Do you have to dumb yourself down to be successful in society? How do you cope?

>>24555979 (OP)
You need to have social skills or be smart or niche enough to overcome lack of

>>24556006
Do social skills include lying, posturing, kissing ass, and all that? I have to practice

>>24555979 (OP)
Just manipulate the dumbs.

Don’t mention anything intellectual and spend a lot of time alone.

It’s pretty lonely being stuck in a relationship with someone who has no intellectual interests while you have developed them.

>>24556025
It's too late for you. You need to learn this in early childhood.

>>24556036
I unlearned those after years of remote studying as a NEET, but people learn to walk again in physical therapy so I doubt it's "too late" to learn anything.
>>24556033
I'll think about that, often my pride gets in the way and I end up saying wrongthink when asked about it

>>24556035
That's good advice.

Be incognegro. If you are too successful you increase the amount of time you spend interacting with other people. If you shuffle your feet and say yes massa enough you can get by without having people in your shit all the time, then you have time for you and yours.
Yes, successful people in like real estate or whatever are dumb. I know this from my kid’s little league. No, you don’t want to dumb yourself down to get that kind of success.

>>24556059
Your kid? How's your relationship with your wife? Every relationship I've had I just played a niggerish character to get pussy

>>24555979 (OP)
Humans are fascinating creatures anon, if they seem boring to you you're the problem. The greatest thinkers in history usually didn't have a problem interacting with people, once you've tasted the fruit of mutually beneficial cooperation there's no going back, it's just too powerful.

>>24556025
No you need to start your own business and patent your own stuff

>>24556081
That's a nice perspective. But I'd argue circumstances matter a lot. I have to learn manipulation.

>>24556089
That's probably the best path to freedom nowadays though you have to participate in corruption and degeneracy

You don't have to if you're measurably "superior" in a way that provides value (aka. matters) otherwise you're just a loner deluding yourself, that's how a society works.

>>24556107
Midwit making up words over obvious matters. No one said "superior" and that is relative anyways.

The normal, ordinary man takes a vivid interest in anything only in so far
as it excites his will, that is to say, is a matter of personal interest to him.
But constant excitement of the will is never an unmixed good, to say the
least; in other words, it involves pain. Card-playing, that universal
occupation of "good society" everywhere, is a device for providing this
kind of excitement, and that, too, by means of interests so small as to
produce slight and momentary, instead of real and permanent, pain. Card-
playing is, in fact, a mere tickling of the will.
On the other hand, a man of powerful intellect is capable of taking a vivid
interest in things in the way of mere knowledge, with no admixture of will;
nay, such an interest is a necessity to him. It places him in a sphere where
pain is an alien,—a diviner air, where the gods live serene.

>>24556064
No, I am completely honest with my wife. We have a really healthy relationship. I have three kids, I live on two acres in southern CA, my net worth is low seven figures. I am successful enough because I am the right kind of dumb in public to make it all happen.
I’m not a principal engineer even though I could be because fuck that. I haven’t transitioned into management even though I could because fuck that. I chose positions in companies where the pay would work out without stressing myself out. This is what I mean by incognegro. I’m reading a technical book for the first time in years and it’s painfully insipid.
With your wife and kids, you can’t hide shit or it just comes out in another way. Everyone else gets to see the mask and I barely ever talk in social situations because I don’t care about what tv shows other people watch. I’m also super religious but not in a dumb way (ready for my (you)’s…), I find this is actually super helpful for keeping priorities straight and not losing your shit.

>>24556096
Why would you need to be corrupt to work for yourself?

>>24556125
That's great, reminds me of my dad. You're the stock that founded America.
>>24556128
You don't have to, but it's corruption and immorality that maximizes profits and beats competition

>>24555979 (OP)
Well I have bad news. It doesn't work. I finally feel pretty fucking dumb after all these years of binge drinking, but I'm still unsuccessful.

>>24556140
I guess being dumb and autistic is the worst fate one could endure.

