Thread 24632186

Why is gay literature so conservative and scared of saying things these days? The Great Mirror of Male Love was way spicier than anything western and it came out hundreds of years ago.

I thought we were supposed to be liberated?

>>24632186 (OP)
Homosexuals used to be based. That being said, what is spicier about Nanshoku okagami apart from the pederasty

>>24632186 (OP)
shameless faggotry is bap coded

>>24632205
I don't think he's that involved with modern homos is he?
>>24632197
I really should watch this anime

>>24632210
what does that even mean?

>>24632276
Bronze age pervert pretends not to be gay

>>24632308
He is pederast so close enough.

Pederasty is based and the key to saving western society but they wanted to keep it to themselves

because homosexuality has been co-opted by liberalism and faggots are retarded and have fem-brained herd mentality.
niggas can't even be greek masc without being perceived as fascist.

circling back to the herd mentality thing: sexuality is treated as a retard subculture instead of a sexual orientation - meaning niggas can't just be into men - they need to be into hag popstars for retard women and watch rupaul or whatever dumb shit to not be treated as an outsider.
fags are chastised for not being vapid. is that just the price for renouncing masculinity?

if you want gay and daring you need to read fags that are long dead.

>>24632859
>fags are chastised for not being vapid. is that just the price for renouncing masculinity?
I've never felt that kind of hive mind pressure from other homos, and there are lots of us who avoid that scene entirely. And for every few lispy superficial queens you get a gay punk or skinhead or death-obsessed weirdo like Mishima or these guys.
>if you want gay and daring you need to read fags that are long dead.
this point I can't argue with, sadly.

>>24632859
>sexuality is treated as a retard subculture instead of a sexual orientation
Because it is a subculture whether you like it or not, you just stay away from it or you're not in it
>no but but it's not it's
But it is.
>but it's not REALLY
Okay.

>>24632859
I think there is a new subculture emerging

Gays are liberated but it comes with a cost. Larry Kramer got so much shit for this book but he was spot on. When you’re having so much sex it makes it impossible to find love.

Somewhat related I recommend you all watch the documentary We Were Here (2011). It tells the AIDS story properly. When AIDS arrived it was probably the most promiscuous time in human history.

>>24632186 (OP)
Modern gays are too busy taking dissociative drugs and being alcoholics to say anything important.

>>24632627
I hate th_l_t_d so fucking much.

>>24632197
All the coolest people I've known were gays that lived closeted lives day to day but romped around like bonobos after dark. They were always much more interesting than straight people. Most were far more eloquent and intentional than the average person. As they were unable to fulfill themselves easily, like straight people do, they hunted for culture and expression in ways the rest of us don't. In contrast, shameless gays that express it out in the open are typically vapid.

>>24633654
>Kramer

>>24632186 (OP)
In the modern era, the only safe target of criticism is oneself, but unfortunately gay people belong to a sexual minority and therefore self-criticism is perceived as criticism of "being gay," and therefore is not allowed. You know this is true: why do you think "haha i wanna kms" humour is so prevalent? It's the only safe target.

>>24633178
>Because it is a subculture
Lol, nice job proving his point.
Fags have the brain of a teenage girl. This is why they have to latch to yass queen slaaayyyy singers, from Judy Garland, to Madonna and Janet Jackson and now Olivia Rodrigo and Ariana Grande or whoever they have now.

>>24633698
I think there are just a lot of different classes of gay

>>24633662
I think this is what everyone used to be like back when things were kept more in the bedroom.

>>24633654
I have a lot of sympathy for the gays during the AIDS epidemic. Watching everyone you love die from a brutal incurable disease (and potentially dying from it yourself) while the world at large didn’t care or act is something no one deserves.

But that said the way these dudes refused to stop having promiscuous unsafe sex was mind-boggling. The gay culture of the 1970-1980s must be one of very few subcultures in history that died out because its members literally couldn’t stop having sex. I’m being a hypocrite here, I’m a massive coomer myself but come on. There are many dudes who died horrific deaths who could have been saved had they not been so risky in their sex lives.

