Thread 64131955

>Background:
>The video first sets the stage with Saddam Hussein's invasion of Kuwait in August 1990, which led to the formation of a massive US-led coalition. The coalition launched a devastating air campaign against Iraq in January 1991, quickly crippling the Iraqi Air Force by destroying communication hubs, ground control stations, and aircraft on the ground. In a desperate move, Saddam ordered his surviving pilots to fly their jets to neighboring Iran for safety. To counter this, the US established an aerial blockade, a "virtual wall" of F-15 Eagle fighter patrols, along the Iraqi-Iranian border.
>The Battle:
>Saddam Hussein devised a plan to break through this blockade using his most capable interceptor, the aging but incredibly fast Soviet-made MiG-25 Foxbat. The plan was to lure a pair of American F-15s into a pincer ambush.
>The Combatants: Two Iraqi MiG-25s engaged two US Air Force F-15C Eagles.
>The Engagement: The Iraqi jets were vectored to intercept the American patrol. The F-15s, alerted by an AWACS plane, turned to engage. During the ensuing dogfight, an Iraqi MiG-25 fired an R-40 missile that detonated near one of the F-15s, causing significant damage to its left engine.
>Challenges: The American pilots faced multiple missile malfunctions, with several of their AIM-7 Sparrow missiles failing to launch or track properly.
>Outcome: Despite the F-15s' technological superiority, both Iraqi MiG-25s managed to disengage and return to base safely. The damaged F-15 also made it back. Although the Iraqis claimed a victory for damaging a superior fighter and surviving, this marked the last significant air-to-air combat for the Iraqi Air Force in the war. The battle highlighted how even an outdated aircraft, with the right strategy and a bit of luck, could challenge a much more advanced opponent.
The MiG-25's were no joke, had they been equipped with lookdown radars like the MiG-31's, those Eagles would have bitten the dust: https://youtu.be/5RtwFbSeV5Y?t=292

yeah

>>64131955 (OP)
>MiG-25 fired an R-40 missile that detonated near one of the F-15s, causing significant damage to its left engine.
if the sequence of events in the video is to be believed the MiG dropped lock so the nearby detonation must have been a fluke, they were both using fox-1s

great, now the mutts will shit up another thread
>MUH F15 YALL GIT DOWN GUNZ YALL YEEHAW

>>64131980
>be russia
>endlessly mock burger planes for prioritizing speed, altitude, sensors and missiles over muh dogfights
>50 years pass
>only soviet/russian jet family that can hang with NATO jets in real world combat is the MiG-25/31

>>64131980
>makes shitty thread about literally one teeny tiny victory against a US aircraft
>no YOU’RE the one who’s mad
Lol, lmao, we don’t need to cherrypick because we won, lmao.

>>64131980
>>64131989
>make thread to discuss military engagement that happened and had an unexpected outcome
>retards can't stop themselves from making it some national pride issue
It's like Pakis and Jeets who can't talk about anything without turning it into a shit flinging contest.

>>64131980
America owns the sky zigger get used to it

>>64131994
Yes, that’s what i just said, good job.
how many iraqi aircraft did the US destroy again? I lost count.
>>64131996
>retards can't stop themselves from making it some national pride issue
Then don’t make reddit-tier posts like >>64131980

>>64131955 (OP)
>America Never Talks About
love the implication that american is deliberately trying to ignore or suppress this, and not that it's a footnote of a footnote
it's what really gives it the seethe flavor

>>64131955 (OP)
>the iraqi ambush america never talkef about
Except it did because it was such a rare event for a US aircraft to get shot down that whole documents were written about what went wrong and how to fix it.
Nobody tried to bury this and it’s talked about so much specifically because it was an exception to the rule.

>>64131955 (OP)
>US Navy Orions searched the area covered by new F-15s in their first combat patrols. On the other side was Soviet MiG-31s armed to the teeth.
>An F-15 pilot, then a junior lieutenant, Rob Graeter, recalls that they were flying with eight missiles and three fuel tanks, so we were not going any faster than Mach 1.1.
>But on my first flight, I remember that they had intelligence how fast the MiGs flew at 70,000 feet, armed with two radar-guided and four infrared-guided missiles, a full combat load at a staggering Mach 2.83.
>That was pretty eye-opening and that they could do that run with enough gas and to carry their missiles.
>The US Air Force had no idea how to approach this new threat because just like with the Foxbat, they didn't know what to expect. Eagle pilots soon developed a new tactic, dropping their fuel tanks on contact and getting up to Mach 1.7 and 40,000 feet as fast as possible.
>And then they could engage the enemy and have enough energy for possible combat.
https://youtu.be/Dm_gesmnpxY?t=820

What blew up this time?

