Thread 64258340

Sometimes I do have to board some public transportation with my wife and kids.

>>64258340 (OP)
You should ask in /hg/, but more bullets are more better. Maybe a 19

>>64258362
26 is the way. Feels the same as my 43 iwb holster but holds twice as many rounds, I sold my 43

>>64258340 (OP)
Probably but I don't know why you'd go for 6+1 when the P365, Hellcat or any of the other microcompacts exist.

>>64258340 (OP)
you are now aware that holsters for spare magazines exist. there's even a few designed for "inside the waistband" in case you want to keep them concealed.
if you're carrying something close to a revolvers capacity, you want a spare magazine.
>>64258422
the hellcat pro is a damn nice platform. I carry in southern Florida and it is damn nice to have.

>>64258340 (OP)
>Sometimes I do have to board some public transportation with my wife and kids.
No you don't, stop lying.

A lone scholar, yeah it’s fine. But a pack of them, maybe not? Though I imagine the chances of them knocking off their enrichment activities are high if you simply produce a gun, and almost 100% if you fire a single shot.

Btw, I know I called them a pack, but I besmirch dogs with that comparison. The proper collective noun for lunchtime rowdies is a “rape” or a “larceny”. As in, “a rape of niggers”, or ‘a larceny of groids”

The Active Self Protection guy has analyzed thousands of security tapes and body cameras and has never seen a civilian need to reload

When I first started shooting I felt like I needed 15 round magazines. What I really needed was more training.

My risk profile is almost entirely retards looking for an easy mark with a dash of ‘rabid animal encounter while walking the dog’ on the side.

I’m not a cop that can encounter organized crime. I’m not a soldier (who is realistically DEEP in the shit if they’re relying on a handgun).

If I somehow land in the middle of a mob 8 more rounds from a handgun isn’t going to save me. People walk around with one in the chamber because a lone knifeman will successfully charge the pitchers mound 9/10 times. Even from 30’ away. Just 2 or 3 people without fear is enough to fuck up my day, regardless of how many bullets I have.

Better to use a smaller handgun with perfect concealment. You can get the drop on your enemy while avoiding the type of people looking to steal a gun (and has a trained eye for his marks).

>>64258340 (OP)
Any gun is better than no gun. 6+1 of 9mm is fine for the vast majority of situations. Even a 5-shot .38 or 6-shot .380 has worked for most people who needed it as long as they got it into action fast enough.

That said, if the threat profile is multiple attackers or one with a gun who doesn't want to turn tail, then magazine capacity becomes very valuable. Those are extremely unlikely scenarios, but they do happen once in a blue moon.

>>64258340 (OP)
If you have some guy with a knife sitting behind you and he decides to kill you, it doesn't matter how many bullets you have.

>>64258373
no its not, no it doesnt, no you didn't.

>>64258340 (OP)
Go read up on Bernhard Goetz then come back and tell us what you learned.

>>64259067
>everything i know about defensive shootings i know from three events in the last hundred years.

>thread created at saturday at 4am

yeah you don't live in america.

Bait thread

>>> /pol/

If a mod were to make creating dogshit CC threads during the weekend an automatic bannable offense, how much activity would this board lose?

I have16 + 1 in .30 supercarry in the summer. You can always get more.

>>64258787
I saw one reload but thats out of my lifetime. Outliers dont mean shit. Self defense situations one mag is fine. In a shootout you need more.

>>64258340 (OP)
Yes, 6+1 is fine. Even throughout the decades of five-shot revolvers and 1911s being popular, there has never been a single recorded case of an average Joe who failed to defend himself due to running out of ammo. Even in the era of cameras everywhere and websites where we can easily watch tons of CCW self defense videos, there is still no realistic support to the idea that an average Joe self defense shooting will turn into a running gun battle with 10+ shots fired. It has simply never happened. We can also look at 2020 with all the shootings that occurred in "mob environments", where even with all the ideologically-charged people who chose to go to conflict areas, no single self defense encounter exceeded 5 shots fired.

