>the cross in the middle of the ball represents the brow line
>oh no wait no it doesn't it's the eyes i guess LOL good luck /beg/s!!!
why is andy such a fucking hack

>>7639221 (OP)
You're supposed to draw a cross?

The thing is that high level artists don't actually use this bullshit, instead they do it by instinct. Loomis is trying to explain his thought process to /beg/s, but it's hard to be consistent when extracting tacit knowledge.
So yeah, basically just suck it up and don't think too hard about it.

>>7639221 (OP)
is supposed to represent anything you want buddy, its just a guide to feature placement, you can put the line 10 meters above if you wish as long as you remember you'll place the eyes 10 meters below

>>7639248
>>7639249
>>7639254
Way to overcomplicate it. This kind of autism is great for selling books but has almost no practical value. It's one thing to point out the characteristics of the skull (such as the temporal planes being oblique, diverging from front to back). But an artist doesn't make a drawing of a head by doing all these geometrical constructions. It's a huge waste of time.

>>7639279
It's good for beginners that have trouble coming up with their own abstractions, but if you have no trouble with abstractions when studying the real stuff, yeah it's useless.

>>7639261
sauce on that pic?

>>7639261
>is supposed to represent anything you want buddy,
It's not, Loomeme is explicit that it's the brow line

>>7639279
You don't know how to take information and synthesize it within the context of your own understanding and it shows.

>>7639261
>>7639221 (OP)
I sincerely do not understand how the ball and cross help people. Looking at >>7639261 there are many instances the cross does not lineup whatsoever with what the artist ended up drawing over top of it. For me I just start drawing the head from the chin, no ball or shape or anything.

>>7639279
Anon those images aren't intended to be a step by step guide on how to draw the head for the rest of your art career. It's intended to teach absolute beginners a lesson on how to view the subject in 3 dimensional space, rather than flat 2 symbol drawing bullshit. You missed the point entirely. At least half of being a good artist is having a trained eye and that is the entire point.

>>7639426
it helps me know the center, which particularly helps me on 3/4ths or similar views

>>7639473
What about instances like this? I don't understand how the horizontal center line is helpful here with the head tilt

>>7639487
ok yeah the way hes got it setup there that would do nothing for me, I try to keep that line curved as if it was following the geometry of the face curving with the brow ridge

>>7639221 (OP)
that middle line is the autistic filter

>>7639487
At some point you just have to accept that 90% of the art rules and guides are just bullshit and people just do them like a prayer before eating.

>>7639221 (OP)
I remember getting to that page and calling BS.
It's not like the skull couldn't follow his standard guide proportions, like >>7639249 shows, so I think he was just being lazy and did whatever he wanted, since it was a skull and not a 'human head'.

>>7639426
It can help with correctly dividing up the head to correctly place features (so breaking the horizontal eyeline into thirds for example). It can also help with perspective, since you'll need to rule out guidelines for that anyway (if you're being anal about it). There's also thumb-nailing, as it's very common to use the cross to indicate where the simplified character is looking without needing to draw in any details.
Generally though, it's a consistency thing, which is why animators use it a lot, because you don't want eyes shrinking or growing, or the features to be misplaced, moment to moment.
However, if you never need it, or outgrow it, that's fine too - I look at the Riley Method for drawing heads and think "man, how tedious", but I'm sure some people like taking away any guess work when placing features, so if it works for you that's great, whatever helps people.

>>7639231
this. construction is not real, its something invented AFTER the fact by people who can ALREADY draw to try and explain how to get better. Nobody gets better with any specific form of construction, you create your own depending on what you feel comfortable drawing.

You technically can just construct shit autistically and avoid as much drawing as possible by just building and constructing on top of construction, but that's not drawing. You end up like proko if you do that, can't even draw an oval without constructing it first.

>>7639654
>Riley Method
I meant to post an image as an example, whoops.

>>7639664
There are precisely 0 professional artists who use the Riley abstraction to draw heads

>>7639355
>You have to follow what loomis says
lol

>>7639669
I've seen videos of professional working artists using elements of that method - the circle in the forehead in particular is the give away.
So, I'll disagree with you.

>>7639727
post 1 video you won't

>>7639593
That doesn't sound like a very educated thought bro

>>7639728
I don't save every fucking video I watch to win internet arguments, you stupid autistic fuck.

All images and books are useless if you spend more time arguing about what works and what doesn't work than you do practicing

>>7639221 (OP)
here he has it as the brow; I don't understand why it changes or how they can both look right

>>7639221 (OP)
Just do a zillion studies until you can do them fast and correct every time. You will be forced to find the "construction method" that works best for you
>>7639231
This

op example is trying to explain the thought process, but the guy who made the image doesn't go through that, he just does it in his head.
Flexibility is an important thing to have as an artist.

>>7639221 (OP)
>>7639994
Because unironically if you look at the pic in OP, you'll find that when the eye sockets are drawn, the "half-line" passing through it doesn't actually bisect the circle.

The bisecting line still passes through the brows.

Loomis had probably internalized this so much and just drew the guidelines for his method after he had done the drawing that he didn't even realize it himself.

