Thread 64191892

>The Navy has awarded BAE Systems a $1.7 billion contract to deliver the Advanced Precision Kill Weapon System II. The indefinite-delivery/indefinite-quantity contract covers full rate production lots 13 through 17.

>The AGR-20 Advanced Precision Kill Weapon System (APKWS) is a design conversion of Hydra 70 unguided rockets with a laser guidance kit to turn them into precision-guided munitions.

At 55k units between 4 lots, that gives us a unit cost of $31k per rockets, a bit more than the $22k contract in 2019, but it's still cheaper than Shahsneeds even with American labor costs. What will dronecels do now?
https://www.govconwire.com/articles/bae-systems-navy-contract-apkws

>>64191892 (OP)
>$31k per rocket
Dronefags on suicide watch lmao

>>64191892 (OP)
the drone cot $500

>>64192056
Not a rocket drone

>>64192056
FPV drones cost $500 faggot. Shaheeds cost more than $20k per unit

>>64192056
>the bullet cost $0.40
Will that stop the bombing brownoid-kun?

>>64191892 (OP)
This mounted on a trainer jet would make for the perfect low cost anti drone platform

>>64192056
>temu drone proceeds to get fried by an M-SHORAD 50kW laser for tree fiddy

>>64192056
$500 drones are jammed easily.

Jam-resistant radios and GPS is expensive, and you need to constantly be updating the design because the opposite side is constantly advancing with their jaming tech.


Shaheeds have gone through a dozen+ iterations because of this and the latest ones use obscenely expensive jam-resistant equipment that makes their total price easily over the $30,000 APKWS II cost.

>>64192192
>>64192152
I'm really liking the fact that drones forced countermeasures to get cheaper and more abundant. Perhaps a day may yet come when missilefags fade into irrelevance and gunchads will rule once more

>>64192152
It's extra funny because the Chinese land forces bought a horde of cheap antidrone lasers. They know the meta doesn't favor drones for long.

>>64191892 (OP)
You had me at laser-guided rockets. Fund it.

>>64192281
OP here, it's already happening. Forgot to include that the APKWS block II is dual mode seeker, which is why it is more expensive than the original APKWS, but with it comes with near perfect hit rate due to the addition of an IR seeker.

>According to BAE Systems, during the US Department of Defense-led exercise, the 70mm APKWS-guided missiles demonstrated 100% effectiveness when fired against 25-50lb drones travelling at more than 100mph.
https://www.army-technology.com/news/bae-systems-apkws-tested-in-precision-guided-rockets-milestone/

>more BAE shilling
grim.

>>64192281
They were used to destroy Iranian and Russian drones already. This is to replenish stocks.

>>64191892 (OP)
What's the range on these?
I thought hydras were basically used at point blank range (relatively speaking), since they were just dumbfired.

>>64192301
frogs on suicide watch

>>64192301
Hey her Yakuza streams are fun at least

>>64192308
1-3km probably, which is comfortably far away enough from an explosion if the drone were to self destruct.

>>64192074
>Shaheeds cost more than $20k per unit
Isn't it a couple hundred thousand per?

>>64192308
>>64193344
~3mi from helicopters, ~6-7mi from fixed wing aircraft

>>64193376
No one really knows, and the price changes frequently as the design itself is constantly changing.

The most advanced recent models LIKELY cost ~$60k+, but it's hard to say for sure.

>>64193376
they costed so much when russia bought it from iran before russia could produce it itself

>>64193384
They’re also working on improved rocket motors to push that range out right now.

>>64193376
It would never be $200k, no. But building one with open market materials does cost over $100k, yes. The propellers usually cost $5k and the engine costs $35k for starters.

Versions built with Russian factories? Not sure.

>>64192150
>trainer jet
>low cost

You knew this would posted, it is your fault anon.

>>64192150
Good, put 8 of them on a Super Taco.

>>64192300
Having the IR seeker to handle terminal guidance also dramatically improves refire time. A generation of engineers and pilots raised with the Itano Circus are making MSSL real.

>>64193556
kill yourself norkschizo

>>64192308
aerodynamic and weight data for some hydra missiles is public information so you can calculate it
I would say 2-3km against a cruise missile and 5-6km against a medium altitude prop drone
ballistic range when fired from a plane at a ground target would be around 20-25km
it's not the best rocket motor in this caliber, using something with higher impulse like C-14 from CRV-7 would increase those figures by up to 50%

>>64193376
Maybe when Russia first started building them, than they hit a critical mass and it became dirt cheap. Then Ukraine started to keep them out of their sky for the most part. Now the average price per unit is probably roughly where they initially were due to how much Russia had to upgrade them just to keep them from being completely useless

>>64192192
It's possible to implement terrain guidance with hardware on the order of a raspberry pi and a phone camera, and terrain guidance is becoming more and more common on both sides.
Of course the latest models of drones we see still have antennas on them so evidently nobody thinks their terrain guidance is a fully reliable substitute.

