Thread 24544309

"Doing the wrong things for the right reason" edition

Previous >>24539550

>What is Web Novel General?
A general for readers and authors involved or interested in the growing phenomenon of 'web novels', serialized English fiction posted to websites such as: Royalroad, Webnovel, Scribblehub, Wattpad, Archive of Our Own, Spacebattles, HFY, various personal author websites, and more

>Why read web novels?
Not for prose or tight editing or deep themes, frankly. As a whole, web novels are infamous for content sprawl and pacing issues. If you enjoy having millions of words to sink your teeth into to get to know the world and characters, though, you may be interested. Keeping up with other readers on a weekly basis to discuss the story's events unfolding is another perk, in the same way discussing an ongoing TV show might be.

>Why write web novels?
Ease of access & potential for Patreon earnings. Many successful authors gain an audience on their website of choice and funnel their readers into a Patreon. See https://graphtreon.com/top-patreon-creators/writing for an idea of what some are earning.
Also, once an author has earned a fanbase, transitioning into an Amazon self-publishing career is several orders of magnitude easier than starting 'dry'.

> Advice for Noobs!

Running your story like the business it is:
https://www.royalroad.com/forums/thread/116847

On writing webserials:
https://alexanderwales.com/how-to-write-a-web-serial/

Sanderson's Writing lectures 2025:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MEUh_y1IFZY&list=PLSH_xM-KC3ZvzkfVo_Dls0B5GiE2oMcLY [Embed] [Open] [Embed] [Embed]

Literary Magazine list
https://pastebin.com/E4MbabAZ

What should I read next? Please shill me something.

>>24544324
I wish I could, but people here hate when I shill my story.

>>24544324
I'm reading Wander West in Shadow right now
it's good. I'm still early but im quite enjoying it
more trad fantasy then typical webslop but more inspired than tradslop

>>24544330
Why let that stop you?

I just woke up. What a wonderful day to continue my autistic crusade on creating a list of these retards doing ai generated review swapping so I can make sure to never read their novels. I would include normal swapping but there's far too many of them.

>>24544324
>I’m an Infinite Regressor, But I’ve Got Stories to Tell

Futa MC
Harem of cute girls
Good writing
No awful fetish shit

Does it exist?

>>24544342
>Futa MC
>No awful fetish shit
?

>>24544342
>Futa MC
>No awful fetish shit

>>24544337
Man, should hire your autism to expose the cabal that runs rising stars. I fucking hate the discord cults and their shitty mentor programs.

>>24544342
Only one I can think of is Ascension of the Sylvan Cosmos. I wouldn't call it 'good writing' but it's better than most of the futa smutty stuff.

>>24544337
Shouldn't this be against the rules of Israeli courts?

>>24544342
This is called dungeons and dalliances by winterwhereof, you can find on scribblehub.

But also.

I'm also ashamed of shilling my own shit, it's very much a slow burn but the stuff you typed out, is my goal for a story. It's Hearts spells & Passion.
Granted the first "harem" members I intend to introduce around chapter 35. I like to write big big prologues.

>https://www.scribblehub.com/series/1491282/hearts-spells--passion-lewd-slice-of-life-progression-fantasy/

>>24544361
Why the fuck would you start your story during the most boring point? My futa smut shit had a bj scene by chapter 2, and it wasn't written like shit either.

For writers on Royal Road, the vibrant and engaged community stands as a testament to their dedication and talent, fostering a direct connection with readers that traditional publishing often lacks. This unique platform allows for immediate feedback, iterative improvement, and the cultivation of a loyal following eager to witness stories unfold in real-time. Detractors who dismiss or criticize this burgeoning ecosystem often overlook the profound sense of connection and communal growth that defines Royal Road, perhaps out of a bitterness born from their own inability to cultivate such a dedicated and supportive readership. The success stories emerging from Royal Road are not just about popular novels, but about the profound relationship between creators and consumers, a dynamic many established authors and critics can only envy.

>>24544364
I'm trying to do a slow dance, if you make the reader cum on chapter 1, they won't read any further. Also, my first sex scene is on chapter 5/6

>>24544370
>It was like the cold has started literally fucking her.

Nice tense mix up.

Thinking about writing an isekai. Squirrel gets smashed by nut-kun. Reincarnates as an american and nuts all over the place.

>>24544337
based
keep fighting the good fight
fuck monopolies, fuck gatekeeping barons, fuck all in groups. webnovels are supposed to be a place to escape all that shit

Is there a market for horror webnovels?

>>24544417
Stephen King wrote 2000 words a day; he's basically a slop gong farmer

I’m still new to litrpg and my first chapter was like a magical girl info dumping to set the stage

I deleted it and im going to just do no real world building next try. Like defiance of the fall, which is just some retard doing shit on his own for 50 chapters (as far as I got)

>>24544453
I've dropped more stories to info dumping than I have to sloppy writing
info dumps are repugnant. you've probably made the right call to rewrite

>>24544350
>>24544383
I humbly request for any ai-ism's you anons are aware of. I am trying to accumulate more power.

>>24544458
Thanks, i figured. I’m just not experienced enough to manage breakneck pace while also giving the slop enjoyer what they want

I think ill plan around info dumping (a bit at a time) like a dozen chapters in once they give a shit. Or not at all if it’s just working— which ive seen in other popular series

>>24544461
I’d prefer not to help people avoid the tells

>>24544461
If you use an unusual word like twice in 20 chapters I will notice. Obviously not ‘blue’, but unintentional repetition is very distracting

>>24544469
You're right. I don't want to help them. It would be a shame if they caught on before I can make a list of hundreds of them.

>>24544324
I hope Years of the Apocalypse becomes the next big thing.

>>24544337
Saved, definitely going to avoid these guys and anyone they interact with going forward.

>>24544472
I absolutely agree. Many of these 'tells' mean nothing by themselves. When a review exhibits many of them though it becomes obvious.

>>24544337
post the spreadsheet once you feel finished with it
I want to download and preserve it

>>24544309 (OP)
What is the Worm of litrpgs?

>>24544517
Primal Hunter? Or Dungeon Crawler Carl?

I tried reading worm but the protagonist was a rat, and the author doesn’t properly acknowledge it; but genuinely writes kt as justified. There were a lot of weird little things like that.

>>24544539
anon... she's a worm....

>>24544548
Heh

>>24544539
I tried reading The Wandering Inn but the inn doesn't actually wander. Instead people wander INNto it. Unbelievably disappointing.

>>24544539
Anon, she's an unreliable protagonist. Most of the things she did weren't justified. Or do you mean that time she wanted to sell her friends out to the police? She doesn't actually do that btw

>>24544342
to my great displeasure like half of the smutslop on scribblehub is futa mc

Any interesting capeshit?

>>24544417
has any author outside of china beaten pirateaba in slop volume per day/week?

>>24544620
No but you can reread worm

>>24544620
I liked super minion
>abandoned because the author's life spiraled out
ah well... there's... no not really

>>24544647
>>abandoned because the author's life spiraled out
Now that's reliable

>>24544620
Uhhhh I finished Perfect Run? Bonus points for it actually having an ending.

>>24544627
nta but pirates slop is probably my favorite. say what you will but some of the arcs actually made me cry. like the flower girl in esthelm. i cant think of anyone who comes close though. at most i see people push 5-8k words.

>>24544548
Would you love me if I was a worm?
How has that not been the premise for a reincarnation isekai novel yet?

>>24544324
Strange Beast City https://www.wa01.com/novel/pagea/yishoumicheng-pengpai_1022.html
異獸迷城

Hidden gem.

>>24544324
Strange Beast City
https://www.ttkan.co/novel/chapters/yishoumicheng-pengpai
異獸迷城

Hidden gem.

>>24544339
This is also good.

>>24544710
Uh, in English, four-eyes?

>>24544722
Google has a built-in auto translate feature, kiddo.

>>24544726
I may be in the slop thread but my standards for sentence quality and writing coherence aren't THAT low. yet

>>24540200
The first one is stylistically incorrect and only done by amateur writers.

Dialog tags are only meant to convey who is talking, not what the talker is doing. If you want to be very strict, dialog tags shouldnt even convey how the talker is speaking. Incredibly lengthy dialog tags packed full of description or action is like using the word 'drole' non-sarcastically to mean 'boring,' or like pronouncing 'forte' as 'not my forté.' It is incorrect.

