/Bigen/ - bisexual general - /Enbygen/ - nb general CO-general
an experiment in combing two minority generals into one thread, hopefully more active

>Qotd 1: For Enbies, what have your experiences with bisexuals been like?
>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?

previous >>40170630

Tagmap:https://tagmap.io/tag//bigen/

FAQ:
>Am I bi if I like women and femboys/traps?
>Am I bi if there's this one member of the same-sex I'm desiring, but normally I like the opposite sex?
>Am I bi if I sexually like both sexes, but only interested in romance with one of them?
Yes, sexual attraction to both sexes is bisexuality.
>Do you love me, OP?
Maybe if life hadn't made a monster out of me I could love someone
>What's the difference between bisexual and pansexual?
Only difference is that our flag is prettier.
>Am I bi if i have periods where I feel only attracted to women and others where I feel only attracted to men?
This is known as the bi-cycle and many bisexuals experience it.
>Am I bi or am I 'prison gay' or porn addicted?
'Prison gay' is not a real thing and porn addiction does not alter your sexual orientation. You are bi.
>Am I bi or pan if I like trans people?
Both are able to be attracted to trans people.
>I think I might be bi but I can't tell. How can I be certain?
Just make a point to check out members of the sex you think you might be attracted to and see if anyone grabs your attention.
>Should I be harsh on myself?
You should be kind on yourself. Few people will do it for you

Resource for Bisexuals:
https://biresource.org/

Disregard thread
Enbies go away

>>40222204
I'm disregarding it because of the AI slop thread pic

>>40222230
no i uh drew it myself
i drew this one too, with a pen and pencil

>>40222258
You even drew the black character with 5 fingers and no thumb both times, damn

>>40222319
yeah, its called having a style

with pencil and paper

>>40222331
can you draw skrillex

>>40222164 (OP)
Good thread.
Bisexual "men" are not real men.

>>40222339
yeah, pencil and paper. i drew this myself

>>40222527
god bless you

>>40222527
Your drawing skills are great, but your file-naming skills are even better

>>40222527
Very impressive

YES. CAN WE CONTINUE THIS TRADITION?

>>40222527
why is his hair a cork board?

>>40222754
i think its a good idea, these threads are never busy enough so combining it with other groups makes some sense to me. i think bisexuals are a welcoming community

>>40222776
I was at the Seattle Pride fest yesterday and I saw that the Bi-Pan booth and the Aromantic/asexual booth were next to each other, with a tent in between them called the “all-or-nothing lounge”. It seemed like it was helping to increase the activity there. But I was still too scared (and too straight) to say hi.

>>40222922
Share more

>>40222164 (OP)
>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
I've only known one enby, they are my friend and are pretty cool

>>40222164 (OP)
>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
Maybe it's because I'm 35 but I'm not sure I've ever met anyone who's identified as NB.

>>40222164 (OP)
Interesting concept, not sure if this will work but hey, whatever, lets give it a try
>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
Mixed.
>positive
Ftm friend used to be they/them briefly before hrt and we had the best talks about gender and sex I’ve ever had with anyone. Online enby I met became my best pvp buddy and a great friend.
>Negative
Man… The uni lgbt club had enbies who would hate me on sight, felt like I was walking on eggshells the entire time. Made me feel like I wasn’t welcome there

>>40222164 (OP)
>Qotd 1: For Enbies, what have your experiences with bisexuals been like?
offline I've been friends with a few bisexuals and online I'd say my experience with bisexuals is neutral and about the same as any other group of people.
also if you want a resource for nonbinary people there's https://nonbinary.wiki
>>40222776
I think it makes sense considering the similarities we have in experiences (e.g. both groups face erasure, both groups get hate from queer and non queer people alike, both groups get misunderstood a lot, ect)
>>40223529
>The uni lgbt club had enbies who would hate me on sight
idk why they would and that seems pretty stupid of them. If anything I don't hate you on sight anon.

>>40223770
>idk why they would
Based on the looks they gave me it was because I was being too ‘straight’. I don’t know for sure of course, but it felt like they were expecting me to hate them or that I was too uncultured or was faking being bi. Which sucked because it took me a long time to work up the courage to go there in the first place
>If anything I don’t hate you on sight anon
Thanks man :) I dont hate you either

>>40222922
>the Bi-Pan booth and the Aromantic/asexual booth were next to each other, with a tent in between them called the “all-or-nothing lounge”
Fucking hilarious name, A+

is it too early to ask for what i want for xmas bc i want a man slave who will let me use him as a fashion accessory

>>40224200
>Which sucked because it took me a long time to work up the courage to go there in the first place
yeah as I said it seems pretty stupid of them to do that. Hopefully it didn't affect you too much though anon

>>40224245
Thats a long wait can’t you fake having a birthday or something?
>>40224421
Won’t lie it still stings and caused me some ongoing insecurities but hey, it is what it is. Life moves on

>>40222164 (OP)
>>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
never met a nonbinary and thus I start with a positive bias towards the nonbinary as the iterated prisoner dilemma shows the best strategies start cooperative but nonetheless are capable of retaliation

>>40224886
>the iterated prisoner dilemma shows the best strategies start cooperative but nonetheless are capable of retaliation
That's not what the prisoner's dilemma is about. The point of the prisoner's dilemma is that mutual cooperation would result in the best outcome, but since both players are incentivized to defect, the (almost) inevitable result is that both players defect and end up in a Nash equilibrium since neither player can unilaterally improve their payoff by changing their strategy to cooperation again.
Autistic rant, I know, but this topic was covered extensively in my game theory class lmao

>>40222164 (OP)
Realistically I must be average at least. It seems like girls tried to flirt with me a little when I was younger and people are pretty nice to me even though I often am rude because I am anxious and sometimes dont make eye contact. And then if I am average it's about the same as if I was a little attractive, some people will like me, some wont. I just need to have better self esteem. And I just want someone who is nice.

>>40222164 (OP)
>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
The worst part about enbies is knowing I would be one if I were a more annoying person

>>40222164 (OP)
How can I get a non-binary girlfriend asking for me and not for a friend btw

>>40227082
non binary *partner
non binary *theyfriend

Alright /bigen/.
If you're a straight dude but are building upper back and hamstring flexibility specifically to suck your own dick, does that make you bi? Or is it just advanced masturbation?

woah the most delusional general just got more delusional somehow

>>40227580
whoever wrote the op would say yes for sure.
im bisexual and nb btw

>>40224200
I don't know bro, there was a widespread misunderstanding that "bisexual" is an orientation that discriminates against enbies, and that only pansexual is enby-inclusive. I think this meme is starting to die now.

