Wild Geese Edition. Last one hit bump limit.
Post gear, discuss gear.
Previous: >>63949852

Earpro infographic made by earpro anon.

Vest infographic.

Body armor infographic.

Eye protection infographic 1.01.

And belt kits! Last one for now.

>>63985986
Maybe its something i would have to try for myself. Just feels like such an obvious solution that there must be a critical factor im overlooking.
Like if you have duals or something obviously this isnt a solution but the vast majority of devices are mono and will be probably until we have robot eyes.

>>63986056
I think it's really just sensory overload. Easier to have your red dot in your dominant eye, NV on dominant eye, then everything is in one eye and it's less calculating for your brain to do.

>>63986047
>No two piece belts
>No war belts
This infographic is ass

>>63986066
That would be the belt infographic.

>>63986047
I have the L4 LCA, please add to the list

>>63986014
The Condor MA33 looks like it's exactly what I want, a 3x3 mag design. Thanks.
The interior divider looks slightly annoying.

>>63986047
I have the L4P LCA, please add to the list

ID on this bullets-out 3xAR magazine pouch?

>>63986036
Howard Leight's Impact Pros are functionally identical to the Sports but have an extra 8 dB NRR—essential equipment if you're confined to an indoor range.

>>63986081
Just keep in mind it's Condor. Do not expect it to be as resilient as pouches from more serious companies. Mine are holding up fine. The interior divider is slightly annoying. To re-index magazines you need to do "front-of-divider" first, then behind, last one closest to you. That's with PMAGs. It's probably cleaner with metal mags. The BMI turret gunner pouch fits four and lacks an internal divider, but that might be bulky as shit if you run three of those.

>>63986083
Aye aye.

>>63986094
That much extra NRR would also be handy for magnum calibers and braked rifles / shotguns.

>>63986094
Those are pistol mags

You have been visited by the turkshit shotgun infographic. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJPlzNajdUs

>>63986129
...ID on the bullets-out 3×pistol mag pouch, then?
That does make more sense, given he doesn't look like he's carrying a rifle.

>>63986137
NTA but this might be it.
https://safelifedefense.com/shop/triple-mag-pouch/

>>63986150
Not even close. The spacing is way too wide, and it's not available in Ranger Green.

>>63986099
d-don't forget me (about $60)

>>63986163
Next version!
>>63986150
Get outta here with that safelife repair safelife replace

>>63986099
Shit, for thirty bucks, I'll buy two of them, rip the divider out of one, and if I like it do the same to the other. If not, it's not like they cost much.

Shit I'll buy three.

i got my little opscore with comtacs on it a while back, 4 or 5 years ago, and now i want to finish setting it up with a radio and ptt button. would like some recs

I just sent ESS a special request. Tell me gq, what price would you put for picrel being copied with same dimensions but with milspec ballistic protection and the lenses becoming singular?

>>63986277
40 american dollars

>>63986277
>and the lenses becoming singular
You're asking them to design an entirely new frame at that point. They probably make something close enough to what you want already, but the answer to your question is "waiting a couple of years for them to bang out a new SKU that fills a niche that they'd somehow overlooked, plus the usual cost of a set of MIL-PRF-31013 ballistic eyewear"

>>63986277
Maybe $60?

>>63986150
lol, even the fake reviews say that it sucks, imagine how bad it actually is

>>63986714
>b-b-but reddit said Safelife was good!1!
Rule of thumb still holds true. If a company has a full-time reddit rep, its reputation cannot stand by itself.

>>63986277
You're asking them to design a brand new product so it's going to cost a couple hundred as a final product if they think it's viable.

>>63987203
Safelife is so meme-tier that I don't think that anybody on Reddit would ever say they're good.

>>63987219
More than that, unless they expect to be able to sell a lot of them. Also, it'll probably take them a year to make the first batch, lol

>>63986258
Who are you talking to and what is your budget?

So, combat shirts. Do you wear something like a T-shirt underneath yours? Or do you just wear it under bare skin?

>>63987359
Bare skin
Originally combat tops were field top sleeves sewn to undershirts to give you a soft underbelly that was cooler and didnt have buttons or pockets between you and carrier. Wearing an undershirt under and undershirt would be a bit weird.

>>63987359
Bare skin.

>>63987278
Negative chief, Safelife's big boss Ngroat is there all the time and gets all the updoots. Reddit is firmly RMA & Safelife country.

>>63986094
They’re knock-off pistol FASTMags. They’re not one shingle, they’re individual pouches molle’d on next to each other h other.

>>63987417
Everything negative that people say about Reddit is true.
>>63987435
Makes sense

>>63987462
Sadly it's where all the noobs go to get advice. The situation with the Highcom 4SAS4 was illuminating. A lot of people got screwed (likely 5,000+ going off of sales figures) and most of them don't even know their armor may have issues.
Where reddit is good is that there's a lot of traffic, so you get news on small things fast. Example being that Stealth armor isn't shipping orders, for example. Cannot rely on it for big things, because astroturf tends to beat you there.

>>63986207
Condormaxx

>>63987334
nobody. just potential shtf stuff, maybe some buddy stuff if i meet someone that actually is interested in chatting on a radio.

>>63988000
>The situation with the Highcom 4SAS4
?

>>63988551
Oh man, you missed a shitstorm.
> Highcom starts blowing out "Ukrainian surplus" plates for $99/ea.
> "NIJ Certified to 0101.04!!"
> They're tested on Youtube and they fail miserably on the first shot. They're among the worst ceramic plates ever tested.
> They're also not 10x12" as advertised, they're literally slightly under 9x11", like SAPI S.
> The distributors, "TacticalShit", have a total meltdown and post angry rants, including one where they take a plate to their backyard and shoot it once with M855 from a SBR. "See?! It works damnit!"
> Price is reduced to $90.
> It turns out that they're not even certified. The "Ukraine surplus" model is very different from the old 0101.04 certified model.
> It turns out that they have nothing to do with Ukraine, lol. Highcom is just liquidating old stock or something like that
> They still sold something like 5000-10000 units of the worst ceramic plate ever.
> Rachel

>>63986029 (OP)
Rebels Raiders/Cannae needs to be added somewhere in these graphics imo

>>63989047
To add onto this with the infographic and some other notes:
>2007-2008: Highcom, a highly reputable armor manufacturer, releases the 4SAS4, a single-curve full cut NIJ 0101.04-certified plate.
>This standard does not require the conditioning tests of 0101.06.
>2009-2010: The 4SAS4 is replaced by the 4SAS7, which cements Highcom's reputation as an exceedingly reliable armor manufacturer.
>2022: Highcom makes a bunch of excess aluminum oxide strike faces for some contract and puts them into storage.
>Mid-2024: Highcom releases the "4SAS4", a multi-curve shooters / SAPI-cut plate. Their distributors are Apex, Tacshit, Titan, Chase Tactical, and others. Using those old strike faces.
>$100. This plate quickly gains traction with everyone, including Buffman - who recommends it highly.
>Buffman tests the plate around October-November and it fails badly. The plate he dropped more arguably did better.
>Buffman reports his findings on arfcom and FNforum, on the latter even calling the plate's backer trash.
>RMA conveniently puts the 1155 on a big sale.
>Huge blowup online. People demand refunds.
>Tacticalshit refuses em. Escalates to Chase Tactical, whose customer service alleges Buffman rigged the test on behalf of "other companies" (guess who).
>Story changes and it was the drop test that did them in!
>/gq/ goes whole hog and finds out these plates were advertised to 0101.06, which has a drop test.
>Nope, they're 0101.04. After everyone bought their plates, Highcom stealth-edited the 4SAS4 page to remove 0101.06 entirely. We caught this on the wayback machine.
>They're not even the real 4SAS4. They're a different model bumming an old cert.
>Even the NIJ confirms the cert is no good.
>People get chargebacks on tacshit.
>Chase Tactical threatens Buff with legal action, he KNEELS and vows to restore confidence in Highcom.
>Retest using plates mostly sent in by Chase. Flaunts test reports (6x BZ API!) he can't show.
>All of /gq/ does chargebacks.
>reddit shills!

>>63989047
How the fuck would an ongoing conflict have "surplus"? Surely that'd've been the first sign something was amiss.

>>63989180
The truth is that Highcom had a shitload of overrun aluminum oxide strike faces from some other contract in 2022. They backed them in 2024 with a relatively weak fiberglass backer and made them into the "4SAS4" - the contract overrun thing is fiction. The plates were freshly made in November 2024 and onward. People were getting plates with manufacture dates weeks or even just days prior to when they ordered. Gear queers and redditors alike got plates that failed the tap and torque tests, had rips in the covers, water damaged labels, were packaged with virtually no padding - all the while reddit shills were yelling they were 0101.04 plates and were never meant to handle drops.
>Because Ukraine would really want fragile-ass plates in a warzone, right.
Several vendors alleged the 4SAS4 was just the 4SAS7 rebranded for the Ukraine contract, but the weights are totally off and the 4SAS7 performs a lot better. Still only 0101.04 though.
>Highcom did advertise the 4SAS4 to 0101.06, see pic related.
Tacticalshit sold more than 8,000 of these fuckers in two months. I guarantee you there are more than 12,000 of these shits out there, adding the other vendors and whatever Highcom / Chase sold directly.

Pic related shows when Buffman totally reversed course and started backing the 4SAS4, even flaunting test reports from 10/23 (?) revealing the 4SAS4 was tested to stop 6x 7.62x39 BZ API, but he can't show the test reports! ITAR! Ignore the fact he literally dissected the plate on live video and that the plate is allegedly seventeen years old!

In the retest he only said 7.62x39 mild steel core, but IIRC never retracted the BZ API claim, so there's some pretty convincing evidence to suggest those 10/23 test reports are fabrications or there's something hinky with them and they wouldn't survive scrutiny.

Here are links to the Highcom threads where this was originally discussed months ago. Long read but hugely informative as to the "real story" of how this went down. You will get a totally different tale from reddit.

THREAD 1:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/62910354/
THREAD 2:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/62950094/
THREAD 3:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/62982073
THREAD 4:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/63009662

>>63986036
i feel like this guide could use some extra information on what constitutes a set being "mid tier" or "high tier" the price isnt even on there, and i have no way of discerning between different ear pros. Relative pros/cons would help a lot.
having something similar to >>63986135
would help a lot
definitely appreciate the guides tho, very helpful

So I'm starting to think Stealth Armor Systems might have some underlying questions. They've only got two active NIJ certifications, the one for Hexar "Titan" went inactive a month ago but they are continuing to sell Hexar. Granted, this was raised by the Ngroat guy that runs Safelife (which infamously got into a big pissing match with Stealth years ago because they both sell flexible rifle armor), but what he's saying here is factually correct so far.
What certs they have are for soft armor, which as per >>63988000 some people aren't getting their orders for. Again, reddit, but you take what you can get.
I also ran Stealth's address (1306 FM 1092 Rd, Missouri City, TX 77459), which is mixed use commercial. Nick was wrong on that one, although I don't see SAS' sign on any of the doors. I'll wayback it later.
Shit you gotta watch out for with armor is that the competition is cutthroat and plays nasty with each other, so you never know if someone rec'ing you armor is a true neutral, a fanboy, a shill, or a company rep themselves.

