Thread 513958126

What the fuck was Hitler thinking here?

>>513958126 (OP)
u do know hitler was fuckking retarded right?

>>513958126 (OP)
overconfidence

>>513958126 (OP)
You have to view WW 1&2 through the lense of a canaan ritual sacrifice. Shitler was trying to kill as many whites as possible. So was lenin, the kike.

>>513958126 (OP)
>US surely won't back up commies, that cannot happen

>>513958126 (OP)
Hitler wanted to take down Russia quickly like France. He was mostly right since the Russian army was so unprepared. Italy and Romania could have fought better in N. Africa, Yugoslavia and Greece. Japan killed Germany by declaring an unwinnable war on the U.S.A which Hitler joined.

That was the plan from day 1, the stupid negrophile French and anglokikes stabbed him in the back.

>>513958126 (OP)
That's nothing, Think about this.
>Stuck in a two-front war
>The capital is constantly getting bombed
>Total sea blockade
>Declares war on USA
Dude was fucking retarded.

>>513958126 (OP)
it is because he was busy holocausting jews, you know

>>513958126 (OP)
He attacked two months later than intended. You can thank Serbs for that.

>>513958126 (OP)
The Soviets were going to invade. Fighting a defensive war against a horde that size would've been an even worse plan. It all makes more sense when you remember that Hitler didn't want WW2, he wanted France and Britain to be on board when the Germans marched east.

>>513958652
>Serbs are responsible for the downfall of Germany, twice
Heh

>>513958126 (OP)
>What the fuck was Hitler thinking here?
>how can i kill the most amount of white people in the least amount of time
. a bit like the current ukraine war.

>>513959014
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-axJTzj0VU

This explains it in more detail if it is available in your country.

>>513958126 (OP)
go to /uhg and you will have a good idea what he was thinking back then.

>>513959014
Most people couldn't comprehend how cursed Serbs are. There were two factions in Serbia in 1st Yugoslavia: pro-German (prince Pavle) and pro-English (prince/king Petar and general Dušan Simović), they've orchestrated Šljivovica coup: let's coup Pavle and join Allies even though we're already in the Axis. What's worse, they thought they could get away with it. Suddenly it's Croatian fault we stayed loyal to Germany instead of getting invaded by them.

>>513958126 (OP)
He was on a lot of amphetamines

how to actually win ww2:

>invade poland with help of soviet union
>provide soviet union with technology in exchange of their endless resources
>talk japs out of attacking the USA
>put all research points into jets, missile and drone technology
>destroy the USA and have every mutt and anglo and frenchcuck castrated by the mid 1960s

>>513958126 (OP)
Hitler was a brainwashed puppet whose handlers did the thinking - in the case of Barbarossa and his bizarre series of battlefield 'blunders' - it was mostly (((Dr Morell)))

>>513958126 (OP)
Hitler needed resources and thought it was easier to invade the Soviet Union than to defeat the British Empire. This was his biggest mistake. Had he focused on defeating Great Britain in the west ( and with the japanese help in the east) the world would look very different now

>>513958126 (OP)
>Hitler thinking

>>513958652
Based Serbs. We owe them one then.

Meth is a hell of a drug.

>>513959439
all he had to do was clean up properly at dunkirk instead of being smug about it and ask the japs to not go full retard by touching the boats

>>513958126 (OP)
War machines require fuel. Germany has zero. He wanted the Urals. Plus some larp about living space.

>>513958126 (OP)
no other way out of picrel

>>513961562
>The usual Suvorov cope

>>513958306
Methamphetamine

>>513958126 (OP)
>Hitler
>thinking
anon..........

>>513958126 (OP)
He knew it was just a matter of time before Stalin betrayed him, so he thought that it would buy him time to try to run them over first. Almost succeded. If it hadn't been for the rough winter, it would most likely have been a success.

>>513961795
you have to go back Ivan

>>513961877
BERVIDIN. :DDD

>>513958126 (OP)
He was most buttmad from the very beginning at communists. He invited most other "reasonable" countries to join him but most ZOGed instead. He thought he could knock them out then deal with the west but was fucked on oil and other shit.

it was a preemptive strike to counter the Soviets invasion of Europe. they already invaded the Baltics and Finland to an extent
plus who wants to live next to commies

>>513958126 (OP)
It's in the dna of eurocucks whenever they unite no matter the ideology they attack Russia and lose in an embarrassing manner. Mark my words those idiots will try again once russia takes more of ukraine

>>513958126 (OP)
>What the fuck was Hitler thinking here?
meth

>>513958652
It was Italian invasion of Greece that caused Yugoslav coup.

>>513958126 (OP)
"The best defence is a good offence. It worked on France!"

