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Thread 151161204

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Anonymous No.151161204 [Report] >>151161216 >>151161457 >>151161468 >>151161769 >>151162177 >>151162240 >>151162418 >>151162626 >>151163280 >>151164324 >>151164530 >>151166905 >>151166934 >>151167067 >>151167933 >>151168853 >>151172164 >>151183339 >>151184587 >>151188959 >>151192569 >>151195758 >>151198377 >>151198945 >>151199887 >>151201620
>Doesn't play Sonic games
>Writes for Sonic comics and games
>Doesn't know the characters or lore
>Writes for the character books and lore team
Anonymous No.151161216 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Anonymous No.151161225 [Report]
Wow. DSP really came up in the world.
Anonymous No.151161457 [Report] >>151161572
>>151161204 (OP)
You posted the wrong man
Anonymous No.151161468 [Report] >>151167024 >>151172100
>>151161204 (OP)
>Ian ruining sonic
>Dave ruining Star Wars
>both of these fags dress the fucking same
Anonymous No.151161572 [Report] >>151161769 >>151162090 >>151162156 >>151162177 >>151162290 >>151163131 >>151164117 >>151164532 >>151164712 >>151165960 >>151166465 >>151166849 >>151167952 >>151171923 >>151172256 >>151175145
>>151161457
He will always be a better writer than fucking Flynn is. Flynn just relies on references.
Anonymous No.151161648 [Report] >>151161993 >>151162020 >>151162127 >>151164187 >>151164413 >>151164503 >>151166261 >>151188444
>Sonic Fans
>Historically mediocre games and messy ass franchise where none of the key players ever give a shit
>Still have an unrealistically high and extremely bitchy expectations despite this never being the standard
I say this as a Sonic fan, btw. You fuckers would bitch about something even if it was perfect.
Anonymous No.151161769 [Report] >>151162140
>>151161204 (OP)
>>151161572
So Penders is just posting here now, huh.
Anonymous No.151161993 [Report] >>151166011
>>151161648
Everyone generally seems happy with Scrapnik island and the manga series. Maybe Evan and Ian just suck.
Anonymous No.151162020 [Report]
>>151161648
WHEN WILL YOU LEARN THAT YOUR ACTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES!
YOU FRICKING FRICKS WILL NEVER BE SATISFIED
Anonymous No.151162090 [Report] >>151162140 >>151198658
>>151161572
Based and true. Knuckles solo series was pure whacked-out science fiction kino.
Anonymous No.151162127 [Report] >>151164263
>>151161648
I liked what Maekawa wrote, that some of those games sucked ass because the gameplay was shit is another story.
Anonymous No.151162140 [Report]
>>151161769
Considering this post >>151162090
Yes, pretty much.

Also
>Knuckles Solo unironically kino
kek, lmao even
Anonymous No.151162156 [Report] >>151162384 >>151175145
>>151161572
>Flynn just relies on references.
This used to be a strength of his during his Archie run. He did a really god job of studying past source material and being very creative with it. Now? It's very shallow.
Anonymous No.151162177 [Report]
>>151161572
>>151161204 (OP)
Can't we just agree that OP applies to both and both suck?

Also Ken having a one-sided rivalry with Ian is hilarious?
Anonymous No.151162202 [Report] >>151162300 >>151164522
Ngl I have suspected for a while now that Ken posts here periodically, I wouldn't be surprised if he's here rn
Anonymous No.151162240 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Based Sonic is weird
Anonymous No.151162290 [Report] >>151162344
>>151161572
>references
Penders was like that too, except with him it was all Star Trek
Anonymous No.151162300 [Report]
>>151162202
He’s a libtard boomer. He probably thinks 4chan will give his computer a nazi virus.
Anonymous No.151162344 [Report] >>151163316
>>151162290
He also apparently stole many stories from other comics and just Sonified them.
Anonymous No.151162384 [Report] >>151162399 >>151163131 >>151172018
>>151162156
Everything Ian's done since the Pendercaust has shown just how hard the foundation built by the writers before him (yes, even Penders) was carrying him. Bro's a midget who was standing on the shoulders of giants.
Anonymous No.151162399 [Report] >>151162409
>>151162384
He has the entire game lore to rely on now, but he just doesn't bother anymore. Maybe getting his universe deleted did a number on him idk
Anonymous No.151162400 [Report] >>151162574 >>151164224 >>151183764
What’s the point of writing for a series if you have no passion for it?
Anonymous No.151162409 [Report] >>151166711
>>151162399
>He has the entire game lore to rely on now
He always did.
Anonymous No.151162418 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Maybe thats why he Jacks off characters like Knuckles, Big, and Eggmsn while leaving characters like Shadow, Amy and Blaze in the background.
Anonymous No.151162574 [Report]
>>151162400
He's passionate about the comics.
Anonymous No.151162626 [Report] >>151164137 >>151164470 >>151177244
>>151161204 (OP)
>turns out to be the best writer series ever has
Tells you a lot
Anonymous No.151163112 [Report] >>151163386 >>151167181
His Sonic stuff ranges from awful to ok to really good. I'd say I dunno why he's so uneven, but he's admitted he hates editing and all his best work is for stuff where he has aggressive editors or was forced to do it.

His Sonic issues this year were really bad. His creator owned book Drogune (the parts I could read through previews) is really good. I dunno how you can get him to stop pandering so much and edit his scripts more.
Anonymous No.151163131 [Report] >>151163160
>>151161572
No. Ken was worse. Every single thing he ever "wrote" was just lifted directly and clumsily, and most of it was terrible anyway.

>>151162384
I think it's more that he's stupidly stubborn and stuck on how the games and fandom discourse were 20 years ago, with a sprinkling of doing things fans online ask for.
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151163152 [Report]
Are you guys looking forward to Sage's mini series?
Anonymous No.151163160 [Report] >>151163342 >>151183753
>>151163131
>stuck on how the games and fandom discourse were 20 years ago
What is the discourse like now compared to 20 years ago? Other than infested with more FOMOfags who don't actually like Sonic.
Anonymous No.151163280 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Sonic fans are pioneers in the field of having an encyclopedic knowledge of the fanfiction inside of their heads.
Anonymous No.151163316 [Report] >>151165960 >>151169166
>>151162344
The story honoring his dead dad is lifted straight from Spider-Man 2099. The end of SA is just ripped from Spider-Man's "If This Be My Destiny." He also straight copied the Peter/Ock team up from the 60s with the weak excuse of it being an homage. Almost all the Echidnapolis content is from the 60s/70s World of Krypton series, with Alan More's more direct 'It's a Nazi allegory" from "For the Man Who Has Everything" added and surface level Borh aesthetics grafted on to the Phantom Zone criminals/Kryptonian fascists. Most Albion stuff is taken directly from Conan and Elric. Knuckles Quest was Thanos Quest but abbreviated and with some Conan references. The final arc of the Knuckles book is an adaptation of The Deadliest Game but with fucking Kraven the Hunter and Grodd because...who knows. Enerjak/Dimitri is Ramuh-Tut/Kang, just from the past instead of the future. Kragok's appearances are literally 1:1 with Ronan the Accuser, down to the fucking jail cell beat down into a teleport.

