Paganism’s a mess of incoherent myths and rituals, cobbled together from tribal superstitions with no unifying truth. Christianity’s got a coherent metaphysics: God as the uncaused cause, moral law rooted in divine nature, and a historical basis in Christ’s life and resurrection. Pagan gods are just anthropomorphic projections, squabbling like petty humans, bound to nature’s cycles with no transcendent purpose. Catholicism offers a rational framework: Aquinas’ proofs, the Church’s intellectual tradition, and 2000 years of theological consistency. Paganism’s got nothing but vibes and larping in the woods. Change my mind.

Nah

>>17811165
God’s omniscience and omnipotence don’t mean He “dislikes” His creation. He permits evil for a greater good, like free will and redemption through Christ. Pagan gods whining about their own mess is peak inconsistency; the Christian God’s plan has purpose, backed by scripture and reason. Try harder.

>>17811168
He does not need to permit evil for the greater good idiot. He's omnipotent.

Unless you are admitting your Jew God has limitations

>>17811178
Omnipotence doesn’t mean God micromanages every sin. He allows free will, which is a good, and evil flows from its misuse. Aquinas lays it out: God’s power includes ordering all to His end, not forcing puppets. Scripture backs this (Romans 9:21, God shapes the clay as He wills). Pagan gods can’t even claim that coherence; they’re just impotent nature spirits. No limitations here, just divine wisdom you’re missing.

>>17811182
Romans 9 literally denies free will exists lol

You don't even know your own scripture

>>17811187
Nice try, but Romans 9 doesn’t scrap free will; it’s about God’s sovereign election, not a puppet show. Verse 18 says He hardens whom He wills, sure, but 9:21-23 shows it’s for mercy and glory, not arbitrariness. Free will’s real (Augustine and Aquinas both affirm it, just subordinated to grace). You’re cherry-picking; read the whole chapter. Pagan myths don’t even wrestle with this depth.

>>17811193
>god removes free will but free will exists though

Brain damage

Also here's your coherent religion bro. I'm gonna create the problems I claim to save you from. Also I created this reality knowing most people go to hell yet want to be called a savior lol.

Deranged

>>17811201
Free will’s real but graced. Romans 9’s about divine initiative, not coercion; check Augustine’s 'On Grace and Free Will'. God doesn’t “create problems”: sin’s man’s choice, and He redeems it through Christ (John 3:16). Hell’s a consequence of rejecting grace, not His desire (2 Peter 3:9 says He wants all saved). Pagan gods offer no salvation, just chaos. Your meme’s a quip, not an argument. Step up.

>>17811206
>backpedalling

Lol I accept your defeat

Free will does not exist logically or even theologically. You worship a schizo

>>17811208
No backpedaling here. Free will’s consistent with theology. God’s justice demands accountability (Romans 2:6), which requires choice. Logically, Aquinas’ First Cause argument holds (free will fits under divine providence, not schizophrenia). Your cartoon’s a cheap shot; it ignores Christ’s voluntary sacrifice (John 10:18) versus pagan gods’ impotence. Argue substance, not snark.

>>17811212
You already said free will is with caveats which is not free will

You already lost. Romans 9 disproves you.

Your Jew religion consists of telepathically groveling to a cosmic rabbi or else hell burn you in magic lava

Deranged

>>17811215
Caveats don’t negate free will, grace perfects it (Philippians 2:13). Romans 9 shows God’s sovereignty, not a denial (read 9:30-32, Israel’s choice led to stumbling). Your meme’s a distortion; Christ heals, doesn’t harm (Mark 2:17). “Cosmic rabbi” jibe’s lazy. Catholicism’s rooted in reason and sacrifice, not pagan magic. Bring real points or quit.

