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Anonymous No.24790487 [Report] >>24790516 >>24790591 >>24790811 >>24790881 >>24790894 >>24790895 >>24790994 >>24794064 >>24797355 >>24798063 >>24799587 >>24799588 >>24799621
Tolstoy Thread
In this thread you will discuss the life and works of Count Leo Tolstoy
Anonymous No.24790516 [Report] >>24790546
>>24790487 (OP)
I wish I never read him. It's all been downhill since.
Anonymous No.24790546 [Report]
>>24790516
I have the same problem. I peaked too early by reading him.
Anonymous No.24790591 [Report] >>24790905
>>24790487 (OP)
real question is would people even claim there is a 'russian soul' without Tolstoy and Dostoevsky?
Anonymous No.24790742 [Report] >>24790755 >>24792007 >>24794864 >>24799334
I'm a Dostobro. Where do I start with him?
Anonymous No.24790755 [Report]
>>24790742
the cossacks
Anonymous No.24790811 [Report] >>24790832
>>24790487 (OP)
My copy of Anna Karenina came in today. Going to get started on it once I finish this sci-fi series I’m reading through.
Anonymous No.24790832 [Report] >>24794748
>>24790811
It is a decent book though much too long. It struggles to keep my attention especially at parts with Levin and the inner workings of his politics.
Anonymous No.24790881 [Report] >>24790972 >>24793450 >>24799665 >>24799762
>>24790487 (OP)
I don't see Ressurection being discussed here often. Why is that?
Anonymous No.24790894 [Report]
>>24790487 (OP)
only thing i've read of his was the Death of Ivan Ilych and I really enjoyed it. I think I liked it more than Dostoevsky, it was just easier to read
I bought War and Peace but haven't read it yet as I've got a few to get through first
Anonymous No.24790895 [Report] >>24794072
>>24790487 (OP)
I liked Hadji Murat
Anonymous No.24790905 [Report] >>24790998 >>24798080
>>24790591
Books are not everything. There is still russian folklore, russian composers, russian dances, and russian orthodox christianity. All of it is impressive.
Anonymous No.24790972 [Report]
>>24790881
During Tolstoy’s lifetime, that was his most popular and successful book. Nowadays it’s pretty obscure. It’s very Christian
Anonymous No.24790994 [Report] >>24792578
>>24790487 (OP)
AK was pretty fun, but what the fuck was he thinking with part 8? It was almost as bad as Atlas Shrugged. The book should've ended with Anna's death.
Anonymous No.24790998 [Report] >>24791042
>>24790905
>russian folklore
Just feels so right
Anonymous No.24791042 [Report]
>>24790998
True. Also, you don't really need a novelist to pass on your folk tales and the values and soul they contain. By the way, I completely forgot russian painters.
Anonymous No.24791304 [Report]
Thinking of jumping in War and Peace next year
Anonymous No.24792007 [Report]
>>24790742
Ivan Ilyich is the best introduction
Anonymous No.24792578 [Report]
>>24790994
Why would it end with Anna’s death when she’s only the co-protagonist
Anonymous No.24792580 [Report]
Gogol and Turgenev mog towelsty
Anonymous No.24793450 [Report]
>>24790881
It's his take on Dostoevsky so you would think it's more popular.
Anonymous No.24794064 [Report] >>24794103 >>24795173
>>24790487 (OP)
That dude knew how to write really well. War and Peace is so well written, it's ridiculous. In terms of sheer scope and scale, nothing even compares.
Anonymous No.24794072 [Report]
>>24790895
Even in old age, he was still writing masterpieces.
Anonymous No.24794103 [Report] >>24794537
>>24794064
>In terms of sheer scope and scale, nothing even compares.
Read more.
Anonymous No.24794537 [Report] >>24794740
>>24794103
Please provide examples otherwise you're just cockteasing
Anonymous No.24794740 [Report] >>24794845
>>24794537
Divine Comedy
Faust part 2
Gravity's Rainbow
Anonymous No.24794748 [Report]
>>24790832
braincel
Anonymous No.24794845 [Report] >>24794876
>>24794740
>Divine Comedy
It is a very focused story, just because its long with many characters doesn't mean it has big scope, they are simple characters and the world is largely thin too. Doesn't mean I don't love it thoughever but not for its scale.