You'll be hard pressed to find a story written by Ken alone that isn't plagiarized, let alone stuffed with pop culture references. It's one thing to be inspired, but Ken would just lift whole plots and characters.
Anonymous No.151163342 [Report] >>151163384
>>151163160
Way stupider and nothing but minor schisms desu. All I mean by saying this is he got stuck for a long, long time on addressing criticism from the era he started in. Trying to give Shadow an arc, making Amy less clingy, explain why Knuckles is where he is, justify Tails, etc. People still say this stuff, but they were big sticking points back then and much less so now.
Anonymous No.151163384 [Report] >>151163409
>>151163342
>making Amy less clingy
These people are directly responsible for Amy having everything that made her more than just "the girl character" sanded off.
https://gayknckles.tumblr.com/post/158689913973/sonic-heroes-amy-rose-is-the-amy-rose-i-wish-i
Anonymous No.151163386 [Report] >>151175347
>>151163112
It really doesn't matter if Drogune is good or not. The people who care about the fact that they don't like him are diehard Sonic fans.
Anonymous No.151163409 [Report] >>151164022 >>151199099
>>151163384
I think it's more a confluence of left leaning creatives worried about stereotypes and the brand as a whole shifting right. Sonic today is way more conservative than it was for its first 10 years or so, and making the girls less obviously flawed pantomimes at progressivism while shifting towards trad values
Anonymous No.151164022 [Report] >>151164357 >>151165047
>>151163409
Girl characters being clingy or not in Sonic isn't a progressive issue, it's an American comic vs. Japanese video game issue.
Anonymous No.151164117 [Report]
>>151161572
I don't like Ian or Penders.
Anonymous No.151164137 [Report]
>>151162626
Ian wrote Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2?
Anonymous No.151164187 [Report]
>>151161648
>Still have an unrealistically high and extremely bitchy expectations
Are you talking about same fanboys that still buy and defend crappy Sonic games like Sonic '06 and Shadow the Hedgehog? Same fanboys that pretend Sonic Xtreme would save Saturn and blame Yuji Naka and Sega of Japan for Sega of America being so useless that they can't even make a Sonic game by themselves while Brits made not one but two good Sonic games without development hell crap and without using other creators' game engines without their permission?
Anonymous No.151164224 [Report]
>>151162400
You Americans are still mad because he mocked you for calling him the Ducktales creator?
Anonymous No.151164263 [Report] >>151164275
>>151162127
Maekawa seems like an adorable guy with his undying love for Shadow (and Maria) and the fact that he insisted Shadow's 1st person pronoun had to be "boku". Wish he wrote for Sonic again.
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151164275 [Report] >>151168745
>>151164263

Anyone who wrote 06 should be kept as far away from the series as possible forever.
Anonymous No.151164324 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
To be fair Sonic's lore was always unstable in American Sonic media and even at the American localization of the core Sonic games. Especially at the story-focused Sonic games like Sonic Adventure where Americans have fully Americanized Sonic's personality, like they did with all Sonic cartoon and comics before Sonic Adventure.
Anonymous No.151164357 [Report] >>151164519
>>151164022
>Girl characters being clingy or not in Sonic isn't a progressive issue
Yes, it is, retard
Anonymous No.151164413 [Report]
>>151161648
>Sir, I would prefer if the Sonic comic were about Sonic and not your weepy OCs.
>YOUR EXPECTATIONS ARE UNREALISTIC
Anonymous No.151164450 [Report] >>151164490 >>151172132
Don't forget that Ian is also dealing with the fact that multiple timelines of the comic have been destroyed specifically because of Penders being a cock weasel about copyrights, and he can't touch most of that material with a ten foot pole.
Anonymous No.151164470 [Report]
>>151162626
He's barely even strung a complete narrative together.
Anonymous No.151164490 [Report] >>151164569
>>151164450
I find it hard to believe that Ken Penders is somehow responsible for the IDW Sonic comics arbitrarily using the setting of Sonic Forces as it's status quo.
Anonymous No.151164503 [Report]
>>151161648
I read Scrapnik Island first. IDW set my expectations themselves.
Anonymous No.151164519 [Report]
>>151164357
It's not. The American comic is vastly different than the Japanese video game.
Anonymous No.151164522 [Report] >>151167018
>>151162202
Ian has literally continued off of specific arguments from these threads in his podcasts
Anonymous No.151164530 [Report] >>151164647
>>151161204 (OP)
Ian hates Shadow and Amy thus is a hack and cannot be trusted with any story involving one of my favorite child hood video game series.
Jake !hYY.7y0DY6 No.151164532 [Report]
>>151161572
Didn't he get fired for implying that Sonic and Shadow are gay for each other?
Anonymous No.151164569 [Report] >>151164664
>>151164490
Forces was shit, but as a setting, it's the best analog to the previous one they can get away with; the comics have always been about the anti-Robotnik resistance, after all.
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151164647 [Report] >>151164781
>>151164530

He hates Shadow outside Archie.
Anonymous No.151164664 [Report] >>151164766
>>151164569
They shouldn't be trying to emulate the previous setting at all, it's at odds with the actual games. They essentially built this whole comic which prides itself on game continuity, off the weird outlier game that barely fits together with the established world.
It got really fuckin weird when Sonic and Blaze go on a trip through Spagonia together and they have to pretend humans don't exist there.
Anonymous No.151164712 [Report]
>>151161572
Were you dropped at a crack house?
Anonymous No.151164766 [Report] >>151164867
>>151164664
Well, tough shit, that was the premise of the comics. Don't be ass blasted that side material isn't strictly in line with canon.
Anonymous No.151164781 [Report]
>>151164647
Hes hated him in Archie, the dude look like a lame edgy loser compared to Sonic and other characters all the time. Even Amy made him look stupid.
Anonymous No.151164867 [Report]
>>151164766
Then why are they calling direct attention to the issue with things like the Spagonia tour? They could just keep things in their weird Sonic Forces bubble of they were committed to ignoring game continuity for the sake of storytelling. Instead it's all half measures and no commitment.
Anonymous No.151164926 [Report] >>151164973 >>151165012 >>151191661
Seen some complaints about Shadow in the book. After looking I’ve realized he’s fine in it. What his bitch ass fans have been really been bitching about all these years is optics, as in, how dare he not win all time or not be perfect. Im not saying he can win or whatever, but the total crying bitch fit over it has been crazy. Even with the glazing he gets, they still bitch because of shit like getting kicked by starline.
Anonymous No.151164973 [Report] >>151164996 >>151177244 >>151191661
>>151164926
I don't get the complaint about Shadow in Archie either. They're complaining about Amy when Shadow oneshotted Amy with zero difficulty in Archie? That's wanking Shadow and putting down Amy, not the other way round.
Anonymous No.151164996 [Report] >>151165055 >>151191661
>>151164973
Shadow was one of the most wanked characters in that book, with exception to Sonic and Knuckles.
They're just salty that he wasn't wanked even more than Sonic and Knuckles.
Anonymous No.151165012 [Report] >>151177571
>>151164926
Nah, that's bullshit.
I don't even like Shadow past SA2, but the way he just shows up in the comic to make mistakes is silly and ultimately makes him an annoying/frustrating presence.
If they don't like him, don't use him. We don't need an extra strawman.
Anonymous No.151165047 [Report]
>>151164022
Archie Comics is literally a series where the punchline is two girls being way too clingy, dude.
Anonymous No.151165055 [Report]
>>151164996
What? Knuckles literally doea nothing in IDW Sonic.
Fuckin Silver does more.
Anonymous No.151165960 [Report] >>151166977
>>151161572
They both fucking suck ass, the idea that someone is trying to make some artificial pissing contest between the two is laughable.

