Who is Jesus Christ? Was he God, man, or both? Did Jesus really claim to be the Son of God? What did Jesus teach about the Kingdom of God?

>>24461128 (OP)
He was the son of God

>>24461128 (OP)
If only there were some kind of book you could read to get these answers.

>>24461128 (OP)
>Who is Jesus Christ?
Rabbu Yeshua
>Was he God, man, or both?
Irrelevant to anybody not jewish since if he was he was the jewish god yahweh
>Did Jesus really claim to be the Son of God?
Yahweh
>What did Jesus teach about the Kingdom of God?
Ironically if you take Rabbi Yeshua's words alone christianity takes on a very different aspect from the version widely taught and practiced

>>24461128 (OP)
>Was he God, man, or both?
He has both a human and a divine nature.
>Did Jesus really claim to be the Son of God?
Yes. He also called himself "The son of Man", and he also heavily implied everytime that he was God, in fact they crucified him for this.
>What did Jesus teach about the Kingdom of God?
He taught about the kingdom of god only through parables and allegories that are up to interpretation, so you will never get an objective answer about this. It is a mystery that we'll only know after death.

>>24461478
>He taught about the kingdom of god only through parables and allegories that are up to interpretation, so you will never get an objective answer about this. It is a mystery that we'll only know after death.

you are an idiot

>>24461502
Christ's original teaching was essentially buddhism or something very similar, Kingdom of Heaven is within you etc

>>24461128 (OP)
>Was he God, man, or both?
He was both, truly man and truly God
>Did Jesus really claim to be the Son of God?
Yes, which implies that He is God.
What did Jesus teach about the Kingdom of God?
Love God with all your heart, mind and strength and love your neighbor as you love yourself if you want to enter the kingdom of heaven.

>>24462190
>Christ's original teaching was essentially buddhism or something very similar, Kingdom of Heaven is within you etc
no it wasn't you, your reading comprehension is deranged, actually you probably didn't read but just heard that somewhere.

>>24462203
Read his actual words brainlet. Get a bible with the red text and read nothing except that

>>24462213
You already believe the bible contains the authentic words of Jesus, now you just have to put effort into understanding them. Jesus had a jewish monotheistic worldview, not a far east indian one. You'd be better off not prooftexting verses that are already agreeable with your presuppositions. I bet if something Jesus say doesn't comport with your worldview, you will just ignore or rationalize it instead of analyzing it with humility.

>>24462227
>you will just ignore or rationalize it instead of analyzing it with humility.
This is what you're doing. Literally find a pdf of just his dialogue only and read it

>>24462232
>“I tell you, whoever publicly acknowledges me before others, the Son of Man will also acknowledge before the angels of God. 9 But whoever disowns me before others will be disowned before the angels of God.
> Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division.
>I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish.
>no one comes to the father except through me.
>Not everyone who says Lord, Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven
>the words that I speak will judge you
>Whoever is ashamed of me and my words, the Son of Man will be ashamed of them when he comes in his glory and in the glory of the Father and of the holy angels.
No show me where buddhism says anything similar... all you've done was quote "the kingdom of heaven is within you" and you just assume it means Jesus is saying we are all God or something.

>>24462190
>essentially buddhism
lol. tell me you haven't read the gospels without telling me. samsara and karma are completely antithetical with what Jesus spoke about. the buddhist origin of compassion and kindness is also rooted in different motivations.

>>24462249
>>24462274
Both of you are coping and the first post could easily be lines from a buddhist text, just replace angels with gods etc

>>24461128 (OP)
He was a fiction cooked up based on some grifter many years after his death. Who's cult got a bit too popular

>>24462279
there is no "God" in buddhism; that is, the all powerful alpha and omega omniscient divine mind. there are devas and asuras that are karmically enlightened but spirtually mislead immortals existing outside of our realm of comprehension. i can tell you know very little about both.

>>24462279
now you're being obtuse, have a nice day

>>24461128 (OP)
A human sacrifice that the Jews hoped would appease their god.
Of course the most valuable human sacrifice is a king, which is why he was proclaimed "King of the Jews" before they killed him.