Strict capacity focus is a meme forced by marketing teams who need to find a way to convince existing gun owners to go back to the store and repurchase what they already own. Just carry a reload if you want, because I have read a few rare cases where an acquaintance of somebody involved in the original shooting will flee the scene to retrieve a weapon and then come back.

>>64258340 (OP)
I wouldn't feel safe with 7 of anything, even if it was .50AE (not that I have the hands to effectively shoot .50AE).

>>64258787
>The Active Self Protection guy
Is this the same surf board retailer that also features a vid on his channel where two women get assaulted in a convenience store, dump six rounds of .38 into him, and still have to try to fend him off for like two minutes before he finally keels over?

Also, there's plenty of instances where a reload COULD have been needed, had the person shooting in question had a lower capacity handgun, like a revolver. Most prominently, Elisjsha Dicken of Greenwood Park Mall shooting fame shot 10 times at the shooter, who had to be struck 8 times before going down.

This is a very nuanced subject that can't be reduced to
>Some guy said he watched a load of vids and didn't see a single civilian reload, so therefore you shouldn't ever carry a spare mag/need more than 5-6shots etc. etc.
so easily. So, let's use some critical thinking next time.

Depends on your skill level. If you can pop off four rounds center mass under stress inside of 10 yards you probably won't need to reload, but if you can't hit what you're aiming at you'll need all the ammo in the world.

>>64259093
the same half dozen faggots who have made carrying j-frames their entire personality need something to talk about when they're just languishing alone at home for two days straight, it's not like they're ever going to actually go out and shoot or anything

>>64259093
>>64259093
Carry gun threads have been the go-to fodder for lazy rage-bait for the last couple of years or so, pretty much a guarantee they'll make up a sizable amount of weekend traffic.

>>64259093
Yeah, how dare people talk about guns on a weapons board.

>>64258340 (OP)
I carry a 6 shot 32 J frame 95% of the time.

The likelihood of me every needing it is extremely low, and a situation where 6 shots would not suffice is even lower.

Its still prudent to keep a proper double stack 9mm around in case you do enter a sketchy area, but it's rare that I'll carry it on person.

>>64258340 (OP)
>>number of bullets
A revolver is more than enough. 99.9% of the time a shot is never fired. The sight of the firearm being drawn first stops the incident. In the miniscule percentage remaining the first to be shot loses the encounter. Even shot placement is irrelevant. 2 shots follows as the next most common and we are into such a miniscule percentage of encounters its mind boggling. 6 is more than enough. As is 7. Although I wouldn't trust my life to 9mm, statistically what caliber you use is irrelevant. Not because they all perform the same in human tissues, but because almost all handgun encounters end because the gun was pointed. Then the realization that one has been shot. Add the fireblast of a 357 magnum from a revolver to up the fear factor if you would like.

>>64259220
[citation needed]

>>64259203
as if we need to talk about 'how many bullets enuff???" for the dozenth time in 24 hours.

inb4 you crash out about ukraine threads

>>64259093
15% reduction. Minimum.

>>64259223
>>64259225
>>citation needed
You cannot be serious. Oh wait, you probably are. You were most likely educated by movies and YouTube, reports paid for by ABC groups and gun and ammo shills. This is barely a conversation faggot go do the research yourself you cunt. Its not a ted talk or formal debate. Nobody gives a fuck. Go back to whatever weeb shit forum you came from.

>>64259257
Trying too hard, 2/10.

>>64258340 (OP)
Bernie Goetz did just fine with a 5 shot .38 special.

>>64259263
I like how you cradle my balls while riding my dick. Good girl.

