Thread 40104874

psychoanalysis typically understands people in some sense as created from an original alienation, or lack. lacan, jung, freud all operate on the assumption that men and women are intrinsically made by an ego lacking half of all being. penis envy makes the split for freud, the anima/animus identification for jung, the relationship to language for lacan. each has an answer for the misfits; emasculation in freudian terms, anima/animus possession in jung, and lacan says theres no reason that the male/female relation to language must correlate to male/female bodies at all. what do they have to say about the autistic, however? those people well known for being less than competent at all things gendered and heterosexual.

lacan claims that the autistic are a radical alterity, possessing a symbolic structure alien and irreconcileable to the common. jung is mute, freud the same. deluze however has other ideas. deluze characterises the autistic as not merely other symbolically, not merely alien to our common language, but alien to language itself. the autistic, to deluze, lack the concept of intrinsic lack entirely. their being is radically whole, radically unothered, radically ungendered. no autistic boy lives with a woman shaped hole inside him. no autistic girl lives with a boy shaped hole in her. no mothers. no fathers. no black. no white. its only alienation from themselves which can force the autistic to take on a gender at all, and even then the autistics inner self is almost always playing manipulator, skinwalking gendered being for advantage. autistic people are intrinsically non-binary, intrinsically trans.

with this in mind, we should understand it as nonsense to deny the claim of an autist to be a girl, or a boy. theyre both, and never could be otherwise. its also by this logic impossible for an autistic person to truly be AGP, though they may express themselves as AGP if social circumstance favours it as a form of prismatic masking.

neat but I'm autistic and agamp, checkmate deleuleuzer

>>40104900
wanting to be a gay little rebis is peak autism
you cant even comprehend true autophillia

>>40104874 (OP)
Nah, autistic men generally aren't all that similar in behavior to autistic women.
And autists aren't actually good at faking normal behavior so it's not like male autists and female autists differ in behavior because they're acting out different gender roles to fit in.
They're both blatantly not fitting in, but also both still display sex based behavior.
I think the idea of lack based gendered psychology that this topic was predicated on is bullshit. People are the way they are because of biological programming, not psychological concepts. Skinner had the right idea with behaviorism.

>>40104957
i think all of human history disagrees with you, anon. i think youre blind to the manipulative behaviour of autistics.

>>40104874 (OP)
this is a catastrophic misreading btw

>>40104986
why?

>>40104988
the “shaped hole” isn’t really a thing. lack doesn’t work like that. read some more about how lacan thinks desire works

>>40104874 (OP)
I hate psychology

>>40105037
im aware of the nuance of the relation, its more or less irrelevant. abstracted genitalia remains sexed.

>>40105044
autistics are lacking just like everyone else

>>40105091
so says the hole fetishist in their fantasy

>>40104874 (OP)
Psychology isn’t a real science for a reason

>>40105099
thats true, its why we find it interesting. a science of the unreal is a hard thing to make.

>>40105104
Yet it doesn’t make any sense
It has no absolute reality unlike physics
Just a bunch of theories with barely any backing

>>40105113
youre almost there, anon. youll get it eventually.

>>40105116
Please explain

>>40105123
understand that lack is its own kind of presence, and you might make the jump

>>40105126
But then it might aswell just be a child drawing an empty page with scribbles that mean nothing

>>40105098
you can be smugly wrong about this forever and i won’t care btw

>>40105136
yeah thats the idea. the bodys somewhat different however.

>>40105139
its expected, thats how this works
you function on asserting a complex that doesnt bear out in reality, in the hope that articulating your desire will bring it further into being. i think, however, there are other plans.

>>40105154
So you are admitting they are all empty words? Until psychologist use calculus

>>40105180
think no words

>>40105184
Psychology will never be taken seriously
Sorry

>>40105202
i know, if anything, thats the goal

>>40105222
Neuroscience >> psychology

Bet you don’t even know what >> means

>>40105234
no anon all im thinking of is this image here

>>40105245
I don’t even know what we are even arguing about anymore Gn

>>40105260
sleep well

>>40104874 (OP)
>lacan claims that the autistic are a radical alterity
Let me guess this was said when there was still a split between autism and aspergers? also most people nowadays who claim to have one don't have it

>>40104874 (OP)
>psychoanalysis
Is overwhelmingly a heap of bullshit.

>>40105433
lacan predates the DSM5 by quite a bit yes

>>40105720
Then it's kinda stupid to talk about autism that context since it would only include people who are as dysfunctional as chris chan or worse

>>40105741
not really, its fundamentally about the relationship between autistic people and core aspects of human existence like language and others. its got nothing to do with biology, nothing to do with pathology, nothing to do with what most of current clinical practice is focused on with the possible exception of psychodynamics.

>>40105752
I just find it disingenuous bringing that up when people get diagnosed with """autism""" willy nilly nowadays and those who don't just self diagnose themselves with that because they lack and identify, wanna be a special boy/girl and wanna be seen as quirky while in reality being quite boring or having a cluster b disorder instead

>>40105245
onlyafro

>>40105764
yes but thats a nothing reply

>>40106087
boomer pls its been 15 years

>>40104874 (OP)
Psychoanalysis that doesn't involve infants or the very young in it's research is like trying to break down a loaf of bread back into it's base ingredients. Too much socialization is absorbed by adulthood to truly understand what the human mind looks like before the external organism of society has made it's permanent mark on it. Adults are limping, children are running, and psychoanalysis so stupidly sees only the limp and calls that a humans natural gait.

>>40104874 (OP)
>>40105098
>>40105136
>>40105520
>>40105433
You’re all retarded. Read the Symposium. We figured this shit out as of Athens, you cannot desire something unless you lack that thing. It’s a logical proposition and necessarily true. If you didnt lack you wouldn't have wanted to all make such shitty posts expressing your thoughts, which thoughts are formulated in language, which Deluze himself admits is centrally structured by and therefore dependent upon lack. If you lacked nothing you’d just stare blankly and rot to death. Lacan is just the one who developed the idea most coherently, by integrating the structure of all language systems into our understanding of the structure of consciousness.

>>40106953
imagine needing language to exist