>20 year old
>"Hey I want to impress that girl lets start gym"
>/fit/ recommended starting strength by mark rippletoe for a total beginner
>Start doing deadlifts and squats
>Fast forward to age 31
>Two lower back discs gone, bad pain and many other problems
Why are deadlifts recommeded by you idiots to a complete beginner? If the person has never trained his core should he really start with something that is known to ruin your back if done wrong?

>two spinal discs ruined
>still walking
Lol okay.

>>76464857
They started degenerating due to those deadlifts. Now at 31 they are moderately degenerated and will only get worse.. Why were deadlifts recommended to total beginners dude.

I started deadlifting when I was young and I hurt my back too. Turns out they're not related. Back pain is like stomach ulcers. Caused by stress. Most people can get a slipped or herniated disk diagnosis from a doctor. Anyone could get one from a chiropractor. They don't mean anything.

>>76464861
No they didn't.

>>76464852 (OP)
I also started squatting and deadlifting in high school and now have spondylolisthesis. Should have stuck to RDLs and lunges desu.

>>76464869
I started getting mild back pain around the time I started deadlifts.
>>76464870
im terrified after reading all the spinal fusion horror stories. How are you coping? Are the symptoms bad?
>>76464868
I wish it was herniated disc. Its degenerative disc disease. Only gonna get worse. Rest of my spine looks pristine so I know it was those deadlifts that did it.

just do them correctly lol

>>76464882
I remember following the correct form like a nazi. Deadlifts put a lot of pressure on the lower back, and minute slip ups especially when bottoming out are easy. Especially for newbies with untrained cores.

>>76464870
>big scary word for slipped disc
>is also still walking despite an alleged condition that by all logic should immobilize you
>>76464876
>deadlift transmitted disease
I do not accept the invitation to mass hysteria.

>>76464861
why are you a mofuggin noob ass faggot? (no offense)

>>76464876
>How are you coping? Are the symptoms bad?
Some days are worse than others but I’m grade 1 (on a scale of 4) so it could be a lot worse. In fact apparently I’ve had it since high school and never knew. I’ve had mild back discomfort and pain for a while but it increased in the past year and depending on triggers can be mild tightness to sharp pain when bending and walking. I got x rays and showed the doc x rays from being a teen. He showed me the vertebral sliding existed even all the way back then. I had it all that time and lifted heavy ran etc. and the condition didn’t worsen, although I did have pain proportional to the type of activity. I had to quit running altogether which was heartbreaking since it’s the worst thing you can do for spondy. But Ive gone to PT and spend maybe 1/3 of my sessions doing core and stability work and don’t do certain lifts anymore. “I’m in pretty good shape for the shape that I’m in”.

>>76464886
>big scary word for slipped disc
It’s actually a slipped vertebra. The bones that connect my S1 and L5 broke on both sides so the only thing keeping my back from being like balancing a ball on another ball is my core muscles and the bone grinding against and degrading the disc.

>>76464900
What age are you? You're gonna need a fusion eventually those are dogshit surgeries. Whatever your doctor says, put that off as long as you can btw.

>>76464852 (OP)
>wrecks himself following a beginners routine
Maybe you're just an idiot, did you ever think of that?

>>76464913
Lower back forces can be 6 to 10 times the load on the bar when deadlifting. So for a 60kg deadlift you are putting 400-600 kg on your lower back. Repeatedly every day.
With bad form (that newbies do) it can go up to 1000kg. Deadlift should not be recommended to beginners.

>>76464920
Cool story, I hope you enjoy your troll thread, faggot.

>>76464868
Ulcers are caused by h.pylori tgat thrives in the bodies consuming shitty food and having poor immune system.

Cultists will never accept this

>>76464909
I quit running because I don’t want a fusion. I’m just training the shit out of my core and relearning everything I know about workout plans, mind muscle connections and bracing. My priorities have changed from being brolic to being healthy, lean muscled and flexible. Fusions are supposedly great at first but then require subsequent fusions every 10 or 15 years if you’re lucky. Fuck that shit.