>>40227116
joyfriend/kissmate**

>>40222164 (OP)
Congratulations, you made an even deader general than either of the ones you were "helping."
Please do not do it again.

>>40224245
>i want a man master who will use me as a cocksleeve
ftfy

>>40227116
Shut up nerd

>>40228943
Hasn't died yet lol

>>40229470
What is dead may never die

Beautiful

Are most nonbineys bi? It kinda makes sense to me to not care about a potential partners gender much.

>>40222164 (OP)
Most enbies I met are usually lesbians. They are chill

>>40231369
So, they're cryptopooners who logically know trying to become a transman will result in worse treatment?

>>40231395
No I met normal lesbians aren’t on T, they just dress more masc sometimes

>>40231496
huh
so what makes them "NB"?

>>40231507
beats me, NB lesbian gender philosophy can be full on college course

twinks btfo'd

>>40231780
Apocalypse power fantasies will never fail to crack me up

>>40231780
This shit is up there with extreme political ideologies (libertarians or commies) in terms of how ridiculous it is lmao

>>40231507
Desire for attention

>>40231780
Fetish content disguised in political commentary

>>40222164 (OP)
This pride month kinda sucked, I felt like nobody really seemed to care but whatever
I wish they had these flags year round on this board lol

>>40222164 (OP)
thanks for making this anon
I'd suggest not using ai and looking at the thread's copypasta, there is some topical stuff that is meant to be changed every thread like
>Do you love me, OP?

>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
dating one and it's been the best thing that ever happened to me

>>40227764
shit thats a good point actually :( I remember seeing some of that but I just figured since we weren’t fucking 16 and went to uni they’d know. Some of them did correct me to pansexual when I told them how I felt about people though.
>>40232201
Flags year round would be great, dont really get how int gets to have it but we dont.
>this pride month kinda sucked
It’s been surprisingly quiet. Not sure if it’s the aftermath of the site going down earlier in the year or if it’s because of general global tendencies to go back into the closet

kino thread idea

im bi (amab) and have been thinking about going nb. I'd like to look more fem but mainly just bc I'm a bottom
do a lot of amab nb people go on E? if you ever say you're interested in E but not trans, people are like "ok girl your egg is gonna crack soon" or some shit
but i just want to look more androgynous and not have hair loss (plus softer skin and less body hair)

>>40233912
E and then chopping tits off if they develop too much is pretty much the classic AMAB NB route. Nowadays there's SERMs I suppose. No clue about that though.

what apps do you all use for fuckin

>>40233912
your life is run by labels and it's depressing. take the e or don't based on your bodily preferences. now shut the fuck up man.

>>40234345
idk ive never fucked in my life

>>40222164 (OP)
The combined gen is interesting, I can’t say the Martin Luther FAQ ever seems like a good idea to me thoughbeit
Everyone I know is bisexual (Reddit or full fat) and two of the three enbies I know are called H

>>40234575
>:( this does not

I'm straight but want to be androphilic.

>>40234345
From my (admitted limited) experience with dating apps as a man:
When looking for women there's a bunch of different apps with different cultures and expectations for each - though you are, of course, expected to dance like a monkey for them because you are a man and she is a woman.
In regards to men, all dating apps are hookup apps.

>>40235149
mmmm interesting

>>40234345
I have become celibate since getting banned from grindr

>>40231507
thats not a real thing

>>40233912
your just another tranny

>>40233482
i, uh, didnt use ai
i drew this myself, pencil and paper

I’m banned from biz again, does anyone have any financial advice
>>40235233
You must have really fucked up

>>40235304
>You must have really fucked up
yeah they literally banned my phone completely even creating new accounts doesn't work

>>40235327
You didn’t try to kiss any boys on there did you. They hate that

>>40235349
oh no no kissing they'd had to pay extra for

>>40235304
>I’m banned from biz again, does anyone have any financial advice
Don't live above your means

>>40234345
just go to the local forest

>>40235304
You can exchange coins for goods and services

>>40235574
>>40235759
You guys wouldn’t fit in, too wise. You’re supposed to bet big so you can score

>>40230882
probably. And most bis are certainly attracted to nonbineys, so we should be natural allies.

>>40236103
I love nonbinary women

>>40233912
don't listen to the haters, that sounds very NB

>>40222164 (OP)
flirted with a gay dude at a party last night and woke up realising I'm totally disgusted by my attraction to other men

I basically wasted half his night as well
cool guy tho

oh well

>>40222164 (OP)
> QoTT 1: For Enbies, what have your experiences with bisexuals been
My bf is bisexual and I love him! He sees me for who I am and I really appreciate that. I feel like people that are monosexual aren’t the best partners for enbies. They always want us to fit in a specific box so their labels still stay intact.
The only bisexuals I don’t fw are Reddit bisexuals or the guys that “turn gay” for ftms.

>>40236169
you have to fuck him to make up for it, take one for the team

If only unattractive people are into me, does that mean I am also unattractive?

>>40236937
That or you have high standards and are putting your looksmatch into the unattractive category

>>40235894
You can exchange BIG coins for BIG goods and services

is identifying as bisexual enbyphobic?

>>40237097
not really, but thats why some people call themselves pan

>>40236982
dang thats rough

>>40237097
They are basically all pan, they’re just normies or think pan is too excessively fruity as a term

>>40235894
I know you're memeing, but as an economics student it hurts me to see all the people that treat investing as gambling rather than just playing it safe, which is the overwhelmingly superior choice statistically..

>>40237097
No, bisexuals love enbies. There are admittedly a minority of enbies who think the term itself is exclusive of enby-attraction, but this is becoming more rare I think.

>>40237097
>>40239253
I don't particularly find myself attracted to enbies, but I also don't think bisexuality excludes enbies either, just not for me.

>>40235894
Hey friend, in case you didn't know, dead people's portfolios measurably outperform basically all active managers or day traders. They win because dead people hold and don't trade.

