Thread 24674274

All the books coming out right now focus on unmasking autism.
I need to get a job. I have to mask to get hired.

Are there any books that actually teach autistic adults HOW to mask?

Just imitate

>>24674274 (OP)
If you are genuinely autistic just lean in, you will break your back trying to pick up on social ques and people will sniff you out anyway. In fact its exactly that you are forcing yourself to fit in that makes you appear creepy to people.

>>24674274 (OP)
>I need to get a job. I have to mask to get hired.

As if normal people don't present themselves in different ways depending on the situation. Become stronger than your compulsions.

>>24674274 (OP)
I don't understand what possesses house niggers like yourself to attempt to under the normie mindset. just read picrel and save yourself the trouble.

>>24674274 (OP)
I feel you op, I also just want a book to show me how to act like a normie. But we get answers like:
>Just be yourself bro
>Everyone lies, overcome your impulsions (???)
>Read "The psychology of masses"
Can some accomplished autistic person help us please.

>>24674335
Even accomplished autists remain visibly autists. See Elon Musk

I related to this way too much, am I autistic?

>>24674274 (OP)
Uniroincally, Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Infuence People

I transmaxxed and since men treat women like children I can be quirky at no cost. #lifehack

>>24674346
Kierkegaard tried not to display his autism to others. Instead, he remained his life being depressed for the entire life

Pick some skill that normies respect and get really good at it. They are way more tolerant of sperginess if you are good at something cool or useful. It's the key to being seen as eccentric instead of weird.

>>24674274 (OP)
literally me

>>24674346
Musk is not autistic. He claims Aspergers because he is an insecure clown that wants his retardation and drug addled antics to come across as intelligence. Asperger men don't speak like him and they sure as hell don't love the lime light as he does. He doesn't even have a diagnosis, he is no different than every other gross nerd claiming autism to be special

Emily Post. It's a big book, but it tells you how and when to talk to people or do things so they know you aren't forgetting they exist and have boundaries
Caveat: I'm unemployable and people still think I'm weird

>>24674620
Naw that nigga has autism

You should try talking to more people. Preferably in a place you don’t go often, so if you accidentally come off as weird, it doesn’t matter since you’ll never see them again. Try different ways of imitating how people speak to one another, see what feels comfortable and what others seem to respond well with. Awkwardness is not necessarily a bad thing, some people find it endearing, or at the very least they see you more as nonthreatening instead of creepy. Talking to yourself in the mirror is also good for noticing little quirks in your facial expressions or body language, and you can try to limit or manipulate those movements to appear more natural.

I don’t think a book can teach you how to mask, anymore than a book can teach you to make money or become more well liked. There is a lot of good advice swirling around, but if you can just internalize even a bit of it, and then expose yourself to as much social interaction as possible, you will see progress.