>>24544736
>The first one is stylistically incorrect and only done by amateur writers.
I read mistborn by #1 mormon fantasy author of all time branderson and he did the "'dialogue line' she said, verbing adjectively" thing like 3x per page

>>24544743
Thank you for proving my point. It's not even difficult to fix.
>"Hurp dee derp," Potatoman said, brandishing his sword and raising it high above so all could see.
>"Hurp dee derp." Potatoman brandished his sword and raised it...
Takes literally no effort and it makes prose tighter than a snare drum.

>>24544756
Yeah I wasn't disagreeing. That particular construct was pretty jarring with how frequent it was.

>>24544736
action tags are often overused and incoherently mixed with dialogue tags but they aren't wrong

>>24544342
>Haremslop
Kys
Also yes, there are a multitude of novels like that, but I won't be telling you the names.

Actually came up with an Isekai story I want to write. I'm going full slop, you can't stop me now.

>>24544795
>he found his spark
burn deep into the mother friggin night brother

>>24544620
My story.

>>24544814
yuri smut levels?

>>24544820
Zero.

>>24544620
Worm, Perfect Run, Super Supportive, Broker

>>24544767
it is incorrect, because they are called "dialog tags," not "do whatever the fuck you want tags."

>>24544828
Broker panders too much. Fucking everyone is some manner of faggot (other than my boy Kingshark and his weaboo maid gf).

>>24544475
I enjoyed yota but it's not big next thing material. it's good, bordering on great, but definitely not peak
then again i think the same for MOL and that's sort of a 'big thing'. desu i think MOL just has early mover advantage though, it's og as fuck

>>24544517
like >>24544520 said, DCC. DCC has mainstream appeal like Worm does, primal hunter is only for litrpg enthusiasts
>>24544539
Wildbow has gone on record saying his audience is retarded and one of his goals was to write an unreliable narrator who increasingly justifies her actions when they're clearly unacceptable, but nobody picked up on it. you are why media literacy is dead

>>24544872
I didnt get that far, i asked others; specifically asking about unreliable narrator which i almost said explicitly in my first post— seems you didnt catch that, retard

And he was probably coping anyway

>>24544848
>my argument is that they're named dialog tags
>no I don't have any actual argument
Almost all published authors will do that shit in their book with varying frequency, saying it's stylistically incorrect is pure autism, anon

>>24544877
I picked up a work of classic literature I was reading and looked for an example to prove myself wrong and couldn't find one. Maybe this is common for 21st century slop but not among Oxford World's Classics.

Wuxia where MC is named Hero Bejing and the main antagonist is named troublemaker tawan

>>24544876
>asking about unreliable narrator which i almost said explicitly in my first post

>the protagonist was a rat, and the author doesn’t properly acknowledge it; but genuinely writes kt as justified

ah yes this definitely seems like you acknowledged how the protagonist is an unreliable narrator. you totally didn't say "why is the author writing this as if he actually believes it", the exact opposite of an unreliable narrator, which is where the author is clearly in on how the protagonist's perspective is skewed

>>24544342
>>24544361
Author of D&D also has another story with the same basic idea, This Ascent to Divinity is Lewder Than Expected.

Also consider reading Rebirth of the Nephilim, I've been really enjoying it. Also on Scribblehub.

Adding yours to my list

>>24544878
I went and opened Great Gatsby and found a
>," he said, verbing
immediately
then went and checked Great Expectations
and found the same construction

I bet even whatever novel you checked has it. Give me the title

>>24544884
I said that retard. Ie doesnt acknowledge it. Ie doesn't overtly hint at it. Ie in Typical literary device fashion
Do you understand?

He was just trying to save face

>>24544901
.....you think when authors write flawed characters they should broadcast it so obviously that everyone immediately knows the author doesn't condone their actions? Fucking christ

Any questionable thought process or tonal shifts are just unreliable narration bros

>>24544901
YOU are trying to save face
nobody believes that when you said
>the author doesn’t properly acknowledge it; but genuinely writes kt as justified
you thought it was a well executed literary device. you were projecting the perspective of the author, not interpreting the actual intent
you are so stupid

>>24544904
I’m reading gene wolfe and it was obvious in the first chapters. I think this dweeb was reachinf in hindsight

>>24544910
Im talking about the author not the character. Ironically doing what you’re accusing me of

>>24544906
An unreliable narrator is an unreliable nigger, only do it if you want the reader to knowingly hate him and make promising use of this artifice.

He didn’t execute it correctly. Not my problem

He didn't read it correctly. Not my problem

>>24544916
holy shit you are illiterate
yes, you're talking about the author not the character. literally what I said and what you're being criticized for

>>24544863
You must be extremely sensitive if a few sentences every other chapter at most counts to you as pandering. A romance story it is not.

>>24544620
Wish upon the Stars

>>24544924
IT MUST BE SIGNALED
Authrial intent, big hoss
Drop me a proper example before act 5’pr whatever and i concede

>>24544933
it was signaled to me
she's an ego centric loser worm who copes by moralizing. it drives her entire character
it's not like it's some high brow art piece. none of this is obfuscated in complex conceit or dense language, it's right there in all the character's actions

>>24544946
I can’t remember the specifics but it came across in a way that had me questioning the author over the character. But ill take your word for it.

>>24544933
It doesn't need to be signaled and it shouldn't be either. Authors should write flawed characters consistent with their own thought processes. That their thought processes deviate from the norm is simply observed.
She isn't unreliable in the sense she's delusional or psychotic. She's unreliable because she will justify her actions to ridiculous degrees, is hypocritical, etc, and it's easy to see that as an outside observer. And it's not something that can be signaled without breaking the first-person perspective, without making her seem psychotic
You are genuinely the worst sort of reader, not only can't you read a flawed character without dropping the book because of moral outrage, you give the genuinely horrible advice to the author to "make it more obvious"

>>24544930
NTA, but every other chapter is too much for me too, but I never read Broker tbf.

>>24544959
>shouldnt be signalled
Brother… Just do your homework, and use your own discretion. I cant do this while phone postinf

Crazy how this esl can drop a 750 word review with academic English within 3 minutes of finishing another review. Someone asked if anyone can outdo pirateaba and I think this is our winner. With this speed they can easily output 15k words an hour. Not just skillful, but impressive!

>>24544930
It's that EVERYONE is a faggot. When >50% of your cast is a homosexual you're just going for internet good boy points. And good thing it isn't a romance because the protagonist is an outrageously annoying faggot playboy character in the limited flirting/romance we do see, which got old extremely fast.

>>24544997
is there a thematic reason for it

>>24544998
Villain put chemicals in the water that turned the heroes gay.
>Hits crack pipe

>>24544959
>And it's not something that can be signaled without breaking the first-person perspective, without making her seem psychotic
I dropped Worm after like 25 chapters because the protagonist genuinely came across as psychotic and everything about her screamed "Insane BPDemon who needs to be put down for the good of everyone".

>>24545001
>everything about her screamed "Insane BPDemon who needs to be put down for the good of everyone"
need more protagonists like this

>>24545004
I can recommend REND, it's about a insane psychopath who needs to be put down for the good of everyone.

>>24544872
>and one of his goals was to write an unreliable narrator who increasingly justifies her actions when they're clearly unacceptable, but nobody picked up on it
All readerships are this stupid. It's just normal. You can't do things like that and expect them to get picked up on. I EXPLICITLY STATED that (not exactly but something similar) I was doing that with my novel and I still got comments asking wtf was going on.

I won't be doing that in future stories. It will be simple third person omniscient narration from here on out for me.

>>24545007
based recommender
I'll check it out thanks

>>24545004
>>24545001
>>24545007
Not webstuff but ‘beyond redemption’. Every character is insane, evil, slime; but the author understands the flaws (and is very intentional with what theyre doing) so you can enjoy them anyway

...editors? am I stupid? I've never seen this before
you can credit an editor?

>>24545023
yes, you can also credit artists.

This capeshit series is basically the opposite of Worm in every way.

