biologists and the whole medical profession is disagreeing with you. But sure, buddy, keep believing you are the holder of the sole truth.

>>149168516
I just dont see this as respectable response. Has no one taught you how to argue yet? Start by stating your main point then add in some supporting facts. Save the punchy memes as a closer. You look foolish.

>>149167755
>Why does Jax mainly bullies the girls
Gee, I don't know. Maybe it's because the only other guy he can bully is Kinger, and there isn't really any fun in picking on someone so mentally detached from reality he doesn't know you're doing it.

>>149166684 (OP)
The tranny believes that they control reality so to them only the things that they want to be immutably real are real.

>>149168643
We really dont. I warp reality by taking hrt the same way cis women taking hrt warp reality. Your acting like we think we have magic powers when in reality we just know that tattoos tend to stick around for a while, get me?

>>149168705
>We

>>149167755
Kinger is completely unaware of Jax's insults. Caine can snap his fingers and make Jax do anything he wants so antagonizing him would be a horrible idea.

>>149167625
Twink death

>>149166818
>>149167338
Not all trannies get their dicks removed or even want to get the bottom surgery.
I think HRT grown tits and a nice looking dick is a god tier combination on attractive looking trans girls (yes, twinkish and feminine mtfs do exist yablablah)

>>149168560
>Yhe Science is settled, chud
>just forget about how The Science also used to say black people were inferior, that women need hysterectomies, that retards need frontal lobe lobotomies, that babies needed their dicks snipped without anesthics, that not washing before surgery was good, that.....

>>149168498
As always, it sounds like you've been mislead. John Money did invent the basis of your worldview.

>>149169822
>just forget about how The Science also used to say black people were inferior
The science still says that, people just get deplatformed for pointing it out.

>>149169843
Sort of like how they get deplatformed when they say trannies are freaks

>>149168334
Some guy made a joke and this is how you reacted? Do you need help?

>>149169823
No, he was an open opponent of transcare as we know it today which owes more to Magnus Hirschfield than Money. Who told you otherwise? Go do your own research. You won't find him promoting trans autonomy and healthcare that's for sure, he was in a school of thought among sexologists that considered all trans people to be corrupted gay people.

>>149169888
I asked if anyone took the joke seriously on any level, then I was asked why the joke shouldnt be taken seriously and I explained. I dont need help but maybe you need help keeping track of posts? And if him asking about first post was supposed to be a joke it wasn't good enough to make me not take it seriously, thats the social contract of the joke.

>>149168560
Great b8 m8

>>149168705
How many years do you think you have before you off yourself?

>>149170709
Like 40 minimum barring debilitating chronic pain or something like that. But honestly it's more likely I'm invited to die the old fashioned way rather than gatecrash. Why? Do you entertain suicidal ideations? It doesnt make you any less valuable.

>>149168560

>>149168595
Everything happens for a reason, pal.

>>149169858
Yeah, they said it.

https://x.com/blueinqnm/status/1898353995623657909

Reminder that a tranny bullied a selfless girl who loved saving foxes

They hate the fact their public perfect image is forever destroyed and are just as defective as the rest of the population.

>>149171127
We will never forget that...

>>149170865
I only as because of the disproportionately high rate of suicide among transgender individuals.

>>149171127
>The said tranny was a furfag homestuck loving redditor.

YIKES.

>>149171150
Disporportionate to what though? To cis people? That implies there's a low number it "ought" to be, but that doesn't comport with what we know gender dysphoria to be. If it wasn't something people suffered from then it wouldnt be something people risk such social alienation to alleviate. We shouldn't compare trans and cis people like that for that reason, of course one group is less troubled. Thats a given.

Whats more relevant is that suicidality decreases with treatment. The 41% percent comes from suicidal ideations which are pre transition, post transition the suicide rates go far down. If we compare people with gender dysphoria who transition to those who don't using survivors as data we see that treatment is the way to go.

Additionally suicide rates are decreased by social acceptance. When governments turn an authoritarian eye to queer liberty they make conditions less tolerable and add to the despair of queer citizens. Its easy to see why, things like bathroom segregation laws correlate with a raise in sexual harassment rates and make it easy to sexually assault trans people.

If you're this concerned, call a local politician and raise hell over Trump's nixing if the trans suicide help hotline. Why does he want children to commit suicide? I dont know, but it is evil.

>>149171127
And Epstein was a cis man, every demographic has shitty people.

>>149172055
Children can't be trans. Go back

>>149172176
Go back where? What a silly request. And yes kids can be trans, I was for instance and so was every other trans adult and many of us do speak up about it as kids. Threatening us into silence and repression only empowers the government and punishes the innocent. My close friend transitioned in middle school and is quite happy for it.

>>149172269
Kids can't be trans. No one can. You simply have tastes that align more with those society expects from a woman. But simply accepting that is not enough fir the so called transgenders so you pump yourselves with hormones to cope with a self inflicted sense of non belonging

>>149172352
>No one can
Thats obvious nonsense, how do you even define trans then? What is a trans person? Do you even know anymore or do you just say whatever sounds clever in the moment? Because at best

>You simply have tastes that align more with those society expects from a woman

Is an alternative definition for what trans people are, not a refutation of our existence.

Whats sillier is that you're ignoring trans people who are very clear that this isnt about gender conformity. Conform as much as you like, be yourself, that's just basic human liberty. Trans people are people who experience discomfort over their bodies, specifically sexual characteristics that can be changed to alleviate the discomfort.

>>149172055

>>149172624
Yup so trans people are about 1% of the population. Of that 1%, it's what 3-8% desistance rates? And of that let's say 8% of 1% of the population, it's another single digit percentage who detransition because they're not trans.

Now those are some sad stories but there's simply much fewer people in their position than in the position of trans people, and detransitioners still suffer from the stigma of transness. So they're allies. Go read some sad pretransition stories about trans people whose transition turned out well, we exist.

Also you're still not elaborating on how trans people somehow exist but dont.

>>149167755
oh fuck off, there's only 1 other male in the group besides him and that's kinger, and jax has bullied everyone
he bullys gangle because she's a literal pushover, ragatha because she's too positive all the time and jax want to see what makes her tick, pomni because she's the newbie, zooble because it's hard for "them" to crack a smile at time and can easily be fucked with by pulling off their limbs, and there's kinger who doesn't need bullying because he already a case of crazy entertainment
now gooseworx is gonna pull shit out of his ass and say jax has a traumatic childhood, or had cross-dressing fantasies, or was just gay for the unnamed frog character

>>149172719
>Hi im confused by gender, let tell you how these characters would REALLY feel!
You watch a trans show fella

>>149172719
>unnamed frog character
It's Ribbit.

>>149172055
>cis men can be evil too!

I agree that all people can be evil. Troons are no exception and shouldn't deserve a whole month for their degeneracy

>>149172421
>how do you even define trans then?
Someone with a severe mental disturbance that makes them think they are supposed to be of the opposite gender.

>Is an alternative definition for what trans people are, not a refutation of our existence

No, it is one of the reasons that may lead one towards this path.

>Trans people are people who experience discomfort over their bodies, specifically sexual characteristics that can be changed to alleviate the discomfort

A group who necessitates to hijack their body's development in order to possibly resolve a dissatisfaction with themselves should be analysed with the aim to reduce and eventually remove such a group from existance(through solving their issues by other means. that sounded harsher than i meant), not being shown in a positive light and encoraging kids to do the same.

>>149173052
>and eventually remove such a group from existance
>that sounded harsher than i meant
No, please, continue. Your maximum harshness is appreciated. Not that anon.

>>149166684 (OP)
>/co/ - Politics and Politics

>>149166684 (OP)
I thought Zoobles thing was she doesnt remember if she was a boy or girl in real life which is why shes called "them" so its not about real world gender identity issues
Also I want to say Goose mentioned you can call Zooble 'she' if you want in one post

Sex with Zooble.
That is all.
Sex with Bazoible too.

>>149173614
Goose seems like one of those trans people who understand that the whole trans thing is confusing for most and doesn't push the topic when it's not super-relevant. It's almost like the world is more nuanced than what either "with us or against us" narrative would want you to believe, or something...

>>149167420
That's just a joke. The general concesses is that transgenderism comes from something going extremely wrong during sexual development like extreme porn addiction or getting molest/raped

>>149172995
Pride Month is for all LGBTQ people and only exists because homophobia and transphobia in the first place. If there weren't creeps trying to control our lives and deny our existence we wouldn't need to reassert ourselves so frequently.

>>149173052
>No, it is one of the reasons that may lead one towards this path.
But its not. Your interests may align that way they may not. Its not going to make you any more or less trans.

>Someone with a severe mental disturbance that makes them think they are supposed to be of the opposite gender.
Then you've fucked up on your 2nd attempt at a definition too. Trans people feel discomfort over our bodies and alter them using hrt to become more like another sex. This isn't that complicated. There's no "supposed to be" involved, there's just uncomfortable sexual characteristics and the means of altering them.

>A group who necessitates to hijack their body's development in order to possibly resolve a dissatisfaction with themselves should be analysed with the aim to reduce and eventually remove such a group from existance
That's a description for literally everyone who seeks medical treatment. SRS has better regret rates than knee replacements for fuck's sake and it's a rarity among us. Hrt has consistently demonstrated results.

The only results yielded by state mandated ignorance have been suicides and ruined lives. You cannot legislate trans people away (we predate legislation) so at most you can make our lives worse. Frankly you may need the government to tell you if you're a man or not but not everybody needs such a nanny state in their life. Restricting information and healthcare only harms people and for no gain. Next you'll try to legislate away left handedness.

>>149173768
Consensus.

And no unless you meant among 4chan kids, which then sure you guys look at porn all day so it's easy to project. Otherwise scientific consensus is that its a neurological condition. Porn addiction wouldnt make sense, what were salzikrum addicted to whacking off to?

>>149173897
>And no unless you meant among 4chan kids
Yes, that's whatI meant
>>149173897
>what were salzikrum addicted to whacking off to?
See the molestation part

>>149173867
My experience talking to a few trans aquantences about their transness all eventually focus down to something like:

>"I'm MtF because I feel like I'm a woman."
>"Could you define what feeling like a woman is? Is it the body, clothes, behavior, and/or something else?"
>"No, it's none of those things. I'm not sure I can define what it is, except I am one and am happier this way."

Each one took a long time to reach that point, of course.

Even though I'm not religious myself, I think there might be better justifications for the existence of god than a trans person's justifications for why they're a different gender. I've had some decent conversations with both, but they eventually both seemed to end at:

>"God exists because I can feel him in my soul. My life was miserable until I found him."
and
>"I am a woman because I feel like one inside. My life was miserable until I said I was one."
Arguments that strengthen one ("My feelings make it true!") strengthens the other. Arguments that weaken one ("You're sure you weren't depressed by other things, and latched onto a comforting possibility of salvation with a welcoming community to encourage it?") weakens the other.

That's my view, at least until I learn better.

I do think it's silly to believe I've reached ultimate truth at any point in life.

>>149173928
Well thats honestly retarded, you're going to get taken advantage a lot if you can't figure out why that doesn't make sense. I cant be too mean since you said you're a kid but this is weak thinking.

Why arent molestation rates higher among trans people? Why dont trans people report any of this in large numbers? Why do we have accounts of gender dysphoria at all? Why do those accounts go so far back in history? Why don't all molested people transition? Why are there trans people who aren't as porn addicted as you and were never molested?

>>149173977
Go ask your friends what gender dysphoria and what it feels like. I don't think anyone feels like a woman frankly. That isnt a state of mind anyone has appreciably documented. What we have documented is that some people are very uncomfortable with their bodies having the sexual characteristics of one sex vs the other. That's easy to verify, you go ask your friends.

>I am a woman because I feel like one inside. My life was miserable until I said I was one.
Those are arguments for trans care regardless of whether or not you believe you can alter your sex. Trans people shouldn't be oppressed because it leads to despair and death, treatment leads to further happiness. Thats all that is.
I'm a trans woman biologically. My sexual characteristics are only found in other trans women, not cis men or cis women. I'm a woman socially because I have the traits we evolved as a species and decided socially that denote womanhood.

>>149174052
> Go ask your Christian friends what the grace of god feels like. I don't think anyone feels holy frankly. That isnt a state of mind anyone has appreciably documented. What we have documented is that some people are very uncomfortable with the knowledge they may burn in hell forever. That's easy to verify, you go ask your friends.

"I am a woman because I feel like one inside. My life was miserable until I said I was one."
> Those are arguments for Prayer in schools regardless of whether or not you believe in god. Christians shouldn't be oppressed because it leads to despair and death, acceptance leads to further happiness. Thats all that is.

> I'm a Born-Again Christian. My spiritual characteristics are only found in other Born-Again Christians, Atheists or people raised Christian. I'm a Christian socially because I have the traits and beliefs we were given by god and decided socially that denote christianity.

>>149173867

>But its not. Your interests may align that way they may not. Its not going to make you any more or less trans.

If one likes things associated with the other gender it could add up with several other factors to make this person be afflicted with transgenderism. Or not. It is a possibility nonetheless.

>Trans people feel discomfort over our bodies and alter them using hrt to become more like another sex.

Discomfort because of what? Body envy? Because then it means transitioning is merely vanity. Which makes it more dangerous and undefensable than my answer.

>That's a description for literally everyone who seeks medical treatment.

Blatant lie.

>The only results yielded by state mandated ignorance have been suicides and ruined lives. You cannot legislate trans people away (we predate legislation) so at most you can make our lives worse. Frankly you may need the government to tell you if you're a man or not but not everybody needs such a nanny state in their life.

It seems you are angry at the fact the world(or in your words, the government) does not believe your view of reality is right and so if you shout it hard enough miraculously your words will become true. Which makes sense, the main trait of so called trans people is a struggle with the reality they've been thrust upon.

