>free will

>>17846104 (OP)
God gave us free will but he only gave us one God. What a cruel and unusual trick

>>17846104 (OP)
They're just letters. They weren't supposed to be this important

>>17846128
All scripture is God breathed, reprobate heretic.

>>17846104 (OP)
and?

>>17846173
Free will is real except when he's not also God loves you except when he doesn't and decides to harden your heart because he feels like it

>>17846176
you make no sense

>>17846173
>>17846178
I meant to say "it's" and not "he's"

Free will is real except when it's not also God loves you except when he doesn't and decides to harden your heart because he feels like it. Btw God never changes and is not the author of confusion.

i still don't see your point

>>17846173
>>17846182
Pray to God to make you less dumb, maybe he'll answer this time, or maybe he will after two weeks.

ok man
once you become more coherent
and can state your problem clearly
let me know
but to this time
look for truth and understanding
peace

>>17846198
The point is extremely clear and obvious. I think you're just dumb.

show me the contradiction

>>17846135
Citation needed.

>>17846104 (OP)
Nobody ever proved the existence of god, prove god exists then I'll take you and the bible seriously

>>17846104 (OP)
My pleb take on this quote is that it is saying all is already fated to occur so you have the free will to do things but what you do is already known and approved of in advance.

>>17846254
You don't have free will, God already decided who will succeed and who will fail. Your actions are predetermined according to God's plan. Says it right there. He already knows who gets what.

>>17846359
Then it's not free will.

>>17846104 (OP)
>>17846181
>>17846427
>>17847091
The "free" in "free will" doesn't mean random or unpredictable. It means unobstructed self-expression. That someone knows you and hence knows how you will express yourself doesn't bind you. By libertarian take I can only be free when there is complete randomness to my decision-making, hence there is no actual identity behind the decisions, hence there is no "I". The libertarian definition is rigged from the start.

>>17846311
Okay, what methodology do you find valid for detecting the Holy Spirit?

>>17847108
Free will means I can make the decisions. If God already knows what decision I will make (and he does if he's all knowing) then it was decided by God, not me, and is thus not free will.

>>17846104 (OP)
>Galatians 6:7 - A man reaps what he sows.
Free will.

>>17846104 (OP)
If he hardens you it's as punishment because of the choices you already made.

>>17846104 (OP)
He's making sense of why the Jews were being shitbags, read the letter

>>17846359
A good word would be providence, indicating that God has jurisdiction over outcomes but is leaving much in the way fate TBD by people and the interactions between them.

>>17847114
It was decided by you. God just knew you to begin with.

>>17846104 (OP)
How does this contradict free will? God wants to have mercy on people who freely choose him, and he wants to harden people who don't.

>>17847139
>God just knew you to begin with.
Then it was decided by God not me.

>>17847146
>>17847139
>>17847130
>>17847120
>>17847108
>>17846359
>>17846254
>>17846198
>>17846182
>>17846173
Idiots.

>>17847166
Both. Like I suggested in >>17847108, try to imagine what it would mean for you to make the choice and you will see a choice can only be free when there is no actual "you".

>>17847171
>Both
Nonsense

>>17847182
Why would that be nonsense? You don't think two agents can interdependently decide something? Negotiations happen daily.

>>17847168
>noooooooo this verse has to contradict free will even though it doesn't at all

>>17847188
>You don't think two agents can interdependently decide something?
One of the agents is the supreme being of the universe who is claimed to know everything that will ever happen (all knowing), which means the universe is deterministic and free will doesn't exist

>>17847229
Determinism is about a prior state fully etermining a later state. God's omniscience is about being outside of time altogether. And funnily enough, the religious concept of free will (although mutilated according to some) can still work under determinism.
Like I said before in this thread, if you let your current idea of "free will" play out completely, you will discover that it's intangible in pretty much any universe.

>>17847115
You are saying this as an absolute? Ok. I hereby sow all of us to not have to go through anymore trouble right this instant with all faith in God being able to do exactly that, and in myself to make it happen. And I do not tempt but seek mercy. If it is not so, then what is written is not fully representative of God as God is deemed: perfect and merciful.

>>17847341
>You are saying this as an absolute?
the same can be said for OP's verse. Now you understand the fallacy.

>>17846311
>Using Charlie Brown to be anti-Christian
How much reddit gold does that image bring?

>>17847168
>reading source material bad