>>64192056
Even if you could make a drone with significant range and payload for $500, if my GDP is 30 trillion dollars and you're basically fighting because you're poor and mad...

>>64192300
>>64191892 (OP)
So, will we need airborne F-16s at all times to fire on drones, or can APKWS2 be fired from other platforms.
Still need to detect, track, scramble and close within range of the enemy drone.

>>64193753
>or can APKWS2 be fired from other platforms
literally anything that can fire 70mm rockets, including ground based launchers.
that's the whole point

>>64193824
Neat.

>>64193574
https://www.ursamajor.com/media/press-release/ursa-major-develops-extended-range-rocket-motor-for-apkws-r-laser-guidance

>>64193753
>Rotary-wing launch platforms
Qualified platforms
• AH-64D/E Apache
• AH-1W/Z Super Cobra/Viper
• UH-1Y Venom
• MH-60S/R Knight Hawk/Seahawk
• UH-60L/M Black Hawk
• IA-407 Bell
• ARH Tiger
• OH-58 Kiowa Warrior
• AH-6M Little Bird
• AH-1F Cobra
• MD 530G Light Scout
• AW109 Power
Demonstrated platforms
• V-22 Osprey
• Bell 407GT
• Boeing AH-6i
• MQ-8B Fire Scout
Potential platforms
• AW139
• Airbus H135
• Airbus H145

>Fixed-wing launch platforms
Qualified platforms
• F-16 Fighting Falcon
• A-10 Thunderbolt
• AV-8B Harrier
• OV-10 Bronco
• F/A-18 Hornet
• A-29 Super Tucano
• AT-802L Air Tractor
• C-208 Combat Caravan
• CASA 235 Gunship
Demonstrated platforms
• AT-6 Texan
• Textron Scorpion
Potential platforms
• Eurofighter Typhoon
• Hawk
• Dassault Rafale
• Mirage 2000

>Ground launched
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6X8fT5IfFM

They make a palletized system that will fit on anything with a bed, and containerized systems, etc. You can stick them on just about anything flying, driving, or floating. Ukraine has been using the palletized systems for years to take out drones, and even vatnigs in trenches.

>>64193949
FA-50 (and KF-21) are potential fixed wing options in the near future

>>64193957
Where does it say that? Because my list came directly from BAE's website. You would think BAE would know, and list them.

>apkws
pakis and chinks have had the same shit for ages and theirs cost 200 usd per rocket

>>64193972
Wow, it's ALMOST like I said and I'll quote
>POTENTIAL
Would you like the definition for the word or would you care to shut the fuck up?

>>64193978
Those aren't laser guided

>>64191892 (OP)
>At 55k units between 4 lots, that gives us a unit cost of $31k per rockets, a bit more than the $22k contract in 2019, but it's still cheaper than Shahsneeds even with American labor costs. What will dronecels do now?

Its still too much. You need to have these rocket pods and their designators (which probably costs 5x as much) scattered everywhere. Most of them wont see a drone to fire on. At this price, a drone interceptor carrying these rockets make sense, you would need less rocket pods and less laser designators.

>>64194000
It's almost like BAE already list POTENTIAL PLATFORMS. Let me check...
>Potential platforms
• AW139
• Airbus H135
• Airbus H145
>Potential platforms
• Eurofighter Typhoon
• Hawk
• Dassault Rafale
• Mirage 2000
https://www.baesystems.com/en-us/product/apkws

Yep, they do. Why do you fucking retarded pan faced gooks always try to shoehorn your shitboxes into fucking EVERYTHING? Especially when your posts are nothing but asspulls with zero evidence to support them? At first, I didn't give two shits about you gook faggots, now I fucking hate you because of your shilling. Just like chinks.

>>64193978
Firstly, HQ-16 is a US Standard Missile knock-off, and that's a fucking scale model. Secondly, 2.75 inch rockets have been around since the fucking early 1950s, and that's not a Mk70 Hydra copy, it's an Mk4 Folding-Fin Aerial Rocket (FFAR) copy from the 1950s. Stop being retarded, and learn what you're talking about. Furthermore, it's a shitty unguided Mk4 FFAR copy, and not remotely comparable to the Mk70 Hydra, and the guidance kits added to them now. You retarded fucking idiot.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folding-Fin_Aerial_Rocket

>>64194064
HQ-16 is actually a Buk clone

>>64194099
And Buk (Gadfly) is an SM (Tartar) clone.

>>64193949
F-15E is on that list too

>>64191892 (OP)
Each one of these can delete a shaheed flying with reasonable accuracy. Send a few hundred thousand of these to Ukraine and watch Russia stop using them.