>>149174135
Well now you've discovered that words have meaning and if you change the words and thereby topic a statement seems silly.

>>149174160
>Or not. It is a possibility nonetheless.
Well lets say it is, its one that no study has found to be reliably the motivation for transitioning. What has been consistently found is gender dysphoria.

>envy
No not envy. Nobody has our bodies remember? No one had my breaats before I had them. I didn't want someone else's breasts (in this sense) I wanted my own. That isn't envy.

>dangerous
In ways that dont seem to make themselves apparant seeing as transitioning reduces suicidality for people with dysphoria.

>Blatant lie.
Do you mean to say you disagree? Why?

>It seems you are angry
I am. I am frustrated with you people for being obtuse but that's why I came here anyway. I am angry that governments looking to amass power will do it by throwing me under the bus. When you grow up you'll learn that anger isn't a bad thing, sometimes you're mad because things are unjust. That's just motivation. The alternative to anger in the face of stupidity is submission and I just think we're better than that.

>>149174052
At this point I just feel sorry for entire generation being manipulated into feeling wrong in their own bodies.
It puzzles me though how gullible people are to believe it was ever about tolerance and unconditional love coming from a community. That is literal cult talk and if someone believes that real world would ever work like some care bares cartoon they can only blame themselves for getting fucked over.

>>149174314
Well who doesnt feel bad for repressors? Obviously they got cheated by a momentary backlash but we'll pull through. Always have always will.

Look I know meant trans people but thats simpleminded. Generation? Singular? When trans people predate the state or at the absolute minimum, color tv? And you can't even name a manipulator or motive that stands to scruitny?

Heres my counteroffer: you're being fleeced by opportunistic jackals who know how to prey on your weakest instincts like your ignorance. People want to distract you from the real problem of oligarchs robbing us blind and they dangled some shemales in front of you, and you were distracted. Wise up. Their bullshit makes no sense for a reason.

>>149174052
>I'm a woman socially because I have the traits we evolved as a species and decided socially that denote womanhood.
Sexist crap.

>>149169772

>>149172719
I mean if you've met someone like Jax and someone like Ragatha, they're usually destined to duke it out.
People like Jax are usually pissed off by like, genuinely nice people but when they get even the slightest whiff of "sycophantic" or "doing this to validate themselves".
They go all out because that's how they actively choose to view good people. They wanna see the wall crack, provoke the reaction which proves the person isn't as pure as they make themselves out to be. So genuinely nice people like Pomni or Kinger tend to be harder for them to go after while someone like Ragatha makes them smell blood in the water

>>149174305
I think when beliefs run on logic so similar that you can interchange the same-shaped arguments and have it still make sense, it means something.

"All niggers/spics/crackers/kikes are evil, just take a look at [example of heinous group of that race]", is one example. To disprove that all niggers are evil, you should be able to use similar reasoning to disprove the rest likewise.

On the other hand, if the statement becomes nonsensical then it means the logic has broken down. But so far, that hasn't happened that I've noticed. Both Christianity and Trans beliefs operate on the same underlying system that isn't as present in other ideologies that don't rely on people starting out uncomfortable (almost universally from some inherent sin/dysphoria, and being promised comfort as long as they follow the teachings, truly believe, and pay no mind to the heretics. Challenging any of this results in excommunication, which since the person's community is almost exclusively from the belief, is nearly unthinkable, especially to the emotionally vulnerable.

>>149174305
In a roundabout way, you confirm everything i say while trying to deny it. Anyway, there isn't much to reply here, so good luck on your fight agaisnt the man.

>Do you mean to say you disagree? Why?

To get this out of the way,you believe that

>A group who necessitates to hijack their body's development in order to possibly resolve a dissatisfaction with themselves

Somehow applies to all who seek medical treatment. At most it applies to purely aesthetic procedures. Why you believe extrapolating that description to all medical seeking people makes sense is beyond me.

>>149174365
Can you tell me what specifically is sexist about saying women tend to have breasts? Or did you mean its sexist to acknowledge that gender is a social construct?

>>149174391
>it means something
It doesnt, its just a way to not engage with any arguments by drawing fanciful conclusions by lazy comparsion. You havent actually said anything that could be read as an attempt at persuasion when all you do is rewrite someone's argument into something else.

>Both Christianity and Trans beliefs operate on the same underlying system that isn't as present in other ideologies that don't rely on people starting out uncomfortable
1. You're comparing trans people to religiosity without any basis again. If the basis is supposed to be found in this statement your logic is flawed because you haven't supplied a reason yet to view trans people as an ideological group rather than an emergent demographic. So its like comparing Muslims & Gingers or Straight Men & Zoroastrians.
2. Trans people dont feel we have original sin, we know we have gender dysphoria.

>(almost universally from some inherent sin/dysphoria, and being promised comfort as long as they follow the teachings)
Yeah funny enough by this logic weight loss is also a cult. Turns out you can indeed witness consequences resulting from your actions. This isn't sinister. Its also the basic idea behind almost any problem solving.

>Challenging any of this results in excommunication
Trans people regularly disagree with each on many things. We're more like blondes than Catholics, you can't be kicked out. I would love to "untrans" some trans people like you might wish Hitler or Epstein or Albert Fish weren't cis men but that isnt possible. You are what you are.

>>149174403
>In a roundabout way, you confirm everything i say while trying to deny it.
How so?

>At most it applies to purely aesthetic procedures
No, how could it possibly when hrt is used for non cosmetic procedures in cis people? For cis precocious puberties, you use puberty blockers. For stunted puberties you might use hrt. Its the same thing. You've only dressed it in scary sounding language. Otherwise you'd surely be outraged by these cis instances of "highjacking" right?

>>149174488
You can do it with similar things, like Herbivores and Carnivores (they must eat a particular sort of food, or they will suffer malnutition and die), but dissimilar things won't work well (Muslims and Gingers both...exist, and wish to propogate?) Showing that herbivores don't need to eat plants to live is almost identical to how you would show that carnivores don't need meat to live, just with a few terms changed.

And, similarly, the belief that a man is actually a woman inside can be approached the same way as the belief that god exists. Many people believe it and take comfort from it, it can't really be disproven, it runs charities that do good, while being accused of spreading harmful ideologies, both are very active in politics and wish to spread their influence in order to survive against growing opposition who would prefer they go away, the relatively rare individual who deconverts is shunned and reviled much more than any simple nonbeliever, and on and on and on.

> Trans people don't feel we have original sin, we know we have gender dysphoria
> Christians don't feel we have "gender dysphoria", we know we have original sin.

A method to prove/disprove one (testing how people 'feel', for instance) will prove/disprove the other.

>>149174520
A bit humorous how your examples seem to have the purpose of correcting wrong developments. Well, since i notice you like spouting studies and the like, prove that a transition process fixes a physical wrongful development and i'll concede that all your views are right.
And just so we are clear, i am not talking about whatever three hundred applications of hrt you have memorized for online conversations, i am specifically talking about a sex transition. And no, a mental disturbance like "i dont appreciate that i have a peepee" does not count as a physical wrongful development.

>>149174488
>Can you tell me what specifically is sexist about saying women tend to have breasts?
It's sexist to say having breasts is what makes you a woman. HRT tits or a boob job doesn't make you more of a woman than a woman who had a mastectomy. You're still 100% not a woman and she's still 100% a woman.

>>149174636
>And, similarly, the belief that a man is actually a woman inside can be approached the same way as the belief that god exists
Ok, but that isnt whats being debated. The questions on offer are these:

1. Do trans people exist?
2. Why do trans people exist?
3. What should happen to trans people?

Thats it. Your view on the outcome of a transition is your own opinion ultimately. And really these aren't hard questions:

1. Yes
2. Gender dysphoria
3. Transitioning because it reduces suicidality and is desired by trans people

>Christians don't feel we have "gender dysphoria", we know we have original sin.
What Christian theologians or preachers describe original sin as gender dysphoria? My point was that Original Sin is a metaphysical condition for all humanity within a religious group. Gender dysphoria is a physical condition for some people regardless of time or place.

>>149174646
>prove that a transition process fixes a physical wrongful development and i'll concede that all your views are right.
I want to accept but I dont honestly know what you're asking for or what you'd like for proof. You want evidence that trans people live better lives after transitioning?

>>149174678
>It's sexist to say having breasts is what makes you a woman
Call me old fashioned but I disagree, i think sex is determined by sexual characteristics. How do you define it otherwise? What is a woman to you?

>>149174701
>1. Do trans people exist?
Yes but transwomen aren't women and transmen aren't men. Not in any meaningful sense, especially not compared to distinguishing between adult males vs. females.
>2. Why do trans people exist?
They feel more comfortable acting and appearing in ways traditionally associated with the opposite sex.
>3. What should happen to trans people?
They should be treated kindly and allowed to act like the opposite sex to a large degree. They shouldn't be treated completely like they actually are the opposite sex because they aren't. And also because it's insane for things like sports. People shouldn't be forced to agree with the absurd view that they're actually women, but they should be treated kindly otherwise.
>>149174729
A steer is still male.

>>149174748
>Yes but transwomen aren't women and transmen aren't men
But they are trans women and trans men, right?

>They feel more comfortable acting and appearing in ways traditionally associated with the opposite sex.
Why? Gender dysphoria.

>They shouldn't be treated completely like they actually are the opposite sex because they aren't
And yet we have cases where treating trans people like their former sex is potentially life threatening. Shouldn't we account for those situations? And what about cases where no one notices a distinction at all?

>steers
Do not undergo hrt, and theyre not humans which is besides the point.

>>149174717
No, anon. I want evidence of a physical problem that may afflict someone through their lives that can be cured by a sex change.
As i know you are wondering, the reason i am asking for it is because you equated a transition to treatment for failed puberties.
No, any answers involving hermaphrodites will not apply.

>>149174701
1. Do Christians exist?
2. Why do Christians exist?
3. What should happen to Christians?

1 Yes
2. They were born with original sin that needs cleansing
3. Accepting instead of challenging them will lead to much happier and more content people

"That's it. Your view on the outcome of being baptized is your own opinion, ultimately. And really these aren't hard questions."

> What Christian theologians or preachers describe original sin as gender dysphoria?
The link between gender dysphoria" and original sin there was in how a preacher wouldn't really believe in gender dysphoria, it's "just a feeling, easily made up or fixed" but strongly preach the reality of original sin because it can be easily observed in how people innately feel, once they know what to look for. The concept of humans being innately bad has also been around for about as long as humans have been equipped to notice the question.

More parallel between trans beliefs and christna beliefs:
It is often taken as a Master Identity for a person, not as something they believe, but something they *are*. As a result, any percieved threat to this belief is generally met with strong defensiveness.
Adherents of it see themselves as under attack, and that it is their moral duty to proudly stand up for their group and spread its message of love.
It has many sects with separate and often contradictory beliefs, which are argued hotly.
It tends to take in the broken and downtrodden with promises to help them reach the only true path to happiness and belonging.
It targets the young and innocent in order to manufacture normalcy and acceptance early on, in hopes of aligning society to its values.
It preaches acceptance, care, hope, and general positivity on the outside, but most communities built around it are generally plagued by petty drama.

>>149174787
>I want evidence of a physical problem that may afflict someone through their lives that can be cured by a sex change.
And would you accept what I described as proof?

>>149174792
Now try it with baseball or men's choir

>>149174785
>Do not undergo hrt, and theyre not humans which is besides the point.
Humans are still animals and can be classified the same way. Removing your nuts changes your hormones. No amount of altering hormones makes a male into a female. Men as adult human males and women as adult human females.
>But they are trans women and trans men, right?
I said that, didn't I? Trans women and trans men are just people who have certain urges and behaviors. Due to discomfort with their bodies usually, but not always.
>And yet we have cases where treating trans people like their former sex is potentially life threatening.
Obviously it needs to be handled on a case-by-case basis. We're not going to solve all of them in this thread. But clearly they can't be treated as 100% identical to actual women as a group, because they're not the same thing.

>>149174814
Honestly? I am simply curious as to what you will produce.

>>149174814
Hm.
It is a group of men (sometimes women) who get together and train in a skill.
It can develop positive feelings of brotherhood in the group, though some take it too seriously.
They wear uniforms.
There's a lot of them.

There's probably more, but I'm struggling to get meaningful links here. Plus, most of those aspects are fairly neutral, and uncontroversial to say about both camps.

On the other hand, if any of those parallels from trans/christianity were a good thing, or 'just misrepresented' or should be stopped, or should succeed, it's difficult for me to see how whatever logic is employed to do so wouldn't apply to the other side. If it's good for christians to indoctrinate as many children as possible with their belief of self-described love and acceptance, then is it not right for trans supporters to do the same? If you say no, then why not, and is there a way that it can't apply to the other?

for saying they're like women socially, transwomen sure tend to argue like men online

>>149174829
>Humans are still animals
But not cattle. Different animals have different biologies. It'd be irritating if I brought up amphibians changing sex during this wouldnt it?

>Removing your nuts changes your hormones.
Yes but not enough to really create secondary sexual characteristics. Which tbqh idk if any of this would work for a bull in the first place but whatever lol. Point is removing testosterone isnt enough to transition.

>No amount of altering hormones makes a male into a female.
No but they can make a man into a trans woman.

>>149174830
I'll get you studies showing trans people are happier after transitioning if you'll agree its proof.

>>149174854
No keep thinking its the same

>>149174862
1. Cis women do argue online
2. I try to talk a little more masculinely when its 4chan boys
3. Trans people dont transition because of behavioral differences, we do it over gender dysphoria.

>>149174898
>It'd be irritating if I brought up amphibians changing sex during this wouldnt it?
Yeah, because comparing amphibians to mammals is a lot sillier than comparing two types of mammals.