>>17811217
You already lost lol

You'd have to delete your post admitting will is controlled by jewgod

Try again next time Christ jew

>>17811222
Check'em. Also, no loss here. Will’s guided by grace, not “controlled” (John 15:16). “Jewgod” smear’s irrelevant; Christ’s divinity transcends that (Colossians 2:9). You’re stuck on insults, not arguments. Next time, hit the text, not the strawman.

>>17811153 (OP)
Incorrect, most people did not believe that a chariot pulls the sun across the sky, not in a literal sense at least. The way ancient pagans saw the world was actually not that different from how modern Christians do today (outside of a few uneducated rural people maybe, nobody, no matter how devout, genuinely believes God is a literal flesh and bone old bearded man who lives in the clouds, rather seeing that as symbolic).

Outside of a few uneducated rural people maybe, nobody, no matter how devout, genuinely believed creatures like Centaurs or Sirens were real. Educated Greeks and Romans often interpreted myths allegorically or symbolically. Think of Plato, who criticized literal myth but acknowledged their metaphorical value; or Stoics, who reinterpreted gods as forces of nature or aspects of the soul. By the time of the Roman Empire, especially from the 1st century BCE onward, educated pagans interpreted myths allegorically and often integrated philosophical systems like Platonism, Stoicism, or Neoplatonism into religious thought. A pagan priest or philosopher in 300 CE did not believe in Zeus the same way a peasant in 800 BCE might have. Just like no serious modern Christian believes heaven is literally "above the sky" in a three-tiered universe anymore.

Thousands of years of Christian and Islamic writers satirizing pagans as stupid has created the modern misconception that Greco-Roman polytheists living in the late Roman period held the same religious beliefs that their predecessors from the time of Homer did, which couldn't be further from the truth. This would be like thinking modern-day Christians believe the sun revolves around the earth because their ancient counterparts did.

>dude philosophy
I've experienced the gods. Never had an interaction with "god". That's all there is to it.

>>17811268
>most people did not believe that a chariot pulls the sun across the sky
Nice cope, but the lack of literal belief doesn’t save Paganism’s core weakness. Symbolic or not, their gods remained finite, bound to nature’s whims (Zeus as a storm, Apollo as the sun). Christianity’s God transcends creation, not just a metaphor for it. Plato’s allegory and Stoic naturalism still lack the personal, relational depth of Christ’s incarnation.

>educated pagans interpreted myths allegorically
Sure, but allegory without a unifying truth is just intellectual masturbation. Neoplatonism and Stoicism borrowed from each other, not from a divine revelation. By 300 CE, Paganism was a philosophical patchwork, not a coherent faith. Compare that to the Church Fathers (Augustine, Origen) building a systematic theology on Christ’s life, death, and resurrection.

>modern Christians don’t believe heaven is literally above the sky
Strawman. The Church adapted to science while keeping its metaphysical core intact. That is, God as eternal, not a sky-dweller. Paganism never had that anchor; it just diluted into eclectic mush. Your point about satire creating misconceptions is weak; primary sources like Cicero and Plutarch show Pagan belief was still fragmented, not a misunderstood monolith.

>>17811269
Describe your interaction with these supposed "gods" that you're mentioning, please.

>take pagan platonism to reconcile hebrew myths
>lol dumb pagans
Aight

>>17811153 (OP)
Meanwhile the Rabbi is the son of the Sky Daddy and is also the Sky Daddy who is not the Magic Ghost who is the Rabbi but is also not the Rabbi who is...

BTW if you are confused by the above you WILL be set on fire.

>>17811273
Platonism got absorbed because it aligned with reason, not because paganism’s superior. Christianity took the best of Greek thought (logos, order) and fused it with divine revelation. Pagans didn’t “reconcile” anything; they flailed with polytheistic chaos. Hebrew myths, grounded in a single God, gave the backbone. Aquinas built on that, not some druid circle. You got it backwards: paganism leeched off the real framework.

>>17811274
>trying to dunk on the Trinity with a word salad
>thinks this is a checkmate

>>17811279
It's not word salad, it's litterally what you pretend to believe on 4chan dot org.