>>151163316
Seriously, they're both just two sides of the same coin. They're creatively bankrupt nerds that have no real ideas of their own, and have no idea how to craft an actual story. Ian just hid it better with fanservice.
Anonymous No.151166011 [Report] >>151167286 >>151168764
>>151161993
I read the entire Archie run back in the day (up til like, 2009) and the quality has always been all over the place, same as the games. Ian and Evan have similarly been hit and miss. Some decent stuff, some bad stuff.
Anonymous No.151166258 [Report] >>151166304 >>151166318
http:/)allourideas.org/soniccharacters
Anonymous No.151166261 [Report] >>151182615
>>151161648
The Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog was universally praised.
Anonymous No.151166283 [Report]
Anonymous No.151166304 [Report] >>151166318
>>151166258
Sorry
http://allourideas.org/soniccharacters
Anonymous No.151166314 [Report]
Anonymous No.151166318 [Report]
>>151166258
>>151166304
Kill yourself.
Anonymous No.151166349 [Report]
Anonymous No.151166388 [Report]
Anonymous No.151166429 [Report]
Anonymous No.151166465 [Report] >>151166665 >>151166691 >>151170736
>>151161572
Archie wasn't perfect, but Penders had wrote some seriously heartfelt material when he was locked in. He's massively overhated because he wrote for a franchise targeted to children and man-child autists who are not used to scary things such as emotions deeper than getting excited for your new toy to drop out, or worst of all, romance since sonic should NEVER like girls (just like me)
Anonymous No.151166665 [Report] >>151166769
>>151166465
Or maybe Sonic just never needed those things.
Anonymous No.151166691 [Report]
>>151166465
you don't get credit for being "seriously heartfelt" when you're a dysgenic autismo that takes everything too seriously
Anonymous No.151166711 [Report]
>>151162409
True as well, I'm just saying that he puts in zero effort now
Anonymous No.151166769 [Report]
>>151166665
when tamers does it it's kino, when penders does it it's bad. hypocritical buck broken fanbase i tell you
*SMACK*
Anonymous No.151166849 [Report] >>151166889
>>151161572
woah there they're both awful but let's not get carried away
Anonymous No.151166889 [Report]
>>151166849
they are. Flynn gets carried by Yardley's art, in terms of story alone Penders' Marriage arc was equally as trash as Ian's House of Cards
Anonymous No.151166905 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Comic writers were always cringe
Anonymous No.151166934 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Oh no, not the sacred lore of Sonic the Hedgehog!
Anonymous No.151166977 [Report] >>151167105
>>151165960
Nah, I think Ian is way better, he just has similar tendencies and is getting worse with Sonic stuff out of a need to please fans.
Anonymous No.151167018 [Report]
>>151164522
Because people from these threads ask him questions on his podcast.
Anonymous No.151167024 [Report] >>151172100
>>151161468
Glad to see I'm not the only one that's made this connection. The similarities go deeper too.
Anonymous No.151167067 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
He's not as bad as the haters think he is, but he's nowhere near as good as the glazers think he is. He's mediocre but I'd take him over people like Pontac and Graff or Penders
Anonymous No.151167105 [Report] >>151167252
>>151166977
He's only "way better" in the sense that Sega goes out of their way to tard wrangle him. If you don't keep him on a short leash, you end up with garbage like giving Charmy brain damage.
Anonymous No.151167181 [Report] >>151169699 >>151192369
>>151163112
>the parts I could read through previews
The fight with Lux and the fairytale were both great. I hated the webcomic version of the fairytale, but this one's a lot more effective.
Anonymous No.151167252 [Report] >>151167520
>>151167105
Sonic's his worst work, man.
Anonymous No.151167286 [Report] >>151168777
>>151166011
Ian’s IDW work has been mostly complete crap. He fundamentally misunderstands Sonic as a character and then spends most of his stories trying to deconstruct his perceived morality. He also ruined Tangle and Whisper trying to pander to online shippers. His only real brightspot has been Surge being an endearing girlfailure instead of being a generic edgy rival.
Anonymous No.151167520 [Report] >>151167540 >>151167970
>>151167252
Even that's debatable when Archie Mega Man exists. The dude's track record is just not very good.
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151167540 [Report] >>151167590 >>151167732
>>151167520

Mega Man was good.
Anonymous No.151167590 [Report] >>151167693
>>151167540
Shut the FUCK up, Boco.
Anonymous No.151167617 [Report]
I think he's ok, just a little boring. Sonic's always been inferior to Mario anyway. Paper mario has more soul than 80% of sonic material & is not afraid to make their men interested in women. sonic is obsessed wth portraying gay asexual dudes except Vector
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151167693 [Report]
>>151167590

What? It was.
Anonymous No.151167732 [Report] >>151167750 >>151167855
>>151167540
Mega Man was very, very mediocre, particularly compared to other Mega Man comics we've gotten like Megamix. Mega Man fans don't need or want someone who sticks doggedly to game "lore" like autistic Sonic fans do. Archie Mega Man going through each robot master an issue with no twists or interesting story beats was pure poison. Video games are video games and comics are comics. Both should play to their narrative strengths.
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151167750 [Report] >>151167855 >>151167908
>>151167732

The stuff that didn't adapt the games was pretty good though. Until Paul's pet OC took over.
Anonymous No.151167855 [Report] >>151167901
>>151167732
For me the crossover shit was worse. Ian clearly wanted to write X instead of Classic, and was more than willing to smother Classic in the crib in his attempt to rush past it.

>>151167750
Yeah, I do do love four fucking issues of Dr. Light being held hostage by the world's dumbest terrorist. Or four entire issues of Mega Man taking forever to defeat a giant spider robot while constantly getting interrupted by X flash forwards. Again, shut the fuck up, Boco.
Boco !sCZ24qY6KY No.151167901 [Report]
>>151167855

Eh, different strokes.

At least it was consistent. I wouldn't bet a dime Udon will have any kind of regular release schedule.
Anonymous No.151167908 [Report]
>>151167750
Mega Man fans don't give a shit about OCs, Boco, that's something you Sonic fans do not get. Many of the robot masters were created by fans! In fact, Mega Man fans celebrate creators making OCs like Bass' sister Piano, created by Hitoshi and not even used in the comic! You dumbass just do not understand anything.
Anonymous No.151167933 [Report] >>151167946 >>151168704
>>151161204 (OP)
You forgot
>wrote all the best stories in Archie Sonic
Anonymous No.151167946 [Report] >>151167969
>>151167933
He wrote the first 20 or so issues when it was funny?
Anonymous No.151167952 [Report]
>>151161572
Anonymous No.151167969 [Report]
>>151167946
I said best comics, not mid.
Anonymous No.151167970 [Report]
>>151167520
Mega Man was a 1:4 good bad ratio. Not ideal, but the good issues were real good.
Anonymous No.151168667 [Report] >>151168687
why are all sonic fans so fat?
Anonymous No.151168687 [Report]
>>151168667
Why are you so fat?
Anonymous No.151168704 [Report]
>>151167933
oops i misspelled Worst
Anonymous No.151168745 [Report]
>>151164275
As far as I understand, Shun Nakamura is behind the story, with Maekawa and Yoshimura writing the scenario (which I understand as them only writing the dialogues).
Anonymous No.151168764 [Report] >>151168777 >>151169757 >>151170311
>>151166011
I think Tangle and Whisper are fun. I wouldn't say they're carrying the story or anything, but I don't mind when they show up. But at times they are overused because they're decently popular with enough fans

I also enjoyed Lanolin, for some stretches, but felt she got sidelined pretty hard recently.

I think killing off Dr. Starline a while back was an interesting point in the story. I expected it to be a fakeout and he'd show back up, but he seems properly dead at this point.
Anonymous No.151168777 [Report]
>>151168764
whoops, meant for
>>151167286
Anonymous No.151168816 [Report]
The biggest issue with Ian is that he wants Game Sonic to become Archie Sonic, and that extends to all supporting characters as well.
Anonymous No.151168853 [Report] >>151169031
>>151161204 (OP)
I live in Flagstaff Arizona and the only motherfuckers wearing cowboy hats are actual fucking cowboys all over the age of 70 and they are not faggots like this guy and Dave Filoni
Bully these people in public
Anonymous No.151169031 [Report] >>151169189
>>151168853
You sound like someone who gets bullied, not someone who bullies others.
Anonymous No.151169166 [Report]
>>151163316
Let’s not forget this is the same man who threw a tantrum and whose ass is still sore (just read that legal paper he co-wrote) because Bioware used the stories he "wrote" as inspiration for a game without asking for his permission.
Never mind the fact that at the time, everyone, including Penders himself, thought those stories belonged to Sega. It wasn’t until a few years later that he managed to con his way into "owning" them.
Anonymous No.151169189 [Report]
>>151169031
You sound like a fedora owner
Anonymous No.151169699 [Report]
>>151167181
Awwww, they're cute.
Anonymous No.151169757 [Report] >>151170311
>>151168764
They're teasing bringing him back.
I liked Tangle at the start but she's stuck to Whisper, who has been crying constantly for years now. They both kinda suck.
Anonymous No.151170311 [Report]
>>151168764
>>151169757
It is a real disappointment he is probably coming back.
Anonymous No.151170736 [Report] >>151170825 >>151172645
>>151166465
Which comics are you referring to? I've read the whole thing twice over and can't think back to anything under his mark that would be heartfelt or involve a deep emotion.
Anonymous No.151170825 [Report]
>>151170736
It's either a bot post or a really bad troll attempt.
Anonymous No.151170943 [Report]
Anonymous No.151171923 [Report] >>151171945
>>151161572
4chan schizophrenic posters literally defending Ken penders, objectively the worst writer this franchise ever had is why I can't take 4chan seriously at all.
Next time another dude is gonna say Karl bollers is amazing too.
Flynn is fine, he's the dude that brought back sonic lore as a whole, that's fine on my book, I'm not saying he's perfect tough, but he just needs to improve some things, that's it.
Anonymous No.151171945 [Report] >>151172579 >>151173014 >>151174194
>>151171923
>nuuuuu you LITERALLY disagreed with my twitter groupthink that i can't articulate or counterargue for myself
>but you're wrong because other people tell me you're wrong!
Flynn is objectively puerile shit. His stories in archie were some of the worst garbage to ever come out of this entire franchise, and yes their worst were severely worse than Penders' worst.
You third-party chinese whisper normalfags are so ill informed you always lump in many of Flynn's fucking awful archie comics with Penders as if to blame him for them.
Anonymous No.151172018 [Report] >>151172232 >>151184283 >>151187081
>>151162384
Ian Flynn has always been a 90sfag and preferred Sonic Satam over the games.