I live in a country where pistols are illegal.
The only option to carry for me would be a makeshift fixed barrel (nigger I'm not making a locked breech pistol without a mill and a lathe, I can't afford that) and that limits me to .380 and 9x18 makarov (picking .380 because then I won't need to fuck with the barrel since 9x18 is 9.2mm and .380 is just 9.0mm so I can use a 16/9 pipe)
the pistol design I'm gonna make also doesn't have a safety/slide catch or anything that'll prevent the firing pin from hitting the casing if I carry it with one in the chamber with the hammer uncocked. the only option would be to carry without one in the chamber to be safe.
t. Russian

>>64259279
forgor to mention, it also limits me to 8 round makarov mags. so it's either 8+1 with a SIGSW in my leg or 8 rounds but I need to cock the gun before I use it.
not even talking about the fact that I'm gonna to to jail for using it at all but it's better to be tried by 12 (lmao they never do jury duty here) than carried by 6.
also I like how I can buy spent ammo casings without license. still have to synthesize primer compounds to reload primers and make ammo. my fren in brazil says fired ammo casings are illegal, can you believe that?

You're all sick people.
I hope you all get cancer. Fuck youse all.
I put a curse upon you all.
Fuck ya
mudda

>>64259033
This is a good point: situational awareness is worth more than a weapon.

You might defend yourself with a weapon, but you can often avoid even having to defend yourself by keeping your eyes open. Pay attention to transitional spaces (in her case, she should have been looking into the train car through the window before she entered, and should have picked a different car where she could sit with her back to the wall).

Never forget that even in deep red states, if you actually use a gun to defend yourself, it's going to cost you - a lot - and not just money. You're going to spend thousands on a lawyer, even if you're not charged. You may wound a bystander. You may lose your job (both picrel and her husband lost their jobs). You may have misjudged the threat or misunderstood the law, and may not have defended yourself lawfully ...in which case you go to jail. There could be a civil suit by the family.

And on top of all that, you have to live with the fact that you shot someone - it will weigh on you.

If there is any way to avoid the threat, that's what you should do.

>>64259324
Chan is flooded by red tits dipshits and dies. 2025

>>64258340 (OP)
Only one civilian defense shooting in recent memory required more than 3 rounds and the guy got charged with murder because he was a white guy defending against a pack of aggressive nigs

>>64259324
All problems in life can be solved by simply not believing blacks are human beings. The moment you recognize that they are actually animals, you cease to have problems with them, and you will never be a victim of black crime or have to stoop to their level.

Nigger got aggressive with you? Don't feel like your pride is wounded. It's the same as being barked at by a dog. Just tell it to go away, go home, and call animal control.
Nigger on the bus? Would you sit your ass down next to a stray pitbull? Nope.
Niggers walking towards you? Would you cross the street if you were coming up on a pack of stray shitbulls? Yep.

>>64259342
More red tits

>>64259279
>the only option would be to carry without one in the chamber to be safe.
Or copy other people's homework, spring around firing pin combined with light weight titanium pin to prevent inertial firing, enlarged secondary sear surface to prevent drop fire. Will require a trigger dingus.
>Just copy the LCP post redesign clockwork

>>64259342
>more than 3 rounds
There was a video I saw here a few months ago involving two apes robbing a store, in New Orleans I think? Guy fired a lot of shots because one did not or maybe could not run.

>>64259345
picrel is design. it already has a spring loaded firing pin and I'm pretty sure I can't buy titanium rods. I haven't finished the primer reloading pipeline yet, waiting for one of the precursors to arrive. need to make sure I can make the ammo first otherwise it's useless. also I wanted to make a single shot single action pistol before making the self-loading one

>>64259033
>Not sitting by yourself and leaning against the wall/window to prevent bubble gum in hair or impromptu shankings
Didn't ride the bus to school, huh?

>>64259149
You make some valid points but using women in a self defense situation doesn't really work. How you, I, and men in general react are way different.
>dump six rounds of .38 into him
Did they actually hit him 6 times or fire 6 times? Either way it's a shot placement issue, not a capacity problem.
>Elisjsha Dicken of Greenwood Park Mall shooting fame shot 10 times at the shooter, who had to be struck 8 times before going down.
Did he not drop until the 8th hit or was he shot 8 times? Huge difference, and as far as I know we don't have that detail. I've done the "Dicken Drill" and can get 10 shots off in 8 seconds from drawing. I've done 7 and 8 hits with irons, and 9 hits consistently with a dot. Point is, you can get a lot of shots off fairly quick and the mall shooter could have stopped shooting after getting hit twice.