>>63989328
I didn't make that one, but I'll update it unless earpro anon wants to keep up maintaining it. Will wait for his response. Great suggestions though!

Okay so I dug deeper and the suite number for Stealth is 508, which is occupied as of 2025 by a Handicraft Heaven, which makes handbags, batik dresses, and sustainable... fashion accessories. Okay... unless they're assembling Dragonskin right next to the chic mini-skirts we got some Adept-style chicanery here.

>>63986036
Not adding if they are Stereo vs Mono, sad

>>63989180
>>63989204
I miss these threads and can't believe that a certain YouTuber still shills them. I recently saw a 4sas4 plate on eBay with a April 25 manufacturer date. The scariest shit with these plates is that the ceramic did not crack, even under x-ray. There is legit no way to tell if your plates compromised.
>>63989219
Thanks for saving my image anon. If I remember I'll post my 12 page fraud evidence I compiled.

>>63989428
> I recently saw a 4sas4 plate on eBay with a April 25 manufacturer date.
Hahahahaha, pretty recent for an .04 plate that cracks if you look at it funny.

>>63989219
Those were such good and funny threads
I still can't believe that Highcom got away with it, though.

>>63989428
>can't believe that a certain YouTuber still shills them
Buff went from your friendly neighborhood armor tester to "Patreon-packing, affiliate links loaded NIJ alternative for companies with baggage" really quickly. It's a shame. See pic related. He's been around for ages. He has every reason to know, or should know that RMA did not disclose the cheat rings and undersized coverage on the 1189 and 1199 for over a year. Yet he says they were upfront. In an earlier thread, we found out RMA was selling the 1189 as early as 2013. Did they disclose the cheat ring then? Apparently not!
>https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/63678773
Five years of not disclosing the 10x12" plate only has 8x10" coverage. That's what I call... upfront. Also, before June 19th 2013 they were apparently selling other companies' plates or plates using materials from another country, didn't specify, so that's nice. Think that was the 1145 shitshow.
Buff also calls their whole lineup "to spec and a little more" - like the NIJ suspended 1155. Multi-hit Level IV losing to two budget-ass Tulammo .308 at 100 meters per an anon's test. To spec and a little more!
>I recently saw a 4sas4 plate on eBay with a April 25 manufacturer date
Not surprising, they kept going or are still going until the strike faces are exhausted. Maybe they'll keep going if people keep buying the things. They make money hand over fist and Highcom is hurting!
>The scariest shit with these plates is that the ceramic did not crack, even under x-ray. There is legit no way to tell if your plates compromised.
Buff's initial plates passed his tap and torque test. I believe his initial assessment, that the fiberglass backer is "trash" is correct.
>I'll post my 12 page fraud evidence I compiled
I remember that from the highcom threads. Good times!

>>63988108
FLC + 2x Condor 3x3s + 2x canteen pouches
I'm gonna be living large

Busting out the RMA sucks infograph since it's pertinent.
>>63989451
Or the backer sucks and the label is half missing because of water damage. Pick your poison.
>>63989455
Their stock price sure isn't getting away.

post current chest rig/belt setup I wanna see what anon has been rocking poorfag builds are always creative and the most welcome

>>63989511
It's just a flak vest. Flak vest with a bible verse in it. My only "gun" is a BP derringer, because I haven't bothered getting an actual rifle/pistol because I live in the great state of California.

I'm too ashamed to post it.

>>63989511
Why are you using elastic "exit only" pouches on your belt below where you can physically see them? Have you ever actually tried reinserting mags into those terrible mag pouches? It only works on the front of a plate carrier

AWS has a double mag pouch. What is /gq/'s opinion on it? Does it look good to you? I'm needing to pick up a pistol pouch or two and I'm exploring options.

>>63989565
omg no way

>>63989549
Based pasgt pirate

>>63989576
Fucking look at the picture dumbass, it looks like any pouch designed in the mid 2000s. It's a basic cordura pouch with a bungee retention tab, it will hold a pistol magazine but it will be shit and annoying to re-index. The only molle magazine pouch worth buying is the Esstac KYWI.

>>63989644
> The only molle magazine pouch worth buying is the Esstac KYWI
Why do you think so, anon?

>>63989649
He has strong opinions

>>63989644
Why are you so stressed about reindexing. Did you just graduate basic training or something??
>>63989576
I think it would be just fine, real pipecloggers use condor shit they get at the PX lolol
>>63989649
I almost went with them but my BFG's have yet to fail 7 years later lol

>>63989474
My TT vest with 2x ma33s is fat as fuck but I can carry 18 mags bro

>>63989638
>black beard on a pirate ship wearing PASGT vest and helmet

>start putting together backpacking setup
>buy a few milsurp items because quality and aesthetics
>months pass
>have collected 21 pieces of modern USMC gear alone
I don't even have a gun atm, called the sudoku hotline and got a five year ban in 2020. Can't decide between an repro M16A1 or original norails M9. Dangerously close to retardedly buying pic related even though I can't even fill it yet

>>63989682
>With blackbeard RF2 plates duct-taped to the outside of the PASGT vest like ghetto ISAPO.
M855A1 / M80A1 protection for 4.75lb and $180 a pop was the deal of all deals. Pic rel is the *cough* old /gq/ armor guide before baganon came and saved us from... the 4800LV. A pair of those sold on fleabay for like $380 a few days ago. That should tell ya something.

>>63989710

>>63989725
That guy has a gun though

>>63989727
>I don't even have a gun atm
Must have been before the sudoku hotline. Did anon bounce the phone bill?

>>63989730
I built an AR in the most inefficient way possible (surplus parts + 80% + jig), got seized along with hundreds of rounds of ammo by the cops that showed up after I hung up on an unhelpful guy that answered the veterans crisis line. It's probably all destroyed now, but at least the ban just expired and the VA has me on effective meds now

>>63989765
In that case the M16A1 would be more based and has better music associated with it

>>63989765
wow, good job being a total crashout you massive retard

>>63989765
Why didn't you just do another 80%

Alright, I've finished the turkshit shotgun infographic with the rarest and most exquisite brakes I could find, along with... ammo!

>>63989859
A year or two after I completed my first/only one CA changed laws so that even 80%s had to be serialized and purchased through an FFL. I could've 3D printed or machined an ugly one from scratch, but really didn't want to become a shotcaller.

>>63989849
You don't know me nigga

/Bag/anon, that Colossus retest finally came out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylO7at_L_ts
Per the table:
1. Defeated by both 7.92 SmKH and 7.62x54 7N37. I suppose the latter does live up to its reputation as an XSAPI-killer after all.
2. Beat .338 Lapua Swiss P API, lost to .338 Lapua Swiss P AP.
3. Lost to M2AP at 3,180ft/s (plate #3). After beating M2AP at over 3,200ft/s. That's surprising. So the 12yo Protech 2230 @ 3,500ft/s v0 beats the Colossus on hot M2AP. Okay.
4. Replicated the one stopped, one penetrated performance in that M948 SLAP test report. I will admit that's consistent, I like that.
5. Some .308 Lapua Tungsten did it in.
I noticed a discrepancy. This is a larger Colossus measuring 10.5x13.25 nominal, actual 9.75x11.625 going off Buff's table if I'm reading that right, average weight ~8.45lb. Advertised weight per Adept's site is 8.1lb and there's no nominal sizing range. So these are smaller than a 10x12 but... weigh 0.3lb more than the large? The plate also got thinner, at 1.13" versus 1.18" advertised. I only skimmed to see the table but I'll watch the vid in full tomorrow and cross the old Colossus vid for spec changes. I skipped past Buff dissecting the plates.

>63990281
Quick self correction, nominal for a large is 10.25x13", not 10.5x13.25". nominal per the table is the same.

I currently have the Vortex Strikefire 2 on my FPC Carbine and while it is a good optic I feel like it weighs down the gun way too much, and I also want to aim down sights faster.
Basically I want to make my FPC as lightweight as possible. What are /k/'s thoughts on the Sig Sauer ROMEO5. Also thinking of maybe putting a 3x magnifier possibly. The Sig and Juliet come around to $140.

ps: is paying $100 more for a romeo5 gen 2 worth it?

>>63990435
Correction. Its more like $120, assuming I buy the ROMEO5 Gen 2 it will all come to around $160 or more.

>>63990435
if you want it light, you're not gonna like the magnifier

>>63990281
I saw that too but it looks like the table has a typo. The plate's measurements are drawn on the plate at 10.5x13.125"
All in all performance seemed exactly in-line with the previous one. Mogs M993 as usual, stopping it at 3500 fps. Beats Swiss P again, which penetrated the XSAPI. M948 performance is like 4200fps V50, which is what people here previously assumed. Also stops 6.5mm tungsten-core at >3100 fps! This makes me wonder about XM1158.
All of the failures were after multiple hits, so I wonder how a "clean" plate would do against 7N37. . .

>>63990435
You barely save any weight with that, though. The Strikefire 2 is 7.2oz, and the Romeo5 with its mount is 5.1oz. You won't notice the difference, so why bother?

>>63990452
The Romeo5 comes in around $120 +/- $20. I would always recommend it over Vortex red dots. The faster refresh rate, longer battery life, and more modern design eats vortex dots. All my vortex dots that I acquired over the years are slowly migrating down my third string firearms and will eventually end up on something like a paintball or airsoft guns

>>63989898
They're so cheap. Is anything badly wrong with them?
Realistically, are they any worse than shit like the Tavor 12? Is the Saiga way better?

>>63989710

>>63989765
>How do you make sure vets are reaching out for help when they need it?
Let's punish vets when they reach out for help!

>>63989173
Nice infographic Anon. Only problem I have with it is criticizing the 3S9M for failing to stop M2AP isn't really much of a criticism. Its a Level 3 plate, it shouldn't be expected to do that.

>>63991061
Genius plan, if you're going for "comically evil" and "ungrateful".

>>63991052
Come to find out, telling the psychiatrist the truth always makes the situation worse.

>>63990435
>>63990452
Don't bother with the gen 2 anon its a meme just buy gen 1 its pretty much the same thing.

