Thread 64167685

First image of Ukrainian cruise missile made from Neptune anti-ship missile

we gotta nuke these piggers before they get out of hand

>>64167690
indeed for specified amount of time and not a week more the gloves have been on but it is high time they are removed and the ukrops taught a lesson

The crazy thing is literally no matter what ghetto guidance system they use it will still be more accurate than the Kh-22. A pigeon guided missile would have a better CEP against land targets than the Kitchen.

>>64167816
>ghetto guidance system
I've always wondered, are milspec INS sensors even any different from the cheap shits in modern cell phones?
Accelerometer & gyroscope sensors (and GNSS chips) are all mass produced in extreme numbers and cost pennies.
What's the difference between sensors in phones and guided ordnance? Data precision? Safe operating envelope? Nothing?

>>64167685 (OP)
How hard is US going to prevent Ukraine from using these? And how asshurt is Trump going to be when they actually use them against Moscow?

>>64167887
>Moscow
Nah, they'll just keep deleting Russian energy infrastructure.

>>64167866
>Accelerometer & gyroscope sensors (and GNSS chips) are all mass produced in extreme numbers and cost pennies
turn off gps and you will see how quickly they get off course

>>64167887
>when they actually use them against Moscow
I find it bizarre how some people on /k/ laugh at how dumb Russians are but then when presented with cruise missile their brain only thinks "ME BOMB MOSCOW, ME DESTROY CAPITAL, MONKE THEN SURRENDER", which is exactly thought process of average zigger commander

>>64167913
Ukies said in 2022 that if they can target Moscow they will shoot at Moscow (if valid targets are present).

Russians are aware of this and so they have pulled their AD from elsewhere to protect Moscow.

>>64167918
>Ukies said in 2022 that if they can target Moscow they will shoot at Moscow (if valid targets are present)
and then if you check what Ukraine actually targets you realize Moscow is very low on priority list

>>64167913
But these are the same missiles they already used to sink moscow the cruiser.
Plenty of targets in moscow oblast as well, and they already droned the local refinery.

>>64167685 (OP)
Kill ziggers
stamp the commies ones face's into pulp
The ones with Russian parents
Make it slow
Peal em
Boil em
Mash em
Make them scream for what they do.

Hang the kremlin agents of influence and quislings with piano wire

>>64167866
Yeah, there's a difference. Also need to factor in Chinese grey market, which means at least 20% failure rate of components.

>>64167938
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77wKp3eywzg

>>64167932
Yes, they target everything else because those things are defended less. Moscow has a lot of AD, because if it didn't it would get hit.

>>64167913
Because the only opinion that matters in puccia is the opinion of Moscow. As long as muscovites aren't being sent to the front, dealing with fuel shortages, freezing, or suffering any other deprivations power remains firmly with monke.

>>64167942
>Yeah, there's a difference.
And I was asking, that is that difference?
Which chips are used by weapon-grade INS systems?

For example my phone has ADXL343 ASIC for gyro/accel and it arguably has better specs than chips like MPU-6050 which are commonly used in larger robotics including UAVs.

>>64167993
"Milspec" doesn't mean it's "superior" spec. It means the components are guaranteed to work inside a fixed set of parameters. Operating temperatures, moisture, etc etc etc.
Your phone's ASIC is guaranteed to work within those but may very well do so.

Are they afraid to attack Moscow because of muh nooks or are they worried Trump will be mad at them? Even if there are S-400s there they can't handle a saturation attack. Or if not Moscow then wherever it is that Putin hides these days

>>64168022
there's not much to attack in Moscow when you can blow up much more juicy targets with barely any AD cover

>>64168005
*isn't guaranteed. Serves me right to post before coffee is proper consumed.

>>64168025
Is an oil depot really juicier than a dictator? They just launched an airstrike at officers today.

>>64168040
Capital cities are the places you can guarantee air defense is tight as fuck. Blowing up distillation columns they can't easily fix or replace are juicy as fuck targets since it serves 3 purposes. No petroleum products for export, no fuel for the army and no fuel for the people, making them feel the effects of their poor life choices.