I don't disagree with your points, but there's still nuance.

>>64259433
> but using women in a self defense situation doesn't really work
go outside dude, ffs

>>64259438
>women are just as capable as men
>women don't panic under pressure
Have you ever even TALKED to a woman?

>>64259451
NTA but are you doing a bit right now?

>>64259451
yeah anon all those women who are higher than you in the company just sucked one dick and got that job

>>64259502
>completely moves the goalposts
We're talking self defense you niggers. Explain how I'm wrong. Go ahead, I'll wait

>>64259489
He's sure as shit not arguing seriously, or at least I hope he isn't...

>>64259451
>example where having more than six shots would have been beneficial to someone
>"lol but that was a woman, doesn't count because men always remain calm and effective in a dgu situation"
why are revolverniggers always like this?

>>64259529
They’re insecure because their guns were designed around leaf springs and go out of time if pocket lint gets in the little stop pin thingy

>>64258340 (OP)
Look how cute it is do you really need convincing

>>64259529
I carry a P32 or a Hellcat depending on the day. I'm right and white knighting for women on the internet won't get you laid

>>64258905

well said

>>64259451
>Classic inceltard accuses others of never having talked to women
Lmao

>>64258340 (OP)
You are safer in the bus than in your car. You should be worried about some drive looking at their phone and crossing over the centerline than about being accosted on public transit.

>>64260695
Where we talking? Chicago, Portland OR, NYC, Portland Maine?

Location location location. Some choices are literal suicide, some are rare enough that transit stabbings are news worthy, one would be generational headlines.

>>64260705
Any of those locations are safer than driving.

>>64258340 (OP)
i hate fuddlore as much as the rest of this board, but most self defense scenarios end after 2-3 shots. if you train frequently and can reliably put 2-3 rounds in a tight group accurately and quickly, a 6/7+1 carry is plenty. if you want more, either carry a spare mag(s) or carry a double-stack handgun. if you plan on getting into a prolonged gun fight, hop on CoD or watch John Wick

>>64260710
Modern cars are extremely safe. The vast majority of deaths today happen on the freeway at high speed. Low speed crashes, where we should be comparing buses, are simply not that fatal.

Now. Lets talk about my risk of being assaulted. Buses are 1000x more violent, and I’m a captive cattle.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-public-transit-really-safer-than-driving/

>>64260705
I've unironically been accosted more in 98% white towns than I have in cities. White people in small towns simply will NOT mind their own fucking business under any circumstances and drink like fish. Lived in one town for nearly 4 years walking everyday and had random sperg encounters with boomers convinced I was breaking into their cars on a monthly basis. One dumbass even tried to stick a 10lb lap dog on me screaming all drunk as fuck acting like a wannabee badass.

I've had two carjacking attempts and one attempted jumping in the city but it's still not as dangerous as walking around bumfuck hicksville.

This is why people don't walk anywhere btw.

i bought a shield back in the day. 8 round mag. never really liked that number so i switched to a shield plus the moment they came out. 10/13 is much better. 15 makes the grip too long and the gun looks weird (4" slide makes it more acceptable). also have a 365xl/macro depending on how i feel at the time so 12/17 rounds.

realistically though i'm never getting in a gunfight because i don't live in the ghetto, don't walk around fucked up places, and don't take public transport.

>>64259067
>IP man walks into a group of four individuals, miraculously beating them all to death with his knuckles
>WOAH, THAT'S SO OPTIMAL LET ME TRY THAT-ACK
He just got extremely lucky that nobody went for the kill, and that civvies back then didn't carry guns. An outlier is not the rule.