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/84799/archetype-slowburn-superhero-progression

>>24544309 (OP)
>Literary Magazine list
>https://pastebin.com/E4MbabAZ
Why is this in the OP? Yes, magazines are often online, but so is amazon KDP self publishing, which obviously isn't on topic. This thread is for web novels, which means long form and serialized

>>24545092
The wordsmith became a baker put it there and it stuck, that's all

>>24545092
resident schizo who frequents here and /wg copy and pastes his stupid list every once in awhile, guess he rushed a bake to sneak his shit in
he did the same thing to /wg/

>>24544997
Everyone? iirc you have the MC, who if anything it's a joke that she flirts with every cute/hot girl, and two incidental male side characters are a couple. But that's it, I can't remember anyone else except for her (dead) ex-wife of course.

>>24544997
>When >50% of your cast is a homosexual you're just going for internet good boy points.
Or they may just be a yaoi/yurifag

>>24543831
>Are you the space mecha anon? A fellow SS chad?
that anon wasn't me originally but you had my attention now—and I gotta say, wow man, you made a real killer story. Not gonna lie I teared up a little. Great work. A few very minor punctuation errors but absolutely solid, you nailed it. This is the sort of quality standard people should strive for.

https://www.royalroad.com/profile/680230/reviews

Look at the time between the reviews.

>>24545209
Do you spend more time searching for bot reviews than writing?

>>24545222
he's on a holy mission leave him alone

>>24545222
Nah, I only realized it last night. I've got over a hundred or so review swappers logged in my autism blacklist though. I am collecting them. I get small bursts of dopamine when I find one. I have read so many ai generated reviews that I no longer can comprehend real human writing. My mind is a sugar cube dissolving in an ocean of indonesian review swappers. help me please

>>24545240
>that I no longer can comprehend real human writing.

>>24545240
Fucking hell I can't handle this one, screenshotted this for posterity.
>>24545193
Thanks, your work is on my read list but I still haven't got around as I'm busy reading another anon's work, but I'll fav and rate it once I get around to!

>>24545240
You WILL share the spreadsheet later, right...?

>>24545305
I VVILL share it. Let me just get a couple hundred more of these fellers.

>>24545209
>less than a minute
they really don't have any systems to detect this?

>>24545255
don't sweat it, compared to your quality my writing is subpar and even rereading mine now it's lackluster. I still struggle with how I'm going to write it's sequel as I delve deeper into its outline.

>>24544872
>>24545010
even outside of webslop the average reader is completely retarded
look at lolita, the most famous unreliable narrator book of all time, somehow getting multiple hollywood adaptations by pedophile directors who don't realize humbert isn't the good guy

>>24545240
>I have read so many ai generated reviews that I no longer can comprehend real human writing.
now is the perfect moment to immerse yourself in mtl'd chinese kino and appreciate the greatest plots and worldbuilding known to slopkind

>>24545335
If you watched the film adaptations and honestly think the directors made Humbert the good guy you are a fucking idiot.

>>24544337
Stay zased.

>>24545240
this is truly a lovecraftian experience

originally I had wanted to finish the story by the end of august. Not sure if I can still do that after productivity dropped these last few weeks. Hopefully I finish by october and spend november and december finishing the script for a porn game I was contracted to write. Next year I plan to work on my sci-fi story. I originally wrote it in 2008 but I've been slowly retooling it and writing a few chapters here and there. I want to try a proper RR launch with flooding chapters and having multiple weeks of backlog. Might even try to monetize it.
also, new art.

What is the serial experiments LAIN of webnovels?

originally I had wanted to finish the story by the end of august. Not sure if I can still do that after productivity dropped these last few weeks. Hopefully I finish by october and spend november and december finishing the script for a porn game I was contracted to write. Next year I plan to work on my sci-fi story. I originally wrote it in 2008 but I've been slowly retooling it and writing a few chapters here and there. I want to try a proper RR launch with flooding chapters and having multiple weeks of backlog. Might even try to monetize it.
also, new art.

>>24544309 (OP)
Is "Show, Don't Tell" the most misunderstood advice?
It's a screenplay advice, but retards apply it to novels like it's the law of god.
The audio-visual medium allows for showing things like putting things in the background.

Instead of telling:
>Bertha was fat.
You can show by saying:
>When it came to matters of weight, John had met few women like Bertha. Those poor chairs that had the displeasure of making contact with Bertha's rear wouldn't live to tell the tale.

One directly says she was fat, while the other strongly implies it. But they are the same thing, and the latter doesn't really add anything.

>>24545240
I have the sudden urge to watch Blade Runner.

>>24545447
my favorite was frank herbet by the time of chapterhouse being lazy and describe miles teg's mom as someone who looked the part of being obese. Or maybe it was in Heretics, boy did Frank had some interesting lazy writing by heretics and chapterhouse. Later in chapterhouse when they're on junction there's like a whole half page where they come across a old woman sitting in the hallway and Frank is describing her expression like a fortified castle. what a wack ass guy. taken so soon... i miss him everyday...

If chairs had voices they would be wailing with screams of the damned as they felt the beast approach. Wooden floorboards creaked and popped as Bertha shuffled into the room. Her eyes scanned around, looking for her next victim. Target located. Bertha casually walked towards her chosen chair. The floorboards looked up with terror. Massive legs the size of tree trunks swung overhead. As if they were in a morbid game of battleship they silently prayed those legs would land upon another.

CRACK. POP.

Joe, a log hewn three centuries ago by an master woodworker using an ancient cedar was the first to fall, his grains splitting apart and shattering into dust under her heft.

Many more fell in quick succession as she waddled across the room. At last, she had arrived. She turned around slowly, displacing a massive amount in the process. The small gust blew several scrolls of the desk. Slowly she squatted down onto the chair with her full mass and-

Like atlas the chair held up the world. With every shift of her weight it creaked out with a cry for mercy. Mercy would not be had.

BUUUUURP. SCRATCH SCRATCH.

I don't know why I'm still writing this. You get the idea.

>Brothers Karamazov by Dostoevsky is 364,153 words
Have you written more than Dostoevsky?

>>24545533
yes actually

>>24545565
Then why don't people read you with the same fervour?

>>24545092
I didn't remove it, yet, because I wanted to see the consensus. I'm in favor of booting it next time, but that's only if someone sensible makes the next general.

>>24545092
>>24545095
>>24545571
Unpublished, bitter cretins.

>>24545569
It had 100k views but ultimately I was incredibly amateurish since I wasn't as well-read back then. It had about 170 followers and 80ish favorites before i dropped it for good.

>>24545581
Kek. Read moar.

>>24545584
In the process of it

>>24545586
If you read fantasy, get into Malazan.
If you read crime, get into Dashiell Hammett.
If you read science fiction, get into Cixin Liu.

>>24545588
Planning on Odyssy after I finish Iliad, then Rendezvous with Rama followed by Stranger in a Strange Land uncut. haven't decided much past that but may delve into War and Peace. I'll see when I get there. Was eyeballing Thrawn trilogy too but I want to finish whats on my plate still since that's pretty far off. Maybe Shogun.

boxing webnovels, do they exist?

>>24545601
War and Peace is a masterpiece and universities try to downplay how beautiful it is because literary studies hate realism.

>>24544872
Taylor did nothing wrong.

>>24544190
>it's real
What the fuck, what the fuck, I never even knew, they're everywhere, I'm nuking my account today

>>24545580
Boring, uninspired wannabe.

>>24544872
> one of his goals was to write an unreliable narrator
If that's true then I think he failed. I can't think of a single case where her narration was unreliable. He did succeed at making some of her actions flawed because ... you know ... she's a tunnel visioned teenager.

IS OUT!

>>24545763
he's literally me

>>24545775
And you don't know his backstory yet. I'm expecting Gigachad edits on TikTok after the final chapter.

>>24545784
Cringe

>>24545686
Just publish via Amazon

>>24545921
>Free ads
>Cringe
I've heard that BookTok can single-handedly carry a series to global success. Why not, bro?

>>24545926
I don't live for clicks and money. Writing is an artform. And, no, I'm not a beatnik hipster who believes in bohemianism. My favourite novels were slop serials in their day. I just want to make a serial of my own that isn't merely fan service for social media clicks.

>>24545930
Honorable, I respect that. However, the fear of an everlasting wagie-life is strong too, bro.

>>24545432
I like that art a lot. Not only do I have a fetish for elves, and dark skinned women with white hair, but the odd shape of the sword makes me go "Huh, what's up with that?". Might I read the first ~100 words of your story here to decide if it's actually interesting or not?

Are all ML translated web novels this bad?

