Thread 150803301

Manic Pixie Dream Girls are good, actually

>>150803301 (OP)
Multiverse. Though often used as a trope to wipe the slate clean, I have a base enjoyment of the types of stories it can tell.

>>150805503
gonna have to agree. multiverse stories can be very, very fun. who wouldn't want to see a story where the main character interacts with a vastly different version of themselves? or find out what happens when x happened instead of y? it's fun stuff when it's not oversaturated

>dorky/awkward but lovable guy gets the girl of his dreams even if she is way out of his league
Yeah, I'm thinking it's based.
Dragon Prince post season 3 and Frozen 2 are non-canon
I also love Batman out of every superhero so him winning against much more powerful opponents with prep time is also based. He's so badass.

>>150805503
Based.

>>150803301 (OP)
Literally fucking anything because /co/ is one of the most pointlessly contrarian boards on 4chan.

>>150803301 (OP)
wholesale references are funny if at least there's an attempt to tie it to the referencer's universe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcvSVXlJglg

>>150807340
based on what

>>150807257
Based enjoyer of things.

Nothing wrong with the Batfamily. Any additions last New52 is just extra crap that ultimately devalues it though. Stephanie should have stayed dead because her story is of a Robin who tried too hard but was never built for the wild world of being an urban city ninja facing off against hardened criminals. And that's fine. Jason flew too close to the sun, too. Nothing wrong with showing the consequences of not heeding the boundary of trusted authority figures/loved ones. If old members die then I can see them being replaced. Like Harold is the maintenance man is dead or something so now we have Harlow or whatever her name is. Crap like that is alright. Anything else just turns me off. Nothing against Black Robin and Black Wing and Damien but they just don't click for me. In particular with Damien he really needs an actual strong male voice in animated works. I don't like listening to what sounds like Naruto trying to be

>>150809550
This. Also, Little Caesars IS complete ass.

>>150805503
This. Casual readers are so inundated with bad examples of multiverse stories they've forgotten that it's just a story tool, and just like any other, it's fun and entertaining when actual thought is put into it.

>>150805503
For as wonky as the writing could be in that season, the multiverse part was interesting.

>>150803301 (OP)
I think villains who aren't impossibly omnipotent assholes can make for a more fun experience. Like, in the clash with the protagonist, they're both evenly matched instead of the villain going "Clearly, you've stepped into my trap" or "I've planned this all along!"

I think The Walking Dead was egregious in how they wrote characters like Negan, for example. I don't think he's cool or threatening. I'm not immersed in his actions or story because he's too much like a character who just lives due to the writers wanting him to. The Joker, too, his shtick is old as fuck. The people in my ear tell me "the villain has to be threatening, so...", but I think you can make a villain threatening without resorting to bullshit.

>>150803301 (OP)
When the character’s evil twin is a shameless slut

>>150807257
Me too

>>150805503
It depends. Some are good, some are pure dogshit

>>150814801
There are losers who COMPLAIN about that?

>>150805503
I think it works better in comics than movies because there's more space to flesh out different universes instead of just having it be a gimmick or plot device

>>150816881
I dont like the whole cape comic business model in general, but it specifically works there and not in shit like Invincible, because Invincible eventually needs to return focus to the one main universe, rendering all the multiverse stuff kinda pointless, whereas the Big Two can actually spin off new universes into their own books and have them crossover later, for better or for worse

>>150805503
There is nothing wrong with multiverse. OR time travel, for that matter. When you hear people complain about this shit keep in mind it's normies who barely consume anything outside of the most casual of pop culture and when they say "X trope is bad" it's just a roundabout way of saying "this one popular thing that did X trope is bad".

>>150814779
People like Negan because he's funny and charismatic. The main villain needs to be threatening because people like underdogs. It gets bad when the villain sticks around for too long and isn't defeated in a satisfying way.

>>150814779
Yeah, I find Villain Sues very boring. Funny you mentioned Joker because I've long felt the same about Kefka from FFVI as well. He just gains more and more power, kills people without in contrived ways without consequence, and keeps surviving ridiculous situations because the writers want him to. Joker is often written exactly the same way. I think a lot of people are just too embarassed to admit that they like these kinds of characters because they find the idea of being an invincible "cuhrayzee" guy fun and empowering. Bonus points if they have a clown/jester aesthetic, naturally.