>>64258340 (OP)
Bodyguard 2.0 is even smaller (including the width) and thus more concealable, almost half the weight, and carries 4 extra rounds compared to the 43. .380 is of course less powerful, but that's probably a benefit in a crowded environment, in the event of a missed shot or overpenetration through a limb, etc..

>>64261065
>>64261068
That’s cool, I’m still gonna carry my 26 over either.

Finally found a replacement for my P365 in the form of a M&P Shield Plus
I'm looking forward to putting it through the trials

>>64261410
Shields are great little pistols, I find that they're just about the right size for me to be decently concealable while at the same time pretty comfy to shoot compared to pretty much any other dedicated carry pistol I've personally shot. I eventually plan on getting a shield plus for the colder months and a bodyguard 2.0 for summer/deep concealment. Till then my 1.0 shield is gonna serve as a middle ground

>>64261450
I'm going to make my Shield Plus my new pocket/deep conceal semi auto gun gun. My 638 has served as my primary conceal carry for 5 years and for 2 of those it was complemented by the P365

>>64261073
>26
get a 357 sig conversion

>>64260710
>niggers are not the most lethal force of death in existence, therefore you’ll be fine around them

Yeah we should really only ever worry about heart disease and cancer. Literally nothing else. Just turn your brain off, risk assessment is schizo thinking.

I’d honestly rather die in a car wreck than be killed by a nigger, if for no other reason than I don’t want a nigger to feel the satisfaction of having killed me.

>>64258340 (OP)
Gets worse when you realize Glocks and other similar marketing pistols actually hold 1-2 less rounds than advertised. That's why you see them have failures so often, retards overstuff the mags.

>>64261450
I love mine. Really accurate despite the 3 inch barrel. Very snappy though, being as light as it is with a fairly high bore axis. But that drawback is minor compared to how accurate, reliable, and concealable it is. One of the all-time best concealed-carry options in my opinion

>>64261410
>Finally found a replacement for my P365 in the form of a M&P Shield Plus
Why did your P365 need to be replaced?

>>64259063
Yes it does, yes it does, and yes I did, stupid.

>>64259080
>he doesn't go to bed at 6pm and wake up at 4am with a solid 10 hours of sleep ready for his morning run and workout

its like you hate combat readiness

>>64261593
It went missing, so stolen

>>64258707
i believe the scientific term is troop

>>64259279
arent guns everywhere in russia? its like an open secret to just buy a handgun. also russia is white and pretty safe unless you live near the muslim provinces

>>64261767
>arent guns everywhere in russia? its like an open secret to just buy a handgun.
no it's absolutely not lmao
darknet markets are 100% scams and honeypots
this leaves out direct criminal connections
if you don't have criminal connections you're not getting a gun
trying to get criminal connections is dangerous unless you got them during jail time
this basically double makes sure that only criminal criminals can get their hands on a gun lmao
>also russia is white and pretty safe unless you live near the muslim provinces
yes, my attack vector are primarily mass shootings
it's absurdly easy to make ammo (reload primers with ww1 compound, use gunpowder from nailgun blank, buy bullets online) and an FGC-9/Urutau here if you have the know how
also any retard can get a gun suitable enough for a mass shooting (read: if it was california it'd be banned lmao) after 2 years of owning a double barrel shotgun: smoothbore AKs (same accuracy below 50 meters and more potent cartridges such as .345 TK / 9x22 Altay and the absolute beast of .366 TKM which has a 9.58mm expansive 15g bullet going at 2800 joules, designed to kill bears and other animals, it's insanely powerful for an intermediate cartridge, granted actual rifle rounds are more powerful but their caliber is smaller), pump action shotguns (most mass shootings here were done with cheap 200$ turkish shotguns hence the law prohibiting the purchase for first time gun buyers)