>>149174862
Oh shit and 4. Somewhat covered by Item 2 but I dont act this way when I go out. This is a filthy online habit. Not something you do in public.

>>149174898
If we've moved into the "insinuating correctness without reasoning" stage of the discussion, then I'll go on my way. It seems if there's evidence to show me I'm wrong to be found, it won't be here, so I'll go on looking elsewhere, much as I do with checking if christians have any strong reasoning behind their own beliefs.

Either way, good luck, transanon.

>>149174914
Yes haha it is silly isnt it? And comparing a human and a steer instead of a bonobo is silly isnt it? And comparing humans to bonobos instead of humans, that's also silly isnt it? Yes sometimes comparisons make us laugh when they dont make sense. We call them silly!

>>149174898
>No but they can make a man into a trans woman.
Sure, but that's a type of adult male human (commonly known as a man).
>>149174935
There are degrees of silliness.

>>149174935
Besides, if steers as an example bugs you so much, you can just imagine we're talking about eunuchs instead. Eunuchs are still male, still men.

>>149174931
Wait a minute lmfao I'll get you it, christ i just wanted to save time. These arent hard to find you know?


https://ustranssurvey.org/download-reports/
https://ustranssurvey.org/report/health/
>Nearly all respondents (94%) who lived at least some of the time in a different gender than the one they were assigned at birth (“gender transition”) reported that they were either “a lot more satisfied” (79%) or “a little more satisfied” (15%) with their life. Three percent (3%) reported that transitioning gender made them “neither more nor less satisfied” with their life, 1% were “a little less satisfied”, and 2% were “a lot less satisfied” with their life.

>>149174944
Men and trans women do not have the same sexual characteristics lol

>>149174969
That'd be better then yes, but my answer is the same. You need hrt for secondary sexual characteristics.

>>149174980
>Men and trans women do not have the same sexual characteristics lol
Never said otherwise. They don't have all the same "sexual characteristics" but they're the same sex. A post-menopausal woman has different sexual characteristics than a 20 year old woman. Both are still women.

>>149173708
Goose seems to actually suffer from dysphoria rather than being a porn-addicted autogynephile. I normally hate trannies but I respect the restraint.

Girl keep going, I am loving this debate

>>149175004
>They don't have all the same "sexual characteristics" but they're the same sex.
How so?

>A post-menopausal woman has different sexual characteristics than a 20 year old woman
Are you sure? Which do you think are different?

>>149168560
>look at this pseudoscience cooked up by activists who infiltrated the field!
nah

>>149175038
Neurology has to be pseudoscience for you to be right now? Tall order, i do not envy you guys.

>>149175027
>How so?
The same way a steer remains as much of a male as a bull is a male.
>Are you sure? Which do you think are different?
Hormone levels for one.

>>149169823
>As always, it sounds like you've been mislead. John Money did invent the basis of your worldview.
source?

>>149175045
>aaaaaargh i need a justification for how i am a woman even though i have a fucking dick
>ummm umm SRY genes or something yeah that sounds complicated enough that nobody will challenge me on it
You have a dick. You are a man.

>>149168334
What point are you even making? The point of the funny sorta-joke image was really that there is an incredibly high rate of autism among MtF trans people. Enough so that it's worth exploring why.

>>149175052
Lets get off of steers and stick to people. How are you defining sex? It cant be by sexual characteristics because you're calling two people with divergent sexual characteristics the same sex.

>hormones
Influence sexual characteristics but to my knowledge are not considered one.

>>149168485
He is our Ernst Rohm. Shut your troon mouth, gays are still above you.

>>149175070
one theory is because autistic people are more willing to go against social norms and act to ease their dysphoria

>>149175065
I dont even lead with the neurology stuff usually desu, so no you're wrong. And thinking about dicks again.

>>149175070
My point is that's pretty stupid and doesn't line up with the timeline.

>>149174898
>I'll get you studies showing trans people are happier after transitioning if you'll agree its proof.
When I bring up studies in an argument people tend to ignore the post or just drop some ad hominem
good luck

>>149175084
Yeah! And there's gay's beneath this guy, he tops gays!

>>149175103
You have a dick and it is small. Maybe if you kill yourself you will be reborn as a cute girl, give it a try

>>149175126
I have a dick and it's honestly not so bad. Hell I'm the one who made it smaller, it used to be trouble. I'm happy enough with this life, I'm already cute enough for one lifetime lol

>>149175083
Here, the AI can explain what I'm getting at.
>Influence sexual characteristics but to my knowledge are not considered one.
Yes, hormone levels are definitely considered a crucial aspect of sexual characteristics, particularly when we talk about secondary sexual characteristics. Post-menopausal women produce different levels of hormones than pre-menopausal women.

>>149173708
These people cannot create art because art requires immersing yourself in your culture and having a high understanding of reality, these people self-isolate from society and delude themselves instead of thinking objectively so whatever he makes cannot be called "art"

>>149168516
Having a genetic defect doesn't make you a new gender, just like having some extra chromosomes as a down patient doesn't make you another subspecies of human.

>>149175175
>using AI to search for stuff
Zoomers brains are so cooked

>>149175183
Meant for >>149168560

>>149175175
I'm not reading AIslop, shame on you.

>Yes, hormone levels are definitely considered a crucial aspect of sexual characteristics, particularly when we talk about secondary sexual characteristics.
Right because they influence the development of sexual characteristics. But menopause? Not associated with masculinization you see with transitioning lol.

>>149166684 (OP)
I'll give gooseworx an exception. They're one of the few trannies out there that aren't insufferable faggots.

>>149175183
Ok. But what about having a neurological profile closer to the opposite sex than your assigned one, then you trigger puberty like developments with hrt to change your secondary sexual characteristics; wouldn't that make you rather distinct as a sexual category compared to others?

>>149175223
>assigned
lol

>>149175240
Well shit little man use whatever PC language you want, you understood me didn't you? You don't need the AI to summarize it for you for now do you?

>>149174898
No, i do not agree its proof. Firstly because it's unrelated to what i said i expected before, and secondly because it can be easily disproven by any reports of sad or dissatisfied trans people

>I'm already cute enough for one lifetime lol

When you get down to it you start to realize "human" is an arbitrary qualification and gender is the least of our problems. Once you break the illusion and realize it's ALL a gestalt, shapeless and arbitrary, you begin to wonder why it matters so badly.

>>149175192
>>149175200
I'm too lazy to type out basic biological definitions for you, so I let the AI explain.
>Not associated with masculinization you see with transitioning lol.
Never said it was directly, but both change sexual characteristics without changing sex. You don't even disagree with me, unless you have an untraditional definition of sex. In which case, you can use your own terminology however you want. That's just word games in the end, but most people recognize the traditional usages.

The real question, is what do we want from people? Getting people to agree that trans women are 100% real women in every sense is never going to work, and we both know that. So what we need to do is focus on what helps trans people be comfortable without going overboard making people pretend they're the same group as the one they identify with.

>>149175223
One is born either male or female. Through some procedures, one acquires a body that looks like thebine if the opposite gender, but they are still their original one.
They have neither become of the opposite gender nor have they turned into a new, third thing. A "biological trans woman", so to speak, is merely a man pumped full of hormones, not a new gender or an actual woman.

>>149175260
>Trannies are so mindbroken by their own bodies that they have an existential crisis
toppest of keks

>>149175292
*the one of the opposite gender

>>149175293
Materialism is less an "existential crisis" and more recognizing the sheer limitations of communication as a format, especially with the english language.

>>149175292
>One is born either male or female.
also a few people are born with both parts in weird combos

>>149175254
Jackass this why you were asked what you wanted for proof lol, you waste time. Thats what you do.

Anyway, you won't find a comparable number of studies that show comparable number of people claiming they regret their transition. Obviously. Or did you think we all regretted it?

>>149175267
>Never said it was directly
Ok. Its not associated with new secondary sexual characteristics. Trans men are not cis women just because menooausal cis women exist.

>So what we need to do is focus on what helps trans people be comfortable without going overboard
No, you need to listen to us better for one thing. We don't want policies for comfort so much as safety. It isnt safe to put a trans woman in a men's prison where she will be prosituted by guards ie v-coding. Bathroom segregation laws raise sexual harassement rates. Preventing access to trans care raises suicidality.

>>149175292
>but they are still their original one.
How can you be the same sex if you've changed sexual characteristics?

>>149175293
Ok so in other words
>trans people are prone to philosophical thinking, haha
Thats fine. Id even agree. Its not for nothing we were so often priestesses of some sort in antiquity.

>>149167842
How much do we have to play along with the transnigger's delusions? I refuse to play this game anymore

>>149175307
>AAAAAAHHHHH IM AN UGLY FAT DYSGENIC MAN ITS ALL THE DEMIURGES FAULT MATTERS ISN'T EVEN REAL *COMMITS 41%*
Many such cases!

>>149175310
>It isnt safe to put a trans woman in a men's prison
makes sense, but puting them in women's prison threatens the women

>>149175333
If I was deluded it'd probably be easier to poke holes in what I say. Then I'd sputter, get mad & post AI replies or memes. But I didn't do that, my esteemed interlocutors did.

>>149175338
Statistically speaking no it does not.

>>149175308
Yeah sure, a miniscule part of the population. Exceptions prove the rule, y'know

>>149175260
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHA1qxsLH-0
Because, while the words and categories are human made, they are chosen because they consistently useful in describing patterns in underlying reality. Similar categories would inevitably be created all over again if starting from scratch. The utility can be judged. Adult male human and adult female human are two categories that can be consistently recognized as useful. Useful enough to have simple words associated with them.
>>149175310
>Trans men are not cis women just because menooausal cis women exist.
They're not "cis" women, but they are adult human females.

>>149175332
>trans people are prone to meaningless drivel, both pseudoscientific and pseudospiritual, in a vain attempt to shatter the indestructible wall of "you have a dick lol"
Fixed

>>149175334
>time to make fun of trans women hehe
>what should i base my cartoon on? Hunter Schafer? SOPHIE? Bailey Jay?
>ah wait i've got it
>*pulls out mirror*
This is honestly my favorite transphobe trope like its always them with blue hair for some reason

>>149175332
I'll be as blunt as possible.
There is man. There is woman.
Man has a penis, produces sperm, and impregnates a woman.
Woman has a vagina, an uterus, produces ovums, is impregnated and carries a baby.
Altering one's outer appearance does not make a man a woman.
Removing a man's penis or growing a pseudo penis in a woman does not make them of the opposite gender.
All that does is make them a man/woman mutilated and deformed by unintended hormones.

>>149175366
Nah, I am the skinny androgynous twink you wish you were.

>>149175360
>but they are adult human females.
How.

>>149175362
>meaningless
No it's meaningful. You're just not that deep bro. You'll grow. Be patient little skipper. The reed does not dictate when it is time to bend.

>>149175381
Um, no you have me mistaken. Sounds cute though! My measurements are like 45-33-45, I am on a different kick from twinks lol. Love em though.

>>149175384
You are better off LARPing as Confucius because you have infinitely higher chances of being mistaken for him than a girl

>>149175384
Define adult.

>>149175402
No I don't, what a bizarre thing to say. He's not even my cup size.

This mentally ill man will never be a woman, no matter how much $$ you throw at it. The sooner you understand, the happier you'll ever be. This is not up for debate. YWNBAW

>>149175409
I'm good with 18+ but really whatever you meant by it is fine. Please, continue.

>>149175417
Why did this need to be AIslop too?

>>149175384
The same way a cow is an adult female of the bovine species.

>>149172421
>Trans people are people who experience discomfort over their bodies, specifically sexual characteristics that can be changed to alleviate the discomfort.
Nearly everyone feels discomfort over their bodies, especially during puberty. Girls can feel insecure about their breasts, and guys can feel insecure about their dick (among other things obviously).
>>149172695
>trans people are about 1% of the population
Fucking lol? It's more like 1% of 1% if even that high. 1% is insanely high.

>>149175180
I'm sure glad I definitely asked for your entirely well-rounded opinion...

>>149175425
>whatever you meant by it is fine
If I meant 7 years old it wouldn't be fine. Definitions being fuzzy doesn't make the distinctions meaningless. Saying there isn't an exact objective cutoff for adult vs. not adult doesn't mean a 7 year old can be an adult. Not in any meaningful sense of the term.

Perhaps you'll see what I'm getting at someday.

>>149175446
Look you know you're going in circles, maybe just ask yourself if you had the tautology all along ok?

>>149175447
No I think it is literally 1% but I appreciate that you'd low ball it, usually people overestimate.

>>149175471
Ok well I assumed by adult you didnt mean a 7 year old, my mistake obviously

>>149175487
>Look you know you're going in circles, maybe just ask yourself if you had the tautology all along ok?
You keep asking the same question, you'll keep getting the same answer.

Explain what you actually believe I disagree with you on. Seems all you want to do is nitpick words and phrasing. What are you trying to convince me of?

>>149175504
And maybe more importantly, what actions would you want me to take after being convinced? Because I don't see why you take issue with my posts by themselves. I support transwomen.

>>149175504
I'm not nitpicking, words just mean specific things and because of that your answers weren't satisfactory. You can't articulate how trans women are supposed to be the same sex as cis men, when you try you spin out at the point where you're asked to get specific. My point is that sex is defined by sexual characteristics and trans women are sexually distinct from cis men due to the presence of differing secondary sexual characteristics. You can't get that far.

>>149175523
I'm not trying to compel you to do anything specific. You outlined your view on trans women. As a trans woman I disagreed and rebutted it. Thats all that happened. No one shows their good side on 4chan, ok? You're fine. All this was was an abrasive anonymous argument over the nature of trans people. If I want you to do anything it's consider if I had a point, thats it. No harm done.