Ian has never liked the games at all (especially not the 3D ones). He especially hated Shadow.

The only thing he cares about regarding modern Sonic is which characters he can turn gay

Putting him in charge of modern Sonic was mistake.
Anonymous No.151172100 [Report] >>151172340
>>151161468
>>151167024
Hahaha yeah I brought this up ages ago, like around the last time we had the archie conductor here
>Both got hired to work on a side project
>Became beloved writers of the side project
>Both had their female pet character
>Both gained tremendous power as executives stepped in and made sweeping changes
>Both became the saviors of their respective franchises, and rode off of their past success.
>Both became complacent without a tard wrangler to guide them
>both now just rely on memberberries to push stories without putting any further thought into them.
>Both have now completely given up and fans are now starting to turn on them
>They both wear a cowboy hat
Anonymous No.151172132 [Report]
>>151164450
IDW is supposed to take place in a universe like the games. Why worry about material that doesn't exist in that universe?
Anonymous No.151172164 [Report] >>151172176
>>151161204 (OP)
Wow, violet made two sonic threads.
Both are shit, figures.
Anonymous No.151172176 [Report]
>>151172164
Kek, that's the dude that likes to samefag?
His mistake on the sonic general was hilarious, he forgot to edit the name.
Anonymous No.151172232 [Report]
>>151172018
>Putting him in charge of modern Sonic was mistake.
This, but with Evan Stanley
Anonymous No.151172233 [Report]
This mentality that "If Ian Flynn is bad, that means Ken Penders is good!" and "If Ken Penders is bad, that means Ian Flynn is good!" is completely idiotic. Just accept they're both bad writers who lack originality or substance.
Anonymous No.151172256 [Report]
>>151161572
Ken was the soul of Sonic comics
Anonymous No.151172282 [Report] >>151172558
This mentality that "If Ian Flynn is bad, that means Ken Penders is good!" and "If Ken Penders is bad, that means Ian Flynn is good!" is completely idiotic. Just accept they're both good writers who bring originality and substance.
Anonymous No.151172340 [Report]
>>151172100
Except he was not a writer on Clone Wars. And he did not create Ahsoka, Lucas did. As far as Clone Wars went, he was no different from Irvin Kershber on Episode 5 or Richard Marquand on Episode 6. He was a hired director, whose job was to bring George Lucas's vision to life and manage daily production work. He only became a writer once Disney took over and Rebels happened.
Anonymous No.151172467 [Report] >>151172558
This mentality that "If Ian Flynn is bad, that means Ken Penders is good!" and "If Ken Penders is bad, that means Ian Flynn is good!" is completely idiotic. Just accept neither are good writers who bring originality and substance.
Anonymous No.151172558 [Report] >>151173093
>>151172282
>>151172467
What is copying and editing my original post supposed to prove here?
Anonymous No.151172579 [Report]
>>151171945
Sneed
Anonymous No.151172645 [Report]
>>151170736
For real, like the closest thing that comes to mind is Knuckles talking to his pops on his death bed, and that's only because Penders put it in because of his own dad dying.
Anonymous No.151172677 [Report]
Ian is an ok writer, but he has proven better than anyone else who wrote for the Sonic comics.
Anonymous No.151173014 [Report] >>151175171
>>151171945
Kinda funny someone tried to shitpost with that Pic, when that Pic is supposed to mock how awful the dark ages were, something Ken penders contributed a lot on Archie.
Damn, people can't even shitpost well anymore.
Anonymous No.151173093 [Report]
>>151172558
Nothing.
Everything.
Anonymous No.151174194 [Report] >>151175171
>>151171945
>His stories in archie were some of the worst garbage to ever come out of this entire franchise
Even as someone who hates Flynn I know that's not true. Some of his IDW shit, maybe, but you'd be hard pressed to say that in the same book with Charmy ODing on LSD.
Anonymous No.151175145 [Report] >>151175186 >>151198424 >>151198960
>>151161572
>>151162156
>This used to be a strength of his during his Archie run.
This was back in the day when the comics barely resembled the games, so it was nice to see him reigning it in. But now that they're aligned, it's become clear that he doesn't "get" the characters and can't write anything with substance. I'm not going to pretend he's worse than Penders but god damn Sega needs to go back to using internal japanese writers.
Anonymous No.151175171 [Report]
>>151173014
You’re proving his point very well, since half the issues from that aren’t even from “th-th-the dark ages!” Half are from Ian’s shitty garbageheap. One image is as late as Ian’s shitty Megaman crossover from the reboot, but you’d rather cry about shitposters and claim Penders wrote that than accept your obese redditor god is a terrible writer.
>>151174194
same book where Tails spent multiple years of stories being cucked by Sonic and Charmy got braindamage that made him an invalid. Both Flynn.
Anonymous No.151175179 [Report] >>151180369
All the melodrama and love triangles of Archie are what made its charm. It's like opening a tabloid rag or watching a play on Broadway. Mario has a love triangle going on & there have been references to drugs, violences, gangs in the spin-offs yet no Mariofag bitches about it. I think sonicfags are closer to barneyfags than we think
Anonymous No.151175186 [Report] >>151175439 >>151181325 >>151199672
>>151175145
Fuck the games. They've always been shallow superficial trash and they knew it, which is why the west is responsible for most of sonics popularity. Even now they had to get Americans to save their sinking ships with the sonic movies kek. And don't you dare bring up the fact theyre japanese either cause jp sonics writing is so far below other japanese writing
Anonymous No.151175347 [Report]
>>151163386
Nearly a day later and the rest of the thread bares this post out to be true.
Anonymous No.151175439 [Report] >>151176237
>>151175186
>Even now they had to get Americans to save their sinking ships with the sonic movies kek.
>They had to get Americans to tard wrangle other Americans.
Anonymous No.151176237 [Report] >>151176393
>>151175439
congratulations, you just found out americans are 80% of sonic's capital and sonic is not globally popular as mario
Anonymous No.151176393 [Report] >>151176513 >>151176565
>>151176237
Ok?
The post still doesn't make sense. It's framing Americans as being the saviors of the movies when it was the Americans who made them so shit to begin with.
Anonymous No.151176513 [Report] >>151178349
>>151176393
Nobody wanted the original Japanese sonic, not even the japanese.
Anonymous No.151176565 [Report] >>151178349
>>151176393
You’ll soon find that half the fandom blames the Americans, half blames the Japanese, half praises the Americans, and half praises the Japanese.
Don’t bother with the math, fandom logic doesn’t add up anyway.
Oh, and a bit of each faction loves the Europeans.
Anonymous No.151177244 [Report] >>151177631 >>151181814
>>151162626
>turns out to be the best writer series ever has
Fuck outta here, bro.
>>151164973
>They're complaining about Amy when Shadow oneshotted Amy with zero difficulty in Archie?
Bro, it's Shadow.
Anonymous No.151177571 [Report]
>>151165012
>I don't even like Shadow past SA2
Thank you! The only ones who like Shadow past SA2 are shippers, thus, they "like him" for all the wrong reasons.
Anonymous No.151177631 [Report] >>151177673
>>151177244
I can think of at least two games where Amy beat Shadow up, and one where she’s his partner to rescue Cream
Making the other cast look weak in side media to wank him off is a privilege, not a right
Anonymous No.151177673 [Report] >>151177747 >>151178364
>>151177631
This, damn. Be happy when you get more wank than 99% of the characters do.
Anonymous No.151177747 [Report] >>151178681
>>151177673
there’d be a mass suicide if Shadow has a single “Sonic Help Me!” game like Forces
Anonymous No.151177884 [Report] >>151178436 >>151183840
This was at the Sonic Expo Dallas.

