Is it overrated? - /his/ (#17848620) [Archived: 227 hours ago]

Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:47:03 AM No.17848620
IMG_5348
IMG_5348
md5: 6591a4302af6925ba814d9f59fc8ca77🔍
Compared to the modern era, Rome appears so primitive
>constant political infighting and devastating civil wars
>autocrats who are wantonly cruel or inept
>huge wealth inequalities such that most of the population did nothing but beg and watch the chariot races all day
>economy subsistent on agriculture and slavery
>no scientific method or industry despite Greek “science”
>repeat for 1000 years
Replies: >>17848624 >>17848651 >>17848657 >>17848675 >>17848879 >>17848913 >>17849120 >>17849151 >>17849154 >>17849178 >>17850133 >>17850200 >>17850800 >>17850874 >>17851296 >>17852464 >>17856593 >>17856614
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 5:48:02 AM No.17848622
None of that applied to Christian Rome, lol.
Replies: >>17848623 >>17848627 >>17850282 >>17851758 >>17853815
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:49:34 AM No.17848623
>>17848622
Rome declined rapidly after it Christianized
Replies: >>17848625 >>17848626 >>17848761 >>17850152
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:49:47 AM No.17848624
>>17848620 (OP)
people only care about maps nothing else and they see rome as this giant red blob on the map instead of a bunch of smaller colored blobs
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 5:50:59 AM No.17848625
>>17848623

It actually skyrocketed in science, mathematics, architecture, and art.
Replies: >>17848635
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:51:12 AM No.17848626
>>17848623
The rot set in earlier than that by the 2nd century birthrates in the RE were stagnating.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:51:28 AM No.17848627
>>17848622
It applied even moreso to christian rome than pagan rome you dunce
Replies: >>17848635
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:54:25 AM No.17848634
Rome was the first "modern" country, it established borders beyond multiple ethnic groups and set the standard for runing a massive, bureaucratic empire
Replies: >>17848642 >>17848922 >>17850121
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 5:54:50 AM No.17848635
>>17848627

See: >>17848625

And we have boatloads of evidence for that. For example, Byzantines built the first oil-based motor vehicle. Pagans didn't.
Replies: >>17848638 >>17848731
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 5:55:51 AM No.17848638
>>17848635

Gas-based*.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:56:55 AM No.17848642
>>17848634
the Achaemenid empire already did that and i'm pretty sure Han China
Replies: >>17848924
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 5:57:45 AM No.17848644
Byzantines, who were Christian, also discovered a primitive form of particle physics. They also built a cyclotron that used physiostatic electricity which was kind of like the LHC.
Replies: >>17848649
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:59:35 AM No.17848649
>>17848644
Are you constantly on this board? I saw you on here four days ago and now I see you again immediately when I make a post.

Can someone fill me in? Is he the town retard or something?
Replies: >>17848653 >>17848657
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 5:59:53 AM No.17848651
>>17848620 (OP)
>appears so primitive
To what? Modern times? No shit, are you stupid?
Replies: >>17848655
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:00:58 AM No.17848653
>>17848649
he is the most recent troll/schizo, also if you want a laugh look up the Simon Salva part of his name on this board and filter by pictures, then do the same thing for boards like bant
Replies: >>17848654
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:01:35 AM No.17848654
>>17848653

I'm not a troll OR a schizo. I'm a historian with a Master's degree in the subject from UC Berkeley.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:02:08 AM No.17848655
>>17848651
When I say “modern times,” I also mean the early modern period (after 1453)
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:03:53 AM No.17848657
>>17848620 (OP)
>>autocrats who are wantonly cruel or inept
Cruel is one of the things you would not call Roman rule. Roman and Greek writers made a point in pointing of cruelty in rulers and officials because of how terrible it was to them. The practice of a fair and generous ruler was part of their culture for centuries and was absolutely expected
>>17848649
New schizo. He just insults people, makes things up, provides no evidence and is very much into homosexual pornography, considering that he posts images of it all the time.
Replies: >>17848659 >>17848660
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:05:08 AM No.17848659
IMG_6825
IMG_6825
md5: 60910a1d03264fbaec1220256672cd2a🔍
>>17848657

I'm not a schizo. My mental health is fine.

Wanna try that again?
Replies: >>17848663
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:05:39 AM No.17848660
>>17848657
China was no different a cruel inept ruler lost the Mandate of Heaven.
Replies: >>17848663
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:09:32 AM No.17848663
>>17848659
You're a schizophrenic homosexual? Yea.
>>17848660
What's the point in comparing Rome with China here? They didn't share the same culture or ethos around how to rule or what made up good practice.
Replies: >>17848666
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:10:27 AM No.17848666
>>17848663

Proof I'm schizophrenic?
Replies: >>17850192
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:15:35 AM No.17848675
>>17848620 (OP)
late imperial Rome from 300 to 550 is the most underrated period in Roman history. It's the era of Roman history which had the most direct and lasting impact on subsequent European civilisation, either through transmitting ancient knowledge or through Late Rome's own innovations.
Its often said that the Late Roman Empire is when Rome started to look more "medieval" than "Roman" but really its more like the Roman Empire, in its late antique iteration, continued to project itself down through the middle ages.
Pseuds will hate it because it's Christian and Christian LARPers won't bother learning anything about the era anyway which means there's not that many people who are actually into late Roman history.
Replies: >>17848683 >>17851765
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:17:34 AM No.17848683
>>17848675

So you're a pseud if you hate Christianity, got it. Even though it has been the most poisonous religion since the invention of writing.
Replies: >>17848687
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:19:27 AM No.17848687
>>17848683

I follow an animist religion (Shintoism), and I think Christians rightfully get what they deserve for their centuries of turning nations into trashpiles.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:36:34 AM No.17848731
>>17848635
>oil-based motor vehicle
Which one?
Replies: >>17848732
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:37:29 AM No.17848732
>>17848731

Which what? God or Satan? Well, I choose God.
Replies: >>17848737 >>17848744
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:43:09 AM No.17848737
>>17848732
Is there an oil based Byzantine engine or did you make stuff up?
Replies: >>17848747
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:48:43 AM No.17848744
>>17848732
Are you trying to make Christians look like liars? Very rabbinical of you.
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:49:30 AM No.17848747
>>17848737

We don't have any records other than Theodore II Palaiologos' account, since the primary ones were all destroyed by, guess who, paganfags.

