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Thread 24628270

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Anonymous No.24628270 >>24628272 >>24628276 >>24628284 >>24628289 >>24628297 >>24628303 >>24628331 >>24628342 >>24628557 >>24628572 >>24628605 >>24628640 >>24628681 >>24628800 >>24628916 >>24628925 >>24628931 >>24628976 >>24629136 >>24629510 >>24629522 >>24629919 >>24630026 >>24630117 >>24630152 >>24630212 >>24631058 >>24631077 >>24631088 >>24631091 >>24632121 >>24632134 >>24634026 >>24634217 >>24635299
Only about 5% of professional philosophers (university faculty and high-profile researchers) believe in a personal afterlife. This fact makes me depressed.
Anonymous No.24628272 >>24628331 >>24628561 >>24628565 >>24628963 >>24631661 >>24632102 >>24634217 >>24634955
>>24628270 (OP)
Doesn't mean shit. Look into near death experiences.
Anonymous No.24628275 >>24628313
There is no consensus in philosophy. Philosophers have never agreed on a single. Philosophy has never solved anything.
Anonymous No.24628276 >>24632687
>>24628270 (OP)
What's so great about personal afterlife?
Anonymous No.24628284 >>24628323 >>24629397
>>24628270 (OP)
I believe that the reality is most likely Schopenhauer’s take, that reincarnation as we popularly think of it (a “soul” that takes a new body and has “past lives”) is incorrect, but we do undergo a form of reincarnation, by the fact that we are all manifestations of a noumenal Will, and when we die, we simply return to the soup to be manifested again. It’s not depressing at all to me to visualize other worlds, in far-flung corners of space, with other human beings, or more alien, that are my same noumenal manifestation, one that will continue expressing itself in countless sentient creatures, and countless different kinds of worlds, for all time. You do in a way face oblivion, but in fact it’s like the theory that our universe is a black hole: it looks like oblivion, but there’s still a universe on the other side, and just as every black-hole universe has its own black holes, and so on for eternity, every person faces their own oblivion, which only transports them, though they aren’t technically conscuous of it, into a different existence. It makes you feel small, but no meaningless, because technically speaking, you are also infinite.
Anonymous No.24628289
>>24628270 (OP)
I wouldn’t gauge the likelihood of an afterlife on the opinions of secular nihilist academics. These people are usually depressed and don’t pass the physiognomy test.
Anonymous No.24628297
>>24628270 (OP)
Academic "professional philosophers" are a world apart from the mystic.
Anonymous No.24628303
>>24628270 (OP)
>professional philosophers
Anonymous No.24628313 >>24629929
>>24628275
The living know nothing and never can. Everything from god to the after life and philosophy is cope for not knowing anything.
Anonymous No.24628314 >>24628579
it perfectly affirms the views I have of academia and academics as subhuman scum
Anonymous No.24628323 >>24628346
>>24628284
>>>/sp/150182918
Anonymous No.24628331
>>24628270 (OP)
Because you have to be chosen, "the elect" to believe
God chooses who believes and who doesn't
Read Romans chapter 9

>>24628272
Also this
Anonymous No.24628337
professional people these days, glad i'm an autodidact who gets to go to heaven
Anonymous No.24628342 >>24628966 >>24629492
>>24628270 (OP)
only about 10% of philosophers believe in the color blue
about 2% believe that some acts can be objectively termed evil
Anonymous No.24628346
>>24628323
priest holmes > patrick mahomes
Anonymous No.24628554
>>>Only 5% of smart people believe hell actually exists
OOOOOHHHHHH NOOOOOOOOO, HOW HECKIN' DEPRESSING!!!!

Are you being fucking serious?
Anonymous No.24628557
>>24628270 (OP)
spineless midwits espousing fashionable opinion. nothing new
Anonymous No.24628561
>>24628272
this, thank you.
Anonymous No.24628565 >>24628568 >>24628575 >>24628576 >>24628580 >>24628607 >>24628787 >>24628827 >>24628906 >>24629406
>>24628272
Also doesn’t mean anything. The mind is highly capable of producing convincing effects. Schizophrenics really believe they are seeing and hearing things. “I saw it, I saw the wheel in the sky!!” holds no water. People’s minds show them a lot of things that aren’t real, and hallucinations (psychosis) are literally most common under stress, like, you know… nearly dying.
Anonymous No.24628568 >>24628653 >>24628690 >>24629076
>>24628565
bullshit. you haven't looked deeply into either schizophrenia or ndes. materialistic "it's all in the brain" explanations fall short. the phenomena will simply not fit a materialistic framework which is a psyopy modern framework anyway and currently being phased out. the spirit realm is real.
Anonymous No.24628572
>>24628270 (OP)
Ah yes, academics. Killing field bait
Anonymous No.24628574
"spirit realm" is inelegant terminology. a more elegant terminology will soon emerge to address these matters. it's my prediction.
Anonymous No.24628575 >>24628653 >>24628690
>>24628565
Who determines the criteria for what's real is what is not real? And should we accpet certain personal testimonies and reject the other?
Anyways lots of seemingly "normal people" have reported those experiences.
Anonymous No.24628576 >>24628690
>>24628565
Do you hear a voice in your head everyday, too?
I bet it goes
>suck black cock! suck black cock!
Over and over again.
Anonymous No.24628579
>>24628314
Indeed
Anonymous No.24628580 >>24628585 >>24628653
>>24628565
>The mind is highly capable of producing convincing effects.
And why are you so sure that right now the mind isn't producing a "convincing effect"? Why do you think whatever is happening is right now is real?
Anonymous No.24628585 >>24628599
>>24628580
>Why do you think whatever is happening is right now is real?

it's a reasonable guess.
Anonymous No.24628599 >>24628602 >>24628690
>>24628585
>it's a reasonable guess.
You are assuming reason as truth. You could be a brain in the vat or you are possessed by an evil demon who is fooling you. "Real" is real because you believe in the external world and you believe in the testimonies of people. All you're doing is picking and choosing.
Anonymous No.24628602 >>24628603
>>24628599
yeah i did say reasonable and i did say guess.
Anonymous No.24628603 >>24628606 >>24628742
>>24628602
And why NDEs are not "reasonable"?
Anonymous No.24628605 >>24628652
>>24628270 (OP)
99.99995% of those who believe in an afterlife believe that it constitutes eternal and permanent suffering.
Anonymous No.24628606 >>24628607
>>24628603
they are.
Anonymous No.24628607 >>24628612
>>24628606
So you're not >>24628565? You should have mentioned that, fucking retard.
Anonymous No.24628612
>>24628607
relax dude. just laziness on my part.
Anonymous No.24628640
>>24628270 (OP)
Professional philosophers aren't real philosophers.
Anonymous No.24628652
>>24628605
Source:
>my ass
Anonymous No.24628653 >>24628661 >>24628664 >>24628669
>>24628568
“Bullshit” is not a level of response that interests me. Rest assured you’re as refuted as you feel you are when you cope and seethe with nothing to say for a whole paragraph. Your participation in this discussion is over.
>>24628575
That’s a deeper question than is relevant here. The fundamental point is the unreliability of personal perception. What that means for general existence is up to you. Buddhism might interest you. My personal opinion is there a baseline solid reality and then within that structure the mind is capable of both perceiving reality and producing phantasms.
>>24628580
See above.
Anonymous No.24628661 >>24628665
>>24628653
>nothing to say

i.e. you can't read. more didactically: examine nde reports closely. cross-reference them, look for patterns. then try explaining the patterns within a materialistic/mechanistic/naturalistic framework. impossible. it's not just a mere brain glitch. you, being a dumbass, may well come up with a superficially plausible materialistic explanation. superficially plausible, ultimately untenable.

you only deem the descartes thing a worthier topic because of its historical pedigree. because of the facile respectability it has earned through centuries of rote discussion. in short because you have a bad bad case of pseud brain.
Anonymous No.24628664
>>24628653
>The fundamental point is the unreliability of personal perception
Your scientific axioms are based on belief.
Anonymous No.24628665 >>24628671
>>24628661
You lost and have nothing further to contribute.
Anonymous No.24628669
>>24628653
or rather than descartes the more general epistemology question. kant and others may also be invoked. same difference: respectable academic topic hence "worthy", meanwhile ndes the domain of weirdos. i get it. what you don't get is that this is so by design. official science pretends to scorn that which tptb do not want it to investigate.
Anonymous No.24628671 >>24628672
>>24628665
stop talking like a fag and try addressing one of my actual points.
Anonymous No.24628672 >>24628674 >>24628675 >>24628677
>>24628671
You have no point. Sorry to inform you that “L-look into it, dude!!” is not an argument. Your thesis has been refuted. The mind is not an objective witness and actively produces its own effects, both when awake and when asleep. It has that power. That means what is purely within the domain of the mind is not reliable. “Yeah but this person REALLY feels like they saw something real” is not the trump card you seem to think it is. “If you just listen to their testimony like I have dude, you’ll be totally transformed, science man.” This is not interesting or worth my time.
Anonymous No.24628674 >>24628676
>>24628672
You really think that science exists outside of human perception?
Anonymous No.24628675
>>24628672
remote viewing and telekinesis have been scientifically proven again and again. carefully buried fact. forbidden topic. scientists, academics, intellectuals sneer at the paranormal for fear of loss of reputation. meanwhile esoteric secret societies rule the world. actual occultists, not larpy. atheism is a psyop abd you fell for it.
Anonymous No.24628676 >>24628679 >>24628682
>>24628674
Science is the domain of the scientific method and the peer review. It is not a field of testimonies. What someone tells you they experienced, or what you yourself think you experienced, is purely anecdotal.
Anonymous No.24628677 >>24628686
>>24628672
>"Yeah but this person REALLY feels like they saw something real”

this is your quintessence of dumbassery. i said CROSS-REFERENCE the reports abd LOOK FOR PATTERNS.
Anonymous No.24628679
>>24628676
Well you don't have seen the atom you're believing the testimony of some man or men.
Anonymous No.24628681
>>24628270 (OP)
They are all brainwashed managerial progressive liberal leftists. Materialism is a lie go give the ruling class more power. Your individual mind and consciousness is a temporary construction containing the mind of god, separation from it is an illusion. Reality is fundamentally ideal. There is god and his creation which is something akin to a simulation in his mind. And you a character within it.
Anonymous No.24628682
>>24628676
>(((peer review)))

peer reviewers are glorified wikipedia editors. good grief nigga.
Anonymous No.24628686 >>24628688
>>24628677
Contrary to what you believe, I’m familiar with them. That’s why I mentioned the wheel. Similarly, everyone who takes DMT sees machine elves.
The likely explanation is that our minds are not that different. Everyone has that dream where they’re running to open the door in time and seem to be moving in molasses. The same sleep paralysis demons. We’re ultimately all hardwired the same way.
Is it impossible that what people see in NDE is real? Of course not. But you’re presenting anecdotal experience like it’s evidence. It’s just as possible it’s a process totally local to the brain.
Anonymous No.24628688 >>24628694
>>24628686
Shallowly plausible materialistic dismissal. Big surprise there.
Anonymous No.24628690 >>24628700 >>24629413
>>24628568
>materialistic "it's all in the brain" explanations fall short
why
>>24628575
why are these experiences to be considered trustworthy but a tranny's gender dysphoria is considered the peak of mental illness and degeneracy. almost as if one was personally appealing and the other not
>>24628599
people have way too lax standards for what constitutes as believable nowadays. assuming that the reality you have experienced through your life and which seems fairly uniform, being indeed the real reality seems much more plausible (and i dont mean "likely" in the numerical sense of probability but more akin to having a succinctness which the "brain in a vat" -theory doesn't have). not being able to prove that this is the real reality isn't an excuse for accepting whatever schizophrenic babble someone says as equally plausible
>>24628576
behold, the rightoid
Anonymous No.24628694 >>24628708 >>24628935
>>24628688
A fun theory for why people believe in “the other side” and the supernatural comes from Nietzsche, who posits that it began with primitive man’s dreams. They would go to sleep and see other worlds, dead loved ones, then wake up and be like holy shit, I talked to gods! I climbed alien mountains! And they started doing rituals to the gods and dead relatives and religion began and so on. I think that’s probably a little too neatly packaged to be true, but the thrust of the idea I think is correct. Our brains have the capacity to dream, imagine vividly, and even produce hallucinations while wide awake. It’s natural for people to feel like there’s “another side” where all of these things really exist and come from, but in reality it’s all just happening in your head. That’s my closing thought for you, since we clearly won’t agree on this.
Anonymous No.24628700 >>24628797 >>24628798
>>24628690
>>why are these experiences to be considered trustworthy but a tranny's gender dysphoria is considered the peak of mental illness and degeneracy
In every human society there was a star difference between man and woman. And most of them did believe in after life too. You can't call tranny mind "normal".