>>24632186 (OP)
time to get back in the closet you faggots
obergefell about to be nullified
>top kek

>>24633178
What about the men who like having sex with other men but don't do the other stereotypical gay subculture stuff?

>>24634879
Some obese bureaucrat boomer hick refusing to issue a marriage license isn't going to end gay marriage in the US, especially since Trump himself isn't against it

>>24635122
you don't have any idea what you are typing about

>>24634850
They literally protested when the bathhouses were forced to close in SF and NY. Saying that straights were trying to assimilate them and stripping them of their uniqueness. Bruce Mailman was a NY businessman who operated who a few bathhouses. When his staff suggested he close them down because of the ongoing health crisis he fired them.

What you said however is true; they didn’t deserve to be abandoned and treated like this. I’ve read stories of funeral homes not accepting people who died of AIDS. It was a time full of appalling levels of discrimination.

I try to emphasize and see the world through their eyes. Here was a time where gay men were literally part of a social revolution and could be out and about enjoying relative freedom in their little gay bubbles in inner cities. And how do you punch in your timecard in this revolution? You put your dick in a guy’s ass. A simple look, a glance, no words needed and that’s all it took for sex to take place. It’s a very primal, very animalistic way of living that straights have no idea about. Just google the BDSM clubs of NY at that time. The Mineshaft and the Eagle come to mind. If straight people knew what went on in there they would’ve sent in the army.

I can see why it reached such a decadent level but I just find this kind of recklessness baffling. A whole generation of gay men literally fucking themselves to death. The gays of then really do embody the story of Icarus. All freedoms must have limits.

And what’s propping up the gay community today? Only science. At the end of the day men will be men and man’s appetite for sex is insatiable. So let’s be honest here, if it weren’t for PrEP and penicillin gay men would be extinct.

>>24632186 (OP)
>The Great Mirror of Male Love
Not gay literature. Being attracted to cute boys is not gay.

>>24635829
>emphasize
empathize***** arghhhhhh

>>24632186 (OP)
Homosexuality emerges from a narcissistic erotic impulse and in the march for making it socially acceptable, homosexuals have repressed their eros in favor of the trappings of heterosexuality.

Contemporary homosexuals are basically the most confused about their sexuality, homosexuals will literally play at female sexual coyness and fit their erotic desires into the the trappings of a traditional heterosexual relationship.

Read about the gay culture of Southern California in the 70s and compare it to the modern homosexual relationship. These people had consistent partners, but they were not exclusive, they lacked the romantic pretensions. There is no such thing as sexual liberation for homosexual men, homosexuals acting in proper accordance with their desires are non monogamous, depraved(for lack of a better word) in constantly seeking new sexual thrills and novelty, and can never be made acceptable to heterosexual people.

>>24635884
Freudian nonsense. Fails to explain the great feats of devotion and virtue displayed by homosexual couplings in history

>>24632186 (OP)
>Faggotry has fallen
>Billions must HAY YAY YAY

Im gay
1. Homosexuality ought to be hidden from society, it doesnt need to be penalized but it should also not be treated as something normal, because it isnt. It has to be shameful, for gay men are meant to dwell in the shadows and bittersweet loneliness. Maybe it was different in antiquity, but nowadays there is no other proper way
2. As others have pointed out, they are trying to brainwash gay man into being liberal internally feminized sissys, gay men are too based and dangerous and have an appreciation for violence, fascism and hierarchies, everything those in power fear. Of course there are also men who are feminine, soft, and as such have different beliefs but to reduce us to this by feeding us every day how mportant it is that people accept and tolerate us and that we are part of some queer lgtba bullshit, is malicious and an attack against our true nature.

>>24635846
What would you say it is sir?

>>24636051
It's not gay, but it isn't exactly straight either. It's something in its own category, something superior to both.

>>24635889
Very silly objection, people sacrifice their lives for friends every day, nobody is claiming that homosexuals lack philia.