But I'll give Theodore's account here:

"The [vehicle][...] it moved like a spear of God, it could shove forward at incredibly fast speeds, and it only needed nectar from the Earth and fire. It could move across the empire within the matter of a week."
Replies: >>17848749 >>17848753 >>17848755 >>17848756 >>17851789 >>17851805
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:51:32 AM No.17848749
>>17848747
How do we know he didn't steal a pagan technology and write about it as if it were Christian?
Replies: >>17848754
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:52:41 AM No.17848753
>>17848747
>This description evokes imagery of both mythical and technologically advanced vehicles. While the "spear of God" evokes mythical and powerful weapons such as Odin's spear Gungnir

AI thinks you're talking about Odin.
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:53:02 AM No.17848754
>>17848749

Because paganism makes the scientific method impossible, and they wouldn't have discovered that level of engineering and science regardless.
Replies: >>17848762
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:53:13 AM No.17848755
Aeolipile_illustration
Aeolipile_illustration
md5: 772f50cc14e7a2ad7984f3cc857807fc🔍
>>17848747
>Pagans
Well unfortunately for (you) Pagans did actually invent the steam engine in the form of the Aeolipile, many centuries before even your false-claims, so even if you weren't bullshitting you'd still be wrong
Replies: >>17848763
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:53:41 AM No.17848756
>>17848747
There's no source for this
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:56:04 AM No.17848761
>>17848623
False.
It was rapidly declining before adopting Christianity.
You could argue that Christianity caused the Western Empire to last a while longer.
Meanwhile the Eastern Empire flourished for centuries after the Western empire fell.
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:56:13 AM No.17848762
>>17848754

Paganism makes the scientific method impossible because you're interfering with the order of the gods, plus the world isn't intelligible because it wasn't created with regularity in mind.
Replies: >>17848766
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:56:19 AM No.17848763
>>17848755
This. Pagans discovered electricity from spectrum and also mechanical gears.
Replies: >>17848765
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 6:57:20 AM No.17848765
>>17848763
*Electrum
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 6:57:30 AM No.17848766
>>17848762

Christianity posits the world is intelligible because it was created by an omnipotent God who makes it intelligible, which literally can't work in any way for paganism without destroying the essence of paganism.
Replies: >>17848775 >>17848853
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:02:12 AM No.17848775
>>17848766
In paganism to know the Gods is to know the universe. I'm still waiting on your actual source,it doesn't seem to exist.
Replies: >>17848786 >>17848804
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 7:04:42 AM No.17848786
>>17848775

Source for what, Vikang larper?
Replies: >>17848789
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:06:50 AM No.17848789
>>17848786
Your oil engine from Palaiologos. Where is the text? What is it called?

Btw Christians wrote treatises from the first millennium commenting and fucking up the Greek natural sciences. If you're interested I'll get the name of it. But more to the point there's nothing Christians came up with that was their own.
Replies: >>17848804
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 7:10:42 AM No.17848804
>>17848789

Accounts from the Palaiologos Dynasty, XV.II.

And that latter part is just all fucking wrong. Christians never bungled any Greek science, because you never had any in the first place. Science only began to exist when Christianity spread, no society before Christianity had any form of science.

>>17848775

>In paganism to know the Gods is to know the universe.

How? By doing science, you are committing blasphemy in a pagan worldview.
Replies: >>17848810
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:16:01 AM No.17848809
1749942071088611
1749942071088611
md5: 88c7406c8f659fd687f07d20b26d1e93🔍
How would a "gas powered engine" even work in a world that lacks the manufacturing tolerances capable of high compression ratios and/or without the ability to generate high enough current to drive a spark gap needed for ignition? All early engines were steam engines as they are external combustion engines as opposed to internal combustion engines and thus do not require either of these things to operate.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:16:14 AM No.17848810
>>17848804
>Accounts from the Palaiologos Dynasty, XV.II.
Do you have a PDF or link? Search engines don't pull anything up. I'm going to page ten looking for this thing.

>Christians never bungled any Greek science
There's whole books about it. They can't wrap their head around a lack of firmament. It's actually comedic. Science stopped with the Christians.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:20:31 AM No.17848817
why are 90% of the replies here simon salva/people replying to simon salva
Replies: >>17848819 >>17848823
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:21:42 AM No.17848819
>>17848817
schizos gonna schizo
Replies: >>17848820
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:22:22 AM No.17848820
>>17848819
is simon actually a schizoid?
Replies: >>17848824
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:23:33 AM No.17848823
>>17848817
I want to see if he'll confess to making up a fake source or if he'll ride out the lie
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:23:37 AM No.17848824
>>17848820
read this thread, lurk moar and you tell me
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:24:45 AM No.17848826
i mean fuck he calls himself "the apostle to the 4channers" how delusional can this one literally who get
Replies: >>17848828
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:27:34 AM No.17848828
>>17848826
He is bringing us his made up scriptures okay
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 7:39:22 AM No.17848846
What the fuck happened here?
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:45:31 AM No.17848853
>>17848766
Nothing of what you say is true, liar.
Replies: >>17848859
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 7:49:38 AM No.17848859
>>17848853

How?
Replies: >>17848866 >>17848866
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 7:54:57 AM No.17848866
>>17848859
>>17848859
>How? By doing science, you are committing blasphemy in a pagan worldview.
You're just projecting your christcuck degeneracy on Paganism. It is well known that Christian authorities condemned the science of Copernicus and Galileo during the scientific revolution. Whatever science the Byzantines may have had in all likelihood was from pagan times just like its greatest art was pagan, as the statues in Constantinople prove.
Archimedes Palimsest is one example that proves christcucks destroyed pagan science and replaced it with theology. And the antichitera mechanism, as well as theories of heliocentrism and evolution from antiquity prove that the world was more advanced in pagan times.
Also just like Christianity condemned the scientific revolution, it is a fact that from Copernicus to Newton it was Hermetism, Pythagorianism and Neoplatonism that is at the root of the scientific revolution.
Replies: >>17848874
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/17/2025, 8:00:16 AM No.17848874
>>17848866

>MUH PULIMFSETS

A prayer book is much more valuable than some elderly midwit pederast's book of (pseudo)"science" and (pseudo)"engineering".