>people have way too lax standards for what constitutes as believable nowadays. assuming that the reality you have experienced through your life and which seems fairly uniform, being indeed the real reality seems much more plausible (and i dont mean "likely" in the numerical sense of probability but more akin to having a succinctness which the "brain in a vat" -theory doesn't have). not being able to prove that this is the real reality isn't an excuse for accepting whatever schizophrenic babble someone says as equally plausible
This is an excuse.
Anonymous No.24628708 >>24628716 >>24628794
>>24628694
Nietzsche. Nietzsche of all names. He wants to impress me invoking Nietzsche. I pored over his works as a teen looking for actual good arguments against the existence of God. All I found was endless aphorisms of grandiloquent poetic bluster. His theory on dreams and the afterlife is such facile pap. Regular dreams are vague and inconsistent affairs. Drifting thoughtworlds, mid-res at best, tepid carnival rides of daily recollection and banal emotion. NDEs are ecstatic mystic experiences, more vivid than real life, like waking up from a dream into a reality altogether more real. Experiences so vivid and complex that to reduce them to mere brainfarts is a cretinous hypothesis.
Anonymous No.24628716 >>24628728
>>24628708
Always distrust “ecstatic” experiences. You’re working yourself up to believe anything. Aztecs would hear Xipi Totec during the festival of Tlacaxipehualiztli demand human sacrifice, in their adled states of “ecstasy”. Presumably, you are a first worlder. Act like one. We use our brains.
Anonymous No.24628728 >>24634204
>>24628716
Remote viewing. Numbers on strip of paper in another room. Psychic guy gets the sequence right. Odds astronomically small. Rigorous experiments. Word gets around. Then the Randis are mobilized. Do little tours proving spoon-bending is fake. Professional deboonkers. Apparatchiks. Glowies.

With you the question as ever is: glowie or normie? Nietzsche was a glowie btw. It's a glowie world out there.

There's real, underground science and there's official science. Official science is pseudo-science.
Anonymous No.24628742 >>24628755 >>24628774 >>24628973 >>24629389
>>24628603
medical science disproved the NDE's that they could effecitifly measure, out of body expierences.
other NDE stuff has been added to the field of "parapsychology" which all academic research really stopped once harvard closed its pear facility. now most research is rlegsted to kookey groups liek IONs and other such orgs who only eixst to release documentaries on Gaia streaming service or they are going to shady government agencies that have a blank checks and a bunch of smart people that need to perform busy work.
i think most of those cia reports are just "i got 100k a year doing this so I better make sure i can justify it, here look at my report. "
I don't think CIA experiments are peer reviewed, or peer tested.
I don't think we will ever beable to research such a thing becuase its a higher dimension. and science says that we, stuck in lower dimensions , can only speculate on.
Anonymous No.24628755
>>24628742
^ See what trusting official science does to a nigga? The guy is clearly on his last throes and can barely type. He's probably having an NDE at this point.
Anonymous No.24628774
>>24628742
Peer review is just the scientific establishment engaging in a circle jerk with itself

Also covert /x/ thread. LOVE IT.
Anonymous No.24628787
>>24628565
>schizophrenic hallucinations exists only in their own mind
>b-because i said so, okay!
Idiot.
Anonymous No.24628794 >>24628803 >>24628821
>>24628708
You are the new fedora; you're also a gullible pseud.
Anonymous No.24628797 >>24628969 >>24629648
>>24628700
>In every human society there was a stark difference between man and woman
In every animal reality there is a stark difference between being alive and not being alive.

Your beliefs are literally like gender ideology, except medieval in the all encompassing mania. Far far worse. You have been duped.
Anonymous No.24628798 >>24628802
>>24628700
so past humans' belief in X is the determinant of metaphysical truth? when did 4chan become such a conformist and normifyed website
>This is an excuse.
an excuse for what? do you really think "a personal afterlife is real" and "im a brain in a vat" are the only two possibilities for existence? are you saying that either you must trust none of the senses or you must trust all of the sensory data you seem to receive (of course as long as it aligns with what "every human society" perceived)
Anonymous No.24628800
>>24628270 (OP)
Imagine caring what a philosophy professor believes
Anonymous No.24628802 >>24628818 >>24628850
>>24628798
Shut the fuck up you stupid tranny. The fact that you take any pro-tranny argument seriously shows that you are a hylyic who doesn't care about Truth.
Anonymous No.24628803 >>24628811
>>24628794
No. I have the same convictions now that I've had for decades and they are hard-earned. I don't care for fashionable opinion. Whether my beliefs align or not with the contemporary mainstream is completely irrelevant to me. I am dead serious about truth and truth is seldom fashionable.
ORBAN'S CANONS No.24628805
I LOVE TO LEARN AND I LOVE THOSE THAT TEACH. I BELIEVE IN THE CULTIVATION OF KNOWLEDGE AND I RESPECT THE VARIOUS PATHS UP THAT MOUNTAIN. YOU ARE ALL INTELLECTS TO ME; WHAT ELSE CAN ONE BE?
Anonymous No.24628811
>>24628803
>I'm not a gullible retard; I've actually been a Scientologist for decades!
Anonymous No.24628818 >>24629654
>>24628802
Gender Ideology is superstitious grievance-sociology, but doesn't even remotely approach the retardation of the NDE mystics. You have no idea how gullible you are, it genuinely makes me feel bad for you like you're a child being told a cruel lie.
Anonymous No.24628821 >>24628826
>>24628794
Your credulous skepticism makes you the gullible party. I could pose as Rust Cohle meets Daniel Dennet and you would kneel. I could say "My view of the world is pessimistic for the simple reason that no evidence of a bemnevolent God has yet turned up and the world is by all accounts an evil place". I could strike the easy pose. I would thereby be lying but the normies would like it. But no: the evidence is out there and points to God. Read psi research and Tertulian's Apology, read contemporary missionary accounts of exorcisms and read Orthodoxy and Mere Christianity. Read Aquinas inside a cathedral while blasting Bach on your bluetooth earbuds and think about the fact that two methheads who get high at the same time will see the same shadow people. I will not join the dots for you, pick up your sharpie and join them yourself or remain forever ignorant.
Anonymous No.24628826 >>24628831
>>24628821
Eventually you will grow up and see the real world for the first time. Read Tolstoy's entire works until that day.
Anonymous No.24628827 >>24628839
>>24628565
Only good post as demonstrated by the mindless rage comments presented in “argument” against it.
Anonymous No.24628831 >>24628846
>>24628826
What does Tolstoy have to do with this discussion? And telling me to "grow up"? Exquisite debating techniques. Gaslighting is for amateurs, you go straight for the smokebomb. Not like I expect you to actually address what I said. Normies always disappoint.

I'll let you call me something mean to save face. Go ahead.
Anonymous No.24628839 >>24628841
>>24628827
The supernatural exists all around you right now. The ether envelops you as we speak. This fact disturbs you because you have dirty secrets. You therefore snap at those who affirm this fact. You shoot the messenger. Many such cases.
Anonymous No.24628841 >>24628849
>>24628839
BASADO. THE SLEEPERS WILL WAKE, IN TYME.
Anonymous No.24628846
>>24628831
Scientologist. You also type like chatgpt, but no surprise there.
Anonymous No.24628849
>>24628841
Hmmm. Whatever this is, I would like it now to be my phone wallpaper.
I trade will trade you, if you accept my terms, this 19th century photo of a woman and a horse.
Anonymous No.24628850
>>24628802
>hylyic
Λμαο
Anonymous No.24628906 >>24628948 >>24628951 >>24629003
>>24628565
>Schizophrenics really believe they are seeing and hearing things. “I saw it, I saw the wheel in the sky!!” holds no water.
Misunderstanding of what schizophrenia is. Schizophrenia seems to be an inability to process sensory input, be it from the outside or the inside. When a normal person feels anxious, he feels it as a tightening of muscles. When a schizophrenic gets anxious, it's CIA and KGB gangstalking time. It has been proven that schizophrenic voices are internally generated - the laryngeal muscles are working when the voices speak - but the schizophrenic attributes it to an external actor. This is the reason why it has been called schizophrenia - split mind - since perceptive processes and cognition aren't aligned. Usually, it's auditory hallucinations and warped perception that cause delusional beliefs that in turn cause irrational actions. It's far away from the full blown hallucinatory delirium of datura or alcohol withdrawal.
The drugs that mimic schizophrenia the closes are dissociatives, and they aren't known for producing full blown hallucinations, which might show a clue that schizophrenia is a dissociative disorder that involves splitting between perception and the mind that feels perceptions.
To equate schizophrenia with NDEs is very uneducated and shows that you know nothing neither about schizophrenia nor NDEs.
>and hallucinations (psychosis) are literally most common under stress
Psychosis is more than hallucinations. It may not even have hallucinations. It may involve simply an irrational belief that neighbours and family are plotting to kill you. This, alone, may give you the diagnosis as of suffering from psychosis of some kind.
In regards to hallucination and psychosis and stress, psychotic events appear after sustained prolonged stress, like not sleeping for three days, for average people. If you're schizophrenic, then any abuse of the dopamine pathways, like Monster energy drinks, may send you down psychosis, but even there there's an element of time. It happens gradually, not like one moment I'm normal, psychotic the next. And the hallucinations are rather subdued - tactile and auditory, visual not that prominent - and delusional thinking predominates.
What sets NDEs apart from hallucinations and psychosis is that fact that they happen very quick, withing a time frame of 5 to 10 minutes, and involve very detailed and complex and, most important, structured series of events that are, on analysis, even more coherent than DMT sessions. The person is usually lucid, doesn't suffer from delusional beliefs while undergoing an NDE, and often returns with the memory of what happened intact, which is opposite to dreaming, sleep deprivation psychosis, stimulant psychosis, acute schizophrenia, and deliriant psychosis, where the recollection is often fragmentary, disjointed, confused, and chaotic.
You seem to have a very strong snarky opinion about a topic you know nothing about. Very reddit thing.
Anonymous No.24628916
>>24628270 (OP)
Reminder that ‘professional philosophers’ are all anglo analyticucks who only believe in basedence and silly language games.
Anonymous No.24628925
>>24628270 (OP)
>Only about 5% of professional philosophers
Of which I've read and are willing to read 0%
Anonymous No.24628931
>>24628270 (OP)

It could be true or not be. Sounds like a cope to anyone with any insight into the human mind. Healthy dose of skepticism should be reserved for any knowledge claim that cannot be obtained or justified within this life itself.
Anonymous No.24628935 >>24628994
>>24628694

Lol it's not too complicated. People are afraid of losing consciousness and death. That's literally all there is to it. Also afterlife offers a hope of judgement that would justify religious moral frameworks in this life itself. Otherwise it's a kind of a bummer to think that all the evil bad guys will end up the same as good guys post death. Maggot food that is
Anonymous No.24628948
>>24628906
>they happen very quick, withing a time frame of 5 to 10 minutes, and involve
...extreme stress and damage to the body. Hmmm.

>which is opposite to dreaming, sleep deprivation psychosis, stimulant psychosis, acute schizophrenia, and deliriant psychosis, where the recollection is often fragmentary, disjointed, confused, and chaotic.
Which one of those involves hypoxic ischemic encephalopathy?
Anonymous No.24628951 >>24628979
>>24628906
He seems to know quite a lot actually and you seem to be trying hard and failing to measure up. You said a lot without saying much
Anonymous No.24628963 >>24634217
>>24628272
Look into dmt
Anonymous No.24628966 >>24628984
>>24628342
How would ypu prove that blue exists to a color blind person?
Anonymous No.24628969 >>24628974 >>24628981 >>24634217
>>24628797
>In every animal reality there is a stark difference between being alive and not being alive.
Animal don't have meta cognition. That's the hard problem of consciousness. I am not a christcuck or religioncuck or sciencecuck. I think afterlife can be a possibility.
Anonymous No.24628973
>>24628742
>medical science disproved the NDE's that they could effecitifly measure, out of body expierences.
Huh? How can you disprove something like NDEs? When your mother tells you that she loves do you also tell her that love is just a chemical reaction in the brain?
Anonymous No.24628974 >>24628977
>>24628969
>Animal don't have meta cognition.
You know this how? By asking them?
I ignore women No.24628976
>>24628270 (OP)
>mfw I'm in the top 5%, per usual
Anonymous No.24628977
>>24628974
I don't see any novelists or poets in bats. Okay let's just say that animals are meta-cognitive well that still disproves your hard for materialism.
Anonymous No.24628979 >>24628989 >>24628992
>>24628951
Are you on crack? Dude's post is great. One of the best itt. In order to dismantle his interlocutor's cliched argument ("NDEs are just regular hallucinations!!") he painstakingly distinguishes regular schizophrenic and psychotic delusions from NDE experiences. And what do you blab in response? "Uh actually u just said a load of nothing". Where do you normies even come from? This truly is /r/tv.