>>17811153 (OP)
>Pagan gods are just anthropomorphic projections, squabbling like petty humans
God literally set bears on people because they made fun of someone being bald

>>17811224
I don't need to respond because you already refuted yourself by admitting free will doesn't exist

Anyway reminder that your christian cult boils down to

>worship this rabbi or else the jewgod will torture you

That's your entire theology lol

>>17811153 (OP)
>Christianity’s got a coherent metaphysics
I wouldn't call that an argument in favor of Christianity, OP. That seems far more like what you'd expect if some guy just made up the tenets of a religion out of nothing because it sounded good to him, a man seeking to persuade other men more than seeking truth. Because if the polytheists are correct, the absence of a single coherent metaphysics or moral law is to be expected, as there are many gods of differing dispositions who control different aspects of reality.

>Pagan gods are just anthropomorphic projections, squabbling like petty humans, bound to nature’s cycles with no transcendent purpose
And that's not a particularly good argument against paganism either. If the universe was created by and presided over by a god or gods, you would expect that the nature of that god or gods could be ascertained by observing the universe they created. If there was a single transcendent, perfect, and never-changing god, why would the world he created be so completely contrary to his nature? No, the world we live in is far better explained by paganism's multitude of fallible gods.

>>17811182
>He allows free will, which is a good, and evil flows from its misuse.
That's the easiest part of the problem of evil to answer though. There's plenty of evil that isn't the consequence of free beings choosing it, like cancer.

>>17811153 (OP)
Germanic paganism has a very clear message to it that’s inspiring for people, but no one knows this very obvious message because the only people who engage with Germanic paganism are people doing so from a place of ignorance, or people doing so from a place of bad faith, so it’s virtually impossible to have a serious conversation about it.
Anyways, the message of Germanic paganism is that divinity is a state and not a role. The gods are gods not because they were born to occupy the arbitrary position of gods, but because they made themselves gods through their actions. Humans semi-regularly become gods in heroic poetry through accomplishing great deeds and cultivating wisdom and virtue.
It’s kind of the opposite of Christianity, where in Christianity you are nothing and can only be redeemed through the actions of another being (God), the pagan believes that his salvation will come after he has earned it through hard work.

>>17811281
The Trinity’s not “pretend” here: it’s one God, three persons, same essence. Father, Son, Holy Spirit: distinct in relation, not substance. It’s not a Marvel crossover plot; it’s theology wrestled with by Augustine, Aquinas, and 2000 years of thinkers. Paganism’s just a pantheon of moody deities with no depth (Odin’s hungover, Zeus is horny). Good luck finding meaning there. You wanna dunk, at least aim for precision, not this “Sky Daddy” meme-tier nonsense.

>>17811319
>That seems far more like what you'd expect if some guy just made up the tenets of a religion out of nothing because it sounded good to him
Nah, Christianity’s metaphysics isn’t some armchair fanfic. It’s built on centuries of rigorous philosophy grappling with first principles. Paganism’s a grab-bag of stories with no logical spine; it’s what you’d expect from oral traditions trying to explain lightning or crops. A single God as the ground of being explains order and existence itself. Polytheism just multiplies causes without necessity, like a bad Occam’s razor shave.

>If there was a single transcendent, perfect, and never-changing god, why would the world he created be so completely contrary to his nature?
World’s messed up ‘cause of free will, not God’s design. Catholicism holds creation was good but corrupted by human choice (sin’s ripple effect). Pagan gods mirror human flaws because they’re human inventions, tied to natural phenomena with no deeper purpose. A single perfect God accounts for the universe’s rational structure (math, physics, causality) while paganism’s chaotic pantheon just reflects the mess without explaining it. You’re saying the world’s flaws prove multiple gods, but that’s just projecting human drama onto the cosmos. One God, one truth, holds up better than a divine soap opera.