Wonder if its a fan thing or not.
Anonymous No.151178349 [Report]
>>151176513
Ok that still means that post makes no sense.
>>151176565
Every branch of Sega in the 90s was a shitshow. The problems with the franchise since then have been complicated, which Sonic fans can't cope with.
Anonymous No.151178364 [Report] >>151180398
>>151177673
Knuckles fans have been starving for decades.
Anonymous No.151178436 [Report] >>151178532
>>151177884
>Wonder if its a fan thing
Why wouldn't it be.
Anonymous No.151178532 [Report]
>>151178436
Sega is officially at the expo and it was next to one of their booths.
Anonymous No.151178681 [Report]
>>151177747
>implying Tailsfags are any more dignified than Shadowfags
Both are insufferable crybaby retards. There's been a token Shadowspammer and Tailscel shitting up practically every Sonic thread on /co/ for the past couple years.
Anonymous No.151180369 [Report]
>>151175179
>Mario has a love triangle going on & there have been references to drugs, violences, gangs in the spin-offs yet no Mariofag bitches about it.
The original Mario movie was loathed for decades now.
Anonymous No.151180398 [Report] >>151180562 >>151181903
>>151178364
No you haven’t, you had a whole movie wanking you off, and a whole short in Frontiers of you beating up the robot and cracking Angel Island in half
Anonymous No.151180562 [Report] >>151180974 >>151181903
>>151180398
and a whole TV series, and Trip who was Fang’s sidekick now wants to be Knuckles’ sidekick thanks to Ian. Not even getting into how much the archie comics wanked Knuckles.
Anonymous No.151180974 [Report] >>151182719
>>151180562
Wade had a TV series you mean.
Anonymous No.151181325 [Report]
>>151175186
Not wanting to be like the games is one thing and I understand that there's no fun in trying to do 1:1 adaptations of them anyway but trying to replace that with garbage relationshit drama and political drivel the whole way throughout is one of the shittiest play they could have done and it's the one they chose
Ian did not fix this one bit
Anonymous No.151181814 [Report]
>>151177244
Don't be upset because it's true.
Anonymous No.151181903 [Report] >>151181977
>>151180398
>Movies
I don't watch that shit. You retarded?>>151180562
>Frontiers and Superstars
Ok, fair. But it took 20 fucking years. Be reasonable here.
Anonymous No.151181977 [Report] >>151193665
>>151181903
NTA, but Knuckles was heavily flanderized for way too many years, especially after Boom. Yeah, Boom Knuckles is funny and all, but only when kept as a Boom-exclusive thing. Sadly, the dumb jock characterization seeped way too much into mainline Knuckles after Boom’s downfall.

No matter what you think of the movies, Idris’ Knuckles, despite not being the brightest bulb in the box, was one of the key players in giving Knuckles some self-respect back, and reminded people:
>“Oh yeah, Knuckles is cool”
Anonymous No.151182507 [Report]
HE IS THE BEST WRITER WHO WRITES THE BEST STORIES!
Anonymous No.151182615 [Report] >>151182651
>>151166261
It's not even that good. It's just ok.
Sonic fans are asking for basic competency, and somehow it's too much.
Anonymous No.151182651 [Report] >>151182689 >>151182817
>>151182615
What's wrong with it
Anonymous No.151182689 [Report] >>151182708 >>151182861
>>151182651
too much sonic wanking
the new character Barry should have formed bonds with all the other characters especially tails since tails is meant to be the sherlock, but instead all he ever does is praise and worship sonic in every line he says and go "What would Sonic do???" while imagining Sonic doing minigames because fuck other characters being playable i guess
also despite being a detective game noone else gets to find anything out, Sonic just wakes up and says that he discovered the train is alive before he fell asleep. Then Barry just gets to talk to Sonic again alone telling him how amazing he is before disappearing and Sonic soloing the train. So much for all the other characters who were meant to be relevant i guess, Sonic solves the mystery by himself and Sonic beats the bad guy by himself, and the new guy has no relationship with anyone he's just Sonic's simp. Why was everyone else even here if they do nothing? I dunno
Anonymous No.151182708 [Report] >>151182757
>>151182689
Kill yourself Tailscel
Anonymous No.151182719 [Report]
>>151180974
Nah Knuckles had a tv series.
They even wasted Iblis and Solaris just to say "uhhh yeah Knuckles soloed this series endgame boss offscreen as a baby so now it's just a super saiyan form for him yolo"
if that's not fanservice i dunno what is. They scrapped any plans for Sonic 06 just to give Knuckles Super Saiyan Red
Anonymous No.151182757 [Report] >>151182863
>>151182708
>hey maybe this game marketed with tails as a main character should have him form a friendship with the new character instead of making the new character just a sonic evangelist dicksucker
>hey maybe this huge cast of characters should get to solve a mystery instead of completely wasting our time with nothing so Sonic can solve everything and look smarter than everyone diverged of the player's involvement
>hey maybe the other characters we expected to get to do something should get to do something, especially this new OC from which the player's POV has been following this whole game
"D-D-D-D-D-DID YOU SAY SOMETHING BAD ABOUT THEM WANKING MY GENERIC MARY SUE SELF INSERT SONIKKU? FUCK YOU TAILSCEL FOR EVER WANTING THE OTHER CAST TO BE INVOLVED!!!"

and this is why the series stinks. Get over your boogeyman already, this is a bad thing that should change so the other cast can fucking do shit again without sucking off your pretentious ego projection hedgehog.
Anonymous No.151182817 [Report]
>>151182651
Didn't say anything was wrong. Just that it's not great. It's just ok. A cute, neat, simple, not very interesting story.

It's a good baseline of quality, but they should definitely be aiming for better than "endearing but vapid." If they made like 5 more of these, people would get tired of them.
Anonymous No.151182861 [Report] >>151182942
>>151182689
>too much sonic wanking
He's barely in it, it's fine.

>the new character Barry should have formed bonds with all the other characters especially tails since tails is meant to be the sherlock, but instead all he ever does is praise and worship sonic in every line he says and go "What would Sonic do???" while imagining Sonic doing minigames because fuck other characters being playable i guess
I only half agree. The others not giving a shit about him was a good gag.

>also despite being a detective game noone else gets to find anything out, Sonic just wakes up and says that he discovered the train is alive before he fell asleep.
I think it could have had a better buildup to the secondary mystery, yeah.

>Sonic soloing the train.
But Amy beat the train.
Anonymous No.151182863 [Report] >>151182894
>>151182757
Kill yourself
Please Kill yourself
Anonymous No.151182894 [Report] >>151182923
>>151182863
Grow the fuck up if you start crying every single thread whenever anyone criticises this series
the reason it so often has to do with your insecure little self-insert, is because the franchise has shit the bed with its own stories just to wank off Sonic.
Anonymous No.151182923 [Report] >>151182948
>>151182894
Kill yourself
Anonymous No.151182942 [Report] >>151182965 >>151184341
>>151182861
did you ever watch Sonic X, that one episode when everybody - including Tails and Chuck two supposed super geniuses and apparently every person on earth including GUN and Rouge - are too stupid to know the moon revolves around the earth? And they all need Sonic to lecture them that's how it works so they can bow down to him and say "Sasuga Sonic Sama, you truly only go your own way for you are wiser than us and like the wind! We should all know to be like you and follow your ways, thank you for saving us from our stupidity!" that's seriously what it felt like.
All us dumb useless losers shut up and let Sonic do all the detective work and train fighting.
Anonymous No.151182948 [Report] >>151182965
>>151182923
No, I don't think I will.
Feel free to yourself though, troon.
Anonymous No.151182965 [Report] >>151182991
>>151182942
>>151182948
Please end your life
Anonymous No.151182991 [Report] >>151183001
>>151182965
get a grip, you're an obese middle aged man not a blue shonen hedgehog
Anonymous No.151183001 [Report]
>>151182991
Kill yourself, please.
Anonymous No.151183013 [Report] >>151183056
modern sonicfags would suck off Sonic Forces if it came out today.
Just look at Frontiers for your example.
Anonymous No.151183056 [Report]
>>151183013
Kill yourself
Anonymous No.151183339 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Anonymous No.151183753 [Report] >>151184125 >>151186866 >>151187663
>>151163160
Here's an example. In 2005, a lot of fans screamed in anger at Shadow being an alien. In 2007, a lot of fans screamed in anger at the Babylonians being aliens (I remember being specifically confused by reactions that went "how are they genies if they're aliens?"). Ian was leading a big Sonic forum and keeping track of these things and it stuck with him.