>>63989898
1) Who cares?
2) Why does this have anything to do with gq?
>Those ammo choices
I think you are running out of shit to do and need a new hobby
>>63988128
Baofeng uv9r + disco32 ptt
Nothing fancy but decently waterproof
>>63990435
Romeo5 + magnifier is going to be heavier than the strikefire. Romeo 5 not so good, get a holosun instead.
>Weighs the gun down too much
Post rifle, it probably isnt heavy you are likely just spending too much time in a hunt/on target position relative to other carry/ready positions.
Or you might be terminally weak which a new optic wont help with either

>>63991427
>I think you are running out of shit to do and need a new hobby
Been saying that for like half a year now. Guy refuses to take the hint.

>>63991427
not the infograph anon but why do you have comms when you have no one to talk to

>>63991427
>he arranged the little gloves to look like hands

>>63986029 (OP)
Can I get the hivemind's opinion on this particular piece of meme youtuber gear?
https://onwardresearch.com/product/crye-assaulters-placard/

>>63991671
Forgot the shoes as feet , biggest fail of my life
>>63991669
What makes you think that?
>>63991689
I much dislike tabbed pouches like that. If you like tabbed pouches then yeah go for it. it is decently made and indeeds hold shit.

Id rather an AVS molle + 3x2 flapped pouches or a AVS molle m4 flap with a flapped tenspeed infront of that.

>>63986036
Add safariland impulse earplugs, they're like 20 bucks. The pair I've got work great for outdoor rifle shooting and I double them up for indoor as well.

>>63991706
>What makes you think that?
NTA but baofeng users dont usually have friends to talk to. They just bought them to have a radio on their kit.

>>63991689
It looks fine if you want a turnkey version of something like that specifically for your Crye PC, but any triple mag shingle with a BFG triple mag thing stacked on its front will do the same thing slightly better for twice as much money and the trouble of DIYing it yourself.

>>63991912
I bought my (armed) friends radios and programmed them myself. They're cheap, easy fix.

>>63990961
Good points, with some caveats I'll address later once I've reviewed both Colossus vids. This is worth closer examination since Adept continues to be certless and all we got to go on are vids and test reports with their own caveats.
>>63991091
Thanks. My beef with the 3S9M is the same as the Hesco 3814. Costs as much as a mid range Level IV, but is about as thick and only slightly lighter. B-32 is a rare CONUS threat.
>>63991427
We absorbed /pfg/, it is necessary.
>>63991669
Annoy hams on the monthly net.

>>63991912
Yes, thats exactly why I suggested it to the anon who said that.

>>63991912
I bought a baofeng for my 1 friend too

We haven't used them in the 7 years since, but one of these days!

>>63991968
So you bought and programmed unencrypted analog ham radios for your friends to larp with. If you ever use them you'll probably just piss off some hams. You know everyone can hear what you say on those right? You know they are easily fucked with right? Direction finding FM HTs is trivial. In a tactical use case they are liabilities not assets. They are good entry radios for new hams because they have a lot of ham relevant features and they're cheap. They are not good tactical radios. You don't care about the ham features and they lack what you do need.

>>63991971
>necessary
No, talking about turkshit shotguns in /gq/ is not necessary

>>63989511
> poorfag builds
I have been summoned

>>63991993
Incorrect. Their magazines are fuckheug and need different pouches. Pouches are gear.
>>63991021
It's like buying Chinese plates. Wide range of QC levels, corners can be cut on machining, and they got quirks and come with caveats.
People rep the VR-80 a lot versus Saigas, but everyone running the former tricks them out like a '98 civic.

>>63991986
That's the benefit of programing them yourself before giving it to friends who don't know what the fuck they are doing, you sync the channel numbers so that you can keep them off Ham freq
>Just keep it on channel 3
And unencrypted is fine if you train for comm discipline, once I get a laminator I am going to make a cheat sheet with frequencies, codes and randomized check in times to keep with the radios

>>63992009
Then they can come and ask for advice 1 at a time, and we'll laugh at them for trying to build a kit around turkshit shotguns
Bullying is the only way some people learn

>>63992038
Very good! If they will not listen, the infographic will at least keep them away from the Tokarev / Black Aces / Gayrasaar shitsticks.

>>63991912
Lol wut? Where did you even get this? I have at least 5 people I know that have one. We only use them when we go camping or innawoods though. I'm not chatting with them on my radio instead of just using our group chat.

>>63991986
t. ham
>So you bought and programmed unencrypted analog ham radios for your friends to larp with
Its for emergencies only, in which case, a ham license is not required or the FCC no longer has any authority.
>If you ever use them you'll probably just piss off some hams
hams hardly use 2M/70CM outside of some kind of IRL event, even if someone did care, what are they going to do? I have a gun.
>You know everyone can hear what you say on those right?
Have you ever tried to find a frequency or signal by just scrolling up and down the band? its harder than you think unless someone has dedicated RDF/sigint tech.
>Direction finding FM HTs is trivial.
Trivial with expensive hardware that even most hams dont care enough to buy.
>In a tactical use case they are liabilities not assets.
A single set of radios could have changed the outcome of the revolutionary war.

>>63992050
reddit

>>63992056
based amateur

>>63991986
Right attitude, wrong execution
If anon has a handful of goofballs with AR15s they arent going to be running a big ass TOC with baofengs or using them to coordinate to adjacent units. They are basically yelling++ for anons. Regardless of their EM signature they are going to get gobbled up in the first contact with anyone who has that sort of EM capability anyway because its a half dozen guys with no logistics.
>>63991993
Second this motion
Motion to dismiss turkshit shotgun infographic is passed.
>>63992015
>frequencies, codes and randomized check in times to keep with the radios
Probably not the shit to write down and leave on people
>>63992056
>its harder than you think unless someone has dedicated RDF/sigint tech.
Frequency counter if close enough, spectrum analyzer, scanner with close call or any sort of SDR will digest the entire baofeng range almost instantly and are all pretty common.
Dedicated coherent SDRs doing TOA/DOA are also much easier to get and field portable in CY+0
>expensive hardware
Idk lets not go this far with it. Chinkshit has made this gear cheaper than most yaesu HTs

>>63992015
So you're just sitting on GMRS/FRS the most used bands in the nation?
>>63992056
t.also ham
>Its for emergencies only, in which case, a ham license is not required or the FCC no longer has any authority.
I didn't actually criticize unlicensed use. IDGAF about that. The important part is drawing the attention of fudd hams that do.
>hams hardly use 2M/70CM outside of some kind of IRL event,
Untrue, the local 70cm repeater to me is very busy. Don't assume your area is the same as everywhere.
>Have you ever tried to find a frequency or signal by just scrolling up and down the band?
You dont do it that way. Fox hunting is actually a pretty popular activity in the hobby. Again, just because you don't do it doesnt mean nobody else does. You should look it up, its pretty fun, ham clubs will make events out it hiding transmitters, whoever finds it first usually gets a prize. SDRs are also getting cheaper and better by the day and there's no lack of guys building DIY SIGINT boxes to detect and locate common radio bands. Its really moved beyond that, they are building DIY drone detectors based on the control signals now. You are either very new to this hobby or very out of touch with it.
>A single set of radios could have changed the outcome of the revolutionary war.
No shit Sherlock. The British didn't radios let alone SIGINT capabilities. But that's hardly relevant to today now is it?

>>63992112
Perhaps but its really hard to theory craft this kind of shit without knowing how things actually evolve. Basic SIGINT to handle analog FM is within the reach of anyone with google and the inclination these days. It doesn't take much effort to at least put yourself above the capabilities of your average local LEO though.

>>63991972
What GL is that? I want a really small 40mm system to check off the "I'm American, I can own a grenade launcher" box and as a fidget toy to live on my desk.

>>63991993
This.

>>63992124
The better argument is that in really small units you shouldnt have radios because you shouldnt be outside line of sight or small arms range from your element in such a small qty.
Radios are useful for talking to people and assets really far away. I dont need to hear you key up to say "reloading".
>>63992140
ML37 that I cut down and made a couple custom parts for.

>>63992112
You have to be basically next to the transmitter to pick up the frequency with a handheld frequency counter. An SDR would be a good tool for the job but theres a lot of traffic in the 2M/70CM band to sift through to find the right signal. A scanner that picks out louder signals could be effective, but it would also find other loud signals, and again, theres a lot of traffic on these bands.
>Chinkshit has made this gear cheaper
I'm probably not up to date, but last I checked vehicle mounted RDF arrays were ~$800.

>>63992124
>The important part is drawing the attention of fudd hams that do.
If things get so bad that I have to get the bois together, Elmer Fudd is going to be stuck in his radio shack not giving a flying fuck about some dingos with HTs using 12.5khz of the 2m band.
>Untrue, the local 70cm repeater to me is very busy
Sure, repeaters get traffic but hardly any hams are just scrolling the 2m/70cm bands looking for illegal stations or even other hams.
>Fox hunting
The transmitter frequency is usually given in a fox hunt.
>But that's hardly relevant to today now is it?
1 radio is still better than 0 radio

>>63992124
>So you're just sitting on GMRS/FRS the most used bands in the nation?
For training, yeah
If it's not training I'll tell them to go on channels 5-9

>>63992112
>Probably not the shit to write down and leave on people
Ah, that's where only having 1 friend comes in, if they get got I have no one to talk to anyway

>>63992199
>Freq Counter
A handheld chink one will get you ~100m for a 5w HT which is honestly way more than you'd imagine.
>but theres a lot of traffic in the 2M/70CM band to sift through to find the right signal. A scanner that picks out louder signals could be effective, but it would also find other loud signals, and again, theres a lot of traffic on these bands.
Any coherent system will track and record with ease. $100 SDRs are eating 20mhz at a time , $100 SAs the russians are using will eat 100mhz at a time with the ability to tie into coherents for DF
>I'm probably not up to date, but last I checked vehicle mounted RDF arrays were ~$800.
~$500 for something manpackable.
>>63992241
You've heard of OTP
Now get ready for one time friends

>>63992199
>If things get so bad that I have to get the bois together, Elmer Fudd is going to be stuck in his radio shack not giving a flying fuck about some dingos with HTs using 12.5khz of the 2m band.
You dont understand. Just having radios isn't enough. You have to train with them to be any useful. When are you doing that? After SHTF already started?
>Sure, repeaters get traffic but hardly any hams are just scrolling the 2m/70cm bands looking for illegal stations or even other hams.
You have no way of knowing how many people nearby have SDRs running at any time looking for traffic passively. Its a hobby unto itself and many aren't even hams. SDRs are cheap and plentiful, most IT departments have at least one dude that's into it these days.
>The transmitter frequency is usually given in a fox hunt.
Depends on the event and the difficulty
>1 radio is still better than 0 radio
Unless the other side is capable of listening to your comms or finding the transmitter in which case its a liability. There's a lot of guys over the years that got smoked because of that. And it doesn't take the US military to do it either.
>>63992153
Radios have a lot of good uses. I think analog HTs are fine for learning the basics and training. Operationally they aren't very useful. DIY'ing MANET with voice codec over meshtastic seems to be the way forward with DIY comms. Way less bullshit than dealing with second hand motos and not as compromised as chinkshit DMRs. You can also tie so much in.