(Or more likely he thought that since there are no brows on a skull, drawing the line for the eyesocket was more identifiable and thus easier to learn, but failed to mention it in the instruction)

>>7639994
>>7640118
Also note that in the face picture, he marks a little spot below the line at level with the eye socket. If you look at the OP pic again, that's where the skull half line actually passes through.

He clearly knew what he was doing and just forgot to clarify lol. No need to make up a zillion excuses like those ITT.

>>7640118
"Unironically" makes no sense in this context anon

>>7640377
Unironically is a synonym for earnestly

>>7640377
It's a modern bastardization of the traditional use, which is still technically correct because now instead of being used to convey a negation of irony, it only conveys an absence of it and like >>7640381 said, it's now a stand in for 'earnestly'.

>inb4 "but..."
No buts. Your ancestors accept Janitor as a synonym for cleaner instead of the original latin "Ianitor" as in doorman (Ianua = door, Ianus = Janus (the god of doors kek)), so you must eat up your postmodern slop too.
Keep up with the times gramps, the language is evolving.

>>7640444
>accept
accepted*

>>7639261
>you can put the line 10 meters above if you wish as long as you remember you'll place the eyes 10 meters below
This is such good advice/explanation, I've been drawing for a long time, and this thing clicked and suddenly my drawings became better, but I couldn't really explain it exactly.

>>7639487
>anon does the guidelines
>tries to follow the guidelines
>"hmmm, I wonder if I made the eyes more tilted"
>shifts the eye a little bit up
>tilts the head
>the guidelines now does not represent the sketch but it was useful in the beginning.

>>7640577
And what, exactly, were they useful for?
If you don’t follow the guideline then it’s not a guideline. It’s just a random fucking line you drew.
>hurr stop being autistic
Stop pretending you have a method when it’s actually just intuition

>>7639221 (OP)
The point is to show how shit lines up in a simple way and it's not that complicated.

>>7640118
>the "half-line" passing through it doesn't actually bisect the circle
neither does the brow line

>>7640118
> more likely he thought that since there are no brows on a skull

Do you not know what the brow ridge is?>>7639231
>high level artists don't actually use this bullshit, instead they do it by instinct
There are many tools to get the result you want, they may not use the loomis method but use a certain construction method, they may even not draw the construction lines but they're still thinking about the placement of the brow ridge nose lips and making sure they're in the same perspective. Construction is very useful when you fucked something up and you can use it to see what happened. Like checking your work with a calculator after doing math in your head

>>7640577
Clearly not the case as the "artist" does the exact same perpendicular cross for every single head on the sheet. So unless they "changed their mind" about 40 different times and the original intention was to draw profiles every single time, you are wrong.

>>7640826
>>7640587
You can't really know exactly what went inside their mind; it really doesn't matter. You should just do your own construction method and wing it. I'll show mine in just a minute.

>>7639261
>>7639487
simple and actual answer, the artist is autistic. some people swear by the circle and cross approach, they start every single drawing with it and cannot draw without it. it helps them visualise how to begin. there is no technique to it, it's a mental/autism thing. I knew a filipino guy in college who did this and that is essentially the answer he gave me.

>>7640832

>>7640842
>eh em, I know the answer, allow me to educate you. my work? here you are:
>posts beg tier scribble
pottery

>>7640853
pyw

>>7640858
no

>>7640853
you should do one, spend 1 min on it, I promise I won't make fun of you.

>>7640870
eh i don't feel like it, either you hate it and I don't care or you love it and I don't care so it changes nothing

>>7640886
true, but it might change YOU

>>7640842
I respect artists that are willing to put their skills on the line, but I learned really quickly that on this board entertaining a pyw is almost never worth. They'll attack your work but never post their own. It's just the nature of an anonymous board that's also a crab pit. Just keep on keeping on.

>>7640886
You talk like a faggot

>>7639355
Loomis also says that all these constructions are just guidelines and you don't have to follow them precisely and basically says to bee yourself and enjoy experimenting and making mistakes

>>7639351
deel@nya
@radiokeg

>>7640757
It does so reasonably close, the brow is somewhat thick so it usually covers the range where the midline passes.

>>7640768
The brow ridge is not nearly as identifiable.

>>7641385
thanks

>>7639231
>The thing is that high level artists don't actually use this bullshit, instead they do it by instinct.
High level artists studied this when they were low level artists. At a certain point you start doing it FROM MEMORY, not by instinct. The thing you call instinct are just internalized art funamentals.

>>7639658
This is a very narrowminded take. A lot of artists learned to internalize anatomy and perspective, using construction by breaking down anatomy into simpler shapes.

I'm sure there's artists that approach learning more instinctively, but saying construction isn't real is just an outlandish claim to make.

>>7644578
"construction" isn't any one thing, its just used to describe any kind of planning and drafting. So when I say construction is not real, I'm talking about the "standard" method that is taught in all books and schools.

>>7644596
It's just one of the methods. Why do you think it's "not real", or why don't you just have a down to earth take, by saying "I don't like this particular method"?
Why do you feel the need to do bait takes like this one?

>>7639221 (OP)

>>7639231
>The thing is that high level artists don't actually use this bullshit, instead they do it by instinct.


Because they have years of using this that they've internalized it. They have the experience to do the construction in their heads and then put it to paper without having to put it down.