The Galileo and Copernicus stories are also totally made up.

The Byzantines didn't take anything from paganfags, pagans had nothing to give.

>Byzantines may have had in all likelihood was from pagan times just like its greatest art was pagan, as the statues in Constantinople prove.

Those statues are Christian and were made of Christian figures.

>Hermetism, Pythagorianism and Neoplatonism

>crackpot demon worship psychedelic ideologies gave us science

LOL.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:02:30 AM No.17848879
>>17848620 (OP)
For all its flaws the Roman Republic and Empire managed to establish and maintain (relatively) complex systems of bureaucracy, tax collections and large urban centers. After its decline and eventual collapse it took centuries for Europe to recover. The decline of feudalism and the emergence of the early modern period coincides pretty well with the re-establishment of large urban centers and the founding of universities where people could go to study (Roman) law.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:38:10 AM No.17848913
>>17848620 (OP)
No, overrated is a coward's way of saying you dislike how popular something is. Be a man and just critic it without referring to it's popularity
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:45:43 AM No.17848922
>>17848634
Persia and China did it first
Replies: >>17853167
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:45:47 AM No.17848924
>>17848642
>the Achaemenid empire
Wasn't actually very beuracratic when compared to Rome, in fact it was more loosey goosey with how it ran it's empire than the average empire. As long as you paid your taxes it didn't care much about what you did to the point different saitraps would go to war without a word from the shah himself.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:02:10 AM No.17849120
>>17848620 (OP)
You just described all ancient/classical empires. Feudalism unironically improved living conditions for large segments of the population.
Replies: >>17849128
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:10:20 AM No.17849128
>>17849120
Rome had the Plebeians Tribune, which sort of acted as a seperate legal assembly specifically for the lower classes, and it was setup this way as to give lower classes some agency over Roman politics but not enough to step on the shoes of the Patrician class who had their own higher assembly of non-elected richfags (The Senate) but the Senate still had power over the plebs, it was just mostly for the interests of the Roman elite. In a way this system can be seen as the predecessor to Feudalism
Replies: >>17849142
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:18:37 AM No.17849142
>>17849128
>it was just mostly for the interests of the Roman elite. In a way this system can be seen as the predecessor to Feudalism
An oligarchy is not a predecessor to Feudalism, otherwise every state in the ancient world from the Sumerians was a predecessor to Feudalism.
Replies: >>17851264
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:23:45 AM No.17849151
>>17848620 (OP)
>Compared to the modern era, Rome appears so primitive
>>constant political infighting and devastating civil wars
>>autocrats who are wantonly cruel or inept
this is bait right?
Replies: >>17849155
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:27:45 AM No.17849154
>>17848620 (OP)
>constant political infighting and devastating civil wars
You think it's better to be ruled by completely immunized meek globalist leaders?
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:27:52 AM No.17849155
>>17849151
Not everyone is a retarded Slavoid anon
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:28:53 AM No.17849158
festivvs maximvs
festivvs maximvs
md5: 0f00a4b0cdd3ee3784d994dd3df45857🔍
tldr, shill
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:43:01 AM No.17849178
>>17848620 (OP)
Yes it is overrated, before during and after there were tons other empires completely interchangeable with it.
But not even close to how overrated modern eurocuck empires which lasted barely a century and right now eurocucks have to lick american feet just to not get bowled over by Russia alone never mind other BRICS.
Replies: >>17849184
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:48:03 AM No.17849184
>>17849178
>and right now eurocucks have to lick american feet just to not get bowled over by Russia alone never mind other BRICS.
I don't speak third world retard, but I'm under the impression you think BRICS is some answer to NATO even though it's an economic alliance and not a defense/military alliance. Right now third worldists don't have an answer to NATO, the closest they have is the CSTO and maybe the CSO
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 11:48:56 AM No.17849186
Very overrated. It worked exactly the same as every other monarchical land empire before modern communication tech with plenty examples before it. The ONLY part with any claim to exceptionalism is the republican conquest state.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:39:50 PM No.17850121
>>17848634
You might argue about China but in the Western world the Romans definitely had the first state with a large organized government structure and a uniform code of laws, language, culture, state religion etc imposed across the empire.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:44:17 PM No.17850133
>>17848620 (OP)
Significantly underrated.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:49:19 PM No.17850152
>>17848623
This isn't true. I also just finished the entire Decline and Fall by Gibbon. He doesn't blame Christianity for it's fall, I don't know why that's falsely attributed to him. He does blame Christianity and German Barbarians for the destruction of the ancient statues and relics, but that's about it.
Replies: >>17850155
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 8:50:10 PM No.17850155
>>17850152
It was more implied than outright stated because England still had anti-blasphemy laws at that time.
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 9:04:56 PM No.17850192
>>17848666
Do we need to remind you of the Liao Whatever thread you did ? Also, show us your master's degree from berkeley

>didn't even try to refute the homosexuals allegations
lol
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 9:07:56 PM No.17850197
we dont hear too much criticism because the romans either genocided or assimiliated all their oppinents and erased as much negative histroy as possible. they were great nodount and achieved a lot but they were vile scumbags
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 9:09:21 PM No.17850200
89db697b86ef9d2dc2f23fef82537297
89db697b86ef9d2dc2f23fef82537297
md5: 25179e9904b6b0d25b70aaa6a23403fd🔍
>>17848620 (OP)
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 9:50:19 PM No.17850282
>>17848622
you are objectively the worst poster on /his/ I've seen in a long time. Even the retarded mestizo Cum Goenus wasn't guilty of spreading as much disinfo as all your posts. Jesus is the Truth, all attacks against historic Truths are attack on Him, antichrist
>t. christian catholic
Replies: >>17850372
Anonymous
7/17/2025, 10:26:44 PM No.17850372
>>17850282
>Even the retarded mestizo Cum Goenus wasn't guilty of spreading as much disinfo as all your posts
>>>/mu/127074863

