Thread 64251898

Are powered armoured suits for each individual soldier the way forward now that tanks and IFVs have become obsolete due to drones?

Its incredibly easy to make plastic mockups of things like this when the only purpose is to look cool.

>>64251898 (OP)
Yes.

>>64251903
Oh say can you see

>>64251898 (OP)
Yes, obviously the solution to AFVs without anti-air coverage being vulnerable to the drone menace is to put every single soldier in their own personal man sized AFV without anti-air coverage that costs about as much as a regular AFV and only has a fraction of the capabilities or mobility on open ground. Great thinking, you may have cracked the code.

>>64251919
Viva la Solo Nobre

>>64251919
Idk who's crazier between corvids in their death traps or loyalists still on mongoose.

>>64251919
I want a Touro so fucking bad bros,

>>64252164
I'd rather be in a MOG, than out of it.

>>64252180
Fair enough. Personally I'd rather be outside of any corvid vehicle than inside.

>>64252314
I agree with you. MOGs might be ancient, beat to shit scrap heaps, and haunted, but I'd rather be in one than anything a corvid "engineer" built.

>>64252314
The Eightball might not be terrible. And there's some charm in just being a flying fortress on horribly, horribly overburdened Tauro legs in the Rat King.

Still, the mog is hard to beat for charm.

Is this the suit that that Chinese furry engineer was working on after being hired by the PLA?

>>64252314
The Rope Kid is probably the best Agrav you can get. Put the old reliable on it as a main and any stun gun you can think of as a second.

Yes. You might think otherwise of feel like you have compelling reasons we shouldn't, but they're all wrong.

Implessive

Yeah

Cosplay isn't /k/

>>64251898 (OP)
We don't know. As of now, even the US with it's ability to plant a Burger King on the othet side of the world day 1 of a war, does not want to bother with suits and shit. It took years of R&D and bitching to get basic combat googles with a nice hud and the ability to ping shit. What most likely is going to happen is more and more drone logistics. The US will have the coolest and most capable drone carriers and some kind of modular exoskeletton to help grunts lift heavy shit with ease.
Also something like Delts will be really good and give the US and Nato almost mystical powers of foresight. The latter will be mocked by the global south for ages until one cunt gets uppity and the US casually murders a few thousands because some guy blew up a tower in Florida.

>>64257940
A DJI quadcopter can already ping and do better recon than any human grunt can do on the ground: https://youtu.be/1ucIm6g9llg?t=130

Fuck off chinkshill

>>64251898 (OP)
All that effort on making useless flip up panels like a Marvel movie and he couldn't work out how to make a good armored knee joint.

>>64251898 (OP)
They are already countered by FPV drones.
Like in the the standard Ukrainian FPV drones warhead is 2 kg thermobaric charge in plastic case, pure blast. No amount of body armor will save against that.

>>64251898 (OP)
Not until we have man portable fusion power generators.

>>64258562
RTG's already exist

>>64258304
I don't disagree with ur point, but thermobaric is pretty bad against armor. It's must be dispersed to work. While you need to achieve fragmentation or some other means to pen

>>64251898 (OP)
No, just letting the infantry drudge forward without armour is

>>64258588
It's the power output issue, not fancy-schmancy sci-fi mumbo-jumbo. Even a motorcycle engine hooked to a generator is less of a brainded option

>>64258588
Making them takes a significant fraction of our total plutonium production. And they don’t make much power for their weight. And when somebody wearing this suit gets shot or blown up, now you have radioactive material scattered everywhere.

>>64258588
But they're not up to the task, nor what he specifically asked for.

>>64258617
You should have told NASA that they should've installed a motorcycle engine onto their Mars rover: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-mission_radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator

>>64258617
That, and most importantly power density.
>>64258634
You're such a fucking retard holy shit, you're the definition of Dunning-Kruger.

honk-honk-honk.webm

>>64251898 (OP)
Powered suits would be crazy expensive for something that cant outrun your average drone

>>64259587
Neither tanks, IFVs nor APCs can outrun drones either

>>64251898 (OP)
I think powered armor is going to become inevitable now that the enemy can drop mortars on you at any time.

>>64251898 (OP)
>now that tanks and IFVs have become obsolete due to drones?
Retard.

>>64258588
Oh good, we can turn on the lights for the next fifty years.