>>150805503
Like others have said, it depends. A multiverse with clearly defined rules is fine and can be used to tell an awesome story.
The problem with the MCU multiverse, for example, is that it has no rules. Every movie and show's multiverse is different, and they often contradict themselves within their own narratives. That's part of what gives them that feeling of being "slop". The writers for these movies and shows just don't seem to have the right kind of autism for it.
That's why the masses' idea of "multiverse" is so negative right now - the primary mainstream examples of it have been pure sludge for over half a decade at this point. No one would be complaining if the stories were well-written and took proper advantage of the concept.

>>150803301 (OP)
Mary Sues going from being perfect and overpowered to even more perfect and overpowered but only if I find them attractive

>>150814779
I'm gonna be honest. High Guardian Spice wasn't as bad as people say it is and the reactions to everything about it stems from culture war nonsense and/or mental illness instead of any actual critical thinking and media literacy.

>>150804065
I'm fine with them as long as the writer actually commits to them being an actual freak instead of having them turn into a boring tradwife at the end of the story
>Heehee I'm so quirky and fun!!!
>O-Oh, the guy I was teasing and flirting with... his growth arc is complete... time to lobotomize myself lol!!!

>>150814779
There are examples who work, you just need the right talent to pull it off. Hannibal Lecter, Judge Holden, Johan Liebert are the ones I personally like, but they work because of how genuinely creepy they are.
Joker sucks, though. Joker has never been even mildly scary no matter how much they edge him up, so all these attempts to make him "the most dangerous man who ever lived" are incredibly stupid and annoying.
Frankly I'd take "villain sues" over "the narrative tells you they're super heckin' geniuses, and then get easily outsmarted and beaten like idiots" villains. Those are the absolute worst.

>>150814554
>Just mash up Sliders with Quantum Leap and put in X-Men characters
How did it work as well as it did for as long as it did?

>>150803301 (OP)
Female characters not being perfect.
Seriously, now more than ever whenever a female character does something questionable it's always blown way out of proportion by Twitter and other culture war crazies and/or those who lack media literacy and overall sanity.
It happened with too many characters to count and i am glad that public perception on characters and media as a whole is shifting into a more clear and relaxed way of thinking.

>>150803301 (OP)
damsel in distress

>>150817878
Based

Women being able to overpower men in fantasy settings. I don't get how people can be fine when Batman punches out Superman using bullshitjutsu but get mad when a martial arts chick beats up a regular bad guy.

>>150817303
>implying the guys "growth" isn't also a lobotomy

>>150803301 (OP)
idgi

Time travel

>>150819394
Because it's never a fucking martial arts chick. It's a woman who's 60 pounds wet.

>>150807257
>>dorky/awkward but lovable guy gets the girl of his dreams even if she is way out of his league
This happens irl, sometimes.
>T. it happened to me.

>>150805503
I like the multiverse especially when used to psychologically torture a character. Even better when it's the protagonist confronting a younger but more villainous version of themselves.

Idk if these widely criticized tropes in animated movies but they’re the ones I get a kick out of.
>the “love at first sight” slo-mo jokes where a main character falls in love with the love interest, usually to the tune of “It must have been love” or “I wanna know what love is”
>goofy comedic character prematurely professes themselves as the best friend, the main character is like “no we’re NOT friends! You’re only coming with me because you can help me with something”. And they eventually do become best friends
>villainous and or otherwise egotistical character has a kid enter their lives and thanks to said kid they learn about the power of love and family. Bonus points if there’s a genuinely heartfelt scene that manages to make the audience cry.
>the dance party ending. Call it corny and cringe all you want, to me it’s the fun part. The characters have gone through the craziest experience ever, they DESERVE to have that dance party

>>150803301 (OP)
Immediately dated political or pop culture references, memes, virtue signaling, caricature, and dopey comments about technology and progress
Watching cartoons like from decades before my birth like this made me feel more connected to the continuation of history on a personal level

>>150817225
It's still pretty bad, but yeh, way over hated

Evil clones/versions of the MC, I don't know but that shit is always really fun

>>150803301 (OP)
That the pre transformation is unironically hotter.

>>150817060
I think "funny and charismatic" has its limits though. When its clear a character has a certain level of invulnerability due to the script, I don't find him as interesting.