>>513958293
>>513958306
>>513958326
shalom

>>513958451
>He was mostly right since the Russian army was so unprepared.
Stalin shot all his best generals because he feared rise of another Napoleon.

>>513959076
>slavs = white

>>513958126 (OP)
Unironically the outcome of WW2 is Italy's fault.

>>513962601
The French were retards.

>>513963107
and who attacked italy?

>>513958451
Hitler could have weaseled himself out of declaring on the US since their clause of support for Japan was if Japan were attacked, not if they instigated. That would probably not have stopped the US from joining the European theater once they got going though.

>>513960933
A golem cannot think indeed

>>513960322
stalin was waiting for the brits and germans to kill each other

No, Germany was not obligated to assist Japan after Pearl Harbor, just as Japan was not obligated to assist Germany after Barbarossa.
It was a defensive alliance which only became active if one of the members was attacked.

not much, he gave in to the warmongers.

>>513958126 (OP)
Those are the kind of plays you have to make when you are at war against the entire world. Its amazing he got as far as he did

>>513961958
Stalin's intended plan for Germany was one he eventually executed against Japan
He would wait until Germans were exhausted and near defeat from fighting other capitalist powers, then would launch massive surprise attack.
But first Germany had to be weakened, which was not case in 1941.
On contrary, Germany was at peak of its fighting strength and would have been a very dangerous opponent for Russia.

>>513958126 (OP)
>What the fuck was Hitler thinking here?

This will be just like France we will have the whole thing wrapped up in 3 months no need for winter gear
*snorts meth*

>>513958126 (OP)
perhaps it was never about lebensraum but only about preventing the bolsheviks from steamrolling europe. binding the ivan at stalingrad, exhaust the ruskies, waiting for the usa to arrive who wont let the reds turn europe commie. perhaps hitler was playing both sides in a 5d chess maneuvre.

>>513961448
There's no oil in Urals, but before discovery of the Arab oil fields (which actually happened during WWII), biggest oil fields in the world were located in Caucuses, specifically Azerbaijan.
This is what Hitler wanted, and why Stalingrad was such an important battle.

>>513965723
with the east-west divide of germany we see exactly that pattern, 2 superpowers clash in germany & come to a lukewarm compromise which would in all cases have been better than either winning.

>>513958126 (OP)
I have a better what the fuck question. Japs fucked around all over Asia except for taking all of Sakhalin Island. That would have solved your oil shortage and made president Roosevelt left holding his STD infested dick trying to figure out how to convince Americans to join the war. Take the rest of this big island from commies? No! I am going to rape and pillage, China, Indonesia, Korea, Vietnam ext. and kill my genetic cousins minding their own business instead of some mongoloid whitoids right across this border. Loses the whole island after the war.

>>513965906
hitler might have lost but for the russians it was a phyrric victory, they lost too many men & equipment, also the usa seized the opportunity & promptly occupied germany & still does today.

>>513959076
>just do art chud to calm you down
once hitler realized how germany was betrayed in ww1 he gave up on his artistic career & decided to go into politics, you are suggesting we engage in occupational therapy to distract us from doing what is more urgent, politics & ethnonationalism. when we are done with that we can return to the finer cultural endeavors in life.

>>513958126 (OP)
He wasn’t aware of how quickly the USSR had industrialized and assumed it was just another Poland. That and just so used to things going his way that he didnt seriously consider the consequences

>>513966718
he had to do it if he wanted or not, the commies wanted to take over europe, they tried it by revolutionary ie civil war means in germany in 1919 but failed, now another attempts had to be made with the gravitos of ilitary power. marx announced in in his "das kapital", the commies were hyped for conquest.

>>513958126 (OP)
Honestly that plan would worked out well if Americans refused to help us.

>>513967444
>>

>>513958487
>stabbed him in the back
What a retard. They said "if you attack poland we will fight you"
Hitler was like "they won't fight over fucking poland. He was wrong, they were obviously quite happy to pit germany vs the soviets even if london got razed

schizo forum, but a lot of interesting takes
http://www.preearth.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=1174

>>513958126 (OP)
He was a retard that wanted to paint maps with colours, not win a war. So he wasted all of his dwindling fuel reserves capturing forests, swamps and villages in bumfuck nowhere instead of using to go get more fuel.

>>513958652
>He attacked two months later than intended. You can thank Serbs for that.

>>513958126 (OP)
Who the fuck made that map, that is not where Stalingrad is

>>513958126 (OP)
>surely we can beat the country that is 50 times larger than us and has twice our population

>>513958126 (OP)
>What the fuck was Hitler thinking ?

The Russians were building up their armies & preparing to attack Germany. They were also bringing soldiers back west from the Japanese front, since the fighting had stopped there, & were set to attack Germany.

