Thread 63894311

Why did their air defense perform so poorly?

Look at the consanguinity rate

>>63894311 (OP)
they're muslims

>>63894311 (OP)
Their entire air defense network is just copies or modifications of pre existing American, Russian, Chinese, French, and British systems, mostly designed before 1979.

Do you promise to do better next time?
I know it's you

>>63894332
Schizo

1. Complete decapitation of leadership combined with a lack of delegation
2. Corruption combined with infiltration by Mossad
3. Air defence was fucked up months ago and never recovered

>>63894311 (OP)
A solid majority of their populace despises the regime and is happy to rat to Israel about all the knowhow and whereabouts of its air defense system

>>63894311 (OP)
>Why did their air defense perform so poorly?
I was told the Israelis send in commando teams to perform synchronized strike on 7 air defense batteries using Spike NLOS missiles

>>63894311 (OP)
They basically rely on legacy soviet AD infrastructure with modernization mostly on the periphery side, ie missile upgrade, "modern" radar that operated in isolation etc. Nothing is interconnected and worse, both the army and IGRC have separate AD command

With the cease fire, other than continue to hunt these mossad mooks that sabotaged the AD, they also need to invest in having a properly modern air defence infrastructure

>>63894543
t. reza "ratface" pahlavi

poor readiness
probably poor training/coordination
probably not enough actual functional assets

the few not-reapers they downed were probably by manpads, just like the houthis.

also, albms are fairly hard to shoot down outside of top-tier systems and being ready for them. the same for harms.

stand-off high-speed munitions are very, very dangerous to most sam systems out there.

>>63894311 (OP)
Their entire air defense network is held together with chewing gum and prayers.

>>63894311 (OP)
Old AD systems, lack of military intelligence and human intelligence, Muslims being Muslims, Israel having access to their US vassal's satellite surveillance networks etc.

The only relevant qualifier for success is whether Iran will test a nuke, eventually, or not.

>>63894332
if i was forced to pick either bibi or ayatollah to be my forever husbando i would pick bibi

>>63894615
this is true
i think they shot themselves in the foot by trying to be open about it all in comparison to the norks who just went hermit and did it far more silently

>>63894311 (OP)
Because most of the early warning radars and longest range stuff got blown up last October, Mossad was actively operating inside Iran and disrupting shorter range AD, and stand off munitions fired from stealth aircraft destroyed almost all that was left in Western Iran before the F-15s showed up.
>>63894576
Integrate what at this point? The Israelis completely gutted the AD network. What are they going to do, beg russia for radars and SAMs? Ask the Chinese to risk major sanctions to supply them with a network?

>>63894670
>The Israelis completely gutted the AD network

What network? Most of Iran AD works in isolation. There's no network other beyond their own regiments
You're conflating assets destruction with C4I failure

>Ask the Chinese to risk major sanctions to supply them with a network?
Do you really think a major chinese or russian defence company give a fuck about american sanctions? lmao

>>63894311 (OP)
>no one ordered me to turn on the radar so I'm not going to
>ah shit my AA battery got bombed, but at what can you do, at least I followed my orders to the letter and didn't show any initiative
>leader knows best, this must have been part of the plan
You know, just Arab culture things.
Even Russians would have performed better. They may have shot down a few civilian planes in the process, but even they wouldn't have displayed this unprecedented level of air defense cuckoldry.

>>63894319
this, to be conpletely and utterly honest

>>63894690
>Do you really think a major chinese or russian defence company give a fuck about american sanctions? lmao
Chinese companies have been increasingly been denying purchase requests from Russian companies

>>63894311 (OP)
it seemed like they did well

>>63894657
This. Even the fucking jeets and pakis knew not to reveal their cards until its too late to be stopped.

Soviet era stuff renamed to Farsi. Nothing else is added.

>>63894824
This. Then, they tried to claim it as themselves by replacing obsolete soviet electronicss with some off the shelf alternative

>>63894576
>t. reza "ratface" pahlavi

>>63894690
Not having any form of early warning radar or actual command structure to hold things together left them paralyzed and forced them to operate far more independently than they would have had to even under ideal circumstances.

>>63894311 (OP)
They were too busy spamming bbc porn on /k/.

>>63895236
That’s not Iran, it’s a butthurt illegal drug addict that trolls some of the general. Just a singular retard.

>>63894804
I heard plenty of wonks say Iran's mullahs never really wanted to rush to a working device, just achieve threshold deterrence. As in they wanted to have all the kit in place and if push came to shove they could just put it together like legos. Boom nuclear Iran.