>>149175571
You're like a kid asking "why" over and over and over again. I'm not your biology teacher and I'm not going to endlessly break down definitions with you. According to the common usages of the terms, trans women are male. How much that fact actually matters and in what situations it matters is up for debate. No point in continuing because the only thing we seem to disagree on is how words are used.
>No one shows their good side on 4chan, ok? You're fine.
No shit. Going to go watch my trans gf play a game now.

>>149175654
>I'm not your biology teacher
Clearly lol

>>149175695
Yeah, you should seek one out.

>>149172719
Jax having a gay backstory with some frog would be fucking FUNNY and also amazing. I would spend like next month watching tumblr and xitter meltdown over their Jax/Ragatha and Jax/Pomni ship getting fucking burned to the ground

>>149175571
>words just mean specific things
what does woman mean

>>149174748
The way i see it, a bloke is a bloke if he got the cock. If he think otherwise, it's his mental illness. Sex is always binary too

>>149175796
close enough

>>149175571
>trans women are sexually distinct from cis men due to the presence of differing secondary sexual characteristics.
Then you agree they share the same primary sexual characteristics. Secondary sexual characteristics can be changed to a degree. All males can change their sexual characteristics to a certain degree, while females can change their sexual characteristics to a different degree with different procedures. Their sex (chromosomal and gonadal) is always meaningful.

>>149175310
>We don't want policies for comfort so much as safety.
More safety equals more comfort

what the hell is going on in this thread anymore

>>149176262
Trans anon couldn't agree that trans women are biologically male for some reason. So there was a back and forth about it.

>>149166818
>Is that a black female in my fantasy setting!? AHH CIVILIZATION IS COLLAPSING

>>149166684 (OP)
Shitty cartoon made by a troon.

>>149176262
>anon 1: transwomen aren't male
>anon 2: pic related

>>149176328
Zased? Fased? Nased?

>>149167338
Consider suicide (sooner than scheduled)

How do incels justify watching a show made by a transsexual?

>>149176366
...
I swear, it looks like she's wearing a diaper

>>149176366
I watched the first episode when it came out in october of 2023. And I found out that goose was trans 2 days ago when someone posted a picture of him.

>>149176341
>noelle
poor deer

>>149176328
>>149176341
>>149176404
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6UfG77Bwpo
Can this be a Deltarune thread now?

>>149175571
>My point is that sex is defined by sexual characteristics and trans women are sexually distinct from cis men due to the presence of differing secondary sexual characteristics.
While biological sex is fundamentally defined by a combination of primary sexual characteristics (chromosomes, gonads, and reproductive anatomy), trans women are sexually distinct from cis men due to the presence of differing secondary sexual characteristics, particularly after hormone therapy. However, cis men and trans women share primary sexual characteristics and are still both biologically male.

>>149173708
>>149175449
Why do you talk like that?

>>149176651
Like what?

>>149167338
As a detranser I just have to say, lets be honest here. Myself and every trans person I've ever met (and living in the queer capital of the world for almost a decade I met a lot) all privately admitted they used to be addicted to sissy/petticoating/futa porn and eventually just started coping that it "unlocked" a part of their brain and "helped them realize" they were actually trans.

No, you just processed something weird, developed a fetish, normalized the concept in your head, then convinced yourself you would become a better, more exciting version of yourself if you did it IRL like all the other people were doing. If you come off your meds you'll get a giant surge of testosterone back into your brain and it will be like a second puberty that fixes you and makes you a regular guy again. Then you'll look back at the pictures of you crossdressing and realize what you actually looked like and cringe.

>>149168560
That's because they decided you don't qualify for tenure if you don't support the narrative and if you don't qualify for tenure after X years you get laid off, and once you get laid off for not qualifying for tenure you can't get a job again.

It's a neat trick they use to "prove" their pet theory of the moment is "totally real and back by ALL THE SCIENCE." The most famous example of this used to be String Theory which is just silly and has absolutely nothing backing it but was astroturfed into the mainstream narrative by making it a prerequisite for tenure.

If you really want to learn something fun look into who first suggested the tenure system and what their justification for implementing it was.

>>149175308
>both parts in weird combos
No human on record has ever produced both eggs and sperm.

>>149175360
>hey are adult human females.
>trans men are human
Check.
>adult
Potentially. If puberty blockers prevented adolescent development of reproductive capacity, they would not be biological adults.
>female
No. The defining trait of biological femaleness is egg production. A female is an organism that produces/produced eggs or would given normal development.

>>149176945
>futa porn
Then there is a lot of closeted trannies then because if we go on sad panda, there are 85,793 results for futanari porn on it and only 76,213 for yuri. So, Japan, the state that demands you are sterilised in order to become trans, is actually full of trans people? Or the ancient Greeks making Hermaphroditus were actually trans? Don't be retarded. There isn't just 'one thing' that does this shit. I do believe porn and anime help contribute to it, but it isn't just one thing.

Trans are mentally ill, I don’t believe genital mutilation is healthy in much the same way that I don’t think it’s healthy for an anorexic to starve themselves to skelly-mode. A lot of this is pushed because trans are perma-paypiggies to big pharma, and it also keeps up the grievance grift so people can feel like they’re a part of an ongoing civil rights lineage like they’re following in the footsteps of MLK or something.
I think people should be treated with decency, but forcing society to cater to your delusion, or worse, your sexual fetish, isn’t on the table. Be a weirdo in peace if you must, stay the FUCK away from kids, get over the fact that you’re not normalizing your situation, best of luck to you.
>But what about the suicide risk
This can only mean one of two things:
A. The trans person is capable of making their own decisions, and thus the suicide is ultimately their fault/responsibility, they gave up, you can’t emotionally blackmail society to accept your delusions/fetish just because you are pointing a gun at your head threatening to pull the trigger.
B. You are NOT capable of making your own decisions (are insane) and need to be committed for your safety.

Either way, the responsibility is not on society/the individual to be trans affirming.

>>149177096
I think you misunderstood, that post is saying FtMs are biologically female, not talking about MtFs.

>>149175183
But an Unnatural Body-horror.

https://x.com/AFpost/status/1896206246174167473

>>149173867
You Disgusting Woke defender.

>>149173977
You Flawborn

>>149177141
You are the only one denying a reality recognised by the scientific community.

>>149174701
Unnatural Body-horrors are nothing but Abomination and an Atrocity against nature.

Poor bastards who mutilate their bodies to become something they are not.

I can't wait until the American Dictatorship goes into full gear and shuts every last one of you the hell up.

>>149176366
Separate the art from the artist, it's that simple.

>>149177154
This one?

https://x.com/blueinqnm/status/1898353995623657909

https://x.com/JaredSchaecher/status/1912593017506263195

>>149173977
>>"Could you define what feeling like a woman is?
It's having a body whose brain expect a female endocrine feedback from the rest of their body.

you know the brain is part of the endocrine system and is sexually different from a man to a woman, right?

>>149177183

>>149173977
I realise my previous post might have come a little to strongly negatively against you, my bad

>>149177195

>>149177169
>source: trust me bro
What I am going to say to you might blow your mind, but memes does not make good substitute to scientific studies.

>>149177201


>>149177141
>>149177148
It doesn't matter if you are afraid or not, the issue is that you are denying a scientific reality.

>>149177208
Do non-binary people have non-binary brains?

>>149177220
I guess. I don't see why it would be impossible for the sexualisation of the brain to be incomplete.

>You must participate in my fetish without your consent

>>149177259
>your discomfort in your own body is clearly a fetish for your own gratification

>>149177274
Half have fucked up body dysmorphia delusions like anorexia and the other half get a boner from putting on a dress and making you call them ma’am.

>>149177274
Yes. The left side describes 99% of troons infesting nerd hobbies.

>>149177298
I like how your infographic there completely ignores dysphoria as a being a factor. At all.
>>149177296
>Half have fucked up body dysmorphia delusions like anorexia
Sounds like something that requires empathy and not derision or being reduced to a fetish.
>he other half get a boner from putting on a dress and making you call them ma’am
I'm not talking about those.

>>149177313
Empathy is affirming the truth (that they are their biological sex) and not encouraging genital mutilation. Encouraging the delusion is only harming them, the loving act is to encourage a return to reality.

Are there any other examples of socially contagious mental illnesses? I’ve noticed that trooning tends to spread in friend groups. I think depression can be influenced by external factors. I’m interested if this contagious form is more AGP or the dysphoria variant.

>>149177259
Not a fetish, anon, so you are wrong.

>>149177296
>source: trust me, bro.

>>149177338
>Are there any other examples of socially contagious mental illnesses?
There is none to begin with.

>>149177358
For many of them it absolutely is. Usually the transbians.

>>149177364
AGP and Dysphoria are both widely recognized phenomena.

>>149177323
>Empathy is affirming the truth (that they are their biological sex)
>"Oh, wow, thanks, didn't help, now what?"
>the delusion
Is hypochondria a delusion? Is a nocebo/psychogenic illness a delusion? If the symptom is real to the patient, what use is classifying it under "delusion"?
>the loving act is to encourage a return to reality
And their reality isn't that they think a vagina is there when a penis is, or vice versa; it's that something else should be there.
>>149177338
Well, I mentioned nocebos and psychogenic illnesses above; those can effect masses of people.
>this contagious form
Is mostly prevalent in young people who have the concept of gender horrifically-poorly explained to them. Sometimes, I wonder if it's on purpose...

>>149177365
>>149177372
>AGP is a widely recognized phenomena.
>source: trust me, bro.

>>149177323
>Empathy is affirming the truth (that they are their biological sex)
see >>149168560

>>149169822
Science didn't say that, actually, it was pre-supposition with which biased scientists based their studies, leading to wrong conclusions. The scientific method is precisely what proved those bias wrong.

>>149170441
>>149171073
Look like you do'nt handle facts well.

>>149175038
Prove it's pseudo-science. What is biased or false in what they state?

>>149176964
>That's because they decided you don't qualify for tenure if you don't support the narrative
Proof?

>>149175183
>Having a genetic defect doesn't make you a new gender
1. this is in no way new and exist since gender exist.

2. Sexual difference within the same species itself come from genetic mutations, arbitrary calling it a defect doesn't make it an actual one.

>>149177376
>Is hypochondria a delusion?
Yes!
>their reality
Not a thing. There is reality (truth), and being unable to perceive basic aspects of it is a mental illness.
>If the symptom is real to the patient, what use is classifying it under "delusion"?
Because that’s what it is, an Anorexic person who is skin and bones is not fat, their “truth” (a delusion) is harming them. Feeding into, and justifying the delusion is actively doing them harm. Forcing society to accommodate a lie is immoral.
>>149168560
The existence of physical deformities doesn’t validate mental illnesses.

>>149177380
Pretty mainstream, no?

>>149177422
>There is reality (truth),
The reality has been scientifically recognised.

>Because that’s what it is
It isn't. You are the one denying reality.

>>149177422
>The existence of physical deformities
Calling it "deformities" doesn't make it any less real. The reality is that the biological sex isn't a cut and dry thing, for humans or any other animals. Having a body that doesn't fall under the usual occurrence does in no way mean you have a mental illness.

>>149177428
That it exist doesn't mean being a trans is a delusion.

At no point has it been proven that all transpeople are only experiencing a fetish.

The fact that asexual can transition too is enough evidence that one does not comply to the other.

>>149177432
The existence of people being born with one leg (a deformity) doesn’t mean I am valid in cutting off my leg because I feel like I shouldn’t have one (a mental illness).
The reality is these people are delusional, they need help from people who won’t participate in their illusion.

>>149177445
>all
Who said this? Let’s try again: >>149177365
>For many

>>149177459
>>For many
No proof either.
Once again, you have no basis to claim being trans can be reduced to a fetish or that most wouldn't transition without it.

>>149177449
>The existence of people being born with one leg (a deformity) doesn’t mean I am valid in cutting off my leg
Not the argument,seeing that being a transperson isn't recognised as a mental illness or a delusion to begin with.

>Extremely abnormal behavior
>Some correlation with autism
>High suicide risk
Sounds like mental illness to me

>>149177476
>you have no basis to claim being trans can be reduced to a fetish
AGP exists, AGP people who self identify as trans exist, ergo, it is a fetish for a portion of the trans-identifying population.

>>149177477
>>High suicide risk
The level of suicide is caused by family rejection and being denied who they are. Acceptance and hormonal therapy actually diminish the risks:
https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-health-and-wellness/hormone-therapy-linked-lower-suicide-risk-trans-youths-study-finds-rcna8617

>>149177483
1. You have failed to establish "many"
2. You have failed to establish that this fetish existing negate the identity of a trans person. At no point have you demonstrated that one exclude the other or that one is being confused for the other.

>>149177484
Rejection is given and dealt with every day, many people have bad relationships with parents, but this phenomena is HIGHLY correlated with suicide. That’s significant in determining what it is.

>>149177492
>Rejection is given and dealt with every day, many people have bad relationships with parents
Which has been observed to increase suicide risk.

> but this phenomena is HIGHLY correlated with suicide
Not when the trans person is accepted for who they are and/or/ start using hormonal therapy. It isn't anymore.

High risk of suicide were also observed for gay people who were rejected or forced to deny who they are.

>>149177422
>Yes!
And the other examples?
>being unable to perceive
Is not the issue, it's the discomfort. They know what their body looks like, they just wish it was different.
>an Anorexic person who is skin and bones is not fat[...] Feeding into, and justifying the delusion is actively doing them harm
Yes, letting someone stave themselves to death would be harmful. Would someone altering their lifestyle, appearance, and (maybe, later down the road) their body to fit a vision of themselves, all under the guidance and supervision of clinical professionals, do the same?
>>149177483
>AGP people who self identify as trans exist
Because it's part of their fetish and they think they've found a cheat code. Sadly, the mainstream allegedly-pro-trans movement doesn't have an answer for what to do about them, except let them in and call anyone who raises a question about it "truscum." Sometimes, I wonder if it's on purpose...

pomni

>>149177508
>her honest reaction to this thread

>>149177502
Pacifying the mental illness may decrease suicide risk, but the significant correlation points to mental illness. People disagree all the time, on faith, beliefs, reality, but for some reason this group kills themselves often if their POV is challenged.