>>64192074
Shaheeds cost about $60,000 per unit, and Russia paid for them with gold bullion.

even if they were 3x the avg cost of a UAV, ~$20-30k per shot is so much closer to cost parity than even a cheap frankenlSAM firing AIM-9s or soviet era R-73s.

You don't have to beat the attacker on cost if you are backed by a far larger economy.

>dustin mah crops
>raid siren goes off
>switch to rockets
>spray the horizon
>fertilize the watermelon fields with cardboard and lawnmower engine parts
>radio say i'm an official ace
>another good day

>>64194688
Drone-kill ace =/= fighter-kill ace, all the way back to doodlebug-plinking

>>64194064
No... I'm just stupid and missed the picture. Fun fact, chinks are mounting these on UAVs now.

>>64194962
Where is the sensor for the laser guidance? Those look like standard unguided 70mm rockets to me, unless you can point out the seeker that can optically look onto the laser designator.
>Fun fact, chinks are mounting these on UAVs now.
So have the bongs and the US....fun fact!
https://cuashub.com/en/content/bae-systems-completes-air-to-air-apkws-interception-from-uas-platform/

>>64194036
If you're thinking of ground based anti drone, AHEAD and laser SHORAD is probably more cost effective.

>>64193978
>>64194962
>FS5 was advertised in 2021
>200$ comes right out your ass
The APKWS was in service since 2010, that's why we're on lot 13 already.

You Changs will say whatever shit you think you can get away with by calling yourselves what we call you, huh?

Somebody explain to me how this can cost $31,000. Does the guidance module cost 20 grand or something?

>>64195148
It's hard to say. The last publicly available information puts the unguided 70mm hydra rockets at $2800 each, but that number is from older production batches, current production, considering inflation over recent years, is likely in the $5000-10000 range.

So yes, the guidence section is likely around $20-25k, though you're also paying for the R&D, not just just the material cost of the guidence section.

>>64195148
I mean, the base rocket is just a basic rocket motor + fins that are spring loaded for release upon launch, and then a warhead + fuze.

The guidence section is advanced computers, sensors, etc. In a small package.

So yes, that's the expensive part.

>>64195331
>The guidence section is advanced computers, sensors, etc. In a small package.
Aside from the high speed high torque servos, the thing is basically four fins with four optical sensors. The electronics inside are probably Arduino-tier.
Definitely a bit of price gouging involved, but that's the MIC for you

>>64195148
>>64195331
>>64195373
I feel like that guidance unit could easily replace the fuse on any unguided rocket, what would stop you from screwing it onto a grad?

>>64195373
It's got an IR seeker too.

>>64195399
Nothing. Ground launcher APKWS exists, it's essentially a small PGM Grad. But fixed-canard fuze guidance units like the M1156 Precision Guidance Kit are better for artillery because they don't need expensive optical sensors and provide sufficient accuracy.
Also, the APKWS unit is a third component that screws in between the rocket motor and the warhead. It doesn't replace the fuze.

>>64195415
Did they actually implement that? IIRC the dual-mode unit is mounted on the nose, necessitating a custom midsection warhead. They might as well get a new, longer range rocket motor to go with it.

>>64195434
>the APKWS unit is a third component that screws in between the rocket motor and the warhead.
So some thread adaptors and suddenly you have cheap PGM grads? Neato.

A air launched grad would have a pretty good range, be hilarious to see them with a APKWS being fired from F-16s or the like at ground targets. Might even be able to add a wing kit.

>>64195511
Yes, this contract is for the dual mode seeker version

>>64195512
>>64195434
Wait, could you.....Air launch a APKWS equipped grad as a AA missile? Could you ground launch one as AA? Even if they weren't great that would be great way to get alot of AA missiles fast, especially if you were shooting them at sneeds that were out of hydra range.

>>64195512
You'd have to scale it up a bit. Grad is 122mm, Hydra is 70. Using it as-is would make it less aerodynamic and more importantly block the seekers' line of sight.
>>64195536
Are you sure? None of the articles mention anything about dual-mode.
>>64195550
You don't really need a Grad, just a better 70mm rocket motor. The L3H Vampire already gets used for C-UAS, but I doubt it's very effective

>>64195619
Grads came to mind just because there are craploads of them available and i can't imagine a 70mm even with a upgraded motor outranging a modernish grad.

>>64195619
>Are you sure? None of the articles mention anything about dual-mode.
NTA, but I'm pretty sure it's not the dual mode seeker since BAE said it won't finish development until 2026.

Similar with the extended range motors being developed for the Hydra rockets. Two companies are (were?) working on extended range rocket motors and AFAIK Ursa Major is months away from flight tests, but that still likely means we're at least 2-3 years from orders getting placed and production going, probably another year or three for testing/integration, and then full rate production sometime around 2030.

