Thread 40271330

>cognitive decline
is that why so many of you are fucking insane?

no its a normal effect of estrogen that cis women also experience

>>40271369
…yeah

>>40271330 (OP)
>linked to infertility
opinion discarded (retarded chud detected)

>>40271330 (OP)
another truke: if one is arguing hrt is ineffective treatment, do you have a better idea thats more effective? protip: no you dont. neither does the entire medical community. its worth it to the patient bc theyre in extreme distress. informed consent exists for a reason. u just want fags to suffer and off themselves instead of being happy and visible. KYS.

>>40271330 (OP)
>New research says
all journos need to face the wall

These are all good things to wish upon your enemies. Personally, I’d have the companies manufacturing synthetic hormones lace them with succinylcholine.

>>40271330 (OP)
>New research says HRT is linked to infertility

Damn, who woulda guessed huh?

>>40271330 (OP)
>infertility
NNNNOOOO YOU HAVE TO HAVE KIDS!!!!! WHO WILL THE JEWS EXPLOIT FOR THE NEXT 75 YEARS????
>cancer
oh wow having breasts makes you suseptible to breast cancer no way duuude that's crazzzzzy, it also lowers your risk of prostate cancer but let's ignore that part :^)

>impact factor 2.7
into the trash it goes

>>40271330 (OP)
He doesnt give any hard numbers on anything. Shits like saying walking outside increases your chances of death.

>>40271330 (OP)
>women and youngshits are dumb because they lack T exposure
Yes obviously, if you want a partner that's as malebrained as you are then the logical conclusion is to be gay. Chuds are just in this ideological liminal space where they haven't realized that.

>>40271657
>warning: estrogen therapy may increase your likelihood of sucking cock as a male

>>40271330 (OP)
no. its probably why so many tgirls r a little stupid but the mental illness just comes with being a woman as far as i can tell. something inherent in the female condition

>>40271524
Maybe just stop thinking about it

>>40271524
There are methods and treatments for depression and anxiety that don’t involve poisoning the patient’s endocrine system.

>>40271845
there are treatments for congenital retardation too

>>40271330 (OP)
kek so is this why women are dumb

>>40271845
you think youre the first to think of this? other methods besides hrt are not effective on trans patients. you are, and likely always will be, mentally a child. or a troll representing the sincere beliefs of people more retarded than you, which is also reprehensible. try again.

>>40271883
Really? So why are autistic children being groomed by the trans movement?

>>40271905
because autistic children have an intersex condition and the average dickless retard thinks he knows better than the general body of scientific knowledge because hes a closeted babyraper

>>40271900
Why wouldn’t they be? SSRIs are extremely effective.

>>40271940
perhaps they are for the general population, but we are talking about a subset of the general population with a prior specific condition sweetie. might i suggest you take a statistics class? as an exercise, why might antidepressants not work for people who are depressed about, say, their chronic pain?

>>40271940
additionally, youre talking about retarded hypotheticals here, likely because you have no concrete knowledge or tangible stake in this conversation, when in reality this has been tried and doesnt work.

>>40271330 (OP)
Paper written by members of
>genspect
>"society of reality based gender medicine" (or whatever it is)

literally lysenkoism. could not make a more ideologically motivated study. complete bunk science

>>40272002
Most trans people aren’t neurologically trans anyways these days.

>>40271330 (OP)
>>40271369
>Xitter post by an anti-trans political activist
>Citing a bullshit City Journal article run by the culture-warrior conservative Manhattan Institute
>Twisting a study that doesn't say any of that directly, and was written by this guy's friend working for a conversion therapy group
Yep it's a tard thread

>>40272052
meaningless vibe based claim. will you concede that someone reporting gender dysphoria is by definition neurological, since its a product of the brain and conscious experience, or will you concede you are not using the word neurological correctly?

>>40272117
Studies are bullshit unless they support tradcon views anon, don't you know?

>>40271330 (OP)
>>40271447
>>40271524
>>40272146
Why did dishonest bullshit artist Colin Wright fail to acknowledge that this supposed research paper is written by conversion therapy organizations?
Why did dishonest bullshit artist Colin Wright fail to acknowledge that the groups who produced this "study" included Genspect, "Do No Harm", and SEGM, now well known for their hateful political activism attempting to abolish trans people?

>>40272174
Do you knot know what sarcasm is?

>>40272174
correct. anyone regurgitating this sort of rhetoric uncritically is complicit in rightists attempts to build a scaffolding for legalized discrimination, at worst willingly and at best through alarming foolishness.