>>64252071
Exactly. These "Drones have made tanks and IFVs obsolete" retards don't have a clue about how combined arms work, or even the basic threat that drones present.
Hell, I don't think they even understand that the threat drones pose to tanks isn't even that different from what has existed for 50+ years with ATGMs, artillery and landmines. The only reason these retards think drones are notable is because they're 90% of war footage these days because they have cameras on them and automatically record the video.

>>64259664
Yeah but putting the money on more vehicles makes sense instead of power armor

>>64259723
Power armor would be more of an infantry replacement than a vehicle replacement. Think of it as a way to make infantry more durable in the face of drone spotted artillery.

>>64251919
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d0w6UnuRgBA&pp=ygUQYnJpZ2Fkb3Iga2lsbGVycw%3D%3D
The audiobook is amazing too.

>>64259725
Yeah I can see that happening in the far future, but im pretty sure by that point we will have the ai and pathing problem solved

>>64251919
But in the book drones reigned supreme too

>>64259725
Power armor is a concept invented before the transistor-guided weapon. Of course it's great for fighting dumb weapons from its own era. But against guided weapons, it makes less sense because no level of man-portable armor is stopping a 100lb artillery warhead that explodes 1 meter away instead of 100 meters away. Or stopping a 1lb EFP warhead taped to a drone for that matter.

>>64251898 (OP)
>That webm

Imagine trying to fit people with this shit and having to deal with dudes who are giga-nigga huge or just fat fucks.

That being said, I could only imagine sophisticated exo-skeletons and primarily for logistical uses. Not having to pay soldiers for wear and tear on their backs and kness and shoulders seems like it would be worth the investment.

>>64259763
Arguably we're already at that point and still using infantry. At least a powered exoskeleton will let us mount measures that might keep a man alive.

>>64251898 (OP)
Just think of when it fails and locks you in place, breaks your bones or both. Best of all, it wk,l be hacked, so someone can just brick you from 200 yards away without firing a shot.

>>64261515
There's nothing that annoys me more than scifi settings where literally everything is connected to raw wifi for some reason and a hacker can wave his arm to turn off your gun and explode your cyberballs. It's just magic.

>>64251898 (OP)
>retarded question based on a retarded asumption
Go away.

>>64251898 (OP)
no
war has to be efficient
human life is worthless (to our leaders) so spending so much just to protect soldiers better isn't worth it

Retard

>>64261611
And yet body armor.

>>64261515
Why is it wi-fi accessible?

>>64251898 (OP)
No, too expensive and still not drone resistant
Just throw some auto targeting 22lr mini gun turrets on your tank, short range Doppler radar should be able to detect anything moving through the air faster than a swallow

>>64265227
Body armor is political
Everyone knows the tech exists at a semi reasonable cost
If a volunteer based military was putting soldiers into combat without basic consideration to their well being it would hurt recruitment numbers

>>64265700
Why should grunts wear helmets or body armors at all?

>>64265709
So why not pay more money? In fact, why not Conscript? It's because warm bodies have value and grinding through your manpower too quickly is often more expensive than just issuing armor.

>>64265744
Because it makes them feel better
Anyone have numbers on how many lives are actually saved by body armor?
My guess is not that many

>>64265759
Yes they do have value, where body armor makes sense but wide spread power armor doesn't
Not just the cost of the armor but the logistics around it, too expensive and complicated, it would make more sense to get them all ATVs to strap their shit to

>>64265779
>wide spread power armor doesn't
>Wide spread
Well there's your problem. You only really need power armor for assault troops that take enemy positions. Gotta keep the men alive long enough to capture a point despite near misses of drones and artillery.
>ATV
Works well with power armor. ATV keeps the batteries charged while the power armor keeps the MGs from sweeping the rider off the saddle.

>>64265774
This reads less like bait and more like zigger cope.

>>64265799
That's an IFV but worse.

>>64265914
An IFV but smaller and cheaper.

>>64265856
Ukraine and Russia are pretty much the same place and I don't care about either of them

>>64265799
The failed premise in OP was power armor for each soldier

>>64251898 (OP)
Retarded chinkoid plastic shit

>>64266203
Yeah, most modern armies barely have kevlar for everyone, never mind ceramic plates.

Implessive

>>64251898 (OP)
>>64251903
this is some chink weeb's cos play project...
still impressive though (Lil man earned the R)

>>64252071
Unlike in an actual AFV, you can duck into a trench with this.

