Thread 213658830

DJT is a language learning thread for those studying the Japanese language.
Japanese speakers learning English are welcome, too.

Read the guide linked below before asking how to learn Japanese:
https://web.archive.org/web/20220326112058/https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/learn/guide.html
Grammar references: https://djtguide.github.io/grammar/grammarmain.html

Archive of older threads: https://desuarchive.org/int/search/subject/Daily%20Japanese%20Thread/

Translation requests, insults, politics, reddit posts, lust, learning method / eceleb discussions: >>>/jp/djt

Previous Thread: >>213641125

おはよ

>YuriJT
乙

Do you guys think Japanese grammar is logical?
Speaking as a native speaker, I don't really think so because I noticed Japanese verb conjugation is more irregular than I thought.
In Japanese textbooks for foreigners, Japanese verbs are roughly categorized into the following three groups judging from how they are conjugated.

>Group 1 (called 五段活用 in Japanese):
>書く, 読む, 話す, 聞く, 死ぬ etc.

>Group 2a / Group 2b (called 上一段活用 and 下一段活用 in Japanese):
>見る, 降りる, 生きる / 求める, 食べる, 捨てる, あげる, くれる etc.
Note: the imperative form of the verb くれる is not くれろ but くれ for some reason.

>Group 3 (called カ行変格活用 and サ行変格活用 in Japanese)
>来る
>する

Interestingly, する verbs combined with one kanji like 愛する are not conjugated like the regular する verbs.

To give an example, する doesn't have its own potential form, so you need to replace する with できる to express it just like:
>攻撃する [kougeki suru] -> 攻撃できる [kougeki dekiru].

However, 愛する [ai suru] has its own potential form and it's grammatically incorrect to replace する with できる in this case.
Other examples are as follows:
>属する [zoku suru] -> 属せる [zokuseru]
>食する [shoku suru] -> 食せる [shokuseru]
>解する [kai suru] -> 解せる [kai seru]

As I study Japanese grammar to give clear explanations to Japanese learners, I feel like Japanese has a lot of grammatical exceptions in many ways and I don't find it logical that much.
Anyways, sorry for my shitty blog post.

>>213660251
>Do you guys think Japanese grammar is logical?
I think there's a ton of illogical things in every language I know so I don't really think about it beyond trying to figure out what it means and memorizing it.

こととて is one of those that just seem illogical to me.
>1 理由を表す。…だから、それだけ。…だけあって。「年をとってからできた子供の—、かわいくてしかたがない」「念を入れた—、よい仕上がりだ」
>2 逆接の条件を表す。…こととはいえ。…だからとはいえ。「いくら初めての—大変失礼致しました」
I don't get why it would have both of these usages, but I will simply just memorize it and repeat exposure until my brain will just pick one of them out of context subconciously.

And が has a ton of uses and for some reason can even be a literary の
I honestly think the best approach is just "Japanese is a highly logical language, except when it isn't" and study what the different things *can* mean and mass immerse to see things in context over and over so one can separate them subconciously. It's okay to interpret correctly, but be unable to explain exactly why as long as you are able to communicate back without misunderstanding. Easier said than done, but language is a matter of many thousands of hours so bits will fall into place here and there over time.

>Note: the imperative form of the verb くれる is not くれろ but くれ for some reason.
I have never thought of this, but when you mention it I can tell its true.
>Interestingly, する verbs combined with one kanji like 愛する are not conjugated like the regular する verbs.
I don't think I've ever noticed this. It also uses 愛せる like the other examples I guess?
>As I study Japanese grammar to give clear explanations to Japanese learners, I feel like Japanese has a lot of grammatical exceptions in many ways and I don't find it logical that much.
I don't know how my languages work, its either right or wrong/unnatural.
>Anyways, sorry for my shitty blog post.
It was illuminating.

>In Japanese textbooks for foreigners
Unrelated but, I kinda wonder what textbooks for Norwegian is in Japanese.

