Why do capitalist economies fail all the time?

State intervention in the free market.

sometimes the working classes just need to be slapped around a little bit

>two more weeks and Marx's heckin' end stage capitalism will come true!
>we'll have a revolution and create a utopia and everything
>stick with the plan!

>>17808153
>I made a graph that trends downwards, that means I'm right

>>17808153
global debt is higher than the global GDP which means that finance capital can't re-finance companies at a profitable rate anymore.

Capitalism is fine when it runs by whites, and cruel when run by jews. Communism is cruel when it runs by jews, and becomes tolerable when it is run by whites.

>>17808211
>racial slop politics

>>17808177
So everyone owes eachother money and is obligated to ensure that said money is capable of being repayed? Sounds like communism to me, tankies are a weird race of humans

>>17808138
This. And before the communazis show up, Federal Reserve is a government entity, it was created by the government for the government and without it the vast majority of government actions today would be impossible.

>>17808213
Profound, while we're on the subject Trump is a big meanie just like Voldemort or Robbie Rotten.

>>17808159
>all the statistics are wrong because, uh.. they just are... ok?
why do people bother typing out these shit arguments, then again why do I bother replying

>>17808177
they still earn dividends and interest, owning capital will always be profitable until an asteroid wipes out civilization or something

>can't re-finance companies
why do they need to refinance companies specifically, do you think the economy depends on constantly refinancing loans, what the fuck are you saying

>>17808213
many people buy properties, refurbish them with their own labor and sell them on, I literally know a gay black couple in atlanta who do that, the economy is far from monopolized by a handful of rich people who refuse to sell anything

there are capital markets, and like the market for oranges there is supply and demand, and investments that yield high returns tend to become overinvested in, reducing the "rate of profit", but also at a certain point people are waiting 20+ years for a return on their investment and are tempted to sell which increases the rate of profit, Karl Marx's "tendency for the rate of profit to fall" is incorrect in its assumption it will fall to 0 then capitalism will collapse

you are jus "incorrect", that's all

>>17808136 (OP)
Greed by those at the top crash the system due to incompetence thinking they can squeeze more profits out

>>17808136 (OP)
Capitalism has been long ago replaced by another system, imo. Probably around the time of the great depression and WW2.

>>17808136 (OP)
There are two main ways that capitalist economies fail. The first and historically more common, is caused by capitalist economies doing the economic calculation via market forces. This means that they receive information with delay, which in turn results in overproduction and the subsequent bubble. The second and more pertinent to today way that capitalist economies fail is by the internal contradictions of capital, namely, the tendency of the rate of profit to fall. For example, due to the TRPF usury and landlordism have become more attractive, which today results in tremendous amounts of labor power going to luxury goods and services for unproductive classes.

>>17808297
Lenin calls it Imperialism.

>>17808253
yes international finance is the prime example of communism. you must be really smart to understand that.

>>17808288
>they still earn dividends and interest, owning capital will always be profitable until an asteroid wipes out civilization or something
they can only pay dividents if they can sell their products or services on the market with a profit.

>>17808136 (OP)
>economy experiences temporary downturn
>CaPiTaLiSm HaS fAiLeD!

Meanwhile, what's left of the USSR and SFR Yugoslavia are basically burnt out husks in a demographic and economic death spiral that still haven't recovered even their 1960s standards of livings 30 years after their collapse.

>>17808345
>demographics
I'm not sure Western countries or Japan are doing too well either.

>>17808345
Capitalism will always fail because maximizing profits while suppressing wages will always lead to collapse

>>17808405
>will always lead to collapse
You don't have a big enough sample size to make this conclusion anon

>>17808136 (OP)
>Why do capitalist economies fail all the time?
"All the time"?
Is that why you posted a picture from literally 95 years ago?

>>17808419
Just look around lmao

Do you know America has more income inequality now than during the french revolution lol

>>17808425
>Just look around lmao
Appeal to Self-evident Truth Fallacy
>Do you know America has more income inequality now than during the french revolution lol
Moving the goalpost. In case you forgot we were asking for how many examples you have of capitalist societies collpsing under their own weight

>>17808436
Stating facts is t a fallacy, retard.

>>17808425
>Do you know America has more income inequality now than during the french revolution lol
After 8 years of Obama and 4 years of Obama 2?
Guess it's time for you to start regretting your vote then

>>17808441
>facts
big if true

>>17808436
>Moving the goalpost.
he really didn't. capitalism fails when people become increasingly poor as companies will get into a death spiral as the market shrinks.