So it wouldn't shock me if BAE is going to bundle the dual mode seeker with an extended range rocket motor upgrade sometime around 2028-2030.

>>64192150
it's what austria plans to do with their new trainers

>>64192150
I hate to be the obvious guy, but the A-10 hasalways been the ideal fixed wing aircraft for this, and have been using guided Hydras for a decade now. At this point new Trainers in hot war are more valuable than any expiring platform.

Better loiter time than any trainer, no conversion, survivability a non-issue when operating in tandem with a friendly SAM net. 84 rockets between the LAU-68 and 131 pods. Minus 7 for a radar pod, if you don't want to use the A-10s designator.

Perhaps it's post-retirement life is a dedicated anti-drone Hydra truck for Ukraine or Jordan.

>>64197143
you're forgetting that most A-10 are at the limit of their flight hours, no other country beside the US uses them and even if we were to sell or gift them it would make no sense for another country to use those considering the challenges they will have in procuring spare parts and the higher cost per flight hour.
Meanwhile a trainer jet fitted with weapons would be more economical, have decent survivability if it has 2 engines or an EW suite and also be used for normal pilot training.
The A-10 is surely more capable, but it's too old now.

>>64197143
>Better loiter time than any trainer
nowadays trainers have in flight refuel capabilities so they have all the loiter time they want.

>>64197183
Even without the probe/boom they all have similar loiter time.

>>64197238
are those slick times?

>>64197295
I think for the internal fuel only values they add an imaginary % of drag to emulate at least a few A/A missiles

>>64194761
What about unmanned fighters?

>>64195399
It goes in between the booster and the warhead, so it'd be kinda funky on a grad rocket since Hydras are like half the diameter. Probably better to just develop a grad specific kit.

>>64197538
I'm imagining something that you would screw in to replace the grads fuse, that is where my confusion comes in. If the APKWS/122mm obj 2025 uses 70mm as a base diameter i can't see why you couldn't just bore out a grad fuse hole and jam it in. Obviously the warhead would still need something to detonate it but that seems a minor issue compared to having the whole APKWS guidance system just screwed into the (probably reamed out) fuse hole.

While on the subject, surely the USSR or someone has tried to fire a grad from a aircraft right? Or even 107mm by the PRC or Norks.

>>64197143
>>64197238
Textron Scorpion has a 5 hour loiter time, it would be perfect here.

>>64197613
See >>64194040
APKWS modules have fins and sensors that need to be exposed to work. If you just screwed it into a Grad rocket it wouldn't extend past the sides.

>>64197689
forgot pic

>>64197143
>yeah uh can I get a uh plane with no radar for intercepting aerial targets?

>>64197662
What happened to it? I tought it was supposed to be the CIA new plane

>>64197773
And trainers have radars?

>>64197773
He literally mentioned radar pods. Pic Rel. It's an AESA radar pod. They use it on strike eagles and F-16s, too.

Besides, APKWS II is Laser/IR guided. Not radar guided. You don't NEED radar to fire them, because its use case is a short range rocket for non-manuvering targets. In a defensive scenario, any plane will just a be given a vector and use Mk-I eyeballs. That includes trainers, prop planes, and ground attack jets.

>>64197796
Most of the trainers in that list have/will have an aesa radar. But like the other anon said, it's not even necessary.

>>64197695
>>64197689
I must be retarded or something: Why not just put them on the front?

>>64198154
That's where the warhead goes. The APKWS seeker/guidance package goes in between the booster and the warhead.

>>64198154
Hydras are designed with impact fuses, having the seeker on the front would require new warheads

>>64198315
>Hydras are designed with impact fuses
hyrdas have tons of fuze options

>>64198333
Yeah, and the purpose of APKWS is that it's not in a section where any of the fuses are. It doesn't affect your fusing options.

>>64198340
Sure, i'm just saying the statement "hydras are designed with impact fuses" is ignoring all the other fuzing options they were designed for.

How do the APKWS sensors work the patent is vague, they have 4 sensors, they seem to be 1 dimensional linear arrays arranged in an X pattern. Does the missile spin rapidly in flight? This is the only way I can make sense of it.
https://patents.google.com/patent/US8390802B2/en

>>64197779
Didn't get bought because Textron wanted to sell eternal service contracts instead of planes.

>>64198911
yes. the sensors are fixed in place, so the whole thing needs to be on a spinning to get a full 360 degree read.

>>64192048
Yes, because there will of course be zero cost in maintenence, and fuel, zero cost in the pilot, and zero risk to the plane. So 31k is the final mission cost. Makes total sense. Can you even lob that thing as far as a glidebomb?