Stop trying to make a big score. Build a good stable yearly income with normal (read as: not retarded yolo) work, spend significantly less than you make, and invest the difference. Give it 15 years and you'll be set.

The needing to kill myself feelings have been crazy strong today, not sure why, don't have time for the therapist and my job is too important to miss for inpatient. My boyfriend being nice to me is the only good in my life
>>40222164 (OP)
I don't really understand enbyism at all, if gender is a societal construct then sure, but someone must identify with a gender unless they are a gender abolitionist but at that point I don't really buy that they would be the type of person to care what pronouns you use on them. It seems a lot more similar to having a nickname than a cohesive gender identity. Try as you might everyone is going to look at you and try to figure out if you are a man or woman as the first thing.

>>40230882
I'm asexual and aromantic so I'm not bi
>>40236263
hell yeah anon
>>40237097
no that's stupid
t. nonbinary
>>40240053
>but someone must identify with a gender
we do usually identify with specific gender adjectives or specific categories, and the overarching category of "nonbinary" is just used for it's convenience.
>I don't really buy that they would be the type of person to care what pronouns you use on them.
I personally don't but other nonbinary people do
>Try as you might everyone is going to look at you and try to figure out if you are a man or woman as the first thing.
Yes which is unfortunate because I'm neither of those.

>>40240441
I feel like this misses the forest for the trees, the reason people look at others and identify them as male or female is because it is the mode of interacting with others in our society. It's fine to say you don't buy in, however I don't see how that really affects me as an outsider to your subjective internal experience.

>>40240503
>I feel like this misses the forest for the trees, the reason people look at others and identify them as male or female is because it is the mode of interacting with others in our society
okay well I don't care how they interact with me assuming these are just strangers. If they want to change how they interact with me because of preconceived ideas that's not my problem.
>It's fine to say you don't buy in
there's no "buying in" or "not buying in" though, I'm not making the conscious decision to be trans (certainly not in this political climate) my gender is inherit to myself.
>however I don't see how that really affects me as an outsider to your subjective internal experience.
well you're the only one that knows the answer to how things personally affect you. idk how me being nonbinary affects you either

>>40240574
>there's no "buying in"
Gender is specifically something that is performed for the purpose of being bought into society, the idea that your gender could be completely internal is just not born out into reality.
>idk how me being nonbinary affects you
If I am expected to interact with you in a specific way it would. If someone was a transgender man who presented as a man it would be both weird to onlookers as well as clearly disrespectful. I do not have a programming built in to interact with nonbinary people. The idea of crafting your own gender that people are supposed to interact with differently than male and female is incredibly self aggrandizing

>>40236263
Well uh

What about you?
Do you only want sex with AMaBs?

>>40240441
Fuck yeah!!
>>40240707
Why would you be so presumptuous anon?
No, I want to fuck afabs as well, it’s just borderline impossible to find a hot dominant fem that’s also poly.

>>40240684
>Gender is specifically something that is performed for the purpose of being bought into society
okay then I suppose we mean different things when we say "gender" then. what you described there I would consider "gender presentation".
>If I am expected to interact with you in a specific way it would
I expect people to interact with me without any specific presumptions as that is how I interact with others.
>If someone was a transgender man who presented as a man it would be both weird to onlookers as well as clearly disrespectful
I don't get this point.
>I do not have a programming built in to interact with nonbinary people.
well we are interacting right now.
>The idea of crafting your own gender that people are supposed to interact with differently than male and female is incredibly self aggrandizing
this doesn't really make sense to me as I don't interact with men and women differently. I may act with different individuals differently but that usually doesn't take into account specifically gender. Also I was born with my gender and didn't go out of my way to "craft" it.

>>40240859
>I would consider that gender presentation
I don't think this conversation is going to be productive if our definitions are so divergent. Gender is the thing that you are identified with based on your gender expression/presentation.
>I don't interact with men and women differently
I don't know why you are larping as though you are bought into society to the point you are identifying with a gender when you clearly have no use for it. It seems very fruitless.

>>40240909
>I don't think this conversation is going to be productive if our definitions are so divergent.
probably not but it is interesting seeing your perspective even if it's very different to mine.
>Gender is the thing that you are identified with based on your gender expression/presentation.
when I refer to my "gender" I am referring to a specific near ineffable part of my self/conscious experience that often goes by the same name. it is separate from my presentation and expression although (if nonbinary identities were well known and understood) I could choose to express it.
>to the point you are identifying with a gender when you clearly have no use for it
I have no inherit use for my hair colour or my height or the emotions I feel or any other traits inherit to myself but I still have them regardless.

>>40240909
also I like the pic anon

what's a reddit bisexual?

>>40240909
i'm pretty sure i'm nearly type ii on that scale. am i fucked?
i'm a fem bottom

>>40241040
Minox it up before it's too late!

>>40241012
Guys that only fuck girls and femboys

>>40241058
Honestly this describes a lot of guys who probably don't even know what reddit is. Although they probably don't consider themselves bisexual.

>>40241073
You’d be surprised
It’s more of a colloquial word used around here

>>40241056
i'm not taking minox but i'm taking dht blockers
is the damage already permanent and am i unattractive to guys with this hairline
i have long hair so i don't think it's super evident
i kind of want bangs but idk anything about hairstyling so idk if that would look good on me
and i'm paranoid about getting it cut long cus it takes so long to grow back

>>40241123
*getting it cut wrong

gdi can't stop thinking about bi mmf and bi mmff

>>40241058
Oh good, I don't have to be reddit-branded. Does girls-or-athletic-men have a label?

>>40241073
You're not allowed to be AMaB bisexual.

That's for women and transwomen (and their... appreciators)

>>40241272
Too bad I don't listen to people telling me what to do.

>>40241058
What’s wrong with that ?

>>40241058
specifically femboys or effeminacy in general?

>>40222164 (OP)
I don't think I've ever met an open enby
I imagine they'd be cute though

>>40237338
Don’t know, I’ve always thought of pan being someone who feels equal attraction to all genders and sexes with no real difference in gendered expectations. Whereas for bisexuals many do have preferences and prefer certain traits for certain genders. But thats just how it’s been explained to me

>>40243459
I think of it like umbrella term, like how trans can mean enby, transfem/masc and etc. Pan is just under bi

>>40243563
Yeah thats how Ive understood it too. I don’t really call myself pan, but I fit the description so I dont mind if others call me that. Whatever floats their boat I suppose, I’m just here for the ride

I'm (M25) in a ltr with my fiance (F25) and will marry her next year. Officially we've only been with each other. I cheated on her with prostitutes a handful of times, including with one tranny.
I have a burning fantasy of being a submissive oral sex servant for a hot couple. I'd love to suck dick and eat pussy every day whenever they would ask me to. I'd gladly fulfill their household chores to add to my submissive fantasy.
Thanks for reading my blogpost, please tell me how you would like to use me.