>>24545953
Pretty much. Normal Chink <-> English translation is very hard but then add on all the xanxia/wuxia terms and poetic phrases and ML just can't cope.

>>24545960
Are there any web novels with actually good prose?

>>24545964
None that have been MTL.

>>24545970
I would read any web novel if they weren't all so poorly wrought. Can you send me one in English that is any good?

>>24545973
Huh? There are plenty of english webnovels - that's what this general mostly covers. If you want a good (human) translated chinese webnovel then your best bet is probably Lord of the Mysteries.

>>24545977
>There are plenty of english webnovels - that's what this general mostly covers
Show me one that is well written.

>>24545982
Pale Lights

>>24545977
So cringe.

>>24545987
>Pale Lights
>They couldn’t, anymore than they could see or touch her – Fortuna herself still had the senses, but she had grown far too weak to touch the material world.
Such a clunky sentence. Dropped.

>>24545987
Is that one the Sanderson-like?

>>24545990
Yes, judging a 1430 chapter long award winning webnovel by it's first page is indeed cringe.

>>24546000
>it's
You're illiterate.

>>24546004
Oh no! A typo, how can I continue to live with myself...

>>24546007
I'd give you an F in my class. I am an English teacher.

>>24545998
No idea, I don't read Sanderson.

>>24546009
Not a very good one it seems.

>>24546014
Teaching isn't about spoon-feeding illiterate man-children. If you weren't reading as a kid then you'll never be literate enough to be a writer.

Why are we getting raided again?

>>24545447
>he doesn’t understand show dont tell

>>24546024
maybe not, so explain

>>24545447
>screenplay advice
It isn't. It comes from Anton Chekhov.

>>24545923
I will and have, but it's just so absurd. I've been writing there for years about preserving light and hope in the heart of darkness all the while raking ad money for Satan's synagogue. Reality is crazier than fiction

>>24546043
>Anton Chekhov

>>24544377
the closest I ever came to reincarnation?
I write trad novels, or I should say I try to.
t the end of the opening trilogy? The guy you think is the hero/MC, gets shot and killed. He's not going to make it in the ambulance ride, and... he tells the other MC (female) that she's to look for him. in other men's eyes.
It became an ongoing plot point. Some part of her believed she found him again, he came back years later. Depending on her day or mood, she believes it more or less. The new guy? Loves her, so he more or less tolerates the delusion

>>24546052
He wrote short stories.

>>24546040
It’s not some hard rule, but should be the default. The only thing you should ever consider is when to tell

>>24546063
So, did he use "show, not tell" just to fill the word count?

>>24546070
Why don't you read him and make up your own mind instead of asking anonymous strangers to think for you?

>>24546074
'Cause I don't know russian.

>>24546080
There are faithful translations. You are on the literature board.

>>24546080
In a era where translations exist, that's the lazy-tardest excuse ever especially considering the length of your initial yapping

>>24546085
Are you telling me to get spoon-fed by a translator?

Also, maybe, Show-not-tell works in Russian but not in English.

>>24546090
This book literally spoon-feeds you on how to do Show-Don't-Tell using Chekhov's stories as examples. It breaks it down, sentence by sentence, word by word. If you can't have the patience to read it, then writing isn't your thing.

>>24546067
actually found a good guideline:
>The general recipe for “show, don’t tell” is this: think about whatever it is you want the reader to feel or imagine or understand, and then don’t write that thing. Instead, write around it, so that the reader can feel what you are getting at by way of implication or inference.

>>24544309 (OP)
Is there anything wrong with a passive protagonist?

>>24544987
This is why kindle is superior

>>24544458
>I've dropped more stories to info dumping than I have to sloppy writing
>info dumps are repugnant. you've probably made the right call to rewrite
>
I guess we all did sprawl and info dumping.
i still remember when I quit doing it, too.
I was a trilogy and an 8-part serial in the bag, before it happened.
All with the same characters.
"I'm going to make this one a stand-alone..."
and the characters or narration, simply referenced things from the preceding 11 books, as needed.
I guess I try to make everything read as a stand-alone now, even though its ongoing characters.
>
in a way, it kind of sucks, basically 11 down the hole, before things clicked.
but, if writing 11 then figuring out how to do three decent ones based on the backstory the 11 makes... I'm cool with that.
God, I racked up a body count. three or four never finished, sprawl attempts, all abandoned.
then a trilogy and a 8-part serial, but... I *finished* them.
So, If I can make three good ones now, based off all that that came before? Fine.

>>24546101
most people generally dont like passive protags

>>24545763
Thank you!

>>24546101
constantly/frustratingly passive to an unlikeable extent + never learning his lesson? yes
relatably passive while becoming increasingly (pro)active is a solid and common template in genre fiction protagonists though

>>24546129
You say that but people seem to fucking love shit like the farseer trilogy

>>24544736
>Dialog tags are only meant to convey who is talking, not what the talker is doing.
I discovered this on accident. Once I embraced dialog, yeah. I needed little lines dropped in, to keep it clear who was talking. I mean, when the author reds their own shit on editing pass, and can't figure out who said that? Yeah, as needed.

>>24544877
>>my argument is that they're named dialog tags
>>no I don't have any actual argument
>Almost all published authors will do that shit in their book with varying frequency, saying it's stylistically incorrect is pure autism, anon
Once I started using dialog tags? I found them to be a great place to put a tiny shred of emotion or description in.

>>24544736
>Dialog tags are only meant to convey who is talking
There is no rule like that. The whole concept of "dialogue tags" is deceptive. You shouldn't think of spoken lines as somehow isolated and floating apart from the prose. They're not. The only thing that matters is that a complete, coherent sentence is formed around the spoken line. Long, cumbersome sentences are only wrong in the way run-on sentences always are, whether there are quotes involved or not.

>>24546096
Ill try to remember that and see if clicks for me.

>>24544959
>You are genuinely the worst sort of reader, not only can't you read a flawed character without dropping the book because of moral outrage, you give the genuinely horrible advice to the author to "make it more obvious"
flaws, particularly to MC's, are essential.

>>24546134
Well a skilled enough writer can make anything work. Also Fitz isn't passive, he's 'realistic' and does change as a character - typically from all the shit he has to suffer through.

>>24544997
>It's that EVERYONE is a faggot. When >50% of your cast is a homosexual you're just going for internet good boy points. And good thing it isn't a romance because the protagonist is an outrageously annoying faggot playboy character in the limited flirting/romance we do see, which got old extremely fast.
this, is what got me out of reading when younger. a WOKE list of characters, combine it with some "editor dropped in dialog preaching", and it just becomes silly.

>>24546162
That debate was about being intentional

>>24546176
I guess i was thinking “reactive” or is that the same thing?

>>24545227
>he's on a holy mission leave him alone
my thoughts, too.
showing widespread faggotry in lockstep, can be a powerful deomnstration.
I remember liking a YT video. maker cold-opened, on a newscaster, saying "a senseless tragedy with a handgun happened late tuesday night..."
then, split screem Another newscaster, saying about the same words. Then 4, then 8, finally there were like 64 different newscasters, all say the same words to open their story.
Very powerful.
The lamestream media? Obviously scripted.
And the newscasters, are complicit.
The video moves on, to explain what NPR is, and what they do. (NPR writes the script)
>
If he can do the same thing, to book reviews?
could be just as punchy.

>>24546205
Bro is afraid review-detective anon is going to suss his botted reviews out too the mods

>that that
Is this ever acceptable? I've been seeing it more and more in both trad pub and web novels recently. Is just seems like bad style to me

>>24545533
>>Brothers Karamazov by Dostoevsky is 364,153 words
>Have you written more than Dostoevsky?
I'm actively trying to maintain against sprawl now.

>>24546220
It’s like an addiction

>>24545930
>I don't live for clicks and money. Writing is an artform. And, no, I'm not a beatnik hipster who believes in bohemianism. My favourite novels were slop serials in their day. I just want to make a serial of my own that isn't merely fan service for social media clicks.
same here. My own bar, is when done i read it. Does it rad an feel like something I would have read and been okay with, in say 1980-1990. I can't be the only one doing this.

>>24546016
>Thinks you need to be trained at a young age to have any form of succes in the arts and that making an effort later in life is pointless.
Ngmi

>>24546192
I think the word you are looking for is proactive. Reactive would respond to stuff that happens but would be passive otherwise.

>>24546129
Harry Potter is in the first HP1 passive most of the book.