>>64198911
Yes, Folding Fin Aerial Rockets use curved fins that pop open upon launch and spin the rocket for additional stabilization.

>>64199052
Who can buy more hotdogs:
>a billionaire at $1m/dog
>a billionaire at $10/dog
>a third worldie at $2.50/dog

They don't have to be cheaper than the drone. That will likely never be possible, until laser SHORAD, and that's debatable. But it's nowhere near the cost of a hellfire or longbow, and is more compact and capable than a stinger. Just getting close in cost is a win for the much richer NATO countries.

>>64198911
quadrant detectors work without any spin, you're trying to find what's the angle of the incoming ray based on how a lens distributes light onto two pairs of elements
that's how paveways, laser spot trackers, UV/IR MAWS sensors worked
here the detector is split into the vertical and horizontal components because of size constraints, two perpendicular wings with 2 photodiodes each would be the minimal implementation

>>64193753
>will we need airborne F-16s at all times
The USAF doesn't even deploy the F-16 anymore. They phased them out in February. Any F-16 still in service with the USAF exists solely to test new technologies. Unmanned ones in particular. But no more are being purchased.

>>64199213
Wtf is this third worlder cope ?

>>64199224
My cope transcends your comprehension.

>>64193949
>palletized
The OSHA certified will inherit the earth

>>64195373
>>64195399
>I feel like
I feel like your mother is a bit of a harlot, she puts out so easy i actually feel sorry for her. I also feel like your feelings are why you're stuck shitposting on a sorry-ass imageboard instead of earning real money building rockets like these. Try feeling less, tardo-kun.

>>64199213
why do people with zero knowledge of aviation always want to say their retarded piece?

>>64199343
Are you aware that this is basic sigint 101 and every fucking DCS pilot knows when to turn off their radar

>>64199343
This but unironically for Chinese jets, their radars probably don't even have LPI and just blast signals everywhere.

>>64199508
Are you actually disagreeing with the fact that the USAF retired the F-16?

>>64199827
Yes considering they recently ordered over 600 F-16V upgrade kits.

The USAF currently has about 760 F-16Cs and 150 F-16Ds in service.

The F-16V PoBIT is upgrading 608 of those existing F-16s to be in service until at least the early 2040s.

>>64199142
I took the drone fags to mean the people who shill for drones in western countries. A new fancy hydra won't change the slew of advantages drones can provide, even for western armies.

>>64198971
There's no evidence for this. More likely, since it was a private venture and not part of any competition the government was under no obligation to buy it.

>>64200144
It was entered in several competitions, it just never made it past the initial stage in any of them. The Air Force is winning to bend over and take it in the ass from the manufacturers for cutting edge fighters, but not for a supposedly cheap aircraft competing against a crop duster.

>>64200175
To my knowledge it only entered two, the Light Attack Experiment and the T-X competition. It's a bad fit for a trainer because it's essentially a personal jet, but for the LAE USAF wanted a turboprop for some reason. AFSOC only really wanted the A-29.
It was a two-seat jet competing with single-seat turboprops, and the buyer wanted a turboprop in the first place.

>>64199434
Are you confounding those dirty OSHAs with the glorious eternal Forklift Certified demigods?

>>64200224
LAAR and Armed Overwatch. But yeah, they're all basically the same competition with all of the same aircraft being entered each time.

>>64199052
You're acting like the stereotypical bean counter, and that's coming from ME, a professional bean counter

Swarms of cheap shit doesn't win modern wars. The keywords are "fit for purpose" and "combined arms". In air combat terms, a hi-lo mix will beat swarms of cheap shit or a small number of gold-plated shit, all else being equal

>>64200572
I'm saying don't lie about the cost of deploying the entire packeage and the risks associated with that. That is all.

Okay but can we call it:
Hydra-2
Or:
Apkwiss
Instead of AY-PEE-KAY-DUBBLYOO-ESS? [APKWS]
Like how ppl say Humvee instead of:
AYTCH-EMM-EMM-DUBBLUOO-VEE? [HMMWV]

>>64191892 (OP)
One step closer to Macross

>>64201358
I've always read it as Ay-pik-wis

>>64193680
Yeah but that would point out the changing nature of war and indicate that there's an enormous gap in our defense preparedness indicating that our trillion dollar budget is being squandered on ineffective tech and that's communist

>>64201392
Even that's an improvement. (But mine's still better-er because it's one syllable less)
>>64201387
You know most nerds are retards same as everyone else, because they prefer Gundamslop over actually fun & exciting Macross.

>>64201439
Sell me on Macross and where to start
Also do they all have stupid idolshit?

>>64201387
I love you Macross anon. Always making me think how kino the Naval and Air intercept battles will be.