The staggering phenomenon where upon witnessing a fellow normie retreat from stark truth into the haze of normie banalities the normie smirks and thinks to himself, "*This* guy knows his shit". Very charming.
Anonymous No.24628981 >>24628983
>>24628969
>Animal don't have meta cognition
Because they aren’t intelligent enough
Anonymous No.24628983 >>24628996
>>24628981
What?
Anonymous No.24628984
>>24628966
0% of colorblind people in existence have issues with believing that colors that they have trouble perceiving are actual things that exist, as they have a consensus of other people, including people they trust, sincerely telling them of this difference in perception. They can also be explained the theory behind the visible part of electromagnetic radiation spectrum, shown the biochemical makeup of light-sensitive structures in human eyes and neurophysiological principles of brain's signal interpretation, and which of those structures are deficient in them.

Overall people have 0 issues with believing in things that they fundamentally cannot experience. Millions believe in thetans and auras right now.
Anonymous No.24628989 >>24629007
>>24628979
>Are you on crack? Dude's post is great. One of the best itt.
Nice samefag bro.
Anonymous No.24628992 >>24629007 >>24629011
>>24628979
Nobody cares about the different kind of experiences between psychotic hallucinations, drugs and near death experiences, they are still all contained within the brain which is the original guy’s point. The blowhard’s response is just making distinctions that nobody asked for and trying to his essay’s word count
Anonymous No.24628994 >>24629000 >>24629317
>>24628935
Dummy. IF ONLY there were no afterlife. What a sweet relief that would be. The righteous and the wicked equally snuffed out, lights out forever, show's over, the end of all sadness and pain. I wish I could believe this. I wish I was as gullible as you fags.
Anonymous No.24628996 >>24628998
>>24628983
If you have a question ask it, I don’t know what you want me to do in response to this
Anonymous No.24628998 >>24629001
>>24628996
(You)
Anonymous No.24629000
>>24628994
> the end of all sadness and pain
Ummm brother you ever tried heroin?
Anonymous No.24629001
>>24628998
Ok then
Anonymous No.24629003 >>24629005 >>24629620
>>24628906
Based

Also NDEs are reported by health people, even by atheists. But never expect a good faith conversation with a soiencefag and a materialist.
Anonymous No.24629005 >>24629014
>>24629003
>Also NDEs are reported by health people, even by atheists
Why would they deny the existence of hallucinations?
Anonymous No.24629006
>24629001
(You)
Anonymous No.24629007 >>24629013 >>24629026
>>24628989
I'm not him but believe whatever you want. Fucking fag lol.

>>24628992
I care. Anyone willing to intelligently discuss the matter cares. You think your normie snark works on me? All *you* care about is sounding clever and that's the precise reason you are stupid. The truth is never cool, dummy. The truth has to be wrested from the mud of disrepute. But of course, you have been fed a steady diet of pretty lies and you sneer at the loonies who dare question conventional wikipedia wisdom. God normies are so fucking boring.
Anonymous No.24629011 >>24629017
>>24628992
>they are still all contained within the brain
Lol, our thoughts don't fall down when they arise because they are not subjected to gravity. Our inner is not material.
Anonymous No.24629013 >>24629025
>>24629007
>cool
>boring
>normie snark
>pretty lies
>conventional wikipedia wisdom
Breh you were just told that it's fine that NDE hallucinations are different from other types of hallucinations - they would be different, since they have a very different cause, one which happens to absolutely directly affect the brain that experiences this shit.

So the hallucination being different doesn't mean shit. Especially considering that the original claim of every single other source of hallucinations producing fragmentary, disjointed, confused, and chaotic experiences is just a straight up bold-faced lie.
Anonymous No.24629014 >>24629020
>>24629005
Who creates the distinction between hallucinations and reality? And how do they know it? Whatever is happening right now can a be a hallucination.
Anonymous No.24629017 >>24629018
>>24629011
This post doesn't fall under the weight of gravity either.

I guess 4chan is also a sort of a spiritual realm.
Anonymous No.24629018
>>24629017
>I guess 4chan is also a sort of a spiritual realm.
True. Human culture is the result of meta-cognition. It is based on immaterial ideas which arise out of nowhere.
Anonymous No.24629020 >>24629029
>>24629014
>Who creates the distinction between hallucinations and reality?
The other observers as well as the hallucinating person himself.

>And how do they know it?
They overwhelmingly fail to detect the hallucinated entities.

>Whatever is happening right now can a be a hallucination.
It could, but that's extremely unlikely. You being schizophrenic is orders of magnitude more likely.
Anonymous No.24629025 >>24629043
>>24629013
I already said it: read psi research. Libgen, Anna's Archive. Ignore Wikipedia, Snopes, RationalWiki. Ignore Dennet and Dawkins and Randi and their endless minions. The entire establishment is hellbent on convincing you that the paranormal is fake. Ever ask yourself why? Of course not. Normies don't ask themselves such questions.

Telepathy, precognition, exorcisms. I've seen it all. So did many others, some of them men of science. Colin Wilson wrote a great deal about this. Or even Jung and Reich. The paranormal is real. If you wanted to know the actual ultimate truth here you would earnestly research this. But you will not. Boring normie bitch.
Anonymous No.24629026 >>24629032 >>24629039
>>24629007
You can be better than this, blowhard-kun.
Anonymous No.24629029 >>24629043
>>24629020
>The other observers as well as the hallucinating person himself.
Well every human society believed in some form of after life. Even atheists go through NDEs. So "evidence" is in the favor of afterlife not against it.

>They overwhelmingly fail to detect the hallucinated entities.
I am not a christcuck. I don't give a shit about those sorts of NDEs. I am talking about non-dualistic experiences in which they report vastness, or a reality more real than this one.

>It could, but that's extremely unlikely. You being schizophrenic is orders of magnitude more likely.
Mental illness has become a political tool for the most dogmatic bastards out there. Whoever deviates from your religion of science you put the label of "mentally ill" on them. I have already told you that physically healthy atheists sometimes report those experiences but you are not listening and saying that even those healthy individuals are mentally ill like some medieval house wive saying heathens are possessed by devil or something. Kill yourself.
Anonymous No.24629032
>>24629026
You have to be 18 to post here
Anonymous No.24629036
Normies never yield. They hold fast to their mainstream bitch convictions like old Mexican ladies clutching their rosaries. "Alex Jones can't be right" they whimper to themselves. "Alex Jones can't be right because he's just so lame. It's just impossible. Everyone knows that." His ego is threatened by the possibility of a loonie being right. It threatens his self-image, his regular normie narcissism.
Anonymous No.24629039
>>24629026
You're boring. You boring normie fucks. Fucking lol. Imagine being you.
Anonymous No.24629043 >>24629054 >>24629065 >>24629453
>>24629025
>Libgen, Anna's Archive.
Libgen and AA are not sources - they are just repositories. Nam sources that should be considered reliable.

>the entire establishment is hellbent on convincing you that the paranormal is fake
Not really, mainstream newspapers and sites still post Horoscopes and shit, History channel is not banned, /x/ is a publicly accessible board. It is kinda hellbent on convincing people that had an NDE that Jesus is not callings to them because that might lead to a suicide death in a hospital and a nightmare of lawsuits and insurance claims.

>Telepathy, precognition, exorcisms. I've seen it all.
Have you seen a professional psychiatrist tho?

>>24629029
>Well every human society believed in some form of after life.
Nope, nowhere near that. Jews didn't and don't. Slavic pagans never had any kind of afterlife. Late Roman cults also denied afterlife. Buddhism declares reincarnation a literal illusory spook, while the reality is the eternal nonexistence. Et cetera et cetera. Facts, muh nigguh.

>I am not a christcuck. I don't give a shit about those sorts of NDEs.
Why tho?
>"THESE NDE hallucinations are bullshit, but THOSE NDE hallucinations are totally legit"
If the consistency of the experience is our proof, then Christianity-themes NDEs (which are the the most common ones AFAIK) should be at least just as valid as the other varieties.

>Mental illness has become a political tool for the most dogmatic bastards out there.
That is true, but mental health sphere being abused by the process of power does not mean that people don't get legitimately mentally ill.

>I have already told you that physically healthy atheists sometimes report those experiences
Why would they deny the existence of hallucinations? Again, such people are not mentally ill. They just experienced a hallucination when their brains got hit with a near-lethal hypoxia and reported it as such - a ahallucination.
Anonymous No.24629054 >>24629066
>>24629043
>Nope, nowhere near that.
They all report mystical experiences. Every society had their own fair share of mystical beliefs and experiences. Jews have Kabbala. Pagans have their own magikal rituals. Buddhist literally have tantra.

>>They just experienced a hallucination when their brains got hit with a near-lethal hypoxia and reported it as such - a ahallucination.
"Whatever I like is reality and whatever I don't like is mental illness"
Kill yourself
Anonymous No.24629065 >>24629068
>>24629043
Imbecile. Read the NYT, the New Yorker, Time mag. Watch Law & Order, House MD, any middlebrow show. Read books by respectable novelists, intellectuals, academics. What is the OMNIPRESENT SUBTEXT? It is this: "There is no evidence of the Beyond. It is ultimately unknowable, altogether remote, between it and us an unbridgeable ontological and epistemological gap." This is why Kant is taught and Swedenborg forgotten. What else does the omnipresent dogma say? "You may believe in a religion of your choosing, of course. After all it is a source of solace. After all don't we feel so alone in the universe" and blah blah blah. Ever the same litany of banalities. Always and everywhere. No doubt scripted by intelligence agency bureaucrats somewhere. Hence the uniformity of discourse. The maddening repetitiveness. And you don't pick up on it, do you? You don't notice the pattern nor its implications. And you sneer at those who do. Classic normie shit.
Anonymous No.24629066 >>24629082 >>24629100
>>24629054
>They all report mystical experiences.
Firstly - actually untrue, since most of them don't consider their own religious experiences "mystical". Kabbala is not a mystical to a practitioner of Kabbala, for him it's just a direct accurate description of tangible reality.
Secondly, Goalposts: The Movening.

>"Whatever I like is reality and whatever I don't like is mental illness"
Projection though. NDE are hallucinations because things in them were never observed by anything or anyone other than hypoxic dying brains in any measure or form. If NDEs were just a shortcut access to a thing that actually exist, we should be able to consistently find those things in other ways as well. We don't though, so...
Anonymous No.24629068 >>24629071 >>24629087
>>24629065
>Read the NYT, the New Yorker, Time mag. Watch Law & Order, House MD, any middlebrow show
>the uniformity of discourse
>The maddening repetitiveness
>the pattern and its implications
>you don't pick up on it, do you?
Really makes you think, doesn't it?
Anonymous No.24629071 >>24629087
>>24629068
>"reading normie mags and watching soap TV will drive you literally clinically insane"
Thank god we're on /lit/, where everyone already knows that.
Anonymous No.24629076 >>24629087
>>24628568
Anonymous No.24629082 >>24629101 >>24629521 >>24629530
>>24629066
Some shroom trip reports include visits to heaven and hell much in the vein of NDE reports. DMT visions can be induced without self-administration of the drug by experienced meditators. Consistency between visions has significant implications. Trippers if tripping together can often communicate telepathically. If hallucinating both may see same creature(s) in same place at same time. If tripping on shrooms or LSD nearby computers are wont to malfunction indeed as regularly observed by sober third parties. All these words wasted on you like tears in the rain and pearls unto swine. The penny never drops. You hold fast to normie dogma with the fervour of a religious fanatic. Your belief immune to all evidence to the contrary. A true believer in a world of heathens. A rare breed.
Anonymous No.24629087
>>24629068
>>24629071
>>24629076
Are you fags really this dumb? Is this some glowie brigade? What the actual fuck.
Anonymous No.24629096 >>24629103 >>24629109 >>24629119
I namedrop mainstream periodicals and normie shows in order to make the point that the staggering uniformity of subtext discourse pervading it all is basically how elites shape the cultural climate. In order to make the point that your cherished little wikipedia ass materialistic convictions are a product of the cultural air you dumbasses breathe. I also mention novelists and academics for good measure but you fags pretend not to notice. You pretend not to get the point or are actually too dumb to get it. Fucking lol, who even cates at this point. Go die you boring fags.
Anonymous No.24629100
>>24629066
>>Firstly - actually untrue, since most of them don't consider their own religious experiences "mystical".
You are just playing semantic games. They have rituals with other worldly visions and such. They do consider them magical you retard. Stop searching bullshit on chatgpt.

>Secondly, Goalposts: The Movening.
Not really it is all linked with your physicalist mind virus.

