Thread 28646525

>Toyota will use a 4-cylinder, 2.0-liter hybrid naturally aspirated unit pumping out upwards of 200-hp, while Mazda will reportedly employ of revised version of its current 2.0-liter, which according to one report, may be hybridized and should develop around 200-hp as well.

>the platform of the next-gen 2-seater MX-5 platform will be stretched slightly to accommodate the 4-seater 2+2 GR86

where were you when sports cars were kill

>>28646525 (OP)
Assuming what you've said is true I can only predict the following:
>toyota will have e-CVT
>mazda will have manual
the rest will be history

>>28646525 (OP)
Will they still offer manual? I think going automatic will kill the Miata. It's basically the only affordable vehicle that gives a 'driver focused' experience. Gr86/Brz come close, but they're a bit more compromised for practicality.

>no link
Plant herbs

>>28646525 (OP)
If it's not sub 2500lbs with a double wishbone, it's DOA.
But basically no gas cars are gonna pass
Emmissions in the next 10yrs

>>28646572
I don't think Mazda would bother if it wasn't going to have a manual, hybrid manual has been done before like that gay Honda egg. And if Mazda are going to produce a manual option anyway I don't see any reason why Toyota wouldn't also provide that option, unless the drivetrain they have in mind isn't compatible. Toyota would obviously be willing to sell a slushbox, or even cvt, only "sports car".
Also worth noting that the only source for this so far is Best Car who regularly publish absolute bullshit, if they're to be believed we should be on the RX14 by now.

>>28646525 (OP)
Gayyyy

>>28646609
this honestly, fuck rentals

>>28646525 (OP)
this little 1/4 window, fake. its a piece of black glossy plastic. ruins the whole car

>>28646525 (OP)
>mx5 and 86 to share platform
10,000 percent bullshit.

>>28646689
It is your penance for not buying a soft top roadster

>>28646874
Probably bullshit, but Mazda making a Miat with an RX-8 equivalent sibling for a Toyoda drivetrain is believable bullshit

>>28646588
>>28646874
Since OP likes sucking cocks instead of posting links: https://www.forbes.com/sites/peterlyon/2025/09/28/toyota-and-mazda-team-up-to-develop-new-mx-5-and-gr86/

>>28646901
I wonder if they'll be collaborating on two cars instead of one, where Toyota will derive the SF-R they keep talking about wanting to build from the Miata, and Mazda will get an RX-9 platform from the GR86. That makes more sense to me than potentially compromising the MX-5 platform that Mazda's engineers have moved heaven and earth to keep small and lightweight.

>>28646977
Isn't Toyota also supposedly working on an MR2 successor, a Celica successor and their own mark 6 Supra? Do they really need a second FR sports coupe competing with the 86?

>86 with double wishbones and a real engine
Too based to be real

>>28646572
They cost as much as a mustang.
Nuff said.

>>28646525 (OP)
>where were you when sports cars were kill
1. Isn't point of mx5 being inexpensive, chill roadster for normies?

2. Future of sportscars is 100% ev. Pistons and cylinders just can't compete with electromagnetic coil doing bzzzz. Sound of real burping engine and farting exhaust is playfield of enthusiasts who like sounds of real burping engines and farting exhausts - not people who actually care about performance.

Fact that manufacturers make hybrids doing fake sounds means that most people don't actually care if burping and farting is real or not.

>>28647148
>people who actually care about performance.
those people don't buy electric cars either because the'yre not fooled by a cheeky couple of dragstrip runs

the only people buying electric sports cars are new-money morons who want a shiny toy regardless of how much sense it actually makes. as we all know, having "stuff" even if it's the fastest car in the universe, isn't a replacement for a personality.

>>28646533
really?

>>28647148
Rational take of a person who actually goes outside.
OP is such a fucking fag btw.

On point 1
Not sure how much I care about Mazda Miata specifically since it's fine with it's market that I'm not part of. I'm just there for the Japanese autism (50/50 weight distro, manual, FR, >muhtougepeakcorneringtheory, light weight, high rev, rotary, etcetcetc) and styling.
Come back to me when they finally get another RX or even another real performance car out.
At this point I don't even care if they just build a Mazda 6 coupe with turbo V6 since the last RX8 was in 2011. SP is more pipe dream and click bait fuel than reality.

On point 2
EV & hybrid will slowly replace ICE. Just like how cars replaced horses.
Doesn't mean there aren't people who own horses, ride horses, use horses, or race horses.
They are just kept to their roles and for the rich/enthusiasts/farmers.

>>28647152
>cheeky couple of dragstrip runs
So there are some other advantages of high performance ICE over high performany EV? Or is it just typical cackle about "personality" or "soul" or whatever?