>>64201463
They do have stupid idolshit but that's a feature.
The underlying dynamic is always to emphasize full-spectrum victory, and the need for holistic social unity during political adventures.
In other words, the Zentraedi or latter villains always fracture and suffer a fifth column. This happens because our soft-power (cute idols) wins over some of the enemy's heart.
The men and women are both involved, the show has better appeal among both men & women too. (Whereas Gundam is much more heavily male otaku)
And IRL, your autismal hobby and outlook is either gonna get weaker or stronger; if you're not growing, you're dying.
Consider the meaning behind female frivolities, understand soft power, figure out how to approach women and start a family. Only then can the Otaku flag rise over the hideous Normalfag Empire.

There's also giantess tomboys who get broken and fall for ace human pilots. In multiple series. (They also learn how to shrink them to human size.)

Macross Plus is a GOATED movie featuring a retold F-22 prototype selection contest as a subplot. Lots of sakuga (master) animation sequences.

>>64201495
Gundam has been pure fujobait for thirty years at this point.

>>64201544
A very funny and witnessed doubles claim, anon, but I dunno how so.
Unless you mean Tomino's weird bisexual shit between Char and Amuro. And kinda also, Setsuna and the Super-America ace from Gubdam00.
(Man, Gundam00 was ass... only surpassed in garbage by SEED and ofc SEED Destiny.)

>>64201557
I’m not gonna bother delving into all the popular pairings or whatever but outside of gunpla otaku, fujos are the main demographic from a monetary sense. Wing is still one of their most beloved series even all these decades later. It’s when Bandai caught on and cashed in, and everything since is garbage fujobait.

>>64201586
Well, consider me enlightened by this revelation.
And now that you mention it, I do recall back in 2011, two art student lesbians I was acquainted with, having a weird obsession with both Wing and Code Geass (Lelouch x Suzaku?).
I believe it.

>>64201495
>Whereas Gundam is much more heavily male otaku
Gundam has basically always had a huge female following. It's melodrama at it's heart.
But sometimes quite good

>>64201605
Mecha always draws a bl following for whatever reason, unless it's absolutely saturated with women

>>64201346
so add the cost of the trucks to ferry the Gerans to their launch pads, and the salaries of the crews to launch the Gerans, and the cost of the GLONASS/Baidu satellites providing the targeting data...

>>64201358
>Hydra
Medusa would be a good name for it

>>64201713
>Mecha always draws a bl following
tomboys like mecha

>>64201823
Is being a fujo predominantly a tomboy thing?
If so that would explain some things I've noticed lately.
To keep it on topic, check out this hydra MRL thing.

>>64201904
I wonder if we'll see graund launched guided hydras outside of CUAS/anti-small boat/USV stuff

>>64192246
why does chinka have such a huge land force? who exactly do they think they're going to fight on land over there?

>>64201985
It's probably just the result of having a bug population

>>64202023
I meant to type big but bug works too I guess

>>64198911
>Does the missile spin rapidly in flight?
You tell me anon.

>>64199213
>Pilot literally cannot see out of his own fucking plane
brother they can look through the fucking floor if they want
F-35s are basically magic

>>64191892 (OP)
Based macross future

>>64201904
I don't even know what a fujo is

I just know that all the girls I know like sword and sorcery anime, anything involving machines only attracts guys and tomboys

>>64202143
>I don't even know what a fujo is


Fujoshi or "rotten girl".

> a female fan of media, particularly anime and manga, that features romantic relationships between men, known as Boys' Love (BL) or yaoi.

>>64202143
The fujos, predominantly, aren't watching it for the robots.
Though sometimes they're fujos FOR the robots but that's another kettle of fish

>>64201904
>>64201981
This begs the question: Given it's weight could it be shoulder launched?

>>64202502
No

Javelin for example is ~11.8kg (with an 8.4kg warhead)

The launch tube is another ~4kg

The CLU is ~6.4kg (the new Light Weight CLU is ~4.8kg)

Putting it between 45-49lbs

The javelin is also only ~47" in length making it manageable by an individual.


The APKWS is 15kg (with a 3.9kg warhead) with no launch tube or firing computer/optics unit, and is 74" long.

Once you provide a launch tube you're likely looking at an additional few inches in length and likely at LEAST another 5kg potentially more, and an optic/firing computer unit like the javelin CLU, at lets say 5kg.

So that's ~25kg conservatively, or ~55lbs, making it heavier than a javelin and harder to manoeuvre with as a soldier. Not to mention delivering a warhead less than half the weight a similar distance (both Javelin and APKWS have a ~3 mile maximum range when ground launched).

>>64202502
>>64202622
Why are you comparing it to a Javelin and not the 70mm shoulder-fired surface-to-air guided missile that's been in service for decades?