>>40222164 (OP)
>>Qotd 2: For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
Have been essentially told I give nonbinary vibes. I get on with nb's well enough genrally, obviously there is varience amoungst every group. If anything it is my own personal hangups about gender that are likley to cause an issue.
>>40237097
>Mogai discourse in 2025

>>40243628
This is probably ragebait, but I'll bite anyway
>please tell me how you would like to use me.
I would force you to confess to your soon to be wife

>>40243772
No ragebait at all.
I'm not proud that i did it, but I simply couldn't control myself those few times and decided to find out how it is to have sex with someone else. I don't plan on doing it again and simply jerk off to my fantasies.
IMO it's better to keep a secret to protect a relationship, since breaking my wifes trust in me (and probably our relationship) by confessing, would be much worse than sucking it up and carrying on. It's called stoicism btw.
I assumed that everyone understood this intuitively and that someone who is caught cheating simply didn't have the common decency to do it discreetly.
I genuinely love my wife, thats why I choose to keep my secrets to myself.

>>40243628
You deserve to be locked up and tortured

>>40243863
Yeah okay, you are definitely ragebaiting

>>40244386
What makes you think that I am?

>>40222164 (OP)
What are bisexual men even like? I am bi myself but I have not met another bisexual to be able to come up with a conceptualization for them.

In other words, I do not have a stereotype for them.

>>40244697
good, don't change that

>>40244697
imagine a pervert

>>40243863
>It's called stoicism btw
Major kek
>>40244697
In real life anything goes. Online the stereotype is basically a redditor.

>>40246650
not to meet other bi's or not to have a stereotype?

hey tell you what, this threads already busier than the last one
my plan? did it work a lil? maybe

Think an 18-20 y/o guy was showing interest in me yesterday and possibly also a 46 y/o guy. Not sure how to process that, I’m like 10 years wrong for both of them.
>>40246984
Yeah maybe. Time will tell if it lasts. Bigenners tend not to stick around for too long I think, based off of what Ive seen from the last year or two. Not sure about nbs

>>40235169
I just installed Grindr this shit is unsuable lol also everyone on here is GROSS ToT. I was deadass flaccid scrolling the whole time. I feel so lost rn lol, am I bi if I only like trans women, femboys, and twinks I feel like such a fraud. I like women but I dont get that "fire in my chest" feeling when fucking.

>>40222164 (OP)
How can I find local bi groups or something like that?
I want more irl friends and want to talk to similad/like minded people but it's scary putting myself out there lol

its quite warm

>>40246732
no stereotype, idk why you would -want- to have any of anyone desu

>>40247931
>am I bi if I only like trans women, femboys, and twinks
Am I bi if I only like people with cocks, people with cocks, and people with cocks? Yes bro you bi. Don't let people try to convince you you have to like bears or muscled up guys in order to be bi. I'm in the same camp as you in terms of the guys I like but that's because I think most men are ugly and typically the ones that are feminine are more beautiful.

>>40222164 (OP)
>Non-binarie
Bro, I fuck both sexes, no that thing

>>40249508

>>40249508
TRUTH NUKE

Have any guys in their 30s been able to get back into self-sucking? Used to be able to give myself blowjobs as a teenager but I haven't been able to recently despite maintaining a lot of my dexterity from martial arts growing up.

>>40250779
>>40250873

enbies won?

Is it possible to have almost zero suspicion or same sex attraction until after your adolescence and still be considered bisexual? When I was 23, suddenly my brain just decided to be attracted to men, and now I am able to view them through a romantic and/or sexual lens.

Is this a common experience among some bi folk? I am having trouble finding concrete proof that this is a thing outside of my own experience.

>>40222164 (OP)
i guess the bile fascination of a co-general is one way to get engagement. retaining it is another matter
>Qotd 1: For Enbies, what have your experiences with bisexuals been like?
ime the negative stereotypes have been basically always true but also i think 99% of people would act the same way if they were bi so i dont care

>>40230882
Most afab non binaries I see on dating apps say no cis men. So I wouldn't say so.

>>40243863
>but I simply couldn't control myself those few times
Nah, you're just a shitty person

>>40244697
>What are bisexual men even like?
Lonely and looking for a husband (as I understand it, this is not common)

>>40246984
Not a fan

>>40250779
>Used to be able to give myself blowjobs as a teenager but I haven't been able to recently
same bro, if you learn the secret then let us know

>>40235263
>file name

>>40253424
The thing they don't tell you about autofellatio is that it feels like tickling yourself in terms of stimulation but it makes you love sucking dick.

>>40250779
>>40253424
https://drive.google.com/file/d/11elS_p3vtObmzznJHtNCy34WPHwN72UF/view
>yogafellatio - biomechanical and technical aspects with operational techniques and instruction

Typical bisexual

>>40255820
Typical redditor*

When uggies msg me should I reply with "xd" or "youre not my type"

>>40255892
Post a pic of yourself so we can know if you are uggo also

>>40222258
>>40222164 (OP)
kill yourself. sincerely, a bisexual enby

>>40256245
Plot twist: OP used AI to keep the thread alive via angry posts like this

>>40256334
Would you even need an AI for that? Typing KYS every few hours seems rather quick and easy

>>40255892
I reply with "no thanks", "not interested" or "..."

>>40251098
I had same sex attraction during my adolescence, although it felt late. What was your cross-sex attraction like before you encountered your same sex attraction?

I wish more women were open to casual relationships
My bf and I are in an open relationship but the only people down for a FWB setup have been other men and when I hook up with other guys I just feel like I would rather be fucking my bf
I need something different and as a strict top the only thing I can't get from my bf is pussy
I have no kinks he isn't able to fulfill. The only thing he can't do for me is be a cis woman
I feel like things would be easier if I was in a relationship with a woman looking to hookup with other men rather than vice versa

>>40257002
They’re called unicorns for a reason after all

>>40257021
I assumed unicorns were specifically bi women down for FFM
Not women down for hookups in general

>>40256584
Normal I guess? I am not sure how to put it.