>>40271559
>>40271605
The methodology of the paper is already suspect from the beginning. It states "Several recent systematic reviews have found the evidence of benefit to be of low or very low certainty". This is a lie by omission. The study nowhere acknowledges the existence of the Utah Review:
https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news/utah-lawmakers-own-study-found-gender-affirming-care-benefits-trans-youth-will-they-lift-the-treatment-ban
It had a surprising finding since it was commissioned by the Republican state legislature to justify their initial ban on healthcare and their restrictions placed on families and doctors who understand these situations better than politicians.
Quotes from the review:
"Notably, our searches yielded a larger number of primary studies than any of the systematic reviews that underwent data extraction".
"The conventional wisdom among non-experts has long been that there are limited data on the use of GAHT [gender-affirming hormone therapy] in pediatric patients with GD [gender dysphoria]. However, results from our exhaustive literature searches have led us to the opposite conclusion".
https://www.assignedmedia.org/breaking-news/plentiful-data-no-regret-utah-review

The paper mentions "risks, such as infertility". This is a lie by omission. The paper completely fails to acknowledge promising recent advances in fertility preservation and restoration, such as using SERMs like clomifene or extended sperm search and microfreeze.

>>40271330 (OP)
I'm not going to dig up and read the study because fuck that noise, so I don't know if they actually had a control population of non-medically transitioning transwomen, but this is unironically a rare case where "Correlation does not equal causation" is a valid criticism. All of these things, even the infertility (which obviously is an effect of medical transitioning) can be caused by being part of such a heavily marginalized group. The human psyche is more fragile than people realize, and it also has way more physical effects than people realize. A lot of what's mentioned here are also correlated with C-PTSD for example.

I can't find it right now, maybe someone else can repost it, but there's a comic where a priest is beating up some gay kid in a bathroom and he has a speech bubble that says something along the lines of "How could you be living such a harmful lifestyle? We already know it causes depression, anxiety, alienation, bleeding, bruises". This is basically that.

>>40271330 (OP)
it's a question of causation. is the estrogen causing their cognitive decline or does their mental health depreciate because they don't get gender identity disorder? meaning, hrt should improve their quality of life. if you show signs of cognitive decline after starting hrt, is it really cognitive decline or did you get what you wanted and now you don't know what to do?

>>40272265
They acknowledge in that very paper that different published studies found different results on cognition. Some studies found a correlation and some didn't. It's not just a correlation without evident causation, it's a correlation without evident causation that hasn't been reliably reproduced.

>>40271845
a lot of meds for anxiety and depression have side effects including dependency issues, head fog, weight gain and difficulty achieving orgasm

also anti-psychotics (which are increasingly being used as an adjunct to anxiety/depression treatment) comes with a whole RAFT of side effects including neurodegeneration. You can literally see the brain shrink

>>40272358
he left the chat bc he got btfo and realized he has no place in adult discussion

>>40272391
yeah still, it bugs me when people scare monger about side effects when basically all meds have horrific side effects we just accept because going without treatment is worse.

like, a LOT of meds have cognitive impacts, and doctors just neglect to mention that fact, especially with psych meds

>>40271524
Testosterone but then you would have to have sex or be really anger

>trans-identified
Uh I have never once identified as a ‘trans’, which isn’t even a thing but rather a temporal state between two points.

>>40271330 (OP)
it's not cognitive decline, dipshit. it's reduced brain mass due to less water retention in the brain, same thing cis women have. woman chemical does woman things, shocker

>>40272265
This post is proof of cognitive decline

>>40272428
gender dysphoria in trans women is not caused by low testosterone and testosterone therapy to hypernormal levels is dangerous and not effective.

>>40272429
This post shows proof of autism. You cannot mutate your birth sex into the other sex.

>>40272174
>evidence-based

Truly the kryptonite of troons

>>40272429
many young people swept up in the trend identify as trans. case in point: hunter schaefer.

>>40271330 (OP)
>what is minority stress

>>40271524
Treatment for WHAT?

>>40271330 (OP)
>infertility
no shit
>early death, cognitive decline, autoimmune disorders
all marginalized groups carry lowered life expectancy and higher chances of these disorders
>elevated cancer risk
of breast cancer yes? that's what estrogen does in everyone

Ok this is an actual legit question, what DOES hrt do to you in the long run? I don't doubt that you need to be careful of blood clots and things but overall is it fucking with your health like smoking or more like something that is small enough no one cares about it like red meat giving you colon cancer.

>>40272747
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_dysphoria

extreme distress caused by sex and gender

>>40272691
meaningless claim that cannot be based on evidence. what was your first language, i’m curious?

is it why i'm more peaceful and less self destructive now?