>>63992252
>voice codec over meshtastic
Based walking CW

>>63992252
>You have to train with them to be any useful.
Knowing to transmit low power, short messages, and infrequently doesn't require training.
>You have no way of knowing how many people nearby have SDRs running
Yeah you're right theres 100 CIA glowniggers actively watching my position every time I hit the PTT.
>Unless the other side is capable of listening to your comms
Radios have multiple uses. Commands to shift fire, move, or target callouts aren't useful intel. Not every transmission is going to be about my secret hidden stash of guns hidden innawoods, and the ones that are can be made using codes or codewords.

>>63992250
>A handheld chink one will get you ~100m
I can barely get mine to pick up the right frequency across the room, maybe I need to get a new one.
>Any coherent system will track and record with ease.
And how many people are running these? This isn't nearly as much of a threat as you think they are.

>>63992321
How do you square
>Knowing to transmit low power, short messages, and infrequently doesn't require training.
with
>Commands to shift fire, move, or target callouts
exactly? If you dont practice giving those commands and carrying them out then you are going to find the first time you try its going to suck. Tactical comms is a skill that takes training. Under stress you fall back on that training. If you have none then you'll just fuckup. Your approach is the same as saying I dont need to train with my rifle, its zeroed and I know what a good sight picture is. Ok faggot.
>aren't useful intel.
Confidently wrong. You dont know what you dont fuckling know. Its clear you are new to this and too proud to admit it.
>theres 100 CIA glowniggers actively watching my position every time I hit the PTT.
I already told you it doesn't take a glowie. Just every other Anon who took it more seriously than you.

>>63992321
Okay but how many of those can you just yeet a flaming rock, whistle, clicker, etc?
>>63992340
I cant give you an exact number but its a large number domestically and is part of global adversary toolkit. Yeah your local barefooted homeless guy stealing powertools doesnt have sigint, but he also doesnt pose much of a threat to the GOONS and their band of musketeers.
>Never ask about the new antennas on your local airport tower.

>>63992349
Hearing "shoot that guy" and comprehending it doesn't require training.
Tell me how the enemy hearing this would be useful intel.
>Confidently wrong.
Not an argument
>I already told you it doesn't take a glowie
If you were to guess, whats the ratio of people with Baofengs to people with RDF equipment currently in the US? I'd guess around 1000:1.

>>63992355
>flaming rock, whistle, clicker, etc?
radio go farther
>large number domestically
picrel

>>63992355
>Never ask about the new antennas on your local airport tower.
The important thing Anons need to realize is that basic SIGINT is within the reach of anyone these days. And prepping is a popular enough hobby for young men that there is bound to be people in your area actively doing it. And living in bum fuck doesn't necessarily save you because there's no shortage of dudes like that who intentionally moved to rural areas as part of their planning. If any Anon can do it then that sets a very low bar for it and your expectation should be that its a fairly common threat. Your comms plan should incorporate that. And even if you don't care about SIGINT, Ham and FRS/GMRS are pretty small in the grand scheme of things. Chinkshit analog HTs are liable to get swamped with all the traffic from every other faggot that bought one on Amazon when shit goes down. I'm constantly picking up GMRS traffic on a normal day. During an emergency its a mess.
>>63992386
>Hearing "shoot that guy" and comprehending it doesn't require training.
It helps me figure out how many of you there are, your level of training and sophistication (not much) what you are doing and depending on how bad at this you are (very) you're going to give away your location and what you think you know about me too. And that's at bare minimum.

>>63992386
>If you were to guess, whats the ratio of people with Baofengs to people with RDF equipment currently in the US? I'd guess around 1000:1.
Since homeless powertool man didnt get the point across;
How many people have night vision goggles compared to glock 19s?
I guess I dont need to worry about NVGs!
>Radio go farther
And you dont see why this could be an issue?
>Picrel
There are coherent systems on every regional or greater airport tower now thanks to israel.

>>63992396
>how many of you there are
>your level of training and sophistication
>what you are doing
>your location
None of this is useful to an enemy who is currently being attacked. They know what i'm doing (attacking them), they know what level of training we have and how sophisticated we are (because we're attacking them), they know what we're doing (attacking them), they know where we are (the place we're shooting at them from).

>>63992413
Ultimately, how important RDF is depends on who your adversary is. Looters? zero. Basically any federal agency besides the FCC or DoD? zero. Other preppers? near zero. Local Police? zero. Hams? who cares.
>And you dont see why this could be an issue?
radio go shorter too
>airport tower
these are useful for tracking planes, not infantry.

>>63992651
>None of this is useful to an enemy who is currently being attacked.
All of that is extremely important information. Who exactly do you plan on fighting? Is your hypothetical SHTF scenario strictly made up of similar small teams of dudes with no support? The ability to relay pertinent information is one of the most important things you can do in contact with the enemy.
>these are useful for tracking planes, not infantry.
You are not infantry. Infantry has training, organization and command structure.

>>63992386
Just join squad as a Squad Leader and i'll see how well you do with comms. Fucking idiot. It takes practice to communicate succinctly

>>63986029 (OP)
>Wild Geese Edition
great movie mad mike was a cunt though and not well liked

>>63992124
>No shit Sherlock. The British didn't radios let alone SIGINT capabilities
sigint has been around for 3000 year the British certainly did have ciphers

https://allthingsliberty.com/2019/06/decoding-british-ciphers-used-in-the-south-1780-81/

conwalis used Balfour’s Alternative Cipher as well as common codewheel cipher

>>63992682
>Cryptography
>not Signals intelligence
Anon, radio waves hadn't even been discovered in 1776. It would be a century before Maxwell characterized them. How the fuck do you have signals intelligence if signals aren't a thing? You are thinking of cryptography which is a completely separate, but related field when you are encrypting your communications.

>>63992386
I suggest you read the The R.O.T.C. Infantry Manual, educate yourself one from the 70s would do

>>63992665
Any information you said could be deduced from radio interception could also be easily observed firsthand and relayed to support elements.

>Infantry has training, organization and command structure.
Infantry is a word to describe ground troops. Needless ad-hominem because you're butthurt.

>>63992665
muh bideo gaem

>>63992693
>You are not infantry. Infantry has training, organization and command structure.
sigint IS cryptography either by semaphone, smoke sigbals or fucking drums and baofengs champ
t. knower

>>63992698
>Infantry is a word to describe ground troops.
wrong. Infantry are orgsnised, equipped and trained. You are none of these things, you donlt even have the knowledge of infantry basics like communication methodology using radios let alone basic manouvres.

>>63992698
>Infantry is a word to describe ground troops.
You aren't that either lol. You're at best a militia but even that implies some degree of organization.
>Needless ad-hominem because you're butthurt.
lol you're the one getting mogged in the comments. I'm just still here to watch you squirm and continue to move the goalposts.
>>63992704
No, there is a difference. intercepting unencrypted transmissions is still signals intelligence. And cryptography strictly is about well cryptography. They are related but not the same thing. These terms are not interchangeable. SIGINT doesn't even have to involve decrypting encrypted transmissions. If my goal is to just locate the source and call for fires I don't really care what they're saying.

>>63992712
Stop talking to me you know literally nothing about sigint you're just a bullshitter. Sigint is thousands of years old and signals can use a vast variety of means and is not exclusive to wireless communications and never has been.

>>63992651
>Looters? zero. Basically any federal agency besides the FCC or DoD? zero. Other preppers? near zero. Local Police? zero.
Extremely narrowminded and flawed perspective but okay
>Radio go shorter too
People do EME at 1W, 3mW being the record.
Be better
>these are useful for tracking planes, not infantry.
I didnt realize a big tower didnt give me LOS against infantry. Silly me.
>>63992666
It doesnt even get that far
Half these motherfuckers have like RPSMA connected to SMA and doing radio checks for 45 minutes because they have never used for their comms for shit or fuck. Ham radio people are gay and stupid but atleast they have the knowledge required to actually make the radio work. Nothing beats DF walking ISR over the people who are sitting there trying to figure out their 12 radio setups and turn them into two working radios over the course of 45 minutes.

Nothing will blackpill you on radios faster than watching people try to use them.

>>63992721
LMAO, it takes two seconds to prove your ass wrong.
>Signals intelligence (SIGINT) is one of the central intelligence disciplines, focusing on collecting and analyzing signals that contain data or information. These signals can include communications (such as phone calls and emails) and electronic emissions (such as radar and telemetry).

You have no fucking idea what you're talking about.
>>63992735
>Nothing will blackpill you on radios faster than watching people try to use them.
fucking preach

I put a curse on yous all. Fuck ya raduo

>>63992769
NTA but you need to be 18 to post here.
lmao at "SIGINT = wireless comms". Intercepting the light flashes from a naval signal lamp = SIGINT.

So instead of armor autism now we have faggy radio arguing
>>63992862
based curseanon

>>63992888
Radio autism is always better than armor autism
RIP LMJ

>>63992888
I'm casually on the hunt for a goodish radio so radio autism is good.

>>63990961
>I saw that too
Buffman does write the actual measurements on the plates, not the nominal going off the XRT and Aliex PE tests, so a typo on the table indeed. Regardless, the plates are around 5.6oz (0.35lb) overweight. This isn't a massive discrepancy but it's worth noting. The plate is also 1.13" and not advertised 1.18", so there are some other variances.
>All in all performance seemed exactly in-line with the previous one.
Well, yes, except that this one did lose to fair hit M2AP at 3,280 (pretty sure 3,180ft/s was also a typo going off chrono #2).
>Mogs M993 as usual, stopping it at 3500 fps
I'm seeing 3,430ft/s at the most for either test going off pic rel. Point stands. Notably, it seems to have a somewhat harder time with hot steel-core M2AP. Backer might be giving out before the strike face does.
>Beats Swiss P again, which penned XSAPI
Yes, but Buffman wrenched the XSAPI test and used generic white label soft instead of milspec backers. XSAPIs are an ICW plate, not standalone, so it is a stop if the round beats the plate but is caught by the backer. In that case, plate #2 stopped Swiss P AP (once) even with mystery meat soft armor.
>M948 performance is like 4200fps V50
Cannot calculate v50 off of two shots, one sample. Coin flip.
>Also stops 6.5mm tungsten-core at >3100 fps!
Certainly, but he only fired one shot, so is that v0 or v50?
>This makes me wonder about XM1158
Swiss P AP and M993 are both very dated, the former is from 1998. I would wager M1158 is still out of bounds.
>so I wonder how a "clean" plate...
Because Buff abides by fair hit rule when he can and the Colossus is PM-12, this is a multi-hit plate and should be able to crack-arrest / localize backer deformation accordingly.