Hitler - And the German generals did a 'Preemptive Strike' - and it worked!
... until Hitler got in the way of the generals, Stopped armies headed to Moscow, diverted Army groups South toward Crimea for oil.
Had they just shot Hitler, Germany would have taken Russia!

- Stalin was getting ready to attack Germany. You think they should just wait for the attack?
UK & Stalin were conspiring against Germany,

The UK engineered that war because German industrial capacity was set to out-preform UK & because Germany was far advanced in Science & Technology. Britain was afraid of the Communists taking more of Europe - and - afraid of Germany's advances in potential weapons (Atom bomb, Jet engines, UFO-type craft, Rockets, etc) as well as their larger & better trained army.
Germany almost won WWI 20 years prior.

>>513958126 (OP)
He was correctly thinking they needed to take Leningrad to get access to the Soviet rail system for further operations, and to take the Caucasian oilfields in the south to deprive the Red Army of its fuel supply, with a just strong enough center force to hold back Soviet counteroffensives

The generals wanted to drive straight to Moscow because they wanted to have a parade in Moscow and they figured that'd be like Paris 1940 and Stalin would just give up, apparently not realizing that Moscow had only been the capital of the USSR for about 20 years at that point, and taking it without doing the other two things first risked a total disaster, basically creating Stalingrad times 3, in 1941 instead of 1942

There was a big argument between the two sides and Hitler finally agreed to the compromise of trying to do all 3 at once because the Soviets would probably collapse anyway, and by the time they had the horrible relalization the collapse was not happening it was too late. They tried to apply the correct strategy in 1942, but they'd suffered too many losses and given the Red Army too much time.

Its easy with hindsight. Lets take a moment to pay respect to all the fallen axis members who atleast tried to make the world a better place. RIP every axis fallen.

>>513969599
>Who the fuck made that map, that is not where Stalingrad is
FIFY

>>513958126 (OP)
https://www.bitchute.com/video/6MEPLNKgwCjB/

>>513970611
Thank you for providing the accurate map.

>>513958126 (OP)
>>513958487
Hitler was based in a lot of ways, but had retarded ideas. Like a lot of NAFOtroons and Zionists today he hated Russians and Slavs - or at least seriously looked down upon them and considered them mongoloid half-breeds - and was obsessed with Bolsheviks, while having surprisingly warm attitude towards the Anglo-American sphere and Anglo-American culture of the day. This is kind of retarded, because Anglo-American pop culture was already heavily Judaized at the point, and completely drenched in consumerism and materialism. Hitler and the Nazis had some surface level criticisms of Jazz (specifically Swing) and Hollywood, but they pitched their criticisms mainly at the Jewish aspects of American po-culture, but not the broader liberal, cosmopolitan, and consumeristic undertones.

Hitler should have not have started a multiple front war. He should have focused on consolidating control over France/the Low Countries/Scandanavia, and left the UK and Russia for down the line. The Soviets were open to a partnership and viewed the National Socialist Germans as natural allies against the Liberal Capitalist West. Hitler should have focused on consolidating control of Western Europe and working with the Soviets to take out the UK. At that point the Americans would be cut of from France, the UK, and their colonies, and Western Europe would be firmly in the hands of the Germans and Russians.

>>513958126 (OP)
He was thinking the Soviet Union is my only source of oil and they're being courted by the Allies I better take it before they shut it off.

Pretty basic.

He was a narcissist with main character syndrome. Trump will end up fucking up the USA similarly.

>>513962630
It’s not just kikes but retard Russians and Americans who love Russia, they cannot fix the cognitive dissonance of Hitler being our White savior Avatar, and how they hate Nazis and sperg out about winning WW2 as something to be proud of, so Hitler must be a jew or evil. And Dugin claims Africans are more honorable and civil than evil Whites and Russians are actually Asian not European.

So race traitors. Most of “conservatives” are kike loving Israel race traitors or pro Russia civic nationalist race traitors or muh we are all equal and only hard work matters Christian race traitors. All disgusting race traitors 99% of entire political spectrum. No wonder we are being genocided.
See:
>>513959374
>>513961250

>>513959428
Literally me. I'm taking risk so retardedly and will give absolutely no thought to the potential failure, Blitzkrieg

>>513958126 (OP)
They needed oil and the resources of the Soviet Union since Europe could barely sustain itself without overseas trade. Hitler was actually right when he blamed his generals for losing the war. He insisted that the scarce resources they had should be used in securing the Caucasus (for oil), since the lack of fuel massively fucked the their army (they had to rely on foot soldiers and horses). But instead, Franz Halder and other niggers like him wasted their chances in 1941 on Moscow (which would have had no impact if captured).

>>513958126 (OP)
funny thing is he just needed to wait a couple decades for the ussr to collapse.
do nothing bros we cant stop winning

>>513971048
And before some retard Russian opens his mouth I don’t support Jewkrain or NATO or US or EU, I think we should stop funding Ukraine so whites stop dying as I believe might makes right and territory was captured like this for millennium.