>>17808425
During the french revolution there was like half a million dollars in circulation. Of course wealth inequality is going to rise once more wealth is created. Certain people have to create that wealth, and they deserve a bigger piece of the pie they baked for the value they attribute.

>>17808604
bro is living in the paradise

>>17808136 (OP)
>>17808153
Reminder "late-stage Capitalism" was coined when 70% of the population had no access to electricity

>>17808405
Profit is bad because?

>>17808656
Inefficient, turns into rents when those profits are used to buy the government. Also it's sophistry to argue over "ideals" when the real system is managerial extractive bullshit nobody likes or wants.

>>17808153
>1970
>earn one dollar a day
>half-decent meal costs one dollar
>2006
>earn 5 dollars a day
>half-decent meal costs 5 dollars
>"But you see, graph go down so that means there's less poor people now"

>>17808715
Poverty and hunger was already pretty much solved in the west in 1970. That's actually when obesity started to trend up in the population

>>17808345
How come after 300+ years of capitalism we still haven't figured out how to avoid economic crashes that happen like every 10 years and oh what a surprise always leave the poor poorer and the rich richer?

Imagine your car breaking down every 10 miles. Would you consider it a good car? Would you tighten some tiny screw somewhere and go "that'll fix it, now it won't break down again" every time this happens, and be absolutely flabberghasted when it breaks down again after 10 miles? How many times does your car need to break down until you start to wonder whether maybe, just maybe, you should get rid of it and try a different one?

Also
>there's only capitalism or full-blown communism with tanks and Russian army vocals, there's absolutely nothing in between or outside

>>17808723
The capitalist "gotcha" graph in >>17808153 is about the entire world population, however.
Also, pretty cringe economic system imho when the strongest argument for it is "after half a century of progress the starving and desperate are 5 % less starving and desperate".

>>17808732
Because people still don't trust businesspeople. Watch any popular show and the bad guy is always a dude in a suit who owns a business. Freedom in both the bedroom (as left desires) AND the boardroom (as right desires) will infinitely improve life for everyone involved. But we do not trust man because altruism is held as a moral ideal. Man is a greedy sinful animal that can only be held in check by the collective, so we chain ourselves as citizenry to enormous economical chains in the name of charity while robbing ourselves of our freedom. Life improved immensely since we divorced church and state. Divorcing economy and state will be the next giant leap.

>>17808746
Did you know in the past the poor used to be skinny and the rich were associated with being fat? The poor today are so well fed that they completely inverted that dynamic and are at much bigger risk from diabetes and other complications than hunger

>>17808779
If you live in America and you are food insecure, it is entirely on you. Food is dirt cheap, you can get it almost anywhere and if you can't pay there are multiple options from petitioning the government for ebt or asking friends/family/business owners in return for odd jobs or some shit. It's not about "ending hunger" for communists. It's about giving the government as much power as possible to regulate all these things and looting the treasury as much as possible. That's why they declare products human rights instead of using rights for what they are for, protection FROM the government.

>>17808136 (OP)
Why do communist countries have famines that purge millions?

>>17808766
>nnooo you don't understand, regulation is bad mkay, how can I compete if my monopoly has competitors, I NEED to be able to dominate a market segment, my brothel NEEDS underage sex slaves to be profitable, how can a man make a living if he's not allowed to dump toxic waste in the local bathing lake, would SOMEBODY PLEASE think of the shareholders?? ;_;

>>17808779
>Did you know in the past the poor used to be skinny and the rich were associated with being fat?

I did. Can't see how that's relevant to 90 % of the world population however.

>>17808800
>daddy, why are the people in Russia starving?
>because their communist system is shit
>why are they starving in capitalist economies too, then?
>umm ... purely non-economic factors

>>17808824
>Can't see how that's relevant to 90 % of the world population however.
The world population is not evenly distributed. Western Capitalist countries are overwhelmingly food-surplus countries. And if you think they also have a responsibility to feed the rest of the world(which they already give enormous aid to) you're delusional

>>17808822
Monopolies exist because the government makes it impossible to compete.
>Entry barriers in the market
>Skyhigh taxes the moment you make more than the average
>Copyright extortion
>Gigantic bailouts if big companies go under but not for mom&pop shops
Divorcing the economy and the state does not mean what you think it means.

>>17808825
>>why are they starving in capitalist economies too, then?
They don't.

How come capitalist apopogists online are always these white Westerners from well-off upper/middle-class backgrounds?

You ever saw a TikTok reel of a South African silicon miner defending capitalism? Or an underage prostitute in Bangkok? Or a 9-year-old slum dweller rummaging through landfills in New Delhi?

Wonder why that is. Wouldn't you like to hear their opinion on this great economic system they're living in?