>>40257002
>>40257021
the other bi women I met at uni would be down for both ffm and mmf for the most part, but most of them weren’t as willing to seek it out themselves. Desires for fwb relationships over one-night stands were less common though. On average they’re probably still very shaped by straight gender norms when it comes to sex, and I can’t help but think that makes them seem rarer than they actually are. Not quite sure how we move past that
>t. Bi afab

>>40259250
Women are hilarious
They're natural bottoms and basically bisexual. You can prank them into sex with other women.

This is just what AFaBs almost always are. They don't have to seek sexual attention; it will simply come for them.
If you're already No.1, why try harder?

>>40259467
least misogynist summerfag itt

>>40257956
that tracks

Gay (and straight)

>>40259250
Yeah it definitely seems like women (even if they want that sort of connection) are less likely to seek it out than men
Like they'll participate but more if it's given to them instead of looking for it
Which I suppose makes sense. I can see how meeting two strange men can be daunting

>>40256245
based

>>40260279
but enough every modern woman

>>40235263
>"I drew this!"
>6 fingers

uh huh, sure you did

>>40260776
Damn, you really got him there Sherlock

>>40260013
how

>>40260776
its called having style

Nonbiney

>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT
>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT

A reminder that tomorrow at 21 GMT we will vote for the next two movies for Movie Night! If you want you can also give your recommendation by replying to this post

>what the hell is "movie night"
its a special night where bigen comes together to watch on Discord two movies chosen by the community

>when will movie night take place?
its FRIDAY at 22 gmt

>where do we watch the movies?
on the Bigen Movie and Game Night Discord server:
https://discord.gg/5EesZxQs

>i don't usually post on bigen/never took part in movie night, can i join?
Of course, movie night is open to anyone, just remember to mute yourself during the movies, be civil and have fun!

fyi: this is the list of every movie we watched so far:
https://pastebin.com/Bc8pqK9h

>>40260473
Yeah there’s the safety concerns too, which I think plays a larger role in countries or social settings where women have been more heavily conditioned to think that all men are dangerous and that it’s their own fault if strangers subject them to rape/violence/murder/whatever. It’s kind of sad, desu, because in some cases you end up with bi women who do want men sexually but give up on seeing them as humans. Which isn’t really good for anyone

>>40262124
so
are there gonna be girls there?

not transgirls
just girls

>>40251090
idk about the other nbs but I've just sort of been lurking in this thread

I'm hot as fuck boi. If only I was tall too then I would get women throwing themselves at me but unfortunately I am short so I only get women that hit on me rarely and I have to approach most of the time. If I was tall I would have it all

I really, really really hate enbies but not in a malicious way, more in a "you're very VERY delusional and I'm gonna try to bring you into the light" kinda way.

See nothing wrong with being f or m, transitioned? Then you transitioned to f or m, don't got the matching junk between your legs? You're still either f or m just packing a different sort of heat.

I cringe whenever I'm snooping at profiles on discord and see a they/them, the fuck that's supposed to mean? I'm assuming it's due to some sorta of trauma so I don't go vilifying enbies too much. Honestly think them existing does more damage than not.

So what do? I don't think I'm ever going to get over my hatred as it's completely anathema to my values and views, but you'll never ever see me lynching them. Also know this thread probably isn't the best to post in, maybe I'll make a thread myself.

Have you seen this NB film

>18-20 y/o I met few days ago turns out more likely to be 18 than 20
>say outright I’ve gone to uni and shit
>still seems interested in me and hopes for me showing up more often
Genuinely I feel like an old sick fuck for finding him cute with this big of an age gap and this heat isnt making it better. I’m not even an attractive person. Honestly dreading if I have to turn him down because he seems really kind

>>40263160
that's stupid. we aren't hurting anyone and while I can't speak for literally every enby, most of us just don't feel comfortable fully identifying as male or female, or we prefer being androgynous (in appearance, perception, or both)
I use they/them because I know I'm not a woman but I hate being perceived as male

>>40263160
>I hate the things I don't understand
>>40263169
I don't really like the artstyle
t. nb

>>40263285
>>40263291
Alright then, why should I understand enbies? I see nothing wrong with being either a andro dude or chick

>>40263323
not personally understanding something is different from hating or judging, which you seem to do

>>40263323
>Alright then, why should I understand enbies?
you don't have to understand us, just don't use that lack of knowledge to try and justify hatred.

>>40263227
How old are you?
I'm turning 28 in a few days and my bf is 21
It's not a terrible age gap
There's a few things I learned in my early 20s that he hasn't learned yet in terms of employment and what he wants out of life but I'm happy to be a bit of a mentor
I would understand if you're considering a serious relationship with him as like a 40 yo
If you're still in your 20s though just have fun

>>40263398
not that anon but as a 23 year old I wish I had a 28-30 y/o bf.....

>>40263422
I'm absolutely smitten with him
He loves daddies, but has very caring parents
He's a little autistic and a little bit of an idiot but a total sweetheart
We've been together for a year and a half now

>>40222164 (OP)
>QOTD 2
Married 'em.
>>40251885
I suppose that's true, mine was heavily girl leaning.
>>40244697
Like me.
I like nature, I'm freakishly tall, I'm almost completely asocial and I don't mind it. So, basically bigfoot.

>>40263160
Genuine question: Why do you hate them anon? not nb myself but you don’t have to understand others to just leave them be. Cringing is sometimes just a fear of somebody defying what you’ve been taught is normal, but if they aren’t advocating for mass murder or whatever trying to convert them to your beliefs seems to be more about curing your own discomfort than anything else. rarely works anyway, so why waste your time if you can just shrug and move on, you know

>>40263160
>So what do? I don't think I'm ever going to get over my hatred as it's completely anathema to my values and views
Answered your own question, nothing.
If you can't grow your views beyond your own biases you're not going to understand anyone that doesn't already subscribe to your views and that means you can't grow, not until that changes.

>>40263169
>mmmm how to do NB representation, hmmmmm
>OH, I KNOW
>LET'S CATER TO THE ENTIRE NB COMMUNITY AND CHUCK IN A QUIRKY GIRL
NBs are women or coping transwomen.
There is no NB.