So cut to 2021 or whenever Frontiers was, and they want to introduce an alien race that's the precursor of a lot of the lore, and Ian has a panic attack and goes "no no the fans will hate it you got to make it at least contextualized and related to something pre-existing or the fans will hate it what about they're Chao" despite the fact that 15 years had passed and by this point, none of the younger fandom actually cared about Shadow being an alien or the Babylonians being aliens.

He actively made a writing decision based on forum discussions of 15 years prior.
Anonymous No.151183764 [Report] >>151191442
>>151162400
Don Rosa is funny because he genuinely is just Ken Penders but good. A lot of the same issues you can point with Penders are in Rosa, but Rosa just goes and makes good comics with it so even if you find his fanwank annoying, you go "but it's a good comic so whatever".
Anonymous No.151183840 [Report]
>>151177884
Huh, I do like the older Kit design.
Anonymous No.151184120 [Report]
Flynn reading this thread.
Anonymous No.151184125 [Report] >>151184158
>>151183753
>Shadow, an established character was revealed as an alien
>Babylon, an established tribe were revealed as aliens
>"you got to make it at least contextualized and related to something pre-existing"
Shit, Ian, do you even know what you say?
Anonymous No.151184158 [Report]
>>151184125
The point is more, the complaint was "and then aliens out of nowhere", so he felt the need to try and cut that by going "actually the aliens were here all along and not out of nowhere", despite it no longer being a thing that needed to be cut
Anonymous No.151184179 [Report]
http://allourideas.org/soniccharacters
Anonymous No.151184283 [Report] >>151184464 >>151184521 >>151184552 >>151191780
>>151172018
>hates Shadow
>gives him one of the best stories in Sonic since SA2
Something tells me you just don't like Ian and are coping
Anonymous No.151184341 [Report]
>>151182942
>did you ever watch Sonic X
Unfortunately.
I gave up after like five episodes because it was terrible. I was 9.
Anonymous No.151184464 [Report]
>>151184283
If you meant ShadGens, Ian and the American Lore Team both admitted that SoJ was heavily involved in both the story and dialogues for it.
Anonymous No.151184521 [Report] >>151193648
>>151184283
Ian doesn't hate Shadow, provided it is the Shadow he wrote in Archie. If it is Game Shadow, then he doesn't like him.

Now anons can proceed to shitfling about what Shadow is better.
Anonymous No.151184552 [Report] >>151184672
>>151184283
>one of the best stories in Sonic since SA2
>A bunch of member berries + "actually nvm I am defined by my past"
Incredible stuff.
Anonymous No.151184587 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
He’s also admitted that he needs his wife to beat games for him.
Anonymous No.151184672 [Report] >>151185417
>>151184552
NTA, ShadGens story was fairly good, but it is true that Flynn's reference dialogue is a pain in the ass (best appreciated if played in Japanese with a proper subtitle).
Some of the iddle dialogues in the hub world go from boring to outright stupid.

>"actually nvm I am defined by my past"
I hope this game finally sets that "Goodbye forever, Shadow the Hedgehog" does not mean "I forsake Gerald, the ARK and Maria forever", but instead that rather than being a shackle to the past, they are now the fuel that makes him go forward (if Sonic Channel character map is anything to go by, that is the case).
Anonymous No.151185417 [Report] >>151186027
>>151184672
>ShadGens story was fairly good
You're gonna have to explain how.
Anonymous No.151186027 [Report] >>151187635 >>151191873
>>151185417
The story itself has a fun premise, one that I think takes better advantage of the "explore your past" storyline than SonGen does (the latter ends up just revisiting classic and modern stuff without really having any impact on Sonic the character). It also helps answer some lingering questions about Shadow’s relationships with Maria and Gerald, while showcasing their dynamics a bit more. Will this have any impact on Shadow’s character moving forward? Knowing Sega, I highly doubt it.
I’ll admit, I like Black Doom as a villain, so I might be a bit biased when it comes to the antagonist.

Now, does me thinking the story is good mean Ian Flynn is a great writer who loves Shadow? Not really. The Sonic vs. Shadow scene alone is a clear sign Flynn has no clue what he’s doing. The only reason I think ShadGen's story turned out well is because Toyoda and the Japanese branch were involved (this was confirmed by the Lore Team). But of course, Sonic Twitterfags, who, unfortunately, are the only ones Sega seems to listen to, give all the credit to Ian (at least the last time I checked, which was a while ago).
Anonymous No.151186866 [Report] >>151186882
>>151183753
Haven't played Frontiers how exactly the known setting was ruined?
Anonymous No.151186882 [Report] >>151190046 >>151194855
>>151186866
I personally don't quite think it was (though I think it ruined Chao), but a lot of fans hate that it gives the Chaos Emeralds a bit of an origin story. That said that wasn't the point I was making- my point was that Ian was acting to try and prevent fans from complaining the setting was ruined based on his knowledge of fan demands... from 2006
Anonymous No.151187081 [Report] >>151191780
>>151172018
>He especially hated Shadow

He doesn't, but he should. Shadow is cringey autistic zoomer shit.
Anonymous No.151187635 [Report] >>151188013
>>151186027
"I like the premise" + "oh, it wraps up some threads!" isn't a good story. That's the point I'm trying to get across. This isn't a knock against anyone who worked on it, it's just a fact of the nature of the story. The writing is almost entirely segregated from gameplay (so much so that they had to add cutscenes into levels to give them anything at all) and the few scenes we do get are so incredibly basic that they don't say much of anything. There's barely even a conflict at all and the buildup and resolution is really rushed.

It's an addendum. A footnote. Nice little nods to you, the fan, rather than its own thing. Calling it the best story since SA2 is you conflating your enjoyment of being reminded of a story you prefer and a few little "FURTHERMORE, YOU ARE CORRECT, THEY WOULD SAY THAT, PLAYER!!" moments with effective composition. Even the fundamental storytelling of Sonic Heroes, of all things, is better realized than ShadGen.

So please understand I'm not trash talking Ian. I'm balking at how vapid your assessment is and how lowly you think of the writers when you put it over stories that stand on their own, including Ian himself.
Anonymous No.151187663 [Report] >>151188412
>>151183753
It also undercut the Chao and Chaos in the process.
But yeah, a lot of his context for fan sentiment is aimed at an entirely different generation of people than the target audience, and what they were saying when they WERE the target audience. He still thinks he needs to establish Eggman as a legitimate villain because of old SatAM Robotnik holdouts of those times who hated how goofy Eggman is, but even *late Millenials* grew up on goofy Eggman at this point and don't give a shit about him being taken seriously. He's been stuck on Shadow's perceived Sonic 06 "growth" for nearly 20 years when it was just 06 being weird and writing everyone OOC. He keeps trying to make Amy as levelheaded and agreeable as he can when most kids don't even remember a time when she had a personality beyond "vagina haver."

Bro needs to look at what the kids are saying right now, about the games they've actually been playing.
Anonymous No.151188013 [Report] >>151188787 >>151188930
>>151187635
>"Calling it the best story since SA2 is you"
And now we’ve hit the main issue that not even an “NTA” can solve on an anonymous board. You either thought I was the same anon, or that I held the exact same opinion (which I don’t think my post came across as, but alas).

I never said or implied that. In fact, regarding that specific point, I completely agree with your premise: It is ludicrous (and even a bit insulting) to call it “the best since SA2".

What I was saying is that I don’t think the story is shit, and that it has a bit more merit than you’re giving it credit for. That said, it’s definitely not on the level of the Adventure Era, or even some of the games that came before or after. I also see the other points you’ve raised, and I think my earlier comments (as Ian-dislike-charged as they may be) show that I actually agree with some of them.

So, if we’re clear on that, mind if I ask which story you think is the next best story after SA2? You seem to give interesting analyses on the matter.
Anonymous No.151188412 [Report]
>>151187663
Eh, Ian's problem is that he seems to not have a middle ground. It's either megatyrant Archie Eggman or Eggdad/Sonic X Eggman.
Anonymous No.151188444 [Report]
>>151161648
for every 2 or 3 dogshit games there is always at least 1 13/10 game.
Anonymous No.151188787 [Report] >>151188818
>>151188013
>which I don’t think my post came across as
I mean, I felt you were just saying you agreed with anon's position.