Oh no he's back!
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 1:53:34 AM No.17850800
>>17848620 (OP)
The most overrated empire of all time is the Mongolian one.
>conquer tons of empty space
>fall apart
Replies: >>17851267
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:52:13 AM No.17850874
>>17848620 (OP)
>Compared to the modern era, Rome appears so primitive
>>constant political infighting and devastating civil wars
>>autocrats who are wantonly cruel or inept
>>huge wealth inequalities such that most of the population did nothing but beg and watch the chariot races all day
>>economy subsistent on agriculture and slavery
>>no scientific method or industry despite Greek “science”
>>repeat for 1000 years
That's why the Achaemenids were better.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 7:32:56 AM No.17851264
>>17849142
>An oligarchy is not a predecessor to Feudalism, otherwise every state in the ancient world from the Sumerians was a predecessor to Feudalism.
and we know this is absurd because ...
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 7:37:10 AM No.17851267
>>17850800
>>conquer tons of empty space
Persia? China? Eastern Europe? Incorrect.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 8:03:07 AM No.17851296
EMPEROR PEPENAX SIGHS
EMPEROR PEPENAX SIGHS
md5: 80d6a9217172d9216c593aeb13cadf35🔍
>>17848620 (OP)
>Compared to the modern era, Rome appears so primitive
>>constant political infighting and devastating civil wars
>>autocrats who are wantonly cruel or inept
>>huge wealth inequalities such that most of the population did nothing but beg and watch the chariot races all day
>>economy subsistent on agriculture and slavery
>>no scientific method or industry despite Greek “science”
>>repeat for 1000 years

Great Caesar's Ghost.

Another ignoramus 'But what have the Romans done for us?' thread...
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:16:46 PM No.17851758
>>17848622
this has to be false-flagging atheist bait to make christians look bad. Most retarded take I've ever seen
>t. also a christian catholic
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:20:15 PM No.17851765
>>17848675
it tends to be overlooked because everything after the crisis of the 3rd century gets massively oversimplified by history as "the period where rome collapsed" even though it endured for a full two centuries after (and arguably never really "disappeared", just slowly mutated into what would become medieval europe. A fuckton of incredibly interesting stuff happened. It also doesn't help that reliable sources for the period compared to the centuries before and after are scant, imagine the kino if we had sources for majorian as detailed, reliable and numerous as those we have for augustus
Replies: >>17851774 >>17853702
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:28:02 PM No.17851774
>>17851765
>A fuckton of incredibly interesting stuff happened
That, I would say, is the era of suspicion. Everything starting in the 4th century is suspect.
Replies: >>17851968
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:34:24 PM No.17851789
>>17848747
This nigga is retarded
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:44:06 PM No.17851805
>>17848747
He literally just made this up. Try to look up the quote. Lmaooooooo what in the literal fuck is this guys problem?
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 2:51:14 PM No.17851814
yeah it was a corrupt bureoucratic shithole
Replies: >>17851966
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:26:07 PM No.17851966
faciem meam cum
faciem meam cum
md5: a784a67fece9248e133d7dc739c5c27d🔍
>>17851814
guards, send this nigga to the arena
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:27:28 PM No.17851968
russian with among us backpack
russian with among us backpack
md5: 4e47c91231116327801eb11487974973🔍
>>17851774
could you elaborate on what you mean? as in, people at the time were more suspicious of each other? or as in, the historical sources we have are more suspicious?
Replies: >>17851987 >>17851998
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:31:58 PM No.17851972
The Roman Empire is overrated

1. Mighty military?

Couldn’t survive without constant conquest, plunder and new slaves
Once the expansion stopped, everything started to crumble

Even They couldn’t recruit enough legionaries from their own citizens, so they ended up enlisting ‘barbarians’ from the frontiers and those very people later brought down the Roman Empire

2. Refined culture?

Average Romans were illiterate, entertained by blood sports
Poetry and philosophy? Just Greek knock offs for aristocrats
Roman aesthetics were half stolen, half steroid pumped versions of Greek art.

3. Wealthy economy?

Couldn’t function without slaves. Real economic engine was slave labor, not innovation
Why invest in tech if you can just buy more slaves? When conquest slowed, so did the slave supply, and the economy crashed

4. Civilizers?

Actually conquerors and destroyers
for stealing land, destroying cultures, and selling people into slavery
Also The idea that Rome civilized barbarians reflects a colonial mindset

In short, Romantic fantasy made by later Europeans
Renaissance scholars idealized Rome to look more glorious themselves
The real Roman Empire, by today’s standards, was a war-addicted state and a half-baked civilization that couldn’t survive without slavery
Replies: >>17851983 >>17851992
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:41:09 PM No.17851983
1601138012864
1601138012864
md5: df50efe6e5e54285993dd33a90c39691🔍
>>17851972
holy midwit
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:42:36 PM No.17851987
>>17851968
The rise of Christianity is of dubious character in the early 4th century. Take Constantine the Great. Everyone knows the story of the Milvian bridge where he led his troops to fight based on a chi-rho symbol in the sky which guided him to sure victory, or if you're an American mason then it was a cross. Constantine became the first real official Christian and makes his infamous Donation of Constantine which was most officially debunked by the 17th century. Now aside from that donation of the western empire to the church being invented by Catholics themselves, everything else might have been a fabrication as well. You may recall that every other emperor up to his point is treated like an enemy by the Christians, even those that were particularly friendly such as Philip the Arab, who some argue was the actual first Christian emperor. What I think happened is that Christians realized they needed heroes in the Roman texts and started fabricating things in their medieval ecclesiastical histories. Most of our conventional, rock-solid Roman history comes from the 3rd century and before but it is shocking how many works from the 4th century onward *only* come from Christian sources.

