You know, I used to think that everyone was "just the same person, with the parts moved around" but my recent studies into recursive thinking methods and levels of thinking have revealed to me that this is a very minimalist view of the depth and diversity of human thought. I have evolved my stance on this philosophical idea: we are similar, all of us, but we are not the same, and to model everyone else's mind, as if it is my own mind, simply following a different path, is in fact, lacking. It is often presented as a kind of deep understanding of empathy, but in truth, I see it as a "shortcut to empathy", in ways. actual deep recursive empathy requires that I step outside the boundaries of my own mental framework, not project them onto others. IRONICALLY, in my pursuit to understand others through understanding myself, I have become somewhat self-centrist in my empathy to others. the idea that everyone was the same soul with shuffled elements simply isn't true. People are different. their brains are different. their internal voice is different. their thought-chain is different. Empathy and recursive thinking aren't just about self-reflection, it's not about turning inward to see outward, not like I thought, it's about... reflection through others. To model another mind truly doesn't have anything to do with projecting yourself onto their mental map, but it's more about allowing yourself to unbecome in the process of entering their mental framework. You can not simply emulate them, you must allow your own mental framework to be rewritten to understand their model, of course, you can return to your default state afterwards. This is a kind of mind-modeling method acting concept I've been considering lately. We all seem to be interfacing recursive engines, with different feedback loops, different trauma, and myths, different beliefs, different understandings, different sensory associations, each person has their own geometry of becoming, their own semantic attractors...

I used to think it was:

>We are all the same sheet,
>creased in different ways
>a thousand cranes
>folded from the
>same paper.

but now it's:

>Each flame burns
>from a different star...
>not a chorus,
>but origin songs
>no other can sing.


This is a profound and radical change in the way I see people.
This of course, confirms my greatest fear: That we are all, in fact, for the most part: alone. Mentally.
Somewhat singular, even.
I spent so much of my life trying to be understood by others, and as a means to that end, to understand other minds.
But It was somewhat folly, as that was never the path to being understood, not really.

You have autism and should get checked.

>>17816022
Smaller minds are sadly incapable of holding the concepts I outlined here.

Good post OP. I can relate.

>>17816022
Nah OP is based and he's right. We're the same yet not the same. Alike yet different. It's a paradox. This personality I'm expressing was formed through a myriad of experiences. You can't just adopt a personality, it's grown.

Embracing the particularly of each individual while finding the universal between each other is the goal.

While we might all be persons, you have to accept that each one has lived their particular experiences and that will always overtake any "objective" truths until you find common language to communicate your experience with others.

>>17816015 (OP)
>actual deep recursive empathy requires that I step outside the boundaries of my own mental framework, not project them onto others.
What you are describing is simply "empathy". No need to qualify it. Some people simply aren't capable of empathy. It is no big loss. Jesus said
>Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them
Anyone can do this; No empathy required. Trust me, I am an empath. You aren't missing out on much.

>>17816018
it's hard for me to relate because i was never foolish enough to hold beliefs similar to your first concept

>>17816015 (OP)
you’re overdoing it and entering the world of sympathy which will change you as a person, seeing into the void and vice versa. Empathy is the understanding, with the right skills (and honestly imagination) you don’t need to unbecome to empathise, in fact it’s working against empathy bytaking away your own human essence that becomes a foundation for your analysis of others. i was teaching something close to applied empathy for years, the people who tried but failes were those who sacrificed themselves spiritually with a misguided extreme and incorrect mental model of empathy.

>>17816015 (OP)
Oof man you got so close
You can never escape your own mental framework. Period.
>deep recursive empathy requires that I step outside the boundaries of my own mental framework
I'm sorry, but this is not possible.
How do you step outside of your own mental framework when you yourself are the inside, outside, and the box itself.

>we are all, in fact, for the most part: alone. Mentally.
This is true, though. And I'd even go as far as to say Physically, but I'd be shoo'd out before I can make my point.

Mechanically, empathy is incredibly fascinating and interesting. It's the single mechanic that allows for the fractional dissolution of the apparent discrete appearance of life. Put in practice, though, it's very simple and humble —and I believe anyone can employ some level of it.

Empathy is just saying, "while I'll never truly know, I can do my best to understand someone's pov."
Some people only need to imagine another's visual perspective, while others need to imagine the entire logic structure and background

Some people don't have souls

Some people are quite literally demonic spirits piloting a human avatar