Thread 64370239

What about this city made it so insanely hard to capture? Obviously urban warfare is hard but the coalition was basically nuking the place every week and ISIS supply lines were cut early on yet it took almost 10 months and a lot of dead Iraqis.

>>64370239 (OP)
>10 months
*3 years

Incompetence, its what lost the city to begin with

>>64370255
The first 2 years was them trying to get to mosul

>>64370239 (OP)
>What about this city made it so insanely hard to capture?
Lack of strategic purpose and thus lack of achievable goals. Putting the 'good' towelhead on every corner just meant that he was more exposed to attacks while executing no function.

Sending in wave after wave to capture more of the town so that more towelheads can be put on more corners just made sure you had even less forces available to capture the next section, delaying your 'success'.

It's generally a problem with military leadership, especially incompetent one - they have no understanding of why they fight, just that they'd really like to.

>>64370264
The city was full of tunnels and random holes between houses. If you don't put sandnigger one there you risk bad sandniggers ambushing you. ISIS hid suicide car bombs in garages and waited until they passed and then you have a car with a ton of TNT behind your humvee

>>64370266
Good job, you just gave all those retards an exposed target who has to defend himself from a 360-degrees attacks, especially by attackers looking like civilians.

>>64370269
You should apply at westpoint and tell them they have it wrong

>>64370239 (OP)
>a lot of dead Iraqis.
Wikipedia says 1400 dead 8000 casualties overall, which is only about a weeks worth of Russian casualties in Ukraine for comparison

>>64370284
No thanks, given that they taught these retards how to get involved in a quagmire like this.

>>64370289
>"Official" battle orders are 10 to 1
>90% of Iraqi battle order are towelheads and flipper-wearers with AKs
>At least 9 months of bloody urban fighting, against defended positions, with car bombs and holes in buildings and tunnels and shit
>"We killed them all" Iraqi commanders.
>"We only lost 1,500 men" regards, Iraqi commanders.

The numbers are obviously fucked. They'd need to drop 37 ISIS fighters daily on their home turf, while sustaining no more than 5 dead per day, while advancing on assault of prepared enemy positions.

>Population (2023)[2]
>• Total 1,792,000
Historically, how many cities with over one million inhabitants have successfully been taken in combat?

>>64370307
We’re just that good, lol.

>>64370314
>We
Should've defended your shithole muslim country better.

>>64370307
>>64370317
>They'd need to drop 37 ISIS fighters daily on their home turf, while sustaining no more than 5 dead per day, while advancing on assault of prepared enemy positions.
The Iraqis had American fire support. The entire Iraqi action was enabled by American service members sending so much ordnance down range most of them got traumatic brain injuries from it.

>>64370406
ISIS launched HUNDREDS of suicide car bombs and the place was booby trapped to all hell. Combined with thirdie face saving no way they lost that much

>>64370446
Launched VBIEDs doesn't mean they made it to their targets.

>>64370406
They're not kidding when they call it 21st century Stalingrad back then. Though I guess that title no longer applies now when Ukraine fiasco eclipsed it by a mile.

>>64370307
>>64370446
You fucking immature retard, 1500k dead in a counter-insurgency war is shitloads of casualties. That's most dead the US had in Afghanistan in 20 years.

>>64371581
But that can't be possible, tens of thousands of Russians died in Bakhmut. What you're saying would suggest sand niggers with US support are more capable than Russia.

>>64370269
>put a squad at every intersection
>"DIGGERS could be here. I've never been in this neighborhood before!"
>gets attacked by ISIS despite being behind the front line
Now you possess a piece of information that you did not possess before: within a few hundred meters of the ambush squad there is a tunnel.
Send in a specialized unit, find the tunnel, collapse it. Or better yet: narrow it down to a block, evacuate civies and blow up the entire block. Whatever is faster and less costly to life and property.
ya dingus

>>64371581
>1500k
0.0001 iraqi dinar has been deposited into your account

>>64370680
The fact that even normies know and remember Bakhmut is a pretty good testament to how bad it was.

>>64370307
>They didn't suffer 1500 dead... because they just didn't okay!!!!
Do you have literally any proof or is this just coping over the Iraqis actually being competent fighters and that going against your preconceived notions of how well Arabs can fight?

>>64373194
>the Iraqis actually being competent fighters
NTA but thank you for the laugh

>>64371819
>Whatever is faster and less costly to life and property.ya dingus
Not doing any of that dumb shit that could see your specialized unit turn into giblets as they walk into a trap, same way as the towelhead.

