If only Chaing could see China today. It would send this chud into a raging psychosis.

>>17854272 (OP)
>still cant invade Taiwan
kek

>>17854272 (OP)
Actually, I bet he'd hate Taiwan's current government more than China's at this point. Taiwan would be completely foreign to him if he was magically revived today.

I really don't think he'd have much of a problem with it

>>17854281
you don't get it. that was HIS china to build.

>>17854280

Taiwanese current government shit all over Chiang legacy and he’s basically viewed as a pariah by anyone under 30

>>17854284
>that was HIS china to build
What did he do for Taiwan exact? The economic boom happened under his son, and he didn't turn Taiwan into a democracy either. He disappeared a shit load of people and basically viewed the island as a base for retaking the mainland up until his death.

But how would Yat Sen react?

>>17854272 (OP)
>>17854330
More likely than enraged they would be in utter awe, sing some praises to the communist party, then demand Taiwan fall in line

>>17854289
Is Taiwanese society also experiencing something comparable to the Western rise of brown zoomers?

>>17854353
>sing some praises to the communist party
Do you, like, know the first thing about Kai-Shek?

>>17854404
Do you?

>>17854272 (OP)
Why? His vision was achieved, just not with his party. He'd think that communism lost, and ultimately the ideals of the KMT won.

>>17854353
Sun would since he was very socialist. Chaing would seethe publicly, but feel envy internally

>>17854330
Sun Yat Sen was pretty ideologically malleable, I doubt he'd care *how* China unfucked itself, as long as it did

>>17854330
"based"

>>17854330
Fucking why couldn't it have been him bros?
Mao was retarded, Chiang was a freak.

It should have been Sun. His idea of socialism, combined with his idea of pan-Chinese nationalism is simply the best of both worlds.

>>17854412
Between the Japanese and the Communists, which one was compared to a heart disease?

>>17854479
The joke is that the image is Sun, retard

>>17854272 (OP)
The best period of china post imperial family was the funny warlords.

>>17854488
Anon said "they", not "he". That means Sun plus Chiang

>>17854479
He compared them to a heart disease because he thought they would bring China to ruin. If he saw how powerful they made China just a few decades after his death he would begrudgingly kneel.

>>17854272 (OP)
Modern day China is exactly what Chiang always dreamed it would be. The only people who pretend the KMT would have any issues with the state capitalist model are glownigger Eglin faggots whose idea of a "prosperous China" is one subservient to the West filled with niggers and trannies in ever major city.

>>17854469
Why do libfags pretend PRC ain’t nationalistic?

>>17854579
they/them

>>17854272 (OP)
KMT and CCP are two sides of the same coin. Being liberated by Japan was China’s last hope

>>17854277
chinks can’t even take Kinmen LMAO

>>17854644
It’s impossible for communists to be nationalists

>>17854627
>If he saw how powerful they made China just a few decades after his death he would begrudgingly kneel.
Exceeeept, China became powerful only once it accepted it would only be nominally communist.
After 30 years of Mao rule they were so pathetically weak they lost a war against Vietnam
>but it was just a border skirmish
No, the operation was meant to liberate Kampuchea

Current china seems more in line with Chaing then Mao, he’s probably smiling down on Xi

>>17854754
China, north Korea,Erithrea are what then?

>>17854272 (OP)
Why?

>>17854272 (OP)
>“One can imagine Chiang Kai-shek’s ghost wandering around China today nodding in approval,” Oxford historian Rana Mitter wrote in his Modern China, “while Mao’s ghost follows behind him, moaning at the destruction of his vision.”
Though I think that's still a fairly reductive way of looking at it.
https://lateralthinkingtechnology.wordpress.com/2022/08/03/whose-party-state-is-it-anyway-the-republican-period-the-war-and-peanut-vs-monkey-king/

>>17855203
Interesting read, thanks. I wish I had the energy to start going in depth for chinese history, but it seems too gargantuan a task.

>>17854633
You’re concentrating too much on material prospects and less on values. Chiang would be alienated by modern China’s marxism and erasure of Chinese history.

>>17855742
>modern China
>erasure of Chinese history
why are you pretending that today's China is run the same way that it was during the cultural revolution? this is like bringing up segregation as if it applies to the way america is run today, just because the political system is nominally the same doesn't mean its policies are

>>17855203
>while Mao’s ghost follows behind him, moaning at the destruction of his vision.
Doubtful. Mao like Stalin wasn't very dogmatic.
His vision was all about self criticism.

>>17855742
>modern China’s marxism
Did you know that Chinese history actually keeps going after Mao died, anon? You should keep reading the next page.

>>17855813
China and the CPC are still very much communist. i would recommend reading Xi's The Governance of China. Guy is a hardcore commie. Their economy being more akin to state capitalism with socialist elements has more to do with bringing the country up to western standards of living. Socialism is not poverty after all.