Objective difference is 1.7s 0-100km/h vs 2.5s 0-100km/h.

>>28647148
The car you posted can't even do sub 7 on the Nurburring despite slinging around almost 2000hp, a carbon fiber body and AWD.
"EV sports cars" is an oxymoron, they're just 1 trick pony fashion accessories for tech bros with too much money on hand currently.

>>28647182
>"EV sports cars" is an oxymoron, they're just 1 trick pony fashion accessories for tech bros with too much money on hand currently.
Sports cars in general are "1 trick pony" and ev just does this trick better. That's why Rimac bought Bugatti and not vice versa.

>>28646525 (OP)
>Toyota will use a 4-cylinder, 2.0-liter hybrid naturally aspirated unit pumping out upwards of 200-hp
But why? RAV4 Prime can pull off 305hp.

>>28646525 (OP)
>the platform of the next-gen 2-seater MX-5 platform will be stretched slightly to accommodate the 4-seater 2+2 GR86
Wait, does this mean Toyota is doing convertible?

>>28647166
>>28647198
wrong order
Rimac the company was bought by VAG and Mate Rimac is now in charge of Bugatti
Rimac as a brand no longer exists.

>>28647344
Mate Rimac (founder of Rimac Automobili) controls Bugatti-Rimac.

>>28647344
Rimac as a brand no longer exists in the same way Bugatti as a brand no longer exists. The new joint venture is called Bugatti-Rimac.

>>28647308
The Rav4 Prime is a PHEV, not a mild hybrid like what OP speculates the NE will be. The plug-in components add an extra 500lbs.

>>28646967
thanks

>>28647340
Doubt it, the RX-8 wasn't a convertible. Adding a second row of seats would mean you can't reuse the miata convertible roof.

>>28647340
>>28648260
Mazda probably wouldn't do this collaboration if Toyota was going to build a convertible

>>28648277
Good point, assuming this isn't just more best car bullshit Mazda would want to make sure the Miat retains a distinct market niche, competing against a Toyota twin is a whole different animal versus a Fiat.

>>28648260
>>28648277
>>28648294
Toyota is the biggest car manufacturer in the world and they have platform for any and every size and type and shape. Except for convertible - that needs it's own, separate platform (enforced in different way) but is considered niche and unprofitable (that's why most companies stopped making them). From Toyota's perspective it would make sense to just buy platform from other company, from Mazda's perspective it's 2-seat roadster vs 4-seat convertible (not exactly direct competitor).

If Toyota wanted to make regular car, they could just use one of their own platforms, that their own R&D is working on all the time, instead of sharing something so different and specific with other company.

>>28647152
On the other hand, the fastest production car around the ring is a hybrid mercedes with 3 electric motors

>>28646525 (OP)
I don't get why they would do this. 86s are incredibly popular, I see them everywhere. They're not some kind of niche car.

>>28646525 (OP)
Toyota is killing its legacy with this hybrid bullshit. They're moving to an entirely hybrid lineup. They will have no fully gas vehicles in a few years, yes they're actually following through with it.

>>28648401
What regular platform does Toyota have for a lightweight budget FR sports coupe? They clearly can't be assed developing their own which is why they have these development partnerships with BMW and Subaru

>>28648696
>What regular platform does Toyota have for a lightweight budget FR sports coupe?
Dude, new Yaris has almost indentical wheelbase to 86 (between 256cm to 258cm - 86 was between 257cm to 257.5cm). On that platform Toyota makes hatchbacks, sedans and crossovers - any shape, powertrain layout and even price range you want. Sporty stuff like Yaris GR or comfy like Lexux LBX - whatever.

Most popular Toyota models are developed on this platform and so, platform itself will be developed for years to come.

Platform for convertible is very different beast - that one needs different construction from ground up with different reinforcements due to lack of roof. Until you want roof of your car to be extra squishy during accidents, it makes absolutely no sense to use convertible as a base for regular car. That's why even if some model is available in regular and convertible version - they both are designed on different platforms, not on common denominator (which is convertible, because you can't design convertible on regular platform).

>>28648684
The 86 can't meet emissions in its current form

I think this will be a separate autotragic hybrid trim level for people whose legs are too weak to daily a manual, and they will continue to offer the manual (they pretty much have to or they'd lose 75% of the market (would be funny to see old Miata prices skyrocket even more though))
I don't know how emissions standards work in the rest of the world but I think in the US, CAFE mandates that the average fuel economy for passenger cars within the brand are kept up within a certain level so this kind of thing is necessary if they still want to offer a driver's car.
my question is, will the ICE trims also offer 200+ horsepower?