That is the problem with this whole situation and the people who ran it, on a strategic level. There's this inane idea that you must fight hajis in some insane CQB bonanza, even though
1) You achieve no goal doing that, strategic or operational
2) If you absolutely must, siege tactics are much better than
>The enemy has killed one of ours... GOOD! Send in more men into the kill zone!
>We'll... blow up their tunnel... THROUGH THE AMBUSH! YES!
>Only 5 losses per day effendi!

>>64373194
Well funny story, since the quote on casualties is from Iraqi Commanders, it is actually up to them to provide proof of that. I'm merely doubting them.

>>64370307
Yeah anon, that's why I was confused about you talking shit
Iraqi regulars fuck, they consistently outperform ever other (non western) force in the region - particularly against ISIS

>>64374628
How'd they lose the country in the first place, then?

>>64374605
I would imagine that there were a lot of losses from militias that weren't counted which would probably explain why it's so low

>>64374667
Yeah the weird thing is, the battle order is already full of militias. That would imply there were other, even shittier militias that got subcontracted into doing all the dying, which would effectively mean that Iraqi rounded up random men, gave them guns and sent them into modern Stalingrad.

>>64374656
They were fighting westerners

>>64374680
... To ISIS, retard, to ISIS! There was no ISIS in Mosul when Saddam ran the place! Neither was there ISIS in Mosul when the coalition tried to rebuild it and ran counter-insurgency.

You also forgot how the Iraqis even lost Mosul in the first place. They literally abandoned and lost the whole city in 4 freaking days despite being a much large force than the ragheads of ISIS. And without US involvement they would never have capture Mosul again or would take long freaking ass time and even more losses, I think they definitely lost more than 1500 they say they did. Arabs have zero credibility’s when it comes to lay fact on the table. But yes, it was basically a modern Stalingrad but in much smaller scale and more regarded ‘armies’.

>>64370307
yea the death count is so obviously turbojewfucked poop history

>>64374878
>You also forgot how the Iraqis even lost Mosul in the first place. They literally abandoned and lost the whole city in 4 freaking days despite being a much large force than the ragheads of ISIS.
I was actually tangentially involved in handling the 2015 refugee crisis, and checked the papers of foreigners, including Iraqi officers who ran away from there. Had a major just blatantly and unprompted admit to escaping from ISIS because his unit was being attacked, and processed also a colonel who at least didn't candidly admit to abandoning his duty, but did so all the same.
It's no wonder ISIS spread so fast when the only people capable of organizing on-the-ground opposition to them just packed their bags and left, abandoning their troops to whatever fate.

>>64370284
I dont think they accept white men any more

>>64370239 (OP)
Not using firebombs. If the US firebombed it it would be captured in one day.

>>64371782
How does rigging buildings with explosives stop aerial bombing? It makes it easier.

>>64374656
>>64374693
NTA but local commanders' corruption was a major factor. Basically they had tons of soldiers and/or militia that only existed on paper, presumably to embezzle funds allocated for them. When shit hit the fan, it became clear very quickly that there were not enough real units in the area to defend a city the size of Mosul, and so most of the units withdrew (with some either choosing or becoming entrapped into a heroic last stand)

In other words, ISIS captured the place without much of a fight. Had there been a full size contingent of the Iraqi army in Mosul, it would probably not have fallen.

>>64370239 (OP)
Because it wasn't ground forces trying to take Mosul from ISIS in '17/'18, it was the Iraqi National Police. Coalition provides airpower but those Iraqi fucks were lazy and cowardly in equal measure. At the first sign of resistance they would stop and call for every block around them to be leveled by coalition fire support. I spent hundreds of hours watching everything east of the Euphrates turn to dust, a city as old as history gone because of stupid towel heads.

>>64394808
>a city as old as history gone because of stupid towel heads.

Iraqi cities were repeatedly sacked and destroyed by multiple invasions over the past 1000 years from the Mongols to Tamerlane to the Safavids to the Ottomans and Nafer Shah.

There was definitely nothing there over 1000 years old.

>>64394808
isis vids from mosul were soo good back then

>>64395863
Nader Shah Afshar

>>64394808
The most effective way to clear out buildings while leaving them intact is chemical weapons.

>>64394808
>At the first sign of resistance they would stop and call for every block around them to be leveled by coalition fire support.

That's literally the modus operandi for most militaries as long as there aren't a large number of civilians in those blocks

>>64382936
These are guesses but maybe as a decoy?
Might cause the plane to think they hit a major target, similar to the wooden tanks.
Or maybe cause the plane to think it did more damage than really did, causing the bombardment to cease prematurely and infantry to move into an area they shouldn't.
its gotta be something related to passing false intel