So while this test is good, there's the weight. Also, referring to the 2024 and 2022 test reports, same round similar velocity and the BFD went up a lot in 24. These tests are still no substitute for NIJ cert, which all of Adept's plates lack.

>63993277 (2/2)
If we also then add the old M993 test report to the mix (pic rel), we see again that the Colossus... used to do better BFD-wise versus the more recent test report. This one is 6.48lb, 9.5x11.5", so it's slightly undersized and very slightly underweight. Nonetheless, it starts in the twenties just as the 2/8/22 Colossus did v. swiss p, versus the 12/24 Colossus starting out at 30.56mm BFD against swiss p, raising to an N/A (>44mm?) and a 43.6 at the end. Yes, M993 is an easier threat than Swiss P AP, but not astronomically and threat level does not always correlate directly to BFD. See how the RMA XRT nearly bombs BFD against M80 but is cleaner against B-32 API on RMA's own reports.
So while, yeah, I'm nitpicking, it is evident that the Colossus is not a super consistent plate and there are notable manufacturing variances even among plates that are sent to affiliate youtubers and test labs. What about plates that are 99% likely will never be shot? The ones going to consumers?
Even here, the plate is almost always north of the advertised weight when Adept's site mentions no variance.
>Regular: 6.5 pounds, 10×12″, 1.18″ thick.
>Large: 8.1 pounds, 10.25×13″, 1.18″ thick.
So long story short, this sucker needs to get NIJ certified and should have been certified three years ago. They keep sending plates to youtubers and test labs instead of getting a cert, all the while even bruh-tier Safelife has four - which is the same number Hesco was suspended and then had to supplant with whole new models in 1-2 years.
Looks great on youtube, but why so afraid of the NIJ? That's the big question. The other question is where the hell they make the things. Buff says Europe, but the address that was on their site is a carboline warehouse.

>>63993143
With the hams in the room, could be a good time for a feedback round on the regular radio guide.

>>63992001
kinda kino honestly. curious how the silhouette looks when worn, could you post a pic?

>>63992693
fwiw you could probably consider intercepted pigeons as SIGINT

>>63993314
>>63993277
Good review. Armor autism is back, baby.
There seems to be a discrepancy on Buffman's chart again, where he gives the weight as 3.81kg, which is 8.39 pounds rather than 8.45.
Also, the large plate is slightly larger than advertised. (13.15" vs. 13"), so that could partially account for the weight difference.
That aside, the plates look very consistent to me? Almost so consistent, and with so much data out there, that you can use them to benchmark super-AP ammo. Like, if something reliably penetrates a clean Colossus, it's an unbelievably badass round, even better than M948 at 4200 fps and M993 at >3400.

>>63993383
Valid points! However, if the plate is so consistent, why not spring for an NIJ cert? The ballpark cost of everything is around $40,000, but that investment will easily pay for itself by LE dept purchases and the NIJ BVP grant system. PDs can be reimbursed up to 50% of the cost for NIJ-cert armor. Colossus for $325 minus batch / LE discounts. Would sell like hotcakes.
It's a large batch test with random FIT follow up tests too. That's the largest distinction between NIJ and youtube, albeit just one .30-06 M2AP a plate. A much, much easier threat. Why not?

>>63992001
This actually looks cool and practical, though you ought to spring for a PASGT or spray-painted ACH to complete the look, unless you're really in the tropics.

>>63993383
Also forgot to mention, but what's still true is that:
1. The 2012-era Protech 2230 still mogs the Colossus on M2AP v0, 3,500ft/s. The Colossus is comparable here to the discontinued Highcom 4SAS12. Mid-3,250ft/s rough v50. The Colossus' TiB2-doped SiC strike face is strong, but the PE backer is meh. Also, the strike face could be thicker.
It would do better as a 7.5lb plate that can stop anything.
2. Aside from .50 cal plates, the strongest plate out there is now the FORT ACP-M @ 2x 7N37, followed possibly by the Protech 2230, then the Colossus, then maybe the Ceradyne 96034 (1x Swiss P) depending on how much you buy the claims about that plate.

>>63992001
more like soulfag

>>63993481
> Ceradyne
RIP
> FORT ACP-M @ 2x 7N37
What makes you believe this? Literally every single time Ukrainian/Russian plates were tested, they failed to meet claims. I mean EVERY single time. Hyperion was shilled on the /bag/ guide until two or three separate tests found that the plates are made out of wet cardboard.

>>63993486
You know, I think that the carpet is doing a lot of work there.

>>63993493
Because FORT is Russia's best armor manufacturer and the specs check out. It's nine pounds, 10x13", Silicon Carbide backed by Chromium Carbide then an aramid backer, and it's ICW too. A plate that heavy can logically stop 7N37, and the plate is FSB issue too so it's going to the Russians with money, unlike cardboard fake ass granits.
Hyperion claimed the impossible. Seven pound plates that could stop multiple 7N37 or no less than THIRTY B-32M API on a 10x12. Revolutionary super titanium crack arrestor! Please.

>>63993503
Nobody has ever seen one, nobody has ever tested one, and the specs don't even check out. Chromium carbide is way heavier than alumina and almost as heavy as steel. A plate like that wouldn't be nine pounds at 10x13".
Hyperion was such astounding bullshit, I'm still pissed off about it.

>>63993516
Of course, the ACP-M is as nebulous as Adept's European facility, lol. The Chromium Carbide layer is allegedly very thin and only functions as a last ditch core-breaker before things get to the backer.
It's also really 10lb when you add soft armor. Stupidly heavy to stop something that's rare as hell and got supplanted twice. First by 7N37M in 2017, then 7N51 long-core like last year. The Colossus Heavy, rated for .50 cal AP, 10x12, is 0.6lb lighter!
Russia's armor still sucks man, and I don't know how anybody fell for Hyperion. Rule of thumb, if it beats the best Ceradyne could offer, it needs some serious scrutiny.

>>63993546
If the ACP-M exists, it kind of goes to show that most plates beat most AP rounds -- but some AP rounds, like 7N51 or .50 cal AP, beat all plates that aren't retarded thick and heavy.

>>63993573
Then again, both the ACP-M and the Colossus Heavy are about the same weight as a 10x12" AR500 plate with "FragLock", and that won't even stop M193, lmao

>>63989710
Genius, you can an hero via Serpa and your family will still be able to collect on your life policy

>>63993625
You think that guy has a life policy?

>>63993573
I agree completely. I think you can break rounds into four camps.
1. The garden variety, composed of everything from pistol ammo to M855 / M193, then M855A1 to M80A1, M61, B-32, M2AP. Rounds that can pierce certain varieties of armor but comfortably all fall within the proxy envelope of NIJ RF3 / Level IV.
2. The brute-forcers. Rounds that brute force their way through armor by virtue of just being fuckheug. .50 BMG and 12.7x108 / 14.5x114. Even in non-AP versions these rounds can produce excessive behind-armor-blunt-trauma and beat plates that aren't up to par.
3. The less-garden variety. Entry level tungsten core AP. M993, Swiss P AP, 5.56 M995 and AP4. These can be handled by a higher rung of plates, like either XSAPI or Colossus or LTC 28601, etc.
4. The next-gen, composed of the real nasty threats like 7N37, M1158, XM1184, SmKH, 7N37M, 7N51 (pic rel), then the harder .338 APs like AP529, API526, M1154 (M1158's big bro), M1214 mini-Raufoss, and the rumored 7N45. M948 falls kinda half into this camp, half into camp #2, but the Swedish SLAP (PTR 10 PRICK) is firmly camp #4.

You can have plates in camp #2 that lose to camp #3-4 threats. You can have plates in camps #3-4 that lose to camp #2 because of how the relationship between strike face and backer works with modern ceramics. The old Ceradyne .50 cal plates can handle .50 BMG M33 at a certain velocity, probably a lot better than a FORT ACP-M can, but I wouldn't trust those boron carbide / fiberglass Ceradynes to not amorphize against 7N37 and other WC-core penetrators. You need a stronger strike face to handle tougher cores, but you need more backer to control resulting fragments and minimize BFD / resulting BABT.

>63993654
>M948 falls kinda half into this camp, half into camp #2,
Whoops, meant to say camp #3 here.

>>63993628
I don't even have a family

>>63993578
>Then again, both the ACP-M and the Colossus Heavy are about the same weight as a 10x12" AR500 plate with "FragLock", and that won't even stop M193, lmao
Preach. If your options are steel or a 7N37-stopping 10lb double-strike-face ceramic solution, the choice is obvious.
Something funny is that the ACP-M must be rather brittle, because (IIRC) it's rated for 2x 7N37 or 5x 5.45x39 7N39. Going off those specs alone, it is possible it would technically fail the NIJ Level III test (6x 7.62x51 M80) merely from the high multi-hit requirement against benign threats.
It is not uncommon for AP-focused high-level plates to lose to the Level III test. Sometimes even half the Level III test with added training wheels, like pic rel RMA 1155.

>>63993662
We are your family now

>>63986029 (OP)
Say, has there ever been a winter gear infographic put up yet?

>>63992876
Keep seething.
>>63993353
There's an RFC for IP over avian carriers so I'll allow it.
>>63993503
>The MiG-25 is the Soviet's best fighter of course it can do mach 3 and has an awesome look down shoot down radar
>>63993674
One thing I've been curious to test but too busy to follow up on is see if AR500 is even the best steel for defeating bullets. There's a few candidates I want to try.

>>63993764
nta but you're retarded

>>63993764
>One thing I've been curious to test but too busy to follow up on is see if AR500 is even the best steel for defeating bullets.
Out of the armor steels I always figured it was Mars / Armox, then MIL-46100, then the garage steels with AR500 being the worst but progressively harder options being more brittle and compromising on multi-hit. Tactical scorpion has AR700, which peculiarly only seems to exist in shield form. Highcom being Highcom has an "AR1000" which is really just MIL-46100 or similar, quite close to AR500.

>>63993825
All of those steels are pretty old and relatively simple 20th century alloys. There's definitely better, more modern ones available today. But their high cost makes them prohibitively expensive for mass production.

>>63993936
>But their high cost makes them prohibitively expensive for mass production.
You do that and you eliminate the raison d'être for steel body armor to exist, really. Are any of these steels competitive, even in a composite (steel+PE, a la AMI TAC3S) solution, against even the LTC 19513?
The one argument I can make in favor of steel is the NIJ fair hit rule. NIJ 0101.06 7.6.2, the minimum shot-to-shot distance shall be 51mm. In other words, if a Level III plate for example is struck by two M80 and the second hits within two inches of the first, the plate is NOT required to stop that second round.
This rule obviously accommodates ceramics very well, given the issues of crack propagation especially with lower end monolithics. Steel plates, at least the good ones, care much less about shot spacing. You cannot force them like you can ceramics by incidentally getting two rounds close to each other. However, that's not an excuse to be rolling 9.5lb plates that struggle against M193 and spall bullets into your limbs and face.