>>17811336
Fair point. Catholic theology says they stem from the Fall: original sin warped creation itself (Romans 8:20-22, creation groans in bondage). God permits it to draw us to Him. Suffering purifies, as Job shows, or points to the need for redemption. Paganism offers no such framework; its gods are too weak to explain or redeem it.

>>17811351
>divinity is a state and not a role
That’s a romantic spin, but it falls apart under scrutiny. Germanic paganism’s “message” is vague, pieced together from fragmented sagas and Christian-filtered sources like Snorri. Your idea of humans becoming gods through deeds sounds badass, but it’s cherry-picked and inconsistent. Odin and Thor aren’t just “great deed” heroes; they’re cosmic archetypes tied to chaotic, cyclical myths with no moral anchor. Where’s the unified doctrine? It’s a patchwork of local cults, not a system.

>opposite of Christianity, where in Christianity you are nothing
Wrong. Catholicism holds man as 'imago Dei': created with inherent dignity, capable of reason and virtue, but fallen and in need of grace. Salvation isn’t “earned” through grit; it’s a cooperation with God’s grace, which demands active faith and works (James 2:17). Paganism’s “earn your godhood” shtick lacks grounding. By what standard? Who judges? It’s just self-aggrandizement with no objective measure. Christianity’s got a clear telos: union with God, backed by revelation and reason. Paganism’s just chasing glory for glory’s sake, which is why it collapsed under pressure from a more coherent faith.

Yes, your desert god makes the most sense.

>we cobble together the best of western philosophy
>therefore jewish mythology
>blasphemous pedophile imagery of christ
Zoomer apologetics are something else

>>17811353
This style of trash-talking betrays LLM use

>>17811358
>Your idea of humans becoming gods through deeds sounds badass, but it’s cherry-picked and inconsistent. Odin and Thor aren’t just “great deed” heroes; they’re cosmic archetypes tied to chaotic, cyclical myths with no moral anchor.
Thor and Odin are not humans-cum-gods. Euhemerism is post-pagan christian fanfiction. The humans-cum-gods I’m talking about are Weyland the Smith, Sigurd the Volsung, and Helgi Hundingsbana.
>Paganism’s “earn your godhood” shtick lacks grounding. By what standard? Who judges? It’s just self-aggrandizement with no objective measure.
Godhood is a clear binary. You’re not a god based on the totality of the circumstances, you’re either a god or you’re not. A god is someone who treks across the world tree, as Odin did in Runatal. To be a god is to unify your imperfect, worldly avatar, and your essence that exists without creation.
The gods we see in stories are not the true essences of the gods themselves, but crude avatars which emanate from their essence but which do not fully capture it. That’s why they seem inconsistent.
To any complaints regarding a lack of strict rules and criteria, I would simply say that thats a feature and not a bug. Unity with your perfect from is a personal experience, not a mechanical one.

>>17811153 (OP)
>no unifying truth
Christianity has no unifying truth for europeans, it's a hastily copy pasted religion over european paganism

>>17811153 (OP)
>Paganism’s a mess of incoherent myths and rituals, cobbled together from tribal superstitions with no unifying truth
THIS NIGGA HAS NEVER HEARD OF PHILOSOPHY BEFORE LMAO READ PLOTINUS

>>17811353
>three persons, same essence
Oooooh that's hell fire forever for you. Thanks for playing though.

>>17811592
>Thor and Odin are not humans-cum-gods. Euhemerism is post-pagan christian fanfiction.
Fair, euhemerism’s a later lens, but your examples (Weyland, Sigurd, Helgi) don’t prove a consistent “humans become gods” theme. They’re legendary heroes, sure, but their “divinity” is ambiguous, more poetic elevation than a clear theological claim. Germanic sources (Eddas, sagas) don’t explicitly frame them as gods; they’re exceptional mortals, sometimes with divine favor, not beings who “trek the world tree” to godhood. You’re projecting a metaphysical system onto fragmented stories.

