Deutsches Requiem is an underrated one

The Mandarin (it's not written by Borges tho)

>>24537228 (OP)
Borges is supreme among my pantheon and I assume genuflection and gobble him everyday. I love many of his stories and consider most of them genius. My favourite is still, and this was the first I of his that I read, On Exactitude in Science. I believe Borges was, in his previous life, the Comte de Saint Germain, and he knew it.
Has anyone read Borges in native Spanish? His work is full of impressive words that I can't help feel more translator's approximation than the author's intended.

>>24537308
>Has anyone read Borges in native Spanish?
He is pretty difficult to read but also satisfactory.

>Pensé en un mundo sin memoria, sin tiempo; consideré la posibilidad de un lenguaje que ignorara los sustantivos, un lenguaje de verbos impersonales y de indeclinables epítetos. Así fueron muriendo los días y con los días los años, pero algo parecido a la felicidad ocurrió una mañana. Llovió, con lentitud poderosa.

>>24537228 (OP)
Tlon

>>24537330
This is the meme answer but yeah, Tlon is pretty good. I like the idea of a fake monist world created from the machinations of some eccentric billionaire’s mind.

>they realize All is One and so copyright laws are abolished because everyone is the same man

Pic related

The Aleph is his most perfect, yet also his most contrived.

>>24537350
yeah i love that one. its hilarious how it turns from a silly anecdote into something barely comprehensible

>>24537228 (OP)
I like 'the other duel'. A lot of my enjoyment stems from the setting of the caudillo era. I find the parallel of the conflict between the two men and the conflict between the federalists and unitarians to be quite poignant.

>>24537228 (OP)
The Immortal, Tlon, Funes the memorious

I really love The Lottery in Babylon.

>>24537228 (OP)
also may I say The south is one of his most underrated ones? It's a great meta-ending to ficciones

And thinking about it, Three versions of Judas is a precursor to the concept of Preterition in Pynchon's GR

>>24537549
Three versions of Judas is literally that moral Orel episode where orel’s theater teacher gets him to play Judas in the school play because Judas’ betrayal is so necessary to Christ’s redemption

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vIWp0YslasE

>>24537319
A whole bunch of non sense. What a dense douche-cuck, sheesh..

>>24538221
>t. has never read The Immortal

>>24537344
Pretty based

>>24537228 (OP)
For me it's The Immortal. The Circular Ruins, Emma Zunz, and The Shape of the Sword really stuck with me as well. It's almost unreasonable how many great stories he wrote. When I think about how lackluster 21st century literature is I have to remind myself that geniuses lived not so long ago.

>>24537228 (OP)
the one where the guy gets out of hospital after being trapped for months that ends with him lunging in a knife fight. That end in media res. Perfect.

>>24539533
The South, I think. It underwhelmed me on my first reading but the ending is perfect--escaping into a less civilized, less sterile world was worth it to the protagonist, even though it destroyed him.

>>24539553
That ending changed my entire approach to writing and helped me develop my own style. Borge will always be one of my favourites though I have mostly moved past him.

>>24539553
I love how he describes the cat in this story and his impulse to pat it

>>24537308
>Has anyone read Borges in native Spanish?
His poetry is better in spanish but his narratives are actually much better in english. Seriously.

>>24539567
That figures. I'm not a poetryfag but I always feel like I'm missing something reading poetry in translation, even the Bible or Homer. Borges reading better in English follows from that clip of him on Buckley's show discussing English vs Spanish. That clip undid the despair I felt after suffering through a semester of "all language is heckin' made up!" slop masquerading as linguistics in college.

>>24539553
The fact that the guy is a second generation German librarian or something similar is what makes the story work. Like he's a pencil pushing dork imagining himself dying in a knife fight when the real ending he received is he hit his head on a doorway and bled to death and the story is his dying dream, how he'd love to have died as a caballero.

>>24537228 (OP)
Library of Babel.
It's a thought experiment that I haven't stopped thinking about.
I never left that library...

>>24540196
>we're all in the library btw
if you squint, you can see the spiral staircase in the corner of this thread

>>24540196
I find that one to be a bit weak and the message is very obvious- answers to life exist but you will never actually find them because there's too much useless crap in the way.