>>28647198
>Sports cars in general are "1 trick pony"
?
>That's why Rimac bought Bugatti
Bugattis are also a fashion accessory but for the rich instead of tech bros.

>>28646977
>pic
holy fucking CUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUTE

>>28647166
>other advantages of high performance ICE over high performany EV?
Yea:
They don't weigh a metric fuckton
They can actually corner
They don't run out of fuel in a single lap
They don't shred their tyres in like a lap due to how heavy they are

>>28646977
looks like a mini shagged an aston martin and the baby survived the abortion

>>28647154
>$4mil hyper cars
>only bought by super wealthy retards who park it for 10 years then sell for a profit
>Every company is abandoning hybrids other than the "we set another lap record" versions.
Yeah, souless AND gay.

>>28647148
your jeet opinion doesn't even make sense

>>28647148
>Future of sportscars is 100% ev
future of sportscars is classics, restomods, and custom kit builds
y'know, actual hobbyist stuff

>>28647154
>mclaren is doing the w1
>ferrari has the f80
what is porsche up to?

>>28650111
Project is stuck in limbo
>Porsche currently dealing with underwhelming EV sales & development hell
>Current CEO may or may not leave
>Poor market response to EV hypercars; plan B seems to be hobbling various 963 & VAG hybrid components into a Revuelto/Tourbillon-esque drivetrain layout
>Mission X as of current is a Rimac Nevera with 4x downforce and no front motor

>rumored that Toyota and Mazda were developing the next MR2
>it's actually just the next GR86
ONE NOTHING WRONG WITH ME

>>28647148
>Fact that manufacturers make hybrids doing fake sounds means that most people don't actually care if burping and farting is real or not.
that they're spending the money to do this in the first place means that they know just how lame they'll sound to people

>>28649037
>>28649022
>?
Acceleration. Engine that accelerates car from 0 to 100 in as few seconds as possible. EV does this better than ICE because magnetic field is instant, while the pistons must accelerate themselves before they start pushing the car. Rest is nuance and adjustment of parts, while most important part will always have advantage when it's electric.
>>28649750
>classics, restomods, and custom kit builds
Dude you have described living in the past, not future. Meantime what will happen to actual sport of car racing that makes new sports cars to be constructed?

30 years ago F1 engines were mostly V12. They're getting smaller and smaller and now they're mostly hybrid V6 - you see where future's going?

>>28648696
>>28648806
From what internet is saying Mazda engineers in Toyota are working on platform for regular (not convertible) cars that is based on MX-5 platform. It seems Mazda wants to replace MX-5 RF with regular coupe and that's what Toyota wants too with new 86 (just little longer).

Platform for Mazda's roadster will be only slightly modified and they don't need Toyota for that.

>>28650395
>Sports cars in general are "1 trick pony"
>Acceleration
Oh i see, you're retarded, my bad. Anyways the"future of cars" is currently underperforming hard against decade old combustion ones.

>>28650443
>Anyways the"future of cars" is currently underperforming hard against decade old combustion ones.
You're comparing regular, 1st gen electric shitbox vs specifically designed race car. I would sum it up somehow meanly, but you've done the job yourself.

>>28646525 (OP)
>sports cars
I mean lets be honest these are not sports cars, same as the gm corvette.
They are lifestyle cars, with sporty styling, and most people just call them hairdressers cars.

>>28650480
>specifically designed race car
You mean the Burger Boomer Mobile? And no im not just comparing these 2 see >>28647182
I hope that's all the irrelevant remarks you had left.

>>28650500
>Burger Boomer Mobile
with a fuckhueg wing, better suspension, brakes, tires, like half the weight, and god knows what under the hood vs what is ostensibly a luxury sedan
of course its faster around a track

>>28646525 (OP)
>just trust me bro

>>28646533
I drove a hornet r/t as a rental for a bit and that hybrid was spinning the fucking tires like crazy. so much torque it was kinda like driving a veloster n without the crackles and pops.

So what is the closest thing to an RX7 or RX8 in the current market?

Miata?
86?
G70?
Toyota Supra?
Corvette?
911?

>>28650443
why did the tesla have to get towed? kek

>>28650398
>Mazda wants to replace MX-5 RF with regular coupe
this might be based if they bring back the option for an OEM hardtop for soft top models.

>Mazda makes an affordable sports car on their own that's consistently profitable for 30 years
>Toyota has to keep revising their lineup while sharing costs with other makes
If Mazda can do it, why can't Toyota?