>Godhood is a clear binary... unify your imperfect, worldly avatar, and your essence
That’s a cool headcanon, but where’s the textual evidence? Runatal shows Odin’s self-sacrifice for wisdom, not a blueprint for humans to become gods. Your idea of gods as “crude avatars” separate from their “true essence” sounds like a modern esoteric gloss, not something grounded in primary sources. Germanic paganism lacks the systematic theology to support this, unlike Catholicism, with its clear distinctions between Creator and creature, rooted in scripture and tradition.

>Unity with your perfect form is a personal experience, not a mechanical one
That’s the problem. It’s so personal it’s incoherent. Without objective standards or a unifying doctrine, it’s just vibes: individualistic, subjective, and ultimately weightless. Catholicism’s got a defined anthropology: man’s purpose is the beatific vision, achieved through grace and virtue, not self-deification. Paganism’s lack of structure isn’t a “feature”; it’s why it couldn’t compete with a faith that offers both metaphysical rigor and universal truth.

>>17811598
If anything, Christianity synthesized what was worth keeping from paganism (virtue, community, natural law) and ditched the baggage like human sacrifice and capricious deities. It gave Europe a universal framework: one God, one moral code, one salvation. Paganism was a fractured mess; every tribe with its own pantheon, no cohesion. Rome fell apart under that nonsense. Christianity built cathedrals, universities, and a moral foundation that held for centuries. What’s paganism’s legacy? Stone circles and fairy tales. Truth isn’t about “feels European,” it’s about what holds up under scrutiny. Christ’s claims are rooted in history, not some vague “ancestral vibe.”

>>17811601
Nice try, anon. Plotinus was a Neoplatonist, not a pagan in the sense of worshiping Zeus or Odin. His metaphysics of the One is abstract and closer to Christian theology than to the messy pantheons of paganism. He’s trying to systematize, sure, but paganism as practiced was still a fractured mess (local cults, contradictory myths, no universal doctrine). Christianity’s got the Nicene Creed, a single coherent framework across centuries. Plotinus is a philosopher, not a priest; his ideas didn’t unify pagan worship. Try again.

>>17811633
human sacrifice wasn't a thing in europe since the neolithic period, most claims of human sacrifice are from outsiders trying to demonize another culture
>rome fell apart without Christianity
rome fell apart when it let in jews

>>17811633
>Plotinus was a Neoplatonist, not a pagan in the sense of worshiping Zeus or Odin
He was a pagan. The fuck are you on about? Suddenly Neo-Platonists aren't pagans because they have all the things you ascribe pagans as not having?
>His metaphysics of the One is abstract and closer to Christian theology than to the messy pantheons of paganism
Neo-Platonism takes the idea of divinity from Platonism. Your equating to Christian theology should be the other way around as Platonism is an older tradition.
>Plotinus is a philosopher, not a priest
Many philosophers were religious figures and many of them were priests.
>his ideas didn’t unify pagan worship
Neither did the Nicene Creed, or the arguments around the mode of energy of Christ. There was never a unified Christian worship either.

>>17811640
>human sacrifice wasn't a thing
Wrong. Archaeological evidence (bog bodies, Lindow Man, Tollund Man) shows ritual killings in Celtic and Germanic contexts well into the Iron Age. Caesar and Tacitus (yeah, maybe biased) report Druids and Germanic tribes doing it. Not just “outsider propaganda.” Paganism’s rituals often leaned brutal; Christianity explicitly rejected that.

>rome fell apart when it let in jews
Kek, scapegoating le joos on /his/? Rome’s decline was complex; overextension, economic rot, barbarian invasions, internal corruption, etc. Christianity unified a fracturing empire, giving it a moral and cultural spine. Paganism couldn’t; it was too decentralized, too tied to local cults. Jews were a tiny minority, not the masterminds of collapse. Blaming them’s a lazy cop-out. Christianity’s spread brought stability (Constantine, Theodosius) while paganism left Rome worshiping glorified weather gods. Pick a better hill to die on.