What makes Constantine an unlikely Christian is that he's coming off of the heels of Diocletian who led the first truly great repressive period on the Christians in favor of defending traditional Roman religion. His father was a strong ally of Diocletian. It doesn't make sense for him to be so militantly Christian when his father was so militantly anti-Christian, and as we have already seen proven, there was already serious fabricating going on with Constantine. But we could go further- everything about Theodosius I is strung together from narratives of previous emperors. He's a reunifier like Aurelian by restoring order in the rim territories, he is a militant Christian like the fictionalized versions of Constantine I, he is a tyrant slayer like Pupienus... (cont.)
Replies: >>17851998 >>17852027
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:45:54 PM No.17851992
>>17851972
First of all, ChatGPT
Second of all,
>Mighty military?
>Couldn’t survive without constant conquest, plunder and new slaves
>Once the expansion stopped, everything started to crumble
the Roman military was still unmatched on the field tho, the Battle of the Catalaunian Plains is proof of it despite severe lack of ethnic Romans in its ranks.
>Average Romans were illiterate, entertained by blood sports
>Poetry and philosophy? Just Greek knock offs for aristocrats
>Roman aesthetics were half stolen, half steroid pumped versions of Greek art.
The first one is hardly surprising, modern people watch very realistic fake bloodsport all the time via digital media. The two other points have nothing to do with whether or not the culture is refined or not. So what if it is originally Greek?
>3. Wealthy economy?
>Couldn’t function without slaves. Real economic engine was slave labor, not innovation
>Why invest in tech if you can just buy more slaves? When conquest slowed, so did the slave supply, and the economy crashed
Rome still sat on a gigantic trade nexus and used it as leverage to meaintain the economy. The slave population in the Roman Emprie stayed relatively stable. What are you talking about?
>inb4 still slave economy
Yes, but then again most economies until the Early Modern Era functionned through forced labor because of agricultural yield limitations. It's hardly the fault of the Roman they had to either institute slavery or serfdom.
>4. Civilizers?
>Actually conquerors and destroyers
for stealing land, destroying cultures, and selling people into slavery
But they did. The amount of literal cities in their conquered Europe either stayed marginally the same, which isn't about the civilizing aspect but imperialism then, but Quadrupled in certain regions. They literally CIVILIZED, built cities, in wildernesses.
>Also The idea that Rome civilized barbarians reflects a colonial mindset
Cultural subjectivist L take.
Replies: >>17852072
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 4:48:42 PM No.17851998
>>17851968
>>17851987
I'll try to shorten this up a bit: my point is that everything we have from the early empire, the first half called the principate, is traditional Greco-Roman history. It's solid, it fits the material evidence, narratives are authentically surprising when something strange does occur, and while there is enormous amounts of propaganda (especially concerning figures like Nero), for the most part it fits the suit. But when we get the to 4th century we are no longer getting traditional Roman histories. They are written differently. Explicitly they are called church histories or ecclesiastical histories. Miracles suddenly become common place, politics takes a back seat to what is happening within the church, figures who defy the Christian deity are warned or shamed with bolts of lightning as if to echo Jupiter but in cheap fashion. The histories themselves are of an unrefined, simplistic character. The propaganda is not only bold but requires the participant to already agree with the propositions because of how wacky some of it gets. The histories after the 4th century are, simply put, not Roman but instead Christian. Tone, substance, argument methods, concerns, values- all different. And that is reflected when we get to what appear at first to be outrageous shifts in culture of emperors whom, up until this point, we expect to act in the Roman way. The mold they seem to be cast from in these Christian histories are entirely divorced, however. One of the biggest culprits of this historical revisionism is Orosius.
Replies: >>17852027
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:02:36 PM No.17852027
>>17851998
>>17851987
I suspect you might be coming at this from an anti-christian angle which I'm suspicious of as a catholic but I don't disagree with any of what you're saying per se, are there any good books on this subjects you'd recommend? One of my greatest worries in life is the extent to which our modern perception of history has been, and may have been, manipulated, and how that leads to a state of effectively historical dementia for people living today.
Replies: >>17852091
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:28:28 PM No.17852072
>>17851992
1. One battle doesn’t prove systemic strength. The fact that Rome had to rely heavily on foreign mercenaries and federated <barbarians> by the 5th century is precisely evidence of its military decay. An empire that once prided itself on discipline and Roman identity ended up outsourcing its own defense. that’s not unmatched strength, that’s survival mode.

2. Equating Roman arena killings to modern digital media is a false analogy. we(now world) don’t actually execute people for public amusement. But Romans did. As for the Greek influence: it's not about purity, but originality. Rome’s cultural legacy is exaggerated when its most celebrated art, literature, and architecture are often direct copies or appropriations of Greek models without the same philosophical depth.

3. That trade network depended on military security and expansion, which failed in the long run. And even if the slave population was <stable the economic model> was not. It discouraged innovation, created stagnant class systems, and collapsed under its own weight once the flow of new slaves slowed. Stability in numbers means little when the system itself is rotten.

4. That trade network depended on military security and expansion, which failed in the long run. And even if the slave population was "stable" the economic model was not. It discouraged innovation, created stagnant class systems, and collapsed under its own weight once the flow of new slaves slowed. Stability in numbers means little when the system itself is rotten

5. Many societies used forced labor. But few empires were as unapologetically dependent on mass enslavement as Rome. The key point is how much Rome relied on it at the expense of sustainable development. Others moved on, Rome didn’t! That’s not an excuse, that’s a flaw.
Replies: >>17852078 >>17852085 >>17852104
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:32:17 PM No.17852078
>>17852072
1st supplement

Calling the Roman military <unmatched> is more myth than fact. They lost plenty of battles. Teutoburg Forest, Carrhae, Adrianople... often against less equipped forces.

Also their success relied heavily on outnumbering, brutal discipline, and an endless supply of fresh troops from conquered peoples. The Battle of the Catalaunian Plains wasn't a purely Roman victory either — it was a coalition effort, not some shining display of Roman supremacy. If anything, it shows how diluted and dependent their military had become.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:36:59 PM No.17852085
>>17852072
no.1 supplement

Calling the Roman military <unmatched> is more myth than fact. They lost plenty of battles. Teutoburg Forest, Carrhae, Adrianople often against less equipped forces.

Even at its height, the Roman military was far from purely Roman auxiliary units made up of non-citizens and so-called <barbarians> often outnumbered legionaries.