>>24546244
He's not...

>>24546239
And I think anyone who writes really shouldn't be bothered by terms as passive, reactive or proactive to describe their own characters. It's edging on TV Tropes kind of shit when you construct your characters in such a way, a easy to understand concept/warning that can quickly result in overcompensation on the writer's part. Knowing the desires and the personalities of the characters intimately will result in better characters then constructing them from the ground up as "proactive" because you got to make sure reddit tier critique from people you don't like cannot harm you.

>>24546244
*goes to stretch my legs*

>>24546231
Literacy is learned and cultural; it is not an innate ability. That is why you have a long way ahead of you if you struggle with reading and writing at a young age.

>>24546244
I don't think he's unlikably passive

>>24545973
>I would read any web novel if they weren't all so poorly wrought. Can you send me one in English that is any good?
I just use a WN site, to park my catalog. I write trad books. Crime, hard-boil, with noir aesthetics.
>
https://moonquillnovels.com/user/tina-migarlo/books
(I'd recommend "Merry's Present", as maybe the best to start with)
its less about what I "do" and more about what I don't do.
no woke characters
no preaching
true first person, like a lot of hard-boil and noir.
(and if you click fast? I'm on the front page, twice. Once, for "recommended", and again for "new release")

>>24546262
>completely makes up phrase
>uses it as criticism
>refuses to elaborate

what did bloom mean by this

>>24546009
>I'd give you an F in my class. I am an English teacher.
do you teach ebonics to the little wiggers, then.

>>24544795
I'm going for a dark low fantasy vibe instead, no isekai. Read to many of them over the last decade. I'm going to filled it with all my fetishes.

>>24546258
He is very passive until arriving at Hogwarts

>>24546275
I teach the curriculum, like every other teacher in the country. Most western countries have national curricula that are set by a department of government. The reason why you do not know this is because there is not enough school funding. Or you simply did not pay attention.

>>24546096
>actually found a good guideline:
>>The general recipe for “show, don’t tell” is this: think about whatever it is you want the reader to feel or imagine or understand, and then don’t write that thing. Instead, write around it, so that the reader can feel what you are getting at by way of implication or inference.
I started doling out things like descriptions. Too many books have this...
"She walked into my office..."
and they proceed to give a police description of the person. I don't. I assign some things about appearance, but over time. I'm letting the reader get some idea in their own head, what the person looks like.

>>24545588
>If you read science fiction, get into Cixin Liu.
Terrible advice; Cixin Liu is a terrible writer. None of his stories have satisfying endings. It's just a long slog of middle padding out wordcount with no catharsis. He only got popular because of a combination of "wow the CCP let this get published?" and "wow chinese people can actually write books?"

>>24546213
>Bro is afraid review-detective anon is going to suss his botted reviews out too the mods
LOL.
I'm blameless, here. I got almost no reviews.
Even if I am any good? Trad novels on WN sites, don't seem to gain traction.

>>24546318
>see people review the plot of cixin liu
>some elements are familiar
>remember the mtl sci fi chinkslop i’ve read
>same cultivation-adjacent chinese sci fi concepts in three body problem and said mtl scifi chinkslops
how do the chinese keep getting away with thus

>>24546321
mother fucker learn how to use commas properly instead of inserting them randomly into sentences in objectively incorrect places. it's not even stylistic, it's wrong. i can always tell which posts are yours because you do it so often

>>24546332
Comma splices are evidence of low literacy, indeed.

>>24546340
I wouldn't care if it was a splice desu, since those are fine in dialogue and a 4chan post doesn't need strict grammar. But those aren't even splices, he's just putting commas in, random fucking, places,

>>24546290
>I teach the curriculum, like every other teacher in the country. Most western countries have national curricula that are set by a department of government. The reason why you do not know this is because there is not enough school funding. Or you simply did not pay attention.
no, anon. I noticed.
And I'll tell you when else I noticed, as well.
back in the day of little schoolhouses in every small town? Just about everybody, could read and write. Read the newspaper, cover to cover. Everyone could add subtract multiply divide. Do fractions and decimals and percentages. Could tell you things about history.
The "national" agenda? Bigger funding?
is getting less overall results. While teachers get raises and new benefits every two years (or strike) all the big new buildings...
All I get for results?
"My body, my choice!"
they learn this, drilled into their heads.
spelling, reading, writing, basic math?
not so much.
I'm not blaming (you) anon, but... you want even more tax dollars wasted on a system getting worse. That's like drinking turpentine and pissing on a brush fire.

>>24546355
>Don't get paid properly for hazardous work.
You can go work in measles infected classrooms in 'Murica for nothing and tell me how to teach kids who don't want to learn how to do any of that because they're glued to their phones.

>>24546321
>>Bro is afraid review-detective anon is going to suss his botted reviews out too the mods
>LOL.
>I'm blameless, here. I got almost no reviews.
>Even if I am any good? Trad novels on WN sites, don't seem to gain traction.

Hey, how you doing, anon.
You sound like the anon I call my "number one fan".
Just in case its not you, I'll explain.
I'm not *writing*.
so, I'm not editing and proofing.
I'm... just typing, anon. When I write? Yes, I edit and proof.
Curiously, people that look at examples of my writing, don't complain about the prose.

>>24546299
There is nothing necessarily wrong with:
>"She walked into my office..."
Ultimately, you can give details on anything, but it might distract more important things and kill the pacing.
The descriptions are the skin of a book, and should never come before the meat and the bone.

>>24546365
>>>24546355 (You)
>>Don't get paid properly for hazardous work.
>You can go work in measles infected classrooms in 'Murica for nothing and tell me how to teach kids who don't want to learn how to do any of that because they're glued to their phones.
>
as I said, I don't blame you. You're just a cog in the machine. I stand by my assessment, though. I've watched the result of education in america, fall steadily for decades. Its like someone took a hold of the idea, of active anti-intellectualism? And decided it was the greatest thing ever.

>>24546391
You're just regurgitating Trump's fascist talking points now.

>>24545432
>finishing the script for a porn game I was contracted to write
Funny, someone was looking for writers on /d/, wonder if it's the same game.
The art is really good, women in heavy armor is underated as fuck.
Try also launching on other sites, at least Scribblehub and Spacebattles, cast a wide net before you pull the fish.

>>24546397
>You're just regurgitating Trump's fascist talking points now.
actually? I'm not. Excellent true life example.
I was trying out writing, all early sprawl, making very newbie writing mistake possible at the time. Neighbor's teenage kid and his friends looked at chapters. One kid, says he got a really bad grade on his English writing assignment, he asked if I'd take a look and see what I thought.
I tried to be as charitable as i could, but it was hard.
I remember in first grade, they gave us paper with large lines to write on, an dashed lines between, for lower case. That's what he wrote it on! So many words were misspelled it was almost unreadable. I don;t man words like miscommunication or recommend. I mean, "chare" instead of "chair".
I thought I picked up on the idea, that young anon was a little "slow". You know, this must me remedial english class.
>
Nope. Honors English! I thought this was some anomaly. No. Its widespread. This was 20 or 30 years ago, its worse now.
What (you) don't get?
is that labeling all critiques as "fascist talking points" isn't going to work forever.
half the country, hates the woke nonsense.
Its no "fascist talking point", its obvious on its face. Kids in gradeschool? Can't read and write, but magically they know all about gay shit.
>
What's next. Offices full of smug jackasses, doing stupid dances instead of work? Oh, wait...

Webnovels?

Open up anons it won't hurt, I promise.

>Kino-Man, you can't post your cover. This is a public space, and you can't waste posts with your shilling.

I HATE MY LIFE

>>24546445
They don't know what theyre missing out on K-Man

>>24546447
It seems that 8,000 words of info-dumping are less /lit/ than discussing RR being an Israeli honeypot.

Any other kinosloppers using Obsidian? Sat it up for both a wikipedia style worldbuilding thingie and to used it to write the chapters as well. Everything in one place. Used that ttrpg extension, removed some things and added a couple of other extenstions.

>>24546438
>Take your meds and conform
Better to die as a rebel than live as a slave!

any anons write an essay ala Howard’s “The Hyborian Age” as a guide for yourself when writing to keep the spirit and accuracy of your works?