>>64265685
Anything electric and/or electronic can be "hacked", or have a backdoor in it from the start. The millisecond this crap stops working, and it will, it immediate becomes an impediment, or a cage that the wearer is trapped within.

Between drones and this shit, we may as well just go full retard and have annual Battle Bot events and leave it at that. "Modern Warfare" isn't much else at this point.

>>64259701
>the threat drones pose to tanks isn't even that different from what has existed for 50+ years with ATGMs, artillery and landmines.
Drone threat is game changing. Drones are inderect weapons tanks can't fight back. Historically real antitank weapons were direct fire weapons and fight was two way. That means that simple tactic "make larger tank blob attack click them forward" worked very fine. If they encounter enemy larger blob simply outguns enemy and wins combat.
Versus inderect weapons it is completely different. Tanks take casualties and don't inflict damage back.
That situation is similar to WWI when artillery went indirect fire mode and could kill infantry without taking fire back. And we all know how WWI ended.
Tank is counter to inderect artillery, tank invulnerable to shrapnel and can rush through it fire. That defined maneuver WWII war.
But now drones counter tanks and it's WWI all over again.

You etheir make tank protected from drones (practically by active self defense means like micro AAA) or tank goes extinctcan it's WWI trench warfare stalemate.

The problem with power armor is that it’s a logical nightmare. Either you have an exoskeleton that has the armor attached to it which requires more power or you make the soldier bear the weight.

The applications are impressive, make them the point man, carry heavy weaponry or even artillery, but the energy and weight are the main problems. I know there’s those crazy carbon fibers or whatever but that’s CRAZY expensive

>>64259779
>Not having to pay soldiers for wear and tear on their backs and kness and shoulders
In literally all of US military history, without a single exception, any advancement that would lead to the soldier not having to carry as much just results in the commanders issuing even more gear so the rate of exploding knees stays static or even rises. Uncle Sam's growth is fuelled by shredded tendons and ligaments.

>>64268382
If the wearer is bears the weight then that's just normal armor, power armor is meant to assist the user in moving with all the extra weight of the armor.

>>64268301
Why don't we just hack all the soldiers radios and tell them to shoot each other?

>>64251898 (OP)
Very neat with all the tiny actuators.
Great for cosplay. Very cinematic.

>>64251898 (OP)
>tanks and IFVs have become obsolete

The hell of it is that the tank isn't obsolete because you need it for assault more than ever but it get gang raped by cheap drones

>>64268747
Why can't you speak english?

>>64251898 (OP)
>now that tanks and IFVs have become obsolete
Have they? It seems both Ukraine and Russia disagree with you there.

>>64268301
>Anything electric and/or electronic can be "hacked", or have a backdoor in it from the start.
But not remotely. Disconnect all the wireless features and the only way to hack a suit would be to plug a cable into it. Since the controller is inside the suit there's no need for external comms.
>Between drones and this shit, we may as well just go full retard and have annual Battle Bot events and leave it at that.
If anything, drones are more vulnerable to hacking because they're dependent on remote controls.

>>64261611
>human life is worthless
Retard take.

>>64268382
The same was said about repeating rifles during the Crimean War. Logistics improve with time and development.

>>64268432
That’s the typical depiction yes, but even having an armor that the soldier can reasonably wear over or under an exoskeleton frame to augment strength would be a massive boon for military applications
These kinds of things take baby steps but with AI that might help make progress exponentially

>>64266949
If you are going to sit inside a trench all day then why do you need the power armour for? The only thing that armour gets you is that you become a casualty if a drone lands within 1-2 meters of you instead of 3-10 meters without the armour, which isn't a huge difference when these things are directly ramming soldiers and flying into dugouts.The power armour doesn't change the outcome nearly enough to justify each soldier suddenly costing an order of magnitude more to field and requiring a much sturdier logistics chain to keep their knockoff iron man suit working.

Even if you write off AFVs as a lost cause and give up on air support like some third rate loser/poor nation, you are still better off investing in artillery or drones and winning the attrition game instead of spending huge amounts of money for marginal gains in infantry survivability against precision guided ordinance (which is exactly what suicide FPVs are). Even unmanned ground vehicles would be a better investment.