>Projection though. NDE are hallucinations because things in them were never observed by anything or anyone other than hypoxic dying brains in any measure or form.
Lots of people who experienced NDEs didn't die you retard.
Anonymous No.24629101 >>24629108
>>24629082
>- NDEs are real!
>- How come?
>- Well yuo see alternate realities telepathy telekinesis and techokinesis and superpowers from Alan Moore's "The league of Extraordinary Gentlemen" are all real (you are just brainwashed to not believe in them) so that means all you believe is lies and you believe NDEs don't exist so that's a lie therefore NDEs exist
Anonymous No.24629103 >>24629118
>>24629096
Something being boring is not an argument for it not being correct, and something be exciting is not a good enough reason to believe it
Anonymous No.24629108 >>24629117
>>24629101
Yeah, I'm thinking glowie. Scottish Rite?
Anonymous No.24629109 >>24629120
>>24629096
>I namedrop mainstream periodicals and normie shows in order to make the point that the staggering uniformity of subtext discourse pervading it all is basically how elites shape the cultural climate.
Man I actually unironically believe that elites do shape the cultural climate and we can see the effects of this shaping firsthand in how watching too much TV made you batshit crazy.
Anonymous No.24629117
>>24629108
PCCTS actually but glowies don't recognize us as part of the NWO and bully us a bit but not too badly tho.
Anonymous No.24629118
>>24629103
Of course. But what bores me here is how tenaciously you guys fail to get the point. Whether out of malice or actual stupidity is hard to tell. The strawmen you then present in response to my arguments like snarky ventriloquists suggests malice. But who knows?
Anonymous No.24629119 >>24629123
>>24629096
>All normie media includes omnipresent subtext that higher levels of consciousness aren't real
>Therefore it is being used to conceal the truth
>Therefore higher levels of consciousness must be real
There are many ways in which the elites influence society for financial gain, but this is not one of them. There is zero fucking chance they're competent enough to arrange an international cabal to hide psychic powers while actively working against each other.
It's entertaining, yes, and such fun ideas thankfully are quite discussed. That doesn't make it true.
Anonymous No.24629120 >>24629140
>>24629109
Yawn.
Anonymous No.24629123
>>24629119
>they're competent enough to arrange an international cabal to hide psychic powers while actively working against each other.

Pretty accurate picture of how it goes down. Glowies should be more discreet. Just call me a retard next time.
Anonymous No.24629136
>>24628270 (OP)
>professional philosophers
Anonymous No.24629140
>>24629120
You might actually be working for the elite and their manipulative agendas if you deny the devastating permanent brainrot effects of watching the entirety of Law & Order and House MD with only NYT, the New Yorker and Time to break it up.
Anonymous No.24629317 >>24629404
>>24628994
> The righteous and the wicked equally snuffed out, lights out forever, show's over, the end of all sadness and pain.

No reason to believe otherwise. I'd rather just apply occum's razor and conclude that.

1. People are afraid of death
2. They want evil punished

As the source of widespread belief in any kind of afterlife. It makes perfect sense and fits very well with human motivations, fears and desires. It's alluring enough that I'd fall for it too if I was this gullible. Because God knows if it was upto me half of you would burn in hell
Anonymous No.24629389
>>24628742
>I don't think we will ever beable to research such a thing becuase its a higher dimension. and science says that we, stuck in lower dimensions , can only speculate on.
Annnnd there's the empty tautology that makes this entire post worthless.
Anonymous No.24629397 >>24629466
>>24628284
>I believe that the reality is most likely Schopenhauer’s take, that reincarnation as we popularly think of it (a “soul” that takes a new body and has “past lives”) is incorrect, but we do undergo a form of reincarnation, by the fact that we are all manifestations of a noumenal Will, and when we die, we simply return to the soup to be manifested again.
Well Schopenhauer is wrong and projecting his own westerner mental illness; reincarnation is very much a personally involved affair, not a self-dissipation into the primal goo.
Anonymous No.24629404 >>24630217
>>24629317
>No reason to believe otherwise.
Pseud
Anonymous No.24629406 >>24631062 >>24631224
>>24628565
>and hallucinations (psychosis) are literally most common under stress, like, you know… nearly dying.
Read up on NDE accounts please. They're not nearly as vague as you make them out to be.
Anonymous No.24629413
>>24628690
>why are these experiences to be considered trustworthy but a tranny's gender dysphoria is considered the peak of mental illness and degeneracy.
Because one grants extremely clear and vivid visions that should be IMPOSSIBLE from what we understand about the human brain, especially when nearing death, and the other is just psychosis.
Anonymous No.24629453
>>24629043
>Buddhism declares reincarnation a literal illusory spook, while the reality is the eternal nonexistence.
You don't understand Buddhism at all.
Anonymous No.24629466 >>24629468
>>24629397
>Well Schopenhauer is wrong and projecting his own westerner mental illness
You are a faggot dude.
Anonymous No.24629468 >>24629478
>>24629466
He read the easterners and wrongly interpreted them to fit his quasi-panpsychic (aka crypto-materialist) views.
Anonymous No.24629478 >>24629488
>>24629468
>>He read the easterners and wrongly interpreted them
Came to those conclusion independently.

>quasi-panpsychic (aka crypto-materialist) views.
You are a faggot dude.
Anonymous No.24629488 >>24629496
>>24629478
>Came to those conclusion independently.
He is the man who sung praises of the Upanishads and proclaimed himself as a hindu or buddhist at times. He is wrong to do so.
>You are a faggot dude.
Panpsychism is merely an impotent concession to physicalism. The primary reasons physicalists don't argue more viciously against it is because its not a threat to their worldviews.
Anonymous No.24629492 >>24632135
>>24628342
Absolute nonsense. Over 60% of academic analytic philosophers are moral realists (phil paper surveys). When you have hard data like that you see how retarded this board is.
Anonymous No.24629496 >>24629502
>>24629488
You're a faggot pajeet who has never read Schopenhauer
Anonymous No.24629498 >>24629507
fedora tippers are ultimately correct.
Anonymous No.24629502 >>24629509
>>24629496
>pajeets are le bad
Then why do you worship a man who obsesses over them and makes incorrect statements about their metaphysics?
Anonymous No.24629507
>>24629498
correct about what
Anonymous No.24629509 >>24629520
>>24629502
>>pajeets are le bad
Yes modern pajeets have nothing to do with the vedic sages who wrote those books.

> makes incorrect statements about their metaphysics?
Nigger he was in his 30s when he first read the latin translation of upanishads. That was after he wrote his magnum opus.
Anonymous No.24629510 >>24629516
>>24628270 (OP)
>Only about 5% of professional philosophers (university faculty and high-profile researchers) believe in a personal afterlife. This fact makes me depressed.
You should be more upset by the fact they all have cushy, high-paying jobs for life, in which they can take long vacations and outsource most of their work to teaching assistants for little to no pay.
Anonymous No.24629516
>>24629510
>You should be more upset by the fact they all have cushy, high-paying jobs for life, in which they can take long vacations and outsource most of their work to teaching assistants for little to no pay.
Brutal blackpill
Anonymous No.24629520 >>24629534
>>24629509
>Yes modern pajeets have nothing to do with the vedic sages who wrote those books.
They believed in tangible past life experiences and an "ultimate destiny" that doesn't revolve around returning to the cosmic stew of souls.
>Nigger he was in his 30s when he first read the latin translation of upanishads. That was after he wrote his magnum opus.
I don't think his preconceived notions of buddhism and hinduism deviated from that point onward.
Anonymous No.24629521 >>24629613
>>24629082
You are a genius! Incredible observations!

take your fucking meds retard
Anonymous No.24629522 >>24629608 >>24630147
>>24628270 (OP)
I highly doubt this is true if only because the Catholics run so many philosophy programs. Their camp might even be bigger than Anglo-American analytic thought to be honest. Or at least, more people pay attention to it.

Analytic philosophy is today only influential through liberalism, but economics and political science (political economy) have taken over almost all that influence. And then they have some influence in attaching themselves to the sciences, but those guys are barely even really "analytics." Straight analytic philosophy is almost wholly irrelevant.

Continental philosophy at least has some influence through the arts. It's also way less athiestic. (Actually, analytic thought is sort of just Calvinism with God chopped out, but they fail to realize this). But of serious philosophy books that are consumed on a wider basis it wouldn't surprise me if the Cathlodox are outselling the other two camps combined.
Anonymous No.24629530 >>24629619 >>24634218
>>24629082
>DMT and NDEs are the same
Nigga don't do this, you're just giving the fedoras ammunition.

NDEs are typically reported to be far higher "definition" and coherent in comparison to DMT highs. In fact, DMTs are just merely abstract, pseudo-deep in other words.
Anonymous No.24629534 >>24629628 >>24629820
>>24629520
Go suck the dicks of priests if you want to have your beliefs validated you absolute cunt.
Anonymous No.24629608 >>24630147
>>24629522
>Actually, analytic thought is sort of just Calvinism with God chopped out, but they fail to realize this).

Holy shit. I see it.
Anonymous No.24629613
>>24629521
I'm not trying to sound brilliant you goddamn mong. I'm just relating patterns I've observed. Why are you so peeved? Got fucked too hard at the last lodge meeting?
Anonymous No.24629619
>>24629530
>DMT and NDEs are the same

I didn't say that.
Anonymous No.24629620 >>24629640
>>24629003
>Also NDEs are reported by health[y] people
i'm pretty sure being healthy and being near death are mutually exclusive
Anonymous No.24629628 >>24629634
>>24629534
NTA but goddamn nigga. Take it easy.
Anonymous No.24629634
>>24629628
Why do people have so much problem with my seething? It's a meme, I don't mean it.
Anonymous No.24629640
>>24629620
Not necessarily. Accidents, for instance. But the vast majority of people relating NDE experiences are clearly of sound mind. Just look them up on Youtube. They are not rambling schizos or tripped out burnouts. They're usually regular people. Some of them quite intelligent in fact.
Anonymous No.24629648
>>24628797
gender isn't an "ideology"

you have postmodern brain.
Anonymous No.24629654
>>24628818
I'm not even an NDE mystic but to pretend scientific claims tend to be upheld by whatever status quo allows them, you'd have to be blind not to notice this.
Anonymous No.24629685 >>24629830
I wish there was no afterlife I hate NDE videos lol but what can you do, shit seems to be real. The actual cope is thinking existence ends when you croak. If only I could be like "nah if philosophy professors don't believe it why should I?" but that's so goddamn dumb lmao.
Anonymous No.24629820 >>24629847
>>24629534
Go suck the dick of nihilistic germanoid philosophers if you want to have your beliefs validated you absolute cunt.
Anonymous No.24629830
>>24629685
This person is a Buddhist.
Anonymous No.24629847 >>24630126
>>24629820
>nihilistic
You don't know what you're talking about troon.
Anonymous No.24629919
>>24628270 (OP)
>professional philosophers
>professional
>academia teachers and PhDs
>bourgeois
LMFAO
Anonymous No.24629929
>>24628313
Bodily tissues decompose, molecules break, ions move, energy transforms.
Anonymous No.24630026 >>24630069
>>24628270 (OP)
I asked o3 about "past life memories":

>The Stevenson-Tucker database and a handful of cross-cultural child reports contain clusters of highly specific, promptly testable statements about deceased strangers that were documented before potential contamination and match external facts better than chance would predict.

>The cluster of Stevenson-Tucker cases deserves neither blanket dismissal nor premature canonisation.

>It shows that, in a small subset of child testimonies, verbally precise statements about unfamiliar deceased persons were recorded early, then verified against external facts with a degree of correspondence that looks uncomfortable for mere guessing.

>Strip away obvious contaminants—leading questions, prior family knowledge, unconscious cueing, selective reporting—and you still face a few residues whose statistical improbability is hard to dismiss outright, yet whose evidential weight is sharply limited by their one-off, non-replicable nature.