>>24546474
Yes, I posted it here but only got this feedback:
>How did Sumerians know what an essay is? Or daemons, when this is a Greek phrase invented by Socrates?
>I see, so it's like that. But if it's written in the present, why is it written like this?
>Is your MC meant to be an insufferable twat?

>>24546504
did you specify that it was a guide meant for the writer/author to read over and rectify/keep their work from straying from its original vision?

>>24546510
I said:
>The essay is written in the present, talking about the copper age tablet that has been “found”. It’s not real, just a fictional text that precedes the Epic of Gilgamesh. It’s a bit like Borges’ fictional books in his stories.
>It’s written like an academic essay, such as Howard’s essay for Conan:
>https://www.gutenberg.org/files/42182/42182-h/42182-h.htm

>>24546458
Fellow Obsidianchad here. I use it for
outlining, writing my zeroth and first/structural drafts, worldbuilding and character notes, etc. Later drafts and ongoing revisions happen in Scrivener though since the simple elegance of markdown becomes a limitation at some point even if it perfectly suits that initial get-everything-on-page step of the process.
What plugins do you use for slopping? I keep my setup very lightweight but enjoy the native Canvas plugin a lot.

>>24546517
>>24546504
then why did you get above as feedback? this is either a case of your essay having some errors of clarity/intent or the anons in the thread suffering from profound mental retardatiom.

>>24546527
Most people aren't giving genuine feedback. They just like wasting time or trolling.

looking into getting a professional book cover done and damn its expensive. 1500$+

>>24546553
Just trad pub.

>>24546264
>Literacy is learned and cultural; it is not an innate ability.
Correct, yet nothing of what you just said makes it a prerequisite to start as early as possible. You can learn how to write properly at a later age, as well as other skills like drawing or acting. It will help to have allready some knowledge and skill pertaining to writing but there is no reason to be demorilised because you started out late.
Take the latebloomer pill, anon. It'll help you.

>>24546279
>Read to many of them over the last decade
Same. Thing is I've come up with way to make it interesting again, atleast for myself. I even found a way to do some System like elements without me wanting to flagelate myself.

>>24546567
I'm not saying it's impossible, it's just a pipe dream if you think everyone can be Stephen King if they start reading and writing only right out of high school. It's actually cruel to give people false hope and that's what all the MFA classes do. They sell you a lifestyle. Late bloomers exist but they are far and few between. Mary Shelley wrote Frankenstein at 16 years of age, and she was definitely reading a lot before then.

>>24546567
>>24546578
I'm too tired to consider the rest of your discussion but will drop the factoid that Conrad only began studying English in his early twenties.

>>24546559
and let them take 85%? no thank you

>>24546589
Joseph Conrad was reading books before that.

>>24546592
Most self-published authors make no money. Bujold made a lot of money with her self-published books but she already had readers from trad pub. You need a following first. Just take traditional publishing royalties as collateral.

>>24546553
You'd be paying a giant premium for no reason. Pay a regular artist significantly less than 1500 for some quality work then either pay a graphic designer to do the layout or do it yourself.

>>24546620
Bookshops don't even stock self-published garbo

>>24546578
>Late bloomers exist but they are far and few between
Actually in the literary world there are quite a lot of latebloomers, or at the least when authors make their best works it is often only when they've reached middle age that their magnus opus comes to fruition. Thing is though we currently live in a societal structure that fucking worships precociousness. Your example of Mary Shelley is a fantastic case study. She wrote Frankenstein at 16, wonderfull. What did she do after that? Most people know of her only through Frankenstein, nothing else. Same with the Great Gatsby, everything Fitzgerald wrote after it was worse. Yet people gawk at the fact they were so young and talented when they did that. But genuinely wgaf. Why the hell is it a lost cause if you pick up the pen when you're thirty years old?
>inb4 brain plasticity
Biggest fucking psyop of the century. You're brain is capable of learning new things even when "old", and being younger doesn't make it easier, it just makes it different. A three year old certaintly would grasp his first language with stupid ease, but he won't be able to have a coherent conversation with a thirty year old. A different thirty year old who learned a second language will have less ease to learn the language because they don't have the rapid brain development but given enough time and he'll be able to converse with the other thirty year old on equal levels. But no, let's worship this phenomenon of the plastic brain amd come to the retarded conclusion that you can't learn shit after 25, gtfo with that bullshit.

>>24546605
Lol im getting a pro cover done because im going to stub soon. I do have a following and will make far more than 1500
trad pub doesn't want litrpg anyway, what are you doing in this thread

5 follows after 2 updates is good, right?

>>24546620
I would consider it but amateurs arent very good, i tried finding some. im getting a top end pro with lots of experience and genuinely great art in his portfolio, done work for major franchises and other book covers too. good advice for a budget option tho I suppose

>>24546631
>amateurs
I recommend talented but down-on-their-luck professional video game concept artists who have been discarded by their cutthroat industry

>>24546627
Pretty good without ads.

>>24546627
A few followers per chap update is decent yeah
If you just launched you should really try to get together the money for an ad, rising stars is a massive return on investment if you manage to get there. well, assuming you have a story people want to read

>>24546623
>Why the hell is it a lost cause if you pick up the pen when you're thirty years old?
I say more power to you if you want to do it, but lets be honest: you don't just learn this stuff overnight and there is far more competition with more years of practice.
>No brain plasticity
I don't believe the brain plasticity argument is hard science yet, but I do think it is irresponsible for you to throw away your day job for a vanity project. Just be an adult about it all. Do you really think your vanity and greed should be unchecked? Every stay-at-home mother in a writing group thinks she can be the next Stephen King, and yet there is only one Stephen King.

>>24546627
that femarchmage slop was already making 7 figs by the time the dramatis personae was posted so it might be all over for you

>>24546624
>trad pub doesn't want litrpg anyway
I can probably find an agent that wants it.
>Shirtaloon, the pen name for Travis Deverell, is represented by Peter McGuigan at Ultra Literary. Shirtaloon is the author of the popular LitRPG novel "He Who Fights With Monsters". Peter McGuigan at Ultra Literary also represents other literary stars.
https://www.ultraliterary.com/about

>>24546220
Of course it is. This book explains why. But be warned, you need a [Literacy] skill at level 99 to fully comprehend this book's teachings...

>>24544309 (OP)
>Sanderson's Writing lectures 2025:
not nature though

>>24546652
funny enough that story took a while to even reach rising stars because it didn't do shout outs. the author said they ran an ad later on to finally get there, then exploded afterward. even one of the biggest breakout successes in royalroad history couldn't organically get to rising stars (quickly, at least. i do think it would've made it a few weeks later). ads are near mandatory now that the market is saturating. and now that the discord cabals are meta. two years ago you could've done it easily if you had a good story

>>24546660
tf is ultra literary
i mean trad pub as in big 5. the ones who get you onto barnes and nobles bookshelves. if they can't do that, it's pointless
i've been messaged by multiple publishers who want to leech off my existing audience. fuck that. ill self pub and keep the profits, they aren't doing shit. it's a total scam

>>24546667
Gonna KMS I already had an RR account back then but was doing other shit.

>>24546391
>Its like someone took a hold of the idea, of active anti-intellectualism? And decided it was the greatest thing ever.
You're close: it's called the Prussian system. Designed to produce factory workers and soldiers, and divorce children from their parents. Read John Taylor Gatto. His books are free online.

>>24546675
It's a literary agency.
They got Shirtaloon published by Aethon Books, which is an independent press.
>Big Five
They just hack at your novel and you get no say over marketing and how many book tours you do.

>>24546553
I had my artist cousin do a commission for mine and it wound up being $280 ($25/hour rate). It's not perfect but it's adequate for a self-pubbed fantasy litrpg first novel.

>>24546688
>They got Shirtaloon published by Aethon Books, which is an independent press.
i know what aethon is lol. i wouldn't need an agent, Rhett or whatever his name is messaged me directly. they do that for almost all the moderate+ successes on rr
an agent in the litrpg space is a total scam. kinda shocked shirtaloon got scammed into not only giving up 50% to aethon but some more to an agent too. guess he was part of the early wave that didn't know better.
>big five
but they get you on bookshelves. they have meaningful massive marketing approaches. smaller publishers do NOTHING to justify taking 30-80% of your profits, man. I already earned my audience, the fuck is an indie publisher going to do? make a discord announcement? advertise me through their newsletter? Literally not worth it

I found a press that will pay you and publish you for LitRPG and gamelit. Thank me later.
https://aethonbooks.com/submissions/

>>24546693
>found
>Aethon
how new to this shit are you

>>24546697
I'm a horror writer published by indie presses. I don't know the scene for web novels.