>>17811640
The numerous bronze and iron age sacrifices from all over Europe from Crete to Britain say otherwise

>>17811657
>He was a pagan. The fuck are you on about? Suddenly Neo-Platonists aren't pagans because they have all the things you ascribe pagans as not having?
Plotinus was a pagan in the loose sense, sure, but his Neoplatonism isn’t the same as the folk paganism of temple sacrifices and polytheistic rituals. His “One” is a philosophical abstraction, not a deity you’d see in a Greek temple. Paganism as a system lacks the cohesion his ideas tried to impose. Most pagans weren’t reading Plotinus, they were burning goats to Apollo.

>Neo-Platonism takes the idea of divinity from Platonism. Your equating to Christian theology should be the other way around as Platonism is an older tradition.
Platonism’s older, no shit, but Christianity synthesized it better. Augustine and the Church Fathers took Plato’s forms and Plotinus’ One and grounded them in a personal God with a moral will. Pagan Platonism stays abstract, detached from the lived religion of the masses. Christianity made it accessible and universal.

>Many philosophers were religious figures and many of them were priests.
Some were, sure, but Plotinus wasn’t running a cult or leading rituals. He was a thinker, not a shaman. Pagan priests weren’t out there debating metaphysics, they were cutting open animals for omens.

>Neither did the Nicene Creed, or the arguments around the mode of energy of Christ. There was never a unified Christian worship either.
The Nicene Creed standardized core doctrine (Trinity, Christ’s divinity, one Church, etc.). Yeah, there were schisms and debates, but compare that to paganism’s total lack of a central authority or agreed-upon canon. Christianity’s got ecumenical councils; paganism’s got a hundred local gods with zero consensus. You’re dodging the point: Catholicism’s framework is light-years more coherent than paganism’s patchwork.

>>17811628
>don’t prove a consistent “humans become gods” theme. They’re legendary heroes, sure, but their “divinity” is ambiguous, more poetic elevation than a clear theological claim.
I don’t know, man, the ending of Helgakvitha Hundingsbana II is pretty unambiguous
>38. "Helgi rose | above heroes all
>Like the lofty ash | above lowly thorns,
>Or the noble stag, | with dew besprinkled,
>Bearing his head | above all beasts,
>(And his horns gleam bright | to heaven itself.)

>A hill was made in Helgi's memory. And when he came to Valhall, then Othin bade him rule over every thing with himself.

>>17811661
>>17811670
>killing people for breaking the law or customs is the same as institutionalized human sacrifice
you sound like a roman propagandist

>>17811673
>Most pagans weren’t reading Plotinus, they were burning goats to Apollo.
What's your point here? Most Christians in Antiquity didn't take any theological thought seriously either. They did equally absurd things. If you take things from the lowest it's always going to sound retarded. Christians venerated the spit of a homeless man and had no idea about the trinity or cared one bit about any theological ideas.
>but Christianity synthesized it better
This line of reasoning is pointless. Christian theology is not special here.
>Pagan Platonism stays abstract, detached from the lived religion of the masses
Theurgy was intensely popular and the morals which it championed formed the bedrock of Roman and Greek society. This is like saying charity and compassion are abstract and detached from the lived religion of the masses for Christianity.
>Some were, sure
Many were. Philosophy was one of the main things nearly all elites in the Roman Empire studied for at least some time. Neo-Platonic ideas were not some fringe thing.
>they were cutting open animals for omens.
Don't know why you're obsessed with animal sacrifice being a feature of paganism when it had already declined in the 3rd century as a practice.
>but compare that to paganism’s total lack of a central authority
The Romans already had this. It's called the state and specifically the Priestly College. Much Church politics in Antiquity was spawned from the same exact mechanisms that existed for State Cults.
>Catholicism’s framework is light-years more coherent than paganism’s patchwork.
Ok? Your initial statement of there being no unifying truth or coherent metaphysics is objectively wrong because it did exist. It's the shit which influenced Christians. Just as there is no consensus in Christianity there isn't amongst pagans.