>>63993968
>You do that and you eliminate the raison d'être for steel body armor to exist, really.
Absolutely. Its also why you don't see more steel plates wrapped in kevlar. That would solve the frag problem but would also make them as expensive as entry level ceramic.
>Are any of these steels competitive, even in a composite (steel+PE, a la AMI TAC3S) solution, against even the LTC 19513?
No idea, that's why I wanted to test them. But shooting PM steel bar stock aint cheap.

Lookit what I found for 100 euro in a second hand clothes store. I identify it as a Ratnik reversible overcoat, and it is awesome, and I think I did a good purchase regardless, but I would like to be able to tell if this is official Russian issue, something identical from an alternate provider, or a civilian market issue. I can find no markings anywhere and there is no face veil BUT there seems to be buttoning for one. Can anyone enlighten me on that?

>>63994912
Looks real, in terms of coloration. The pants have a special little sleeve that the tag tucks into, the smock may have something similar; check the pockets. But really they were widely available up until the invasion so I don't think they were reproduced much or at all; the ones for the civilian market were just same technikom production minus the foliage loops on the shoulders.

>>63994912
Its legit. pic related, if there are any stamps on the tag then youll know its issued. If its blank, then it was sold on ebay by some quartermaster.

>>63995204
(pic)

Who is worse?
Body armor guy who replies to himself OR Infographic guy who has never touched equipment

ya mudda

>>63995347
They're the same person

>>63995365
There's two, can tell from writing style lurk more

>>63995347
They're literally the same guy. Armor autist #1 is the infographic guy.

>>63986099
There's a padded belt for PLCE you can find for around 20bucks on Ebay, called hipo pad, if you want more comfort

>>63995397
It's the same dude.

>>63986029 (OP)
Whats the consensus on Kejo?
https://www.bodyarmorcompany.com/product/kejo-special-forces-helmet-2/
Any verification on their rating? They dont even list the weight if their helmet so it doesnt seem like a serious company.

>>63995784
>Paypal
>Venmo
It's a scam website

>>63995784
>Clone stamped out the bottom of the image where the watermark would be
Hell yeah bro send it

>>63995784
They're white-labeling Chinese helmets, visors, etc. The website is real shady. As >>63995799 mentioned the lack of a legit payment processor is a red flag among many. Is this... F grade Chinesium? Pass on this shit like SERBAN .50 cal schizoplates.

>>63995784
lol just buy a surplus ACH Anon.

>>63995799
>>63995811
>>63995819
>>63995916
Thank you, ill stay clear

>>63995784
>high cut
Even if it were legit, this is a bad product.

>>63986029 (OP)
I have a bunch of shit that came with surplus I wanted like 30 belts and 55 cargo strap clamps in a bag, naval gunnery book, metal sling clips, 27 3.5' belts of reassembled fired 5.56... shit.
Should I make a sale thread here or like what? Facebook?

>>63996411
Why, what do you use?

>>63996443
In Ukraine high-cuts now are seriously frowned upon. Viewed as unsuitable for real war where fragments are the primary killer.

>>63996443
ACH

What LBE/ Webbing+Pouches is this guy wearing?

Poast H-harness inspo

>>63991706
>>63991427
What’s the tegris frame on the inside of the PC? Some Crye product I’m unawares of? Looks like it would chafe like a sonofabitch

>>63996494
Harness says SFLCS to me
Pouches say LBT 1195K to me
So anyones guess

Classic m60 pouches up front for sure
>>63996570
Prototype universal structural carrier harness
>Chaff
As long as you are shaped like a dorito and not a pear you will be fine. The edges terminate before the edges of the carrier anyway so you cant feel it.

>>63986163
You are not forgotten.

>>63986036
>>63986094
>>63989328
>>63989400
>>63991897
All good ideas, made a quick edit to earpro anon's infographic.

>>63986099
Need to add SOTECH LISS.

>>63997013
>>63986163
You are not forgotten, and here you go. Quickly-updated belt kit guide.

>>63997012
>>63997052
You need a new hobby bro

>>63997062
Don't worry, I've reached what I think is a good stopping point. Soonish, I'll upload all infographics to an album on some site and take a break for a while so I can focus on other things.

>>63997052
Thanks infobro, and your hobby is as valid as gear collecting itself, albeit much more autistic.

>>63997153
Glad to be of austistance. My goal was to finish what /bag/anon started and modernize the old infographs, which I believe was met and then some.

>>63997052
Info of interest, there exists the materials such as cordura thread spools that will let you bypass a lot of costs at the expense of swallowing hours in securely sewing in the webbings that hold the rings that hold the harness. I just spent +4 hours making my $40 non-harness belt be able to attach a separate H-harness

>>63997167
I think you did gud InfoAnon.

>>63997430
>>63997153
>>63997062
Well, the time has come! May I introduce the /gq/ Infographic Emporium. Thank you to everyone who provided feedback & suggestions, both positive and negative, as well as to /bag/anon, the other armor autists, earpro anon, and others.
https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6

>>63997461
Good, you can finally shut the fuck up about your needlessly bloated infographics. I hope you had fun, I sure didn't.

>>63997478
post multicam rig with $3000 generic AR and comms

>>63997478
>I hope you had fun
I sure did!
>I sure didn't.
What a shame.

>>63997478
infoanon is a pillar of the community and you are a tourist
back to r*ddit with you, sassy boy

>>63997478
you just blew in from reddit town pal?

Here's my remaining to-do list of infographics. As mentioned previously I'll be taking a break from infographing for a while, but will start back up to handle at least some of the below:

1. Holster infographic.
2. Shotgun infographic.
3. Winter gear infographic. (good suggestion, >>63993715)
4. Rifle infographic, modernizing the /pfg/ guide.
5. Pistol infographic. Same intent as above.
6. Bolt-action / large-caliber rifle infographic, with an emphasis on defeating armor.
7. Analog NV not-/pfg/ infographic. Will be drawing from the old /nvg/ copypastas / infographs for this.
8. HF radio guide redo, split into 3-4 parts.

>>63997523
>omg my anodizing doesn't match
This but un-ironically.

>>63997567
muh three mags high speed

>>63997596
3 mags is more than you would ever need

anyone got binocular recommendations? low/mid/high, tiers/price point

>>63997621
>Hey Carlos, this guy thinks you can get through the boog with ninety rounds

>>63997621
sorry pal but i carry 18 mags and its still not enough

>>63997621
>Need
lol, lmao even

>>63997659
Based MA33 condormaxxer.

what's the lightest lvl 4 plate I can get for under a thousand each?

>>63996494
Blackhawk LRAK. Its a copy of an LBT vest, but LBT isn't that big overseas so its almost certainly blackhawk.

>>63998055
Hesco 4601 for certified (6.4lb), Militech RF3 Black uncertified (6lb).

>>63997012
Thanks for the earpro guide.

>>63998756
You can probably get a pair of ESAPIs for less than $800. (Less than $500 if you get lucky when you happen to visit a surplus store near a military base.) Pair them with decent soft armor, and you're at around 6.5 pounds, but they probably perform a lot better than the 4601, and they're a lot cheaper too.

>>63997012
You're missing the best one:
> https://www.hearos.com/collections/all-consumer/products/xtreme-protection-series
NRR 33. Double up with those, and you might not get tinnitus even if you shoot all the time.

>>63998055
To add on this guy's question; are 3+'s worth the weight reduction and are any good? I don't think I'll get slapped by a 3006 tungsten round but if I do, I've earned it.

>>63995204
>>63994955

Okay guys you are good at this. I found the little pocket, I guess I didnt even recognize it as a pocket on my own, and these are the tags I found on the inside. Size and washing instructions I assume. Nothing that looks like depot markings though.

>>63998959
ESAPIs are great value, but you need to be cautious of three things.
1. Condition. The oldest ESAPIs are 20 years old and will have seen significant conditioning since that time. Look for inspection stickers on the back. The tap and torque tests are not 100% conclusive and a plate can pass both and still be compromised. Used ceramic armor can only be guaranteed with an x-ray.
2. Revision. ESAPIs revision A-F are somewhat weaker than a Hesco 4601 (1x M2AP, 60% against second M2AP, 3x required M80 versus 1x M2AP but very likely can do more or 6x required M80) multi-hit. G-H add M995 at 3,350ft/s and raise M2AP to 3x, making them much stronger. REV. J adds a higher v50 and is preferable. The latest GEN III ESAPIs have a higher BFD limit (58mm) versus NIJ plates and are lighter.
3. Soft armor. ESAPIs are ICW almost always and need soft armor to work. Milspec is ideal but you can sub with good, preferably cert non-mystery meat IIIA. Make sure it's good IIIA, it has to be or you may catch penned fragments.
>>63998970
Look for M855A1 and M80 protection like with the LTC 19513. III+ is all over the place since it's an unofficial spec. You save about a pound versus the 4601 or ESAPI + soft, over 2lb versus the 4403 and LTC's cheap Alumina IVs. Is that worth losing M2AP (steel, not tungsten except for a rare WHA heavy alloy variant from 1944), M80A1, M61, and other larger steel core threats to ya?

Talk to me about handwear, civili or military.

>>63999476
All gloves are consumable, some get consumed faster than others.
With that in mind ive been using the magpul gloves for a couple years now and they are pretty good. You will chew them up eventually but oh well.
>Gloves for warmth
Whole different story

>>63998967
Damn that's pretty good

>>63997566
Mostly lurking here but thanks a ton for those graphics and all the updates infoanon

Who here /Arktis/?

>>64000137
I have two pairs of arktis pants, with a third one I'm wanting to sell as I don't like how they designed it personally (waterproof pants). I like them. Are they as good as my crye pants? No. They were much cheaper though and in a camo pattern that crye doesn't offer without having to pay out the asshole for 100 pants. I'm still going to some day get the ukranian to make me a pair in the camo pattern I want however.

can someone id this jacket?

Apparently some shit's going down with Stealth Armor Systems.
>inb4 reddit
https://www.reddit.com/r/QualityTacticalGear/comments/1m2se98/poor_experience_with_stealth_armor_systems/

>>63993684
>Brush at the end of the barrel
LEWD. Does he have any idea how close her barrel is to his crotch if he brushes there?

>>64001390
He likes to love dangerously.

>>64001149
Reddit is for faggots.
Also, Reddit's main man Apex ships orders randomly and sometimes people have to wait for months. So "wah wah I didn't get my order in a week" is pure faggotry and possibly bullshit from that shady Ngroat guy.

>>63993431

He told me he would get the certified under NIJ and that was a couple months back so i assume its coming, but i would say its more leaning towards a EU market with VPAM testing from TNO and others.