Their success relied heavily on outnumbering, brutal discipline, and an endless supply of fresh troops from conquered peoples. For example, the Batavians, a Germanic tribe Rome considered inferior, were one of the most elite auxiliary forces, crucial in campaigns like the conquest of Britain.

The Battle of the Catalaunian Plains wasn't a purely Roman victory either. it was a coalition effort, not some shining display of Roman supremacy. If anything, it shows how diluted and dependent their military had become.
Replies: >>17852092 >>17852093
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:37:41 PM No.17852087
H.G. Wells in Outline of History eviscerated the RE as an oppressive corrupt and intellectually stagnant slave state.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:40:19 PM No.17852091
>>17852027
>are there any good books on this subjects you'd recommend
Not a single one. You just have to read through Orosius, Gildas, Bede, all the rest of it and see for yourself. Instead of just taking what they're saying, ask yourself what their motivation for recording a certain thing is. Gildas constantly chides the British for being wretched and actively enjoys their suffering but at the same time insists that they're good Christians and that he's one of them. It's sick-but that's what you're getting into.

There's weird stuff too. Like the whole persecution complex really picked up steam with the 5th century writers and Orosius even celebrates the ten great anti-Christian persecutions, but when you read Gildas he says that anyone who opposed the professors of Christ would face legal repercussions, as if Christianity were a state protected religion, from the time of Tiberias to Diocletian. Obviously you've got to decide for yourself what to make of all this.

You really cannot trust anyone else to do the interpreting for you. Just pick up any "ecclesiastical history" from a medieval or late classical source (400s-900s especially) and see for yourself.
Replies: >>17852110
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:41:20 PM No.17852092
>>17852085
You're dealing with an idiot. It's better to let him be.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:43:57 PM No.17852093
>>17852085
The Roman army mostly ceased being ethnic Italians by the late republic as their territory expanded and more and more legions were recruited locally from the border regions.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:51:02 PM No.17852104
>>17852072
>1.
You have not given a single evidence as to why relying on those actually degraded the military capabilities of Rome. I can give you one, a geopolitical one, in that those same foederatis could demand and did demand physical compensation for their work - which roman soldiers already did in the form of salary instead of land and titles - but those aren't MILITARY deficiencies
>2. [About bloodsport]
The point is that our high entertainment still relies on bloodsport, if only illusionary. Rome severely regulated that type of entertainment in the same way we regulate media in order to avoid IRL gore and abuse. The most they could do to satisfy the public's craving for bloodsport, unlike US with digital media, is that they either had to use slaves, or purely volunteers. By the time of the splitting on the empire after Theodosius, the fights were also phased out by massive donations instead for racing, which was tremendously popular in the Eastern Roman Empire.
>2. [About culture]
Rome's cultural sophistication often is lauded for their authorships in historical treatises, poetry, political apologies, and legal sciences. You just nitpick the elements of "culture" which are or are not laudable in your eyes arbitrarily. Authors like Ovid are still studied to this day for a reason.
>3.
You have not given a reason why exactly Rome's economy needed to skyrocket. I could argue "soldier's wage", but again the military switched models to instead - theoretically, Theodosius did my boy Alaric dirty - granting fiefdoms and positions in the hierarchy to their mainly foederati-heavy armies.
>4.
AI slop repeating itself due to its pea-brained language model
>5.
Rome didn't "move on" because the Western Half collapsed before it did, and Diocletian basically already did most of the legwork by developing manorial serfdom in the first place as an alternative economic model for the development of the coloniae.
Slavery was to be slowly phased out but the Empire died before.
Replies: >>17852142
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 5:53:20 PM No.17852110
>>17852091
The rise of Christianity was an effect rather than cause of the RE's decline as Gibbon et al postulated. In the increasingly unstable, uncertain times that were developing its messianic beliefs and promise of a hereafter were very very sellable to people.
Replies: >>17852125
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:02:20 PM No.17852125
>>17852110
My working theory is that Christianity led a mass slave and popular revolt sometimes in the mid 4th century and wiped out Roman culture wholesale. There was no soft-passive transition but rather an abrupt end to continuity that required engineering a new type of history to favorably allow the Christians to feign pacifism and victimhood without taking responsibility for the destruction of Europe. Goths coming to power in Rome actually starts in the Gothic war during Theodosius' time, and that may be a result of the transition of power being handled poorly by the Christian upstarts. Likewise, it's why some old power dynasties like the Anthemius family became notable Christians as it allowed them to maintain their grasp on family estates and liquid wealth.
Replies: >>17852152
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:09:39 PM No.17852142
>>17852104
1. The degradation wasn't instant, but structural. When Rome became dependent on foederati non roman tribal groups for essential defense, it surrendered both strategic autonomy and internal cohesion.

The Battle of Adrianople is the clearest evidence: Rome admitted the Goths as foederati, mismanaged them, and then suffered one of its worst defeats in history.

This reliance shifted military initiative away from Rome to tribal leaders the very <barbarian> chiefs rome once scorned whose loyalty was transactional, not ideological and this proved fatal, because rome ultimately fell at the hands of those same barbarians.

2. Digital bloodsport is simulated and consent-based. But Roman arenas involved real human deaths, often of slaves and prisoners with no agency. Regulation wasn't a sign of moral progress. it was damage control for public unrest and religious pushback.

Also, the transition to chariot racing didn't replace brutality with culture. it just redirected mass hysteria into different forms, like the Nika Riots, which killed tens of thousands. The point isn’t that Rome lacked all culture. but that its dominant popular culture thrived on institutional violence, unlike the symbolic violence of today.
Replies: >>17852146 >>17852147
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:10:40 PM No.17852146
>>17852142
3. Rome's literary legacy is dwarfed by the Greek canon it emulated. For every Ovid, there’s a Homer, a Sophocles, an Aristotle. Roman culture often served imperial propaganda rather than independent thought, even its greatest works were filtered through a political lens

4. The argument isn’t about <needing to skyrocket>

It’s about how Rome chose not to innovate because slavery made it unnecessary. The lack of incentive for labor-saving technology meant Rome was economically stagnant compared to other ancient civilizations like Han China. Even its military logistics lacked innovation compared to what could’ve been achieved. Also, the fief system that emerged later wasn’t innovation.

it was a sign of systemic breakdown, replacing civic-based institutions with feudal fragmentation.