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24461128 (OP)
my Lord and my God

>>24462283
>the all powerful alpha and omega omniscient divine mind
nirvana for many buddhists is losing the individual self to the divine consciousness. buddha was sent to eartb in the form of pronce siddhartha by this consciousness. it's all the same

>>24462311
yea every religion starts out as a cult, that's pretty Sociology 101 stuff

>>24462337

You and I agree, but many people don't. I encounter lots of pushback against that meme, or just fedora pictures

>>24462311
pic done in bad faith but let's ignore the miracles for a second. anyone who is well read and reads what Jesus said will see there's something very different since He speaks with divine authority. it is not simple a charismatic man promising things or saying smart things. divine authority presents itself differently, it is not human cleverness, philosophy, science. this is pretty clear to anyone who reads it with sufficient maturity and honesty

one cannot mention anyone who spoke in such manner. and before someone says "the gospels are fabrication by the disciples" this simply impossible. are you telling me simple fishermen and other workers from 2000 ago developed the most fascinating figure??? AND AS A LITERARY DEVICE???? to what gain since they all embraced persecution and death?

>>24462347
>"pic done in bad faith"

It will seem that way until it clicks for you.

>"but let's ignore the miracles for a second."

No, let's not. Name some independent contemporaneous witnesses to those miracles. Shouldn't be difficult if there were over 500 who saw the resurrection. Or the saints risen from shattered tombs, which even among NT authors, is mysteriously noticed only by Matthew.

>"and before someone says "the gospels are fabrication by the disciples" this simply impossible. are you telling me simple fishermen and other workers from 2000 ago developed the most fascinating figure??? AND AS A LITERARY DEVICE????"

I never said this, I'm not a mythicist. Muhammad & Joseph Smith existed too. Presumably you agree this doesn't, by itself, vindicate Mormonism or Islam.

>"to what gain since they all embraced persecution and death?"

Cultic psychology. Same reason 11 Mormons died rather than recant their beliefs during the Mormon Extermination Order of 1838. Or does that prove Mormonism?

>>24462334
ah yes, the divine consciousness that sent buddha here in a date we can't nail down, into an affluent family to walk away from his wife and child and cherry pick what he liked from hinduism and remove the pantheon of rape gods and unfair caste system. "it's all the same". even if granted, the messages are still at odds with eachother, which is the original point. if buddhists consider Jesus a bodhisattva, look to what Jesus says.

>>24461129

>>24462357
nta but science takes the evidence available to make the best guess. what is the best guess, with all the evidence available, to explain what happened following the crucifixion of Jesus? josephus, tacitus, letters of pontius pilate, etc, attest to his death and the massive spread of his influence. the apostles were willing to die for something they knew to be a lie? this is of course based on extraneous sources as the gospels were written prior their deaths. thousands of insular jews and gentiles coming to Christ and spreading his message? within 20 years thousands occupied Rome nearly 2000 miles away from Jerusalem.

>Muhammad & Joseph Smith existed too.
these two are easily debunked reading their material as its antithetical to the gospels. joseph smith's story translating found tablets in a hat and promoting polygamy is laughable. muhammed was illiterate and couldn't even nail down names of figures in the old testament. Miriam was the mother of Jesus, and he wasn't crucified but hidden away? check the gospels to verify the quran but the gospels were corrupted? that's impossible since we have what was written hundreds of years before muhammed and exactly what he would have used to verify his revelation.

>>24462357
>Name some independent contemporaneous witnesses to those miracles.
lol

because the testimony of 1) peter, 2) matthew, 3) paul, 4) john, 5) mark, 6) james and 7) jude doesn't count since they were not "independent". how many people do you think were writing stuff in the region at the time? and why would history preserve it when most ancient writings ended up being lost to time?

are you telling me fishermen like peter, james and john out of nowhere miraculously happened to have a 180° change of character and became prolific writers of otherwordly spirituality?

>>24462379
>josephus, tacitus, letters of pontius pilate, etc, attest to his death and the massive spread of his influence.

