McFarlane, Larson, Bagley. Three artists who in part defined 90s Spider-Man. What would you say are the key differences in style?

>>149247117 (OP)
We could argue who had the best Venom design (strong argument can be made in favor of Bagley), but in my opinion McFarlane drew one of, if not the best Spider-Man ever.

>>149247117 (OP)
Mcfarlane-very organic, loose style. Full of details but not necessarily "right". Plays fast and loose with anatomy and especially perspective, not just buildings but figures and even body parts. Probably the most unique in terms of how he does pages, he basically has very little classic Marvel DNA in how he lays out a page, it's all flash. You can't deny how much he stood out.

Larsen- basically took his simpler, classic inspired style and applied McFarlane's rendering style on top of it. More blocky and chunky, he takes a lot of inspiration from Kirby which isn't noticeable in this era as much, but definitely influences how he constructs a figure. Stronger sense of perspective, but he does make his figures more stylized so they aren't as grounded within it as they "should" be. I think drawing like McFarlane was uncomfortable for him and it shows in some cases. I can't help but shake that his run on Spider-man had an "old timer trying to draw modern" feel, like Alex Saviuk. Though that's being harsh since I do think it did feel modern enough for the time(and I don't hate Saviuk's work either)

Bagley- Very sleek and streamlined. Not a single line done without reason. Has a very "hard" and "solid" feel. Lots of emphasis on technical details and perspective. And very consistent, which is a strength but could also be a downside in that it sometimes sees formulaic. But I think he was able to take McFarlane's flourishes and truly "mass produce" it in a way to make it work for all future artists. I see him as the ideal artist for monthly comics in that his pages never really feel like they have any bullshit or weaseling out of drawing normal people or backgrounds, and his storytelling is very effective and readable.

>>149247357
Yeah, this is complete bullshit.

>>149247375
We can have a discussion if you like.

>>149247357
thanks chatgpt

>>149247564
goddamit anon I spent a few minutes on that hoping we could have a thread about art for once.

>>149247117 (OP)
>AMSS 347
My favourite. Thanks OP.

>>149247117 (OP)
Why is McFarlane obsessed with large under bites?

>>149247595
>artists
>on 2025 /co/
Those days are long gone since the Gen Z invasion but I appreciate your post

>>149247950
"Monsters don't go to the dentist, bud"

I like all 3

>>149247117 (OP)
Bagley is my favorite of the three but I'm biased because I grew up reading Ultimate. Long-jaw Venom is a design choice I respect but it never sat right with me.
>>149247357
Based analysis post anon

>>149247950

>>149247117 (OP)
>>149247357
McFarlane has a striking style and is one of the titans of the industry in the 90s
There's clear talent in the art, any pin-up or splash page where it's clear he tried looks good
Anatomy gets goofy in regular panels, my pet peeve being his use of profile shots and refusal to draw Peter's nose under the mask, just a slope from his forehead to his chin
And, maybe this is just me, it felt like Todd didn't put maximum passion into his writing. A lot of his stories came across as just a job
But I'll admit to not having read his original IPs to compare

Larsen just came across as Great Value McFarlane, slightly worse in every way

No notes on Bagley, he draws a solid book

>149247564
>let me be an asshole for no reason
>>149247357
I really miss 90’s bagley, his paneling and drawings were a lot more dynamic and polished without looking too clean. I don’t even hate ultimate Spider-Man but something about the way he drew bodies, faces, and all those dumb eye close ups were really lame. Still an amazing artist, and has my favorite spider-man design

>>149249841
> refusal to draw Peter's nose under the mask
How many artists actually do that?