>>24633654
The documentary that tells the AIDS story properly is Hoise of Numbers. AIDS was just the effects primarily of poppers and secondarily of other fastlane gay lifestyle factors, then AZT, then other "treatments." AIDS is a completely different "disease" in different times and places because it's defined as the culmination of HIV, and HIV is fake.

As a straight, I like transgressive gay fiction because I can enjoy the literary use of edginess without the madness-inducing distraction of sexual arousal that.

>>24636129
Did you enjoy Hogg?

Gay men have been pretty based, almost a crucial force in art and history. Modern fags are annoying though and I gradually lose tolerance for them over the years. There are few things more insufferable than a vapid catty feminine rainbow faggot.

>>24636135
Haven't read it. Wiki says it includes rape of women, which might give me unwanted boners.

Lately I read The Sluts and watched some Kenneth Anger films.

>>24636129
>A group of scientists interviewed for the film later complained that their comments had been misrepresented and taken out of context, and that the film promotes pseudoscience.[4][5] The film also interviews Christine Maggiore, a prominent AIDS denialist who later died following AIDS-related conditions.

>>24636166
>nice try but wikipedia says the conspiracy theory documentary you recommended me is psoodoscience.

>>24636207
Do you have a better source?

>>24637154
I recommend not expecting a single source to tell you how it is when it comes to anything controversial you care about, but watching the documentary, reading some books from various "denialist" perspectives, revisiting the "mainstream" narratives and seeing how they hold up given what you've learned, considering the biases and interests involved and forming your own opinions. Some authors: Peter Duesberg, Joan Shenton, Jon Rappoport, Steven Epstein, Robert Willner, Torsten Engelbrecht

>>24637291
>Peter Duesberg, Joan Shenton, Jon Rappoport, Steven Epstein, Robert Willner, Torsten Engelbrecht
Lmao the bottom of the barrel. Cheers to Darwin!

>>24637291
>talmudian literature

>>24635855
Hocquenghem was a disgusting pedophile, though.

>>24635829
>And what’s propping up the gay community today? Only science. At the end of the day men will be men and man’s appetite for sex is insatiable. So let’s be honest here, if it weren’t for PrEP and penicillin gay men would be extinct.
Hey, speak for yourself, there are some penis-havers-who-have-sex-with-penis-havers (I use the awkward phrasing because I'm not, precisely speaking, either gay or a man, and I'm just going off my own example) who are careful about protection and testing. (Also, they wouldn't be extinct, because exclusive homosexuality would have been extinct millennia ago if it were straightforwardly genetic just for selection reasons; it's more likely just a glitch in human sexual development, not too different from intersexuality. But that's besides the point.)

>>24635884
>Homosexuality emerges from a narcissistic erotic impulse
I can understand this argument for the homosexuals who seem to want to fuck a duplicate of themselves, but what about those who are very feminine and want a very masculine partner or vice versa? (This applies to both male and female homosexuals.)

>>24635884
Also
>homosexuals acting in proper accordance with their desires are non monogamous
I can grant that perhaps homosexuals are more likely than heterosexuals to be non-monogamous by natural inclination, but I don't think it can be stated as an absolute like this, rather than a tendency. (Or is your contention simply that men in general are by nature non-monogamous and homosexual men merely show how men are inclined to behave without the restraining influence of having to keep a female partner content? In which case again I can believe that that exists as a general tendency, but not an absolute.)

>>24636051
>>24636053
The way I like to put it is: Normal human male sexuality consists of attraction to women and twinks. The ancient Greeks knew this.

>>24637291
What should you do if you read a dozen conspiracy theories and they all seem convincing on their face but also all contradict each other?

>>24637635
lol what did ChatGPT say about them? xD

Btw there's also a followup to House of Numbers, pitched at a more technical level, that responds to critics.