>>64251898 (OP)
I want to see armoured suits like Batman wears, minus the cape and with the mouth covered

>>64270205
>That’s the typical depiction yes
There's no if or buts you retard, if the armor isn't powered, it's not power armor, it's literally in the name.

>>64270320
Gotta clear trenches and bunkers.

>>64270320
I predict wars in the future will not be won by committing even harder to the endless stalemate of flinging drones at each other forever, but by whoever comes up with an alternative approach.

It's not like they cost that much, you have plenty of budget to experiment.

>>64259763
you act as if power armor wouldn't have counter measures. Drones aren't this all powerful ultimate weapons. They're good in ukraine because they can be used unrestricted

>>64270200
>to our leaders
illiterate handicapped retard

>>64251898 (OP)
The idea of wearing shit full of sensitive electronics powered with batteries on the battlefield sounds so dumb to me.

>>64272551
>Radio
>NVG
>Blue Force trackers
>GPS
Bit late to be a luddite.

>>64272543
Still retarded. Manpower is the #1 resource that gives everything else value. Experience and expertise is what separates the competent armies from the useless ones. Only the worst leaders throw men into the meatgrinder and only until they run out of warm bodies to throw at a problem.

>>64273245
cope, you know you answered without reading the full post

>>64273256
Still retarded take. Also, not >>64270200

>>64273280
it's a retarded take to say that our leaders don't care about human life? lmao
yeah i read your post, experience ecc. its very obvious gamer experience.

>>64273410
Retarded leaders don't value human life. Good leaders value life if only as much as any other resource. A leader that wastes lives rather than spending them is a bad leader. Saying human "life is worthless (to our leaders)" is like saying "Our leaders are shit". Even if it's true, you don't say that to outsiders lest said outsiders take advantage of it.

>>64273463
so who are the good leaders? where are the leaders that aren't knowingly sending soldiers to their death?

>>64273483
>so who are the good leaders?
Who sends their men in with decent armor and fire support?
>where are the leaders that aren't knowingly sending soldiers to their death?
Not the issue. Lives need to be SPENT not WASTED. Losing a hundred men to take a hill isn't a failure until you realize the Same hill could have been taken with 10 casualties.

>>64273527
>decent armor
so you agree with me. my original point was that war has to be efficient.
decent armor is literally efficient armor. power armor would be too expensive.
that's the whole point of my argument.

>>64273537
Is that what you were saying? I thought you were saying power armor was never going to happen because our leaders don't give enough of a shit about ground pounders.

>>64273592
ye
they won't do it cause it's too much spending just to arm and protect 1 soldier

>>64273735
At the same time, we can't seem to take infantry out of the battlefield and these battlefields are getting so deadly that sending men out without power armor is going to accomplish jack shit.

>>64273537
I don't think that these powered armors would be more expensive than the APCs and IFVs they would be replacing. And they would be perfect for airborne troops who literally have limited armoured vehicles that could be deployed to support them.

>>64251898 (OP)
It'd have to be something that could easily be taken off. Imagine trying to treat life threatening wounds when you have to use a grinder to get them out.

>>64273945
NTA but if you're trying to replace AFVs with power armor you're doing it wrong. Better to make Infantry+. At the very least you could make APCs that carry power armor and keep them charged until they dismount.

No
We need to retvrn to plate and gambeson against frag

>>64274026
All our plates and soft armor pop off with ease for the exact reason. We're not going to be discarding this incredibly obvious feature once we move onto powered armor.

Battery tech is still the bottleneck

>>64251898 (OP)
Robots would be an easier option than a complex, heavily armored, life support system. Their targeting would probably be better too. Just have some regular grunts far behind some robots and you have the same thing with way less danger

>>64258634
100 watts of electric power. 0.13 horse power.

>>64259755
Books are for communists since reading is for faggots

>>64251898 (OP)
Genuinely impressive

>>64280232
We still hesitate when using fully autonomous robots and ai in our military for obvious reasons, and remote control has obvious drawback and weakpoints.

>>64280503
If our science has reached a point where actual working power armor is doable, then robotics and programming has probably kept up or outpaced it

>>64281319
I don't think it's an issue like making a bigger battery or synthetic muscles or something, we simply don't trust AI and we reasonably can't rely on it. Every day we find out another system has developed some ridiculous problem we could have never predicted and we don't seem to be getting much better at avoiding it. If anything the greater complexity just leads to more bizarre cases.