>>17808833
>ignores like 90 % of Africa

>>17808849
People in poor countries with factories that export to the west still prefer that work over half their family dying because of 1 bad harvest. If the factory is just there and you think it's horrible for it to be there, they can just *not* work there, you know? But they do work there en masse because the pay is better than what they had before, which was hardly anything.

>>17808852
Africa does not have capitalist economies, only religious or governmental extortion. They live on hand-outs that only exist due to capitalism in the west.

>>17808852
Most of Africa's population exists to begin with thanks to their dependence on support from food-surplus Capitalist countries.

>>17808829
So, basically, you agree that capitalism only benefits a small number of countries while it doesn't do jack shit for the majority of the world's population, or more likely even, is a net negative for them?

In this line of thought, I'd really like to know how all those Third World countries we're giving "enormous aid" to would be faring by now if they owned their vast resources themselves and wouldn't have to sell away exploitation rights to Western conglomerates to receive such "enormous aid".

>>17808869
Capitalism would benefit everyone if all other countries stopped oppressing their populace with draconian regulations like sharia in the middle east or the governments in africa that pocket 80% of all foreign aid. Don't get me started on china and their uyghurs who are literally being forced to pick cotton as we speak. Capitalism created the wealth we see today, and the countries that refuse to adopt it in favor of the government dictating life to the populace will face the economic consequences, not because people in america ARE allowed to trade relatively freely but because they REFUSE to let their populace do the same.

>>17808869
You should only leave Africans to their own devices if you wish for their numbers to plummet. I'm in favor of course :-)

>>17808831
Monopolies exist because there's no regulations that would forbid buying up competitors, or that dictate minimum wages and prices, which allows rich megacorporations to run on a loss for years until there's no one left to compete.

Child workers don't exist because there's regulation against that.

Entry barriers in the market exist because the top dog dictates all value, from wages and prices and land value. Good luck founding your oil company if BP just snatches the land you were about to buy away from you by paying double the amount.

>skyhigh taxes
Don't see the problem here. Wanna exploit this country's workforce? Then pay the taxes it prescribes. Don't like it? Go somewhere else, maybe some other country gives you a better deal. Invisible hand and all. Isn't that what you want so hard?

>Gigantic bailouts
Gee, I wonder why only big corporations capable of maintaining an army of lobbyists get bailouts. Surely if we lower regulations on lobbying even more, the problem will go away.

>>17808888
>Don't see the problem here. Wanna exploit this country's workforce? Then pay the taxes it prescribes. Don't like it? Go somewhere else, maybe some other country gives you a better deal. Invisible hand and all.
Then when there's regulation that Capitalist countries can't trade with your Commie shithole you complain that it's the reason your Commie shithole is such a shithole even though it can trade with other countries that use your clearly superior system.

>>17808854
>People in poor countries with factories that export to the west still prefer that work over half their family dying because of 1 bad harvest.

Good point, next time I'm in Thailand I'm gonna tell my favorite child hooker that she should be grateful to live in such a wonderful time where rich grandpas can fly over to cum in her ass all day. I'm sure she appreciates all the patronage she's receiving thanks to capitalism.

Capitalism doesn't exist, bank runs are caused by people's loss in confidence in the financial situation. The German economy, which was subsidizing US infrastructure development, finally broke. This lead to the rise of Hitler and the collapse of the real estate bubble in the major US cities which was caused by speculation based on the never ending boon of the German reparations and the prominence of US trade.

US cities stopped being filled with wops and instead transitioned to mexicans fleeing the mexican revolution

We're in postcapitalism now, anyway. Bezos et al are now trying to become technofeudal kings.

>>17808904
The west is more communist than it ever was

>>17808899
The thing is, it is horrible, and it is thanks to Capitalism, just not in the way you think. That child's existence is largely thanks to Capitalism and the massive growth it produced. Take Capitalism away, and those countries would still be shitholes of course(that's the secret, they will always be shitholes), but in much smaller numbers, which prevents horrible phenomena like this from occurring on massive scale.

>>17808906
lol

>>17808909
>government admitting to wide open borders championing human traffickers belonging to satanic child sacrificing mountain mexican voodoo cartels
>communist candidate in new york calling for a tax on white people
>entire psychology industry pushing the transgender lie for profit (and to destroy men)
>brown illegals learning about the pilgrims in public school

>>17808899
That girl(boy) would be slaving away in the rice fields for sustenance were it not for free markets. And if she(he) wants to slave away in the rice fields, she(he) can still do that today!

>>17808888
Lobbying is corporate socialism, still evil just like communism. That's why when I say "divorce the economy from the state" you still don't understand what I mean.