>Faust
Not even sure why that's there.
>GR
Haven't read it.
Anonymous No.24794864 [Report]
>>24790742
How much land does a man need
then
The Devils
then
Death of Ilya Illich
then
Hajdi Murat
then you can jump into his larger works.
Anonymous No.24794876 [Report] >>24795356
>>24794845
I think it's pretty clear that when we hear scope and scale, we mean entirely different things. I consider 100 Years of Solitude a very small novel (by design), in spite of its massive cast of characters and a 100 year runtime.
Anonymous No.24795173 [Report]
>>24794064
There are certain chapters, like the horse race in Anna Karenina, where I’m not even sure it’s humanly possible for a person to write better than Tolstoy did.
Anonymous No.24795356 [Report] >>24795509 >>24795927
>>24794876
To me scale means there are many many things with many many things. In War and Peace, there's a lot of things to learn about the politics, geography, characters, themes and plot. There's an overload of relevant information, that is what I mean by scale.
Anonymous No.24795509 [Report] >>24795839
>>24795356
And I agree with the definition, with scale additionally denoting the time scale. Divine Comedy covers everything from Biblical time and the antiquity to Dante's future through prophecy. Between all the mythological references, historical figures from all time periods, Italian politics, symbolism, the litany of saints in Paradiso, medieval cosmology, and theological discussion the Divine Comedy is a very dense poem that you'd be hard-pressed to tackle without annotations due to its sheer density of information.
For me the scope is what the book covers, or how Universal it is to the Human Condition. You have books that are a snapshot of a specific time period, books that cover ideology vast historical forces controlling the human lives, and at the very top there are theological and philosophical books that deal with the human soul directly.
Faust part 2 transforms part 1's deeply personal tragedy and makes it universal. Between Faust dealing with kings, wars, and giant industrial projects and the classical walpurgisnacht, culminating in the eternal-feminine, there are few books with scope as broad as that of Faust. And anyone that made it through the classical walpurgisnacht will tell you that its scale is also massive.

I choose to put zero weight on the characters and the actual plot when talking about scope and scale. Just the pure erudition, the information density, as well as the closeness of themes to philosophy and theology.
Anonymous No.24795839 [Report] >>24795854
>>24795509
To me the amount of commentary or subtext is not scale. it's not about what's underneath the semitiocs, but the sheer amount of them--that dictates true scale. Imagine if Dante's poem also included a Buddhist adventure, a Vedic adventure and a paganistic adventure, that would be scale. The density of the work is not scale to me.
Anonymous No.24795854 [Report] >>24795900
>>24795839
You might enjoy Manuscrit trouvé à Saragosse
Anonymous No.24795900 [Report]
>>24795854
I've never heard of it so thank you sir anon
Anonymous No.24795927 [Report] >>24795951
>>24795356
That's my favorite thing about Tolstoy. His panoramic quality. It's not a simple narrative, it's a giant sprawling look at human life in so many different dimensions. Even a more straightforward book like Anna Karenina has the same quality to it
Anonymous No.24795951 [Report] >>24796062
>>24795927
That's really the greatest mark of a writer I've found, just effortless exhibition of life. I write but its hard to write anything with so much, high or base, humanity. A flash of a line may hint at an entire life's worth of facts.
Anonymous No.24796062 [Report] >>24796466
>>24795951
For example, this is how Dolly is introduced in Anna Karenina:
>Darya Alexandrovna, wearing a dressing–jacket, the skimpy braids of her once thick and beautiful hair pinned at the back of her head, her face pinched and thin, her big, frightened eyes protruding on account of that thinness, was standing before an open chiffonier, taking something out of it.
In this one sentence you get the whole story of a marriage and the kind of woman that she has become as a result of it.
Anonymous No.24796466 [Report]
>>24796062
Not only is this a matter of craft but also a matter of soul. Tolstoy read people, he wept for them, he stored them somewhere and in that folder he kept million different lives to pull from so effortlessly.
Anonymous No.24797355 [Report] >>24798116
>>24790487 (OP)
I just watched "Ikiru" and now I will be reading The Death of Ivan Ilyich because I heard Ikiru was inspired by it.