>>24556136
>You don't have to, but it's corruption and immorality that maximizes profits and beats competition
No doubt being a sociopath helps in the business world but you can succeed at creating things or selling products without that.

>>24556125
Do you have any friends you can be mask off with? Just the closest family seems very lonely.

>>24556081
NTA.
Do you understand that the vast majority of people have average intelligence? If you measure it, you'll see they're not smart. They avoid thinking things through; they just react based on instinct and what they've learned.
Most people think they know everything, when in fact they can't even come up with original ideas or original solutions to problems. Most people believe arguments are just about differences of opinion and being rude or polite about accepting other peoples views. Most people don't realize they live in a society where there are rules and regulations and systems all around them, and that those things are just something we made up, something that can be changed. They refuse to acknowledge this and try to suppress any attempt to change things or investigate things or understand things.
For them it's too complicated. they don't want to assist or take part in it.
For them no one could be able to understand such things, and therefore you shouldn't talk about it; for them it's something religious, it's something you're not allowed to challenge; there are experts and specialists put in place to handle such matters; to them, generalists are seen as crazy kookoo in the head, they're seen as committing the ultimate hubris for questioning the system and suggesting things could be different, and the worst thing you can do is come up with actual practical solutions.
If you have great ideas that will change society for the better, you're shunned; because it requires systemic change, and the vast majority of people identify themselves personally with the system in all its various expressions, be it customs, traditions, rules, powerdynamics, etc.
They're not interested in changing the world for the better, because it means they themselves would have to change.

>>24556150
>you can succeed at creating things or selling products without that.
nta.
Like what for example?

>>24556170
How is your credit?

Me and my brother flipped some particle board we bought from china to some contractors.

You could get land and get a grant for the government to teach you how to grow and raise animals and plants a do and recieve free greenhouses and shit.

I mean, if you are that smart you should be able to tell me. But you aren't and also likely trolling.

>>24556186
It's easy if you don't think about the working conditions of those you buy it from, or the chain of production up to the point where you buy it.
Can you really trust the Chinese?
Where does the wood come from? Rainforests? how do you know that it's ethical the whole way through the value chain?

I don't know where you live, but I live in Denmark, and you can't get free land and animals and training for farming here.
Also even if you could, you wouldn't be able to make any money from that, It's basically impossible with all the regulations and the competition with economies of scale.
Also if you have an IQ of lets say above 140, you're not serving your gifts to society by farming. You'd be better off doing something with your brain instead.

>>24555979 (OP)
Yes you do.
You need to learn how to dumb your conversation down for casual exchanges, even in work situations.
Knowing too much ruins reality, ignorance is bliss.
Learn how and when to lie, most people lie because honestly gets you nowhere, and it will even set you back.
Listen to how the idiot at your job who's in charge or who just got promoted talks to people. Most of what is said is just filler nonsense, it's like improve, just agree and add on. Most people just want to be acknowledge, they want a hello and compliments even when they didn't do shit. Success really does does down to just being the loudest most likeable person in the room. The smart people do the work and the loud idiot gets the credit.

Yes you do.
You need to learn how to dumb your conversation down for casual exchanges, even in work situations.
Knowing too much ruins your reality, ignorance is bliss.
Learn how and when to lie, most people lie because honesty gets you nowhere, and it will even set you back.
Listen to how the idiot at your job who's in charge or who just got promoted talks to people. Most of what is said is just filler nonsense, it's like improv, just agree and add on. Most people just want to be acknowledge, they want a hello and compliments even when they didn't do shit. Success really does does down to just being the loudest most likeable person in the room. The smart people do the work and the loud idiot gets the credit.