>>24674598
took me a long time to realize I (probably, most likely) have Aspergers. When I was young, Aspergers didnt exist, and autism itself was lumped into studying retardation.
>
They recently lumped aspergers and autism together, and thats incorrect. Spend any amount of time around *any* high IQ aspie then spend time around real autistic. There's no comparison. I have been hearing how I "remind people of that one brilliant but weird PhD they had in college" most of my life. As an aspie, I feel the entire range of human emotions, bar none. They simply don't show automatically on my face like a normal person. Also, my body language is the same. My emotions and mood don't produce the body language. Studying the moden personality nomenclature, I'm an INTJ.
>
That's my raw materials to go through life. A stanford IQ tested IQ of 145, six foot tall, not ugly. More or less a chad-lite, physically.
>
Academically, I always was a star. Its socially the problems creep in. And once out of both college degrees, well... the social situations get in the way of work. I spent my life coming up with "rules" that are coping mechanisms.
>
You need a face. A go-to face. It needs to be so automatic to slap that baby on, and it better be a one size fits all face. Lift one corner or one lip up, hold it for a while without saying anything. Then lose it and go back to it later.
>
You can't ignore people. That creates more issues. Always give the little wave to anyone you know. A nod, a smile, anything. Never initiate conversation. If a normie wants to socialize? They'll initiate. Do not carry the conversation. Let them start it. They pick the topic. Nod, smile, shrug and react to all their drivel. If they pause, ask a question about their story. How ugly *was* that dog sweater in that funny story. Let them tell you their planned jokes about how ugly the sweater was.
>
You're only part in the conversation, is to take it all in and react. if they pause, ask for further information. Its their topic, they like it. Any time they try to shift the conversation to you? Little bit of nothing, deflect, back to them. In reality, you say little, you give almost nothing away. Yet, they do all the talking and remember you as being a "great conversationalist" and "polite".
>
when normies at work end up inviting you out somewhere, follow this same pattern. Don't make real friends at work. Use your system. Do your minimum socially, stay quiet and back off.
>
Yes, I've been studying normies my whole life. You pick up strategies and even little "this is what you do here" pointers. I'll end this with one example, what life is like.
>
young child, teacher addressing me.
"Quit looking around! When I ask you a question? You look me right in the eyes, so I can tell if you're lying or not!"
*whatever* adult demand this rule over and over. I begin to look all people directly in the eye. Like they demand I do.
Same teacher, later.
"You better quit eyeballing me! What's your problem, huh"

>>24674832
And I thought autists were supposed to be self-aware. Going by this, everyone you speak to would instantly peg you as a spectrumite, and a particularily bad case too. How could you not know?

For OP, I know successful autists that fit in. How do they do it? Well, they're soulless psychopaths who dedicate their lives to emotional manipulation and subtle tricks. And you know, even then, they're grating and inappropriate and unloved. Maybe it's possible to do it well and truly become a normie, but I wouldn't recommend trying. You're also right that the "you" people will tell you to be actually just comes across as creepy and unpleasant to them. I think you simply have to accept always being seen like that, and move on to build your appearance with that in mind, without focusing on mitigating it. You can get hired like that.

But if you really must go normie and truly can't get hired or whatever otherwise, read manipulative pop psychology with titles like "how to make people like you" or "having people do what you want" and then test it on people. It works for that, if not for the authors' intended purposes.

>>24674485
g-gawdlike...
(pls tell me this aint real)

>>24674898
it's real anon. I mean, I used 'transmaxxed' as a tonge in cheek, but I really transitioned because of dysphoria. Before, I was a invisible loser, now people talk to me and are friendly to me (I had luck and was always very feminine/not masculinmized so it was easy to pass). It's unbeliveable how different society treats men from women. If you're a loser as a man, you're basically invisible and don't matter. As a woman you can't be a loser, as long as you're somewhat pretty/fuckable people will engage with you, give you attention, remember you, you will exist. it's important to be able to have a good ability to mask and do what normies expect a woman to do (even a weird/quirky woman).

>>24674925
>as long as you're somewhat pretty/fuckable
I think this is the key. There's another part where nobody cares if you said something dumb or smart, they are both the same things when you're speaking as a female
t. female wallpaper

>>24674931
>There's another part where nobody cares if you said something dumb or smart, they are both the same things when you're speaking as a female
true, you can say whatever as long as it doesn't spook them, and it will be taken lightly, again, as if you're a child. I actually use this a way to break down the barriers when interacting with someone, as it makes them see the situation in a less serious light.

>>24674274 (OP)
no seriously this is literally me at 30, what the fuck do I do. I managed to coast this long but people at work are starting to think I'm weird.

>>24674931
>t. female wallpaper
Huh? literally never heard this conjunction of words before

>>24674940
Basic competence in a female is spooky af to most people

>>24674925
>Before, I was a invisible loser, now people talk to me and are friendly to me (I had luck and was always very feminine/not masculinmized so it was easy to pass).
Lol, not surprised at all, ive heard this one so much before and even seen it reflected on twitter, trans people suddenly become way more confident, open, and outspoken. To be fair, you never get a sneak peek of their lives before so you can never really say how different it is, but the outcome is almost always so drastic that you have to figure that they were the opposite prior.