Neagan shit talking characters is useless when you know his actions don't have any meaningful consequences. If i could skip the dialogue, I would. It'd be different if you know he could be harmed here while he's doing his thing, and even better if he DOES get harmed in a way that matters as a way to remind the audience that no one's invincible. But, instead, we get The Walking Dead comics and TV show.

>>150823134
For one of these I want the love interest to be a childhood friend who upon seeing the make over have zero reaction to it and treat the individual the same as always. or better yet he can say, "Nice hairdo, faggot"

>>150817225
>culture war
No one liked it though

Childhood friends to lovers.
People always bitch about it "not being realistic" or "never actually happens" but that doesn't really matter in fiction, does it?
When it's done in a way that isn't an ass pull or doesn't seem like the characters would ever actually get together that's one thing, but it's another to just outright say this trope is shit for simply existing.
I think it's sweet, fuck you. There's a reason the intro to Up was glazed as hard as it was, people like seeing a story of two characters who actually love and appreciate each other through their lives.

>>150803301 (OP)
villains who are just bad guys because theyre assholes and don't have to have to have a sad backstory and well-intentioned motivations.

>>150805503
relying on a multiverse for your story is like on par with some teenager making OCs with ALL BLACK AND RED costumes or color schemes because it's BAD ASS.

it is the Genesis Valentine of writing.

>>150805503
Yes.

>>150823764
>People always bitch about it "not being realistic" or "never actually happens" but that doesn't really matter in fiction, does it?
The answer, of course, is "no". Reality matters the least in fiction. It matters so little, you can literally pick and choose which parts of reality you want to feature in your fiction, and tell the rest of it to fuck off. I hate to hear retards looking at fantasy with orcs elves and other unrealistic things and going "yeah, but realistically speaking, he wouldn't be able to swing that sword because its made wrong. So the design's stupid". Yes because everything else about the fantasy was realistic? The dragons, the magic, all of that's perfectly fine but not the sword?!

>>150824152
what's the argument here? that the existence of magic immediately means you should ignore how physics affect objects in any given world?

>>150824046
>Genesis Valentine
Why do you expect people to know what this is?

>>150824675
He hopes to be among kindred spirits

>>150805503
I like it when it isn't just being used as a Member Berries device. The Flash movie is a stellar example of multiverse done wrong. It exists for no reason other than to nostalgia-bait Gen X/Millennials by pulling Keaton back into the Batsuit and make Epic References^TM to past WB imaginings.

>>150824046
>>150824675
>genesis valentine
sounds like a stripper or a tranny

>>150824675
Honest to god thought there was some comic lore I was missing only to be incredibly disappointed.

>>150805503
Anything that can give me cowboy world, funny cartoon animal world, evil and good swap places world, and manga world is great in my book.

>>150823764
I've only ever seen women dislike this. apparently it's "creepy".

>>150825163
I've heard it from the perspective of "it gives the idea to boys that they should expect romance from any girl" and I think that's stupid.
I've had female friends who I felt no attraction to. I've had female friends who either became crushes or friends who started as crushes but then I figured out there was no chemistry romantically. It's just socially retarded people who are the problem.
I actually knew a pair who met when they were 12 and ended up getting married. It happens.

>>150825251
>it gives the idea to boys that they should expect romance from any girl
fair point, expecting romance from a woman is pretty deluded.

>>150803301 (OP)
Grim and gritty superhero comics. They're fun.

>>150824556
The argument is that "reality" is the least important thing when writing fiction. As I said above, you can literally pick and choose which aspects of reality you want to have in your world. You can decide earth has low gravity, or everyone can breath in space just because. When people go "Yeah, but that's not realistic" when it comes to fantasy, its a similar complaint to someone going "Yeah, but that's not fantasy enough" while watching a documentary or historical fiction.

>>150826789
agreed

>>150803301 (OP)
Power of friendship

>>150829421
thats gay

>>150805503
Spbp

>>150803301 (OP)
>Nerd gets the girl

>>150817225
I feel bad for Raye, imagine having your little darling webcomic turned into a laughing stock for reasons beyond your control.

>>150830877
To add to this, the fags at Crunchyroll own the rights to HGS so Raye can't even continue it.
Super sad all around.

>>150805503
When it's used as an actual plot device and not a Reset Button or a "Look at all our IPs!" it's good.