>>64168022
They have already targeted stuff on the outskirts of Moscow, refineries and stuff like that.
Probably not worth it to try and snipe HQ people, they can run away easily.

>>64167918
There's a huge difference between claiming you'll bomb Moscow for shits and giggles and actually doing it.

>>64168048
Could they exploit this by targeting the air defense systems themselves? S-300s, Pantsirs, and Buks must be expensive to replace

>>64168056
Ask Gaza/Lebanon. You need some pretty hefty saturation.

>>64168005
You're still not saying anything of value that I didn't already know and mention.

Anyways, to me it seems that a $5 off-the-shelf chip can do anything a guided missile would need to know where it isn't.
- more than high enough sample rate for a PID that drives the rocket
- great deg/s and max g measuring ranges
- enough g resistance to survive rocket motor startup jolts
- very wide operating temperature range
- ready to interoperate with external sensors like magnetometers
- etc
If anything these mobile chips have a bunch of unnecessary extra features like low power pedometer mode and hand gesture recognition algos. But they're completely programmable for any task.
What else would it need? Maybe the sensors' precision/sensitivity aren't enough?

>>64168059
If you already knew, why the fuck did you ask? Manufacturer of that $5 off the shelf chink SOC ain't gonna guarantee that it won't just stop working when the rumbling begins for $5.
You might get lucky, but most people don't want to leave the rest of the cost of the missile in the hands of that cheap untested shit.

>>64167887
They can't do shit against local munitions except seethe. Like what are they going to do, stop military aid?
That being said, >>64167892 is right. Energy infrastructure will be fucked and the faggot duo of Hungary + Slovakia will be left eternally assmad. Reminder they have only themselves to blame for their current level of energy independence.

>>64168064
Because I don't know the specs of real life military hardware and lack real life engineering expertise. I've only built PID-guided missiles in vidya.
Sometimes there are subject experts present here in /k/, not just angry tards with nothing useful to say.

To me it seems real life concerns of reliability could be mitigated with redundant hardware. It's not like the mass or cost of extra sensors is prohibitive.
I wasn't going to address your schizo chink rant at all, but you really should know that the chips I mentioned are both from american companies.

>>64168054
They have been doing it since 2024.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/russia-ukraine-drones-moscow-1.7379721
https://abcnews.go.com/International/moscow-attacked-massive-drone-barrage-ahead-us-ukraine/story?id=119659545
https://edition.cnn.com/ukraine-drones-moscow-airport-disruptions-intl-hnk

>>64167887
>How hard is US going to prevent Ukraine from using these? And how asshurt is Trump going to be when they actually use them against Moscow?
It's Ukie made. They have zero say about it

I do chuckle that Trump siad
>You can't win a war unless you hit the enemy at home
And MIGAtards got buttmad that he was supporting Nazi Ukrops, then 2 days later, it leaks that he has blocked/banned Ukraine from using long range weaponry on Russia. Silence from MIGAtards outside of him being based and white trad Russia wins again.

Why nobody can see Trump is kompromat I don't know.

>>64167913
>which is exactly thought process of average zigger commander
And why do you think that is, Sherlock? Could it be that it's precisely what would break them themselves, so they try projecting it on their enemy, like everything else? They sperg about Zelenski in the same manner, although nobody really gives a shit about him, because they view him as the strong-daddy mirror image of Putin without which it would all crumble.

And I'm not even going to address your
>the cancer is trying to kill you but you trying to kill the cancer means you're just as bad as the cancer
fundamental retardation.

>>64168095
It's honestly hard to tell if it's bait, retardation, retarded bait or a genuine full blown schizo opinion with posts like this these days

>>64168102
but he's right. do you not come on /k/ or go on /pol/? what a baffling post. how much are you paid to make ontologically incorrect posts? i'd love to be paid to make such low-effort posts, really.

>>64167866
Western commercial GPS receivers are nerfed and shut off above certain altitudes and velocities so that they can't be niggerrigged into cruise missiles.

