Thread 28579592

Mustang is 12k underwater. What are my options?

>>28579592 (OP)
Talk to the lender for options. They might be able to sell it for you and apply that to your debt which could pay it off if it’s equal or more to what you owe.

I’m not joking. They just want to have the debt paid as much as they can. They’ll probably work with you.

I had that happen to me and my loan company bank sold my car (that I couldn’t possibly pay for anymore) for me and gave me a $8K check.

>mad in love with the S550
>no ZF8 or DCT option
aaaaand dropped

>>28579592 (OP)
Makes sure you have gap insurance, then wrap it around a telephone pole during a rainstorm. Say you think you hydroplaned.

>>28579592 (OP)
Work some overtime and pay it off early.
You can avoid 75% of the interest costs that way.
Then remember why car loans are horrible

>>28579592 (OP)
You could just keep driving it, what's the issue?

>>28579642
If you’re underwater then by definition the value doesn’t cover the note

>>28579592 (OP)
Suicide?

get a Turo account

>>28579666
Ford's 10 speed is a ZF8 with two more gears

>>28579763
I’m curious as to how much underwater.

>>28580001
$12k

>>28579994
then why is it slow and gay in comparison? Especially the downshifts using the paddles. I heard there are numerous lawsuits against ford because of their garbage auto trannies even

>>28580035
adding two gears wasn't a great idea in retrospect. but they thought they needed to comply with Obama's fuel economy rules

>>28580023
Ok, so…does this mean that you can sell it for at least $12K and break even?

Or could you sell it for more?

Check (just for fun) what Carvana would give you. Again, just to get an idea. Also see what your year & model with mileage go for on sites such as Autotrader.com and carsforsale.com

I’m going to assume that you’re in the US for this venture.

Now, this is if you have another way of getting around and don’t absolutely NEED that Mustang.

I’m hoping that you have somesort of a job and can get to it without that Mustang.

Or, that you can quickly get a job (I don’t care if that’s making burgers) to pay that shit off and better yourself.

Leverage this debt against what you need to do to come out of this unscathed.

In other words, sell it or use it to drive to work in order to make money to get out of this fiasco.

>>28580116
It’s not clear to me that people know the definition of words anymore, but underwater by 12k is supposed to mean “if I sold this car, I would still owe 12k on it after putting the proceeds towards the loan”

>>28579994
What the fuck.. it's absolute trash in comparison. Absolute trash can transmission.
>>28580116
car worth 30k but he owes 42k as an example

You either have poor credit or paid over MSRP. Sucks for you

>>28580139
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford%E2%80%93GM_10-speed_automatic_transmission#Layout
>The transmission is based on the well-known 8-speed automatic transmission 8HP from ZF.
surprised me too

>>28579994
Ford's 10-speed is an absolute POS

I've driven 20+ automatics Mustang for a week at a time (addicted to prostitute cars--er I mean rental cars, I treat them like prostitutes tho and that's how I learned they are shitty trannymissions)

>financing
Lol!!!

Don't feel too bad I guess, every imbecile who buys new and/or finances is underwater the moment they sign and roll out of the dealershit

My car is worth more now than when I bought it last year. The c2s MSRP is 18k higher than when I bought it kek

>>28579592 (OP)
>What are my options?
probably the best option would be to make regular payments+a little extra to reduce your risk if you total it
if you own a home(LOL), using a secured line of credit would let you shift the debt on to your house for likely a lower rate

lastly, you can default on the loan and completely fuck your credit which would essentially blacklist you from any loan with anything other than loanshark terms like 30%apr
and also mark you as an 'unreliable irresponsible fuckwit' for anything that ever pulls your credit

>>28580506
>le cash only boomer

There are lots of times when financing makes excellent financial sense. It's just never when a retard says "well I've got $1000 after bills each month so I can afford to finance this depreciating piece of shit for 7 years at 10%"

>>28580506
reminder that cash buyers are complete retards that waste money.
financeGODS get their cars for free, even super- and hypercars.
If you know, you know

Just drive it

>>28579688
What about mortgages?