As for origin the biggest "clue" should be the fact that tariffs on china never changed the pricing (Though i bet the EU tariffs will)

>>63993546

Honestly people where distrusting the Hyperion hype back then on Discord too, ofc now you can buy your own plates from Ukraine and test them if you want

FORT cant even make reasonably pure tiles.

>>63986277
> ESS
Has nobody improved eyepro since the GWOT-era?

>>63986046
>>64001596
Just saw the infographic. Looks like laser protection is the new thing, but nobody actually makes anything worth a damn apart from those brown glasses for $12?
Why would anybody pay >$200 for worse performance?
Is the brown tint too dark, reducing situational awareness?
Why aren't these things ranked by OD/wavelength in a more systematic way?

Man, I have so many questions.
But it looks like "the meta" in 2025 is brown-tinted polycarbonate for $12? If so, that's cool I guess? We should figure this out though./

>>64001498
Ah, the big guy himself!
>He told me he would get the certified under NIJ and that was a couple months back so i assume its coming
That's good. If the Colossus gets certified under 0101.07 and can pass a FIT, I have no further issues with it. My only question is why in the eight years Ganor has been active (counting Diamond Age) he's never gotten a single cert for anything. He's losing out on the LE market like crazy. Could be mogging Hesco here.
>but i would say its more leaning towards a EU market with VPAM testing
Very viable but NIJ certification can still never hurt. It's the dominant standard worldwide, and again, he's had eight years. VPAM is superior but lacks a public CPL you can check.
>As for origin the biggest "clue"
There are ways around tariffs. SMS never changed the pricing on their HFXC, did they? Holosun? RIX? For armor, Jinwudun? Jake could have brought a supply over from wherever, stocked it, and I doubt he's moving too many units so there's no need to raise prices. Adept is relatively unknown. They're like SAS, their marketing is basically Buffman and a couple other youtubers. When regular joes think armor, they think AR500, Spartan, RMA. When cops think armor, they think Safariland, Protech, Point Blank, maybe Hesco, Highcom.
>Honestly people where distrusting the Hyperion hype back then on Discord too
As I discussed above, the biggest clue is that they literally claimed the impossible. Thirty 7.62x54 B-32M API on a 10x12" 7lb monolithic SiC plate is impossible. We'd be talking quarter-inch shot spacing capabilities on a conventional SiC plate with a titanium crack arrestor. Diamond Age wasn't getting that with polycrystalline diamond!
>Though i bet the EU tariffs will
We will see. Ganor himself is originally from Hong Kong. It's not a killer if Adept sources materials from China - hell we glaze Militech all the time here - I'd just like to see some independent QC, large-batch.
>FORT
Hence why the ACP-M is a 10lb solution! It sucks!

>>64001634
> When regular joes think armor, they think AR500, Spartan, RMA.
Updated for 2025, the budget "best armor" comparison will have you laughing:
https://www.pewpewtactical.com/best-body-armor/
RMA didn't win an award because it let M80 Ball sneak through AGAIN!

>>64001667
Come to think of it, I'm actually pretty amazed that they really tested all of those shilled plates. It would have been easier and more profitable for them to hold an auction, and highest-bidder wins "best plate."

>>64001464
You're a touch behind on the reddit lore. Anything that takes more than a week to arrive is bad, and therefore RMA is the only viable armor manufacturer. Threw up a bit in my mouth saying that.
Anyways, I read through that entire exchange and, while I cannot prove it, I would not be surprised if that was a setup by Ngroat and an employee of his to try and disparage SAS.
1. Allan Douglas Bain, CEO of Stealth, and Nicholas Groat, CEO of Safelife, have beef going back years. There was a legal battle over Safelife's FRAS allegedly ripping off Bain's Hexar. I think Bain lost that one and Groat might be going in for the coup de gras since SAS is hurting. That would make him the only dealer in flexible rifle armor besides Tencate, who sells their shit to precisely nobody.
2. There's some inaccuracies.
>It doesn't help that he had the whole Dragon Skin scandal
Bad info. Bain here is getting thrown under the bus for shit Murray Neal did twenty years ago. He had nothing to do with Dragonskin from 1999-2016. The reason why Bain has flopped is because he can't distance himself from Neal's independent shenanigans with Pinnacle.
>There’s some MUCH larger issues going on than getting the runaround. They will surely come out in a matter of time.
According to Groat. I think I know what he's talking about.
>Yeah I believe the account deletions were done in an attempt to destroy evidence.
Referencing reddit and ebay accounts by Bain. I noticed a while ago that the ebay account offered to repair Phoenix (Neal!) dragonskin, which doesn't make sense since they're competitors, and also even had overruns from Phoenix IIRC.
My theory is that ever since his bankruptcy in 2013 or so, Neal has been working under the table for Bain. Neal's basically the most shitlisted guy in the armor industry, bar none, after the dragonskin scandal of 2006. It doesn't make sense that an ebay account (don't have it anymore to ref) would sell both Phoenix and SAS products simultaneously.

>>64001667
>https://www.pewpewtactical.com/best-body-armor/
>One of the two 7.62 NATO M80 shots managed to sneak one round through when it hit very close to a previous round.
Son of a bitch, and it was the 1155MC this time! Little known fact. The 1155 and 1165 both use the same strike face, just that the 1165 for realz actually uses a PE backer, so the same problem will keep happening across their entire Level IV lineup. I don't know what it is, their ceramics just can't crack-arrest for shit.
>>64001673
It's the overton window. If you normalize the shit brands, and make the competition just the shilled plates, people don't think to dig deeper and go for better budget options. I don't see the LTC 19513, 26605, or Hesco 4403 there.
>VS-PTBL2
Why... do they have an 0101.04 legacy model from velsys there for $335. The shit? Hang on, let's get the 4SUS4 in here. Why not! Who needs drop foam? Literally more expensive than the 4403 and worse in every way except weight. Awful list.

>>64001611
The S.P.E.C.S are surplus, or well, "surplus" and are being sold well below real value. I have two pairs and I can vouch that they're great against a green laser HFXC, but aren't jack shit to a 200mW glizzy or other equivalent dazzler. I don't think the OD against green wavelengths is very high. The green lens version is older, and from the 90s or so when green lasers were much rarer.
>>64001596
There's a massive supply of cheap surplus eyepro and no huge impetus to change things. It's not like armor where there's a hypebeast element driving change.
>>64001617
The brown-lens S.P.E.C.S are extremely cheap and very useful. Problem is twofold.
1. Because they have an OD rating against particular wavelengths, they do mute your red dot.
2. They aren't enclosed goggles and the splash from dazzlers and other wider lasers can go "around" the lens. Even the reflection from a 200mW laser can cause damage.

Anyone have experience with dank ass sweat smell in their surplus? Mine specifically smells like field BO. Tried smoker odor spray, Ozium, and a detergent scrub but didn't get very far, waiting on rubbing alcohol to dry atm.

>>64001634
>VPAM is superior but lacks a public CPL you can check.
VPAM has higher levels and more granularity but it lacks the rigor of NIJ. Nothing like FIT tests and no central database. Just independent labs test to the standard and sign off on it. Imagine how much bullshit we would have if NIJ worked the same way.

>>64002015
Agreed, and that's why when anyone thinks armor standard, it's levels I through IV - NIJ. Even in China GA141-2010 kneels to NIJ for most commercial purposes.
>Imagine how much bullshit we would have if NIJ worked the same way.
It'd basically be a return to the pre-CPL days of NIJ 0101.00, which was a 1971 shitshow of things that work, things that half work, and things that don't work at all and nobody knows which is which.
>higher levels and more granularity
The real reason why I think VPAM is superior at least in terms of ratings is just that it considers tungsten threats.14 levels (with manufacturer unofficial + and ++ here and there too...) are too damn many. Realistically all NIJ 0101.07 needs is M855 included in RF1 with M193, RF2 replacing M855 with M855A1, and a new RF4 being 1x 7.62x51 Swiss P AP @ 810m/s or preferably a 7N37 proxy and it'd be perfect.
Where VPAM falls short is precisely what was exemplified in Buff's Colossus retest. As shown by 7N37 and others, there is a colossal (hah) gap between VPAM PM-12 (Swiss P) and PM-13 where modern tungsten-core AP reigns supreme and there are virtually no plates up to the challenge. If you need more protection than PM-12, you basically have no choice but to step it up to .50 BMG AP plates.

>>64001063
The pants and the backpack cover look like the same colour and material. I can't even find anything on reverse google image search except that it's potentially Spanish Naval Infantry. I wouldn't be surprised if it was some kind of 'maritime assault suit' thing they get issued to board ships or do OTB things. The photo is also a very obviously staged promotional picture too.

If you want a coyote brown rain jacket for your larp antics you can get a similar looking one from probably 100 different brands.

>>64002015
>Nothing like FIT tests and no central database
Forgot to address another point, on this note, particularly with regards to Adept. Far as I'm aware they have no legitimate business address for the NIJ to go to and collect FIT samples. The two addresses I've found are:
1. 1809 W Frankford Rd, Carrollton, Texas, 75007, which belongs to a Selery E-commerce business.
2. 4401 S. 72nd E. Ave, Tulsa, OK, 74145, which is the back of a Carboline warehouse (pic rel) and is shared with a Hodges Warehouse and a Midwest Logistics. I see their name on the door of neither.
I think they just use the address of whichever E-commerce provider as their "business" address, which probably wouldn't fly if the NIJ shows up and they get handed a 100-count box of Dixie ultra-strong by a random warehouse worker when they ask for plates. lol
Previously, when they were Diamond Age, their address was 344 E. Louisiana St. McKinney, TX 75069, which is a fitness store called lockout supplements.
While admittedly true that Stealth Armor Systems shares an address with Handicraft Heaven, which sews dresses and fashion accessories, that's at least the right kind of business for assembling and sewing armor panels. Ostensibly everything else, according to Nick Groat, is made in Bain's garage or something. Yet in 2018, was Diamond Age selling N-1 plates, 4.75lb standalone carbon nanotube Level IVs, with the 6lb jugs of protein powder? If so, that's pretty based.

>>63999476
these or something similar unironically, for the reasons this guy mentioned >>63999516

>>63999476
gloves are neat and protect your hands
mechanix are fine everyone uses them I have some gucci shooting gloves but it's not really worth spending money on

>>64002182
if you do or plan on doing a lot of digging or larping in a trench get a pair of these so you can rip your disposables to shit instead of trashing a decent pair
I usually carry 2-3 pairs of gloves now for different things, also if one pair gets soaked I can swap

>>63999516
>gloves for warmth
I wasn't in extreme conditions but having wool glove liners with some OR suppressor gloves kept me toasty when it was pretty cool in a cooling wind valley effect (whatever it's called) area.

>>64002182
Im the one who asked, I actually work in glass industry and can get cutproof gloves out the ass, never seen anyone use them for funz, they lose quite a bit of tactile feeling.