But I’m also not stupid and I’ve seen my NatSoc friends be imprisoned or forced to flee Russia for decades since Putin was elected, he is not pro white more pro Muslim, Chinese, and Caucus browns, it’s clear.

Back in those times, offensive warfare was way better than defense. You wanted to be on offense for sure. The Germans were going to take down the Russians.
The problem is the Americans funded and supplied the Russians through the arctic corridor allowing them to gain steam and recover instead of being wiped out.
This was a swift assault intended to be decisive, which ground to a halt and tarried too long, and the germans had no winter tires or winter clothes.

One of the biggest problems is the germans didn't yet understand the absolute critical nature of oil and therefore the middle eastern region. According to Ryan Faulk's video, if they had simply used their diplomatic leverage with turkey properly, they could have reached the caucus region and completely cut off Russia's oil supply, leaving them dead in the water. Guns or no guns, without the oil they are nothing. The germans meanwhile never even had a good supply of oil and often had to abandon tanks. If they had secured the Russian's oil supplies first, they would have easily won and then found a negotiated settlement with America. Likely the deal would have involved letting the Germans have their pre-WW1 borders

>>513958326
Finally someone get it

>>513971172
if he cared so much about oil why didn't he defend the Ploiesti oil fields at all costs against amerisharts -see Tidal Wave?.. ,maybe the kraut anon is right and this was 5d chess to sell europe to americans just to avoid total commiefication

>>513958126 (OP)
Hilter was under the impression that since they destroyed Tsarist Russia in the last war, that Russia would be easy to take out as well. He was right to an extent. When his troops could see the spires of the Kremlin, he thought the war was all but over and deviated from the plan. He was not expecting the Russians getting a second wind, on top of the US supplying Stalin.

>>513963542
He actually declared war on the US, making a big spectacle of it

>>513971048
Your retarded. Normies hate Russia. The civnat neocons are constantly simping for Ukraine and Israel and pushing their low IQ faux-nationalist talking points about Russians being Mongoloid subhumans and Israel and Ukraine being defenders of the White race. Russia is not the problem. The US and US controlled neoliberal organizations like NATO and the EU are the single greatest threat to the long term survival and prosperity of Europe and the White race. Russia isn't the one promoting liberalism, cosmopolitanism, free trade, and open borders. That is indisputably the US. The US and EU are at the forefront of neoliberal and globalization, which along with Zionism are the only really threat to Europe. Russia is literally the birthplace of the Indo-European peoples. America has done far more that Russia to undermine Europe and to harm the interests of the White race as a whole. America is the one promoting liberal values, open border, and neoliberalism. Russia may be fake nationalist, but America and the EU is real globohomo.

You sound like an Adam Green fanboy, and Adam Green does great work criticizing Israel and Christianity but otherwise he's basically a secular neocon.

>>513971048
Nevermind, I posted >>513971797
before I saw
>>513971439

>>513971797
modernist architecture has been a disaster for the human race

>>513970836
>The Soviets were open to a partnership and viewed the National Socialist Germans as natural allies against the Liberal Capitalist West.

The Soviets were about to invade Germany. The reason the Germans took so many POWs and destroyed so much Soviet stuff in the first weeks of Barbarossa is because the Soviets had deployed those forces/supplies/airfields up to the border, ie offensively. In spring of 1941, they were issuing German phrasebooks to Soviet soldiers including questions like "Where is the local SA office?" SA offices only existed inside Germany, not Poland.

Stalin figured the British had largely destroyed the Luftwaffe's tactical air arm and half the German army was sitting in France or being spent trying to put out fires the Italians kept setting. It's a lot shorter distance to Berlin from the 1939 border than Moscow, and he had a lot of troops and tanks and aircraft.

>>513958126 (OP)
If it wasn't for lend lease it would have worked.

>>513971637
The Romanian oil was not enough. Even if Romania doubled their oil production, the Axis would still be in deficit. And by 1944 it didn’t matter anymore if an oil field or two got bombed. After Stalingrad the Endsieg started and it was gg. Some argue it was over even by late 1941, because the 1942 campaign was so forced that it was bound to fail

>>513958293
That gay Zogbot was destroying Germany in an multiple front war while do not build up enough anti aircraft defense. If you need elaboration how you should better go to Disney.

>>513971904
What's so bad about it?