>>40263398
Recently turned 31 so… Not generally something I’d think of as an “acceptable” age gap, even if he’s constantly been seeking me out so far. I’m aware he’s technically an adult but. Yeah.

>>40263464
I fucked up in my original post, "hate" is too strong, even dislike might be pushing it. See it more as one, core part of their nature that I dislike. Could hang out with them and maybe even be friends, but I could never accept the they/them portion of enbies and I'd try, with utmost respect, to sway them away. Though your reply definitely gave me something to think about, as I always have reasons for hating something as I see blind hatred as savage and meaningless, while purposeful hatred allows one to focus on what they find good and just.

But back to enbies, why? Not sure honestly, why do most people hate stealing? Because it's a selfish action that ends up damaging the greater community the thief belongs to. Thinking about it, maybe that's why I don't like enbies. Think I see them as damaging to the efforts to the greater LGBT movement? No normal person goes by they/them.

Example, I hate the mainstream LGBT community for doing so much publicity damage by acting like nutjobs and wackos, who obsess over pride and standard out rather then acceptance and fitting in. I've dreamt of a world where the outside accepts us and doesn't hold a grudge behind their back that you absolutely know they do. But then we have insane barely passing wackos you see in porn or on discord runing everything, people see those, even if they are the minority, and think we're all like that.

I think it's because I see enbies as trying to be special without any higher goal of purpose? This is the one thing I dislike that I never gave much thought into.

>>40263694
So basically you're blaming us for lack of acceptance, and not religious fundamentalists or bigots.

>40263160
>40263694
you are a self-centered person that would rather hate and spew bile than learn any better
>I've dreamt of a world where the outside accepts us
this is all cope from a pickme
everybody move on, don't look at the ranting pickme spilling their spaghetti

I miss bigen threads when they were dead, better than a thread full of shitheads I won't lie

>>40263805
Im not a shithead

>>40263694
Hm I see. You’re probably right that no normal person goes by they/them, but then again we could make the same argument against being bisexual or gay or trans. Guess what I’m trying to get at is that normalcy isn’t inherently better than abnormality and vice versa, but I can understand fearing the consequences.
Whether we act as the most moral upstanding citizens or not there’s always going to be people willing to kill us on the basis of not fitting neatly into their world view however. The world you’re dreaming of doesn’t seem achievable on account of human variance being an unchanging part of humanity itself, if I have to put it bluntly. We’re just too many people with too many opinions for there to exist a future where our particular brand of abnormality will register as an acceptable degree of social deviation to everyone. With or without nonbinary people I suppose we’ll always have somebody out there who hates us

I once didn't like nonbinary people because it was hard for me to add another set of pronouns because I wasn't used to it but I realized that different people have different life experiences and while I may never quite understand it, I am open minded and realize my life experience isn't the "right" one, and it's super easy and the right thing to do to use nonbinary pronouns because it makes others more comfortable and happy and makes the world a better place

>>40263934
That’s roughly how I operate as well. I don’t really get it but it’s alright because theres a ton of other stuff I dont really get either. No need to be a dick when I could be having fun with people instead

>want to join a wignat group to save my race
>they are all doing combat sports
>If I get one boner, I will be shot

Males are rarely attractive in real life, but they are probably better at making pictures and videos that make me want to jack off because they have the same sex neurotype as well as the same anatomy and probably a closer range of hormone levels, biasing them toward a similar perspective on what looks good and creates more sexual feelings.

Well! Just jerked off to the thought of that guy who seems to hit on me despite the massive age gap. Life is over. I hate summer I hate summer I HATE SUMMER

>>40259664
you say that like misoginy was some outlier in 4chong posters behaviour

>>40262370
I think is more about the social stigma of being a slut for looking for that sort of thing I mean even men who participate in that sort of shit might have that opinion about the women they fuck

>>40263160
everyone knows it isn't a real thing even enbies do I don't think you should get upset about it when is not a really serious thing

>>40263528
It's up to you how committed you want to be. If it's just sex, you're two consenting adults
If you or he wants a relationship, then everything else applies

>>40265124
Didn’t seem like that big of a concern among the bi women I met tbr (guess because being openly bi as a woman here often earns you the title of slut whether you slut around or not so it’s a losing battle from the start) but I suppose it also differs from culture to culture and social group to social group

>>40263455
>So, basically bigfoot.
plz date me. I'm a bisexual man too.

There is no such thing as multiple "enbies." All enbies are actually the SAME nb travelling forwards and backwards in time. Only one nb exists in the entire universe. What we observe is just an illusion.

>>40263455
>bigfoot x theyfab
truly peak relationship right there

>>40222164 (OP)
>For Bisexuals, what have your experiences with nb's been like?
I've never met one who wasn't an irritating person to be around.

>>40265204
Yeah, I guess. Just makes me feel disgusted with myself anyway because I’m “supposed” to be mature enough to gently direct him towards a more age-appropriate option than me and realising that I might fall in if he offers is scary. I don’t really want to be a story he looks back on ten years from now and regrets.

>>40222164 (OP)
>Qqtd
a fucking bitch whore I fucking hate her I hope she dies bitch still has my gamegear I'm going to kill her

we made some good fajitas one time so over all bisexuals aren't too bad

>>40266691
Preach

>>40265109
it is here, bigen threads are usually nice like that

>>40222258
Did you draw it with all six of your fingers? Or does your thumb have three bone segments?

>>40268329
Amazing gotcha moment, OP was left speechless

>>40268329
Indians have a lot of deformities

is this sort of thing really that obvious...

>>40269500
The fact that you responded to it gave you away lmao

>>40266009
This is true

Birthday today, still virgin at 26. I'm such a pathetic fucking loser.

Work crush had a gf.

>>40270723
F in chat. Hate it when that happens

>>40257002
Afab loser again, returning with a question:
where would MM couples like yours searching for people like me irl even go looking? FF and FM couples seem relatively easy to find (tinder, lesbian apps), but the only place I can think of for MM is Grindr (where I dont want to intrude)

>>40222164 (OP)
What does Nonbinary mean to you?

