Thread 64119427

>every military is getting rid of bullpups in preperation for WW3
>Australia be like
>also, no you can't have a civilian version!

Why?
Why is Australia keeping bullpups?
Why is everyone else getting rid of them?

Why are you so obsessed with bullpups?
You already got told off in the last thread.
Dumb faggot.

Aftermarket. Its cheaper and easier to buy OTS accessories than contract specific ones. If some country that uses M16s wants to upgrade them in some way, there is a whole world of proven drop-in solutions for whatever issue they have. Bullpups are all proprietary, even ones like the Aug that are well liked and have been around for nearly 50 years still has a very small aftermarket; and so as a result when Australia wanted to upgrade their AUGs, they had to go right back to the drawing board and essentially rebuild the gun from scratch. It also helps that the touted benefits of bullpups (ie, long barrel while still being compact enough for mechanized troops) have shown to not really matter that much, since as much as barrel autists insist that anything less than 20" is death; 13-16" has shown to be just fine for infantry use; and when combined with a telescoping stock; conventional pattern guns can be pretty small.

>>64119434
wasn't me

I'm too busy on /co/ discussing Jax

>>64119451
i think it's a multi role thing

the New aug and other bullpups are effectively an SMG sized gun, so are good for urban work. But have the range and stopping power of a standard intermediate rifle
Even a marksman aug with the longer barrel is still regular carbine sized.

Australia's units use small group tactics so everyone has their role, but also needs to be a generalist. This one gun is far more flexible than an squad weapon, where they would have dedicated marksman rifles that really aren't practical for use in tighter environments, smgs that aren't practical for longer range encounters, and standard weapons that are slightly too large for comfortable transport and urban use. As time has gone on the US military has favored smaller carbines over full sized assault rifles for this reason.

>>64119427 (OP)
>Why is Australia keeping bullpups?
because on paper they are in fact better than the competition
>but they are le uncomfortable for soldi-
cry about it faggot

also every iteration they get better and better
the first generation of US service rifles were dogshit and had decades and billions of dollars of R&D put into making them good
>Why is everyone else getting rid of them?
weak minds

>>64119427 (OP)
Australia
>massive cunt
>sparse cunt
>need to get in a vehicle to go fucking anywhere cunt
>has a bunch of metal and resources to build shit itself
>got the rights to build the Ooog for cheap and building it and updating it is the only thing resembling a domestic small arms industry they got left

all you need to know

>>64119557
>building it and updating it is the only thing resembling a domestic small arms industry they got left
>he doesnt know
cunts not gonna make it

>>64119434
Post like these are always such a brutal self-own. Basically saying "You cant discuss this popular topic because I have already seen it discussed recently, on account of me spending every waking hour on /k/; and therefore implicitly having nothing else going on in my life". Nigger some of us have jobs and friends, just because you've seen it talked about doesn't mean everybody has.

>>64119427 (OP)
Remember how the US had long barrels then short barrels then realized short barrels suck and went back to long barrels?
Imagine having a 6 inch longer barrel with a 1.4 inch shorter overall length.

>>64119590
yea 18.5 inch x95 is the same length at a 11.5 AR
it's pretty wild

>>64119427 (OP)
>civilian version
nigger you can't even have a "civilian version" 8.1 inch blade
shit's totally fucked
>THE BLADE WAS 8.1 INCHES YOU SICK FUCK

>>64119574
Check the catalog before posting, faggot.

>>64119427 (OP)
>Why is everyone else getting rid of them?
Lobbyism and corruption.
They're objectively superior for militaries but there's too much money involved in switching them out for the big militaries.
Smaller ones like austria and australia can afford it.

>>64119427 (OP)
Because they're fucking good when you actually train to use them.

>>64119613
>>64119623
Yep, the only downside is clearing some jams but that it solved with design, simply having a dust cover would work.

hot take: personal drone formfactors are now more important than personal weapon formfactors

>>64119574
/k/ is filled (post-2014) with vetbro glownigger paraplegic-pension BodySnatcher HOA larpers like this

>>64119485
>>64119613
>>64119623
>>64119630
This.

Bullpups were a novel and good idea in the seventies when FAMAS and AUG arrived, yes there are downsides like the trigger pull but that can be improved and mitigated. The compactness and versatility are ideal for urban combat

And as we all know, since the 1990s the "AR platform" has become globally ubiquitous so there's now a worldwide inertia for military procurement to "get an AR" because of parts availability/interchangeability, cost etc. in other words the "AR" has become the Glock of mil rifles, in an eternal race to the bottom, Kleenex-for-all eventuality. That's the bullpup's competition

>>64119655
>ideal for urban combat
You're not supposed to fight in urban areas. Cities are meat grinders, you should go around them and fuck them with artillery and starvation.

>>64119696
>You're not supposed to fight in urban areas
They are defenders advantage so if you are defending they are great.

>>64119700
.....making cities meat-grinders that should be fucked from range and control of resources?

>>64119696
>not supposed to
Agreed but yet, as mil rifles bullpups are suited for this

>>64119714
Yes, forcing the enemy to commit huge amounts of air and arty to a single target is good.

>>64119696
often you don't have a choice because objectives, bridges and transport hubs tend to be inside cities

>>64119655
There is also another reason. And that is same exact reason why US top brass refuses to entertain the idea of a bullpup - the institutional inertia. Same as in US - they have been for years with a rifle in same configuration, they have all the manuals, all the institutional knowledge they would ever need - and since individual small arms dont really fucking matter - why go through all the hassle to change it? Its not like man portable death lasers were invented or something else that's completely groundbreaking. Logistics are sure happy nobody is fucking with the entire supply chain they already have.

>>64119798
>hurr durr institutional inertia!!!
>proceeds to give three legitimate reasons that have nothing to do with muh fucking inertia
idiot

>>64119798
Which is the reason why Sig won the NGSW program. It's not just despite the fact that their gun is the least ambitious design, it's BECAUSE it's the least ambitious one. It takes a pre-existing firearm and bumps up its size to take overpressured cartridges. It doesn't actually do anything NEW, and that's why the brass loves it so.

>>64119590
>Remember how the US had long barrels then short barrels then realized short barrels suck and went back to long barrels?
No, not really. The 14.5" M4 is still the most common gun in service, and its being partially replaced by 13" M7; except in the marines where they're replacing the 20" M16A4 with the 16" M27. Idk where you're seeing a pendulum swing back to longer barrels.

>>64119799
Are you unable to read?

>>64119900
I can read that post better than you, clearly

>>64119427 (OP)
I Croatia gettung rid of theirs? No? What about other countries that are keeping them?

>>64119798
>institutional inertia
Yes this as well with regard to the U.S. mil-industrial gigaplex

>individual small arms dont really fucking matter
>why go through all the hassle to change it
>Logistics are sure happy nobody is fucking with the entire supply chain they already have
Preach it brother, all this.

>>64119633
Personal weapons were never important.

>>64119984
It’s amazing they let people like you vote kek

>>64119801
It’s because of things like this we can never have nice things

>>64121015
There should be restrictions on internet access starting with that 2 pbtid

>>64119604
Definitely one of the best memes to ever come out of 4chan

>>64119557
Its nearly this but really its about Lithgow's scale and low budget. They don't have the depth and size to do more than slowly facelift externals of original Austeyr in house (i.e. not adopting AUG upgrades). They're owned by Thales who doesn't into small arms. Minimum budget to keep up appearances (so not get replaced).

>>64119427 (OP)
>Using a retarded meme gun instead of an 11.5 AR like everyone else
That's not very skibidi desu