5. That’s not progress that’s collapse management. Slavery wasn’t phased out because of Roman morality, but because the economic engine supporting it was failing.

Diocletian and Constantine didn’t end slavery they reshaped it into serfdom, binding laborers to land under harsh conditions. This wasn’t ethical advancement but a desperate pivot to sustain control under decaying institutions. The empire ddn’t outgrow slavery it just <<<rebranded>>> it.
Replies: >>17852451
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:11:15 PM No.17852147
>>17852142
>When Rome became dependent on foederati non roman tribal groups
This happened immediately after the Samnite war. You're ignorant.
Replies: >>17852160
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:14:14 PM No.17852152
>>17852125
>without taking responsibility for the destruction of Europe
what was destructed? my country didn't even have literacy until Christian era our history only begin with Christianization in 10th century.
Replies: >>17852154 >>17852159 >>17852168
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:16:00 PM No.17852154
>>17852152
The fact you don't know your country's history prior to the Christians is proof they erased it. You are praising your abuser.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:17:31 PM No.17852159
>>17852152
Why do Slavs think their opinion matters or that they were even actually part of Europe instead of the westernmost part of Asia anyway?
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:17:43 PM No.17852160
>>17852147
Dude... That's completely inaccurate. The Samnite Wars were in the 4th century BCE, during the early Roman Republic

Rome had long incorporated non roman peoples into its military, especially through auxiliaries. But what began as structured and subordinated inclusion in the early empire eventually turned into outright dependence on foreign tribal armies with their own leadersespecially during the late Empire
Replies: >>17852167
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:21:01 PM No.17852167
>>17852160
>what began as structured and subordinated inclusion
They were always dependent on their socii. You're saying this didn't happen until the Gothic wars but this was happening five hundred years earlier in the Punic wars. That's why those wars were such a big deal. They started by realigning Sicily. Socii played a pivotal role since the Samnites and Umbrians fought with the Romans to the point they felt they were Romans.
Replies: >>17852210 >>17852211
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:21:09 PM No.17852168
>>17852152
Poland?
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:24:58 PM No.17852173
truth is most of Europe in general didn't have literacy until Roman conquest or Christianity
Replies: >>17852177
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:26:34 PM No.17852177
>>17852173
We wouldn't know. Christians destroyed everything pagan.
Replies: >>17852185 >>17852871
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:34:17 PM No.17852185
>>17852177
That was before Christianization. Iberia, the Balkans, Britain were all conquered and Romanized by the 1st century AD and all were pre-literate peoples prior to that. Truth is the Romans well before the Christian era actively paved over local cultures.
Replies: >>17852204
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:43:32 PM No.17852204
>>17852185
Even in areas they didn't directly control. The Norse gods were just Roman gods that Germanic traders brought back home and modified for their local culture.
Replies: >>17853233
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:46:00 PM No.17852210
>>17852167
nta but Central Italians played a very different role in Republican society than Germanic warlords did in the Late Empire. Central Italians shared a culture, society, political culture. religion, their languages were similar and they had the same goals and shared an overarching 'Italian' identity. They were essentially independent from the Roman state but they all wanted it to succeed, because they were all in it together and both got what they wanted from it. You can see this even during the Second Punic war, even at their lowest nearly all of the Central Italians stuck with Rome. They had nothing to gain from the dismantling of Roman dominance over the region.

Germanic warlords had almost the exact opposite relationship. Most of them were completely independent and invaded the Empire against their will. They absolutely rejected Roman rule and the Romans obviously did not trust them because of it. Germanic peoples took from the state and attempted to extort it when they could. It was a zero sum game, only one party can win here. Peoples like the Vandals, Seubi and Goths maintained their independence and all but the Visigoths didn't even pretend to be 'allies' of the Roman state
Replies: >>17853261
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 6:46:54 PM No.17852211
>>17852167
You're a little right that Rome relied on socii early on, like the Samnites and Umbrians. But there's a key difference

socii were integrated under Roman command and gradually absorbed into Roman citizenship and identity. Their loyalty was shaped by a shared political destiny.

In contrast, the foederati of the late Empire were autonomous tribal groups frequently former enemies of Rome and, to stress it once more, their allegiance remained entirely transactional.

Rome didn’t command them but negotiated with them. This wasn't partnership but dependence. That’s why the Empire eventually fell to the very barbarian tribes it once looked down upon.
Replies: >>17853261
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 7:35:56 PM No.17852280
As others said the army was mostly composed of non-Italians by the late republic and the elite Roman families became increasingly detached from war and lost their martial prowess. The army turned into people in it for pay and plunder with no loyalty except to an emperor who was a successful battlefield commander.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 8:40:46 PM No.17852451
>>17852146
>It’s about how Rome chose not to innovate because slavery made it unnecessary.
Slavery doesnt make innovation unnecessary. That is midwit Marxism take.
For example despite slaves Romans still employed draft animals to pull cargo. Because draft animals diet consist of hay for a large part and hays is massively cheaper than grain. Romans built massive infrastructure projects like roads to reduce costs of transportation. Why don't they just carried all cargo by slaves over dirt road hurr durr? (How Marx can explain that.?)
But at sane time Romans had no horseshoe and horse collar and these inventions at minimum half land transportation costs. Romans thinked and acted big but not smart.
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 8:47:00 PM No.17852464
>>17848620 (OP)
>uses roman domes
>uses roman archways
>uses roman ballbeirings for machines
>uses roman 3 branch government
>uses roman alphabet to type his shitposts
>uses literally caesars calendar to celebrate gis birthday