Thank you for reading my blog.
Anonymous No.24798063 [Report]
>>24790487 (OP)
>He choked on what he desired. When our simple Rus' loved him with a simple and radiant love for War and Peace, he said: “Not enough. I want to be Buddha and Schopenhauer.” But instead of “Buddha and Schopenhauer,” all that came of it was 42 photographs, where he is captured in three-quarter view, half-profile, full face, in profile, and, it seems, “from the feet up,” sitting, standing, lying down, in a shirt, a kaftan, and something else, behind a plow and on horseback, in a cap, a hat, and “just so”… No, the devil knows how to laugh at those who sell their soul to him (to fame). “Which photograph should we choose?” say two female students and a male student. But they buy three, paying 15 kopecks for all of them. Sic transit gloria mundi.
Anonymous No.24798080 [Report] >>24798784
>>24790905
Russian Orthodoxy is the most vulgar and bastardised form of Christianity shy of those corporate megachurches in the southern USA. It's essentially just a vehicle for organised crime and state surveillance nowadays. If there were justice in the world the Patriarch of Moscow would be burned alive.
Anonymous No.24798116 [Report]
>>24797355
I've been putting off Kurosawa's movies, but I'll have to check it out.
I read that Mizoguchi also had a film based off one of Tolstoy's works. its called "The Straits of Love and Hate" and its supposed to be based off Resurrection. one of his earlier sound films. Mizoguchi seems like the guy to do a good Tolstoy adaptation. Ozu would too.
Anonymous No.24798784 [Report]
>>24798080
Tolstoy got himself excommunicated from it
Anonymous No.24799334 [Report]
>>24790742
this collection
Anonymous No.24799587 [Report] >>24799588
>>24790487 (OP)
I don't think much about him these days but he left an indelible mark on my psyche. I read War and Peace at 18 and it's the novel that made me fall in love with literature. I've read "literary" novels before, including Dostoevsky, but W&P felt like a qualitatively different experience. There's Tolstoy, and there's everyone else. This is in large part due to his merit as an artist, but I also can't deny that there's an element of nostalgia for me here. I think of that period where I was in my "honeymoon phase" as the capstone of my development from adolescence to young adulthood. I'm not a kind or warm person now, but I cannot think back to my childhood without shame when I think about how I treated people in my life. I was/am very much a late bloomer in the sense that certain capacities for warmth and empathy only started developing when I was in that 16-20-ish age bracket and in my mind reading Tolstoy is inextricably linked to the most active stages and culmination of that process. For these reasons, as well as for its genuine artistic merit, and for its exciting historiographical/philosophical aspects, I am very fond of W&P. However, Anna Karenina is Tolstoy's best artistic work in my opinion. I've reread it every year or two since reading it for the first time and listened to an audiobook version in English and in Russian. I've been sitting here trying to figure out what to say but I think all I can say is that it is the finest example of Tolstoy's best quality as a writer, which is his capacity to portray characters with depth and tenderness. I feel like trying to write anything beyond that is like describing a woman's charms with words. All I can do is say the equivalent of "she's got fantastic tits" but we can all see how beautiful she is and all I'd be doing is reducing that to a vulgar and unnecessary phrase. If you've read Tolstoy you know, and even though logically I know many people read it and did not like it, I cannot imagine why so I have nothing to say on that score. I can't help but love Anna, and I can't help but be touched by Levin's somewhat ridiculous philosophical journey. On my latest reread I found Karenin to be an especially compelling character. The scene where he tries to confront Anna for the first time was oddly moving, and the scene where he's there with her when she gives birth to little Anna is probably my favorite, although I've never seriously tried to pick just one. I have read most of his longer short stories/novellas and a fair amount of his short stories. The ones that stuck out the most are Hadji Murat, Father Sergius, Devil, and Kreutzer Sonata. Out of these, Hadji Murat is the one I found most beautiful, and Kreutzer Sonata is the one I found to be most thought provoking, which is funny because I'm very much the stereotypical 4channe(le)r when it comes to relationships with women.

1/2
Anonymous No.24799588 [Report]
>>24790487 (OP)
>>24799587
2/2

Next to his great novels, I'd say The Death of Ivan Ilyich+Confession is the work that had the most effect on me. I say work because my edition had the two bundled together and it's a decision that makes sense to me. The former, as wonderful as it is, for me is just a prelude to Confession. I'm not sure how I feel about it. In Tolstoy's plain spoken and incisive way, he articulates the way a certain kind of person - and I consider myself to be part of this set - wrestles with the question of what constitutes a good life. I don't think I ever understood Tolstoy's conclusion (I thought I did for a time and had a brief fascination with Christianity and also monasticism...) but the way he presents the question stuck with me, and by that point I was genuinely curious to read about Tolstoy as a person (I also bought a biography about him). Aside from my love for his art, I feel like I got something from him in a way that I never did with any other artist/philosopher. I'm not sure how to describe it, maybe you can call it a perspective or an outlook although really it has nothing to do with his philosophy - and I have read his Gospels in Brief, the Kingdom of God is Within You, What is Art and a couple of other essays - and I don't consider myself a disciple of his, like how some people are "Hegelians"... but I would still say that his works have had a profound influence on me in the ways I describe above and in many ways I cannot describe. All that said, I haven't read everything. I attempted to read Cossacks in Russian but I haven't finished yet, and I never read it in English. I haven't read Childhood/Boyhood/Youth. My biggest unresolved issue is that I gave up on Resurrection partway. An Anon ITT said it was his most popular book during his lifetime. I don't know if it's true but when I tried it I found it lacking in the kind of charm his other novels have in droves. I will definitely revisit it someday.
Anonymous No.24799621 [Report]
>>24790487 (OP)
The best imitator of the French.
Anonymous No.24799665 [Report]
>>24790881
Though it isn't that preachy in tone, it is preaching a message and people today cannot take preaching - especially not in art. I reckon it's the one in the end Tolstoy would want to be remembered for.
Anonymous No.24799762 [Report]
>>24790881
Just market forces. War and Peace and AK are easier and more profitable to sell because almost all people read books to show off.

Plus it has a lot of truth in it and the capitalists hate that.

As for here, nobody reads here.