>>64131955 (OP)
>>64132034
F-15bros?

Why were AIM-7s so unreliable?

>>64131955 (OP)
>>64131994
It's always fun watching thirdies cope
>one F-15 was nearly shot down
>this was a great victory
Iraq could have shot down 50 F-15Cs without having any effect on the outcome.

>>64132557
Fox-1s are just shit, if you lose lock the missile is scrapped, BVR shots can easily be bleed of energy, the radar mode switches on launch telling the enemy it's coming and it was introduced in 1958.
The AIM-7 solved a lot of issues but it's still an old design.
>Of 44 missiles fired, 30 (68.2%) hit their intended targets resulting in 24/26 (54.5%/59.1%) kills. 19 kills were obtained beyond visual range.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIM-7_Sparrow#Post_Vietnam

>>64131955 (OP)
>The battle America doesn't want you to know about
>Pilot and plane both make it home

>>64132611
I thought the "newest" fox1's after breaking a lock switched to inertial guidance and data link or are you talking about older ones that are purely SARH?

>>64132959
fox 1 is purely SARH, autonomous inertial guidance and datalink is for the AMRAAM which is fox 3

>>64132928
Against MiG-25's that were supposed to be dog shit for dogfights while flying F-15s which were supposed to be GOAT

>>64132969
I know what fox3 is. But i thought that "newer" fox1's after breaking a lock won't go stupid and they will look at last known target location and "predict" where target is going and go somewhere near the target if he didn't changed its path (inertial guidance), and you can re-acquire the lock after breaking it (data link) because missile recognizes your radar.

>>64131994
Source?

>>64131955 (OP)
If the Iraqis somehow managed to get MiG-25's upgraded wtith Zaslon radars, the airwar from 1991 would have looked much more different

>>64133040
It's literally from the youtube video

>>64132034
>the MiGs flew at 70,000 feet, armed with two radar-guided and four infrared-guided missiles, a full combat load at a staggering Mach 2.83
They can do that once before their engines start to eat themselves and need to be replaced. In that envelope, the range would be abysmal. The F-15 can do mach 2.5 all day without killing its engines.

>>64133056
>the airwar from 1991 would have looked much more different
F-15's k:d would only be 104:2

>>64133012
Lobbing missiles from 25 miles away and turning around to run in full AB isn't a dogfight.

>>64133040
AFD-070912-043.pdf named USAF Manned Aircraft Combat Losses 1990-2002 from Air Force Historical Research Agency (AFHRA)

>>64133030
retarded brownoid

>>64133062
That's not a source. What is the primary source, you braindead idiot.

>>64133066
That was only an issue with the engines from the MiG-25, not the ones from the MiG-31

>>64133076
>>64133040
forgot pic

>>64133086
>not the ones from the MiG-31
those that topped out at mach 2.8 completely clean? those engines?

>>64133079
why?

>>64133086
No, they all have issues. Just look at how many MiG-31s Russia has lost just to wngine fires and other related engine problems in Ukraine. At least 6 by my last check.

>>64133094
Go back to /pol/, Dennis.

>>64133099
there were other cases too

>>64133102
>>64133100
>>64133079
not brown but i accept you concession about not knowing how fox1's work

>>64133072
>The F-15 K:D in question:

>>64133149
>state of the art soviet shit performing as designed
your point?

>>64131977
>dropped lock
that's literally an ir missile

>>64131955 (OP)
>Using Desert Storm to try hype up Soviet weaponry and 3rd world military competence
That's confusing.

>>64133567
well if they want more examples they have to go back a few more decades, that's one of the most recent ones they've got and it's all they have, leave the poor sons of bitches alone.

>>64133056
Why? The Iraqi MiG-29s had look-down/shoot-down radar and didn't accomplish much of anything.

>>64133074
Then we should be building interceptors because combat ranges are only getting longer.