>>513971876
Again I’m talking more about modern POL which is overwhelmingly pro trump pro Russia, and people can say whatever they want that I’m wrong, but I was literally on active far right skinhead groups who took ACTION and we all knew what Putin was then and the war didn’t change shit. I will never support that anti white jew state. Like 30% of Israelis speak Russian and are ex Soviet it’s a 5th column of kikery just like the US

>>513958126 (OP)
According to the Nazis themselves, the USSR was preparing to invade Europe just as the Germans were preparing to invade them, and such the game theory is valid in that whoever struck first at the most unexpected time would be most successful. The concrentration of forces along the Axis border and the panic of the USSR aligns with this testimony, but post-war historians just say that Hitler backstabbed the USSR (which doesn't make sense considering they were moral enemies who were "making a deal with the devil" and both logically wished to backstab each other).

You have to remember, from the very beginning the goal of the Germans was to eradicate Bolshevism and thus from 1933 onward any rational actor would've expected the war with Russia.

>>513959439
Alright calm down Turk

>>513959076
I love centurii-chan bros

>>513972267
Sorry forgot to say in EASTERN EUROPE active far right skinhead in the late 2000s to mid 2010s. I love and support Rusich and Russian Imperial movement, just like Misanthropic Division.

Any modern petty nationalist bullshit except WHITE RIGHTS & WHITE RESISTANCE is Judeo-brainwashing.

Imagine a world in which Britain wasn't completely retarded and took the peace deal Germany offered.
>the british empire would still exist, with imperial holdings all over the world. All of India and Africa would be under European control
>Germans would take over Eastern Europe and launch colonies into Russia, producing an advanced and modern civilization in what is today a backward region.
>eugenics would be championed and embraced, the average person today would be significantly more attractive and more intelligent
>white populations skyrocket as Africa becomes a European continent
>Japan takes over China and southeast asia, producing a glorious anime empire of the rising sun

It would be a tremendously better world. We would be leaving the solar system already in that reality.

>>513958126 (OP)
He was thinking, "How can I cause the most casualties for my jewish overlords?"

>>513959439
Germans really are uniquely stupid huh
>invade poland with help of soviet union
it's what happened
>provide soviet union with technology in exchange of their endless resources
Stalin would have NEVER done anything more than non-aggression with Hitler, because Hitler ran on an anti-communist and commuism = jews platform.
>talk japs into...
they were under US embargo and facing reprisal over expansionism at the first opportunity, you could not talk them into shit. Even the americans were catching wind Germans were developing transatlantic bombers. Even then if Germany tried to attack the US it would have gotten far more than it bargained for. The Japanese had one chance to win in the pacific and it was Pearl Harbor
>put research into
Meaningless, Germany had no oil access. The post-war period was entirely focused on oil. Germany's only chance was to either take the north african or the Russian oil/gas to compete with the US industry.

Your main issue is not realizing the US entering the war was not a matter of "if", it was a matter of when, especially with the A bomb. Germany needed ONE thing to win and it was not starting wars, but exporting nationalism as a valid model against communism. They couldn't know it at the time, but they would have had a crushing victory over both democratic and communist countries. Their lack of faith in their own system killed them. A smart Germany would have eaten league of nations sanctions and taken some smaller oil producing region in africa by force. In fact if they waited 15 years, they would have found easier deposits in more independent countries. Again, rushing killed Germany like it killed Napoleon. Imagine how a germany-supported South Africa and Rhodesia could have fared. The US would not have had free reign in the middle east either. The balkans would probably be at least partially united.

>>513958126 (OP)
This was pure retardation no matter how much retards brainwashed by stormfront .jpgs cope

>>513971797
Also Russia does promote open borders you are literally the retard I’m talking about “muh based Russia against globohomo” Putin has said that all Russians from Siberia or Caucuses are as Russian as Slavic Russians and that racism is a grave sin. He imports hundreds of thousands of Muslims and builds mosques in Moscow and St Petersburg. Then he floods Europe with subhumans through Poland and Belarus when we are already being ethnically cleansed from all sides. Grow up dipshit, Putin isn’t your friend.

>>513972267
I get what your saying. Russians target the far-right just like in the West, and they do gay shit like brag about building Mosques and simp for Central Asians and Churkas more than they need to. So I would say you are 100% correct that Rsusia is not supporting any genuine ethnonationalist or pro-White policies.

I don't support Putin or Russia, I just don't think they're one of the primary threats to Europe and America, and I think our politicians use them as scape goats and as a way to fear monger. Russia, China, and Islam are like the three scape goats that are constantly used to distract from Israel and from the fuckery of our own politicians and elites.

>>513958126 (OP)
You should be asking your self what fuck did Hitler do to Ukraine that there are so many nazis there.