>>24556154
I deleted one rambly version of a response. I’m like verging on deleting this one but I don’t have time to write another. I took those hokey myers briggs tests in college because that’s what you do and I always scored a perfect introvert, so there’s that.
Loneliness isn’t really a function of intellect, it’s about connecting or not connecting. Having that connection being over a book or a sports team or cars or crochet patterns or whatever isn’t really the point, those are vehicles and they are vehicles that can run out of gas.
Icons are meaningful and super helpful, to say you are jumping straight to negative theology is kind of false or very difficult. The icon serves to bootstrap you. The Rosary is very effective for this same reason.
If you can have that deep, satisfying intellectual discussion it’s just that icon that bootstraps you to that place with no loneliness. But you have to reach that highest, ultimately non-intellectual level to avoid boredom. So no, I don’t have that special friend who I tell all about what I am getting out of trudging through Julian of Norwich, but I don’t need to, it shows in my relationship with God, it transforms and vivifies me and makes me more capable of love, then I can come down off the mountain, be content in myself abiding in infinite love that I share with those around me by talking with them about their kids’ summer camps or playing with magnetiles with a three year old or whatever. I’m cool enough with myself that I can go where they are, be with them, not be lonely, and not be frustrated that oh I’m not getting my special attention or whatever. That made no sense but I have to finish writing a boring corporate document.

>do you have to dumb yourself down to be successful?
No, I have to try as hard as I can!

>>24556124
Superior is in scare quotes, midwitism is relative aswell, the text below is clearly supposed to assign you to the group "of powerful intelect". Considering this you should listen to Schopenhauer: "Die anderen sind Dummköpfe, desshalb kümmere dich nicht um was sie sagen"

>>24556186
"nta" means its not the person youre originally replying to

>>24555979 (OP)
>Do you have to dumb yourself down to be successful in society?
I wouldnt call that 'succesful'. Id rather die.

>>24556318
It doesn't take a genius to be smarter than the people you have to deal with, and intellect alienating you is a trope as old as Horace. "Superior" is in quotes meaning "Superior in what aspect?" Is an ugly short man with 70 IQ that has more offspring survive, "superior?" It would be in a purely darwinian worldview. But you wanna be a smartass o algo.

>>24556268
Good advice. No idea why other people here will cope.

>>24556186
OP here

>Me and my brother flipped some particle board we bought from china to some contractors.
So you created nothing? You were a middleman tricking someone to spend more on something you didn't create? How is that not at least a little immoral? I'm not saying you're wrong in doing it, but I think that is immoral.

I had a contracting business, without being too specific, the only way to beat out competitors basically boiled down to tricking people or ripping them off in various ways. Like making a worse product where'd they have to pay us for maintenance and it was so confusing and badly implemented where they couldn't find anyone else to replace us. I got tired of that so I left to pursue higher education.

Every other opportunity I've seen boils down to tricking people. Anything else required much more capital than any one person would have access to and connections impossible to make... And no business grants here either.

>>24556406
Success in society implies money. Constantly at least double your money. Build credit. Aquire land. Be on the look out for a niche to fall into. Oppurtunities constantly present themselves if you look for them.

>>24556393
Superior as perceived by society (your papers get cited more frequently, you generate more leads, whatever), I thought it would be easier to extrapolate my short sentence but sadly it appers conciseness loses again. What I was saying was just that, if someone making such a post was so smart (and they were implying some form of superiority over others from their point of view with the formulation "dumbing down") they could surely realize that intelligence to gain social approval. And yes, I wanna be a smartass, I think everyone in /lit/ has some amount of their self worth attached to being a smartass in any and every conversation because it was the best positive reinforcement we got as kids.

>>24555979 (OP)
>Do you have to dumb yourself down to be successful in society? How do you cope?
I have to turn down my autism which is usually impossible
I cope by drinking vast quantities of alcohol

>>24556406
Not him. But sourcing is a skill, and takes time and effort.
Also, buying from someone having things in stock vs ordering something from china that you never know what quality it will be like, and you could wait up to 3 months for, if you'll ever even get it delivered.
If you have good contacts and can promise delivery and quality then it's not tricking someone if you keep to it. In that perspective the middleman is just doing some work which the buyer would need to have done himself if it wasn't for the middleman. Middlemen in that regard can be seen as outsourcing dealing with the supply-chain of the product, often involving storage facilities and delivery and so on.
Middlemen can have important roles in the economy.