>>28647340
yea just like the convertible supra they have

>>28653554
Mazda are the epitome of based retards. Car manufacturers are raped by the EU to meet strict emissions (Do it again Diesel Harris), and are encouraged to sell massive profit margin 4 doors. Even fucking lotus is going to sell an SUV now. Mazda have small market share and have pissed money on retard pursuits like the Wankel, the MX-5 etc. from their inception. Excellent for broke enthusiasts, who will maintain their car to the hilt, won't sell with Stacey who will still buy the 5 door ford SUV until the engine grenades from burning oil and wet belts, and then come in and buy another of the same model. They even sell in my shitty potato country where they tax 20k for registering a car to drive, before you even tax it

>>28650398
rx-8 2 electric boogaloo

>>28653525
overheating

>>28653554
Because the volume Toyota expect from a single model dwarfs Mazda's entire production. Mazda are still living the 90s JDM dream, bean counters run Toyota. It isn't that Toyota can't, Toyota have the resources to do whatever they want, but it doesn't make sense to move production space over to small projects when they could be using it to shit out phev Rav4s instead. They're already doing their halo passion product with the Lexus GT3 shit anyway.

>>28653054
Supra or M2 or something I guess. A compact FR sports coupe. Nothing selling today really captures Mazda's obsession with light weight performance like the FD did though, the MX-5 sort of does I guess, but it is a different animal, and lacks the stupid wankel drivetrain which is really the defining feature of an RX#.

>>28654532
does it count as a halo car for Toyota if it's under a different brand? or do you just mean in terms of internal employee passion

>>28650129
is it over for porsche?

One day they'll bring back THE Silvia, and then we'll celebrate

>>28655412
Yeah, it is a halo product for Lexus and not Toyota, but the point is that it is hard to justify wasting staff and production space to multiple niche products at once when they're already unable to produce enough hybrid SUVs to meet demand. If a company like Mazda wants to do insane borderline boutique sports cars that make almost no profit then it makes much more sense for Toyota to buy in and badge engineer something for product diversity than to go all in themselves.

>>28650395
Back to V8s
https://sports.yahoo.com/article/f1-could-return-v8-engines-193606678.html

>>28650395
you're so retarded i can't even call you a nigger in good conscience; you're something worse. you also write like you're ESL.

>>28646525 (OP)
That's great news! Greater complexity and more technology provides for a raw, visceral driving experience.
Repairs may be more difficult and costly but that's worth it for the reduce reliability.

you guys ARE getting the best driver's car before they ruin it right?

>>28650212
That wasn't the rumor, it was the supra being a Mazda i6 that was a rumor

>>28655412
Lexus is Toyota's halo, not Toyota. The lc500 and soon to be lfr/grgt3 are the halos

>>28646635
Here is a (YOU) just wanted you to know not everyone completely ignored the only sane reply in this thread.

>>28646977
you can tell this car will never exist because it looks too unique and doesn't have 4 sets of headlights and a square grill

>>28646525 (OP)
Abyssmal dogshit

This entire thread is retarded. Toyota is done building in house sports cars because they don't want to devote money to RnD so they've been collaborating with other manufacturers to Frankenstein ones. BRZ is toyota modified body and Subaru engine, Supra is a Toyota modified BMW Z4 with an engine swap, the real issue partnering in making a sports car with Mazda is that Mazda's suspensions/chassis are better in this category (afforable sports car) than Toyota, and unless this car is going to be a small displacement V6 with something like miller-tech superchargers, it's going to be a rotary as Mazda has announced they want to make an Rx-9.
*IF* they did partner up I seriously doubt that Subaru would be okay with Mazda using the BRZ/GT86 platform, nor would Mazda likely want to use Subaru's anything. Toyota would like throw together a body based off of one of their current sedan/hatch models. Crown if Mazda pushes a rotary, Camry for small dispo v6, and Corolla if it's just going to be a turbo 4 banger with a rotary "range extender". Everyone keeps screaming "HYBRID SPORTS CAR" but there have not been any examples of manual hybrid sports cars because those markets don't intersect much if at all, the comfort and sports car categories are the two who care about fuel economy the least as long as it's not atrocious
>tl;dr this thread is for morons speculating.

>>28646525 (OP)
B A S E D
We'll now have faster acceleration and still have good horsepower. Also fuck the Miata. Literally a toy car for retards.

How much power does the G16E make without a turbo?

>>28646525 (OP)
>Mazda will reportedly employ of revised version of its current 2.0-liter, which according to one report, may be hybridized and should develop around 200-hp as well

WRONG
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a64493876/2027-mazda-miata-future-details/

>>28663334
It is part of the "Toyota Dynamic Force engine" family, so the M15 i3 is sort of the NA equivalent, though with slightly different displacement, it makes 92kw.