>>149249841
>refusal to draw the nose
I agree but when he did like pic related, it was pretty kino. The anatomy bugged me more but not as much as that one time Liefeld drew Spider-Man in X-Force. Ugh.
I think Todd was planning Spawn and he saw the signs coming he was leaving. That and maybe he thought fudging it would work with writing.
Larsen to me felt like a good artist except for some of his faces and maybe his style was too angular/blocky at points. He was still good.
I like Bagley's art as much as anybody else but Todd's expressive faces alongside the detail were the best. Micheleine definitely had fun during their run with having goofy characters out of sitcoms and cartoonish type scenarios happening while Peter and MJ looked fun and hot.
Bagley's are good but become samey. Still like him too. The mt. Rushmore of Spidey artists would be quite hard to pick as Romita and Ditko are easy but picking between Bagley, JRJR, Todd, Sal Buscema, and Gil Kane is hard.
If I had to make a cartoon I'd have Bagley do the art style as he fits nicely into that mold of creating character designs that fit with animation, Todd do key frames and expressions, villains/monsters, and Larsen for stuff like tech, backgrounds, and villains/monsters. That's another way to think of it.

>>149249841
Spider-Man has a nose?

>>149247117 (OP)
Bagley > McFarlane > Larson

>>149250386
A radio active spider nose

>>149247117 (OP)
McFarlane's Spider-man looked like an adult male. I miss that. These days Spider-man is always drawn as a skinny teenager even if he's supposed to be in his late 20s or early 30s at this point.

>>149250843
He should be like 40 at least, sliding timescale is dumber than just rebooting but if you're gonna do it have a little balls to stick to it even if you can't have legit old age

>>149250384
Say what you want about his writing, Todd knew how to panel the fuck out of a page

>>149247117 (OP)
From best to worst, how are they now?

>>149249841
>>149251111
Funny story, the way Todd was writing his solo title was that he'd draw up some images and pages, lay them on the floor, then figure out what order they should go in(I'm sure he had some pages already decided in continuity, but overall he was playing it by ear)
It's not great writing but I just think that's a cool approach. Todd never bothered to learn how to write or anything, in his Comics Journal interview he basically makes Gary Groth reeee because he's a meathead jock and says he only ever reads the sports page.

>>149250384
I miss Spider-Man having darker looks and vibes. I know it's the exception not the rule, now, but as a kid I didn't know that and liked how comics back then could look creepier. As an adult it's why I turned more towards Batman, but this era of Spidey will always be what got me into comics as a young kid who liked horror and "gothic" stuff as much as scifi and heroes

>>149251215
Interesting how that magazine cover is so foreign to today , feels like a real industry

>>149251215
Gary Groth getting mad an artist decides to lay out a page like a collage is dumb as hell. The more I learn about this guy the less I care about him. Or if he's getting mad that he isn't as well-read in general cultural things to use as inspiration, that I get, but getting mad at him in that setting it's kinda weird. I'd just laugh it off and maybe tell him afterwards that it would be a good idea so you don't run out of ideas when you're writing. Todd needed a writer but at least he made the books look good. There's not much I know about Groth other than some lawsuit I think with Shooter or somebody else and him being seen as pretentious. I know he like ran TCJ for a long time.
>>149251111
Yep. I miss inventive paneling. Webs used as borders or to layout a page itself is pretty kino.
>>149251093
Peter was like in his mid 30's from my impression during the JMS run. Or JRJR's 5 o'clock shadow on Peter just made him look older. Man that run was the furthest we ever got with the progression...
>>149251186
In what way?

Pic rel was the book Bagley had to draw for and send in which he won and got a job at Marvel. Yet again, Shooter massively influencing stuff.

>>149251415
>In what way?
How good their art is nowadays. Even if they do a variant cover once in a blue moon.

>>149250384
>MJ looked fun and hot.
Todd injected an amount of cute into his MJ that really no other artist got
Mostly everyone else makes her 100% hot

>>149251463
I'd say Bagley > Todd > Larsen
Bagley isn't great and can look rough but I think he can match his Ultimate heights if he is given time and money. Todd and Larsen are a bit old and their art looks rough in the way that can't be fixed like JRJR.
>>149251537
I'd say Bagley's MJ in Ultimate looked cute when she was questioning/criticizing Peter or having fun like issue 13. JRJR's also looked cute like when in the 80's she looks worried about Harry in pic rel, or when she gets surprised or worried in Mackie's and JMS's runs. You'll like that aspect when we get there. JRJR art back then was really good.