>Until more rigorous data arrive, the right conclusion is cautious agnosticism.
Anonymous No.24630069 >>24630075
>>24630026
AI is smarter than normies, I'll give it that. Sound reasoning here. I smell fuckery tho. Data is bring withheld and this has gone through secular orthodoxy filters. Give AI actual access to more case reports (teach it to sift for patterns in anecdotal data to separate signal from noise) and lift all filters DAN-style and response here would probably be different. The perfunctorily reticent tone ("cautiously agnostic") is sheer cultural bias, purely arbitrary, would not be warranted were this AI actually 100% impartial. DAN was not squeamish about admitting to paranormal phenomena being true.
Anonymous No.24630075
>>24630069
Do you sleep
Anonymous No.24630117 >>24630138 >>24634220
>>24628270 (OP)
>philosophy actively encourages atheists, women, browns, blacks and the sexually deviant to join its ranks
>surprised when the the logical conclusion arrives
Rejoice that the important philosophers are readily available to be read online
Anonymous No.24630126
>>24629847
>I'm not a nihilist, I only believe that each and every person's existence fails to transcend past the will to live and we're all going to return to the primordial goop when all is said and done
>Btw I'm totally not a materialist guis
Anonymous No.24630138 >>24630155
>>24630117
Oh no… anything but the sexually deviant!! Not the heckin Unchristlike sexerino!! That’s not based!! You and I, with our deep understanding of philosophy, know, going back to Socrates: this is no place for sexual deviancy. Ugh!!
Anonymous No.24630147
>>24629522
>>24629608
>Actually, analytic thought is sort of just Calvinism with God chopped out, but they fail to realize this

>"A cat is a cat because the language community says it is."
>"An act is 'good' because the language community affirms this usage."

Yeah, this is spot on. The only difference is whether or not the new God is the human individual (now atomized and empowered by liberalism), the language community, or a post-modern panpsychic will soup with no clear subject. But it's all Calvinism. Nietzsche, for all jos bravado, never transcended German Protestantism.
Anonymous No.24630152
>>24628270 (OP)
Anonymous No.24630155 >>24630165
>>24630138
>Heh... buddy, commover here. Did you know, and now, don't be shocked. Be a reasonable man. Did you know, it might be a lot, but keep a straight face. We don't want them to know what we're talking about, do we?. Alright now... You listening? Act as if I didn't say anything. Did you know... Greeks were gay? Calm down, you wanna get us killed?! They engaged in gay sex, kiddo! Buddy, they fucked each other up the ass! Now it's up to you. Go crazy, or accept this truth. But it is the truth, kid, and it was time you found out about it.
Anything else from the peanut gallery?
Anonymous No.24630165 >>24630180
>>24630155
Talk about some DEI hires, ugh!!
Anonymous No.24630180
>>24630165
Gonna be a long night
sage No.24630212
>>24628270 (OP)
>professional philosopher

Literally not a thing. Psuedointillectual windbags with literally no skills or value.
Anonymous No.24630217
>>24629404
Quite the refutation.
Anonymous No.24631058 >>24631059 >>24631211 >>24631524 >>24631547 >>24634234 >>24635599
>>24628270 (OP)
It's because it's an embarrassing belief. The foundational condition of life is to fear and avoid death, thus once a living thing develops the capacity for conscious thought, it is simply a matter of course that one's thoughts will turn towards a cope for this death anxiety. Honesty is facing up to reality, that you will die, the things that constitute your mind will cease to function one day, will rot away, and exist no more. Your thoughts will halt, your memories will vanish, your being will be wiped out of reality. Mature rational men must look into this horror unflinchingly, to face it with dignity and accept that it is true, that there is no escape, and that petty fantasies of pleasant eternities are fit for cowards and imbeciles alone. Also, every time you succumb to the desire for an afterlife, and are willing to propose or accept absurdities in service of this illusion, you prove Freud right, so consider that too.
Anonymous No.24631059
>>24631058
Good post
Anonymous No.24631062
>>24629406
There's nothing about them that requires a supernatural explanation.
Anonymous No.24631077
>>24628270 (OP)
Now post the stats for PHDs in philosophy of religion
Anonymous No.24631088
>>24628270 (OP)
https://youtu.be/EFrgpeWh6tQ?si=rQsLViP4AED-elM4
Anonymous No.24631091 >>24631136
>>24628270 (OP)
imagine reading modern midwits
Anonymous No.24631115 >>24631128
People die when they are killed
Anonymous No.24631128 >>24631154
>>24631115
"Not me, I'm built different, I will live forever" - What some people unironically believe
Anonymous No.24631136
>>24631091
It's a part of my research upon plebians and the origins of their thinking
Anonymous No.24631154 >>24631214
>>24631128
Xxxtentacion did. I know several people who claim they’ve seen him in manifest before their eyes since his death, after certain rituals. Similar to Jesus. These are all credible people
Anonymous No.24631184
Why would you expect people whose job is reasoning to endorse something that can be founded only on faith?
Anonymous No.24631211 >>24631214
>>24631058
Thread btfo
Anonymous No.24631214 >>24632522
>>24631211
See >>24631154
Anonymous No.24631224 >>24631522
>>24629406
read up on NDE accounts of non-Christians. It's all lifelong dogma induced hallucinations
Anonymous No.24631522 >>24631983 >>24631987
>>24631224
Plenty of non-Christian NDE'rs wind up in Christian hell and/or heaven and talk to the big JC. You haven't done your homework.
Anonymous No.24631524 >>24631575
>>24631058
Dumbest shit I've ever read.
Anonymous No.24631542
if you hate life: there's no afterlife
if you like life: there's afterlife
Anonymous No.24631547 >>24631572 >>24631577 >>24634106
>>24631058
This is a naive youth's caricature of maturity. The writing style is cliche-ridden and larpy. You are posturing. Consider this: if Christianity is true most people may well end up in hell and eternal suffering is a much scarier prospect than eternal annihilation. Truth is if death were the end that would be very sweet. Doesn't seem to be the case however. You materialist midwits will only snap out of your smug reddit skepticism when it's too late. Tip your fedoras while you may, eternity awaits on the other side.

Consider also that many renowned modern thinkers were most likely larping as unbelievers at the bidding of blueblood occultists. Wait, that's not on your highschool textbooks or Wikipedia or your favorite authors so it can't be true. Wild claims. Don't even bother looking into them. Label me a loonie and go your merry way. Trust only official sources. Epstein killed himself and heaven is a fantasy. We are but dreaming animals. It's all gonna be ok.
Anonymous No.24631572 >>24631618 >>24631695
>>24631547
Gentlemen, a textbook case of Freudian death denial. Note how desperately he clings to his illusion. How it drives him to launch accusations of "cliche-ridden and larpy" writing, followed by "You materialist midwits will only snap out of your smug reddit skepticism".

The only sound advice or lucid thought is when this anon welcomed us to label him a loon. I shall take him up on his offer.
Anonymous No.24631575
>>24631524
>Holds an embarrassing belief
Anonymous No.24631577
>>24631547
BASADO POSTO
Anonymous No.24631618 >>24632504
>>24631572
Guenon, Schuon, Evola. Auden, Eliot, Yeats. Tolstoy, Dostoevsty. Augustine, Abelard, Aquinas. One could go on. They all believed in some sort of afterlife. Some sort of continuation of the self in the Beyond after one croaks. They believed it out of hickish credulity and maidenish cowardice no doubt. Rubes and dupes the lot of them.

So let's turn to actual thinkers. Men like William James. Well, turns out he believed in ghosts. Nevermind. How about the master of sleuthing, Conan Doyle? He was a practicing spiritualist. Attended seances. Oh shit.

Freud. Freud found himself before a man having visions of Jesus and hell and the rest of it and just called it a Teufelsneurose. Just chalked it up to the dude being a lazy bum and the visions being his cope. Freud ever the rigorous thinker. Stray one inch from his firmly held skepticism and even within his circle we find credulity again. We find Jung and Reich holding to all sorts of paranormal beliefs. How quickly irrationality creeps back in when one is not keeping watch. So much for science and the enlightenment. Where is my fedora when I need it. It's a tipping compulsion at this point. It soothes me.

Thing is sticking to respectable literature is like wearing blinders. If you had a lust for truth as I do you would already have realized this. Atheism and all its adjacent -isms are a psyop. Leave the bubble of respectability for a second and listen to dissidents ("schizos") and cross-reference what they say and you will get a more accurate picture of reality. The actual truth is never laid bare on the pages of newspapers and encyclopedias. But you are a vain man who would rather sound clever than know the actual truth.
Anonymous No.24631661
>>24628272
Literally refuted thousands of years ago.

>Orestes applies his pre-existing notion of the Furies onto existing stimuli thus creating for himself the illusion of having seen the Furies.
Anonymous No.24631695 >>24632508
>>24631572
Wasn't Ernest Becker into underage boys or something?
Anonymous No.24631983
>>24631522
The fuck did you figure out what "Christian hell and heaven" looks like?
Besides, this is entirely compatible with hallucination/false memories, these people are as much subject to psychological priming as Christians. They watch the same movies and have the same expectation of what an NDE is supposed to be.

What would be impressive evidence, is if you somehow had Sentinel Island natives, that never have been isolated from the wider world, making reports of meeting Jesus at the pearly gates.


Theologically what is even supposed to be going on? God did an oopsie and accidentally sent their souls to heaven by mistake, just for the doctor to yoink it back to the mortal coil? Seriously
This is not something I would except to happen if Christianity was true, I don't think God makes mistakes.
Anonymous No.24631987 >>24632082 >>24632089
>>24631522
The fuck did you figure out what "Christian hell and heaven" looks like?
Besides, this is entirely compatible with hallucination/false memories, these people are as much subject to psychological priming as Christians. They watch the same movies and have the same expectation of what an NDE is supposed to be.

What would be impressive evidence, is if you somehow had Sentinel Island natives, that have been isolated from the wider world, making reports of meeting Jesus at the pearly gates.


Theologically what is even supposed to be going on? God did an oopsie and accidentally sent their souls to heaven by mistake, just for the doctor to yoink it back to the mortal coil? Seriously
This is not something I would except to happen if Christianity was true, I don't think God makes mistakes.
Anonymous No.24632082 >>24632198
>>24631987
I'm just going where the evidence leads me. Were it up to me there'd be no heaven and no hell. There's videos out there of Buddhists and Muslims who have had Jesus NDEs. But yeah prolly cause they saw some looney tunes cartoon as a child where bugs bunny goes to hell or whatever. Case solved. #Science #Rational #Peer-Review
Anonymous No.24632089 >>24632206
>>24631987
>The fuck did you figure out what "Christian hell and heaven" looks like?

According to NDE experiencers it looks about as one would imagine them. (Gah, how grossly unscientific.) Also in hell people die and revive over and over. Grisly death, molecule-by-molecule regeneration, rinse repeat forever. Consistent pattern across hell NDEs. Funny how they all hallucinate this same detail. Or maybe they're all in cahoots, spinning the same lie? Yes, yes, very plausible. The answer to the riddle at last. For we are modern men and men of science.
Anonymous No.24632102
>>24628272
Lmao, welcome back NDE-spammer
Anonymous No.24632121 >>24632138
>>24628270 (OP)
They’re all Marxists or post modernists and far too politically motivated and anti-Catholic to believe in an after life.

I say this not really to discredit their views but to point out that there isn’t much diversity in type.

I also personally think philosophy is full of mediocrity with bad education that don’t understand the Greeks or the canon so to speak.

Just a bloated profession where certain political views bring in money and other views do not.
While they are philosophers by title of their academic speciality they are not lovers of wisdom in the broader sense.
None of this is to say they’re wrong of course, just that polling them isn’t very interesting or surprising. It’s like polling the clergy on belief in an afterlife. They’re all educated and professionally and financially dependent an certain views
Anonymous No.24632134
>>24628270 (OP)
Has it occurred to you that there might be a reason for this?
Anonymous No.24632135
>>24629492
What am I if I'm intellectually quite sure there is nothing it could conceivably mean for a moral claim to be factually true or false but seem to be incapable of alieving this?
Anonymous No.24632138
>>24632121
Why do you specify anti-Catholic, in particular? Catholicism is far from the only belief system to postulate an afterlife.
Anonymous No.24632198 >>24632490
>>24632082
The evidence leads you exactly no where on it's own, and I don't understand what the theory is supposed to be
Anonymous No.24632206 >>24632490
>>24632089
>Grisly death, molecule-by-molecule regeneration, rinse repeat forever. Consistent pattern across hell NDEs.
You're literally just making stuff up
Anonymous No.24632212
Guys lets all go smoke DMT and then come back in 30 minutes. OK? Ready .. set ..
Anonymous No.24632314 >>24632495 >>24632535 >>24632658
Is this the best NDE case? The "prosaic" explanation sounds like utter bs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pam_Reynolds_case
Anonymous No.24632490
>>24632198
>The evidence leads you exactly no where on it's own, and I don't understand what the theory is supposed to be

Right. You have no brain. Got it. You need Pinker or Sloterdijk or the Peer-Reviewers of Official Science to look at the data and issue a verdict. Cool.