>>64261974
I also didn't mention conversion guns
99% of illegal PISTOLS here are converted from signal/traumatic (rubber pistol, see picrel for my post on them) pistols stolen from their owners or bought privately without a dealer
it's not available for the average joe, you need to have the know how (exact blueprints of the makarov barrel, available on odysee) and a lathe with operation skills or a machinist with the access to a lathe who's willing to break the law and make the barrel to you
then you make a special device to push the dummy barrel out of the pistol and press the actual barrel in, boom illegal gun ready, also need to change recoil spring
they're cracking down on this method as we speak by making the guns harder to convert
in brazil they just illegalized all signal guns to solve it lmao

>>64262000
>signal/traumatic
this includes blank guns and deactivated guns that can only fire blanks btw (CХП, cтpeльбa хoлocтыми пaтpoнaми or blank round firing)
before a law was passed they just made blank makarovs by replacing the barrel so it's trivial to convert if you have a lathe
btw the crocus city hall attack was done with converted AKs, they took deactivated blank firing AKs and reactivated them and made them full auto, it's quite a job to do it, probably an entire team worked on them (they're also cracking down on those... teams of men working to create illegal guns)
btw I couldn't stop crocus city hall with all the training in the world and with all the guns in the world even if I had 20 rounds of 5.7x28mm AP (not blue tip or whatever its called, actual AP 5.7) because they were fucking wearing composite military grade body armor and were training to cover each other's lines of sight

>>64260604
>entire argument revolves around access to holes
Even if that was true about me, how does that make me wrong? You argue like a woman.

>>64261520
I have never had a problem loading my glock mags to stated capacity.

>>64262017
In that attack there was something visibly odd about the muzzle flash of those aks. Was that homemade ammo or gunpowder? They also seemed to miss at people spraying from feet away. Unrifled barrels?

>>64262464
>Was that homemade ammo or gunpowder?
synthesizing NC gunpowder is quite infeasible at home, if they didn't use factory ammo they must have used NC powder from nailgun blanks. I'm pretty sure they used normal factory ammo though, if they have access to an entire machine shop and machinists willing to do illegal stuff they damn well have access to factory ammo. it's as easy as finding a hunter with an appropriate license and bribing/threatening them to purchase ammo (no limit on ammo purchases, 1000 rounds per purchase but you can just come back to the store 5 mins later and buy more)
sure civilian ammo has no steel core but it doesn't matter since they're killing civilians
>Unrifled barrels?
wouldn't result in that, smoothbore AKs work fine and their accuracy is virtually the same below 50 meters (assuming the barrel has correct diameter). I think it's an issue with the gas port in the barrel, maybe a bit of gas leaked but the gas operation system still functioned

>>64262473
Thanks for the insight of how thing works at home anon.

I miss the pre war trade. I don't even shoot my ak/tokarevs/mosin any more due to the ammo drying up. I just sit on my unopened spam cans like a dragon horde and dream of the past when I could shoot 1k rounds at the range for $120.

>>64262504
it's a shame US banned gun imports from Russia (even before the war), with the war all trade is null
you could just get your AK rechambered to .223 and poof you can shoot it
not that there's much of a difference unless you're shooting at 300m
even we have AKs in .223 here (Saiga MK), but they're rare since .223 is rare
5.45x39 is CHEAPER than .22lr here, remind you

>>64262516
Due to all of our gay import laws, I wouldn't dream of modifying my ak, a 1980s Romanian underfolder. I have so many ARs and a sig 556 so that isnt worth it.
Guns are cheaper than one or two thousand rds ammo cases.
I have some 9mm para conversion barrels for my tokarev and cz52. Finally got a 9mm Para pps43.
If the war ever stops eating men and steel hopefully we will see much of that production capacity flush back into the civilian market for us both.

>>64262516
>5.45x39 is CHEAPER than .22lr here, remind you
This is crazy for us. My friend bought a ak-74 right before our government banned 7n6 ammo. Now it sits in the safe.