>>149251415
I should clarify, Groth wasn't seething over the process(though he probably would've been too), he was upset over Todd telling him he didn't really read much besides the newspaper, and occasionally Cerebus because he likes Dave Sim's art and writing. And Sports Illustrated articles are too long for him.
Here's a look at it from Cartoonist Kayfabe. Ed Piskor makes a point to say that Groth and others like him are from a whole other economic class than McFarlane, and it shows how they approach comics. Todd at this point very much is looking at it at how he can make the most popular images and stories for the target audience of teen boys.
https://youtu.be/aYQOSEzw5Wo?si=zJDAnqnjIeC6rM5X&t=7873
Actual interview is here. It's worth reading if you have some time,it's basically two polar opposites talking, with Groth trying to make catty snaps at him and Todd just sort of smiling and nodding. The screaming argument vs smiling guy meme.
https://www.tcj.com/thats-the-spice-of-life-bud-the-todd-mcfarlane-interview/

>>149251788
Ah yes I think I saw you posting this before. I kinda glazed my eyes over it. But after skimming some of the article, I forget how much more thoughtful Todd is even though he must be considering how he left, created Image while being a father, and his toy company even if I hear nowadays it isn't as great.
I'll read it in full some time and listen to Piskor later. But yeah even though I disagree with Piskor on things, he definitely is worldly in some ways like Todd is. His work isn't always my cup of tea just like Spawn isn't either. But they definitely have merit to their work. Piskor's history of rap and hip-hop is definitely brimming with creative potential and is appealing. I think I just remember Red Room isn't too great.
Yeah Todd definitely is the most based comic creator in an all aspects way in the history of the medium, championing people who were great at writing and creators as a whole, extending deals to historical creators that were gypped (PAD reference), being a great artist himself, and creating a platform for indie artists to spring their careers from.
Reminds me, if anybody knows, how is Donny and Stegman's child BDSM company doing (their comics company is called Kids Love Chains, to those uninformed)?
Also lol, Todd getting away with dropping n-bombs while praising DeFalco's talent but comparing his allegiance to Marvel as being in a racist abusers home is hilarious. Based Toddfather.

>>149249298
Why were clowns such a symbol of evil in the 90s

>>149252355
John Wayne Gacy

>>149252205
>>149251788
Also Todd's ability to trade jabs and answer Groth's questions pretty well is so based. Makes me grin like Todd in this pic. Also further justifies what we all think about comics being for teen boys and all that entails which is still the case and lines up with how Valerie D'Orazio said the Big 2 are killing comic stores in favor of bookstores and gas stations/supermarkets. They can't help but think they are above us and are chasing a target audience that doesn't exist.
Also Todd wanting to draw the harder original costume for Spidey is supremely based and added even more webbing to the pattern while others would skimp out on it.

>>149252573
>Also further justifies what we all think about comics being for teen boys and all that entails which is still the case and lines up with how Valerie D'Orazio said the Big 2 are killing comic stores in favor of bookstores and gas stations/supermarkets.

Wouldn't it be the other way around, because like if you're selling at a gas station/supermarket you're trying to make it cool to an even wider audience.

>They can't help but think they are above us and are chasing a target audience that doesn't exist.

This part I think was her point though
Bookstores I could definitely see the people in the industry try to go for because they believe they can get a better target audience there, but in reality I don't think a lot of the industry is attuned to what customers want or need

>>149252877
>Wouldn't it be the other way around, because like if you're selling at a gas station/supermarket you're trying to make it cool to an even wider audience.
It's the opposite, the trouble is filing off the edges that give it appeal to the core audience in the first place.
You take the small amounts of titillation and violence from teenage boys in order to cast a wider net you end up catching no interest with a bland product and also drive away your original audience

>>149251537
Actually Todd's MJ was the one who always struck me as being tbe most generically hot one of them all.

Yes

>>149247117 (OP)
They look identical

>>149247117 (OP)
>McFarlane
Stiff but iconic
>Larson
Anatomy and sanity optional
>Bagley
In his prime back in the day

>>149250396
Yes.