>>17759099>>17759115>Not only does the High Priest pray alongside those who pray authentically, but those who are in heaven, the angels who "rejoice over sinner who repents more than ninety nine just persons who have no need of repentance" (Luke 15:7), and likewise the souls of the saints who have gone to their rest.I'm not seeing any praying to saints here, only that the saints in heaven pray, which we know from the Bible anyway. Your argument is about invocation of the saints, yet you quote Origen not mentioning that, but instead the saints in heaven praying. Where does he say we should pray to the saints
>Durr it's just asking them to pray for us not praying to themI'm using the exact same lamguage your church does
>We need only ask Saint Joseph for the grace of graces: our conversion.>Let us now make our prayer to himhttps://www.vatican.va/content/francesco/en/apost_letters/documents/papa-francesco-lettera-ap_20201208_patris-corde.html
>>17759103Early Christians couldn't even decide on who the first few Bishops of Rome were, nor if Peter was even the first bishop of Rome, nor who consecrated the first one (or two) - was it the apostles in general? Or Peter? Or Paul? Or Peter and Paul?
Irenaeus, Against Heresies 3.3.3
>Linus (ordained by "the apostles")>Anacletus>ClementTertullian, De Praescriptione 32
>Clement (ordained by Peter)Eusebius, Church History 3.2, 3.13, 3.15
>Linus (after the deaths of Paul and Peter, doesn't say who ordained him)>Anacletus>ClementLiberian Cataloge of 354 AD
>Peter (earliest mention of Peter being the first bishop)>Linus>Clement>CletusJerome, De Viris Illustribus 15
>Peter>[second bishop]>[third bishop]>ClementJerome mentions an alternate lists used by the 'Romans' i.e. the christians in Rome, which has a different order:
>Peter>ClementApostolic Constitutions 7.4.46
>Linus (ordained by Paul)>Clement (ordained by Peter)There's even more sources to add to the Romanist confusion, but these will suffice