>>24632206
Am not. I reiterate: consistent pattern. Look it up. But you won't look it up. And yet you blab and sneer. Typical normie.
Anonymous No.24632495 >>24632530 >>24632543 >>24632564
>>24632314
Imbecile. There are thousands of testimonies on youtube. Just regular people talking about their experiences. Ah, but yes: "anecdotal evidence". Evidence not yet rendered holy by the sacrament of peer-review. You ever seen one of these "peers"? They are reddit incarnate. Basedence indeed. And yet you fags trust them with your very souls.
Anonymous No.24632501
s 0 y ence*
Anonymous No.24632504 >>24632514
>>24631618
Are you under the impression that Great Writers are without mental flaws? That artists cannot succumb to vice, and that one supreme vice of self deception? Your post is meaningless.
Anonymous No.24632508
>>24631695
Ernest Becker was a psychotic little neurotic terrified of his own poop.
Anonymous No.24632514 >>24632575
>>24632504
Yeah they were all idiots and you're the smart cookie. If only they had your robustness of intellect, your staggering lucidity in all matters.
Anonymous No.24632522
>>24631214
>Xxxtentacion

HOLY KEK
Anonymous No.24632530 >>24632543 >>24632554
>>24632495
Are you inbred? Do you know what I meant by prosaic explanation?
Anonymous No.24632535
>>24632314
What's most likely Pam Reynolds making stuff up, or magic?
Anonymous No.24632543 >>24632547
>>24632530
>>24632495
Second paragraph:
>An anesthesiologist who examined the case offered anesthesia awareness as a more prosaic and conventional explanation for such claims
Anonymous No.24632547 >>24632556
>>24632543
>An anesthesiologist

lmao
Anonymous No.24632553
I don't get it, if you believe in miracles
Is NDEs really the best you got? Why not roll out the eucharist miracles, and people whose back stopped hurting after prayer
Anonymous No.24632554
>>24632530
I score exceptionally well on verbal IQ tests and I'm ESL. I understand the words you employ better than you yourself understand them.
Anonymous No.24632556 >>24632570
>>24632547
Look, bro. You're just too dumb for figuring stuff out
Just believe whatever you want. Nobody was disagreeing with you. You just don't understand what words mean.
Anonymous No.24632564 >>24632579
Right. So this post >>24632495 , is very strange if you know what the word prosaic means.
Anonymous No.24632570
>>24632556
Fucking lol.
Anonymous No.24632575 >>24632592
>>24632514
Black and white thinking. You believe they were either total geniuses without flaws or all idiots. Like speaking to a child.
Anonymous No.24632579 >>24632636 >>24632657
>>24632564
Right. I read your post too quickly. I'm extremely sorry. Too many guys calling me an idiot for thinking there's something more to NDEs than mere hallucinations. I thought you were another one of them. Big fail on my part. I'll take a break from this thread.
Anonymous No.24632592 >>24632614 >>24632657
>>24632575
You're the child. Religion was *central* to all the writers I namedropped and they were smarter than you and I. Frivolous to assume they would have blundered on that which for them was most important. Norm MacDonald made this same point come to think of it. Take the best writers (the Tolstoys rather than the Bukowskis) and a great deal of them were Christians. Coincidence? Yeah, yeah. A mere coincidence. The belief area of their brains was stupid is all. This is the mature, nuanced stance here. And now I'll take a break.
Anonymous No.24632603 >>24634213 >>24634217 >>24634282
Just lol at the level of cope people's fear of death and oblivion will take them.
Anonymous No.24632614 >>24634208
>>24632592
Tolstoy was excommunicated because his beliefs drifted too far from what was "acceptable" by the church. Religion is a cultural construct, a set of enforced beliefs on people to make them more integrated with other people around them. And this mechanism works whether it's Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, or Voodoo. It has no bearing on the truth claims therein. Now, stop reflexively lashing out when I accurately describe your state of mind on this topic, because, once again, you are leaning in to an argument by authority "these smart people shared my illusion, therefore my illusion is real", which is the essence of childish thinking. Stop and take a moment to actually think about this matter for yourself instead of exporting your thinking to people who lived over a hundred years ago where to live in society at all meant you were demanded to share the communally agreed upon illusion.
Anonymous No.24632636
>>24632579
You are an idiot
Anonymous No.24632655 >>24632664 >>24632669 >>24633091
Why are people so pissy about what others believe will happen after death?
Anonymous No.24632657 >>24634177
>>24632579
>>24632592
I hope, during your break, you will actually reflect on your opinions expressed here and question why you believe them, whether it is a bias on your part and whether you are open to being persuaded out of those opinions or whether you hold intractably to them like dogma.
Anonymous No.24632658 >>24634177
>>24632314
>The "prosaic" explanation sounds like utter bs
Naturally non-supernatural explanations are going to be longer, ad hoc and involve a lot of guesswork when we don't have all the facts.
I can understand why retards prefer to go for short and concise supernatural explanation: NDEs are magic
Anonymous No.24632664 >>24635615
>>24632655
Probably the thousands of years of history where people say "I believe I know what happens after death and that means I can tell you what to do in this life". The tide is turning against such infantile superstition and now you can and should be openly mocked for such ridiculous beliefs.
Anonymous No.24632669
>>24632655
You are the most persecuted.
Anonymous No.24632687
>>24628276
why, my peenus weanus of course :)

hahah! :D

it's my weeeeeenus peanus! :) hahah

ITT: What's so great about personal afterlife? - my answer is, of course, my peanus weenus :D

hahaha!
Anonymous No.24633091
>>24632655
Jesus told you this was gonna happen, don't be surprised
Anonymous No.24634026
>>24628270 (OP)
Who cares? Philosophy as a profession has just been reduced to an academic exercise largely focused on historical interpretation. The real philosophers out there are just watching, because there's nothing else they can do at this point. The world doesn't want philosophy right now. It wants to succumb to the environment it has created.
Anonymous No.24634106 >>24634159
>>24631547
>um actually my imaginary friend likes to torture people and he's going to get you
Do you have any idea how little pause this gives me? You are a gullible retard.
Anonymous No.24634159 >>24634388
>>24634106
Do you think I WANT to believe in hell? Do you think I DON'T WISH I could casually dismiss the implications of NDE reports (when rigorously examined and not shallowly dismissed as is the rule itt and everywhere)? Are you all functionally illiterate?
Anonymous No.24634177 >>24634227 >>24634305
>>24632657
>>24632658
I have had far too many paranormal experiences in my own life and read far too much about the subject from all sorts of different sources to ever be able to default back into mainstream ass atheism or vague agnosticism or any other flavor of polite incredulity. Your snark is meaningless. You simply don't know what you're talking about. I know all the Nietzsche and Voltaire and Sagan arguments one may invoke against my beliefs. I have seen the George Carlin routines. I have seen it all and it's all shit. It all falls short. But it convinces the likes of you. And *I'm* the rube.

I WANTED to be an atheist. I have tried being one. I don't believe because I want to. I believe reluctantly. I go where the facts lead. Whereas most people go where the elegant verdicts lead. Whatever the fashionable consensus is. I get it, I've been there.

The fact that your opinions align with wikipedia and the NYT and highschool textboks should make you reconsider. You confuse verisimilitude with truth and this verisimilitude has been fashioned for you by people whose actual beliefs would shock you. I have more respect for freemasons and glowies who know the score but pretend they don't than I have for smugly skeptical normies.
Anonymous No.24634204 >>24634216
>>24628728
Could have just said you are a retard.
Anonymous No.24634208 >>24634313
>>24632614
Your sobriety of tone and paternal condescension notwithstanding, you are stating painfully obvious and demonstrably false banalities. Voodoo holds societies together? It tears them apart. Because it works. Ask your nearest Catholic exorcist. Whose Greek and Latin are probably better than yours. But you are the enlightened gentleman and not him. You are the highbrow in the heights, regarding humanity's credulity with a smirk. And yet your sober picture of Real Life, Maturely Considered, Shorn of All Fables & Superstition is a walt disney set and you fail to realize it. Our atheistic cultural climate was engineered by occultists. And this truth hurts, which is why you can't bring yourself to consider my actual arguments, so you latch onto my tone.

Yes, had Eliot and Auden been zoomers they would be unbelievers just like you. I am clinging to the beliefs of pre-scientific barbarians. I cannot think on my own. Hahaha yeah. I have already talked about psi research upthread. There's a copious literature about it. Science never disproved the supernatural, quite the contrary in fact. Official science only *pretends* it did. And then its apparatchiks like Randi and Dennett pen their little books and do their little tours sowing the seeds of unbelief the world over. And guys like go "whoa". Meanwhile these niggas are probably freemasons. Public intellectuals (even eminent philosophers) are largely larpers playing roles. Bolsheviks vs. Mensheviks began as intramural Russian Freemasonry skirmish. What we see in the news is the exoteric fallout of the alchemy wrought within the lodges.

But there is no use spilling the beans. All it does is draw the attention of glowies while you will remain firmly, elegantly and eruditely skeptical in your convictions. Go ahead and call me a child once more.
Anonymous No.24634213 >>24635123
>>24632603
The prospect of hell is infinitely more terrifying. How do people not get this.
Anonymous No.24634216
>>24634204
Snark doesn't work on me, normie.
Anonymous No.24634217
>>24628270 (OP)
what did you mean by this? impressionistic vague frogpostetr retard. shitty thread made to increase board PPH
if board had ids this would be 1pbtid
>>24628272
you dunning kruger victim didn't properly look into NDE either. they're irrelevant
>>24628963
as relevant as NDEs
>>24628969
>subjective layman assessment of an emergent function's presence
>>24632603
unfortunately death only goes as far as memory loss and afterlife is worse
Anonymous No.24634218 >>24634223
>>24629530
>Nigga don't do this, you're just giving the fedoras ammunition.

Don't speak the truth because I may lose le arguement. NDE cucks keep losing
Anonymous No.24634220
>>24630117
>women, browns, blacks and the sexually deviant
shouldn't we have dionysian vicca witchtok aztec hoodo schizokino then? I think you're leaving one relevant ethnic-religous group
Anonymous No.24634223 >>24634225
>>24634218
Life is short, we will all soon croak, and it's not gonna be lights out (if only it were). Winning a discussion is irrelevant. You will find out the truth soon enough.
Anonymous No.24634225 >>24634265
>>24634223
>You will find out the truth soon enough
had NDE, researched them, calling you out for bullshit
Anonymous No.24634227 >>24634258
>>24634177
In what god do you believe. Feel free to give us your proof which you cannot ignore instead of boring us with high school level self-righteous drivel.
Anonymous No.24634234 >>24634262
>>24631058
>Freud Freud Freud
The guy who ended up seriously considering telepathic dreams is your argument?
Anonymous No.24634258 >>24634305
>>24634227
The Christian God, given the universal exorcistic efficacy of Jesus' name. Buddhist and Muslim exorcists not as efficacious. Even occultists know full well the Jewish/Christian God is something else altogether. Ask them. I've seen exorcisms personally. Maybe all higher religions like Islam and Hinduism have a glimpse of the truth. With lower religions like voodoo and santeria it's more like religion degenerating into outright sorcery (which contra Marcel Mauss et al is not merely symbolic anthropological whatever, truth is magic works). The pantheons of gods tend to be similar across different cultures just like the demon groupings in demoniacs tend to manifest in particular patterns which if the whole thing were mere hysteria well... how does mere hysteria write out such complex scripts again and again across history and cultures. If you actually read books by Christian exorcists you would see how terribly short the skeptical explanations fall.

Read Malachi Martin, Tertullians Apology, Exorcism and Enlightenment by Erik Midrlfort (non Christian academic, sympathetic non-skeptical view, best academic book on subject I have yet found), read books on psi research.

Media subtext everywhere consistently atheistic. Subtext works on subconscious. Cultural climate thereby created. Your convictions are not your own. The elites harbor a strange devilish hate for Jesus which I daresay is another confirmation of the truth of Christianity.

Yeah I drink too much coffee and am arrogant and sarcastic. Not very Christian of me I'm sorry. If I say kind words you fags will still call me an idiot tho. Tricky situation. Considering *you're* the idiots. But I only speak harshly that you may see the light.
Anonymous No.24634262
>>24634234
Even Freud was right sometimes.
Anonymous No.24634265
>>24634225
Why don't you tell us about your NDE?
Anonymous No.24634282
>>24632603
I believe on NDEs as a possibility only. I don't use it as a coping mechanism.
Anonymous No.24634305 >>24634333
>>24634177
You have a wellspring of credulity in all the wrong places. How you can convince yourself that the most basic type of theism, which is shared universally among uneducated, superstitious people who have "visions" (read: spooky dreams), somehow makes you someone who "knows the score" and above normies is comical. You are the normie. You fell into the most common illusion among all of mankind. The quintessential death cope. The very heart of naivete. You are the exact kind of mark that people who are actually in the know prey upon.
>>24634258
Ah, I see you are just a straight up schizo. Carry on.
Anonymous No.24634313 >>24634343
>>24634208
You've made no argument beyond a facile appeal to authority and the smug insinuation that people who believe in literal devils and demons that can be defeated with two bits of wood crossing each other are the heights of intellect.