>>513972356
>The concrentration of forces along the Axis border and the panic of the USSR aligns with this testimony, but post-war historians just say that Hitler backstabbed the USSR

I love that so much.
>The peace-loving Soviets just wanted to get along, Hitler backstabbed them!
Then why did the Germans take so many POWs and destroy so many Soviet aircraft/tanks/supplies in the first couple weeks?
>well they were all deployed right up at the border
But that's what you do when you're about to invade, where you intend to do your fighting on the other guy's side of the border so you want the shortest possible supply lines and the deepest air coverage over their territory. Defensive deployment has the bulk of your forces far back from the border, out of air attack range and ready to counterattack, and Stalin was clearly doing the opposite of that
>you're an antisemite

>>513972778
They’re also not the birthplace of “Indo-Europeans” as there was no Russia at that time obviously.. just a completely retarded talking point. Plus it was on the land of modern Ukraine actually so even more ironic.

>>513972835
Well I agree with you and see your point but I also believe that the new axis firming is actually US-RUSSIA-ISRAEL, and even if Russia succeeds in making a multi polar would that still means genocide for Europe. I’m against and suspicious of every single modern country and establishment in world, except North Korea & Iran I quite respect. But Russia just has tons of anti white talking points, how they’re not white, they’re uplifting Africa, it’s sickening they are like leftist white traitors who hate their own race , they will turn on us

>>513972161
that picture illustrates the lack of character for modernist buildings, meaning they're not distinct
before modernists started making the world ugly, you would actually be able to tell where you are in the world depending on how the buildings looked and how neighborhoods were constructed, now it's nearly impossible to distinguish since every you go they have skyscrapers and concrete blocks

>>513973202
Russia is just another globohomo country actually. There is a longstanding doctrine of Russia using nationalists as proxies, or tools for their disposal. The CIA has done similar shit.
The world today is basically seen as the globohomo intelligence apparatuses using their subtle manipulations to play nationalist blocs against each other. Then tear them down again when they served their purpose. The nationalists are just seen as disposable tools.

>>513958126 (OP)
A frontal assault was not Hitler's plan. He planned to have 2 armies go around Moscow and encircle it cutting off the USSRs supplies. He was right but he was infected with a bout of dysentery and couldn't stand up to the general staff so instead a traditional method of warfare was implemented.

Hitler and Hus associates had a disproportionate amount if power compared to their collective intellect.

>>513958126 (OP)
He wasn't thinking that was the issue

>>513958126 (OP)
Same thing the imperial Japanese navy thought when they attacked Pearl harbor, 'we can win this'.

>>513958451
>Italy and Romania could have fought better in N. Africa
Italians were doomed, and Romania in africa ? They were better off being used in Stalingrad streets instead of germans.

>>513958126 (OP)
3 day special military operation

>>513972589

>Japan takes over China and southeast asia, producing a glorious anime empire of the rising sun

Ironically, much of the economic success of the Four Asian Tigers (Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong) can be attributed to the industrial infrastructure, land reform laws, and compulsory education system first implemented by the occupying Japanese, which were built on by to make their success

Hitler was unpredictable. It was his key characteristic.
And he was proud of this, and contemptuous of the Prussian officers who always followed the rules and did everything by the book (typically Clausewitz)
Studying Clausewitz was useless for trying to understand Hitler. He didn't follow any rules, he broke them.
This unpredictability was the key to his success in politics and war.
His attack on Russia is a good example. "Everybody knew" it was crazy for Germany to start a war on 2 fronts.... So he did it.
The same happened at the end of the war. In late 1944 "everybody knew" the war was over, and that the Germans would soon make peace like in November 1918.
Instead Hitler launches the biggest offensive in the west since 1940. Huge WTF.

>>513958532
The British were supposed ally Germany against the soviets. Germany was actually winning the war in Atlantic with uboats until advancements in radar allowed the allies to target uboats in the darkness. Then the allies adopted a convoy system that overwhelmed the German defense so the uboats had to be withdrawn.

As for declaring war on the USA. The USA was already placing vessels in the way of the Germans hoping they would target them causing war to break out between the 2 countries.
>>513958652
Flooding in Russia caused the invasion to be delayed not any sort of fighting in the Balkans. That's just a propaganda moral boosting talking point.

>>513972692
>This was pure retardation no matter how much retards brainwashed by stormfront .jpgs cope
It's better to not explain with incompetence what can be explained by malice in these matters
Having said that, it actually could have worked, as testified by the puppet Hitler's repeated interventions whenever Germans threatened to gain a decisive advantage, as happened at Moscow (Directive 33) and Fall Blau (Directive 45) which to this day stand as two of the most epic, obvious and classical 'blunders' in military history
It kind of boggles the mind that there are serous people in denial about the absurd level of sabotage going on in (((Nazi))) top ranks

>>513973573
They were quite smart, I'm pretty sure Hitler ignored his generals

>>513973734
That was a little different, the Japanese had very little expectation of success against the US and the attack on Pearl Harbor was just a gamble to hopefully delay the US' naval forces as they take Indonesia and the Philippines for fuel to continue their war against China. Japan was not like Germany who was forced by fate to go to war in 1941, they could've abandoned the war in China and accepted the loss, but instead doubled down on a war that they knew was suicidal and not in their favor.