...yeah bros... im starting to think this Roman Empire thing is over rated, i am more a wang dynasty man myself...
Replies: >>17852634 >>17852649
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 9:44:41 PM No.17852634
1643637263048
1643637263048
md5: 0086fea648097c8ba4dde7f81270275b🔍
>>17852464
you also forgot
>uses roman derived language
>uses roman derived legal system (this is arguably one of their top legacies alongside architecture)
>uses roman derived calendar (and many modified roman holidays)
>uses roman names for children
>uses roman military structure (including tactics, unit breakdown, training regimen and career model)
and I'm sure I'm forgetting much more
Replies: >>17852640 >>17852649
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 9:46:55 PM No.17852640
>>17852634
oh also
>uses and inhabits roman-founded and developed major european cities and ports
>uses roman trade and transport routes (often to the point where many modern roads follow ancient roman roads 1:1 but just with upgrades over time to modern standards)
>uses roman building materials and principles
THE LIST GOES ON
Replies: >>17852649
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/18/2025, 9:49:09 PM No.17852649
>>17852464

>>17852634

>>17852640

All of that glory came from Christian Rome. Pagan Rome was Neolithic-tier.
Replies: >>17852657 >>17852668
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 9:51:03 PM No.17852657
>>17852649
>All of that glory came from Christian Rome.
Ah yes, Gaius Julius Ceasar, inventor of the Julian calendar, lived 100 to 44 BC, the very famous Christian dictator of Rome

Get the fuck out of here, Simon, you fucking tranny
Replies: >>17852663
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/18/2025, 9:53:12 PM No.17852663
>>17852657

Actually, we were wrong about Christ's birth. He was actually born in 213 BC, new archaeological evidence purports.
Replies: >>17852671 >>17852673
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 9:54:36 PM No.17852668
>>17852649
Like I said earlier - I'm a proud roman catholic, but you're a stain on our religion, you fucking midwit.
Replies: >>17852677
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 9:55:36 PM No.17852671
>>17852663
do mods even enforce the
>trolling outside of /b/
rule anymore?
Replies: >>17854950
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/18/2025, 9:56:03 PM No.17852673
>>17852663

Berg, et al. "The birth record of Jesus and supporting archaeological evidence" (Mar 2024).
Replies: >>17852700
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/18/2025, 9:57:32 PM No.17852677
>>17852668

How am I a stain? My name literally means "listening saves", and I had multiple dreams about giving sermons, etc. from 7-16. God anointed me.
Replies: >>17852699
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 10:03:54 PM No.17852699
buc nasty
buc nasty
md5: 26a948a337b08168235edccadfa768ee🔍
>>17852677
so why don't you live up to your name by shutting the fuck up and listening a little
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 10:04:03 PM No.17852700
>>17852673
nigga your article doesn't exist, did you shit a title hoping I wouldn't look? I used 4 search engines for this shit and nothing close to what you're referencing comes up
Anonymous
7/18/2025, 10:05:20 PM No.17852706
can someone elaborate on what simon cuckva has been doing for the past month plus and why hes here?
Replies: >>17852711
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/18/2025, 10:06:27 PM No.17852711
>>17852706

A month+? I've only been here since last week. You must be mistaken.
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/18/2025, 11:01:26 PM No.17852871
>>17852177

Good.
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 12:50:44 AM No.17853167
>>17848922
Assyria did it before Persia.
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 1:12:29 AM No.17853233
>>17852204
What's the evidence for this?
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 1:21:16 AM No.17853261
>>17852210
The Germans were bound by familial oaths, that's what made them different. What were talking about isn't the weakness of Rome but the strength of the Germans.
>>17852211
>In contrast, the foederati of the late Empire were autonomous tribal groups frequently former enemies of Rome
It was always that way. Rome defeated most of the socii. Foederati and socii may well have been synonyms. Rome fought the Samnites and Umbrians.
>Rome didn’t command them but negotiated with them
Turning the tables was a German thing. It wasn't like Romans suddenly had a bad system, the Germans knew they could cooperate.
Replies: >>17854979
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 5:15:12 AM No.17853702
>>17851765
>, imagine the kino if we had sources
Specifically good sources too. I think its Libanius but there's this guy from the fourth century with thousands of surviving letters. But 80% of them are just the ancient version of letters of reccomendation for the Imperial bureaucracy and most of the rest are just generic letters sent to friends with little mention of contemporary events. I mean it makes sense that most letters you write will be stuff like that but its funny in a tragic sort of way that a letter supporting Flavius Flaviolus Flavianus' application to be a scribe to the Governor of Bithynia survived but half of Ammianus Marcellinus' history did not.
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 6:46:54 AM No.17853815
>>17848622
Google Honorius.
Replies: >>17853961
Simon Salva - Apostle to the 4channers !tMhYkwTORI
7/19/2025, 8:21:09 AM No.17853961
>>17853815

?
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 6:41:12 PM No.17854950
>>17852671
Only if you trigger them. Half the retards are probably jannies anyways. Its best to ignore all nigger faggots
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 6:50:36 PM No.17854979
>>17853261
>The Germans were bound by familial oaths
Most Germanic peoples did not have any sense of succession or strong family ties or even a tribe identity until the end of the Roman West. What do you even mean by that? If you just mean clans, plenty still existed in Rome.
>that's what made them different
The differences between Rome's Central Italian allies and the Germanic peoples invading the Empire centuries later couldn't be any more different. 'familial oaths' are meaningless. The Vandals weren't tied by anything other than the success of their leaders, mainly just Gaiseric, they wanted nothing to do with the Roman state, they constantly made war with them and spited them. The Samnites despite fierce rivalry with Rome cooperated and actively joined in on the project of conquest and war through all of their cultural ties
Replies: >>17855134
Anonymous
7/19/2025, 7:51:38 PM No.17855134
>>17854979
>Most Germanic peoples did not have any sense of succession or strong family ties or even a tribe identity until the end of the Roman West. What do you even mean by that? If you just mean clans, plenty still existed in Rome.

Here, from Bede:
>"Of these Horsa was afterwards slain in battle by the Britons, and a monument, bearing his name, is still in existence in the eastern parts of Kent. They were the sons of Victgilsus, whose father was Vitta, son of Vecta, son of Woden"
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/38326/38326-h/38326-h.html

My annotated version includes an excerpt on the all the tribes that traced their descent to Odin.
Anonymous
7/20/2025, 6:58:37 AM No.17856593
>>17848620 (OP)
Maybe.
Anonymous
7/20/2025, 7:17:09 AM No.17856614
>>17848620 (OP)
at what point did you realize that ancient Greece was the better civilization than ancient Rome?