>>149177523
>Pacifying the mental illness
being Trans is not recognised as a mental illness nor a delusion so I stopped reading there.

>>149177506
>Would someone altering their lifestyle, appearance, and (maybe, later down the road) their body to fit a vision of themselves, all under the guidance and supervision of clinical professionals, do the same?
Yes. It’s inhumane to entertain a delusion, it’s only putting a band-aid on the underlying issues. Pacifying a symptom, with catastrophic, irrecoverable procedures.
It also places undue burden on society to accommodate their lie.

>>149177540
>Yes. It’s inhumane to entertain a delusion
You have failed to establish that it was a delusion in the first place.

>>149177546
Self evident, they feel the need to alter their bodies into something they aren’t to feel comfortable, like an anorexic, often to the point of genital mutilation. Clearly this is a delusion, in much the same way the people who think they *are* wolves are deluded.

>>149177406
>Prove it's pseudo-science. What is biased or false in what they state?
They have literally invented a nonexistent bullshit concept of "chromosomally male/female"
Like bro you either have a dick or you don't. Hermaphrodites are the exception that proves the rule.

>>149177540
>It also places undue burden on society to accommodate their lie.
Like democracy, or alcohol being legal. Glad we agree.

Trump won

>>149177577
I mean yeah, our democratic process is corrupted and pretty fake/inefficient at representing the will of the people, I would love to see that undone.

>>149177582
Like a wrestler in the WWE, yes.

>>149177591
Me after bullying yet another troon into suicide

>>149177585
>I would love to see
And why should they listen to (You), you eleutheromaniac?

If troons stuck to being weirdos who know they are weirdos instead of being the next progressive passion project, it would have been fine. It was the normalization campaign that created the resistance. Can’t you just be weird?

>>149177600
No anon, if each and every person on Earth doesn’t affirm them personally they WILL kill themselves and that’s society’s fault!

>>149177595
Oh it’s you.

>>149177600
They are narcissists. It's not enough for them to exist in peace. They need to MAKE YOU kneel and deny the truth for their own ego.

THERE ARE FOUR LIGHTS.

>>149177622
Answer the question: why should they listen to (You) about whatever system (You) want implemented?

>>149177632
Why should they implement anti-corruption measures? Well, loyalty to America and our principles I suppose. Will they though? Unlikely.

>>149177641
>Why should they implement anti-corruption measures?
Define corruption, and how it would be alleviated.
>our principles
Why are you including yourself in a system you have no connection to?

>oh my contrapoints... i caught a chudj-ACK!

>This is what passes for /co discussion
This site should've stayed dead

>>149176305
Unironically why should black people be in a fantasy setting based on European folklore? That's like having whites in a fantasy setting based on African folklore, or hispanics in a fantasy setting based on Asian folklore.

>>149177659
Well for starters removing illegals from census data, federal law preventing them from voting, fixing gerrymandering, paper ballots one day voting, national holiday to vote, audits, voter ID nationwide, registering AIPAC under FARA, that’s just off the dome there’s a billion things to do. No stock trading in congress, term limits, fuck so much.
I don’t understand the second question.

>>149177684
>WAHHHHHHHHHHHHH I GOT BTFO AND AM ON THE VERGE OF SUICIDE! IT'S ALL 4CHANS FAULT I'M A DYSGENIC FREAK!

>>149177692
Yeah it’s lame and immersion breaking.

Goose is a really cool dude who has lots more to contribute to the world, I hope he’s secure and doesn’t kill himself, it would be a sad day, like when SOPHIE killed himself. This illness has taken some artistic geniuses from us.

>>149177701
That's nice. I'd just make literacy tests mandatory for all citizens, save for those already in Governmental Power.
>I don’t understand the second question
You have no connection to the Government. What are "our principles" that both you and it somehow share?

>>149177728
Well, ostensibly the government is supposed to (in principle) work for we the people, the system is meant to be ours. It isn’t and that’s a major problem.

>>149177736
>the system is meant to be ours
Why?
>It isn’t and that’s a major problem
Same question.

>>149177553
>Self evident
Seeing it's not scientifically recognised as such, no, it isn't. It's just you being in denial of what is currently known.

>They have literally invented a nonexistent bullshit concept of "chromosomally male/female"
Proof that it's nonexitent bullshit?

>>149177744
Appeal to authority fallacy.

>>149177585
>and pretty fake/inefficient at representing the will of the people
About that...
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/majority-of-americans-reject-anti-trans-bills-but-support-for-this-restriction-is-rising

>>149177755
Appeal to majority fallacy.

>>149177600
>If I could continue to shame and insult trans people without being called a meanie I wouldn't have turned right-wing
You were always right-wing.

I’m loving the prepared links and arguments, very organic.

>>149177631
>They need to MAKE YOU kneel and deny the truth for their own ego.
They are not asking you to kneel to anything and they certainly are not asking you to deny the truth. You are full of shit.

>>149177755
if your biased poll reflected reality, trump wouldn't be in office right now troon

>>149177765
That’s a whole ass other sentence.

>>149177771
>They are not asking you to kneel to anything
yeah and thats why they have spent the last decade trying to ruin the life of anyone who calls them by their actual gender
>and they certainly are not asking you to deny the truth
except the fundamental universal truth that there are men and women and you can't change between them

>>149177706
>REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Really getting a use out of your basedjack folder today, huh

>>149177771
Of course they are, people get fired for not participating in their compelled speech rules.

>>149177760
Boy you are bad at this, anon. At no point did I claim that the majority willing this meant that this made it true, therefore it's not such fallacy.

The point was that anon complained that the system was bad at representing the will of the people and I showed him that id the system represented the will of the people the system wouldn't pass anti-trans bill.

Try to follow the conversation.

>>149177773
>biased poll
Proof?

>>149177793
Motte and Bailey fallacy.

>>149177787
Being fired for being disrespectful in the work-place is not a rule established by trans people, anon.

Do you also consider you are forced to kneel because you'll be fired if you use a racial slur against a black co-worker?

>>149177800
Trump won

>>149177804
So it’s a compelled lie, it is “disrespectful” to tell the truth.
Point proven.

>>149177800
All polls are biased. It's so fucking cringe to see anyone left or right point to them as proof of any consensus.

>>149177803
Nope.

Once again, you don't understand the fallacy you are accusing me of commuting.

>>149177804
A flat earther thinks people refuting his bullshit is "disrespectful" too. Should we be fired for that?

>>149177743
Funny that asking "Why?" is apparently enough to stun-lock an eleutheromaniac...

>>149177806
He wasn't even elected by the majority of the voters, let alone all the american citizen in age of voting.

>So it’s a compelled lie
You have failed to establish it was a lie in the first place.

>>149177810
Proof the bias were significant enough to delegitimate the poll?

>>149177804
I find it disrespectful to ask me to lie about somebody’s sex. Who’s getting fired for disrespecting me?

>>149177823
Your question isn’t interesting.

>>149177816
>A flat earther thinks people refuting his bullshit is "disrespectful" too
Flat earhters have been proven wrong, so not a valid equivalence. Flat-earthers aren't protected minorities who are regular target of hate crimes either.

>>149177835
>I can't answer it honestly
Fixed.

>>149177828
>I find it disrespectful to ask me to lie
You have failed to establish it was a lie in the first place. Your argument is invalid.

>>149177743
>Why?
Not that anon, but if it the system is not working in the interest of the people, what's the point for the people to support it?

You are your biological sex.

>>149177826
>He wasn't even elected by the majority of the voters
He won more votes than team tranny, so either your poll is bullshit or the people who claimed to oppose anti-trans legislation voted for an anti-trans president.

>>149177857
Sorry, I identify as someone who can visually ascertain the sex of other people, you must respect my point of view or I will have you fired and then KILL myself.

>>149177837
You have also been proven wrong but you won't accept that because it's probably the only thing keeping your mentally unstable ass from suicide.

>>149176945
explain elagabalus

>>149177858
see >>149168560

>>149177873
Physical deformities don’t excuse mental illnesses.

If troons really believed they were literally women they wouldn’t need to take hormones and cut their dicks off because they are in a woman’s body.

>>149177873
see
>>149175038
>>149175065
>>149177574

>>149177857
>if it [sic] the system is not working in the interest of the people, what's the point for the people to support it?
Why does it need the people's support?

>>149177859
>He won more votes than team tranny
Harris actually toned done her support for Trans people and Trump still didn't get the majority of voters, You still haven't shown proof this poll is biased.

>>149177864
>my gut feeling and first visual impressions are more valid than a medical exam and throughout scientific studies
Sure, buddy.

>>149177867
>You have also been proven wrong
Now look who is delusional. Where have I been proven wrong? (also, I am cis, by the way)

>>149177823
>eleutheromaniac
You again? Fuck off you bootlicker

>>149177876
You have failed to establish it was a mental illness.

>>149177888
see>>149177406

>>149177897
>Why does it need the people's support?
A system collapse if the people no longer support it and are willing to take it down.

>>149177900
PBS has a liberal slant, that's a fact of life. I could show you a biased fox news poll that "proves" my side is actually the majority but I don't have to because my side wins elections, faggot.

Also there is no such thing as "cis." It's called NORMAL.

>>149177916
>PBS has a liberal slant, that's a fact of life.
You still have to establish that this specific poll was biased and how it affected the result. Go look at the methodology of the poll and how it might have resulted in an invalid result.

>>149177902
>bootlicker
Oh, oof, ouch, so hurtful, et cetera. Happy?
>>149177908
>A system collapse[s] if
The people in charge of it allow it to be weak enough. An uninformed rabble should have no effect on it whatsoever.
>willing to take it down
Willing only so long as they're able, yes...

>>149177900
Yes, identifying men and women is easily done even by small children, it’s a necessary adaptation for reproduction.
>>149177908
Self evident, they suddenly feel like they don’t belong in their own body, that they are a different category of thing than they belong to.

>>149177916
Cis and trans are term who have existed in chemistry for decades, now.

And just because there is less occurrence of something doesn't mean you are abnormal.

Being white isn't abnormal either.

>>149177927
You unironically believe people shouldn't have free will. So do as you preach and shut up and let others make your decisions for you

>>149177936
>My retarded ideology has plagued the earth for multiple decades now that gives it legitimacy!
No.
>Being trans (which i chose) is like being a racial minority! (which you are born into)
No.

>>149168210
i hope he's burning in hell

>352 replies and 56 images omitted. Click here to view.

>>149172719
My take is that he bullies the others to exert some degree of control over a situation that is completely out of his control. The reason he was so freaked out by the votes in the most recent episode is because he has even less control over his life than he previously thought with even his mind and body able to be changed by Caine.
Probably also why abstraction freaks him out so much as well.

All the characters are coping with their situations in different ways.
Jax is tormenting the others to exert control.
Gangle has fallen into learned helplessness and just allows whatever misfortune or abuse occurs to her to happen because she feels she can't stop it.
Zooble has mostly checked out and just tries to ignore the situation by not engaging with it.
Ragatha is seemingly in denial and distracts herself by babying the other characters projecting her insecurities onto them so she can maintain the illusion of her being unaffected
Kinger has gone insane/is disassociating

In Pomni's case she seems to be taking a tentatively proactive response by trying to understand the others and learn about how things work in the digital world instead of just coping with it.

>>149177950
Troon came in with prepared talking points, bump limit was inevitable.

Even the top 1% of the 1% can’t get the voice.

>>149177944
>You unironically believe people shouldn't have free will
*don't. The question of free will is a question of metaphysics, not politics.
>do as you preach and shut up
Is anyone going to make me? No? Okay, then.

>>149177927
>An uninformed rabble
This is of no relevance to discussion at point, so this is not relevant.

It remains that a system collapse if the people under it no longer support it.

>so long as they're able
There exist no system that can't be overthrown if the majority of people want to take it down. A machine can no longer function if its parts cease to be compliant.

>>149177933
>yes, identifying men and women is easily done even by small children
Source literally is "trust me, bro".

>Self evident
Seeing the medical community disagree with you, no it isn't.

>>149177950
>56 images
>0 Pomni smut
I'm disappointed/co/, very disappointed

>>149177976
>People don't have free will!
>Disproves his own viewpoint by doing something other than what he was told
Congrats we disproved your retarded thesis

>this guy's got a gaping wound where his genitals should be, we're gonna need immediate medevac!

>>149177945
>>My retarded ideology has plagued the earth for multiple decades
There has record of trans people for centuries. And something backed by sicntific data is not simply an ideology.

You are in denial of facts.

>>Being trans (which i chose)
You have failed to prove it is a choice. You once again fail to make a point.

>>149177977
>Source literally is "trust me, bro".
No it's literally asking a kid to identify who is a boy and who is a girl. My 1 year old son can do this

>>149177977
>This is of no relevance
To you, because reality doesn't matter to you.
>A machine can no longer function if its parts cease to be compliant
Then you fix the parts, not ask the parts what sort of machine they want to be in.
>>149177985
>>Disproves his own viewpoint
The chemical reactions that caused life to arise were entirely deterministic. Why would life itself be any different?

>>149177977
Source is everyone throughout human history across separate cultures were able to navigate sex identification rather easily, and each of the 8 billion people on Earth is a result of a successful identification of sex, no ringing up an academic for verification required. If it really was so complicated, it should have popped up as an obstacle regularly.