I dont know how to feel about this. I've always thought to myself that to be able to change that drastically, there had to have been nothing really there in the first place.
But one could call that cope because I know I could never and would never change as such. In a way Im even more broken than an autist, and barely mentally ill enough for therapy to really do anything.

Anyway, interesting that you were honest.

>>24674951
You can blend in with the scenery as a female and never be engaged in conversation and nobody will call you an autist unless you make noises

>>24674832
>>24674897
bookmarking this for later

>>24674274 (OP)
For me the key has been finding out that normalfags have abyssal self esteem and you can just gaslight them if you're notably eloquent. Instead of blaming you for your autism they will blame themselves, unironically "just be confident bro".

by 30 you shouldnt give a shit about that stuff anymore

>>24674897
>And I thought autists were supposed to be self-aware. Going by this, everyone you speak to would instantly peg you as a spectrumite, and a particularily bad case too. How could you not know?
we didn't call it that back then. Today you have labels. Back then, you were just weird. And while I understand about the tricks, to use normies. That's not the best way to go through life. Using people and viewing them as ends to your own means.

>>24674956
yeah this sucks, it's one of the downsides when compared to being a man. As a woman you can't have hobbies outside of the norm, so forget about anything intellectual, technical, stuff like that. As a man, I could have less common or technical hobbies and not be looked at with weirdness for that, but as a woman I have to hide it all and pretend I'm not into technology or philosophy or online forums like 4chan. In short, as a woman you can only really have "society-sanctioned opinions for women". oh yeah, and you can't have strong opinions. Well you can, but they have to be sanctioned by normie society first.

>>24674948
>no seriously this is literally me at 30, what the fuck do I do. I managed to coast this long but people at work are starting to think I'm weird.
So?
"Anon. Are you crazy or something."
"Yep! Thanks for noticing!"
"Anon, you're weird."
"So I'm not normal? Good! The average guy off the street, is a fucking retard. Thanks for the complient."
>
its not so much about what cards you're dealt. Its about how you play them. Life's a game of euchre that way.

>>24674960
>trans people suddenly become way more confident, open, and outspoken.
translation to english: More of an annoying pain in the ass than already.

>>24675056
they don't talk to me

>>24675057
It's giving
>Fat girls are more vivacious and loud
>No no it's a personality not a need for attention they don't otherwise get

>>24675060
>they don't talk to me
perhaps a preferable condition. I don;t crave social interactions. parties, going out, all that. If people make me do it, I do it. Doesn't bother me to do it, I just don't prefer it. Once in a while when the group makes me, fine. If no one's bothering you, that's not a bad outcome.

>>24675057
no it's because being a male loser, nobody gives you any attention, you basically don't exist. it's a soul crushing life so your confidence is zero, you don't even feel like talking to anyone because they don't want to talk to you and it's pointless.

As a woman, people actually engage with you, they talk to you, often they are the ones to start the conversation. It gives you the confidence and self-esteem to live and be social.

>>24674662
he is playing a role idiot as the eccentric genius

>>24674966
What kind of noises? Heavy breathing? Hooting like an owl?

>>24674479
Can vouch for this one

>>24674274 (OP)
How to Win Friends and Influence People.

>>24674274 (OP)
Just be autistic nigga. It will probably work in your favor

>>24674662
>>24675483
He's an autistic person pretending to be an autistic person.

>>24675920
sounds reasonable

>>24674485
You're gonna hang yourself

>>24674274 (OP)
masking is not possible for someone with actual autism
It's something that fake autists use to disguise their normalcy

'i am autistic. i am just masking. that's why i look like a neurotypical normie"

>>24674274 (OP)
>>24674479
How to Win Friends and Influence People worked for a friend of mine (I didn't learn he was autistic until he showed me his 500 page fantasy novel)
I'm probably a sperg but I'm pretty high verbal IQ so I usually tell people I have autism before they start to wonder

>>24674274 (OP)
Read Liel Lowndes' How To Talk To Anyone. I have autism and it's probably the biggest reason I'm able to sustain a job and how I managed to make/keep friends.