>>24546693
>found
brother aethon is the biggest publisher in our space, omg. everyone knows them. you're so obviously a tourist. and i strongly recommend against aethon, personally.
if anyone really is considering messaging a publisher directly, consider royal guard. their royalties are much better. they also accept dry submissions, selectively
>https://royalguardpublishing.com/submissions/
Authors/Writers :
Submissions are open but restricted. If we can’t help you earn more than you could yourself, then we tend to reject your script. If you’re a talented author who is struggling to gain traction, but can write efficiently with a deadline, and produce a quality story, we are selectively interested. We prefer to have stories custom written so the premise is to market, but do accept pre-written on occasion. Marcus / Han is the gatekeeper here. Email him @

>>24546688
>aethon
>burning
>blazing
>book publishing company
Uhhhhhh they didn't really think that through, did they? I am STILL mad about the Library of Alexandria.

>>24546692
The point of having a publisher is to get more spare time so you're not working full time. You should understand that as someone who is constantly trying to understand your audience and writing to a deadline.

>>24546712
i guess im built differently. coordinating with a cover artist and a typographical designer really does not take that much effort. neither is formatting to epub. after that you just publish to KDP. it's ~15 hours of work total AT THE MOST and then you aren't giving up 50% of your paycheck.
im guessing you work with an indie pub? I think you got scammed man. it's not that hard. and becomes easier the more you do it.
well, maybe not, horror space works differently i assume. and plenty of people go through aethon and shit, this is just my opinion.

>>24546721
*and working with an editor ofc

>>24546704
their site looks like absolute dogshit
if their own presentation is like this, why should anyone trust them to promote anything?

>>24546728
bro.... i already told you, indie presses DONT promote. at least not to any meaningful degree. thats why i would only consider the big 5, they have ways of getting millions of eyeballs on your book. they (maybe) make it worth their cut
anyway i do agree the website is dogshit lol, but royal guard has a good reputation in our space.

>>24546721
Do you have to cover all your own legal fees though? How do you deal with plagiarism or piracy? These are usually why people choose traditional publishing, only because it's less liability to cover on your own. I know you probably have a hardcore fan base that will help you with some of these things, but not everyone is so lucky to appeal to people enough they will call out piracy or plagiarism.
>well, maybe not, horror space works differently i assume. and plenty of people go through aethon and shit, this is just my opinion.
It's more short form and it isn't a market that appeals to a wide range of people. It becomes more and more elitist and purist as you go up the rungs of "who you know". It behaves more like black metal than anything else: anti-commercial intellectualism that is somewhat reactionary and elitist.

>>24546733
>Do you have to cover all your own legal fees though?
what legal fees, lol? like if some rando tried to sue you for...what? yes, you would have to buy your own representation, but this really isn't an issue, ive never heard of it happening in our space
>How do you deal with plagiarism or piracy?
if on amazon, report to have it taken down. it gets taken down. if elsewhere, even publishers can't get it taken down from piracy sites lots of the time
>It becomes more and more elitist and purist as you go up the rungs of "who you know". It behaves more like black metal than anything else: anti-commercial intellectualism that is somewhat reactionary and elitist.
ugh this makes me nauseous even reading. thank god i work in slop where people just care about books being fun

>>24546743
I needed to get public liability insurance when I registered as a self-employed business (Writer) in my country. It's for anything from public appearances, to general laws around obscenity (which are still in place around the world). James Joyce had to go to court for it, for instance. You also can't depict someone in such a way as to be defamatory; the biggest laws against writers are obscenity and defamation.
>ugh this makes me nauseous even reading. thank god i work in slop where people just care about books being fun
You probably just have your own forms of it.

>>24546748
>You probably just have your own forms of it.
fair enough
>liability insurance
i write pretty safe fun sloppa so it's really not an issue for me. litrpg is so niche, none of us are 1/100 the size of James Joyce lmao. we don't need liability insurance.

>>24546220
I've always liked that that myself. It makes the text feel as if it's asking the reader if they're paying attention.

>>24546748
America-chads stay winning. Thank God for the first amendment.

>>24546752
The other thing I have to watch out for is taxation. I don't usually claim my earnings as income because it's small enough to go under the radar. But if you're a full-time writer, you have to keep all receipts of your earnings for tax.

>>24546760
I don't live in a country with free speech. You can get fined for discrimination and bigotry is against the law.

>>24546761
of course. im filed as an s-corp LLC for tax advantages, and have a business account. that's how most independent creatives work (if they're above a certain income)

In other news xkarnation, the author of demonic tree, had his story professionally translated to korean and is posting it to the korean web novel site. very interested in how it performs, it might be meta defining for all of web novels if it works out

What happened last night? My daily quota is a thousand words. One thousand good words. Last night I banged out 3,955. And looking back it’s solid stuff. What is going on?

>>24546788
Muscle memory.

>>24546220
had had is the true crime

>>24546768
I'm not well versed in xianxia but it has all the hallmarks of one, so I guess it'll do well, though I dropped recently.
>>24546788
You are becoming a true slopper, soon you'll write whole novels over the course of a week.

Has a slop gong farmer ever tried their hand at poetry?

>>24546788
You were on a roll. It happens when you get in the zone. Just enjoy it and don't try to force it, or you risk burning out.

>>24546802
I am slopper man
Writing words all day all night
Mogami gawa

>>24546788
I've written 8,000 words in two days, but I messed up and wrote 'see you tomorrow' in the chapter's comment section. So now I have to write another 4,000 words by tomorrow.

PAIN

>>24546811
5-7-5 haikus aren't real; that's a meme
Here:
https://www.graceguts.com/essays/the-heft-of-haiku

>>24546788
You're finally building your writing muscle.
Let's get this to 10k.

>>24546828
That's a lot to say
That mora aren't sylables
And cultures differ

"Slop, Anon. What do you believe it is?"
The older man turned, weathered eyes meeting orbs of crimson.

"It's... Just a word, right" anon said, suddenly unsure of himself.

"No!" The old man's voice cracked like a whip, causing anon to start like a scared goose.

"No", said the man again, more gently this time.

"Slop is what happens once you let go. Slop is the act of fully embracing your destiny. Slop, my friend. Slop is truth, bar pretense nor reservation".

And thus anon was enlightened

>>24546848
Is that the best ironical prose you could crank out. I shudder to think of your web serials...

>>24546855
>ironical

>>24546860
Did you just learn a new word?

>>24546860
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/ironical

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=ironic%2C+ironical&year_start=1800&year_end=2022&corpus=en&smoothing=3

>>24546866
Different words have different connotations depending on intent, syntax, and general style. You should know this as a writer.

>>24545982
These two are recent ones I read that had alright writing. Most web novels are inherently amateur so you shouldn't be holding them to the highest literary standards. That being said, I still want my web sloppa to not give me an aneurysm when reading it.

Courting Death
The Elf Who Would Become A Dragon

>>24546874
ironic and ironical are essentially interchangeable. the only difference is the literal sound of the word, there is no connotative difference

>>24546891
When you have "synonyms" in English, you can use them for different purposes. The sound is everything. Aren't you a writer? The way the language sounds and rolls off the tongue should be like music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJYoqCDKoT4

>>24545982
why would you read web novels and expect good prose? we shouldn't have to explain that shit uploaded to the internet doesn't have the polish that professionally vetted and edited works do
the OP even says so, ffs

>>24546897
You said there was a connotative difference. A difference in sound and lyricism is not connotation. Connotation refers to a meaning difference, emotions associated with a word beyond the strict definition. Ironic and ironical do not have a connotative difference. You are misusing words. You are a writer, you should know better.

>>24546900
So it's just a low effort, low cost movie in your head? What is the point of discussing anything then?
>>24546907
Language comes from usage, not prescription.

>>24546458
Also using it as an internal wiki and world building repository. Even found some css templates that gave me a wiki style sidebar for characters, places and events in the story. I am still quite new to it and haven't gone in to using any plugins though. What ttrpg extension are you talking about?

>>24546917
>Language comes from usage, not prescription.
And ironic and ironical are used with identical meanings. They simply have different sounds, which, again, is not connotation. If you disagree, stop pussyfooting around and explain the connotative difference between them. It's a very simple task I've asked of you, and your continued refusal to do so is revealing.