>>149177989
Let me guess you have like two examples or you're doing that thing where you take a foreign culture's gender-nonconformity (like native two-souls) and colonizing them into modern trannyism.

I watched you niggas invent this shit on tumblr in like 2014 you're not fooling anyone.

>>149177988
>that wrap
>those stickers

>>149177998
>No it's literally asking a kid to identify who is a boy and who is a girl.
And sometimes, they will get it wrong, even for cis people.
The person on the right here is a ciswoman, by the way.

You fail to make a point and are in denial of reality.

>>149178024
Ugly people existing doesn’t mean sex identification can only be done in a lab.

it's funny how hard these mental gymnastics get BTFO by "you have a dick"

>>149178002
>Source is everyone throughout human history across separate cultures were able to navigate sex identification rather easily
Wrong again, history is filled with record of trans people.

>>149178008
>Let me guess you have like two examples or you're doing that thing where you take a foreign culture's gender-nonconformity (like native two-souls)
Thank you for recognising you are wrong.

>I watched you niggas invent this shit
Couldn't be modern studies of trans people pre-date WWII and I doubt you are that old.

>>149177988
Are they seriously arresting him to? Ultra kek

>>149178021
I ask with genuine curiosity: who might this be directed to?

>>149177999
>The chemical reactions that caused life to arise were entirely deterministic
The chemical reactions have so much variance that there is never going to be a clear indication of what the effect of any given cause will truly be. At best you will get a generalized idea of what might happen. Do you even understand basic chaos theory? It's why predicting the weather is often a compelte crapshoot with only the biggest generalities being correct.

>>149178031
And those people were seen as their biological sex, easily identified, another of the trillions of times it has happened.

>>149178028
>Ugly people existing
your argument is based on the sex-identification being visually so obvious that even kids can do it.

It was already flimsy in its own way and even then, it is proven false, here.

>>149167631
Oh no, the person who wants to get fucked for a living but demand you treat them like a person instead of an object...like they are selling themselves as to men. They are having a bad time?
Anon, do you hear it? The smallest microscopic violin is playing!

>>149178024
>people get it wrong
Yeah people get things wrong, doesn't change that there are empirical facts that can be observed you retard.

>>149178045
>And those people were seen as their biological sex, easily identified,
You have already been shown that visual identification isn't reliable, anon. >>149178024

>>149178031
Thank you for admitting you engage in cultural colonialism on the ethnic minorities you pretend to be on the same level as.
By the way, the existence of people like Elagabalus doesn't prove anything other than that there's always been crazy people. It doesn't make your or his beliefs any more valid.

>>149178047
Exceptions don’t negate principles. Billions of people exist because we have the ability to distinguish gender visually, finding an ugly person doesn’t change this fact about the human condition.

>>149178034
>The chemical reactions have so much variance
Still deterministic.
>Do you even understand basic chaos theory?
That our inability to measure literally everything means there will be outcomes we cannot predict? Sure. That doesn't make chemistry less deterministic, or give you any magical free will.

>>149178052
>Yeah people get things wrong
Thank you for recognising that visual identification by kids is not reliable and therefore not a valid basis for an argument.

>>149178053
It’s absolutely reliable, it’s led to billions of pregnancies.

>>149178047
Generally speaking sex identification is that easy you dumb faggot. If a little kid can identify a man and a woman with 99% accuracy then yeah it's pretty fucking easy. Weird variences will always occur but that doesn't ignore the general rule. What are you gonna do next make the retarded argument that intersex people legitamize the trans movement?

You know, yall should try boypussy, transmen hole sure is great.

>>149178055
>Thank you for admitting you engage in cultural colonialism
You have failed to establish that it is, anon. Argument dismissed.

>>149178059
It negate the basis that visual identification by kids is a valid way to identify sex.

sorry, the medical community and scientific studies say you are wrong, what kids say is not reliable.

>>149178066
>It’s absolutely reliable
You have just been shown it isn't.

>>149178068
>Generally speaking sex identification is that easy you dumb faggot.
General trends is not enough to dismiss scientific studies, anon.

>>149178073
No it doesn’t, an exception doesn’t negate a principle. If I flip a coin ten billion times and call the coin correctly ten billion minus one, I am an accurate coin caller.
Humans can visually determine sex easily, it’s a process necessary for reproduction.

>>149178080
Ah, yes, when losing a rational argument, rely on threat of violence, typical.

>>149178073
Crossing your arms and going "you have failed to establish X" or "you never proved Y" when you lost an argument isn't the nuclear button you think it is midwit

>>149178084
>No it doesn’t, an exception doesn’t negate a principle
It establish it isn't not a reliable principle.

therefore, whatever a kid say is not sufficient to undermine actual scientific studies.

Can't believe I have to actually explain that to you.

>>149178079
False, a negligible margin of error isn’t the out you think it is.

>>149178088
>when you lost an argument
See, this is the bit that has yet to happen.

So far, YOU are the one claiming that being trans is a delusion, YOU are the one trying to make an argument, and you still haven't succeeded.

>>149178090
I notice you refuse to engage with the billions of pregnancies argument because you have been cornered, and your only recourse is to ignore how throughly ludicrous of an argument you’ve made. This is clearly a bad faith argument.

>>149178091
You have failed to establish it was negligible.

>>149178096
>You still have yet to succeed by my arbitrary rules where I'm always right
You still have yet to grow a womb up your neovagina.

>>149178096
Actually it has, you’ve failed to demonstrate how I’ve failed to demonstrate.

What causes this?

>>149178105
I gave 117 billion examples of successful sex identification, you’ve given one potentially unsuccessful one.

>>149178060
Another eleutheromaniac stun-locked, love to see it.

>>149178079
>General trends is not enough to dismiss scientific studies, anon.
It is when its in the margin of error

the incel-to-troon pipeline is real

>>149178136
Past-tense indicatives aren't pronouns.
t. nothing more than a pedant

>>149178125
>>149178098
>I notice you refuse to engage with the billions of pregnancies
Nature is filled to the brim with species humping the wrong thing, sometime not even alive. You don't need an highly precise sex-identifier capacity to reproduce, you just need to hump enough time to eventually get someone pregnant.

You are not making a point.

The case remain that there is no hard definition of what biological sex is, regardless of what kids say.

>>149178108
You needing to prove yourself is not an arbitrary rule, anon.
And I am fine with having a penis.

>>149178111
Seeing you have been unable to prove being trans is a lie or a delusion o just a fetish, I haven't.

>>149178134
Have you proven that it is within the margin of error?

>>149178148
i know but its funny

>>149177999
>To you, because reality doesn't matter to you.
Uniformed rabble is not a matter of reality, you are not making a point.

>>149177999
>Then you fix the parts
You won't be able to alter the parts if the majority of them are not compliant.

It remains a system can't exist without the support of the majority of the people.

>>149178152
You can't be a woman and have a penis.

>>149178161
I am sure your threats of violence do a lot to assuage your own insecurities, anon.

>>149178152
>Nature is filled to the brim with species humping the wrong thing
Why are you deflecting to non-human intelligence? We are discussing humans.
>You don't need an highly precise sex-identifier capacity to reproduce, you just need to hump enough time to eventually get someone pregnant.
You’ve failed to establish that indiscriminate, blind humping is the mating strategy for humans.
>You’re not making a point
Of course I am, 117 billion cases of successful sex identification, in many cases consensual so you can double it (goes both ways). This indicates a biological norm, a trend in the human species that is observable and practical.

>>149178178
Only mentally unstable people feel threatened by memes.

>>149178167
Well, I am a man, so personally, I am good.

On a more general level, neuro-science say you are wrong, especially as the biological sex is not something as clear and cut as you seem to believe.

>>149178193
It’s been clear 117 billion times, minimum.

>>149178182
>Why are you deflecting to non-human intelligence?
Your argument rely on getting people pregnant and that such imperative require an highly accurate ability to distinguish sex for it to happen, seeing even non-intelligent humans can get other of their species pregnant, your argument that there is a need for such ability it proven as invalid.

>You’ve failed to establish that indiscriminate, blind humping is the mating strategy for humans.
Your argument rely on it being needed to obtain pregnancy. I have established that it isn't.

therefore, visual identification is not a reliable way to determine sex.

>Of course I am, 117 billion cases of successful sex identification
Seeing they do'nt require precise identfication to happen, this isn't a valid argument.

It remains biologic sex is more complex than something that just need visual recognition by a kid.

>>149178202
see>>149178224
An higly accurate identification i not required for those pregnancies to happen.

It remain biological sex is a more complex matter than you think.

>>149178224
>It remains biologic sex is more complex than something that just need visual recognition by a kid.
Yeah it usually involves pulling down your pants but I wouldn't subject a kid to that.

>>149178163
>Uniformed rabble is not a matter of reality
Yes, it is. It's called the majority of the population who do no work inside of any Power structure.
>You won't be able to alter the parts if the majority of them are not compliant
Good thing we're talking in analogy, and outside of it, the "parts" can easily be "fixed" in one or several quick motions...

>>149178230
>It remain biological sex is a more complex matter than you think.
You still have not proven that is the case.

>>149178231
It's the anon there who brought up using small children to identify men and women, not me>>149177933

>>149178230
>seething so hard the words are all jumbled
Lmao

>>149178241
here>>149168560

>>149178245
I am not the one failing to make any valid argument, there.

>>149178187
I presented my threat of violence as a meme, so that make it okay
Sure, budy.

>>149178243
Yeah NTA, his argument is retarded. There are troons who pass (usually FtM) and looking like a gender isn't what makes you that gender anyway, your chromosomes/genitals do.

>>149178245
I am not the one failing to make any valid argument, there.

>>149178187
>I presented my threat of violence as a meme, so that make it okay
Sure, buddy.

>>149178265
Go back to twitter, i guess
oh wait lmao you aren't coddled and protected by the authorities there anymore (which means your ideology dissolves in an environment of free speech)
maybe try bluesky fag

>>149178269
>your chromosomes/genitals do.
And even then... >>149168560

>>149178277
Lol, I have been on 4chan since 2007, I probably have a longer tenure here than you do.

>>149178224
You’ve failed to establish that indiscriminate, blind humping is the mating strategy for humans. You’ve postulated a hypothesis based on other species, but that isn’t enough to establish your argument.
If accidental gay sex was a common phenomena in the human sexual experience, you would expect to see this reported widely. Seeing as this isn’t a common trope, or common issue, it would appear that your hypothesis lacks observable evidence.
117 billion successful identifications of sex, minimum. It’s not complicated, you wish it were, but it isn’t.

>>149168516
Unown look rather funny these days.

>>149168153
>Human boy gets cucked by a brown alien in the final episode
Rightwing white men are obsessed with that fantasy they even put it in their cartoons.

>>149178250
Appeal to authority complex, assuming that's not just some random person with no credentials on twitter.
Everything they said was retarded. There's no such thing as "biologically male but chromosomally female"

>>149178224
Phew this is what getting backed into a corner looks like. Absolute sophistry.

>>149178288
>You’ve failed to establish that indiscriminate, blind humping is the mating strategy for humans.
I don't need to. All I have to establish is that a super-accurate identification of gender is NOT required to obtain billion of reproduction.

I have done so, your argument doesn't hold.

>>149178297
>Appeal to authority
Appeal to authority require that I argue that a political or religious authority says so.

Pointing out to the knowledge dispensed by a specialist of their field who has actually studied and understood the matter in question is NOT an appeal to authority fallacy.

>>149178301
You do, actually. If your out is that humans are *potentially* inaccurate in their reproduction strategy because butterflies are, you must demonstrate that human inaccuracy in a way that measures up to 117 billion successful pregnancies. If you fail to do so, you’ve merely presented a hypothetical.

>>149178301
>identification of gender is NOT required to obtain billion of reproduction
…In non-human mating behaviors, which is irrelevant.

>>149178313
>Appeal to authority require that I argue that a political or religious authority says so.
Nigga what?

>>149178299
Pretending you win won't make you magically right.

You made the argued that people have an highly accurate ability to make sex-identification and brought up the billion of pregnancies happening to prove it's true.

I have shown to you that highly accurate ability to make sex-identification is not needed to make billion of pregnancies happen.

Therefore, you can not claim that people having highly accurate ability to make sex-identification is an established fact.

Learn to logic.

In twenty years when this is all looked at identically to bloodletting or "of course babies don't feel pain" a lot of people are going to remain permanently mutilated and many more will quietly pretend they had nothing to do with this.

>>149178337
That's what the "authority" bit means in that context, when people refer to "appeal to authority".

It refers to someone or an organisation in a position of power that people are expected to obey to.

It does not refer to a professional who has actually studied the field in which the argument is at key.

>>149178339
>have shown to you that highly accurate ability to make sex-identification is not needed to make billion of pregnancies happen
In non-human mating strategies, an irrelevant comparison. Can you demonstrate these human inaccuracies? What do you think the margin of error is, compared to the 117 billion successful breeding sessions?

>>149178351
>In twenty years when this is all looked at identically to bloodletting or "of course babies don't feel pain"
That's actually where we were in the past about trans people. The current stances now are based on better knowledge on the subject.

>>149178313
You are arguing that that person on twitter is a scientific authority, and that makes them automatically correct.
Assuming that random person on twitter is a real scientist, any creationist can bullshit their way into a degree and then hop on twitter and declare creationism the truth. That doesn't make them right.

>>149178240
Thought I'd give you twice as much time as normal, but I'm calling it now. Stun-locked, yet again...

>>149178339
Pretending you haven’t lost won’t magically make it so.
You’ve deflected to an irrelevant comparison to propose a bad faith what-if sophistic hypothesis about the nature of human mating strategies. I am entertaining your claim, but you are unable to back it up. You have refuted nothing.

Anon do you really care or do you just want an excuse to be mean?