>>24540205
It's a rephrasing of the Absurdity question, but that's always begged the question that Meaning exists in the first place; it's just that we're too unwise to understand it.
How do we get wise to understand meaning? Rejecting it is unwise. And it should be hard since for some reason, metaphysically, meaning is obfuscated in this world to us.
Theologically this all makes sense (The Fall), but Philosophy without Theology doesn't make sense to begin with (we didn't make this place or ourselves, so we should stop pretending we men is the sole gods here).
The solution that would make Borges happy is to make new books by making sense of the gibberish ones.
Decipher meaning.
Use your mind/body/soul to decrypt the gibberish of existence.
Make new stories.
Start with the one how you become a saint in this life and transcend your fallen nature: explain the unexplainable gibberish to everyone.
Make sense of it.

>>24540205
It's a rephrasing of the Absurdity question, but that's always begged the question that Meaning exists in the first place; it's just that we're too unwise to understand it.
How do we get wise to understand meaning? Rejecting it is unwise. And it should be hard since for some reason, metaphysically, meaning is obfuscated in this world to us.
Theologically this all makes sense (The Fall), but Philosophy without Theology doesn't make sense to begin with (we didn't make this place or ourselves, so we should stop pretending we men are the sole gods here).
The solution that would make Borges happy is to make new books by making sense of the gibberish ones.
Decipher meaning.
Use your mind/body/soul to decrypt the gibberish of existence.
Make new stories.
Start with the one how you become a saint in this life and transcend your fallen nature: explain the unexplainable gibberish to everyone.
Make sense of it.

>>24540201

>>24540220
I like that it implies any of the books can have the true meaning because language can be interpreted in any way. The book with only the letter A in it can be interpreted as clearly as the book containing Shakespeare if you know how to read it and what to look for. It pushes the boundaries of language and thought.

>>24540232
That's one of the scariest/most profound thoughts I came across when thinking about the Library as well: what if we just didn't discover the language yet?
Gives me a lot of hope.
You can see it in Borges too as he looks as Language on a Meta level as a deciphering tool to decrypt meaning. Maybe we can do better than English or any other language that currently exists?
Perhaps we can eventually get to Tongues?

>>24540232
>>24540249
Also if you can make sense of all the books i.e. you know the code/language, then that also makes you the Uberman.
And an Uberman is only uber if he can make others like Him. Otherwise, he's a charlatan; a petty & small god.
Goodhood is memetic.

>>24540249
>Maybe we can do better than English or any other language that currently exists?
>Goodhood is memetic.
perhaps this new language is meme-like?
who knows
¯\_(ツ)∩

>>24540257
Memes are a language so long as they are symbols and communicate something. In the Library of Babel, there are books of Doge, advice dinosaur and all of the rest.

>>24540258
I wouldn't confuse insurmountable with impossibility.
The former is possible though seems like the latter.
I think it's possible to heuristically catalogue the Library of Babel. At least the presupposition of that is possible; like you could find a technique that describes the ordering of where the books are and why; a dewey decimal system for the Library of Babel.
it's possible.
difficult.
worthwhile.

>>24540258
I wouldn't confuse insurmountability with impossibility.
The former is possible though seems like the latter.
I believe it's possible to heuristically catalogue the Library of Babel. At least the presupposition of that is possible; like you could find a technique that describes the ordering of where the books are and why; a Dewey Decimal System for the Library of Babel.
it's possible.
difficult.
worthwhile.

>>24540249
Its called german

>>24540291
It's phonetically hideous.
Pretty much every other language in Europe refers to the german language as barbarian in their own tongue; they were one of the last European groups to be civilized. Most have a etymologically derivative for Germans that means "doesn't make sense" or the like, like the word "Nemachka" for Germany. They have a savage & humble origin.
otherwise it's great for compound linguistic construction and you can get some real interesting & complex new concepts/neologism out of it (e.g. "schadenfreude" or "fahrvergnugen"), but it's not elegant or poetic.
The Germanic Opera never really expanded beyond Wagner.