>>24636007
>Maybe it was different in antiquity, but nowadays there is no other proper way
In antiquity you just had a very developed rape culture in which powerful people used their subordinates.
If you want to see pederasty in the modern day, google bacha bazi.

>>24637748
I wonder what pushes the twinks into it though, I never had attraction to older men.

>>24637764
Being more androphilic, I suppose, which probably has something to do with masculinization or feminization of certain brain regions.

>>24637752
Forming your own opinion sort of looks like breaking different theories down into smaller factual claims, evaluating the plausibility of those, eliminating received assumptions that don't follow from the most certain premises, putting things together again and repeating.

>>24637764
The more passive the twink the more he's going to want someone more dominant

>>24636007
Here’s the ultimate black pill - Posession. Not the simplistic Christian sense.

See my sexual side has literal to no interest in women and more broadly I dont want to fuck like most men want to do. Instead I like dick near, on, and inside of me. I don’t see this as a rejection of the masculine but rather a craving for it. It’s the phallic plus all the accoutrements - firm chest, smell of cologne, prickly face, logical mind, nice tight boxer briefs etc..

At the same time there are conflicting desires to lead a virtuous and civil life like most heterosexuals - be a dad, husband, volunteer etc..These are all non sexual desires but still important to the overall self.

The lbgt movement tries to reconcile all of this by mapping into the heterosexual dynamic and using surrogates which all comes across as artificial and non natural.

I kind of get the feeling this is one big prison planet and various entities/souls take over our body and drive our decision making (like Freud’s ego, id and super ego) but I’m not sure it’s not real entities.
I think this is the larger issue. We become slaves to our competing desires and it’s like there is no one central processor at the wheel. We try to explain with simplistic adjectives like gay or straight but they’re insufficient. Honestly I don’t even think I’m gay there’s just some mfer in my head that likes dick.

>>24637978
>and using surrogates which all comes across as artificial and non natural
You could adopt- there are plenty of children who don't have families of their own.

>>24637990
There are plenty of straight couples who want to adopt. THey should have priority

>>24638093
you're saying it as if you adopting a child is somehow stopping a straight couple from adopting

>>24637748
>>24637764
Couldn't it just be phrased as attraction to feminine form? I was never into burly or old guys but I do get traps/twinks in their peculiar way along with women.

>>24634850
Why do you still sympathise with them if you realise that it was entirely their fault that they couldn't stop having disgusting buttfuck sex?

>>24638179
if there's limited supply of adoptables, wouldn't it?

>>24638258
They just needed the money

>>24638283
they're still making new ones, you know

>>24637724
That is a fair objection, and I hope I do not come off as dismissive if I state that, in my personal life it has been my personal experience that these types seem to have an entirely different psychology from the typical homosexual, which leads me to question whether including them in the same category is an error. In my inclination towards an extreme type of categorical thinking I failed to account for them and to that end I would revise my original post if possible to attempt a more complete account.

>>24637738
I think the male sexual impulse is nonmonogamous universally, but that monogamy develops in heterosexual men as a reflection of the dynamic between male and female sexual strategies. By removing the female sex strategy you cease to have monogamy make sense.

Your prior post pointed out, rightfully, a category of homosexual man who adopts the trappings of feminine sexuality and who I think is worth examining in this context. Female sexual strategies are ultimately predicated upon the high cost of children, whereas the feminized homosexual man does not operate in that regard. I do not doubt that at least some will take on a sort of mirrored female sexual strategy, but I would assert that it is a cultural imposition which drives it, rather than being a reflection of the nature of the feminine homosexual.

>>24638093
Perhaps, but even with all of them not every child in need of a family actually has one.

>>24638200
That's more or less what it is, I suppose.

>>24638629
I can agree that there is a tendency seen across many cultures for men to have higher sociosexuality than women and it probably has biological roots, but I don't think you can state it as a binary absolute; it's a matter of two overlapping distributions, Like most differences between male and female humans.

>>24638795
>>24638326
they don't grow them on trees. do you know the TFR these days? also countries are no longer allowing foreign adoption