>>76464960
>10 or 15 years
Ive heard 2 years. And like half of the time they go bad and leave u in worse pain. Some result in you being bedridden permanently in terrible pain.

>>76464965
>>76464960
I heard a doctor talk about a person who had 3 fusions and is totally disabled 2 years later and has lost his mind from the pain.

>>76464971
There was a girl at my school who I heard shoved a hotdog up her pussy, but she was a couple grades older, you wouldn't know her.

>>76464852 (OP)
Good thing I never deadlifted above 100kg in my entire life

>>76464990
I only did 60kg. Enough to fck my back. see >>76464920

>>76464976
Child.

>>76465005
60kg is natural, animals and women weight this much, the male body was made to lift this amount.
Anything above 100kg is just masochism though

>>76465032
Not off the ground though. Even american special forces have banned deadlifts from the ground

Starting Strength and Stronglifts are some of the worst memes on this board. The idea that you can target every muscle and get a good physique doing 3 or 4 lifts is ridiculous. Those programs are designed for powerlifters (fat) or skinny teenagers who play American football and want to get stronger. There's a reason bodybuilding is called that, and not back-legs-chest building. You're supposed to sculpt your whole body.

I miss the individual posters feature on 4chan.

My pull up bar slipped out and I fell on my back and definitely fucked something up bad in my lower back, what are my options? I’m scared im fucked for life

>>76465052
Where in the back exactly and what symptoms

>>76465067
Like right in the lower middle back area. The pain was really bad for the first couple days and I was scared to move but now after about 5 days I only really feel the pain when I bend over or do any type of movements that put strain on my lower back like getting out of bed without using my arms to prop myself up

>>76465076
k u fucked up a disc. In a decade or so expect more and more pain.
But good news, till then you'll be fine, with some mild pain here and there.

>>76464852 (OP)
Go back and do bench press instead.

>>76464852 (OP)
You really think you can get injuries from SS that last 11 years? You only workout 3 times a week, and you half your DL volume after the beginner phase and start rotating with powercleans. Use a belt too, retard.

>>76464852 (OP)
>31
it's just your second puberty
you'll be peaking at 35 and will look and feel 20 again by that time

>>76465005
>destroyed his back deadlifting 60kg Sorry but you shouldn’t be giving advice as you were born subhuman

>>76465086
Please explain this concept of a second puberty in more detail

>>76464852 (OP)
>"Hey I want to impress that girl lets start gym"
>/fit/ recommended starting strength
I want to know why so many blindly followed the advice they found on fucking 4chan of all places.

Every so often i think of adding deads back in then i come across a thread like this

>>76464852 (OP)
>>76465296
oh and i didnt get that girl btw she went with a dickhead i hated

>>76465266
Right, I’m not saying starting strength is necessarily awful for at least getting someone into the gym and used to pushing themselves, but I don’t know how anyone can look at the programming and think, “Oh, yes, squatting three days a week and doing power cleans totally aligns with my goals of looking like Brad Pitt”

>>76465406
What if my goal is to be able to carry that 30kg electric bicycle on fifth floor without elevator

>>76464852 (OP)
>I won't deadlift because it's dangerous
>Low back gets weaker
>It snaps tying your shoes
Everything is dangerous. Everything has a risk and benefit

>>76465457
The discs there also have moderate degeneration. Degeneration after injury takes around a decade for it to get to moderate. And 20 was a decade before 31. See the connection?
I wish.. I never came on /fit/. Or looked at that girl. OR LIFTED THAT FUCKING BARBELL OFF THE GROUND OR SET FOOT IN A GYM.

>>76465568
And we know that degree of degeneration or MRI findings don't correlate with amount of pain. There are people with nice fat discs that are in chronic pain and 65yo that aren't because they built the musculature around their vertebrae.

>>76465753
ok..? Mine is bulging and causing all kinds of problems. lateral recess stenosis. i will need a surgery.