>>24540305
>They have a savage & humble origin.
it's why hitler paid smart clever people with lots of reichsmarks to fabricate a new mythology & metaphysic for the germanic people. that whole teutonic and hyperborean crap and the rest.
their origin story is embarrassing for such ambitions they have and how they saw themselves in the modern world; as shapers of history (well ephemerally).
I don't hate the germans, but I don't think they're that special either.
just another pretender thinking their gods or some shit (ontological hubris/hamartia)

>>24540305
>They have a savage & humble origin.
it's why hitler paid smart clever people with lots of reichsmarks to fabricate a new mythology & metaphysic for the germanic people. that whole teutonic and hyperborean crap and the rest.
their origin story is embarrassing for such ambitions they have and how they saw themselves in the modern world; as shapers of history (well ephemerally).
I don't hate the germans, but I don't think they're that special either.
just another pretender thinking they're gods or some shit (ontological hubris/hamartia)

>>24540305
>>Pretty much every other language in Europe refers to the german language as barbarian in their own tongue;

I like the Polish one- Niemitz. Literally "dumb" but dumb as in can not speak - because Germans cant speak Slavic like every other group in that region.

>>24540313
>just another pretender thinking they're gods or some shit (ontological hubris/hamartia)
『"Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first make mad" 』

>>24540321
same shit's gonna happen with the jews.
no one wants to speak hebrew btw.

>>24540315
they are missing a lot of phonemes.

>>24540253
This reminds me of The writing of the God, with the guy trying to decipher the patterns on the jaguar

>>24540249
>>24540257

Terence McKenna talked about this, with the notion of information condensed as visible matter, akin to a sculpture, but far more precise, being the perfect logos.

>>24540305
>It's phonetically hideous.
Low IQ angloid opinion, follow by lengthy cope.

>>24540249
He regretted saying that btw.

>He talks about a North American translation of his stories, published by New Directions:
>“By the law of least effort, the translator always translates the Spanish word with the most similar English word. If I say habitación, he translates habitation instead of room. The result is a very strange style and a language that is barely English. I once said that one advantage of English is that it is a language half Anglo-Saxon, half Latin. Now I’m being punished for that phrase. It would seem that, rather than an advantage, it’s a danger, a calamity.”
(From the Bioy Casares Borges diaries)

He also said:

>BORGES: “Spanish has a greater purity of sounds than other languages.
>It is free of the ü of French, of the excess of consonants in English.
>It’s an excellent language; I only observe that it hasn’t produced as many good writers as French or English.”

>>24537228 (OP)
The Zahir is my favorite one. The Writing of the God and The House of Asterion are very underrated imo, pure magic for me

>>24540686
>; I only observe that it hasn’t produced as many good writers as French or English.”
This seems true, sadly. The Godlen Age is great but since then Borges and what else? None of the other latin american boom authors are that great

A Weary Man's Utopia always gets overlooked. Of all the fiction about WW2 Germany, Borges rendered the most subtle and fascinating criticism in this story.

>>24540745
>None of the other latin american boom authors are that great
Actually I would consider some of them better than Borges. He's massively overrated. Nabokov was right when he said his work was like a portico with no house.

>>24540745
Borges is not a boom author btw

>>24537308
>his previous life, the Comte de Saint Germain
how many niggas will continue to steal his drip

>>24540926
Of course not, doesn't stop him being lumped into that group by fat greasy Mexicans and little matchstick Peruvians

>>24540646
>Terence McKenna
>perfect logos
Man Western Christianity is lost.
You people have no idea what "Logos" even means.
As wealthy as the West materially is, it's spiritually bankrupt and it shows. What was basic Christian knowledge in the Empire is now considered esoteric. That Faust tale was right, you people did sell your souls for a rocket ship to the wrong "heavens".

>>24540686
ironic that his post-regret justification doesn't match to the level of argumentation as his pre-regret argument.
perhaps it was a coerced retraction because of his metapolitical standing as an intellectual in the Latin world...
That makes more sense to me than for someone to renege of 2+2=4 for 5.

>>24537228 (OP)
I ain't gonna read any beaner "literature". No thanks.