The blackpill is that on average most neurotypical people are tall children with varying degrees of emotional immaturity, some of whom are more obvious than others. To effectively mask as an autistic adult, you need to learn how to tardwrangle the normies who never mentally/emotionally grew up past being a teenager/young adult.

Here's some tips that helped me out.

>Make a good first impression. Shake everyone's hand and introduce yourself. Don't be too quiet or too loud, be firm and direct. Speak from the gut.
>Wear a smile when greeting people. Look people in the eyes (but for autists, train yourself to look at the bridge of the other person's nose).
>Compliment a person's clothing and pay attention to their new haircut/accessory/etc. Praise them for helping you, and ask them what you can do for them. Show that you are grateful.
>Most people are starved of emotional connection. They may not have intimate friendships or stable dynamics with family or loved ones. If they want to rant/ramble/vent/shoot the shit about stuff they like, then let them (within reason).
>Be patient and understanding. Take a step back and reflect on why a person may be acting in an anti-social way. Are they lonely? Overworked? Forgot to eat lunch/drink water? Dealing with body functions (periods, aging)? Strife with family/friends?
>Don't butt into conversations. Wait for a lapse in the conversation, and then introduce yourself.
>Think twice about what you're going to say. If you think you'll spill your spaghetti, you probably will. Sometimes, saying nothing is better than saying anything.
>Give co-workers thoughtful gifts and novelties. They may appreciate it quite deeply and it might open the door for future opportunities for you.
>Be funny. Steal jokes from lesser-known comedians or from media that your co-workers don't watch.
>Don't overthink things. Sometimes just going for it is better than getting stuck in a self-reflective neurotic paralysis death spiral.
>Don't get too hung up on what people think about you.

When you understand that most adults are just children with jobs and more privileges, life gets way easier. Don't sweat it.

>>24674409
You are just a guy with no personality to charm thinking some unalterable state of existence is causing you to suffer when all you needed was to be a little more outgoing to accept a few elementary school invitations, make some funny jokes at lunch, be slightly athletic to hold your own during sports, had a little more courage to talk to the kind of ugly girl that was interested in you that became a beautiful young woman, and now that you stalk her social media sites reminiscening on what could have been.
Nut up and call it like it is.

>>24675502
Minecraft villager

>>24676289
All good advice, anon.
I would just like to add, that a lot of behavior of an autist, is linked to a hyper sensitive nervous system. What is minor stimulation to others, is major stimulation to autists. So one of the things that helps, is learning to regular your nervous system.

Number 1: Take the time to breath. Breathing helps calm nerves. And inhale deeply before you speak. Inhaling will prevent you from speaking too fast, or tripping over your words in a stutter. It will also give you half a second to organize your words before they come out.

You can prevent ruminating by bringing your thoughts to a conclusion. Typically the thing you're ruminating over had an unsatisfying conclusion, or no conclusion at all. Which is why you're thinking about it. You have to find forgiveness for the things you can't control, and you have to confront the things you can control. Typically, people learn this lesson from religion. They ask god for forgiveness. But you don't need religion to practice this yourself. You can simply decide if you forgive yourself or others. You have that power. Typically, forgiveness resolves most ruminating thoughts. But sometimes you have to be more proactive, and actually *do* something to resolve the issue. So go take care of business. Don't allow unfulfilled tasks build up into a clutter in your mind.

This is probably going to sound insane but this is the best advice I think I can give, learn to smile.

When I was a kid, I would get yelled at all the time because my parents or teachers thought I was angry when I was just quiet and thinking. I had immense social troubles as a kid and it was a challenge. But I got obsessed with this, did a lot of theater and psychology. And the biggest thing I've come away with is to smile, make eye contact and animate your face.

99% of human interaction is completely fake. Other humans are gauging the environment. If you're sitting there with the typical frozen mug of a sperg, it makes them uncomfortable. But if you smile and animate your face to what they're saying, it makes them comfortable and feel like they're engaging with you. Also most people are so self-involved and don't care what you think and feel and just want you to mirror what they are thinking and feeling.