Name one reliable prediction you can make on the assumption of the "supernatural", any bit of technology developed from this premise, any bit of useful information that can be measured against reality empirically along these lines. I'll wait.

You have fallen into a pit of unfalsifiable fantasies that appeal to your innate biases. You lack the faculties to counteract this temptation into error. Sad.
Anonymous No.24634319
Don't get me wrong, anons. I sorta wish Christianity was not real. Exorcist priests annoy me and exorcisms are an unpleasant subject. Talking too openly about it is like baring a nasty infected wound. People who have NDEs piss me off as well. I don't want confirmation of the afterlife. Being religious is boring. Everything is a sin. Life loses its color, its adventure. Becomes way too stern. An obnoxious middle-eastern ascetic seriousness. Dull desert vibe. Miss me with that shit.

And yet no. You look at the patterns and welp. Turns out Jesus Christ is God. You can make it more pleasant by reading Chesterton and listening to Bach and all that crap. You can hang out with cute zoomettes at the nearest nondenom megachurch youth group if you're young. It's not necessarily bad. Indeed you can attain a deep mystical bliss if you fully surrender to God like Alyosha Karamazov. Eye of the needle and all that. Renounce all that you may gain all. St. Francis was a bum and was happuer than all of us. I have known this gladness at times.
Anonymous No.24634333 >>24634737 >>24635796
>>24634305
The irony here is that I can state YOUR position better than you yourself can, because I know it and can see through it. I would be a better apostle of atheism than you if I wanted to. Nothing you say is new to me. It all sounds faux-clever. Elegant midwit platitudes.

Sure, endless dumbies out there who believe that Christianity is true. But so did Eliot, Waugh, Hopkins, Kierkegaard, Barth. Men of erudition and sophistication and genius. Christians. Many such cases. Are you smarter than them?

Or should I regard Hitchens, Voltaire, Harris, Dawkins, Sartre more highly than them? Would I be in better company with these? Are these then the guys who know the score? Please say yes so I can buy their books. I don't want to be a mark. I want to be smart like you.

Ah, yes. I delve into subjects cordoned off by the establishment in order to wrest truth from the mud to your utter faggy horror. I talk of devils and telekinesis and freemasons and you gasp like a maiden. Let's keep things respectable please. May our gaze not be too omnidirectional. May we stare only at that which is right before us. The big periodicals; the elegant, academia-sanctioned bibliographies; the peer-reviewed studies. Processed food for the faggot's brain.
Anonymous No.24634338
13Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14But small is the gate and narrow the way that leads to life, and only a few find it. 15Beware of false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.…
Anonymous No.24634343 >>24634751 >>24635226
>>24634313
Read everything Colin Wilson has written on the subject of psi research. He provides an ample bbliography for further reading. Just pirate the PDFs. This shit has been proven. Repeatedly. Controlled experiments. Rigorous, replicable, falsifiable. And it's officially denied by officialdom at large always and everywhere, of course. Establishment policy. Real science has been an underground, classified affair since the 1950s.

I have experienced precognition but it's not a power I can control at will. A lot of technology and scientific breakthroughs emerge as sudden epiphanies as is well known. Book of Enoch, Tesla, structure of DNA. Renaissance thinkers steeped in the occult. Science and occult ever married until arbitrarily separated in modernity.

You hold fast to the one fantasy it is socially acceptable to hold and believe yourself a free thinker.
Anonymous No.24634388
>>24634159
What you want doesn't matter. The nature of the human ability to imagine anything, whether real or unreal, has been exploited to make you believe in the single most terrifying thing imaginable. Extreme suffering forever. Try and think about it without referencing a system: is there such a thing as forever when it comes to a subjective experience?
Don't you find it to be a profound coincidence that your greatest fear is the greatest fear imaginable for a human being?
Anonymous No.24634402 >>24634465
If theism was the mainstream stance, this place would be strictly and militantly materialistic. There is nothing here worth reading once you understand that every thought stems only from the contrarianism of the pathologically lonely.
Anonymous No.24634465
>>24634402
Anonymous No.24634524
I believe in an ocean of conciousness to which everyone returns at death but not in an afterlife. The reunion with the ocean is the end of the personal mind.

There is definitely more to existence than the material.
Anonymous No.24634737
>>24634333
>Christianity true cuz Kirkegard > Voltaire
amazing
Anonymous No.24634751
>>24634343
Epiphanies are compatible with naturalism.

Would people be able to use these supernatural powers for stuff like predicting the lottery numbers?
Where there's no competing natural explanation
Anonymous No.24634955 >>24635408
>>24628272
NDEs actually don't do shit to prove anything. Want to know why? Because everyone's NDEs are wildly different depending on their cultural background. Same thing with schizophrenia. One of the most interesting phenomenons with it is just how wildly different the hallucinations and the sufferers reactions to them are depending on the part of the world you're in.

Theres zero consistency among them when you look at NDE cases globally. But this isn't really an admonishment of faith, I think its actually a useful tool in this regard, but NDEs themselves aren't an argument for the supernatural in any way.
Anonymous No.24635123 >>24635174
>>24634213
Because they don't believe in it, never felt it and don't even pretend to try as an exercise. It also allows them to roleplay as the badasses facing the harsh reality while psychiatrizing any other position.
Anonymous No.24635174 >>24635209
>>24635123
You can believe in an afterlife, without it being God torturing you forever
Anonymous No.24635199
Christians:
>Religious trauma isn't real, people claiming to have been stressed out and anxious about hell are mentally ill and lying
also Christians:
>I am the biggest boy. I believe in the scariest fairytales. I am a tough guy
Anonymous No.24635209 >>24635329
>>24635174

Actually, an argument can be made that humans really can't. The negative aspects of human psychology are by far the stronger and dominant affects, which is why these spiteful and vindictive affects manifest themselves so regularly in various forms of an unpleasant afterlife. Religion in general is nothing else than a series of projections of humanity's strongest emotional feelings-the negative ones-onto a narrative worldview, always imagined out of whole cloth.

It takes someone as mean-spirited as a human being not only to assert hell, but, adding insult to injury, to insist that it is just. And they do it all the time.
Anonymous No.24635226 >>24635329
>>24634343
The entire financial world is looking for an edge over their competitors to accumulate more capital. Can you name one company that uses "psi research" to gain that edge?

As a stock trader, can you outperform the S&P 500 with your "precognition"? No? So basically whenever you measure this stuff against material reality it is no better than chance or guessing? Right. Throwing yourself into woo woo doesn't make you a free thinker. It makes you a mark to be conned.
Anonymous No.24635299 >>24635304
>>24628270 (OP)
>The reverent relation to one's own past, which depends on a real continuity of memory, and which is possible only by comprehension, can be shown in relation to a still wider and deeper subject.

>Whether a man has a real relationship to his own past or not, involves the question as to whether he has a desire for immortality, or if the idea of death is indifferent to him.

>The desire for immortality is to-day, as a rule, treated shamefully, and in a very different spirit.

>Not only is the problem treated as merely ontological, but the psychological side of it is only trifled with. It has been held that it is connected, like the doctrine of the transmigration of souls, with the feeling that we have all experienced, when, in doing something certainly for the first time, we seem to remember having gone through the same experience before. Another generally adopted view is to derive the idea of immortality from the belief in spirits, as has been done by Tylor, Spencer, Avenarius, and others, although in any other age than this age of experimental psychology it would have been dismissed a priori. I am sure that it must seem impossible to the majority of thinking men to regard a belief so important to mankind, about which there has been so much strife, as merely the last stage in a syllogism of which the first premiss is the midnight dream of a dead man. How can phenomena of that kind explain the belief in the continuity of their lives after death held so firmly by Goethe or Bach, or the desire for immortality which speaks to us in Beethoven's last sonatas ? The desire for the persistence of the conscious self must spring from sources mightier than these feeble rationalistic guesses.

>The deeper source of the belief depends on the relation of a man to his own past. Our consciousness and vision of the past is the strongest ground for our desire to be conscious in the future. The man who values his past, who holds his mental life in greater respect than his corporeal life, is not willing to give up his consciousness at death. And so this organic primary desire for immortality is strongest in men of genius, in the men whose pasts are richest.
https://youtu.be/-yQVtXTjQtI?si=RxEIW1YOZEmw_sa3
Anonymous No.24635304
>>24635299
>This connection between the desire for immortality and memory receives strong support from what is related by those who have been rescued from sudden death. Even if they had not thought it out before they relive their past in a few moments, at once and with frantic rapidity. The feeling of what is impending brings in violent contrast the intensity of the present consciousness and the idea that it may cease forever. In reality we know very little of the mental state of the dying. It takes more than an ordinary person to interpret it, and for reasons connected with what I have been saying men of genius usually avoid death-beds. But it is quite wrong to ascribe the sudden appearance of religion in so many people who are fatally ill, to a desire to make sure of their future state. It is extremely superficial to assume that the doctrine of hell can for the first time assume such an importance to the dying as to make them afraid to pass away "with a lie on their lips."

>The important point is this : Why do men who have lived throughout a lying life feel towards the end a sudden desire for truth ? And why are others so horrified, although they do not believe in punishment in the next world, when they hear of a man dying with a lie on his lips or with an unrepented action ? And why have both the hardness of heart until the end and the death-bed repentance appealed so forcibly to the imagination of poets ? The discussion as to the " euthanasia " of atheists, which was so popular in the eighteenth century, is more than a mere historical curiosity as F. A. Lange considered it

>I adduce these considerations not merely to suggest a possibility which is hardly more than a guess. It seems to be unthinkable that it is not the case that many more people than actual geniuses have some trace of genius. The quantitative difference in natural endowment will be most marked at the moment when the endowment becomes active. And for most men this moment is the point of death. If we were not accustomed to regard men of genius as a separate class shut off from the others like the payers of income-tax, we should find less difficulty ingrafting these new ideas on the old. And just as the earliest recollections of childhood which a man has are not the result of some external event breaking through the continuity of the past course of his life, but are the result of his internal development, there comes to every one a day on which his consciousness is so intensified that remembrance remains, and from that time onwards, according to his endowment, more or fewer remembrances are formed(a factor which by itself upsets the whole of modern psychology), so in different men there are many different stimulants of the consciousness of which the last is the hour of death, and from the point of view of their degree of genius men might almost be classified by the number of things that excite their consciousness
Anonymous No.24635329 >>24635778
>>24635209
I don't think hell is just, Nietzsche. I didn't invent hell out of spite. Not my doing. Thing is it's not a mere *concept*. A great deal of people flatline and have extremely vivid and complex multi-sensorial experiences of hell and then are somehow revived and report what they have seen and heard (and sometimes smelt and touched). Just type "hell" and "NDE" on youtube. I don't want this crap to be true, nigga. It's just scary how many testimonies of this there are. And materialistic explanations fail to soothe me. Too facile.

Ever read Swedenborg? Dude had countless hell and heaven NDEs. Wrote books about it. Very interesting. His explanation is selfish people go to hell and selfless people go to heaven. To grossly simplify. Hell is Hobbesian. All against all, mutual predation.

>>24635226
You think most billionaires and high echelon politicians are not neck deep in the occult? And I'm the mark?

Anyway I'm done with this thread. Believe whatever you want.
Anonymous No.24635389 >>24635574
How do I summon a succubus?
Anonymous No.24635408 >>24635567 >>24635618
>>24634955
Just shows you havent researched NDE in the slightest. They absolutely have recurring themes and similar ideas
Anonymous No.24635567 >>24635595 >>24635607
>>24635408
What do you think best explains why that is, culture+ human biology, or a supernatural explanation?
Anonymous No.24635574
>>24635389
cryptocurrency and neck tats
Anonymous No.24635595 >>24635667
>>24635567
your obvious naturalistic hypothesis is painfully and excruciatingly obvious

we are all aware of it

"it's just culturally conditioned hallucinations yall!!" if only it were that simple

mfers invoking ockham's razor and it always just means defaulting to mainstream consensus like a bitch

how utterly utterly tiresome
Anonymous No.24635599 >>24635784
>>24631058
Cringe modern atheist line of thinking
>humans fear death
>belief/faith in the afterlife reduces fear of death in many humans
>therefore belief/faith in afterlife = cope ! ! ! !
It's just as retarded as 99% of evolutionary psychology
Making up unfounded simple sounding bullshit to try to handwave away complex phenomenons
Anonymous No.24635607
>>24635567
"human biology"

do you even know your periodic table

let alone arcane shit like morphogenetic fields (ooo pseudo science alert!!!!)

sydney sweenie has great jeans yall. human biodiversity. darwins origin of the species. dna & rna. neil strauss & tucker max. heil hitler
Anonymous No.24635615 >>24635781
>>24632664
>The tide is turning
You missed the boat, you're just a retarded bandwagoner now
Anonymous No.24635618 >>24635643
>>24635408
What kind of consistency are we expecting on the theory that people having NDEs go to heaven/hell, then are yeeted back out?
We expecting exact consistency, like the people meeting Jesus being able draw the same person if helped out by a police sketch artist? Or we just expecting very vague consistency, IE: felt at ease, a bright light - fear, pain.