>>64133518
No Fox 2 is an IR missile, Fox 1 is n Semi-active Radar Missile like the Sparrow

>>64133924
NTA R-40 has two versions heat seeking and SARH. But you are right Fox1 is SARH

>>64133578
>MiG-29
There's your problem, It doesn't have much fuel, nor does It have powerful enough engines for going high and fast like the MiG-25 can. If the latter had been upgraded with Zaslon radars, the F-15's and US coalition aircrafts would have been toast, being shot at while not being able to shoot back because the Foxbat would be flying too high and fast, which was the main reason why the AIM-7's lost lock during that engagement.

>>64133728
have you been living under a rock for 50 years?

>>64134024
they have a lot of bravado online but they basically know and understand on a fundamental level the fact that they're fucking worthless compared to us. 1000 dead browns for 1 civilised white person or asian is considered a great victory for them.

>>64134024
Very impressive considering that the MiG-25's were able to do that despite manuvering like a brick and not having radars with look-down capability, yet they managed to damage a F-15 while the F-15's AIM-7's failed to engange any of MiG-25's during that encounter. Being the fastest fighter jet ever built has it's advantages.

>>64134046
>being the fastest fighter jet
it's not a fighter jet
>has it's advantages
like spontaniously being lucky 1 time that the aim-7's failed to engage?

>>64131955 (OP)
>If Russia could make better radars and planes then they would be better than the Eagle
What a profound thread Socrates

>>64134046
Is it really an advantage if it didn't lead to anything meaningful? The iraqi air force still got turbo raped in the end.

What blew up this time?

>>64133567
Is everyone in this thread purposely ignoring the whole point of the video?
Its about an outdated obsolete interceptor miraculously having its day in the sun and standing toe to toe against the best fighters the west had to offer.
This is not a thirdie flex, its not propaganda, Its just a neat story about how its important to not underestimating your foe and how over-reliance on technology can be dangerous.
The channel has great videos documenting the development of the F-15 and the Foxbat and how cold war politics shaped their programs.

>>64136488
I wouldn't say miraculous since the MiG-25's speed coupled with a more modern radar and missiles It would still be a formidable aircraft, since Fox-3s are what decides air combat now.

>>64133578
Holy fuck I want to fuck that plane bros

>>64136503
>>64135160
the pidor literally can't help himself

>>64135160
It's called the MiG-31:>>64132034

>>64136578
another absolute trash heap of a plane.

>>64136586
>MiG-31 can fly at Mach 2.83 with full combat load while the F-15 could only reach Mach 1.1
Calling the F-15 a big flying trash heap of a plane, is a bit harsh don't you think?

>>64136609
We weren’t doing that, we were calling the mig-31 a flying trashheap
>B-but it’s faster
But not better, and hardly comparable to the F15, mig-31 is a flying trashheap sorry

>>64136609
>MiG-31 can fly at Mach 2.83 with full combat load
it can't, it can do this clean once before the engines have to be completely replaced. it also has 300km combat radius.

sorry not sorry your flying anvil is hot garbage designed and flown by subhumans.

>>64133149
>at the time state of the art soviet aircraft
>supported by massive amount of AA
>vs state of the art at the time american aircraft
yeah
what about it

What blew up today?

>>64133149
Remember the old talking point about how these lopsided numbers were solely because of arab pilots.

>>64133990
>thinks this
Holy fuck the delusion.

>>64136488
nu/k/ is pathetic and retarded

>>64133179
>>64139396
I'd like to see the outcome between F-4 Phantoms against MiG-25s

>>64140967
Why? Haven't there been enough destroyed phantoms for your satisfaction?

>>64140967
funny how despite being a decade older phantoms still have by far superior radars to the hobbled flying anvil

>>64131955 (OP)
>vatnigger shit's greatest victory is a scratching the paint on an F-15 and escaping an engagement
Grim.

>>64140967
happened in the yom kippur war, in lebanon and in the iran iraq war
there is a reason you don't boast about its combat record
because it's unimpressive

>>64136488
It's pretty difficult to have meaningful discussion on this site these days. 4chan's always been a mess with plenty of trolls and whatnot, but it's become much worse in the last several years. I blame /pol/s's influence for the current trend of assuming that any and every post must be in bad faith and that everything must have some sort of "angle" to it.