>>40272690
then why do the vast majority of physicians who use evidence to make decisions agree with using hrt to treat gender dysphoria?

>>40272801
Your doctor is gonna ask you about a family history with blood clots and cancers those are the primary concerns. You have to understand that men and women are not different species, you are not chemically any different from the 50% of the population that is on estrogen, you carry all the same genes that they have and bio-identical estrogen will work in your body on the same proteins and genes that are found in theirs. The risk of being on estrogen are the same as any cis woman.

none of you listened to glegle

>>40272881
Well I know, but I think the risk of blood clotting is known to be higher than it is for cis women so there are at least a few unique problems caused by transitioning. It honestly doesn't sound like a very bad thing to do to myself but you know it doesn't sound all puppies and rainbows either.

>>40272905
hmm source? things do get in the weeds when you get into different estrogens like Premarin which used to be commonly prescribed 30 years ago versus bioidentical estrogens which are standard now and have a better side effect profile. We also know that method of administration changes risk of clots in menopausal HRT with injections and creams being less risky than pills, but many trans people are still on pills. Also factors like age of cohort should be considered where a lot of studies are done on older transwomen who transitioned in their 50s, I'm less confident they can be directly compared in terms of cardiovascular risk and strokes to cis women as transwomen who transitioned younger.

>>40273025
It definitely doesn't seem so bad for the first 20 years but there haven't been any trannies who lived to 90 yet and transitioned when they were 20 like I would in my dream world. Considering how shit most people eat I think a good diet is probably going to leave me ahead even with HRT all things considered lol

>>40273092
i think the first tranny that ever got srs managed to live to her 70s/80s, can't remember her name.
Bambi will also be turning 90 in this year

you are measuring this in a population also effected by chronic stress and marginalisation, which are also associated with all those things

>>40271330 (OP)
genuinely how would you even measure that in the case of a trans teen? what's your control group?

>>40273113
That's cool. Sounds like whatever impact it has is noise compared to all the other things that can kill us or keep us alive.

>>40273092
I think people are overly eager to apply issues with life expectancy to estrogen when it seems more obvious that the answer would be minority stress. Occams razor and all that

>>40271330 (OP)
A few notes:
>The VTE risk is likely almost entirely a result of usage of oral estrogen, which carries a far higher VTE risk than transdermal and injected estrogen.
>Suicide was included in the early death rates.
>Cognitive decline may be due to a deficiency in 17α-estradiol (a highly neuroprotective estradiol). Perhaps biologically male bodies are less capable of producing it from normal 17β-estradiol.
>>40271845
I think that doping someone up with a bunch of SSRIs so that can more easily ignore that they are living a lie is pretty dystopian.

>>40273324
well has anyone experimented with administering 17α-estradiol then? Sounds like an improvement on HRT waiting to happen

>>40273370
There are mostly enbies on SERMs using it. Since it's a less feminizing estrogen, it can stave off some of the cognitive and vasomotor risks of hormone deprivation.
If studies come out saying it's beneficial, it is certainly something regular trannies could add to their HRT regimens.

>>40272126
They don’t have gender dysphoria as it was previously identified. They think they do because of vibes. Now go back to your transbian argumenthon soul gem.

>>40273127
> a population also effected by chronic stress and marginalisation,
Yeah. Men.

>>40273405
are you a fucking retard?

>>40273410
>non-sentient reddit tier response
Lighten up, chuckles.

>>40273449
You are a NIGGER!
Fuck you NIGGER!

>>40273449
>south park gif
this anon shows up in so many debate threads to repeat the same phrases in the same order and post the same images. It’s such impressive levels of autism.

>>40273476
88 NIGGER 88

>>40273487
this is the first time i've done this, I think we all must have the exact same idea or something

>>40273390
>Y8G4Y
care to qualify how this nebulous faketrans group doesnt meet previous criteria for gender dysphoria? curious that im the argumenthon when youre the one dropping retarded contrarian baits and trolls that hurt others. do you need to feel superior to an ugly dirty nasty transbian boogeyman to cope or something?

>>40271330 (OP)
I'm much more professionally and financially successful than Colin Wright so I doubt it.

>>40272052
>Most trans people aren’t neurologically trans anyways these days.

>>40272905
>Well I know,
do you actually anon. Think about it

>>40272117
the Manhattan Institute's right-wing economics writer recently transitioned and literally millions of insane right-wingers have been telling her to kill herself for months now. she had to quit twitter

>>40271330 (OP)
>colin wright
this dude has been seething about trannies nonstop for like 10 years, why is he like this