And I'm not saying it's bad, either. It's sorta boilerplate. I'm just saying it's similar in how vapid it is to Sonic Generations. It's just that SonGen has a more straightforward and functional narrative but 0 interest, while ShadGen is really struggling to construct and execute a full narrative arc but does much better with intrigue. Neither really stands up as well as a normal story in part because of the anniversary level pack stuff.

>So what's good?
It's really easy to point at the Storybook games because they have the best catharsis and character writing, but the actual narrative stringing the journey along is pretty weak for both of them.

Best is probably Unleashed and Colors? They both have a strong core narrative with some thought out themes and great moments. Unleashed is a bit too slow paced for its own good and struggles a bit with intrigue while Colors replaced moments that could work as good character beats and building tension for bad jokes. So, they've got their issues, but on the whole they're pretty good stories.

Shout out to Shadow's Titular game, of all things. It doesn't have a traditional narrative structure and it's cheesy as hell, but it's really effective as a character piece and does a great job getting across the ideas it's going for. Honestly has the best character writing in the entire series, which is insane.
Anonymous No.151188818 [Report] >>151188930
>>151188787
*Some of the best character wriying, for Storybook games.
Also, Unleashed and ESPECIALLY Colors make great use of environmental storytelling. I ignored the 2D games at large because most of them use this and have even thinner writing, but the way these two use the locations Sonic runs through to extrapolate on themes and narrative progression is up there with S3K. It's really a shame that Sonic Team had to start mass recycling level assets after Generations.
Anonymous No.151188844 [Report] >>151188939
>> Penders's response to Sonic Adventure Echidnas
Anonymous No.151188930 [Report]
>>151188013
>>151188818
Another side note: Forces and Frontiers are both really bad, but I sympathize because it's really clear both games got massively screwed by sweeping cuts and late rewrites. Frontiers was especially bad because some of the cut stuff was still shipped in the final game and between the boss songs being about the cast, the Ancients lining up 1:1 with them, and the weird handwave of Sage awakening the mechs in just one scene, it's obvious that part of the plot was supposed to be Sonic fighting his friends over things they've been keeping from him. Probably got nixed for brand image reasons.
Anonymous No.151188939 [Report] >>151189580 >>151189957
>>151188844
But we know his response. It was "Oh, sure, I suppose there were some savages out there, why not? Anyway, about my sci Fi story..."
Anonymous No.151188959 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
>fat retard in a gay hat is given the reigns of a long-running IP
>fucks up everything, bastardizes every characters, fucks with canon and continuity
>when called out on this, then insists that he's the one in charge and he has all the authority to do whatever he wants, so DEAL WITH IT
Weird that this keeps happening. Don't trust chubby men in hats to run your show.
Anonymous No.151189580 [Report]
>>151188939
Sonic Team canon still won
Anonymous No.151189957 [Report] >>151192386
>>151188939
I don't know how much the Archie Sonic Crew knew about SA1 before Spaz brought his Japanese, but I guess they likely knew a bigger narrative was coming and it might involve the echidnas.
If so, I'm quite sure that around that year, Penders was absolutely sure it was a matter of days before Sega came knocking on his door to beg him for permission to use his echidna lore. I can only imagine how he reacted when he was told:
>"Oh, see this MesoAmerican Magical Echidnas? These are the official thing."
Anonymous No.151190046 [Report] >>151191225
>>151186882
It ruined Chaos for me completely. Also, it just makes the Chao and Wisps interchangeable because now they're both cutesy aliens.
Anonymous No.151190212 [Report]
Penders was lol bad but Flynn is so, so, so bland.
Anonymous No.151191225 [Report]
>>151190046
Pic related
Anonymous No.151191442 [Report]
>>151183764
Rosa actually has a passion for Scrooge and Donald and tries to build upon Barks’ work, Penders on the other hand uses the Sonic universe as a vehicle for his ancient civilization worldbuilding.
Anonymous No.151191661 [Report] >>151191798
>>151164926
>>151164973
>>151164996
You're all retarded faggots and have no idea what your talking, Shadow is done dirty and smeared in Archie and idw, sega games has to save what ever dignity he has in the fans eyes.
Anonymous No.151191780 [Report]
>>151184283
>>151187081
Fuck you both, Ian has bad taste like you do and has never written Shadow good.
Anonymous No.151191798 [Report]
>>151191661
This picture being posted by you further confirms the optics thing, lol.
Anonymous No.151191841 [Report] >>151191930 >>151193794
I just want Shadow to be rational, likes to do things alone BUT can be a team player when the time calls for it, and respects Sonic but doesn't need to outright say it.
Again, the moment in the MV was just so fucking bad for him.
Anonymous No.151191873 [Report] >>151192058
>>151186027
Ian truly makes it unsubtle he considers Sonic the cooler, more likable, more capable and ultimately better of the two like a sonic fanboy trying to shit on a shadow fanboy from ye olden internet times, instead of treats them like Japan treats them, ultimate equals and sometimes good allies. Ian writes Sonic because its a fan fantasy job for him to do what he always wanted to do since as a kid, win at the Sonic vs Shadow debates, and sometimes Knuckles vs Shadow debates with Sonic and Knuckles respectively.
Anonymous No.151191930 [Report] >>151192092
>>151191841
>can be a team player when the time calls for it

Hes never been that, Iizuka says he depises company outside of missions and self interested goals. As for respecting Sonic, I dont need him to kiss his ass like everyone else does or have a apparent jealousy of him because hes the greatest thing they ever rivaled. Shadow is based cuz he is one of the few who doesnt view Sonic highly because hes specifically as capable and as special as Sonic without effort and views him as a immature and idiotic version of himself.
Anonymous No.151192058 [Report] >>151193596
>>151191873
Making it real unsubtle you just want Shadow to be all that, seen as cooler, beats Sonic, everyone else, etc. every fucking time with you clowns.
Anonymous No.151192092 [Report]
>>151191930
>I dont need him to kiss his ass like everyone else does or have a apparent jealousy of him because hes the greatest thing they ever rivaled
That's... that's what I said anon. He doesn't need speak it, he doesn't need to thumbs up Sonic when he shows up, but if he ever did like a head nod, that's cool, like a "Yeah, I know you got this" internally, and he just leaves to do his own thing.
Anonymous No.151192369 [Report]
>>151167181
Kinda flat, but decent.
Anonymous No.151192386 [Report]
>>151189957
I don't think he cared at all. He saw the games as the secondary media.
Anonymous No.151192569 [Report] >>151193497 >>151200094
>>151161204 (OP)
Anonymous No.151193497 [Report]
>>151192569
But she was a loudmouth fangirl in SA1 and 2
Anonymous No.151193596 [Report]
>>151192058
I mean it works for Akuma in street fighter.
Anonymous No.151193648 [Report] >>151193806 >>151195838
>>151184521
>Ian doesn't hate Shadow, provided it is the Shadow he wrote in Archie.

Ah yes Archie were he made Shadow beg and nearly cry to Sonic and Tails to find the truth of his past and written him as a Jobber to Metal Sonic more than once.
Anonymous No.151193665 [Report] >>151193782
>>151181977
>Sadly, the dumb jock characterization seeped way too much into mainline Knuckles after Boom’s downfall.
Boom Knuckles was only characterized like an idiot because the games already focused a ton on him always get tricked by Eggman (I even think in Rush, Cream outright says Knuckles "isn't very bright"). If mainline Knuckles ever came off as stupid after Boom, it was because that's how just Sonic Team viewed the character typically.
Anonymous No.151193782 [Report]
>>151193665
Yes, there’s some truth to that. But if you read or watch the Japanese versions of the times he’s been tricked, there’s a slightly different nuance, he’s not just “dumb”, but rather naive and prone to letting intrusive thoughts get the better of him.
I’m not joking; they go for a “too pure for this sinful Earth” explanation (not that that stops a few jabs from characters like Sonic or Rouge).