Yeah, that was kinda stupid from get go.

>>63894804
They didn't have it, they weren't working on it, they weren't close to it. Bibi just needed to expand his wild ride, what Iran was actually doing had no relevance.

>>63895253
You sure cause when Iranian internet went down the bbc porn stopped?

>>63894690
Do you think sanctions can only applied against individual companies?

>>63895351
can only be applied*

>>63894311 (OP)
There may have been consequences to giving the 'export Jihad' branch the lion's share of the budget.

>russian air defense are cuckolds

what are indian, iranian, and qatar, israeli, houthi air defense?

>>63895413
Did you mean, which one of these ADs drops missiles?

>>63894311 (OP)
Islam.

>>63894344
Yes, the guy who spams posts 24/7 is in fact a schizo.

>>63894851
But his mom told him all his life he was a special boy! Don't be rude.

>>63894311 (OP)
Because it was destroyed back in October.
Because it was vatnik systems.
But most importantly, because they are ragheads.

>>63894724
>Russians would have performed better
>they wouldn't have displayed this unprecedented level of air defense cuckoldry
lol
they are both cut of the same cloth

I never noticed the repeating patterns on Iran’s flag before. Don’t think I’ve ever seen it up close. Looks nice desu

they were cursed by the one and only

>>63894472
>Complete decapitation of leadership combined with a lack of delegation

People don't seem to comprehend just how bad of an impact this had on Iran. On the first day of attacks alone, Iran lost

>the Chief of Staff of the Armed Forces
>the Commander-in-Chief of the IRGC
>the head of Khatam-al Anbiya Central Headquarters (Iran's general staff)
>the Commander-in-Chief of the IRGC Aerospace Force (head of Iran's offensive ballistic missile forces)
>the Commander of IRGC Air Defense forces
>the Head of Intelligence of the Iranian Armed Forces
>the Head of Intelligence of the IRGC

This would be a catastrophic loss of brainpower even if the Iranian command structure wasn't throughly Sovietized.

>>63895600
30 people in total, all in brigadier general rank and above btw.

>>63895600
I wonder if killing the top guys is actually that debilitating.
Kill one, another gets promoted and the machine keeps on churning.

>>63895638
You dont get muzzies, each of those guys were setting up little corruption empires that are going to fall without them. New guys will do the same. It'll be short lived turmoil but turmoil nonetheless.

>>63895335
It was a coincidence. There’s one retard who trolls /hg/. It won’t make sense unless you’re a regular.

>>63895638
It really shouldn't if the organizations work.

>>63895590
At this point I'm convinced he's from a parallel universe and all his data feeds correlate to reality there, it's the only thing that explains how he can be wrong 100% of the time. Even a screaming methed out schizo is occasionally right, but not Copelord.

>>63895262
The real stupidity was not recognizing the opportunity cost to the economy of the nuclear program. Totally not worth it. If they have a hard on for messing with Israel you do that with money and resources which they have much less of due to decades of sanctions.

>>63895638
In authoritarian regimes the military is strictly controlled from the top down so it wont pose a threat to the ruling elite or its upper echelons who are usually placed there on the counts of loyalty and not merit.
The Iran the problem is compoiunded by the fact that many of the top guys are personal choices of the Ayatollah and they held their officers for a ridiculous long tenure , people like Amir Ali Hajizadeh, who commanded the IRGC aerospace forces held his post since 2009. so its absolutely debilitating in that kind of a force structure.

>>63895590
>>63895697
Is there an expression describing something even worse than a broken clock? Because he's that.
Maybe nostradumbass?

>Had the perfect surprise attack
>Killed a ton of leadership
>Russian AA was ineffective since jews had all the information they needed on it
>Mossad doing glowops, blowing up radars and AA with drones from within Iran
>Hundreds of spies compromising the entirety of Iran's leadership
>AA totally gutted after a week of bombardment
>Trump half asses the bombing response and then orders everyone to have a truce guaranteeing that Iran will restart their program. Its even dubios how much damage was made (from USA's own sources)
Is he retarded? They had the perfect opportunity to regime change Iran and they wont get it twice after blowing all their tricks this time

>>63895754
Israel may take a pause, let the Mossad get to work locating the remnants of Iran's nuclear program and materials, and then go after that in a few months. It's not like Iran is going to have any more air defense in a few months than it does now unless the Chinese surge then some for some reason (China must be thrilled with now things have turned out so far, oil price barely budged but now Iran is even more beholden to China).