>>76464852 (OP)
>thinks girls are impressed by muscles
Ahahahahaha it's all face + height (in that order)
No girl has ever said "Ewww that guy is so ugly, but look at his muscles they are soooo hot I wanna fuck him"
Literally no woman ever has fucked an ugly man just because he has muscles.

Enjoy your wheelchair gymtard

>>76464869
Yeah they are, the retard ruined his back forever with memelifts and he got a whooping 0 ZERO extra girls because of it.
Ouchie!

Let me give you gymturds a reality check.

If you fuck up your back with meme exercises that literally no woman cares about and you get chronic pain, after the opioid crisis, you'll be begging doctors like a pathetic junkie for some codeine or tramadol lmao.
They'll look like you like you are some subhuman who wants to get high, you'll have 24/7 pain from the moment you wake up until you go to sleep.
They'll ''''treat'''' you with tylenol and ibuprofen both of them are fucking useless and will ruin your liver, kidneys and body in general.

Don't believe me? Go look at some chronic pain forums, see how desperate the are and how many killed themselves because they couldn't handle pain literally every second of their life kek. This can easily be avoided by not exercising.

>>76465052
>what are my options
Go back in time and stop being a retard who fell for the exercise scam.
>I’m scared im fucked for life
You are fucked for life the back never actually heals and the surgeries are some medieval shit.
Hey enjoy your lifetime paracetamol addiction (it won't do shit for the pain but the death from liver failure will)

>>76465081
>so expect more and more pain
And expect doctors to be more and more reluctant to actually prescribe opioids which are the only drugs that help with the pain.
Better start making a heroin stash from the local nig dealers.

>>76465387
>oh and i didnt get that girl btw she went with a dickhead i hated
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH no way dude I was sure doing deadlifts will get you the girl, girls LOVE deadlifts and muscles in general!

Ok last post this place is truly dead like OP will be 15 years from now when he can no longer cope with being in pain every second of his life.
Make sure you pick a good suicide method you did this to yourself.

>>76464965
Yes if they fuck then up it’s bad. But being that mine is low grade and I have several resilience factors I could ostensibly go longer.

>>76464971
That sounds awful, good speed to that guy.


You can also get collagen injections in your disc that I guess help for a few months at a time. But I think minimizing medical intervention as much as possible will be ideal. I have diclofenac for when it flairs up but haven’t really needed to use it. Got some PT and a feeling on the right track. Will try to find my x rays

>>76464852 (OP)
because /fit/ has daddy issues and this guy used it to sell a powerlifter program to impressionable youths

>>76464852 (OP)
Let me guess
You don’t do lower back training, you have bad form, and you also don’t stretch

>>76464900
>>76464870
>>76464909

I also have grade 1 spondylolisthesis, used to have pain even when walking but after fixing posture + increasing core strength I never have pain.
I can run, sprint, jump with 0 pain, but deadlifts, squats and bent over rows cause pain. Everything else is no problem.
If you have anterolisthesis like me, for core you should avoid planks, as it puts more pressure. You should do hollow body holds, floor leg raises, the kind of core exercises you can do on your back on the floor.
But just in case I avoid long distance running, don't want to risk it keep slipping

>>76465831
also no girl has ever said "ewww that guy is so ugly, but look at his height he has soooo long bones i wanna fuck him"
if you are at least average looking in the face and not a turbomanlet, a muscular upper body really makes you hotter

>>76465037
you're right SS and SL are meme programs, but discrediting "short" programs are stupid. have fun wasting 20 hours in the gym with your arabian rear delt extension + swiss quadricep flys supersets retard

>>76465928

are you stupid? you probably avoid driving your car because using your car means it'll break down at some point so you let it rot in the garage.

>>76467400
>haha, you're actually wrong because of this thing I'm quoting that you never actually said!
NTA by the way.

>>76464852 (OP)
>Stuart McGill
Look him up. I stopped doing deadlifts 2 years ago. I need resiliency not strength, hence core is more important. Plus unless you are competing why bother with an exercise that puts significant force on your spine despite perfect form?