Regardless of that, I agree with your general sentiment.
I'm trying to find a business model myself that isn't unethical or immoral, where I can earn so much money that I'll be able fund larger projects to improve society. I've been looking for a long time without luck. It seems the system is stuck in an immoral gridlock fueled by stupidity and greed.
Unless you initially have an exorbitant amount of money to fund a startup or buy an existing business, I feel like it's basically impossible to enter the market on a moral and ethical basis, unless you're extremely lucky falling into a one in a million opportunity.

>>24556451
>Oppurtunities constantly present themselves if you look for them
nta. But could you please provide examples of such opportunities constantly presenting themselves?

It is a challenge to communicate through high tier autism. Do not dumb yourself down, keep up the superiority complex and sift through the trash until you find other autists you can talk to. I lost one of those recently. Keep acting "weird" and you'll find other "weirdos". Do it a lot, it's a numbers game. Your superior mind was a gift. Do not waste it.

>>24556484
Very self-aware. Other intelligent person would also realize such post is an invitation for external input and the obvious question serves as rhetorical device for communicating so.

>>24556484
are you saying that if you're very intelligent, then you don't have to adjust your way of being when you're around dumb people in order to meet their expectations? i.e. "dumbing yourself down"

>>24556617
nta but yes they are saying that. I imagine that they must still be in school because hat's the only way they can get away with that type of behavior without noticing that people don't actually like them, because students are essentially forced to socialize. No one likes a smart ass, not even intelligent people, you come off as insufferable. No one is going to want to talk to you if you're constantly trying to one up them. And that's an easy way for you to be too cocksure and say some stupid shit that will make the smart people in the room think of you as a permanent idiot.

>>24556631
I consider myself highly intelligent, and I want to be around other intelligent people that constantly try to one up and improve each other. I don't care if people say something really stupid as long as they're willing to admit their mistakes and move on. I feel like you have to be able to make mistakes in order to improve. If you're afraid of challenges or looking stupid, you'll never improve, you'll never become more intelligent. The problem arises if someone is a hard head when they're confronted with their stupidity.

>>24556683
The why the fuck are you on here?

>>24556683
>permanent
The most intelligent conversations and interactions you can have with people are collaborative in nature. That doesn't mean you don't question or challenge or try to give a different perspective on a subject or train of thought, you just don't do it with the intent of showing someone up, instead your goal should be to learn, and reach a better or new conclusion.

>>24556683
The most intelligent conversations and interactions you can have with people are collaborative in nature. That doesn't mean you don't question or challenge or try to give a different perspective on a subject or train of thought, you just don't do it with the intent of showing someone up, instead your goal should be to learn, and reach a better or new conclusion.

>>24555979 (OP)
Well you need to get along with people to become likable and to get shit done so you should have reasonable social skills. In order to do that just compliment them on a job well done, speak clearly and slowly, listen to them without yapping in between while maintaining eye contact and smile if they make a joke and remember to put your needs first always or people will think you're a pushover. Trust me you'll get shit done and you'll probably get laid just by doing this. The problem with myself is that I am addicted to self sabotage and I have a psychological issue where I ghost people close to me, I just can't help it. I have become addicted to loneliness and depression so I've stopped trying.

>>24556698
I haven't found any place for me in society. I have a very complex personality.
The real help I have to offer is not considered or appreciated. I haven't found anywhere in society where I can unfold my gifts, and so I'm stuck where I am.

I have played along and acted along for most of my life just to fit in, but that drains me and leaves me in extreme depression. I would rather die than hold a normal regular job. I feel physical pain and become very ill if I have to work with 'normal' people.

>>24556719
English is a second language to me.
I don't know why I had the conception of 'one upping' having a neutral connotation in some respects.
Maybe because I don't really care that much about peoples social skills too much as long as they work to improve things. I don't consider the social barrier that big of a deal if we're on the same team trying to reach the same goal. Probably because it's extremely rare for me to find someone just slightly like-minded to myself.

>>24555979 (OP)
a little bit