I said contemporaries. None of these men were alive at the same time as Jesus. I didn't deny his death, nor that his cult was successful. So were Muhammad's and Joseph Smith's.

>"nta but science takes the evidence available to make the best guess. what is the best guess, with all the evidence available, to explain what happened following the crucifixion of Jesus?"

Very obviously, his followers stole his body to inspire a legend so the wise teachings of their beloved master would not die along with him. Consider the resurrection as a purely metaphorical event: That the Roman government sought to quash Yeshua’s teachings & ministry, his life’s work, by killing the man behind them. Only for those teachings, and his ministry, to not just continue on after his death but explode in popularity to the point that he’s still a hot topic of discussion even today. In light of that, did Rome truly succeed in killing him? Can it not be said that the essence of Yeshua, his message, survived his bodily death? In a sense, did he not rise from the grave and ascend to exultation?

>"these two are easily debunked reading their material as its antithetical to the gospels."

Do you not recognize this is a biased and presuppositional heuristic? Or that to atheists, Christianity is also easily debunked? >>24462338 >>24462336 >>24462333 >>24462330

>>24462382
>because the testimony of 1) peter, 2) matthew, 3) paul, 4) john, 5) mark, 6) james and 7) jude doesn't count since they were not "independent".

That's right, and they were members of the same cult. Members of Amy Carlson, aka Mother God's cult all attested to her resurrection in 2021.

>"how many people do you think were writing stuff in the region at the time?"

You, yourself, namedropped multiple non-Christian historians who mentioned early Christianity.

>"and why would history preserve it when most ancient writings ended up being lost to time?"

Not my problem.

>"are you telling me fishermen like peter, james and john out of nowhere miraculously happened to have a 180° change of character and became prolific writers of otherwordly spirituality?"

We have only the NT as a source for this. I might just as easily ask you the same of the 7 witnesses who signed sworn statements affirming Joseph Smith's golden plates and seer stone.

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24462387
>I said contemporaries.
that's the thing. your evidence demands a time machine and video recorder. you wouldn't hold that same standard to anything else in history with far less documentation.
>So were Muhammad's and Joseph Smith's.
right, but foundationally destroyed with anything more than a cursory glance.
>Very obviously, his followers stole his body
very obviously 11 frightened men disarmed guards and rolled a 2 ton boulder away in the night to steal a body as a "cover story" for Jesus' words. you're high.
>Do you not recognize this is a biased and presuppositional heuristic?
this is neither of those. it's literal fact checking of what the quran says. it is literally at odds with what it says. if the gospels are true, the quran is false. joe smith has zero supporting evidence and again, is antithetical to the bible. they both play the same game about scriptures being corrupted and THIS is the way to be, but we have the manuscripts that predate them.

>>24462390
>Not my problem.
it is your problem because you are demanding impossible documents while most ancient documents were lost to time

you again compare it with other cults and spiritual leaders when my initial post relied on the fact jesus' words are not comparable to those of any other man since they hold divine authority and i speak of this with sincerity: i hear his words proclaimed on a daily basis for 7 years while i study comparative religion and philosophy and ive never seen a philosopher or spiritual leader speak with such authority. i've read spiritual leaders of other religions and i'm fond of greeks like plato and plotinus. always had plato as reference before my conversion, i was not some naive guy easily impressed by mere nice words of a 'charismatic leader'. i insist: you will never find in any other man the authority jesus held in every thing He said

>>24462369

>>24462190
wrong

>>24462311
worthless ideas

>>24461502
Name a single verse where he teaches about the kingdom of God without a parable.

Jesus is the original LARPer

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24461128 (OP)
4 fucking christcuck threads. Get a religion board to contain you fucks.

>>24461128 (OP)
he was Apollonius's contemporary

a purely spiritual being who never truly experienced pain or suffering. The material world is a prison for the soul, which Jesus was free from. The Word made flesh.