>>28580506
Financing works for classics or restoration projects. I myself financed a 9k car, spent 1.5k on it and am expecting to spend another 3k total to make it pristine and this car sells for 30k in my country. Financing new or newish cars is the retarded option, because they are most certainly going to depreciate

>>28580506
t. poorfag driving a 1994 toyota thinking he's being practical

>>28580116
Are you stupid? And why are you putting a line break after every sentence?

>>28580743
>Financing new or newish cars is the retarded option, because they are most certainly going to depreciate

Often manufacturers will finance below the market rate though, so you have to take that into account, so the question becomes "can you make more money than prime+depreciation?"

If you're making good money, have 100k in the bank and you want a $100k Lexus, for which we'll say 31% depreciation over 5 years:
>cash
Initial = -$100,000
0 monthly payments = $0
5 years: sell car for $69,000
Final net worth imapct = -$31,000
>finance
Down payment = -$20,000
Finance $80,000 @ 4%
60 monthly payments add up to -$88,378 over 5 years
Invest $80,000 at 18% annualized (aka any basic bitch index fund these last 5 years)
NW: - $20,000 down - $88,378 payments + $69,000 used value = -$39,378
80,000 @ 18% compounded x 5 years = $183,032
Final net worth impact: $183,021-39,378 = $143,643

Ignoring tax fuckery (both sides, capital gains ofc if the financoor cashes out those assets, but also often car payments are deductible), the bro who financed is up $143,643 cash and $174,643 net over the cash buyer. This also doesn't account for inflation -- finance bro's last car payment in year+5 was at a number set in year 1, but the payment is a lot less money in real terms.
If it was 2020 and you got a 0% loan? Thanks to inflation, the car company literally paid you to finance a car from them as your investments exploded in value

>>28580506
even if you're going to buy a car with cash it's often better to finance it as a negotiation tactic and then pay it off immediately

>>28581097
Index fund performance is not guaranteed and certainly not 18% annual averaged. Also your masterplan requires you to have or make an extra $88k for the payments.

>>28581228
>Index fund performance is not guaranteed and certainly not 18% annual averaged
I was using that as an example of the most brain-dead investment literally anyone can make, you poor faggot, and it's even funnier because in real life NASDAQ has actually returned 23.5% annual, averaged since 2019. 18% annual is conservative if you have two brain cells to rub together.
>Also your masterplan requires you to have or make an extra $88k for the payments.
Some people are destined to be poor forever. This is so stupid it actually breaks my heart -- I will, nonetheless, explain this to you so even a child could understand it.
Big Tall Grownup A: Buys the shiny car for $100k cash
Big Tall Grownup B: Finances the shiny car for $20k cash down, then 60 months of payments totalling $88k
Grownup A spends $100k on the car and has a $69k used car at the end of 5 years
Grownup B person spends $108k on the car and has a $69k used car at the end of 5 years
The difference is that over the 5-year period, Grownup B's $80k investment (that's what he has left after the down payment! See, because 100-20 = 80!! good job!) at what is actually a conservative 18% annualized return is worth $183,032, whereas Grownup A has $0 because he spent that money on the shiny car that goes vroom vroom

If you can actually afford the car (this does not mean "I have $500 left of my McDonald's paycheck after bills so I can afford $500!!!!") and are capable of the amazing financial feat of outperforming (manufacturer's financing APR)+(yearly depreciation) per year, financing a car is free money. Do you need me to explain what "afford" actually means?

Put the fries in the bag.

should've got flood insurance if it's underwater OP

>>28581279
>it's even funnier because in real life NASDAQ has actually returned 23.5% annual, averaged since 2019
Past performance is not guarantee of future profits.
>Some people are destined to be poor forever. This is so stupid it actually breaks my heart -- I will, nonetheless, explain this to you so even a child could understand it.
Even a child could tell you're comparing a 100k single payment to 20k down payment + 80k investment + 88k over 5 years, or 188k total. You could just pay the 100k for the car and then put the other 88k in stocks or whatever and outperform your dream scenario, unless you do actually need to finance the 88k which a Big Shot like you surely can do for lower rates than what the dealership will offer you and without having to put a car as collateral. In fact, why does this have anything to do with cars at all? If you're guaranteed 18%+ yoy every year just go take as many loans as possible with lower APR than that and dump everything into stocks, literally free money and you don't have to wait until you buy a car to do it.