>>76464852 (OP)
I'm also 31. My back feels way stronger now compared to 10 years ago when I a neet playing vidya all day and I've been squatting and deadlifting for years without any major injuries. Are most of you just glass backs or did you just never take the time to actually learn how to lift properly.

>>76464852 (OP)
Try rock collecting.

>>76464852 (OP)
Just go lighter,I can jump with 2pl8s and work with 3pl8z.

>>76464852 (OP)
Idk, I think deadlifts are not appropriate for a lot of people
>be me 7 years ago, early 20s, not ripped at all, mega DYE
>Go get a personal trainer
>tries to make me do body building type fitness, scaled to my strength
>Have low blood pressure, never manage to do a set of more than 130lbs in all the 6 months or so I saw him
>Become chronically ill, don't lift for many years
>FF to now
>Ignore all that shit, just do what I feel like I can do based on my body and chronic illness
>do ONLY recumbent exercise and never to failure because shit blood pressure and neurological issues
>rows, recumbent biking, planks, etc. all lying down
>However have very high test, good diet
>6 weeks later have visible muscles, more muscles than I ever had
>will probably never do a deadlift in my life
>but also, never strained or tired during workouts but getting more gains than when I tried to push myself

I had a conversation about this with my friend. in north america, the ideal masculine qualities are still based on a 19th century farm boy. Strong as fuck, no outward expression of emotions. So our lifting styles reflect that. Except you don't NEED to do that. You don't need to KYS on a deadlift or 1 rep failures or anthing like that. You can still workout at a gradual pace and enjoy it and develop a great physique. Its all so tiresome, wish i realized it earlier.

>>76467648
ok i wanna clarify i do break a sweat and get strained, but never enough to like let out a grunt or anything like that. I'm not dead tired and pushing myself THAT much, is what I mean.

And probably I'm way less muscle than you guys, but my point is that doing squats, deadlifts and the like doesn't work for everyone

>>76464852 (OP)
>/fit/ recommended starting strength by mark rippletoe for a total beginner
no they don't. You got baited.

>dad took my to gym with him on my 15th birthday
>two decades later feeling great
growing up without a dad has got to be dogshit

>>76467380
How much are you running?

>>76464882
>do them correctly
You really meant
>use a trap bar

Literally the best lift you can do. More quads than a deadlift, more hamstrings than a squat, lightyears safe than either.

>>76464852 (OP)
That’s why I just do legpress/hacksquat and rows. Just train like a bodybuilder, slow down the movement and stick to higher rep ranges you will have way more longevity and hopefully feel better. Many pro bodybuilders don’t even backsquat or deadlift anymore and professional athletes also are moving away when everyone is racking up injuries in the offseason.

>>76464852 (OP)
>anon fell for the ss meme

>>76467982
>legpress/hacksquat
>>76467942

Are those safer?

>>76467562
>Are most of you just glass backs
this is the answer, for some reason people are unaware of the body's adaptability and assume that muscle building is based on sculpting, just changing the shape of existing mass into something more aesthetically pleasant with no concept of functionality or adaptation
i can bet not a single guy complaining in this thread has even heard of a jefferson curl

>>76468248
Machines are way safer as they’re a stable plane and will isolate the targeted muscle group better than a compound. The biggest roider in my gym who is basically a shredded silverback only does leg press and hacksquat for his main lifts for legs.

Just don't deadlift nor barbell squat. It's that simple

Anything else that involves your lower back you do it slowly. You also increase the weight slowly. Use a belt if needed.

Do that, warm up and do stretches on non-training days and it's hard to get injured. DO NOT listen to the stupid cultists in this site, do whatever feels best for you and try things out first to see if they're a match for your own body.

When I started lifting I did squats with low weight and I still felt discomfort in my lower back despite checking my form with multiple trainers. I stopped doing them and now I just do machine isolations, and guess what... They still work to develop your legs.