>>63894311 (OP)
Islam and Inbreeding, the middle east in general is just a intelligence drain.

>>63895754
>truce guaranteeing that Iran will restart their program.
right of course, because israel will just sit by idly

>>63895638
To be fair to Iran I think all organisations would struggle with that kind of churn even if the comms worked. If your boss died think about all the stuff you would have to immediately jump into - in a good organisation you would have already performed or at least seen such tasks but you would still want to go into listening mode for a first week rather than take leadership.

But I think the delegation point might be more important. If your boss doesn't turn up to work then should be confident enough to exercise your own initiative and perform your mission. The dudes who don't hear from command but see an Israeli jet should know what to do and do it just as NATO armies allow the commanders at the front make wide-reaching decisions simply by merit of being on the scene and knowing the objectives.

35 Iranian personnel who worked AD were killed in 12 days of fighting. for referenc, iran's attack on israel killed 28 people, including one off duty soldier. that's just the AD guys. so you know their losses were heavy

>>63895754
You're overestimating how much of a plan was in place for that and how achievable it would be.

>>63895606
damn. and i thought the number of russian generals that got merked at the start of the ukie conflict was high

>>63895974
forgot pic

>>63894576
Which other militaries, other than the US, even have network centric warfare capabilities?

>>63896101
israel

>>63895351
Hurr

because anything less than the best air defense doesn't work against a trillion dollar defense budget.

>>63895979
God Lord, the Mossad was busy.

>>63894311 (OP)
Face saving cultures cannot admit fault and therefore cannot fix the problems that develop

>>63894311 (OP)
Because it was all based on reverse engineered Russian crap from the late 1980s and American hardware from the late 1970s. The most modern anti-missile defense system they had was based on the S-300.

>>63894332
Hi, Geg. It Neal.

>>63894576
>t. reza "ratface" pahlavi
He's right tho. The majority of the Iranian population today is urban and the majority of these urbanites absolutely hate the shit out of the Ayatolahs and will, under the right incentive, risk their lives and that of family members to stick it to the regime. If Israel had the means to deliver small arms to the population en masse, which is quite fucking impossible given the geography of Iran, this country would be in a Syrian-tier civil war by now.

>>63894690
Why would China sell shit to Iran and justify whatever tariffs trump wants to impose when Pakistan + Africa will happily buy their stuff.

>>63894615
Thanks to modern computing systems, you don't have to anymore. Besides, testing a nook would just invite another B-2 raining Massive Anal Penetrators on their asses.

>>63894657
Iran could have become Saudi rich, buy a Russian nuke power plant and after its up an running develop nukes when no one can stop them.

>>63894311 (OP)
sandniggers allahu snakbarring with vodkanigger hardware

>>63897005
you mean the tariff Dumpy tried to impose on China anyway and ended exploded in his face?
Or the fact that he literally had to call on China to not stop rare metal export?
Or that he had to ask China to persuade Iran to not close Hormuz Strait?

China isn't stupid. If Iran fall US is going to surround China hence equipping Iran is in their best interest to keep the status quo

>>63895638
>I wonder if killing the top guys is actually that debilitating.
>Kill one, another gets promoted and the machine keeps on churning.
theoretically yes, but iran is a shithole country with a shithole military
so it's all top down and the military is not meant to actually work, it's meant to do what's good for the top brass. Having a functional military with well trained and highly experienced officers is a threat to the top brass
and having generals who know what the fuck they're doing is also a risk to the political leadership.
Performing well is punished since it makes you boss look bad, so you sit down shut up and do exactly as you are told with no deviations even if you know the orders are bad
So the guys who can "Step up" into leadership positions have basically no motivation or initiative to do so. Why should they? They don't have experience doing it either.
They have experience with malicious compliance and seeing shittier officers get promoted ahead of them due to corruption
This kind of shit breed incompetence and malicious compliance at all levels of the organization. This is a problem at the very top of the military, and it just filters down and gets worse as you go down the chain of command.
tldr: shithole military things

>>63895732
>In authoritarian regimes the military is strictly controlled from the top down so it wont pose a threat to the ruling elite or its upper echelons who are usually placed there on the counts of loyalty and not merit.
exactly

>>63895638
Killing Soleimani was genuinely what started most if not all of this. He was irreplaceable and Quds has been a fucking disorganized mess ever since.

>>63895741
A broken stopwatch?