>>40271808
an umbrella of different things

>>40271808
Faggot but even gayer

>>40271808
Anglosphere upper middle class white woman with little or no purpose or difficulties in life trying to be special as a form of teenage rebellion. Similar to other upper middle class people who identify as communists - which enbies often do also.
The only way someone can identify as non-binary is when they have little or no responsibilities or problems in life, which being rich obviously helps tremendously with.
I don't know if it's a linguistic issue, but I don't think I've ever heard of or seen non-binary who weren't from English speaking countries (more or less just the US, UK and Canada). Many languages have much more clear divides in terms of grammatical gender, so I wonder if that makes a difference also. I bring this up because I live in one of the richest and most progressive countries in the world (Denmark), and yet I've only ever met one person who claimed to be non-binary - and that person even had an accent that I couldn't quite figure out.

>>40271019
I have a Grindr, bumble, tinder and hinge profile
They're just my profiles (my bf has his own) but we advertise ourselves as open to group stuff and include pics of both of us together
Plenty of men have shown interest in me alone and my partner and I together
No women though

>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT
>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT

The poll is now open, no further recommendations will be accepted.
The voting will stop tomorrow at around 4 PM GMT, so be sure to vote before then!

Here is the link to the server:
https://discord.gg/3cnrvDw4

>>40271019
>the only place I can think of for MM is Grindr (where I dont want to intrude)
If you go on grindr, you will likely get a lot of angry messages from gay guys, but you'll also get your choice of bi guys to choose from if you want mmf.

>>40271808
either a woman (AFaB) or coping transwoman (AMaB)

I see women - and particularly radfems - as a threat to the ability to become divine or achieve godhood, but I also recognize that my growing disdain for women and my desperate internal clawing for some form of divine superiority above reality are born from an ugly part of my ego lashing out at it's limited and impermanent nature. What do I do about this?

>>40273257
Damn, not a single one? That’s pretty fucking bleak, not gonna lie, but wishing you guys luck on finding one in spite of the odds.
Last time I lurked Tinder through a friend here the selection in threesomes was all FM couples, most of them being composed of two seemingly straight upper-middle class people with relationship problems they couldnt solve on their latest backpacking trip through India
>>40273470
Yeah I feel like it’s well within their right to get huffy if somebody like me were to use it lol but noted

>>40273765
>What do I do about this?
Take your meds. The only way to ascend beyond humanity is by going to the gym anyway.

>>40274016
>Yeah I feel like it’s well within their right to get huffy if somebody like me were to use it lol but noted
Yeah they can be (legitimately) mad, but if Grindr doesn't ban you and you can tank/ignore their anger, you'll have fun with some bi guy for sure.
When I was single if I had ever run into a fujo girl on grindr I would've gone for that immediately.

relapsing over a I guy I used to like help NOW!

How was bigen's experience at Pride this year?

>be 2025
>haven't been to Pride in nearly 5 years
>kind of hate the new vibe after the "official" flag change
>decide to go anyway to celebrate my *lack of shame* in being bisexual
>arrive at Pride
>not so many shirtless gay men this time
>mostly a bunch of angry "queer" women with buzz cuts
>try to ignore and make my way to the flag booth
>try to buy a bi flag and a rainbow flag
>get handed a pan flag and a progress pride flag
>politely try to exchange the flags
>"oh so you're one of THOSE people."
>head towards the main venue
>hear "Free, Free Palestine!!" in the distance
>get to the main "Pride" area
>see more Palestinian flags than Pride flags
>realize I am surrounded by mostly "queer" people
>literally the only person with a regular rainbow flag
>wonder where all the regular gays are
>see one trying to speak at the podium
>he can't
>gets pushed aside by an angry "queer" woman
>"Free, Free Palestine! Pride was a riot! Death to Imperialism!"
>I start to boo loudly ("This isn't why we are here!!! Go somewhere else!!!")
>get escorted out of the venue while crazy activists shout "Death to Israel"

>>40276259
>kind of hate the new vibe after the "official" flag change
I fucking despise that flag so much, it's like the epitome of retarded gender fuckery and slacktivism infiltrating a movement that should just be about legal rights and acceptance.
The original rainbow flag works so well because it's so simple: it's a rainbow, it encompasses everyone, it doesn't have any weird symbols or references to specific subgroups or communities. Meanwhile the "progress" pride flag is an ungodly abomination of peak American navelgazing where being oppressed apparently means you are required to be worshipped - even over other groups who face the same problems!
The fact that the "progress" part of the flag looks like a triangle forcing its way inside the original rainbow flag is just so hilariously ironic it almost feels like it's on purpose.
Sometimes I legit wonder if that flag is actually a Russian or Chinese psyop intended to divide minorities and destabilize the West because of how ridiculous it is.

>>40275494
Double noted.
>if Grindr doesn't ban you and you can tank/ignore their anger
It does seem pretty scummy so probably won’t be my first choice even if I’m capable of shrugging shit off. Would be cool to meet somebody who isn’t weirdly straight and repressed about threesomes if my confidence improves though . Tinder clientele seems too normie for that on average
>>40275676
Love is temporary. Good masturbation skills are forever or until your arthritis hits. Get to it

Are there any bisexual men who have a thing for cross-dressing? I have never tried, but the concept of being a women arouses me, and this might be something I have a bone for.

>>40277327
>Are there any bisexual men who have a thing for cross-dressing?
yeah, me

>>40277671
What about it do you like? I feel incredibly jealous of women. the fact that they have such a feminine body, with tits, and are able to accessorize themselves makes me wish I had what they had.

Going through a weird phase in my life where as a teen I thought I was a genius then, as a young man I thought I was all wrong and that I was a doomed idiot & now I’m at a spot where I realize oh I am way above average intelligence It was just my behavior (especially at work) that was stupid.