Not sure how chinese receivers behave, if they are even accurate at the typical cruise missile envelope.

>>64168102
Huh? Just a selection of posts from the thread with the Trump post in it. People seething. I'm sorry facts don't conform to your headfriends and tulpas.

>>64167887
Trump is the one encouraging it at this point. He finally got fed up with ziggers

>>64168132
>encouraging
>fed up
>does nothing/keeps blocking aid

>>64168138
Give them some time. Hegseth just need to recover from last weeks hangover before he can implement the tweet.

>>64168059
IMUs are not very accurate. If you ever worked with acceleration sensors, you know, that they are incredibly noisy. Using inertial sensors for positioning leads to drift, which means that they are only useful in combination with other methods.
High cost IMUs are simply more accurate. Even good hobbyist IMUs will easily cost hundreds of euros. Look up a picture of the ef-2000 IMU it is massive. This is needed to get good accuracy.
If you want to learn how inertial sensors work, read a book.

>>64168132
>>64168138
>>64168143
Trump just forbid Ukraine from striking deep into Russia proper. Trump lies even more than the Russians.

>>64168447
>Trump lies even more than the Russians
Or one hand doesn't know what the other is doing.

>>64167887
He will remind everyone he gave Putin a way out and monke didn't take it, then something about Biden/Obama being responsible for this entire debacle and elections beig stolen.

>>64167933
Oh, Moska was Mosquew? Hahahaha.

>>64168521
It's both in the case of the Trump administration

>>64168556
Also possible.

>>64168056
They do, and have been blowing up AD radars, launchers, and control systems.

>>64167866
>>64168059
Drift over time. Phone sensors are only good for very short durations, like seconds to a few minutes max. Military gyros have to work for hours.
Take this SAAB gyro, the angle random walk is specified as less than 0.05 deg/sqrt(hour).
Compare that with the cheap gyro ADXRS642 from Analog Devices: it specifies a angle random walk of 0.02 deg/sqrt(second).

Hours vs seconds. That's a 3 orders of magnitude difference.

>>64167816
>ghetto guidance system
My brown friend, ukies literally produce military grade gyroscopes and inertial guidence systems.

>>64167906
There is a way to have good navigation with those shitty COTS sensors, but yeah, you need to design around their crap like drift and such

>>64167913
There is value in bombing moscow, quite a bit of it actually. But it's both not high enough in terms of priority (it's not like you have infinite missiles to target everything you want) and also frowned upon by western partners of Ukraine.

>>64168625
proofs?

>>64168076
>To me it seems real life concerns of reliability could be mitigated with redundant hardware.

>strap 3 of the same cheap chip for triple modular redundancy, account for weight and spend more time wiring it up, knowing that if there is a failure mode the cheap chips will likely all fail the same way
or
>spend $100 more on a chip guaranteed to work inside the parameters you need on your $100,000 missile

The expensive chips could even be the same as the cheap chips in different ins after testing. The cheap chips are technically capable, but when you're doing shit like this it usually works out cheaper to spend a bit more now on something you know will work. What happens if those missiles are put in storage, are those $5 chips guaranteed to be working in 5 years time? what's the failure rate?
cheap drones under $500? slap whatever SOC you want on them, they're cheap enough that the failure rate matters less

>>64168076
>To me it seems real life concerns of reliability could be mitigated with redundant hardware.
It depends on what issues you might face. Some of the stuff is easily solvable by redundant components, some other stuff would need creative logic around multi-sensor solutions, some crap isn't solvable by redundant sensors at all. Generally you can do a shit ton of stuff with COTS parts, basically do everything with them, but it would require creative engineers and agile iterations to solve all issues, which isn't really a thing in classic MIC.

>>64168040
>thinks Putin isn't in an underground bunker in the Russian Far East

>>64168132
>if I were President
>President DJT
I know he's talking about what Biden did in 2022, but the phrasing is funny.