You have to be careful to turn this off around other spectrum-y people though as they see through it and see it as insincere.

Also read up on body language, if you can read the other person, you can give them what they want even if they don't know what that is.

>>24674832
Ah, yes, that good old feel, when you read the text and about 90% is about you despite describing a different person.
>>24674274 (OP)
Basically what >>24674598 says. You become super useful - and if your boss is clever, he'd put you in a corner with a workload suitable to your skills. Just pick up a tech job like programming and don't go for "social" jobs. Ah, yes, learn to answer truthfully most of the times, learn to speak clearly without shouting, learn (through experience only, unfortunately) when not to talk (i.e. when mention details and facts only on direct demand). Last one is the hardest one.
Ah, don't hope for proper socialization. Not that you actually need that, the world in your head is your best friend. Just keep filling it with various sources - books, cartoons, movies, paintings, music etc - to help yourself to make it really good.

>>24674832
they already know you are weird because you refuse to contribute, this is what normies do best, notice changes in behavior and gossip about causes and consequences then ignore you and treat you like an ignorant child treating the knowledge like a sheathed knife to be produced later when they feel threatened by your weirdness, they can definitely tell you are pretending because they are doing it too, what they probably can't tell is why, so you could be a very long running joke among the social circles you frequent and not even know it

>>24675991
I get what you're saying but don't quite agree with you. Masking is possible but cracks start to show quickly and not to the extend that fakies say or autists hope.
You can blend in better with enough practice and understanding of basic rules of engagement. The moment you lose focus you're going to fail and be back to being the weird one.
You'll never be a normie and you shouldn't strive to be either.

is it even worth it to mask the autism?

>>24674274 (OP)
>No serious book recommendations.
Give the sperg a bone.

>>24676744
Yes. It allows you to figure out the balance between stress you are willing to take and hiding things you better hide to avoid negative physical/financial consequences.

Does anyone else here prefer conversing with ADHD people over other autists?
You'd think it'd be a bad match if they're so impulsive and unstructured
But I often find ADHD people honest and extremely humorous. They also connect readily over any subject.
Other autists are often way too dense for me to connect over anything.
I don't know what ADHD people would get out of autists. Maybe the honesty too and the high octane schizo babble I can sometimes provide.
Any novels on the ADHD-autism dynamic?

>>24674832
>They recently lumped aspergers and autism together, and thats incorrect.
Isn't the difference between aspergers and classical autism only the speech defect part?
I can understand why they did away with the distinction. Right now I could probably pass as an aspie but as a child I had trouble communicating anything at all (not merely social cues),
hence the classical autism diagnosis, even when I don't have an intellectual disability (I hope)

>>24676780
>Isn't the difference between aspergers and classical autism only the speech defect part?
First thing you should understand on 4chan, is that whenever a retard is saying something randomly as declarative and authoratative as "a X professional category is wrong" they are narrativizing based on emotional anecdotal experience and have no idea what theyre talking about.

They're the type of retard that thinks their personal experience is so significant its generalizable to abstract concepts.

Why do I say this? Well firstly, because its true, and secondly. Because the word "incorrect" or "wrong" carry more weight than they should. Somebody who will prove something "wrong". Won't literally use the word "wrong" or "incorrect" because its insufficient, unless theyre appealing to some invisible justification they cant justify in the first place.

>>24676808
>as "a X professional category is wrong"
There is a certain problem with any authority - if professionals start talking lies even in the smallest causes for whichever reasons, he stops being a trusted one - hence his supposed knowledge is invalidated for everybody else by his own choice. Make it two liars in the same group - and you now have reasons not to trust the entire group.
>>24676808
>Why do I say this? Well firstly, because its true
Proceed to commit sudoku. Also
>reddit spacing

>>24674832
>INTJ
God I'm fucking sick of my personality type being associated with you faggots. INTJs are not autists, we have dominant Introverted Intuition (a non-rational function) and 3rd position Introverted Feeling. Go fuck yourself. If any type is autistic it's ISTPs.