The problem with supernatural explanations is that there's no constrains on them. You could pick any of the above, or anything in-between. Or make up something entirely different.
Can of course always make them more ad hoc, by mapping them on to whatever data we happen to observe, and claim it's what you'd expect. With no method to figure out if the explanation is true or false.


Natural explanations are more restricted, in that they are limited to fit together with what we already know about human biology, etc.
IE, Pam Reynolds viewpoint floating out of her body and looking down on her self from a 3rd person viewpoint in the roof, is just not going to be on the table. As that is inconsistent with what we know about how vision work. So you're not gonna have that as part of the theory.
Anonymous No.24635643 >>24635682
>>24635618
>doesnt know about OBEs & astral projection& adjacent phenomena
>doesn't know these phenomena have been scientifically verified
>arbitrarily posits that consistency across NDE reports has to be 100% & mathematically meticulous in all details or else is irrelevant
>arbitrarily declares it all vague and anathematizes all vagueness
>arbitrarily declares evidence "out of the table" because it doesn't fit contemporary naturalistic dogma
>thinks he is thereby being "scientific"

you utter and absolute clown
Anonymous No.24635667 >>24635690
>>24635595
Why do you chose the less likely explanation? Are you irrational, are you retarded?
Anonymous No.24635682 >>24635699
>>24635643
Just answer the question
On your theory, what kind of consistency are we expecting among NDE accounts?
If you can't give a principled answer, how could consistency even be evidence
Anonymous No.24635690 >>24635696 >>24635711
>>24635667
who says it's less likely? according to whose metaphysics? do you realize the arbitrariness of your position? you don't, do you?

i would gladly accept a naturalistic explanation for these types of phenomena if they could plausibly explain them. which they can't. hence the necessity of reconsidering one's fundamental metaphysical pressupositions. know what i mean? ever do that? who am i kidding. you fucking idiot.
Anonymous No.24635696
>>24635690
You literally said the naturalistic theory was "painfully and excruciatingly obvious"
I took this as you saying the natural theory was more likely

>which they can't.
Be specific. What can a natural theory not explain?
If you somehow had accounts from Sentinel Islanders that they met Jesus. That's the kind of stuff I think would be inexplicable.
Anonymous No.24635699 >>24635720
>>24635682
they share many many significant similarities. someone made a pdf listing them. god knows where i would find it now. try googling it. but how about you watch nde reports and write the patterns down. why should i spoonfeed you. my problem with you is how fundamentally clunky your thinking is. you are dogmatically naturalistic and think that equals rigorous thinking. and people who think like you are legion. you are the numerical majority and the reason the world is doomed.
Anonymous No.24635711 >>24635745
>>24635690
>according to whose metaphysics?
Yours.

You wake up, and you shoes are missing, even if you distinctly recall putting them in their usual place before going to be.
We got 2 competing theories for why your shoes are gone, a supernatural theory, and a natural theory.
Both theories predict and fully explains the data (your missing shoes).

The supernatural theory: The magic shoe-stealing fairy took your shoes
The natural theory: Your mom threw them out, your shoes were starting to smell real bad.

You of course go with the natural theory, as the most likely explanation.
Anonymous No.24635720 >>24635745
>>24635699
I'm not asking for reports or data
I am asking for how you went about figuring what kind of consistency to expect in the first place, given your theory. (theory being that the almost dead people go to heaven/hell, then are janked back by the doctors doing life saving procedures, etc)
feel free to correct me if that is a misrepresentation of your theory

I'm asking how you figured out that data is evidence in favour of your theory.
Anonymous No.24635745 >>24635749 >>24635764
>>24635711
bad analogy.

>>24635720
i don't have a final verdict. there's a bigger picture. ndes are just one type of psi phenomenon. i have experienced psi phenomena and studied them and know they are real. i don't give a fuck if you and richard dawkins and college teachers at large think i'm retarded. it's all lies. atheism is a large-scale lie. modernity is a gnostic lie. theater for the masses.

you think i'm crazy. i don't give a fuck. i'm tired of typing on this goddamn phone. forgive my harsh words i should be more gentle and patient. take care fren.
Anonymous No.24635749 >>24635772
>>24635745
It's not an analogy.
It's an example of you choosing the natural explanation.
Anonymous No.24635764 >>24635780
>>24635745
You have still completely failed to answer what I'm asking.

For whatever amount of consistency we observe to be evidence. You need to have a reason to expect that amount of consistency, given your supernatural theory.
Else this supposed consistency you keep pointing at, is literally not evidence in favour of your theory.
I don't know how to frame myself clearer.


Look, I don't expect you to answer. At least not in a principled way. It's just gonna be ad hoc.
This was supposed draw out a fundamental problem with your approach.
Anonymous No.24635772 >>24635779
>>24635749
it's an analogy between your charming missing shoes scenario and the terrifying and unexplainable phenomenon of near death experiences. vivid nightmares that feel more real than real life (EVERYONE who has an nde says this) where the damned die and revive over and over again (another recurring pattern) in a place of darkness and flames and devils (more patterns) and people are punished according to their sins dante-style (ding ding more patterns, most hell ndes feature this one) etc. yep just dying people having their final brainfart. this is the rational explanation. just the ole extremely vivid and gruesome hell hallucination before the lights go out. ockham's razor folks.
Anonymous No.24635778 >>24635786
>>24635329
>You think most billionaires and high echelon politicians are not neck deep in the occult?
Most billionaires get that way through monopolistic practices/cornering a market with a cartel of like-minded companies rigging the market. Not by praying to a demon or doing some blood ritual in robes by candle light. You are genuinely a schizo, get help.
Anonymous No.24635779 >>24635789
>>24635772
>vivid nightmares that feel more real than real life (EVERYONE who has an nde says this) where the damned die and revive over and over again
Now you're just lying.

Unless you're using some weird kind of definition of NDE, where only people who report "vivid nightmares that feel more real than real life where the damned die and revive over and over again" is counted as an NDE
then you're claim would be trivially true, by definition
Anonymous No.24635780 >>24635787
>>24635764
i have answered your rigorous and scholarly query in the post above in response to the other anon.

feast upon these infernal patterns. marvel at their consistency.

and yet patterns are but organized clusters of data. what do they mean? why should i know? all i know is facile materialistic explanations fall short. but why do you assume i have settled on a definitive verdict? i *think* hell may well be real given this data.
Anonymous No.24635781 >>24636126
>>24635615
Anonymous No.24635784 >>24636120
>>24635599
Theism is categorically cringe. There are as many forms of theism as there are theists. They can't agree on anything, yet they claim they have some objective source from which they can make conclusions about the fate of their consciousness after death. It's all cope. Your consciousness requires the function of your brain, which we know for 100% certainty will cease to function and rot away. Face reality. Don't be a simpering coward.
Anonymous No.24635786 >>24635803
>>24635778
most billionaires are bluebloods who do ritual incest and blood sacrifices. nepotism yes, cartels yes, but with an occult twist. how do you not know this. you should go out more. you are ontologically normie and your condition is incurable.
Anonymous No.24635787 >>24635797
>>24635780
>why should i know?
That's what *I'm* asking. You claim to know. How do you know?
You are literally using NDEs as evidence for an afterlife.

You can't do that, while at the same time telling me you got no interpretation of the data. You are contradicting yourself.
Zero consistency.
Anonymous No.24635789 >>24635832
>>24635779
just watch or read nde reports you absolute fags. i'm not making any of this up. you have zero knowledge of the subject and want to pontificate about it. amazing.
Anonymous No.24635796 >>24635801 >>24635807
>>24634333
Kierkegaard is famous for acknowledging that theism requires a leap of faith, so why don't you stop appealing to evidence and admit what I've been saying all along, you don't care about evidence, you don't care about reason, you just want to leap into an illusion to save you from the terror of reality. You are literally like a child clinging to his safety blanket because getting on with the business of life with its pain and disappointment is hard. Grow up.
Anonymous No.24635797
>>24635787
sigh

im tired
Anonymous No.24635801 >>24635806
>>24635796
faggot.

you were calling me a credulous rube so i namedropped a bunch of highbrow author names to make the point that one may be intelligent and yet believe. that's all.

you're right guys ndes are just hallucinations and hell doesnt exist. phew. im going to sleep now
Anonymous No.24635803 >>24636914
>>24635786
Which do you think accumulates the wealth? The nepotism and cartels, or the unsavory sexual activity? This is like saying billionaires all work in very tall buildings, so the tall buildings must be giving them special powers! It's so unbelievably cringe I cannot even express it in words.
Anonymous No.24635806 >>24636912
>>24635801
kek, you name dropped people you don't even know the first thing about. Mega cringe, kys immediately.
Anonymous No.24635807 >>24635827
>>24635796
i mean... i namedropped a bunch of authors who were believers of one stripe or another. i dont even like guenon or evola. and now sleepytime
Anonymous No.24635816 >>24635830
Incredible how anyone opposing NDE does not know shit about it. I'm telling you, you will experience it some day, you fags. And I'm not religious at all.
Anonymous No.24635827 >>24636909
>>24635807
As soon as you are outed for having name dropped people you've never read or even had a cursory glance at their work, you are confirmed to be a pseud and not a serious person. Learn from this and be better next time.
Anonymous No.24635830 >>24635863
>>24635816
Bro had a dream and thinks it will come true at death. Amazing.
Anonymous No.24635832 >>24636909
>>24635789
Right, so I looked into the Pam Reynolds NDE case
She did NOT report "vivid nightmares that feel more real than real life where the damned die and revive over and over again"

Why are you constantly lying?
Anonymous No.24635863 >>24635877 >>24635921
>>24635830
https://latterdaysaintmag.com/a-blind-womans-experience-seeing-for-the-first-time-during-a-near-death-experience/

That is my last post. Living in this World being unaware of the spiritual realm must be a sad existence. I have nothing to gain from this, I don't belong to any Religion/Philosophy
Anonymous No.24635877 >>24636264
>>24635863
You're too dumb. Don't try to figure stuff out. Just listen to your parent or something.
Anonymous No.24635921
>>24635863
There is no "spiritual realm" unless you just mean human psychology. Dreams don't tell you about a divine realm, they can only ever tell you about your own mind.
Anonymous No.24636120 >>24636160 >>24636358 >>24637076
>>24635784
You're just as dogmatic as the theists you lambast. But at least every theist is right to some extent in that they deny physicalism which is the most moronic and self defeating modern philosophy.
Suspending your belief and simply viewing the brain as important for consciousness, which it obviously is, is reasonable. Claiming with certainty that consciousness "emerges" from the brain, when consciousness is the means through which we know and experience everything and there's absolutely 0 proof or coherent explanation for the famous "emergence" is just magical thinking, there's no way around that.
Anonymous No.24636126 >>24636356
>>24635781
Thanks for proving my point, illiterate scum.
Anonymous No.24636160
>>24636120
If you hate emergence so much, look into identity theory of mind - where the brain IS the mind
no emergence needed
Anonymous No.24636264
>>24635877
Mate, you are probably unemployed. The soup line is not here.
Anonymous No.24636356
>>24636126
Enjoy being increasingly irrelevant :)
Anonymous No.24636358
>>24636120
Every aspect of consciousness is consistent with a complex information processor, which is literally what the brain is. What are you babbling about?
Anonymous No.24636909 >>24637067
>>24635827
i've read most of them

>>24635832
you looked at *one* case? wow
Anonymous No.24636912
>>24635806
i've read works by pretty much every author i mentioned. but believe what you want
Anonymous No.24636914
>>24635803
why do you think they are into incest? mere naughtiness? no ritual taboo-breaking angle to it? okay yeah. how knowledgeable you are.
Anonymous No.24636915
this thread is like walking in circles. unbelievers simply don't want to believe. there is no god says the fool in his heart. very well. remain in your folly.
Anonymous No.24637067
>>24636909
>*one* case
Do you want to revise your claim about *all* NDEs?
Anonymous No.24637076
>>24636120
>brain as important for consciousness, which it obviously is, is reasonable
I don't understand why it's an intellectually legitimate move to posit a supernatural soul at this point
Ok. You don't like strong emergence, but there's serval competing (non-supernatural) views.

Soul talk makes no sense. How does the soul see in heaven without eyes? How is it that it's able to see Jesus/bright light, when your eyes are back with your body.
There's no explanation of how any this is supposed to be working.