>But the erectors
Hyperextensions

>>76468817
Why wasnt i told this 11 years ago?

>>76468817
Many people do squat & deadlifts to train their backs. Machines can't replicate this effect

>>76464876
>I started getting mild back pain around the time I started deadlifts.
and you kept doing them until you were 31, retard?

>>76469656
i did them for 3 months when i was 20. never been to gym since.

>>76469522
>>76464956

>>76464852 (OP)
Use the Smith Machine. No more problems with the back.

Watch this guy's videos. I have an injury from HS hockey in my lower back/hip that had bothered me. These efforts solved it.
https://www.youtube.com/@lowbackability

>>76469863
Worth mentioning that he still deadlifts

If I deadlift heavy my lower back will hurt a little bit for a day, nothing debilitating or anything. Am I gonna be fucked?

>>76470021
the better your form, the less it will hurt. if you're worried, you can deload a little bit and focus on your form until you feel better about going back to a heavier weight
learn to recognize if the lower back pain is just doms or something else. if you go heavy its almost inevitable to have some muscular soreness afterwards and there's nothing wrong with that

>>76464852 (OP)
All adult males should be able to pull 135 with no training. Deadlifts train your core. SS is kind of retarded in that there are no accessories but nobody is stopping you from adding core accessories to your routine.

>>76469733
That's how you fucked you back retard. Start doing deadlifts again

>>76468817
Imagine being this dyel that you think you can replace the 2 compound movements that recruit most muscle with machine isolation movements....

>>76468248
Yes, those machines are safer than a trap bar, but they pretty much leave out the hamstrings entirely.

Hack squats don’t hit them at all. You can kind of hit hamstrings on leg press if you use a wider stance and keep your feet higher in the platform so your knees don’t travel as far forward, but it’s minimal, especially if you’re not short.

Trap bar can be more like a deadlift or more like a squat (that is, more back and hamstring dominant or more quad dominant) depending on how you position your back and knees with regards to your feet.

Because your hands are at your sides, it’s a lot easier to bring your hips forward and keep your back properly aligned regardless of knee movement. It’s just a lot easier to perform correctly compared to a barbell DL or squat..

>>76467942
>More quads than a deadlift, more hamstrings than a squat
If you deadlift regular you use more erectors which is the whole point of deadlifting

>>76470158
Imagine being this much of a CULTIST that you think someone can't develop their back and legs without these 2 high-risk powersharter exercises

i feel lucky that i've only slipped discs and not done worse things
through rehab exercises, i'm able to stay pain free and even do some back exercises, but nothing that I want to do
i'm still afraid that something might go wrong, so i take it very slow with any hip hinge

>>76469940
>>76470021
>>76470053
>>76470136
>>76470146
>>76470158
>>76470336
>>76470342
>>76470813
>>76471064
What's a good exercise program I should look at if squats and deadlifts are out of the picture.

Not going to lie squats and deadlifts do help me poop so I might at least just keep a barbell to them like bruce lee or whatever that guys work out was

deadlifting and squatting is both completely unnecessary for hypertrophy and the risk to reward ratio is so skewed to the former that I have to think if you're simping for these lifts you are a gigantic fucking retard

>>76471224
ANSWER ME ANON
>>76471218

>>76471228
there are back-supported squat variations especially with machine squats (like pendulum squats) if you absolutely need to squat

otherwise just target the muscle groups of your leg like with any left, there's no reason you can't grow your legs without doing some big magical heavy compound lift that has to target damn near everything

extensions and lunges for quads, leg curls for hams, one legged calf raises, weighted hyperextensions for lower back, hamstrings, and glutes the works

>>76471218
use a typical program and switch squats for something that you are able to do
that can mean:
>lunge
>split squat
>leg press
>hack squat
>smith machine
same for dead lift. replacements can be
>back extension (GOATed exercise imo)
>good mornings
>RDLs
>trap dead lifts
the last one, in my experience, is most doable with kettlebells in something like suitcase deadlift, i find it easiest to approach

>>76471240
I think there is a hack squat in my gym, you think that is fine?