>>64168138
you can just say things)))

>>64169977
And of course I am still correct. Hmm, yes I adjusted my statement when presented with new, reliable indicators that North Korean troops were involved. In 2025. That's called being truthful, learning, and scientific. Before that, all indicators were false. They were from unreliable sources and remain false. They don't become true simply because they did deploy troops there later. Of course, an anti-science meme repeater wouldn't understand the concept of time.

>>64170044
Norks absolutely were involved prior to christmas 24

>>64169977
RWA is one of my favorite social media clowns

>>64167913
They don't have to hit Moscow. They just need the credible threat of hitting Moscow.
Being able to strike the heart of your enemies territory is enough to affect their thinking and actions.

>>64172005
>sleeps through the Night of the Silent Shill
One of the many reasons i miss that night

>>64168102
Posts like that weird-ass rant come from Khan or Mandic.
Yeah, they're actual schizo/autistic pedos. They're the source of the tranny gore saying "slava urine" or algo-generated babecock K-pop images.
They're also fond of a certain posting style of, "and yet [x that is bad for Ukraine], how curious."
"But anon, you DO [asinine prerequisite x], don't you?"

>>64168108
>>64168127
As you see with these, they sometimes coordinate or samefag.

>>64168025
But you have to poke it once in a while to check what air defenc doin. And I bet there's a target or two of value there too so as not to waste attack for cosmetics.
> Special airplanes, like presidental, comms relays etc
> Weapons dev centers
> Power plants and fuel depots
> Train loco depos
And other fun sites like pic. rel. As a capital it's an industrial center and lot's of military manufacturing and support happens there. Besides Muscovites have most direct influence on government.

>>64173158
>And other fun sites like pic. rel
It already got droned...

>>64168125
It's not the receivers that are rigged, it's the civilian satellites.
Can't bypass that with some kind of jail-broken black market GPS receiver.

GPS signals are also super fucking easy jam, because they're weak as fuck.
The Satellites orbit waaaaay higher than regular communications sats, so the signal has a long way to go before arriving on earth.
That means GPS can't be relied on as a means of guidance for cruise missiles striking high value targets, which are liable to be guarded with air defenses and GPS jammers.

>>64173203
Well, yes and no.
GNSS is what you use to reset INS drift, so intermittent satellite fix is not a problem.

>>64173203
The standard for cheap is combined GPS/INS using GPS to provide correction for the INS system. This makes temporary jamming along the flight route mostly ineffective.

>>64173170
I mean... there's always more
>55.696 37.440
>55.822 37.777
>55.856 36.865
>56.173 37.769
>55.698 37.588
>55.735 37.560
>55.782 37.524

Also - is it just me or google maps wide area quality has gotten so bad it's impossible to distinguish anything unless you're 100% zoomed in on location?


Also the fuck is
>56.27 38.44
That straight road, train tracks and distributed buildings scream weapons and and underground structures. Wikimapia says arty testing. Don't see no craters though.

imagine how shitty a navy has to be for your opponent to say "lol we don't need anti-ship missiles anymore"

>>64167913
Moscow is one of two cities that matter and Z absolutely loses it when Moscow takes fire of any kind.
This is not a peer war, there is almost nothing as a target in russia to sneer at but Moscow itself IS in fact a capture point which will flip the country to your color.

>>64168022
Gee it's a mystery...

>>64168022
Is it worth throwing all your shit against the heaviest fortification to maybe get a few potshots at Moscow? Not really.

>>64168132
Yeah for this week. The whole problem.

>>64173158
Ukies should strike airports of moscow and st. pidorsburg, if civilian aviation doesn't exist in Ukraine because of russian strikes, then it shouldn't in russia as well. Simple as.

>>64174485
Anon, valuable fighting age cripples still escape that way, let them.