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24462786
Love your soul

>>24461128 (OP)
Nobody knows who he was, with all certainty. Probably a man. A teacher of sorts. He almost certainly did say he was the son of God, in my view, but what he meant by this is unknown to us. I don't think we can know what Jesus said about the kingdom of God. Though I believe the critical readings of Nietzsche and people like Giordano Bruno were probably more more accurate than the traditional Church ones. Even then it must be taken into account the Gospels were not written by Jesus, (assuming traditional authorship, which is contested) two of them weren't written by people who knew Jesus and one of them wasn't even written by a guy who knew a guy who knew Jesus. In that there are already at least four (more like seven, really) points of failure.
>>24462190
Is this Nietzsche?

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24462411
>right, but foundationally destroyed with anything more than a cursory glance.
So. Is. Christianity: >>24462333 >>24462330 >>24462336 >>24462338 >>24462344

>"that's the thing. your evidence demands a time machine and video recorder. you wouldn't hold that same standard to anything else in history with far less documentation."

You're bait and switching with mythicism. I'm not a mythicist. There is sufficient evidence that Jesus existed. But what you say about no other historical event having multiple independent contemporaneous sources attesting to it isn't true.

>"this is neither of those. it's literal fact checking of what the quran says. it is literally at odds with what it says.

So is the Bible in many places, you just don't accept examples of contradictions.

>"if the gospels are true, the quran is false. joe smith has zero supporting evidence and again, is antithetical to the bible."

There's also zero supporting evidence for the resurrection or any miracles.

>"they both play the same game about scriptures being corrupted and THIS is the way to be, but we have the manuscripts that predate them."

Early versions of the Bible do not contain the Trinity, or Mary witnessing the risen Christ.

>"very obviously 11 frightened men disarmed guards "

If 11 men couldn't roll a stone away from a crypt entrance (a type of burial the crucified did not historically receive) then how was it sealed to begin with? There actually is an account of a guard who saw them stealing the body, which the authors had to get out ahead of with their own counter-narrative, here: >>24462336

>>24463880
You are wrong at literally everything you just typed

>>24461129
He literally said he was the Son of Man.

>>24464316
referring to the prophecy of Daniel where the Son of Man is a divine figure.

>>24462753
Jesus was Jewish. I do not mean this in a bad way its just a fact

>>24464316

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24462347
Based

>>24461128 (OP)
Jesus Christ is the central figure of Christianity, believed by Christians to be the Son of God, the Messiah (Savior), and God incarnate (God in human form).

>>24463913

No you're wrong, and brown as well

>>24465062
you are nigger

>>24465077

Behold the final form of the christcuck and his only real argument, insults

>>24462802

I am not above thinking some aspects of the official Gospels were twisted to suit the purposes of the early Christian Authors.

>>24461128 (OP)
>Who is Jesus Christ? Was he God, man, or both? Did Jesus really claim to be the Son of God? What did Jesus teach about the Kingdom of God?

he is the son of God

>>24465080
anything is better than being an atheist

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24464318
Divine != Son of God, and Son of God != God

>>24461128 (OP) If you want to know, read this: https://acim.org/acim/text/introduction/en/s/51?wid=toc&fwv=true

If not, then don't.

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24461128 (OP)
Some kike who said not to hurt kids. Whoooa thanks Shlomo couldn't have figured that out on my own.

>>24466418
you guys are so gay

>>24461128 (OP)
A first century jewish apocalyptic preacher who taught that the kingdom of God was coming, and that his followers should lay down their earthly attachments and prepare for this upheaval. He was executed and his followers believed he was resurrected. He soon was thought to have been anointed by God (made divine), then later believed to have been born divine, then later still to have been a divine being and part of a triune god since the beginning of time. Over time this became the world’s most important religion.

>>24461128 (OP)
>Who is Jesus Christ? Was he God, man, or both?
There are two Jesus Christ. One is a man who may or may not have existed in classical Roman Judea, and had developed somewhat of a following in his life time.

The other one is a fiction invented by his posthumous followers and canonised by the catholic church.

>>24461128 (OP)
>Was he God, man, or both?
>Did Jesus really claim to be the Son of God?
>What did Jesus teach about the Kingdom of God?
Yeah.