>weighted hyperextensions
I heard those were bad for your back too anyway.

>>76471224
>gigantic fucking retard
*rubs your and gives u hug*

>>76471253
Hack squat is more than fine, just make sure your back and ass are glued to the seat behind you. Prioritize form. I mostly hate free weight barbell lifts. I think they are a meme, personally. At least for non-olympic lifters but traditions die hard. People do them for "noble" reasons.

>I heard those were bad for your back too anyway.
they are not, I got lower back sprain from linear leg press (did it like a retard a couple years back when I was just starting out, lifting my glutes) and this helped reinforce my back after the initial recovery
contrary to popular opinion, direct lower back work is key to improving lower back symptoms, just start slooow

>>76471218
Chatgpt helps with exercise selection. Regardless

>Machine isolations for pretty much everything
>Belt squat (doesn't compress your spine), RDLs
>Hyperextensions for erectors, can be weighted for progress

>>76471253
>I heard those were bad for your back too anyway.
Not if you do the movement slowly and overload progressively.
>hack squat
Still compresses your spine.

>>76471274
>they are not, I got lower back sprain from linear leg press (did it like a retard a couple years back when I was just starting out, lifting my glutes)
you mean pic related? I never heard anyone getting injured with it how do you even lift your glutes with it?

>contrary to popular opinion, direct lower back work is key to improving lower back symptoms, just start slooow
whats a low weight to start with, or just bodyweight?

>>76471278
ok buddy i know chatgpt is wrong at least 60% of the time whenever I use it to help my homework

i think you guys are just memeing

>>76464852 (OP)
start yoga and calisthenics asap.
you'll still build muscle mass, you'll still build tendon strength, and you'll unfuck your back faster than weight lifting.

>>76471306
this is true
/fit/ is terrified of yoga because it looks pussy
it fixes 99% of problems, takes relatively little time, will help lifts generally, you can do it at home and there are a million videos to follow along with

>>76471319
For actual non-bro science on why yoga AND calisthenics fixes your problems.
Tendons only respond to TOT, via the stem cell necessity mechanism this means there is no amount of "reps" you can do or muscle mass you can build to fix tendon issues.
Tendons require multiple minutes, even up to hours (accumulated over weeks/months) to have enough stimulation to the stem cell for the tendon mass to add a proline or hydroxyproline molecule to the tendon mass.
This process will happen, the body will reabsorb old tendon mass and eventually the entire tendon will be a completely new structure that is more beneficial to your posture.
Either lengthening/strengthening itself if weak/short.

There is a reason roid trannies have 9/10 of their injuries at the tendon/muscle insertion point. The muscle is stronger than the tendon, because it takes years to build the tendon mass to double or more your lifts.
Some people take years just to go up 50% on their lifts depending on genetics.

>>76464868
>Ulcers are caused by stress
They are not
>Back pain is caused by stress
Yeah and my fractured tibia is caused by the ghosts in my basement

>>76471291
>Being spoonfed
>Noo but I don't like it
Then research yourself, faggot. Chatgpt is just a tool like any other

>try doing some OHP
>break both my wrists and my rotator cuff slides off my shoulder
>start deadlifting
>lower back instantly explodes
>recover and focus on squats
>i tear my glute and develop giant hemmorrhoids
FUCK YOU FIT FUCK YOU FIT FUCK YOU FIT FUCK YOU FIT FUCK YOU FIT FUCK YOU FIT

>>76471406
>>i tear my glute and develop giant hemmorrhoids
dude how does that even happen?

yeah same thing happened to me
>omg gotta increase the weight
>keep doing it for several years
>back pain getting worse and worse
>at one point I had to hold on to things just to get out of bed

I'm doing the Mike Mentzer consolidation routine for the past weeks with no back pain

>>76464852 (OP)
I have ankylosing spondylitis, and squatting and deadlifting helps manage pain. Sounds to me like you were doing them wrong your entire life and now blame the exercise instead of yourself

>>76467397
You are correct face and height are both required in order to be attractive.
No woman wants to fuck a dude who's ugly.
No woman wants to fuck a dude who's 5'4 (usually).