>>213662522
skinning :3

>>213662882
she would say ¡qué asco! :O

>>213660960
>Unrelated but, I kinda wonder what textbooks for Norwegian is in Japanese.
For example.

>>213660251
No such thing as a language with logical grammar. Making it overly logical would just suck the fun out of it anyway.

>>213663152
なるほど、悪くないと思う
わざわざ教科書の参考を見つけって見せられてすみませんm(_ _)m
そういう仕事をさせるつもりではなかった。とにかく、見せてありがとうございます(´・ω・｀)

独り言なので読まなくていい(自分の言語だけだ):
「akkurat」は相槌の場合には当たるでもちょっと違う気がする、難しい言葉だ。なるほど(そうなんだ?)、ピッタリ(ある/ない)、正解、ギリギリ、 なるほど。。。(ボン引き)、丁度。相槌だけではない。
「ja vel」は危険な言葉だ、「そうですね」とは一度でも思わなかった、もっと舌打ちの後で通じ合えなくてもう話してもしょうがなく*rolling your eyes*「ja vel...」という感じだ。それとも、興味深い声色で「ja vel ja?」へえー?。一番怖いのは「ja vel..?」の全然興味ない、なんでそんなこと言っているの?想像するだに怖くなる。
どんな言語でも難しい「何それ??」言葉があるんですね
もちろんネイティブなら何もそんな定義のことを考える必要はない
会話を勉強するだけでは足りなくてたくさん会話を聞くことは必要だ、どんな言語でもそれは効いていると思う

practice makes perfect [spoiler]except for me[/spoiler] ('､3_ヽ)＿

>>213664425
自信を持って頑張りましょう!(震えて「私の場合は終わりだけど」頭によぎる)大丈夫大丈夫!

>>213664541
ガンバリマス! ヽ(=´▽`=)ﾉ

>>213664790
>画像
実は。。。買い物に行く度に、一番好きな声優のラジオ番組を聞いている(￣▽￣;)
それは多分、誰でも言わないほうがいいふふふ
早口の訳で最初の聴解力では無理だったでも知らないうちになんとなくわかるようになった。

>>213664960
>わかるようになった
literally 好きこそものの上手なれ desu ne! (ㆁωㆁ*)

>>213663539
>Making it overly logical would just suck the fun out of it anyway.
Yeah, I agree with you.
If I'm not mistaken, Esperanto is a constructed language designed for communication between humans.
Enthusiastic Esperantists expect it to become a replacement for English, but I don't really find the language attractive at all for some reason.

>>213665278
うん、その通りだ!
残り1時間未満新しい「 ゲーセン少女と異文化交流 」の1話が放送されてる
一緒に異文化を交流してね〜

>>213668113
>異文化交流
exactly what we are doing right now (*´･ω･)(･ω･｀*)ﾈｰ

>>213669240
( ^ω^ )(*´꒳`*)ﾅｶﾖｼ~

this is a chino chan

>>213669855
見える(/oω-\)

>>213669855
the one I ordered was syaro chan :3

南無観世音菩薩
南無観世音菩薩

カッコ良すぎる
キャップを被ってグローブでも着けてる…
十歳ショタの憧れの女の子だなー

学問に王道なし

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUyz1qkMb2k
最近のようつべ変なもんしか見せてくんねえな

>been to japan 3 times
>going again in january
I've been to tokyo each time, along with toyama and the surrounding area
I'm an arborist and enjoy hiking around the trees in winter, do you have any recommendations for areas to go for a less-populated hiking tour? I think hokkaido might be too much for me haha

飲酒しながら淫夢実況見てたらすごく堕落してるような気がして気分悪くなって来たが

もうお荷物はごめんだお

Thoughts on Tunic? Have any jpanons played it? If so, what do you think about the game's constructed language and its in-game manuals? Is it like reading English words you don't understand?
To me, it seems like reading words I don't understand in Japanese or other languages.

学問に衆道あり