>>513958126 (OP)
I will try to astral annotate your question to ask to Mr Hitler in the interview.

>>513958126 (OP)
>be Hitler
>try to get a road to link the rest of Germany with Danzig
>Poland says eat shit
>try to get the Poles to stop persecuting a couple million Germans still living on the territory that used to belong to Germany before Versailles
>Poland says eat shit
>appeal to Britain and France
>they guarantee Poland's sovereignty and pledge to declare war if anyone attacks them
>call it a bluff and invade Poland
>Britain and France declare war
>Soviets invade Poland 2 weeks later
>Britain and France say nothing

>Britain tries to influence Denmark
>have to invade Denmark now
>Britain tries to invade Norway
>Beat them to the punch
>France now the biggest continental threat
>knock them out of the war in just a couple of months
>Britain refuses to negotiate a peace deal
>Murder several thousand French sailors in North Africa for good measure
>Yugoslavia tries to join the Axis
>Britain coups their government
>have to invade Yugoslavia now to prevent a southern front

>Soviets try to invade Finland
>a tiny amount of Finns annihilate the Soviets, but eventually must agree to give up some land due to sheer numbers
>Soviets give Romania an ultimatum to give them Bessarabia, Romania gives it up begrudgingly
>Soviets annex the Baltic states, the west says nothing
>Soviets begin the largest buildup in military history on their new borders with Germany, place planes in forward airfields, have units in offensive posture
>German generals advise that within the next year the Soviets will invade them
>Hitler will have a 2 front war no matter what
>After annihilating every country they've gone up against and seeing the Soviets struggle with Finland, he deduces this is the best chance he's going to ever get to potentially avoid the protracted 2 front nightmare scenario
>throws everything he has into Barbarossa
>falls just short of the goal

That's what he was thinking and why he did what he did.

>>513973984
>Hitler was unpredictable. It was his key characteristic.

it would have been so extremely easy to take usa as an ally, all western world as an ally, is hitler had just made 1 serious diplomatic visit, and told them he was fighting against communism. that surely they didnt want their belongings taken away by collectivistic communists.
but no.
the sun king has no need for allies.

the sun king chose not to even give blueprints to the japanese and italians of german tanks and antitank cannons and submarines, and planes etc. so japanese got massacred when they went against soviets because japanese didnt have tanks, nothing mechanized.

sun king was sunny and didnt need anyone. a very trump person.

>>513974367
Provided Jennifer Psaki comes to fix it.

>>513958126 (OP)
Ride or die nigga

>>513974391
>it would have been so extremely easy to take usa as an ally, all western world as an ally, is hitler had just made 1 serious diplomatic visit
you are a phenomenal idiot, and dont have a drop of knowledge of what you're talking about

>>513958126 (OP)


hitler could have won in the east but that would have required a total revision of policies that meant actually liberating the post soviet countries, not having partisans all over the place, helping suppy lines etc, forgetting the holocaust which ate up tremendous resources telling rommel to stop after tobruk as was initially the plan, and actually putting all the german panzer forces doing absolutely fucking nothing in norway and serbia, greece etc to use in the east

people forget just how much faith hitler put into his allies therefore not actually using his own elite forces instead of allies, which of course was his downfall around stalingrad

as for the US, they would never get the support to go to war against germany, and britain would over time be forced to a stalemate, since even after the 1942 fall of tobruk churchill almost became a victim of his own war frenzy so it was a matter of time, germany could have bided its time, especially if they dont attack the soviets and go all in on african oil to iraq, iran which would have been a more kino setting and one that would have been awesome to read about in history books instead of fucking planes in russia

Churchill is perhaps the biggest criminal guilt of white genocide in history.
>Shat on Mussolini over a rogue land controlled by a savage nigger overlord who attacked Italians
>Forced Italy into German's side when Mussolini despised Hitler
>Forced Britain & its lapdog France into a World War that killed almost 100 million whites
>Cucked during Yalta, "daddy Stalin why are you sitting so close to Roosevelt ?"
>Lost ALL COLONIES over the planet, turned Britain into a tiny little island with no navy and no army to be to be reckoned with it
>South Africa collapsed, Canada became for all that matters a little America
>Britain is now being colonized by pajeets and sandniggers, brit women births are 50% brown offspring

But you got your Malvinas right Crowley fuck boy !

>>513974560
>as for the US, they would never get the support to go to war against germany,
That's why their puppet helped them along by declaring on them just because of Japan, which cukced Germany massively by not even reciprocally declaring on the USSR
It was all far faker and gayer than any of you realize

>>513974728
Imagine believing a comped patsy like Churchill had an actual say in any of that, KEK

>>513958126 (OP)
He thought the USA would ally with him.