Muscles are a meme they are neither face nor height. The only reason to go to the gym is lose weight and debloat your face.

>>76467424
You are literally fucking retarded. Humans are not cars and don't experience rust and I'd rather have a garage queen than a car with 200k miles.
Exercise puts stress on your joints, muscles, heart etc. You do realize those systems in your body have a limited use time, right? The more you use them the more they wear down, people who live to 100+ don't do any exercise.
Not that you want to live to 100 you are perfectly fine with dying at 50 like your favorite body builders or dying at 35 like Sam Sucklek.
Cause you are mentally handicapped and have no reason to live, hope you get chronic pain from your meme exercises then you'll realize just how fucked up the health system really is in the west.

Just in case you subhuman gym goers didn't read this the first time. If you get chronic back pain from deadlifts, meme lifts, or just doing exercise in general even with good form YOU'RE FUCKED.
As in you're actually fucked, surgeries are a scam, they are medieval at best and fail most of the time and make your situation worse.
Your only relief from 24/7 pain will be opiates, do you want to be an opiate addict at the ripe age of 27?
I'll ask again, you want to be addicted to opiates at 27?

Guess what retard doctors no longer prescribe opiates after the '''' OPIATE CRISIS''''' doctors don't want to go to jail, the DEA will fuck with them. You'll be stuck begging not for morphine, not for oxycodone, but for some fucking codeine (which is useless) and some tramadol (which is also useless) and you'll be seen like a junkie fucker by society lmao

Some of you idiots here are basically speedrunning your opiate addiction.
And since you won't get prescriptions anymore because it's not 2005 anymore you'll be stuck buying street drugs to cope with the constant pain. Those street drugs are sold by the scum of the earth, they could be mixed with rat poison, pipe cleaner, usually fentanyl. Anything to cheat you at the scale. Future fent OD victims oh well I don't really give a fuck about you, die.

>>76464852 (OP)

>population of people that sit all day
>weak joints, atrophied muscles, poor alignment
>tell them to load hundreds of pounds on their spine

barbell training was pushed by the medical industry to get an entire generation reliant on constant medical care, supplements, and medication

They're called deadlifts bro

>>76471411
There's a fat Scottish comedian here and he said he did the same thing when he started working out but he's like 40 and decided to just start doing it

>>76464852 (OP)
>If the person has never trained his core should he really start with something that is known to ruin your back if done wrong?
probably not

but this is /fit/
people like to blame their own retarded shit on /fit/ advice a lot

>>76472401
>gyms were pushed by the medical industry to get an entire generation reliant on constant medical care, supplements, and medication
Fixed that for you.
If you are sedentary and have weak muscles all you have to do is walk. If you walk everyday most of your muscles and your core will get fixed without ending up with chronic pain.
This sounds unbelievable for gymrats but humanity for 99% of the time did not have gyms.

>>76464852 (OP)
>deadlifts and squats
Wouldn't simply substituting these with dumbbell shoulder squats and dumbbell RDLs be enough to prevent injury yet still hit all the necessary muscles?

>>76464852 (OP)
I actually just started doing SS and I already get lower back pain once in a while. Not sure if it's the muscles or the spine. But I've set the weights back and I'm worried I'm going to fuck it up. Was it over before it even started?

>>76464852 (OP)
I wish I was less gullible when I was a teen or even in my 20s but it's criminal that squats and deadlifts are still being pushed hard.

>>76472438
yeah but then your training is not as dramatic.
how will you brag about your barbell squat and deadlift?!

>>76473110
the rip squat is total meme weight humping. he's nostalgic from when he was young and trashing his body.
do front squats, barbell back squats and add a hamstring exercise.

>>76474106
*barbell hack squats