>pic related
This one’s funny, though, because Advance 2 in particular is one of the few cases where the Japanese version actually plays along with the “Knuckles gets tricked because he’s dumb/gullible” trope that the English version usually leans into.
Anonymous No.151193794 [Report] >>151199224
>>151191841

Shadow does respect Sonic, he just can't stand Sonic's constant yapping and five second attention span.
Anonymous No.151193806 [Report] >>151195838
>>151193648
Archiedow was a mistake
Anonymous No.151194855 [Report] >>151195250
>>151186882
The origin story makes zero sense because it's at odds with what was already established in Unleashed. How the fuck are the Emeralds from space while also being crucial to the Earth's cycle between light and dark gaia? It's total nonsense, and especially rich coming from the "lore master".
Anonymous No.151195250 [Report] >>151197981
>>151194855
The Master Emerald was still on Earth when the Ancients had the emeralds, so the emeralds are still attached to Earth regardless of being on the Ancients' planet.
Anonymous No.151195758 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
>doesn't play Sonic games

Flynn literally did a 24 hour Sonic Lost World charity stream when the game came out.
Anonymous No.151195838 [Report] >>151196410 >>151196437 >>151196836 >>151198907
>>151193806
>>151193648
>ah-bloo-bloo Archie Shadow was a jobber
Archie Shadow beat up entire armies of Metal Sonics and Black Arms. Shadowfags are such asspained diaperbabies.
Anonymous No.151196410 [Report]
>>151195838
>Archie Shadow beat up entire armies of Metal Sonics and Black Arms. Shadowfags are such asspained diaperbabies.

Compared to Sonic and Knuckles thats not a high accomplishment. Sonic kicked the trap out of baddies better than Metal in a army and Knuckles literally punched the gods tiers in the face and won. This is without the chaos emeralds. So yes, Jobbdow in Archie was a little bitch in the series.
Anonymous No.151196437 [Report]
>>151195838
>Archie Shadow beat up entire armies of Metal Sonics and Black Arms. Shadowfags are such asspained diaperbabies.

Compared to Sonic and Knuckles thats not a high accomplishment. Sonic kicked the crap out of badniks and reality warpers better than Metal in a army and Knuckles literally punched the gods tiers in the face and won. This is without the chaos emeralds. So yes, Jobbdow in Archie was a little bitch in the series
Anonymous No.151196836 [Report] >>151199000
>>151195838
You mean throwaway mass produced Metals invented by Uncle Chuck? I’m not even that big of a Shadowfan but let’s be honest the comic didn’t really have the best record with him. He’s cartoonishly evil in Mobius 30 years later and gets punked by Penders’s OC of all people.
He gets better in Sonic Universe but they kind of overcorrected M30YL by making him a great big softie and he needs the super power of teamwork to achieve any victories.
Now when Sega tries to explain that Archie Shadow was its own weird thing and canon Shadow is supposed to be a lone-wolf that only views Team Dark as work associates he once again massively over corrects and makes IDW Shadow a complete arrogant douche that never listens to anything anyone says. He still kept his idea that Shadow is a weakling that needs friends to become strong.
Anonymous No.151197981 [Report]
>>151195250
Except that just raises further questions! Why was the ME on Earth while the CE were in space? Are they implying they're two entirely separate things that just so happen to work with each other? It a retcon that answers nothing while making the backstory of the franchise even more of a mess.
Anonymous No.151198213 [Report] >>151198442 >>151198448
The best thing about this thread and all other threads like it is that all of you are wasting valuable time on this planet just complaining about the behavior of someone within a series who will never read your complaints, never care about them, and never change anything because of them.

Every time you waste minutes of your life complaining, the person you're complaining about wins, because they spent their time doing something useful, while you did not.
Anonymous No.151198377 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
That mattt video made me side with Ken Penders over this faggot.
Anonymous No.151198424 [Report]
>>151175145
>Sega needs to go back to using internal japanese writers.


No they really dont. Sega should probably just die. Sega Japan are the ones who wrote that Sonic isnt real and it's all a story made up by a woman to tell her kid about her jet fighter pilot dad nicknamed Sonic. Because he goes sonic speeds in a jet. This is also why sonic flies the plane in the old games at first before tails.
Anonymous No.151198442 [Report]
>>151198213
In the end, none of us have any say, but I like talking about the franchise in these threads. Does it get retarded at times? Yeah.
Anonymous No.151198448 [Report]
>>151198213
He's fat so he's probabaly just eating food starving crack head African children could be eating who cares
Anonymous No.151198658 [Report]
>>151162090
Excuse me? Explain your reasoning. I mean I hear that other people liked playing in Penders' sandbox and that when it happened the work generated was superior than anything Ken could commit to paper using the very resources he inspired but beyond that and a general/shared disdain for his artwork I never see anyone really talking up any of the Knuckles lore. Like specifically. It's always this general "yeah it exists" and that type of apathy is almost like it's better off having never existed at all. Especially when it's all empty canon so it's essentially valueless information sitting around in your head that'll eventually be pushed out for something else more interesting
Anonymous No.151198907 [Report]
>>151195838
>he thinks I'm complaining about Shadow jobbing in Archie
Funny how you have no idea what my issue with that version of the character is... and just so you know, most hardcore Shadowfags spawned during the late 2000s and 2010s are actually Archiedowfags
Anonymous No.151198945 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
>>Doesn't play Sonic games
Good taste
>>Doesn't know the characters or lore
That's the Japs, they think Sonic is just Hello Kitty
Anonymous No.151198960 [Report] >>151199142
>>151175145
>Sega needs to go back to using internal japanese writers
The worst official Sonic media is Japanese and it's not even close. Sonic Underground is more coherent than the Adventure games, and those are the ones zoomzooms point to as "the ones with good story."
Anonymous No.151199000 [Report]
>>151196836
>Archie Shadow was its own weird thing
The fault lies on Sonic 06 and those who misunderstood the Shadow-side of the story. I blame the translation.
Anonymous No.151199010 [Report]
IDW being closely related to games is one of the problems.
Anonymous No.151199039 [Report]
IDW being closely related to games but written by people who want write Archie is one of the problems.
Anonymous No.151199099 [Report] >>151199199 >>151202296
>>151163409
Imma be real, growing up Amy was one of my least favorite Sonic characters because I found her clingyness annoying. And even now My favorite version of her was from the Boom show because they finally began toning it down and worked on other aspects of her.
Anonymous No.151199142 [Report] >>151199219
>>151198960
>Sonic Underground is more coherent than the Adventure games
Bait used to have more effort than this back in the day.
Anonymous No.151199199 [Report]
>>151199099
Other aspects like what? Everything is either subdued or lost if anything they should have slightly toned down how clingy she was with Sonic... less aggressive and demanding and more sweet and swooning. Shes passionate with a heart of gold and wears her exaggerated emotions on her chest. Boomamy is a nothing burger like NuAmy
Anonymous No.151199219 [Report]
>>151199142
Anti-JapPurists are a breed of their own
Anonymous No.151199224 [Report]
>>151193794
>Shadow does like Sonic for mischaracterized reasons listed
It should be he doesn't like him because hes too care free with an occasional smart mouth. Go watch movienic diaperbaby
Anonymous No.151199672 [Report] >>151200087
>>151175186
Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 are the greatest works of storytelling since The Odyssey.
Anonymous No.151199887 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Ian has been in the Sonic fandom longer than you've been alive
Anonymous No.151200087 [Report]
>>151199672
lol lmao
Anonymous No.151200094 [Report]
>>151192569
I liked competent logistics coordinator.
Anonymous No.151200758 [Report]
Flynn bump
Anonymous No.151201620 [Report]
>>151161204 (OP)
Anonymous No.151201719 [Report]
Flynn said that he has no respect for the Sega overlords and does the bare minimum for approval.

Flynn said that most locations are generic because he has no plans for them.

Flynn said that world building locations that do not have some grandiose effect on the world at large is stupid.

Flynn admitted to pitching ideas that are bad for a comic but did not see the problem with it.

Flynn got annoyed when SEGA told him that Sonic does not care about danger until he sees it. He is not proactive.

Flynn admitted he prioritizes plot over character.
Anonymous No.151202296 [Report]
>>151199099
You're entitled to bad taste, bro.
Not saying the old writing was perfect, but her girly tendencies contrasted with her stubbornness was what made her interesting.
Anonymous No.151202384 [Report] >>151202402
So is Sonic the soul of some dead American jet pilot, a weird fairy like creature that was born on Christmas Island, or a science experiment?
Anonymous No.151202402 [Report]
>>151202384
Yes.