>>24546917
>So it's just a low effort, low cost movie in your head?
no clue how you jumped to this. don't strawman me and maybe ill reply

>>24546923
"Ironic" is an overused term to mean sarcastic or insincere, to be ironic is to be "done in bad taste" or to not mean what one is literally saying.
"Ironical" is the lesser used form and means, more strictly than "ironic," that it pertains to irony, such as dramatic irony or situational irony. It has less connotations of internet culture, for instance, which is said to be "irony poisoned" with insincerity.
That's how I differentiate the connotations of the terms' lyricism and musicality. "Ironic" was a term of abuse and derision in the works of David Foster Wallace, for example.

>>24546927
If you don't care about the quality of language, then go make a machinima.

It really is funny how this fag wanted slop to split off of /wg/ and we did, then he immediately got bored and followed us

>>24546954
I was here before /wg/ existed. I used to post in critique threads in 2016.

>>24546958
What's your point? Clearly you belong in /wg/, instead you're haunting the slop thread, repeatedly complaining how we talk about slop. What is your malfunction? Are you just this 4chan addicted?

>>24546965
>Are you just this 4chan addicted?
Yes, I am a daily user and try to get as many (you)s as I can. I like talking about writing, too. But I don't mind if you write web novels and slop, as long as you engage with the literary canon as much as you can. The poet in me wants you guys to push yourselves a bit more. Don't you enjoy thinking about words and the music of language?

>>24546974
>Don't you enjoy thinking about words and the music of language?
Not zero, but 1% how much i enjoy story and characters. people here are fine reading chinese mtl slop. transcendent use of language is not remotely important to us, as is made clear in the fucking OP. if you like poetry fine, but stop begging us to do the same, we don't give a shit and you aren't going to change our minds by being an obnoxious spammer who instantly jumps to strawmans in every single post

>>24546984
Well, there is a tendency in newb writers (not here, but just the writing groups I've been in) where you can tell the person has a movie in their head rather than a proper literary story. It seems people default to writing because it's cost-free when their ideas would be better suited in other forms, like movies or visual media.

>>24546984
Bruh you can just hide and ignore trolls. If you stop feeding them, they go away.

>>24546974
>The poet in me wants you guys to push yourselves a bit more.
You're being disruptive. Knock off the "stop not liking what I like" attitude.

>>24547011
I am enlightened. Not by any god's blessing, but the radiance of my own intelligence.

>>24547022
kek, nice quote actually

Any advice on how to include a loli heroine in my slop without triggering a lynch mob event? I want to because loli heroines are good otaku culture, and also let me explore a completely different dimension of the protagonist that the other heroines can't. Regardless of whether she is intended to win the MCbowl or not, would I be fine as long as the MC protagonist strongly reminds the audience that he isn't a lolicon?

reply to posts you find interesting and ignore posts you find uninteresting/disruptive/etc
it's that simple. silence doesn't mean agreement that can be used against you at some point and protest usually shits up the thread further

>>24547036
Write it in a style similar to Nabokov. Lolita is seductive in an ironic way. It's both humorous and nice to read.

>>24547036
Don't remind the audience, if you point that out it's going to bring her age in an order of importance.

>>24547036
Why not write for an audience that likes loli instead an audience that despises it?

>>24547050
Sure just let me slap my loli heroine tag on it so all those cool guys show up to read my slop! Oh wait.

>>24547062
I mean, I am not sure what your point is. Scribblehub has a loli tag so maybe they will accept whatever you want to write?

>>24547075
My point is that there is no significant English audience that likes loli, and more to the point no English-speaking audience who won't shit their pants at the mere existence of a loli heroine. Which is why I was looking for ways to include one without sending them over the edge.

What's my other option, learning Japanese so I can write it for an audience that all love lolis?

>>24547036
Do you also plan to have your protagonist brush his little sister's teeth?

/wng/ Daily Quest

>reply to start your timer
>write your slop
>24 hours later reply with a reaction + report based on your progress toward the goal

Word goal of the day:
>1200 words
Quote of the day:
>"Skill is practice + Talent"

>>24547088
Weebs are generally pro-loli. Not even in a sexual attraction way, but in a "it's japanese culture / trope and I like Japanese culture and tropes" kinda way.

>>24547036
Just do it with giant brass balls. Introduce the character, lean into tropes, when people complain either delete their comments without commenting yourself, or tell them that's how the story is and you hope they keep reading. Whatever you do, don't do it and then apologize for it.

>>24547088
Are you sure about that? Maybe you just need to advertise where the cunnysseurs congregate, e.g. sad panda forums, instead of redditor spaces like RR.

>>24547100
No I'm not a siscon and couldn't write a sister heroine properly. I know what a good one looks like (e.g. Kasagano Sora) but have no faith I could do it properly.
>>24547111
This seems like genuine advice so fuck it, guess that's how to do it. Thanks.

600 words to go niggas.

>dialogue
peak
>action
tedious
>description
kill me

>>24545952
https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/63818/the-crow-and-the-rabbit
the character in the image is not introduced until later in the story but go ahead.

>>24546429
>Funny, someone was looking for writers on /d/, wonder if it's the same game.
unlikely, we started two years ago but both became busy with other things, and it isn't /d/ material.

>Try also launching on other sites, at least Scribblehub and Spacebattles, cast a wide net before you pull the fish.Try also launching on other sites, at least Scribblehub and Spacebattles, cast a wide net before you pull the fish.
spacebattles looked like a good place to post it, I was planning on that.

>>24547194
>rabbit
Oh I already had this on my PTR, guess it just got bumped up a bit.

>>24547194
Oh, it's rabbitanon, based elf enjoyer.

>>24547166
>dialogue
kill me
>action
ok
>description
peak

Is 50k a big enough backlog?
At the current rate I'll have it by the 22nd.

>>24547227
Depends on posting rate and chapter length. Try to have at least a week of buffer regardless of both.

>>24546647
>but I do think it is irresponsible for you to throw away your day job for a vanity project.
What? What compelled you to write this? What the fuck does this have to do with anything we're talking about?

the only /ourguy/ fics i can readily name are
>The Crow and the Rabbit
>FFF-Class Unlucky Antagonist
>Archetype
>City of Lies

>>24547292
>City of Lies
Almost

>>24547292
What about the Mad Scheherazade?

>>24547300
City of Files

>>24547292
>the Four Heavenly Kings of /wng/
i kneel

>>24547292
FFF-Class anon here. Since I can’t post my link, why not add a pastebin in the OP with all our novels listed?
>>24547194
Hello bro!!!!

>>24547354
Get over here!

>>24547227
How much of your story is done so far, how much is left?

>>24547133
>No I'm not a siscon
And that's exactly what your character would say while squeezing his imouto's breasts.

Time Loop slop?

We live in the weimar republic of slop that is degenerate and cringe. There will have to be a revival.

>>24546101
abandon protagonism and RETVRN to omniscient 3rd person

>>24547778
Are you joking? Web novels are raw and fresh GLOBALLY, even as they're derivative and sometimes outright plagiarism. There's "sovl." It's trad pub that's gone full weimar, sex degeneracy and divisive political agendas.

>>24547844
This. I think some people find it harder to write compared to I I I me me me but that's just cultural narcissism at play. Once a writer gets used to omniscient third person narration, actually /telling the story/ becomes a lot easier. It's like explaining what happened to a guy sitting next to you in a bar.

>>24544377
>Thinking about writing an isekai. Squirrel gets smashed by nut-kun. Reincarnates as an american and nuts all over the place.
>
Is it just me, or is there some kind of unofficial contest to see who can have the longest and strangest title. I mean, I made a joke with my friend, showing him my books on my site, and naturally we looked at all the other books. He was like me, lots of weird titles.
>
I would make a joke, saying something like...
"Help! I've been reincarnated into a mouse, and the farmer's cat is trying to eat me alive!"
but... its probably going to be a real title next month, lol.

>>24546019
>Why are we getting raided again?
when aren't we under one raid or another.

>>24546699
>I'm a horror writer published by indie presses. I don't know the scene for web novels.
>
where you were, at the indie press place. Was it horror only, or do you think they take other stuff.

>>24548131
>suddenly

>>24548184
It's either horror or weird fiction. What do you write?