We could move onto Zoroastrianism as well, which has everything you're proclaiming as well.

>>17811673

>Most pagans weren't X, they were Y.
>Some were, sure, but ...
>He was a X, not a Y.
>Pagan priests weren't X, they were Y.
>Yeah, there were X, but Y.
>light-years more coherent than paganism's patchwork


STOP REPLYING TO THIS FAGGOT HE IS JUST USING CHATGPT TO RESPOND

Christianity is not coherent.

>>17811684
>No, no, those children that were ritualisticly dismembered and then cannibalised at Knossos to the point that the Greek archaeologist who found them refused to belive they were children but were actually monkeys (they were children) were actually hardened criminals!!!
Desperate cope.

>>17811743
>what about cretans 4000 years ago
stuff it up your asshole how about that retard

>>17811816
The very first European civilisation practiced child sacrifice and cannibalism. Deal with it.

>>17811820
There's no evidence of cannibalism faggot

>>17811153 (OP)
>Christianity’s got a coherent metaphysics:
Only if you are selective about which Christian thinkers get included. You can look at a limited number of pagan philosophers and construct a coherent metaphysics as well. That's an intellectual exercise, not proof of anything.
And to address a further point. A tradition of "serious thinkers" Also doesn't mean much. If what those serious thinkers have to work with is speculation or false information thousands of years of serious thinking is not going to make the underlying ideas true, it will just build more robust and complex iterations or defenses of those ideas.

>>17811823
https://www.archaeology.wiki/blog/2017/12/18/ritual-human-sacrifice-mycenaean-palace-kydonia/
Cope and seethe. Seethe and cope.

>>17811843
So outside of a 4000 year old reddit asspull of a subterranean island is there a single piece of evidence of european sacrifice from the roman era?

No? oh it's all propaganda?

>>17811850
>now admits that the Minoans, the founders of based EVROPA practiced child sacrifice and cannibalism
The Romans themselves buried Gauls and Greeks alive as a sacrifice according to Livy. Cope and seethe more.

>>17811862
Most secular exerts today think the ancient Israelites practiced human sacrifice too. Molach wasn't a god, it was a method of burnt offering, and the God they were making that offering to was the God of the bible.

>>17811862
>the people calling everybody else human sacrificers with no evidence were actually sacrificing humans
your incoherent babble just contradicted itself

>>17811889
>Livy is incoherent babble
See what I mean about cope? Anon has reached the hysterics stage.

>>17811895
You've already given up, you were hoping you google blog link was enough but you're actually mentally retarded

>>17811898
>Livy is mentally retarded
Cope and seethe, seethe and cope.

>>17811905
Yes you are mentally retarded, there's no evidence anybody in mainland europe practiced ritual sacrifice since the neolithic era thousands of years before the romans were using it as propaganda to crush them

>>17811910
Apart from the archaeological evidence of the based and trad first EVROPEAN civilisation and the words of a based TRVE ROMAN Livy.

>>17811914
So you don't know of a single person sacrificed in europe for the 2000 years before roman conquest when they said everybody was into it?

>>17811918
So you admit the Minoans did indeed practice human sacrifice and cannibalism and that Livy did indeed say that the Romans themselves practiced human sacrifice when needed?

>>17811926
So romans used human sacrifice as propaganda, took over the jews and then seeded their empire with them who then espoused their ethnocentric religion and broke the empire over their knee?

>>17811153 (OP)
>Catholicism offers a rational framework: Aquinas’ proofs, the Church’s intellectual tradition, and 2000 years of theological consistency
>three is actually one, because IT JUST IS OKAY? JEEZ

>>17811932
Who are you quoting anon? Has the fact that based TRVE ROMAN Titus Livius wrote about how the Romans sacrificed humans broken your brain?