>Dogs go bark when they’re hungry.
>Actually cats go meow when they’re hungry, so I’ve demonstrated that you don’t have to bark when you’re hungry. Learn to logic bro!!!

>>149178411
Yes, it’s a horrible illness and it’s unhealthy for a society to cater to lies, compelling speech and messing with social harmony.

>>149178411
What’s mean is encouraging these poor souls to mutilate themselves.

>>149178356
>Can you demonstrate these human inaccuracies?
I don't need to demonstrate those humans accuracies, I just need "if a human male hump enough people, it will lead to pregnancy" to be true.

>>149177582
zionism won niggerfaggot

>>149178391
>You’ve deflected to an irrelevant comparison to propose a bad faith what-if sophistic hypothesis about the nature of human mating strategies
I haven't.

YOU are arguing that billions of pregnancies wouldn't happen if humans didn't have an highly accurate ability to recognise sex. You have yet to prove that true.

>>149178447
Are you also against cancer patient being encouraged to have their tumor removed?

I've personally taken the full taxonomy pill. You either produce small gametes (male), large gametes (female), neither (neuter), or the imperceptibly rare both (hermaphrodite). So, I'm sorry, but your 20-year-old cousin who lost her ovaries to cancer before menopause is no longer a real woman. Cope.

>>149178504
Your healthy genitals aren’t a malignant mutation.

>>149178490
False, you are avoiding responsibility in your arguments because you cannot back up your hypothesis. 117 billion pregnancies, very low reports of accidental gay sex (or accidental hetero sex from gay people). This suggests that humans have exceptional accuracy with determining sex. The very idea that trans people are attempting to look a certain way, suggests that they have a mental conception of what that target sex is, visually, and are unsatisfied looking like the other one. People can look at simple bathroom signs with cartoon pictures, and understand which one is the man and which one is the woman. We have that ability.
Your argument is that it’s possible that maybe we don’t, because butterflies or whatever don’t, and they can still breed. The issue with this hypothetical is that it:
A. Conflates the mating strategies of non-humans with humans (we are known for our cognitive function)
B. Lacks credible evidence as a theory

Now will you back up your hypothesis or will you continue to evade?

>>149178532
for a trans women, male gonads are a source of hormones that can negatively impact their female brain that expect a female hormonal feedback.

In such situation, the removal of the source of male hormones, in addition to the administration of female hormones can be a way to put an end to this negative impact.

>>149178614
They have a male body, so their brain is male. The unhealthy aspect is their mind.

>>149168004
>Why can't rightoids make some good animated show as well
Trannies are still subhuman no matter what, and there's some good conservative suff.

>>149178601
>False, you are avoiding responsibility in your arguments because you cannot back up your hypothesis.
You are the one who made an argument, I am not avoiding anything you are.

YOU are the one claiming that those billion of pregnancies can ONLY happen if humans are equipped with an ability to highly accurately identify sex.

You have yet to prove that statement true.

>>149178623
>They have a male body, so their brain is male
Source that someone with male genitalia will ALWAYS have a male brain?

How is transgenderism any different than flat earth theory?

>>149178648
One is confirmably linked to only one death.

>>149178648
Transgenderism is actually backed by science.

>>149178638
Same sperm, same egg, same DNA. Developed together, same body. That is a man’s penis, that penis is wired to a brain that belongs to that male body, ergo, it’s a male brain.
>>149178648
It really has gotten to this point.

>>149178666
>Same sperm, same egg, same DNA. Developed together, same body.
Biologist will disagree with you. Neuro-scientists too.>>149168560
>>149177183

>>149178632
You made a counter “argument”, a hypothesis with no evidence.
>What if all the babies came from aliens from outer space, the ancients seemed to write about aliens, thus they didn’t have to be accurate, prove that it wasn’t aliens!
A hypothesis isn’t a refutation. You’re simply evading because you know you can’t defend your claim.

>>149178695
>, the ancients seemed to write about aliens, thus they didn’t have to be accurate, prove that it wasn’t aliens!
actually, my argument would be that even ancient seemingly writing about aliens isn't enough to prove babies come from aliens.

Along the same line, billion of pregnancies isn't enough to prove that humans have highly accurate ability to identify sex.

>>149178686
They’re incorrect.

>>149178686
You do realize that the "brain scan" study found a 20% deviation from the norm in brain structure with those it studied. Not that it correlated with a female brain, just that it deviated from the male brain structure. Another important note all brains studied were from individuals that were sexually attracted to men as biological males. This study didn't have any male identified homosexuals in the study. This is important because that study may have proved a structual difference in homosexual brains, not transgender brains.

>>149168560
>It's another retarded tranny debate thread
Man I hate /co/mblr

>>149178716
Proof?

>>149178730
The gametes your body is currently producing

>>149178714
Still evading. You’ve clearly given up, you can’t respond to these points: >>149178601
My hypothesis holds water, you can’t even defend yours.

>>149172055
choosing to become trans is an evil act in itself, same with being a faggot/dyke

>>149178724
>This is important because that study may have proved a structual difference in homosexual brains, not transgender brains.
difference in homosexual brain have already been done in other studies, anon.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-84496-z

I am sure you can point out somewhere how those difference are the same as the ones observed for trans people.

>The accidental gay sex epidemic theory
The flying spaghetti monster of trans sophistry.

>>149172695
>Yup so trans people are about 1% of the population.
If being trans is so rare and unordinary, why is it being accepted as the new normal?

>>149178759
Because these people will sacrifice the harmony of the 99% to accommodate the 1%, on every issue.

>>149178743
That's not a proof that biologists are incorrect.

>>149178744
>Still evading.
There is no evading. YOU made the statement that billion of pregnancies can only happen if human have highly accurate ability to identify sex, anon, not me.

YOU are the one evading that you are unable to prove that this is the ONLY way for those billion of pregnancies to happen.

>My hypothesis holds water
Up until you have proven this is the ONLY way, your hypothesis doesn't hold any water.

>>149177154
> recognised by the scientific community.
kek you did the meme
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItBDepGyfK0&ab_channel=BasedjakPartyVideoArchive

>>149178755
Huh, it's almost like it overlaps, that's sure weird, the guys pretending to be women because they're effeminate and like dick.

>>149178759
There are less than 10% of the population who is white. Is being white abnormal, anon?

>>149178776
>Evades again
I accept your complete and total surrender, thank you for playing. Your baseless and undefended accidental gay sex epidemic theory will not be winning any awards. Your next post will be cope, because you lost, and you know you lost. GGs.

>>149178776
The proof that only two genders exist and cannot change doesn't disprove the "biologists" making shit up about them being transitory?

>>149178778
>if I call a fact a meme, it make it untrue
Not how it works, anon.

>>149178783
>Huh, it's almost like it overlaps
Does it, anon? That was my question, does the differences actually overlap, or are they significantly distinct?

>>149178024
>And sometimes, they will get it wrong, even for cis people.
>The person on the right here is a ciswoman, by the way.
this logic can literally be applied to some AI vids now. Does that mean I accept them as reality?

>>149178800
Yes it overlaps

>>149178797
I kneel

>>149178797
>I accept your complete and total surrender
Anon, you saying I am evading won't change that you are the one who made an argument without backing it up.

You have argued that billion of pregnancies can ONLY happen if humans have highly accurate ability to identify sex. You have yet to prove this true.

>>149178161
man I fucking love chud posting

>>149178798
>The proof that only two genders exist
Please provide proof that this is the dominant consensus in the biologist community.

>>149178818
Proof it does in a significant way enough?

>>149178812
It means you shouldn't rely on AI just like you shouldn't rely on a children visually identifying sex.

>>149178841
You need proof when you simply observe this in nature?

>>149178797
>lose the argument
>claim have win
>bring up a theory anon never mentioned to begin with
>say he leave the conversation
lol, cope

>>149178785
first, where the fuck is this statistic coming from? and second, being white is what you're born as, you don't decide to change your race because of a mental illness going on in your head

>>149178825
Your hypothesis was accepted as a competing theory, and when given the floor to present evidence, you failed to do so (because you can’t). Didn’t even show up. So, I presented further evidence against your claim and for mine, you ignored it. Your cope is to pretend that you can postulate an undefended theory as an alternative and then claim that because of the postulation you’ve won.
>What if uhhhh the babies just showed up one day out of nowhere, ever think about that, chud????
>No I don’t need to defend my babies appearing out of thin air hypothesis, I’ve debunked your claim!
Literally 0/10 argument, I’ve never left an argument here so victorious.

>>149178800
It's a meme since you woke types always fall back on the "trust the experts" while they obviously have an agenda to push

>>149178857
As pointed out to this other anon who keep insisting that billions of pregnancies couldn't happen without an highly accurate ability to identify sex, simple observation without more throughout investigation can lead to many mistakes and presumption.

Sex is not a simple thing.

>>149178867
You’re so angry you had to pretend to be someone else to get a final jab in LMFAO
I objectively won, the opponent didn’t show up.

>>149178886
You’re free to present evidence to the contrary at ANY time.

>>149178886
Your body is literally designed to facilitate the housing of either the small gamete (male) or large gamete (large). This isn't that complex, constantly typing "muh proof" doesn't magically mean that the organs in your body and its design aren't built around the facilitation of these gametes. Even sterile individuals show these characteristics

he RAN

>>149178868
Depending on how you define white there are around 7 to 16% of white people in the world.

>second, being white is what you're born as
So is being trans.

>you don't decide to change your race
You do'nt decide to be trans either.

>Your hypothesis was accepted as a competing theory
Lol, I made no competing theory. There has been only ON argument:
"Billion of pregnancy can only be explained by humans having an highly accurate ability to identify sex, there can be no other explanation to explain that number"

And you have been unable to prove that statement true.

>So, I presented further evidence against your claim
You presented nothing. YOU are the one who made a claim.

And you can't back it up.

>>What if uhhhh the babies just showed up one day out of nowhere, ever think about that, chud????
Never been my argument.
>>No I don’t need to defend my babies appearing out of thin air
Because I never made such claim to begin with. Keep being dishonest, there, anon.

>>149178881
>It's a meme since you woke types always fall back on the "trust the experts"
It's actually "Prove the experts wrong", anon. And you have failed to do so.

>>149178888
It's stating the truth, anon.

>>149178900
>You’re free to present evidence to the contrary at ANY time
You have yet to prove it is the ONLY possible explanation, anon, until then, the billion of pregnancies are NOT a prove that human have this highly accurate ability to recognise sex.

It's kinda cute when there's a fight.
You go back and forth thinking you're the only two people in the thread but you don't ever see the full picture!
Personally I like to believe each one of those replies is a different person feeling the same feelings...
It's the magic of anonymity. We are all the same even when we're trying to be different.

>>149178911
>Your body is literally designed to facilitate the housing of either the small gamete (male) or large gamete (large). This isn't that complex
The body is actually highly complex. Any biologist will tell you.

Gametes aren't the only sexed organs of the body, the whole endocrine system (which the brain is part of) is also different for male and female bodies, and each organs don't always align with each others, as explained here
>>149177183

>>149178939
for>>149178878
too

>>149178939
False, you claimed that because bugs have accidental gay sex often, that humans could have accidental gay sex often too, and thus, it’s possible that we don’t have great sex identification skills to achieve those numbers.
So, that’s your theory, the accidental gay sex epidemic theory, your foundation is non-human reproduction. You made that argument, you’re terrified you made that argument because you know how horrifically bad it is and that you cannot defend it, you have to pretend it didn’t happen, but it did. You are a sophistic cowardly faggot. This post was the kill shot: >>149178601
>But but but you didn’t disprove my claim!
Your claim had no foundation but non-human mating strategies, non-humans are cognitively less equipped and observably different than humans, so your foundation is actually nothing.
>But it’s possible!
Is it though? Have you demonstrated this accidental gay sex epidemic? No? Then you’re arguing for flat earth. GGs!

>>149178955
>Only
You’ve been accepted as a competing theory, present your evidence of rampant accidental gay sex or concede.

>>149178989
>Your claim had no foundation
YOUR claim has no foundation.

When YOU make a claim such as
X can only be explained by Y
but someone point out that
X could also be explained by Z
it's up to YOU to demonstrate it's impossible for X to be explained by Z

Until you have ruled all other explanation, you can not make the claim that X can only be explained by Y.

That's logic for you.

>>149179007
>You’ve been accepted as a competing theory
No anon. You tried to pretend it was a competing theory so you could evade that stating "there are billion of pregnancies" doesn't constitute an actual proof.

>>149178970
1. Intersex people are genetic abnormalities. Using them as a defense of transgender individuals who have no genetic abnormalities is akin to arguing a man without a disability should be able to use the handicap spot becauzs people with disabilities exist
2. Even intersex people has bodies that are designed to facilitate a certain gamete (sperm or ovum) even if they are sterile (which the all are one again highlighting their genetic abnormality)

>>149179045
It literally is a competing theory. My theory is that people know what they want to fuck and fuck that thing and we have billions of results to suggest this.
Your theory is that humans are blind naked mole rats that hump everything and the 117 BILLION babies were collateral damage.
You presented a nothing argument with no proof, and then sat down, folded your arms, and claimed victory.

>>149179039
Only was abandoned, you were given the floor as an equal, and let your theory be crushed into dust. Thus, the “people know the difference between a man’s asshole and a vagina” “theory” wins.

>>149179062
>1. NOOO YOU CAN'T POINT OUT THAT OTHER SITUATIONS EXIST? THAT'S CHEATING!
Being trans is also a rare occurrence, you do not make a point telling me it doesn't happen often. It doesn't change that biological sex isn't a clear and cut case, not that the brain itself is gendered and thus also potentially subject to those kind of variations.
>2. Even intersex people has bodies that are designed to facilitate a certain gamete
That doesn't change my point.