>>17855793
So why does modern China feel the need to police their temples and continue to use materialistic Marxist thinking in their cultural sphere if modern China, under the governance of the CCP, is so in line with Chiang’s vision? What is stopping them from reimplementing Confucian doctrine the way Chiang did when the Nationalists ran China? And speaking of the “cultural revolution”, the event is still taught in China as a liberation rather than thought policing. Mao is still on the currency. Modern China has nothing culturally in common with Nationalist China.

>>17855827
Xi is a nationalist, han supremacist, has spoken fondly of Confucian ideals, and although a Marxist leninist, chiang himself was fond of Lenin, a sovereign market based nationalist china is what chiang would be looking for anyways, maybe you can say it dosent bring in the past enough today, but big picture it’s about his ideal

>>17855827
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_ideology_of_the_Kuomintang

Isn't ironic that CCP China today is basically what the KMT was 50 years ago?

>>17855967
>ChatGPT screenshot
Read a book faggot

>>17854754
Read Internationalism and Nationalism by Liu Shaoqi, and Patriotism and Internationalism by Mao Zedong.

>>17854469
>Why couldn't it be this idealistic American born Chinese who couldn't into politics or military?

>>17854272 (OP)
If he was somehow still alive and in power he'd have negotiated Taiwan's reunification with the mainland under a one country, two systems arrangement decades ago. Modern Taiwanese don't even like him and the KMT is much friendlier to the CPC and mainland China than the DPP.

>>17854754
It's impossible for Americans to be intelligent

>>17855827
>So why does modern China feel the need to police their temples and continue to use materialistic Marxist thinking in their cultural sphere if modern China, under the governance of the CCP, is so in line with Chiang’s vision?
That's not Chiang's vision, nor did he implement "confucian" government. Only the Qing did, and they collapsed as a result. Wanting to be ruled by 3rd century BC Chinese ideologies instead of enlightenment European ones is colossally retarded. Fukuzawa Yukichi was right about confucius and ancient Chinese culture, like it or not.
>What is stopping them from reimplementing Confucian doctrine
Not being retarded
>the way Chiang did when the Nationalists ran China?
Lmfao

>>17854750
china would obliterate your shithole

>>17854644
Because the "nation" is whatever the party decides it is, as opposed to some vaguely objective bundle of traditions and culture like in normal nationalism.
It's George Orwell-style nationalism

>>17857607
>some vaguely objective bundle of traditions and culture like in normal nationalism
The majority of countries in this world were made up and didn't exist 100 years ago. There's tons of Pakistani nationalists even though Pakistan is objectively the fakest country in existence.

>>17857978
All countries are "made up" in some way, in that their borders are kind-of sort-of believable but never completely objective.
But don't fall for the continuum fallacy of something being either completely plausible or fully arbitrary

>>17857607
Go on then, what’s the actual China supposed to be? That the CCP took away from us?

>>17858515
He's either referring to an imaginary China that only exists in his headcanon of Chiang kai shek, or Qing China which got BTFO'd by modern powers in every way.

>>17858277
The majority of countries today are faker than anything George Orwell or whoever could imagine. I've seen "emirati patriots". Like you're proud of being born into a square drawn by the British. What is even going on. Europe isn't exempt from this either. Ukraine is a largely made up country yet Ukrainian nationalism has been obnoxious amongst their diaspora in Canada way before the war even started.
But yeah to have a country you need a state and government, and so it's always the state that defined the country. No one actually knew wtf a "Germany" was until von Bismarck, leading an army, told everyone what Germany was, and everyone just agreed.

>>17854644
Because Mao was retarded, he was simply too retarded to actually be nationalistic. He valued little the lives of his subjects, he would make offhand jokes about how China could lose half it's population and still have 300 million people to do his agrarian socialism or whatever the fuck. A man like that isn't nationalistic, he cares little about his nation, he is just raw ambition animate.

>>17857607
>as opposed to some vaguely objective bundle of traditions and culture
What do you think all the Chinese festivals are about? Why do you think Chinese people still obsess over filial piety?
Chinese traditions are actually incredibly enduring which is why they've been preserved under multiple foreign dynasties.

>>17856453
Enlightenment European ideas drew heavily from the ancient Greek world. It's not insane to think you could adapt Confucianism to a modern society because modern societies in the West are still studying Plato and Aristotle for similar reasons. The family as a model for the state is part of Confucian teaching and is quite sensible and occurs even in Western discourse.

>>17856449
I’m not American

>>17855002
communist

>>17856398
>read Mao Zedong
Mao was a retard lol

>>17855813
wait what it does

>>17854754
they can, it's just a very schizophrenic kind of nationalism

>>17854272 (OP)
I can see him actually being pretty proud of China being so powerful and influential nowadays

>>17856446
He was born in China though