>>64201985
Possibly saars. Possibly puccians. They really just need something to make their people feel safe and keep the defense industry alive so they can "never again" chest pound.

>>64202143
It's a Japanese term self-appointed by (usually teenage and young adult) women who obsess over gay male relationships. Fundanshi is the male equivalent (but is for male fans of gay male relationships, not of gay female relationships). A lot but not all of them are female NEETs.

>>64201981
>graund launched guided hydras
I was squee-ing a tad early in the war because Ukraine was given a few hundred of these, called the "Vampire". basically ground-launched APKWS. they put it on a truck. they'd been talking about this for a while but there had been neither interest nor battlefield requirement until now.
recently they've been praised for downing Shaheeds.

>>64202502
>could it be shoulder launched?
possibly. but the guidance unit might not be shoulder-portable

>>64202776
See
>>64201990
That thing is the current most bare bones compact hydra launcher on the market.
I don't think in it's basic form it needs anything more than something lasing for it.
https://fulcrumconceptsllc.com/product/one-shot-jump-rocket-launcher-rl-1j/
No idea if anyone actually buying it though.

>>64202776
Not recently. They've put Vampire on coast guard boats blocking Odessa since 2024.
It took a while to assemble the capital and people to expand guidance kit production.

General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems is who you should show up at, after sending angry letters. They have responsibility for Hydra. They told me they're waiting to hear from you, but haven't found a way to contact you yet.

>>64201990
>>64202920
it's literally just a Hydra 70 propped on a bipod like a fucking Congreve rocket. "bare bones" is almost an understatement.
the problem is the weight of the designator, without which it probably does have the accuracy of a Congreve rocket.

>>64202776
>but the guidance unit might not be shoulder-portable
should be able to lock onto the laze from existing designators no problem, not to mention the newer dual-mode seeker

>>64202956
uh hello BASED?

>>64200004
Well isn't it just strange that I can google "F-16 retired" and get all these results about how it is in fact retired, that no more are being purchased or trained on, and that this has been the case since February? It is no longer in active service. This is a fact.

>>64203082
Not him but block 40/50+ are slated to remain in service until 2040 at the earliest
figured that out by googling "F-16 retired" and spending literally 5 seconds browsing results
you might be retarded and/or illiterate

>>64203082
https://www.twz.com/air/u-s-air-force-fighters-deploy-to-reinforce-middle-east
https://www.airandspaceforces.com/air-force-doubles-down-f-16-fighters-north-korea/
https://www.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/4242024/51st-fighter-wing-enhances-readiness-through-f-16-upgrades/
https://www.twz.com/air/air-force-chief-responds-to-possibility-of-buying-new-block-80-f-16s
https://www.airandspaceforces.com/f-16s-to-serve-nearly-two-more-decades-replacement-choice-still-6-8-years-away/

You are a retard. This is a fact.

>>64199213
>The USAF doesn't even deploy the F-16 anymore
>>64203082
>This is a fact
Literally kill yourself, it would save the people around you the trouble of feeding you. It's also a net gain for humanity, and good for the environment.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/us-moving-fighter-jets-middle-east-israel-iran-war-rages-2025-06-17/

>>64203082
Yes, some of the oldest F-16s have been retired, the block 10/15 F-16A/Bs, but the USAF block 40/50 F-16Cs are largely being upgrade to the F-16V block 70 standard and will remain in service for at least another 10-15 years. The PoBIT (Post Block Integration Team) program is also doing airframe reconditioning bringing the airframe service life up from 8000 hours to 12000 hours.

>>64201812
You should. But be honest here. Does a truck suck any significant diesel compared to the fuel use of a jet? And the cost of satellite data is pretty minimal, with how many operations they support. The big cost/problem i mentioned is the risk of loosing the very expensive jet and very expensive pilot. That risk isn't there with drones. At most you are loosing a drone pilot, thoose a a dime a dozen compared to a jet pilot.

>>64202706
There's more normie fujoshi than neet ones, especially in Asia.
But you'd be correct in saying that a lot of female neets are fujoshi to some extent or another.

>>64203630
>female neets
seems to me you'd have to be pretty fucked in the head to be a female neet in Japan, when there's always the options of waitressing and whoring

>>64203796
Well they are quite head-fucked indeed, to be honest. Both waitressing and whoring require that the person is okay with regular social interaction. Lots of Jap girls just want to play brother-sister romance games on their computers all day.

>>64191892 (OP)
Why not just keep buying Canada's war crimes rockets? The CRV-7 still fucks.

>>64204035
CRV7's main strength was that it was better than Hydras at killing tanks cheaply. now that we have cheap PGMs CRV7 has lost its raison d'etre.