>>40277714
Just the variety and cuts. Male fashion has taken a nosedive recently imo, it's all just baggy, straight-cut crap that all looks the same. You have to dig deep to find anything else, easier to just start shopping in the women's department. I suppose it's less crossdressing and more just augmenting my wardrobe with women's clothes although I'd say it's like 60% currently lol

>>40278134
so like your phase was being fucking normal? I guess as an adult your a dipshit

>>40266009
there are other nbs actually but yeah it's ultimately the same person just different versions from different timelines. Also time traveling to create multiple of us at any given time of course.
>>40271808
not strictly male or female
>>40276259
>>40276566
I was going to ask "what's the new bi flag" but then I saw other anon's reply and it made sense. The progress pride flag is pretty meaningless imo but it led to that funny meme where the pride flag turns into the ohio flag so that's neat

>>40278301
You talk like a hasbin hotel character right before they breakout into a song about their trauma

>>40277327
I like to sometimes wear my girlfriend's skirts, stockings and holter tops while we fuck
She loves how my muscles look in it and idk why I enjoy it, I just do

>>40276790
Im taking a break from porn

>>40276259
I went outside and saw the pride parade. It was kinda boring, like most parades. No palestine retards but also no crazy naked people. Like usual lol

>>40278851
Well fuck. Guessing there’s no one else to project your longing onto or what’s the situation ?

>>40276790
>Tinder clientele seems too normie for that on average
So the thing about grindr is that it's very direct. You don't need to swipe, you can be explicit about both sex and what you want out of relationships from the start. Like you can say "Oh I want a monogamous relationship with these exceptions for group play and this type of sex" in a blunt way that would be considered way to rude or fake-seeming for Tinder.
Obviously as a woman, you'll be out of place there.
A decade ago, Craigslist personals would've been the place to find the guy you want, but that's gone now due to SESTA/FOSTA legislation. You could try DoubleList or Reddit r4r, but it's not quite the same as Craigslist.
Grindr may unironically be your best remaining bet. But you'll need to cast a wide net. Maybe try feeld but it kinda sucks lol

>>40280738
thats definitely what it feels like, I was relapsing because our friendship is the strongest its been (at least how I feel) because I basically escalated things and honestly glad he forgave me for thinking he was leading me on. But life just feels hollow and I went on a huge porn binge like twice a day for a few weeks and felt even worse. Havent watched it/ jerked it but Im like fiending all over again.

>>40281262
Yeaahh fuck, that one’s tough. Whenever I think I’m over some of my friends it all comes flooding back as soon as we hang out more regularly again, or whenever someone else tell me they aren’t single anymore. The only thing that’s really had any effect on calming it down for me is trying to cope by seeing new people or jerking off to the thought of them without berating myself afterwards (seems pathetic but does help if nobody else is around imo. Major caveat is that you have to remind yourself it isn’t real though).
>>40281144
Craigslist sex listings are gone? Man that’s a little sad almost. Not that it would have helped me much as a Eurofag but I can’t think of anywhere else that’s spawned posts like the “Jerkoff crystal” guy kek
>Feeld
Don’t think I’ve ever heard of that one. Guess I’ll ask my friend if it’s in use here but I doubt it.
>you can be explicit about sex
Yeah, that’s the thing I suppose: when you’re looking for something outside the ordinary being blunt about who and how you’re wanting to fuck is kind of useful. I’d wish there was more of that for other demographics tbr. I don’t really feel like I need a 6 page Facebook post essay telling me why Jane and John 31 are oh so courageously looking for a third lol

>>40282387
>Craigslist sex listings are gone? Man that’s a little sad almost. Not that it would have helped me much as a Eurofag but I can’t think of anywhere else that’s spawned posts like the “Jerkoff crystal” guy kek
lol yeah honestly I had a lot of my earlier m4m and m4t experiences there, it was really good.
Unfortunately we have only one senator who understands computers in the US, Ron Wyden, and he failed to stop this shit from going through and killing a lot of the internet: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FOSTA-SESTA#Response
>Don’t think I’ve ever heard of that one. Guess I’ll ask my friend if it’s in use here but I doubt it.
It used to be called 3nder, like Tinder for threesomes. But then they got sued by Tinder for the name lol. Honestly the app is the buggiest fucking app in the world but it has two benefits:
>Explicitly stating what you want sexually+relatinoshipwise
>You can swipe left and right to skip profiles without having to say "yes" or "no" permanently.
If you're in europe, maybe you'll find luck on locanto, that seems a bit craigslist-like, but I've never used it so no clue lol.

>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT
>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT

And we have the two winners!:

>rush hour 3
> mr.bean's holiday

So see ya later at 22 GMT!

>>40282387
>>Feeld
I wouldn't expect much from Feeld. It's a pretty dead app in my experience
People on there aren't checking on it that often and you'll be shown the same 20 profiles over and over even if you "deny" them (you can flip through profiles without committing to a yes or no, but no doesn't really mean much to the app because you'll be seeing that profile again)

>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT
>MOVIE NIGHT
MOVIE NIGHT

A reminder that in 2 hours Movie Night is gonna start! Here is tonight's selection:

>rush hour 3
>mr.bean's holiday

>what the hell is "movie night"
Its a special night where bigen comes together to watch on Discord two movies chosen by the community

>where do we watch the movies?
On the official Bigen Movie and Game Night Discord server:
https://discord.gg/3cnrvDw4

>i don't usually post on bigen/never took part in movie night, can i join?
Of course, movie night is open to anyone, just remember to mute yourself during the movies, be civil and have fun!

fyi this is the list of every movie we watched so far:
https://pastebin.com/Bc8pqK9h

>>40282597
>reading picrel
fucking hate how it’s seemingly always a mix of politicians who don’t know jackshit about the internet and politicians who know full well it’s not going to work but wants to do it anyway for other political reasons. Here in Europe they’ve been wanting to do age verification and force encrypted mail and message services into handing over user data when asked. feels insane just reading about it
>3nder
Oh lol
>Locanto
Never heard about that either but I guess I’ll snoop around
>>40282807
Yeah okay that does sound pretty buggy and borderline unusable lol

i get tired when i get stressed

>>40276566
Hard agree. The progress pride flag is so ugly. The pastel colors and brown/black stripes clash with the rainbow itself.

People of color were never excluded by the rainbow flag... but the presence of black/brown stripes suggests that the old flag was 'deficient' in that way. As if the rainbow wasn't a symbol of diversity already.

Now in 2025 it actually feels like sporting an OG rainbow flag is an act of open defiance. Which... what the fuck.

>>40285326
I looked up the person who created it, and he apparently goes by (among others) "xe/xem" pronouns: https://x.com/danielquasar/status/1319172769788141568
We live in an actual clown world.

Bump for anti-progress pride flag

>>40227764
id hope you'd all be dead by now

>>40287350
You’re an idiot

>>40222164 (OP)
I would like more bi friends
Irl or online works, where can I find them?