>>28581330
>Past performance is not guarantee of future profits.
lmao holy shit you mean there's risk involved in investing? Good thing you're too smart to fall for that scam! Put the fries in the bag.
>You could just pay the 100k for the car and then put the other 88k in stocks or whatever
It's amazing dealing with poor people, because you come up with literally the simplest possible scenario custom designed to be easy to understand, and they still don't get it.
>well why don't you just have a million dollars?!!!
Lol
> In fact, why does this have anything to do with cars at all?
>If you're guaranteed 18%+ yoy every year just go take as many loans as possible with lower APR than that and dump everything into stocks, literally free money and you don't have to wait until you buy a car to do it.
Because, and I am going to try to use the tiniest words I can so you can understand
1. Manufacturer financing is often the cheapest loan you can get, far below what any other loan on offer is and
2. In this scenario you're going to buy a car anyway, because that's what we're talking about
So, as I said in the first case
>If you're making good money
>have 100k in the bank
>and you want a $100k Lexus
#1 means you can afford to have a $100k car. This does not mean "you have enough so you can cover the cost of the car" -- thinking like this is one of the reasons why you're poor. Let's assume you're netting 100k and thus are on the outside edge of what's acceptable for a $1470 car note.
If you spend $100k on the car and then drop $1470 a month into stocks at an average 18% annual return, at the end of the 5-year period you have deposited $88,000 into the account and have $136,000. You have earned about $46,000. The 80,000 with zero additional contributions is worth $183,000. You have earned about $103,000. This is because it's better to compound 80,000 for 5 years than a slowly increasing amount from 0.

>>28579592 (OP)
nigmaxx and just don't pay

>>28579592 (OP)
Somthimes you can work with the lender to basically give the car back and they won't destroy your credit. Or work out a lower payment.

>>28581097
>>28581279
>passive-aggressive with reaction images
>aggressive in post anyway
Hang yourself from the nearest tree.

>>28581330
>If you're guaranteed 18%+ yoy every year just go take as many loans as possible with lower APR than that and dump everything into stocks
Plenty of people do that with heloc and margin

>>28581364
>lmao holy shit you mean there's risk involved in investing? Good thing you're too smart to fall for that scam!
So we went from "financing a car is free money" to "of course there's a risk involved". Interesting.
>You have earned about $46,000. The 80,000 with zero additional contributions is worth $183,000. You have earned about $103,000. This is because it's better to compound 80,000 for 5 years than a slowly increasing amount from 0.
Cool so we went from investing being 143k up to just 57k up. Now do one where you get a loan from the bank rather than just putting money each month.

>>28581364
Ngmi.

I financed my car at 4.5% because I'd rather invest than pay in cash.

>>28581417
>So we went from "financing a car is free money" to "of course there's a risk involved". Interesting.
You literally can't read lol
>If you can actually afford the car (this does not mean "I have $500 left of my McDonald's paycheck after bills so I can afford $500!!!!") and are capable of the amazing financial feat of outperforming (manufacturer's financing APR)+(yearly depreciation) per year, financing a car is free money.
Tell me which words in this sentence you don't understand so I can break it down for you Grade 3 style.
>Now do one where you get a loan from the bank rather than just putting money each month.
Lol ok, for an unsecured personal loan for a high earner with excellent credit you're looking at about an 8% APR
So, instead of borrowing $80k from Toyota at 3.99%, a down payment for $20k from the cash in your account and investing the remaining $80k, you borrow $80k from the bank at 8% and buy the car cash for $100k. Your monthly payment from Lexus would be $1472 and your monthly payment from the bank is $1,622. Both investment accounts end up at $183,000, but the guy who financed the Lexus paid $8,377 in interest over the term of the loan and the guy who borrowed from the bank paid $17,326, ending up with $8,949 less for absolutely no reason.