>>64204035
A guided version was made, creatively dubbed CRV7-PG was to be made but it seems it never got beyond a few test firings

>>64205211
>creatively dubbed
I mean, "Canadian Rocket Vehicle 7cm Precision Guided" is perfectly on-brand

>>64204035
>Retired from service in it's home country
Wtf Canada
>>64205211
>offered it for sale starting in 2007
>None procured or exported before being discontinued
WTF CANADA
>

>>64203082
Next you'll be telling us the B-52 has been retired from active service because they stopped production decades ago.

>>64203796
>Why would there be female neets in Japan when they could like, get jobs
Anon...

>>64202502
It's happened with S-5 or S-8 rockets before.
Chechnya is one example.
And there was one semi recently from russians in Ukraine
Always very sketchy

>>64209391
Here it is.
https://youtu.be/LeYcPpXs6xU?si=CY9FE7um2jlA6YAd

>>64202776
Any talk of these seeing use against ground targets or just shadman zapping?
Could you launch one like a grad while having someone closer to the target paint it with a laser?

>>64214097
In theory.
In reality the range is a little low for that with the standard rocket motor, and the warhead is a little small for armored targets.
May as well just use an FPV.

>>64215125
There's already extended range motors out there just waiting to be slapped on as seen here. There's a huge amount of cheap growth potential here.
>>64193876

And more HE filler than a standard RPG warhead in the HEAT warhead (that said I don't really see it as an anti armor thing)
I think things like it's submunition, WP and anti structural warheads are more useful.
Not to mention the speed advantage and ability to ripple fire as well as ignoring jamming.
I don't think it'll supplant quads in their niche, just that it has plenty of potential uses in the ground aside from just killing drones

>>64215544
>There's already extended range motors out there just waiting to be slapped on
No, they're actively developing them right now specifically because the range of standard Hydra motors is lacking.
They static fired them for the first time only a few weeks ago.

>>64215566
To be fair, that means they're ~6-12 months from low-rate initial production, assuming the flight tests don't show any major problems.

>>64215566
Can't we just take the CRV7's motor and slap it on a hydra?
Clearly Canada isn't doing anything with it and the parents are all well expired.

>>64215607
>Clearly Canada isn't doing anything with
They sent all the rocket motors to Ukraine

The main reason is politics, the US wanted to keep production in the US owned by US companies. But it also would've required completely new manufacturing facilities (or major overhauls of existing facilities) as well as training/re-training all the workers needed for the production process. The US at the time already was working on the Mk66 motor, which still falls short of the CRV7 motor, but was better than the original Hydra rocket motor it was replacing and was "good enough" for the US's needs at the time, especially since it wouldn't become a guided rocket for another ~30 years.

Now that the guided APKWS hydras are obviously here to stay for at least another few decades the US is working with Nammo and Ursa Major to develop new rocket motors for the Hydra/APKWS that outperforms even the CRV7's rocket motor and is easier/faster to manufacture while also being done fully in the US.

>>64215702
>rocket motors for the Hydra/APKWS that outperforms even the CRV7's rocket motor and is easier/faster to manufacture while also being done fully in the US.

>>64215725
Yeah the big advantage Ursa Major is touting is that they're 3rd printing the rocket motor casing, nozzle, and other structural components in the motor while also utilizing a newer, much more energy-dense propellant.

>>64215806
>3rd
3D

>>64215702
Is the CRV7 still manufactured? It's two biggest users dropped it (Canada and UK) while allegedly Australia and NZ still use it.

Only recent news I could find about it and it's manufacturer other than the Ukraine transfer was a lefty cry session about how terrible it is as a Canadian fo sell weapons like CRV7 that make people die and one about how the evil death rocket factory heckin poisoned the waterhole respectively

>>64216248
Magellan Aerospace claims it's a currently available product in their lineup, so presumably the still retain production capability, even if it isn't currently in production.

>>64193546
You have no idea what you're talking about. You can get an equivalent engine MADE IN GERMANY for 8000€
https://3w-modellmotoren.de/produkt/3w-684i-b4-ts/?lang=en

>>64219266
>>64193546
According to Russian MOD, the production cost for a Geran 2/Shaheed made in Russia is a bit over 5 million rubles, which is between $60,000 and $80,000 depending on how badly the ruble is doing on any particular day. The first ones they bought from Iran were traded at about 2.5 times that value, but they weren’t paid for with currency, they were paid for with IOUs for fighter planes. Subsequent batches of Iranian Shaheeds have been paid for with gold bullion at between $100,000 and $120,000 equivalence, because Iran is suspect that the IOUs for Sukhois might be irredeemable.

>>64221392
Price must've gone up with all the anti jamming shit they have to stuff in there to make it fly straight this far into the cat mouse game

>>64191892 (OP)
Sounds a lot like Martlet.

>>64221530
Yeah, except already in full service and better