>>24676780
>I don't know what ADHD people would get out of autists.
as someone with adhd i find the demented proprieties of autistic people to be refreshing and kind of cute. I also love it when someone cant contain their passion for a subject

>>24676744
Part of masking is not banging your head and rolling on the floor any time more than 5 guys are in the room so yeah it seems pretty important

>>24674274 (OP)
im dont know much about autism but 'how to win friends and influence people' could be a helpful

>>24677137
holy typos mb lol

>>24675087
You aren't being treated like a woman, you're being treated like the elephant in the room
Source: one of my high school friends trooned out recently

>>24677172
No anon, that is not correct, first, because I transitioned many years ago and now I am stealth, and second, because people actually do treat me as a woman, want to make plans with me, men ask me out, etc

>>24674479
fuck, he's back

>>24677191
There's no point in getting too deep into specifics across different situations, but I just want to point out that being invited to things and getting hit on by men doesn't exclude being treated as the elephant in the room. For example, disabled people will also receive validation like that.

>>24677229
No, as I said, that is not the case. I have had certain times when I told a guy when hanguing out that I was and then he changed his demeanor and stopped wanting to have sex. That is the result of being stealth, and is why I moved cities, to Madrid, and cut contact with old friends and coworkers. It seems you have already made your mind and won't listen to anything anyways.

>>24677172
As a man diagnosed with schizophrenia, autism, ADHD and bipolar, I am the elephant in the room and people don't approach me for any reason. The only people not repulsed are the beautiful and the stupid

>>24677229
Anon, no one's asking out a tranny because they want to be accomodating or something, that'd be retarded.

>>24677308
They're not asking out a tranny to be accommodating, but because they're gay sex perverts. Two different situations

>>24677278
>It seems you have already made your mind and won't listen to anything anyways.
You're posting in an autism thread

>>24677513
If autism means retarded and obstinate, then this entire thread is worthless, autists are subhuman tier then. No offense.

NTA btw.
A lack of self awareness is probably quite literally the worst possible trait one can have. I can deal with and tolerate stupid people who know theyre stupid. But somebody whos stupid and not only thinks theyre right, but that "special" kind of right where they have no need to justify something and cant just confidently assert claims about external subjects, based on their own fundamentally contrained internal subjective judgement?
Thats subhuman.

>>24677588
Aplícate el cuento
>>24677445
Isn't it convenient when you ignore part of the text to suit your preconceptions?

>>24677629
>Aplícate el cuento
Kys dumbfuck retard.

>>24677588
>A lack of self awareness is probably quite literally the worst possible trait one can have. I can deal with and tolerate stupid people who know theyre stupid. But somebody whos stupid and not only thinks theyre right, but that "special" kind of right where they have no need to justify something and cant just confidently assert claims about external subjects, based on their own fundamentally contrained internal subjective judgement?
>Thats subhuman.
Yes, trannies are very annoying indeed and they can never be women

>>24677640
I misunderstood sorry

>>24677672
dummy. i rolled my eyes. you have to live with that now.

>>24677656
You dont understand self awareness. And I've noticed a lot of people don't.

Also your attempt at an inverse greentext gotcha is stupid. Trans people dont claims that everybody else is trans, based on their experience of being trans. Which would have to be thr case for "claims about external subjects based on internal subjective judgements" to be the case.

You can find exceptions everywhere, but most trans people also justify their assertions. They'll appeal to scientific evidence of some sort and whatnot.

If your claim is as stupid as "Trans people calling me transphobic is internal judgment imposed on external subjects" then youre stupid because not only do you do the same, but the standard of justifying "This person is repelled by trans persons" is much easier than Assuming that everybody thinks a particular trans person you talked to online doesnt pass as a woman in real life, this can only be supported by a bias, which is the point of pointing out an internal subjective judgement, something that is wholly validated by one's internal feelings, with no engagement with the external world from a perspective not your own.

Case over. Youre retarded.