>>64174517
When crap happens they can't leave via planes, they leave via ground

>>64167887
US has lost most of its leverage over ukraine. first with stopping any new delivers and second by fucking with the already allocated stuff in transit the last geriatric allowed. ukranians know they are unreliable and have been working with friendly europeans to hedge the risks. for example year ago 70% of war material came from outside with 30% domestic. today the numbers have reversed

specific stuff like patriots will remain a niche to be covered by patchworks but at the end of the day ballistic missiles aint cheap and cant be spammed like those sahsneeds have been

now ukranians are going to be diplomatic of course since agent orange aint immortal and you cant sour relationships (what is left) with americans because of one vatnik simp. Next guy might be friendlier or more indifferent to sell arms not giving a shit what is done with them. like jd eye liner

>>64170044
Classic gaslighting, well done

>>64168953
Pic related is literally made in Kyiv

Another /k/ troon just shot a bunch of kids at a Catholic Church
Shame on you queers

>>64177123
>Another /k/ troon just shot a bunch of kids at a Catholic Church
>Shame on you queers

>>64168059
What others haven't mention is that military chips can handle the g forces a rocket would have that your 5 dollar chip won't have.

>>64177123
you fucking retards forgot to make sure the notes you wrote for them weren't in russian

>>64177255
Why do you bother posting when you 1) don't have any clue what you're talking about and 2) can't even read the post you're replying to?

- enough g resistance to survive rocket motor startup jolts
The cheapest chips are rated to withstand 10000 g.
Military grade MEMS-based IMUs have g resistance ratings in the same ballpark.
Even a fucking sprint missile accelerates two orders of magnitude slower. The chip is fine.
Microchips aren't exactly fragile when it comes to surviving acceleration. They're basically just rocks, rocks we fooled into thinking.

>>64167685 (OP)
>with great ingenuity, taras invented a missile using just duct tape, a squirrel and a missile
i swear to god when there's a "ukrainians invented xyz" post it's always the lamest shit ever

>>64177478
>sinks moskva
heh nothing personnel kid

>>64177104
wut? what does this weird led light has to do with missile guidance?

>>64174560
we don't need leverage we have the minerals deal and Europe has agreed to purchase our arms. we are now a net profit on this war which is the position Trump accused Putin of being in. so naturally ensuring Russia is a net negative is imperative for Ukraine. there is no disagreement here between us but you can well poison about this all you'd like cuck. you're fucking losing and being thrown a lifeline by the administration.

but Ukraine may not want to surrender so even with our support you still may have to return all that you have taken. should have accepted cease fire terms.

also fuck you for not doing that btw but it no longer matters. we will continue to sue for peace until you have no infrastructure remaining. then we will escalate. you still have time.

>>64168625

>y-you are brown Russian shill.

This is a strange take away from a post predominantly mocking Russian missiles but yes you've caught me I'm literally pic related. The issue isn't gyros and inertial navigation which are the bare minimum for any cruise missile made after 1948 the issue is if they can produce reliable TERCOM/TERNAV that massively improves accuracy with automatic position fixes using terrain maps and doppler radar.

Without TERCOM or unjammed GPS the missile's gyroscopes (even very accurate flat earther bamboozling laser ones) will start slowly drifting as soon as it is off the rail and over a 300 nautical mile flight it really adds up. That's why Russian cruise missiles without TERCOM like the AS-4 I shat on in my original post) end up landing on a jungle gym 2 miles from the target while western cruise missiles with TERCOM always magically land with 15 square metres of the aimpoint

>>64178995
(you) faggots are literally stopping supplies of stuff to ukies, supplies approved and paid for a long time ago, furthermore you're routinely fucked up their communications via starlink and prevented strikes into russia

>>64179349
SURE

while the russians killed a few people in Kiev with balistic missiles and drones, Ukis did this with a bunch of slow ass drones.
I don't think Russia is going to make it if those Ukrainian cruise missiles go hot.

>>64168040
Blowing up Monke's mansion isn't going to slow down Russian logistics, even if it would be very funny.
Blowing up anything oil related is basically the closest thing we can get to kicking monke directly in the economic nuts, Russia is basically just a giant run down gas station larping as a superpower and without that oil they cannot even feed their peasants.

>>64179687
That would explain the shilling

>>64167887
What blew up this time?

>>64179565
All the points were reported on multiple times, I'm not sure why are playing a fool here

>>64179687
Ukies going all out on those oil refineries the past weeks