>>149177870
A decadent Roman Emperor who was basically a gooner, he had a general reputation for extreme decadence and sexual excess. Famous for his orgies. Don't see why him having a fetish is far-fetched.

>>149179081
>It literally is a competing theory.
I am not the one claiming that I have the only theory that explain billion of pregnancies at the exclusion of all other theories, so no it isn't.

The moment you posited that billion of pregnancy can ONLY be explained by an highly accurate ability to identify sex, you abandoned the "competing" situation and put yourself in a situation where YOU have to disprove all other explanation.

that's the consequence of absolutism, anon.

Until then, you can't use those billion of pregnancy as a proof for your stance.

>>149179100
>Only was abandoned
Then I accept your concession that the occurrence of billion of pregnancies isn't proof that the biological sex is a self-evident thing.

>>149179146
Considering you have not been able to present or defend a viable alternative explanation, the overwhelming evidence suggests that humans are extremely adept at distinguishing gender. No concession was given, merely the hypothetical floor for you to hang yourself (which you would do if you tried to defend your gay sex epidemic theory).

>>149179169
>the overwhelming evidence suggests that humans are extremely adept at distinguishing gender.
What evidences?

Furthermore, people being able to distinguish sex most of the time doesn't entail to any conclusion about the actual biological nature of sex itself.

>>149179209
See: >>149178601
>people being able to distinguish sex most of the time doesn't entail to any conclusion about the actual biological nature of sex itself
Actually, it does.
1. Sex is real
2. Sex is easily observable
3. There are two sexes, male and female (deformities aren’t a sex, but a mutation, healthy humans have two legs, a human born with one leg doesn’t negate this).
4. They don’t transform from one to the other.

>>149179146
>>149179209
Trans brains aren't female brains. They're shifted towards female averages more than male ones, when looking at specific structures. These structures don't necessarily have anything to do with sex, and why they're different isn't fully understood.

You might say trans brains are meant for receiving opposite sex hormones, because the brains belong to people who want to transition and feel good taking opposite sex hormones, because those thoughts and feelings occur in the brain. But any sorts of desires and personality are reflected in the brain, that doesn't mean that brain is inherently "female." The brain is extremely complicated and plastic, you can't just say "it's a female brain in a male body." I'm sure if you've looked into this you know that's a huge over-simplication of the research.

>>149178939
>So is being trans.
>You don't decide to be trans either.
and you also don't decide to have a mental illness, but hey, what can you do

>>149179254
>See:
Again, pointing out billion of pregnancies happening isn't proof of anything.

>2. Sex is easily observable
People being able to identify sex most of the time does not entail to any conclusion regarding the actual nature of biological sex.
>3. There are two sexes, male and female (deformities aren’t a sex, but a mutation, healthy humans have two legs, a human born with one leg doesn’t negate this).
Keeping saying Biologists are wrong won't make you magically right. "It does not happen often" doesn't mean it doesn't exist or shouldn't be accounted nor even defacto be considered unnatural. Naturally blond people with black skin is a rare occurrence, it doesn't mean it's unnatural.
>4. They don’t transform from one to the other.
Trans people are born trans.

>>149179274
Proof that they’re built for taking female hormones?

>>149179291
I'm saying the opposite, they're not inherently built for taking female hormones.
>>149179274
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8955456/
Source, forgot to include, sorry.

>>149179102
Way to completely ignore the argument presented. The existence of intersex people doesn't magically destroy the concept of a binary and more importantly has no bearing on the trans argument as trans people are not intersex. Would you argue Humans cease to be a bipedal species because some individuals are born without legs?

>>149179274
>because the brains belong to people who want to transition and feel good taking opposite sex hormones, because those thoughts and feelings occur in the brain
All of those are phisiological response, anon.

It doesn't change that they respond positively to female hormones. Same as Transmen who respond positively to male hormones.

And regarding the shifting, it doesn't change that it establish that it isn't a delusion, but an observable variation compared to the cis brain.

>>149178744
>>149178797
>>149178867

Dear Lord you're so cringe I'm actually feeling second hand embarrassment

>>149179307
It's not a delusion, it's an observable variation like any difference in personality and desires.

>>149179306
>The existence of intersex people doesn't magically destroy the concept of a binary
Actually, it does.

You only need one exception to prove an absolute wrong. Saying "it doesn't count" doesn't change that.

furthermore, I have already shown what the biological sex actually entail to: >>149168560


You argument basically boil down to "the distinction seemed obvious to me, I do not like being told by expert it actually isn't".

>>149179274
>Dataset shows a huge variance in brains of the same sex to the point they actively intersect with one another
>but look at how different the tranny brains are even though they fall into the same data set as those in the cisgender groupings
This data actually harms the argument of there being male or female brains.

>>149179325
>This data actually harms the argument of there being male or female brains.
That's why I posted it. The reality is much more complex.

>>149179321
All those cis and trans people had various whose brain were scanned likely had various personalities and desires that didn't prevent from their cis and trans aspects to demark themselves much more significantly.

If it was just a matter of personality and desire, you just would have an homogenous cloud.

>>149178648
It is identical. Down to the lie that trannies have always existed for thousands of years among the ancients and were accepted, just like the lie that the ancients for thousands of years thought the earth was flat
>>149178759
Where is it being accepted outside of the western world? Matter of fact its not even widely accepted there

>>149179323
So humans are not bipedal because legless people exist?
Humans are not capable of sexual reproduction because IVF exists?
Humans cannot communicate because mute people exist?
Humans are not animals because Terry Shiavo existed?

>>149179325
>>149179334
It actually doesn't, seeing there is no overlap between the male and female brain of cis-people.

>>149179334
No you posted it to make the argument that men and women don't exist when the reality is they do and it's determined by other biological constructs beside the brain you dumbass.

>>149179366
>seeing there is no overlap between the male and female brain of cis-people.
Anon, look at the graph again. There is literal overlap. Are you blind and stupid?

>>149179290
>Ignored the points raised in the post AGAIN
Are you scared? Here let me do this:
>POINT ONE: very low reports of accidental gay sex (or accidental hetero sex from gay people). This suggests that humans have exceptional accuracy with determining sex.
>POINT TWO: The very idea that trans people are attempting to look a certain way, suggests that they have a mental conception of what that target sex is, visually, and are unsatisfied looking like the other one.
>POINT THREE: People can look at simple bathroom signs with cartoon pictures, and understand which one is the man and which one is the woman. We have that ability.
>People being able to identify sex most of the time does not entail to any conclusion regarding the actual nature of biological sex
How can it not? Observable with high accuracy means there’s things to observe about it.
>It does not happen often doesn't mean it doesn't exist or shouldn't be accounted nor even defacto be considered unnatural.
The low frequency is just one aspect, additionally, there is no positive use case for these deformations and there are negative ones (can’t breed, not appealing to majority of mates, no advantage gained). It meets the standard of a deformity. Its accounted for as an abnormality, which are naturally occurring, but not a sex (it doesn’t contribute to reproduction, ergo, not a valid sex).
>Trans people are born trans
Doubt it but not my argument. Your biological sex doesn’t change, that isn’t observed in humans.

>>149179361
>So humans are not bipedal because legless people exist?
It means that humans having two legs is not an absolute.

>Humans are not capable of sexual reproduction because IVF exists?
I means humans being capable of regular sexual reproduction is not an absolute.

>Humans cannot communicate because mute people exist?
It means that humans being able to communicate by producing sounds with their mouth is not an absolute

>Humans are not animals because Terry Shiavo existed?
It means humans not being brain-dead is not an absolute.

>>149179318
Cope, I claimed victory when it arrived, simple as.

>>149179385
I was talking about the grey rectangles. why do I have to spell that out?

>>149179398
But those things are defects, are they not?

>>149179348
>All those cis and trans people had various whose brain were scanned likely had various personalities and desires
Of course, but the personality and desire I'm talking about here specifically is being a person who wants to transition.
>If it was just a matter of personality and desire, you just would have an homogenous cloud.
I don't see why.

It's worth noting that other things like sexual orientation can also be reflected by similar (not identical) brain structures to trans people, complicating things.
>>149179377
Are you retarded? I never argued men and women don't exist.

>>149179391
>>POINT ONE: very low reports of accidental gay sex (or accidental hetero sex from gay people). This suggests that humans have exceptional accuracy with determining sex.
How does that make it exceptional? Again, that doesn't prove anything.
>people can look at simple bathroom signs with cartoon pictures, and understand which one is the man and which one is the woman.
Because of sociological convention that men usually do'nt wear robes. It doesn't have anything to do with an acute ability to recognise sex.

Again, people being able to recognise sex most of the time does in no way undermine the actual nature of sex studied by biologists.

>Observable with high accuracy
You have failed to prove it was high accuracy.
And you have failed to establish how this recognition entail to anything on the biological level, especially when ti comes to non-visible organs that also happen to be sexed.

>there is no positive use case for these deformations
Utilitarianism has too many pitfal to be a reliable method of argumentation. Whether a mutation help an organism to be more successful or not at reproducing should not be a tally to decide whether or not a person should be accepted.

>Your biological sex doesn’t change
Biological sex has not a proper single definition, that's the point.

>>149179427
see>>149179460
>Utilitarianism has too many pitfal to be a reliable method of argumentation. Whether a mutation help an organism to be more successful or not at reproducing should not be a tally to decide whether or not a person should be accepted.

>>149179453
>but the personality and desire I'm talking about here specifically is being a person who wants to transition.
The thing is, the need to transition is not so much a desire but rather a medical need that has objectively been observed to improve the quality of live of the trans-patient.

>I don't see why.
If being trans was just a desire like any other, it would be noised by other desires and wouldn't demark itself so ostentatiously.

>It's worth noting that other things like sexual orientation can also be reflected by similar (not identical) brain structures to trans people, complicating things.
this is further indication that being trans is not just a fancy but is at least as remarkable as sexual orientation.

>>149179467
Accepted? What does that mean? You can be accepted as a person and be biologically defective. The sexes exist to make children, if your deformity prevents you from doing so that’s fairly extreme.

>>149179290
>Trans people are born trans.
Trans people are not necessarily born trans.
>Biological sex has not a proper single definition, that's the point.
Depends on what you're talking about. While biological sex can be complex due to variations in development, the definitions of primary sexual characteristics themselves are exceptionally well-established and consistently used in biology and medicine for the vast majority of the population. Chromosomes, gonads, Internal Reproductive Anatomy, external genitalia, etc.

>>149179460
>How does that make it exceptional?
Hundreds of billions of sexual encounters, very low reports of “oops, I wanted the other one, my bad”. This suggests that humans are very accurate.

>>149179499
>this is further indication that being trans is not just a fancy but is at least as remarkable as sexual orientation.
You misunderstand me if you think I'm dismissing it as "just a fancy". I'm not saying it's a desire like any other, it's often very strong desire and the people who have it have shared traits.
>a medical need that has objectively been observed to improve the quality of live of the trans-patient.
Even that isn't as well-established as you'd think. Especially when looking at minors.

>>149179512
>Accepted? What does that mean?
It's the whole point. accepting the identity of a trans person for who they claim to be and not ostracising them for it. There exist no objective reason to not do so.

>>149179513
>Trans people are not necessarily born trans.
Seeing they have distinctive brains and react to hormonal treatment differently than cis people, it's likely that they are.

>While biological sex can be complex due to variations in development, the definitions of primary sexual characteristics themselves are exceptionally well-established
they are strongly established in the collective consciouness, that doesn't mean it is correct and thus the general public understanding of it shouldn't be a basis to deny trans people.

>>149179528
>Hundreds of billions of sexual encounters
You haven't established that the ability to accurately identify sex is required for those billions of encounters to occur.

>>149179569
Are the brains distinctive from birth?
>this is further indication that being trans is not just a fancy but is at least as remarkable as sexual orientation.
I'd argue that gender identity is far more deeply intertwined with societal constructs and expectations than sexual orientation.

>>149179411
Because even those overlap you dumbass

>>149179544
>You misunderstand me if you think I'm dismissing it as "just a fancy".
It's clearly what you sounded like when you tried to resume it to a personality or a desire.

I am a cis-male, I identify as male, do'nt like when I am being called "ma'am" on the phone and I don't consider my male identity to just be a personality trait or a desire.

>Especially when looking at minors.
Minors don't transition yet, they are given blocker until they are old enough to be able to make a decision on their own.

>>149179593
*Always distinctive from birth, I should say. I think there are things about your brain at birth and your prenatal environment that can make you inclined towards transitioning. But I don't think all trans people necessarily had distinct brain patterns at birth.

>>149179601
>It's clearly what you sounded like when you tried to resume it to a personality or a desire.
Well it might've been what it sounded like, but it wasn't my intent to "resume it" to a personality or a desire. I don't think personalities or desires are minor things.

>>149179593
>Are the brains distinctive from birth?
Not enough studies to show that.

You'd have to make pre-emptive studies of an huge sample of newborns, keep making scans as they grow up and wait to see if enough of them turns out to be trans and, only if the sample is big enough, see if there is distinctions on their brain compared to cis-people from that studies.

It would take a lot of time and quite a lot of money.

>I'd argue that gender identity is far more deeply intertwined with societal constructs
Seeing how most transwomen were raised as boys their whole live before transitioning, and seeing how most transmen were raised as girl before transitioning, I'd say transitioning happen DESPITE societal constructs, not because of it.

As horrendous as the James Money experiment was, it at least prove that you can not fore a cis-boy to become a girl, no matter how much of a power dynamic you have over the boy.

>>149179656
>I'd say transitioning happen DESPITE societal constructs, not because of it.
How do you explain clusters of teenage girls transitioning together?

I've watched enough people on Final Fantasy XIV discords being convinced they're "eggs" to know there's social influence pushing people towards identifying as trans.

Throw around all the søyience you want, trannies are disgusting on a base level

TADC?