>>64262648
>7n6
so you can buy AP ammo? 7N6 is steel core
why did they ban it?
assuming you could buy steel core 5.45, can you buy steel core .223/5.56? what core is regular range ammo and what people actually use? regular fmj?
we can only buy regular FMJ with lead core

>>64262652
Politics around what is a handgun. It's very crazy and the laws make no sense. Laws regarding what is AP vary by state, but federally AP rifle ammo is legal, AP handgun ammo is illegal to import.
Some companies would import or manufacture an ak-74 pattern with a short barrel but no stock to make it a handgun.
Then the federal agency says well if this is a handgun then 7n6 is AP handgun ammo and is illegal to import.
Since fundamental rights are protected, they try to hurt us in any little way, and make things as expensive as possible.

They also did this by saying any barrel that was once in an automatic weapon is always one, and cannot be remade into a semi-auto to export to the USA. The did this to stop the import of cheap ex soviet state semi auto ads.
My Romanian is from before this rule so that's why I treasure it.
The rule was recently reversed by trump, but the damage to the market and parts kits is done.

>>64262694
what about open bolt guns? is it true that it's illegal to manufacture SEMI AUTO open bolt guns since it's easy to conver them to full auto? how is it constitutional
it's easier to manufacture open bolt guns than closed bolt ffs

>>64262694
>but federally AP rifle ammo is legal
also, does that mean everyone just buys AP? for range shooting and home defense? is AP more expensive?

>>64262652
It's an excuse to inconvenience gun owners. One of the classic avenues of attack in the US due to the legal protections on firearms from the 2A is to find clever ways to restrict or increase the cost of ammo. The more people you price out of the hobby the easier it is to manufacture consensus against it. You see this with liberals banning cheap import ammo like 7n6 because it's "armor piercing", trying to ban lead core ammo because "lead is bad for the environment", pushing excise taxes on ammo, and targeting tariffs on cheap foreign ammo producers which they will never roll back even after they roll back the other tariffs. They consider any inconvenience to gun owners to be a win.

As far as steel core ammo goes it is legal in the US outside of "handgun" ammo, this is due to a ban passed in the 90s over a manufactured hysteria about "cop killer bullets" that gun grabbers created. This then opens the door to getting creative about the definition of a "handgun" allowing them to try to ban rifle rounds.

>>64262706
yes, this happened in the 1980s with the California crime wave and guns like the tec-9. its not technically illegal so not technically unconstitutional but they make the open bolt designs so hard to approve as "not easily convertible" that it is de facto impossible and easier to use closed bolt design.

>>64262709
not really. AP is obtainable but not from a normal store shelf, and is not useful in most defense cases where overpen is a huge concern.
Also what is AP is misunderstood by the public. People like to say that soviet steel core is ap but it was really for economic reasons. They tried to take our greentip 5.56 under the same pretense as 7n6 but since that harmed american companies it was stopped. greentip isnt true AP, its for better performance through brush/foliage/ light cover.
My LPS ball 7.62x54r has worse pen against steel than lead core due to mass.
They say that romanian steel core 7.62x25 is ap but again that is for economics and inherent to the bottleneck design vs. soft armor.
Its just political lies and public retardation. I say if its not tungsten core, its not AP. the lawyers disagree.

>>64258707
I second the term 'larceny'. Very fitting.

>>64262709
does that mean everyone just buys AP? for range shooting and home defense

additional thoughts on this, I use cheap lead core on indoor ranges, and cheap mild steel core on outdoor ranges.
For indoor protection i use jacketed hollow points.
In my defensive rifle I use greentip penetrator with every 5th round being a tracer and the last 5 rounds are tracer, since if I'm using the rifle things have gone all the way bad.
But I don't consider greentip or mild steel core AP, although your govt. seems to.

>>64262652
You can buy steel core rifle ammo. I've even seen the army's M885A1 for sale lol. Could probably find M995 somewhere if you looked hard enough.

>>64258340 (OP)
I would just get a revolver at that point. That’s why I just bought a 26. I think people are overstating it’s chunkiness and uncomfortably to shoot. It’s really not that bad and you have 10 round capacity as well as the ability to use every other double stack 9mm Glock mag .