>>24541031
Looks like you're the same as those you dislike, then.

>>24541095
Am I really yeah? Post your adress you fucking cretin, and I'll do the same

>>24541062
>ain't gonna
As if you're in any way more cultured than Hispanic writers like Borges. Pearls before swine.

>>24541041
It was from a casual conversation with his buddy, not from some serious environment. But chances are he was double faced and tailored what he said depending on the crowd.

>>24541122
I'd take it a step further and say that English is obsolete and should make way for an even better (not esperanto, that's gay. something organic like how memes naturally developed and can't be faked since it instantly comes off as inauthentic (it's like a shibboleth)).

>>24541273
Language limits the potential thought.
It's a schema for how we relate the external world internally to ourselves.

>>24541282
English at least proved to be a true Global Language/lingua franca; the British were able to maintain a world empire with it for awhile.
But it's time to think bigger perhaps? Or we can retool it; English is great at absorbing languages and loan words from Latin, Germanic, Greek, etc.
the whole etymology of our lexicon is mostly of non-English origins. even the world etymology is made up of french, latin and greek.

>>24541039
>you people this you people that fucking hylics baka look at how superior I am with my REAL hidden wisdom

basic Christian "knowledge" being esoteric now is a moot point, all ideas have been common place in atleast one group of individuals at one point in time, the point is, if we are to borrow their concepts, to process them in our ways and unify them with other concepts to produce yet new philosophy. grow up and contribute meaningfully instead of posting "faust talking to a jew.jpg" from your 2 gb reaction image folder

>>24537228 (OP)
Tlön Uqbar, The Theologians or The Zahir are the best for me

>>24540196
>>24540258
I like to think that somewhere in that library is a book with a huge ascii drawing of my penis

>>24542548
it's not moot; that's like saying losing 2+2=4 is "moot" or visible light is superficial to our blindness.
common knowledge of Truths should be the norm.

>>24542716
There is.
Now imagine that every other book is some other form of ASCII that no one has connected the dots on yet (like constellations).

I have been putting Borges off and feel bad because i'm a spicanon capable of reading him without translation.
Should I just jump into his work? Is him being difficult to understand just a /lit/ meme?

>>24543080
well i agree in that "its better to know things than not know them" but i dont see why le downfall of western christianity is my problem. if christcucks dont know of some theological concept widespread in the 5th century, that's their problem and reflects nothing on philosophy as a larger area. furthermore, christians have no monopoly on the concept of a more evolved language, perhaps even a language made incarnate. arguably its not even that relevant to christianity (as religion, not as pseud theology) since no christians since the death of jesus have seen the Word-Made-Flesh, but have only heard about him through human words

>>24543194
>Should I just jump into his work? Is him being difficult to understand just a /lit/ meme?
he is not at all difficult to understand in terms of prose, perhaps only in ideas. for an example
>Yo vi una Rueda altísima, que no estaba delante de mis ojos, ni detrás, ni a los lados, sino en todas partes, a un tiempo. Esa Rueda estaba hecha de agua, pero también de fuego, y era (aunque se veía el borde) infinita.
is not difficult linguistically, but understanding what it means within the story and how it relates to mysticism more broadly might be difficult for some people. overall he is very accessible, i prefer the website literaturapuntous for his works

>>24543194
You ain't missing anything. If you look the definition of "PRETENTIOUS IGNORANCE" in an academic dictionary there should be a picture of this Beaner Borges. Latin americans try to mend up their lack of history, culture and knowledge about anything in general, with semantic stunts. So this "Jose" Borges just spends more time looking for the most obscure and weird words in the spanish language, to write the most boring stuff in the most retorted way possible. He just try to imitate classic greek prose, wich is stupid for a person without much to tell. "Juan" Borges doesn't have a big body of work, on the contrary his work is scarce, that's a known thing. Maybe he was lazy, but my believe is that more than anything, he wasn't much of a creator or a man of ideas. Writing was a chore for him.
I would prefer to read the Quixote a third time before wasting my time with "Pedro" Borges.

>>24543284
I can tell you got filtered because he doesn't use obscure words in Spanish lol

>>24543284
this reads like a trump post