>>64002126
This doesn't seem that mysterious. Seems like good opsec ackshually. They build their plates in one location and handle shipping/mail at a separate location. I guess the actual facility address will become clear if/when they certify plates.

>>64002206
Unironically what I hate about mechanix is how they spam their logo everywhere.

>>64001766
> Because they have an OD rating against particular wavelengths, they do mute your red dot.
I think that if you're that worried about lasers and dazzlers, just use irons lol
> They aren't enclosed goggles and the splash from dazzlers and other wider lasers can go "around" the lens. Even the reflection from a 200mW laser can cause damage.
So the best eyepro would be brown lenses that have a more complete or enclosed design?
Think there's a way to fix those $12 ones so that they don't suffer from this problem?

>>64001714
> Why... do they have an 0101.04 legacy model from velsys there for $335. The shit?
Because they needed a "premium" option to compare Mira/RMA/Spartan against, so they dug something ancient and mothballed out of somebody's closet.
It's very funny that the RMA plate failed to M80 Ball AGAIN. It's also kind of funny that SEO shill/clickbait websites have better and more honest product evaluations than you'll get from Reddit. But none of this is surprising.

>>64003204
The need for a company selling life-saving equipment to have OPSEC from their own customers and the general public is a non-starter. Even LTC and Ceradyne (RIP) making XSAPIs and various plates for SOCOM / CAG / FBI have / had business addresses with their name on the door. They wouldn't let you in but you could drive to where the plates are made.
The only guys being shady with an address are Stealth and Adept, and the former is likely a garage operation (Groat seems to know Bain well...) and the latter is, IMO, more likely than not using Chinese materials on at least some of their armor. This is supported by their low prices and a Chinese patent for a TiB2-SiC strike face that was granted right around the Colossus' first lab test. https://patents.google.com/patent/CN111348920B.
The timing is very suspicious. It's not a smoking gun but the company who patented it ought to be investigated further.
Otherwise, the true facility needs to be in the US for them to certify under the NIJ.

>>64003209
>>just use irons
Or if you want to be snazzy, use a laser / dot outside the ODs of your eyepro. Holosun's gold dot may be of service here.
>brown lens best eyepro
They don't always have good ODs against red, IR, green, AND blue. Sometimes if you know the precise wavelength ranges you're up against, switch color. Brown S.P.E.C.S cover a lot of ground though. The more expensive goggles can have better treatments so the OD is higher and yet visibility is a little better than the Mexico filter in breaking bad.
>>Fix the $12 ones
Duct tape folded around the edges to cover your peripheral vision? That's the ultra-cheapo solution as long as the laser isn't strong enough to light the duct tape on fire.

>>64003205
it is distasteful

>>64003214
>premium option
Jeez then just yank a roached REV. A ESAPI off of facebook marketplace or something and test it with some Second Chance monarch in a dumpster from 2002. Military grade!
>RMA plate failed to M80
It's probably a shot spacing problem. How far were the shots spaced? Keep in mind Level IV is literally a single hit requirement and many Level IV plates have virtually no multi-hit as you can tell. RMA calls the 1155 both legendary and multi-hit Level IV, neither of which is accurate unless the multi-hit claim is with maximum spacing.
Even Level III plates and below get 2" minimum between hits.
>Reddit
RMA-Safelife country now and forever.

>64003531
>Otherwise, the true facility needs to be in the US for them to certify under the NIJ.
Self-correcting this because it was worded poorly. My bad. It just cannot be in China, there are companies in the UK, Germany, etc with NIJ certs on their armor. There are Chinese companies (Longfri) with NIJ certs because they have a US operation that can accept FIT inspections. The FIT process also includes material tracing auditing and sample consistency inspection, so if Adept cannot adequately document their sourcing to the NIJ's satisfaction then no certs. Also, if certified, the plates must have a compliant label on the back with the precise manufacturing location.
Even Buffman and Shorta, the latter of whom is RMA's community rep and has personally met Ganor - likely when the two companies collaborated on the female curve plates - have no clue where the armor is really made, just not in America. They're ITAR exempt so it's either Europe or China. Ganor is from Hong Kong and filed patents for optical camo and other weird stuff there, so that plus the other evidence (cost, other patents) swings slightly in favor of China. There are ways around tariffs.
Buffman says somewhere in Europe. Shorta says and I quote "mystery meat."
Anons have said Czech Republic.

>>64003012
the lower ANSI levels get you more tactile function back. Honestly i just grabbed the pic rel because they were close enough, but my go-to pair is level 3, and I have zero qualms with how they feel

What did TNVC/NVG want for 4th July sale duals this year?

>>64003626

All i can say is that i have been told its in the Czech republic, September the 5th (further back then i thought) I was told by them that they where gonna start the process for NIJ Certification, during the same time i got some samples from him (Different materials and a plate)

Specifically they where certifying for RF3, I known for a fact that DA has done Biochem stuff for the DOD.

I agree that VPAM should have some kinda regulatory body in the style of the NIJ.

>>64001999

Use low percentage citric acid. Like 2%, or something stronger but diluted with water to a similar strength. Let lie in solution overnight, then wash in machine on normal program. smell should be gone.

>>64005497
>Czech republic
That's what another anon has said, but nothing substantive. I'm still curious as to why they didn't move forward with certifying the Colossus to Level IV in 2022. The likely LE BVP orders would more than offset the cost of recertifying to RF3 later. On paper it mogs the 4601.
>Biochem
Do you have any more info on that? Diamond age's entire website has been purged from the wayback machine, which is odd. You can submit requests to have that done, but I don't see why they would unless they needed to hide something.

>>64005519
>>64001999
This sort of thing works very well:
> https://www.amazon.com/Rocco-Roxie-Supply-Co-Professional/dp/B00CKFL93K
Any "enzymatic" cleaner that's strong enough to work on cat piss will work on your surplus.

>>64005669
> On paper it mogs the 4601.
In fairness, also in every single test ever seen. The 4601 is extremely mid. Also the 4800 was a mistake. I honestly think that the 4400/4401/4403 are the best Hesco plates, lol

>>64003550
> They don't always have good ODs against red, IR, green, AND blue
Can you ever really know what you're up against, though? Every wavelength is popular these days, even violets are around. Imagine this fucker pointed at your eyeballs:
> https://biglasers.com/product/odin-purple-handheld-laser-405nm/
Brown is the only reasonable option IMO

>>64005683
True, but the 4601 has a cert and the Colossus doesn't. Adept / DA hasn't gotten any NIJ certs in eight years. The concern is not whether the Colossus can perform, we've seen it can, it's whether there is sufficient quality control so that every plate meets good workmanship and consistency standards. In other words, whether EVERY plate performs. A cert, a large batch inital test, and continued FIT success reasonably proves that. Buff shooting five plates in three years doesn't.
Hesco does better in the low and mid-end. LTC is better if you need lightweight B4C armor. The 4601 is just the best overall certified Level IV under $1k. Lot of conditions there.
>>64005707
It's the jack of all trades.

>>64005763
I suspect that a lot of questions are going to be answered with the release of the .07 CPL. I've heard 2026, is there any news on that?

>>64005788
That's the same I've heard. We don't know for sure until then since Adept isn't volunteering any info. I'm personally waiting until .07 drops to upgrade plates. Either the 4601 (4602 by that point?) or Colossus depending on whether the latter gets certified. Hence why I'm subjecting it to so much scrutiny. We'll probably see a lot of new models, so the field will look different.
If Hesco can release a 4602 at 5.8lb or so that otherwise equals the 4601 and gets certified, that'll be stiffer competition.

Would /gq/ buy MOLLE stuff made by some guy in his apartment? Is there a niche not being filled by anyone currently? I've been itching to get into hobby #20 and sew my own line of pouches and whatnot.

>>64005924
no unless you prove yourself to be a good craftsman and you can do bespoke stuff.

>>64005924
There is a shortage of MKA-1919 / Saiga magazine pouches cheaper than the Beez stuff ($35). You could appeal to the 3-gun crowd.

>>64005924
I mean, if it's good, sure why not? There's pretty much zero money to be made in dump pouches and mag pouches, though.
Carriers and chest rigs might be okay if you get hypebeast status, but most of those guys like Rebel's Raiders make their shit overseas in factories.

>>64005924
I unironically want a leather-tegris plate carrier.
Some company made a meme version a while ago, but it would have been much better if they played it straight.

>>64005669

I know they did one about going beyond Tranexamic Acid in casualty care, if you go on Adepts webpage they also talk about some other biochem stuff

Here have a picture of the amorphous material used in the thunder plates.

>>64005924

Make stuff you cant find, or that fixes specific problems you are having in gear, and others will want it too.

>>64005924
cat ears. You could arm the entire tumblr corps!

>>64005946
What would you in particular want custom made, for example?

>>64005951
cha-ching

>>64005966
Shit, mag pouches were at the forefront of my mind but yeah, there are plenty of good and affordable ones already available. Definitely some room for creativity when it comes to carriers and shit though.

>>64005973
I had this retarded-for-a-number-of-reasons idea a while back for a line of modern gear made with pre-synthetic materials ie. cotton/leather/brass/steel. First time hearing about tegris though, were you thinking of it being a stiffener behind a layer of leather?

>>64005985
My personal problem is overpriced surplus, maybe there's potential in small batch reproductions?

>>64005995
How about high speed camo-palette kevlar dog masks for those weird tactical furries that exist

>>64005973
The chafing that would happen when it starts to slide around due to sweat would make me kill myself.

>>64006144
> I had this retarded-for-a-number-of-reasons idea a while back for a line of modern gear made with pre-synthetic materials ie. cotton/leather/brass/steel
Cotton and leather would be interesting. Linen and silk, too. Brass and steel for buckles and fasteners.
It would definitely be something different. Honestly, it could even be different+better.

>>64006149
Even back in the 17th century leather products usually had fabric liners. In Europe linen was most popular, in Asia it was typically silk.

>>63998967
What makes those better than other foamies? Like obviously the NRR is higher, but how?
PS 3M makes different grades of foamies, too, up to 33 NRR. What's the difference?

NEW: >>64006223
NEW: >>64006223
NEW: >>64006223
NEW: >>64006223
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>>64006207
Good questions.
> Like obviously the NRR is higher, but how?
IDK, maybe it's denser?
> What's the difference?
You can buy the Hearoes really cheaply on Amazon, that's what.

>>63998116
You were right. It's the LRAK MG set

>>64006144
>What would you in particular want custom made, for example?
havent figured it out yet lol

>>64005924
Cordura thread spools aren't as expensive as you may think. The only problem is the increased labor in the form of hours and needing a pair of pliers and something like a bottle cap to push the needle thru the material

>>64006589
ok i'll wait :^)

My weapon.

>>63991427
>get a new hobby
>says the guy who tripfags on 4chins
Rich