>>28581434
Yes, this is what I'm trying to explain to the impoverished retard

>>28581441
>$8,949 less
That's a big leap from the $143k less we started with, isn't it? All of this investment bollocks doesn't belong here, you're deliberately glossing over the risks and using examples that are heavily skewed towards investing then acting like it's an apples to apples comparison.

>>28581395
>you can talk the nigger talk, but can you walk the nigger walk?

>>28581474
You have to be ready to pull a gun on a repo man. It is what it is.

>>28581468
>That's a big leap from the $143k less we started with, isn't it?
Yes, because in this new ridiculous situation you've dreamed up to cope with, our buyer inexplicably paid cash for a car and then immediately borrowed $80k at a higher rate for absolutely no reason, when they had the option of borrowing the same amount of money at half the rate by financing the car.
> All of this investment bollocks doesn't belong here
You are poor and you always will be poor. In first world countries, financing is a common way to purchase a car, and if you have two brain cells to rub together it's an excellent option. It's clearly not for you.
>you're deliberately glossing over the risks
The main reason you're poor and always will be poor is because you do not take risks. You can't win if you don't play. An index fund is just about the most boring, safe investment anyone can make, and they've been returning >20% annual average for nearly a decade now. Actually the funny thing is, thanks to inflation effectively acting as a tax on money-holders rather than asset-owners, your wealth is consistently flowing to those who do play. You not only can't win, but lose by the rate of inflation, every single year.
In actual first world countries, not the sodden crab mentality hellhole you're trapped in, pretty much everyone owns appreciating assets. If yours are beating (manufacturer's APR)+(depreciation), it is free money to finance a car (leaving aside specific self-employment/business situations in which car payment interest is tax-deductible which makes it even more attractive).

>>28581497
not him but the financing of cars is why they are unaffordable today. it's the same phenomena that makes homes unaffordable. you give someone with a 60-80 IQ a 95% LTV loan and they use it to bid up the prices of assets well beyond what is reasonable.

>>28581512
Ok so how does that make any impact on the topic? If you pay cash can you suddenly pay 40% of the price instead of 100%?

>>28581525
>If you pay cash can you suddenly pay 40% of the price instead of 100%?
yes.

>>28581279
Bro people in qqq didnt break even tunil like 2015, you're a fucking retard

>>28581531
The opposite actually. Your money will never be worth more than it is at this exact moment. It is losing value every second. If you finance a car, your final payment will be a number set right now, but that will actually be considerably less actual value by the time you pay it.
That said Anon is correct about subprime auto, which is poised to ruin all our shit again unless we get massive rate cuts soon. Good thing it looks like Powell bent the knee today

>>28581544
>I tried to use some Investy Words
>hope it worked!
Unfortunately you just made yourself look stupid and poor

>>28581548
Not sure why you're bothering. Most people are retarded when it comes into investing and money in general.

>>28581097
>18%
Lol, 10% would be an exceptional year. Expect 5% and anything more is a bonus, retard. In this climate it makes margins much tighter given the average interest rate on a loan or finance and suddenly the premium car market sales decline makes sense, unlike your fantasy world of 1000% gains.

>>28581549
>Not sure why you're bothering. Most people are retarded when it comes into investing and money in general.
I was totally clueless about all of it until an anon was rude to me years ago, which was a huge growth moment for me and changed my life.
Thanks to his mockery of me for being retarded when it comes to investing and money in general, I realized he was right. Everyone has had to play the Money Game since the first caveman traded a seashell for a dead squirrel, but most people play it in the way where you are guaranteed to lose every single day of every single year. I was trading time for money, which was constantly being devalued and the value transfered to people who owned stocks.