>>17808833
the Great Famine in Ireland though. relative to the Irish population it was worse than any famine in the USSR. and the examples are plenty in the colonies.

>>17808136 (OP)
Capitalism is still here, so no it has not failed

>>17808262
because the economy would have collapsed without government intervention. The free market is not intelligent.

>>17808966
The government caused the collapse, the new york branch of the fed raised interest rates to 20% causing bank closures. One of these banks was aptly named "Bank of United States" with no actual affiliation with the government. When it collapsed papers printed "Bank of United States bankrupt" and so a large amount of ESLs in the world thought our central bank went bankrupt causing a chain reaction

>>17808153
>world
Don't care.

>>17808966
The free market is we the people, we also vote in the government. How is the government any more intelligent then? Or do you want to defend Joe "lemme sniff your kids" Biden and Donald "bombing iran is good actually" Trump? That's the best we came up with for the last decade.

>>17808153
If you set it higher then poverty has increased lol

>>17809002
>The free market is we the people
Anon you have zero influence over the market.

>>17808136 (OP)
They don't as “Capitalist oppression” does not exist.

Capitalism by definition is the government not having control over the economy. “Private property” refers to property not owned or controlled by the government. Think of it as separation of economy and state, just as secularism is separation of religion and state.

This has never oppressed anyone. The government not having control over the economy physically and literally cannot oppress anybody. Every single instance of “capitalist oppression” that people point to was in reality caused by government intervention.

Socialists fight against an enemy which exists only in their heads and complain about problems that never existed. “Capitalism is heckin evil and oppressive” is no more true than “the earth is flat”, I.E. it’s schizophrenic nonsense with no basis in reality.

Marx was not an “intellectual”, he was a conspiracy theorist, no different from your drunk uncle on Thanksgiving ranting about how the world is run by a secret society of cyborg lizard people from outer space. Marx was nothing more than a moron who didn’t know what he was talking about (especially since his own parents considered him a failure).

>>17809043
How is having 1 vote any different?

>>17809060
If you work hard and smart you can increase your income. But you can never increase your vote.

>>17809049
>the wealthy capitalist class won't collude, create monopolies and lobby to protect their interests

really?

>>17809076
Lobby is government interference in the market, not capitalism. It is currying favours loke contracts and anti-competitive bills in exchange for campaign donations votes.

>>17808907
>trust me, you're better off being MY slave

>>17808935
Too bad there's no rice field anymore because some fat investor from the West put a factory in its place.
Where does she go? The few remaining rice fields? The owner of those is not going to employ her because her refusal to suck cocks means she's not willing to go the "extra mile". Buy her own piece of land? Too bad, unaffordable because the current owner has a better offer from a Western investor.
What should she do? Just accept the cock and take it? Hail capitalism

>>17808936
So basically you expect everyone to just refrain from using their power and influence over politicians out of the goodness of their hearts so we can have le trve free market capitalism?
This coming from the "communism doesn't work because muh human psychology" side.

I mean I know burgers are retarded, but man.

Also, once again
>there's only capitalism or communism, nothing else in between or outside

>>17809186
LMAO
>t-that's not TRUE capitalism!! ;_;

>>17809215
true capitalism has never been tried

>>17809215
Yes, when the government interferes in the economy, that is not a free market. This is simple stuff.

>>17808136 (OP)
lack of information creates bubbles

>>17809049
>Capitalism by definition is the government not having control over the economy.
>This has never oppressed anyone
>"Why yes, me burning and enslaving the townfolk didn't harm anyone. It was merely the free market deciding"
>"Police ? How could you DARE suggest government intervention on private property"

Any "rights" depend on the government to be enforced. The right to own your property is already reliant on the state intervening on the idea of private property(i.e. enforcing that you can't become a slave, that only money dictates exchanges etc). Besides, having rights to your own property isn't capitalism.

>>17808312
Ar this point we are beyond Imperialism.

such is the nature of civilization. it does not progress, it grows and recedes. what fills the gaps in-between is nothing more than empty hallucination.

>>17809960
>Governments have never burnt down and enslaved towns (especially ones they "own")
Fascinating.
What's the exact difference between a government and a corporation with a protection racket that builds company towns and defends its interests with nuclear weapons and guns, exactly?

>>17809049
>Marx was not an “intellectual”, he was a conspiracy theorist
who do you consider an intellectual?

>>17810757
jordan peterson

>>17810757
tucker carlson

>>17810757
He was an imbecile. He has everything wrong beyond the observation that life's hard if you're poor kek.

>>17810765
>>17810831
>>17810840
dangerously based