>>17811961
I'm trying to get you to think but it seems you're incapable. Are you christian? Does learning your religion is just some virus that killed the roman empire with no legitimacy frighten you?

>>17811965
Broken brain confirmed. Based TRVE ROMANS did what must be done and buried Gauls and Greeks alive for the Gods. Livy said so.

>>17811973
Get your shit together and come back with an actual argument

>>17811974
>One of the main Roman authors describing the Romans practising human sacrifice isn't an argument
Ok, enjoy your life.

>>17811983
you've based your entire gotcha talking point on the people you argue with caring about what romans say about anything

did it ever occur to you you're reading propaganda?

>>17811986
>Livy spread propaganda AGAINST the Romans
Ok.

>>17811994
HElloooooooooo

retarded nigger helloooooooo

>>17811182
The bible doesn't mention free will

>>17811673
>Most pagans weren’t reading Plotinus, they were burning goats to Apollo
Yes, just like most christians weren't reading Augustine and Aquinas, they were just praying to the bones of long-dead saints in the hopes it would cure their ailments

>>17811996
You don't know who Livy was, do you?

>>17812002
Why would I care? It's so funny how you think waving these reject's names around mean anything. You have no argument. I don't care what Charlemagne said about the mountain men

>>17812008
>Why would I care that the most important Roman historian openly talked about the Romans performing human sacrifices
Because it would utterly buttfuck your argument?

>>17812011
The most important roman historian talked about ritual sacrifice in europe? He witnessed it himself?

No? Oh you're only bringing it up because you're just a bully and have no argument

>>17811206
>Pagan gods offer no salvation
They don't need to. They offer pride

>>17812014
>The most important roman historian talked about ritual sacrifice in europe
Yes.

>>17812021
Okay so you've not failed to post anything relevant for 50 posts why? are you mentally disabled?

oh of course you are we've already established this

>>17811153 (OP)
>Catholicism offers a rational framework: Aquinas’ proofs, the Church’s intellectual tradition, and 2000 years of theological consistency
And less than 1% of Catholics care about any of that shit.

You don't seriously expect us to believe filipinx housewives are having heated discussions over Augustine's interpretation of the nature of grace lol

>>17811153 (OP)
>Paganism’s a mess of incoherent myths and rituals, cobbled together from tribal superstitions with no unifying truth
It does, though:
>Thrift and vigilance, as in the Havamal
>That promise-breakers cannot be trusted
>Self-sacrifice for improvement, as Odin losing his eye at Mimir's well for wisdom, or hanging from Yggdrasil to learn the rules
>The winning of social respect through accomplishments
>Order is maintained by fighting chaos
>Courage in the face of defeat, as with Ragnarok
Of course it is not unified because proto Indo European migration diverged. But Christianity is also multiple sects, even though I'm sure yours is the one true faith

>>17811153 (OP) (OP) #
>Paganism’s a mess of incoherent myths and rituals, cobbled together from tribal superstitions with no unifying truth
It does, though:
>Thrift and vigilance, as in the Havamal
>That promise-breakers cannot be trusted
>Self-sacrifice for improvement, as Odin losing his eye at Mimir's well for wisdom, or hanging from Yggdrasil to learn the runes
>The winning of social respect through accomplishments
>Order is maintained by fighting chaos
>Courage in the face of defeat, as with Ragnarok
Of course it is not unified because proto Indo European migration diverged. But Christianity is also multiple sects, even though I'm sure yours is the one true faith

>>17811168
these are the times when I wish we could have a troll-free environment.

There are multiple discrete pagan religions that each have their theologies and philosophies. Many such as Navajo, African religions or aboriginal religions are ethnoreligions . This is also seperate from Neopagan religions too.