>>24467366
Why is /lit/ so full of fedoralard redditors who are completely historically illiterate?

>>24461128 (OP)
>Who is Jesus Christ?
Non-canon Sauline fandom self-insert Sonichu.

>>24461404
>Ironically if you take Rabbi Yeshua's words alone christianity takes on a very different aspect from the version widely taught and practiced
Wrong. Christians do what he instructed (Matthew 28:20)
>>24461478
>He taught about the kingdom of god only through parables and allegories that are up to interpretation, so you will never get an objective answer about this. It is a mystery that we'll only know after death.
Lmao filtered

>>24461128 (OP)

Are there any good books on the topic of the nature of Jesus? Specifically regarding the council of Nicaea or first council of Constantinople?

>>24461128 (OP)
Jesus was supposedly a zombie preacher from around 0 AD. He supposedly rose from the dead and performed a few magic tricks and said some basic niceties like "be kind to people."

>>24467891
>Are there any good books on the topic of the nature of Jesus? Specifically regarding the council of Nicaea or first council of Constantinople?

Nicaea and Its Legacy: An Approach to Fourth-Century Trinitarian Theology by Lewis Ayres

>>24461128 (OP)
He’s intriguing to say the least. He never claimed to be God, because according to christians, God is humble and became 100% human, which means that he isn’t God anymore, to show us the way to his kingdom, which is at hand within us. And the gap between the human and God is bridged with a loving sacrifice.

>>24467786
>Lmao filtered
The other anon did not anser me, so I'll repeat it: Name a single verse where he teaches about the kingdom of God without a parable.

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24468147
you are retard

>>24461128 (OP)
You’re seeking the truth? Today’s idiots are geniuses compared to the imbeciles roaming the earth during Jesus’ era. Lies and fabrications are all you’ll discover.

>>24469065
Wrong

>>24461128 (OP)
Jesus was the promised Messiah/Christ promised to Adam and Eve at the Fall, and later promised to Abraham later to bless all nations. He is the Son of Man given dominion over all nations and kingdoms in the Book of Daniel. He is the Mighty God, Wonderful Counselor, and Prince of Peace described in Isaiah. He was the God-Man. He assumed a human form, lived a human life, and was killed by His own people, and rose again in glory. He has opened up the way for us to receive the Holy Spirit and live the life of God within us by grace through faith.

Jesus is really the axis on which all history turns. Even the very calendar we use today is predicated on the birth of this man. The Scriptures said that all of the nations would come to worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob when the Christ came, and this is exactly what happened as Christianity spread out of Judea and into the Mediterranean, and later to the different continents. Everyone wants to appropriate Jesus Christ for their own ends. The Muslims say he was a prophet, the new-agers will say he was God-conscious, the Buddhists and Hindus will often try to claim that he was a proponent of the dhamma or Vedanta as well.

Jesus was the most influential man who ever lived, and the second most was surely His Mother.

>>24461135
>If only there were some kind of book you could read to get these answers.
1000 hours to read. retard

>>24461128 (OP) All your answers are here: https://acim.org/acim/text/introduction/en/s/51?wid=toc&fwv=true

>>24461128 (OP)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxDIeoVz7_8

>>24469339
>His Mother was the second most influential man who ever lived
Wow, that birth really was a miracle.

>>24468345
Stop posting this gay shit, you faggot.

>>24469601

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24469601
this is a Christian board, deal with it.

>>24469622
Based my brother in heaven

>>24469622
No it isn't. This is a literature board and you are an annoying spammer with no self awareness of how cringe and annoying he is with spamming and samefagging. Kys

>>24461128 (OP)

>>24470475
this is not your mom board you faggot kys and be done with it

Why are modern Christians all passive aggressive schizos?

>>24471313
jesus spoke to me today and said the rapture is coming soon, have fun being left behind sweetie

>>24471313

>>24469601
>>24465080
>>24465062
>>24462775

>>24471774
Topkek, why atheists are so deluulu