>>28581557
>10% would be an exceptional year.
The funniest thing about a poor retard saying this is that it instantly betrays that you're a poor retard who doesn't know the slightest thing about what's been going on for years. NDX (that's the NASDAQ-100 for you) is up nearly 12% this year already, and it's still August. 2024, +25%. 2023, +45%. 2022 was a miserable year with a -32% drop but that was after being up 27% in 2021, 47.6% in 2020, and 37.96% in 2019. You could just be putting money into some mutual fund, paying like 0.8% annual management, and printing.
>In this climate it makes margins much tighter given the average interest rate on a loan or finance
this, for example, sounds very Businessy and Investlike to a retard like you or a child, but it's nonsense

>>28581559
There's nothing wrong with trading time for money. I invest around 130k a year all because I'm trading my time for money. Your numbers are kinda crazy though. You can't assume 18%. I usually use 8% or 6 to be conservative for when to decide to quit working. Although I've been holding pltr and rycey for 4 years which have 10x so it's skewing my numbers.

>>28579592 (OP)

go get another shitbox that's not over priced and while your credit is decent voluntarily repo the mustang

>>28581567
>I invest around 130k a year all because I'm trading my time for money.
That's different though, you're financing assets in order to stop trading time for money. I mean the people who just do that their whole lives, just wage and spend until they're too old to work
>You can't assume 18%
I'm pretty young so I've only been at it for 15 years but I've had exactly 1 year sub-15%, in 2022 because I got greedy and didn't sell fast enough, but that was after 80% in 2020 and 40% in 2021, literally 100% mutual funds and maybe 2 trades a year
That said I am very aware that I've spent my entire investing existence basically in a giant bubble

>>28579994
I have both, and I will say the GMC 10 speed is a clunky fucking mess, won’t shift through 5th when it’s cold, and misses gears which the Ford engineers named “intermittent shifting” but the fucker does keep going and will probably never go out. I really like the ZF8.

>>28580742
What about mortgages?
You can flip the house and it will be worth more.

>>28579592 (OP)
Skill issue.
I was never underwater on my car loan because I put 12k down, and I paid it off early to save myself on interest.

>>28581279
>Big Tall Grownup B: Finances the shiny car for $20k cash down, then 60 months of payments totalling $88k
in what kind of fantasy are you living in where a 60 month auto loan for $80k will only have $8k of interest over it? I have a 782 FICO 8 score and I cant even get rates that good

>>28581482
>repo man
Why would you focus on him? He's just like you, operating in this fake economy.

>>28581777
>in what kind of fantasy are you living in where a 60 month auto loan for $80k will only have $8k of interest over it?
That's 4% APR. Come September's rate cut, that'll be a very high rate for an 800+ FICO
I just googled and Lexus around me is offering 2.99% on a bunch of models and 0% financing on some RZ's. At 0%, thanks to the magic of inflation, Toyota is literally paying you to buy a car from them

>>28581048
That's genuine reddit spacing right there. Wish anons knew what it actually meant instead of calling all paragraphs "reddit spacing".

>>28582249
>reddit spacing

That's not a real thing. Anons were "reddit spacing" years before reddit existed.

>>28582380
Well yes but that manner of posting has fallen out of vogue by this point. But the double linebreaking is a thing Redditors do now, I think, genuinely never posted there so idk.
I personally think the whole >reddit spacing thing is dumb, since it's incredibly disruptive to threads;
I've seen entire threads get derailed by a guy posting like 3 sentences like this, maybe with a

space between to seperate an idea. And someone else having a mega-spergout because of it.

>>28582391
>I personally think the whole >reddit spacing thing is dumb

Reddit spacing was a trap designed by some genius anon a decade ago to expose idiot election tourists from reddit, by convincing them that normal post formatting was le secret newfag telltale on the secret internet hate machine. Thus /r/donald redditors would instantly expose themselves by yelling "reddit spacing" at normal posts.

It worked too well

>>28580506
this.
look at the financecucks seething (i would be too)

>>28582421
>I'm going to spend cash at the precise moment when it can never be worth more
>to buy a depreciating "asset"
>when money is almost literally getting thrown out the window

>>28581820
Ford had 0% on rangers last month. If they throw 0% on a DH I might snag one