>>513974267
Japan needed the resources of China to fight a prolonged war against the united states. History is lying to you. The greater Asian co prosperity sphere was Japan's administration of Asia to boot out western colonial imperialism in china and Indonesia. America had military bases in the Philippines threatening the Japanese empire. France, netherlands and the British empire had imperial ambitions in Asia.

History is lying to you. America(west) was aggressor who cut off oil supplies to Japan when western imperialism in Asia was threatened after Japan's invasion of China and the south pacific. Japan was actually an ally of America in WW1. When Japan invaded Manchuria powerbrokers in Washington and wall street got spooked. Pearl Harbor was initiated so Japan could dismantle the American navy so they would have freedom to remove western imperialism from Asia. At the time of pearl harbor Japan had more carriers than America did. They did not expect the American people to wage war against Japan after Pearl Harbor as the USA was isolationist at the time.

That's the thinking(at the time) which seems odd today considering we know America created the largest navy in the world after pearl harbor.

>>513974369
He also considered Britain to be defeated already, but they were only holding out for the Soviets to eventually end the war. He figured if he could defeat the Soviets then the British would have to sue for peace.
Then the Japanese had to (WITH NO WARNING TO THE GERMANS) attack Pearl Harbor. German soldiers were freezing outside of Moscow when this happened.
Fucking Japs don't get enough hate, should have allied with the Nationalist Chinese.

>>513958126 (OP)
Have you ever considered reading a book? You would know the answer if you weren't so ignorant.

>>513974560
>as for the US, they would never get the support to go to war against germany
Eden told Maysky in summer '41 that the US support for their cause is already secured, so I'm not sure about that.

>>513975046
>his handlers made him think the US would ally with him
fixed
They also told him there was a 'peace party' in the UK, lmao

>>513973984
>His attack on Russia is a good example. "Everybody knew" it was crazy for Germany to start a war on 2 fronts.... So he did it.
Russia was about to invade, see
>>513972954
and "Icebreaker" by Suvorov
>In late 1944 "everybody knew" the war was over, and that the Germans would soon make peace like in November 1918.
The Germans had been making official and unofficial peace offers since 1939, and were told the only acceptable terms were unconditional surrender and the end of Germany as a state

>>513975159
His handlers?

>>513975229
>and "Icebreaker" by Suvorov
Fake and gay glownigger slop for coping hitlertards

Something something slavs are subhuman something something lebensraum

>>513974267
Japan had beaten China in 1890s and Russia a few years later -- both much larger countries -- so it absolutely did believe it could beat the United States.
Presumably there would a big "Tsushima" style battle, followed by Japanese occupation of all major Pacific islands.
By the time the Americans had rebuilt their fleet and were ready for a rematch, Japan would be invincible.

>>513975093
>America(west) was aggressor who cut off oil supplies to Japan when western imperialism in Asia was threatened after Japan's invasion of China and the south pacific.
This is what I was referring to with my fuel comment, Japan was essentially given a choice by the US: Either give up the war in China and accept American/British hegemoney or go to war against us, and they gambled on the second. This is what I mean by that Japan was not forced like Germany, Germany was given a choice between war and war, Japan was given a choice between humiliating peace and war.

>At the time of pearl harbor Japan had more carriers than America did. They did not expect the American people to wage war against Japan after Pearl Harbor as the USA was isolationist at the time.
IIRC the Japanese generals did expect the USA to go to war after Pearl Harbor and expected a long and bloody war. They did know America had superior industrial capacity than Japan, but IIRC they did underestimate just how superior our industry was. Also they didn't expect that we would take our carriers out on a field exercise during Pearl Harbor, which significantly limited the impact of that first strike.

>>513975259
Yes, his handlers. Hitler had quite a few, as can be expected from the puppet masters, given the stakes
In this case his 'geopolitical mentor' Karl Haushofer and his jewish son Albrecht who sent Hess to Britain were both instrumental

>>513958451
Hitler also believed a Japanese invasion of the USSR from the east was possible. So did the Soviets. They had dozens of infantry divisions in the east that were brought into the battle of Stalingrad.

>>513958126 (OP)

The Caspian Oil fields. There were few sources in the World then. He was paying premiums he moved at Obviously. Why did you make a stupid topic? He didn't want to be a bitch and put over a barrel and screwed for it. Like he was getting out of debt. However it tempted history. Losing was so much worse, it was a gamble. Worse was the lack of support for his column that moved in, the overconfidence of it. On defeat it forced retreat and defense.

He had a NAP and broke it. It was for the oil Russia controlled.

>>513967532
He could be talking about Trump today.

>>513974267
thats not entirely accurate, the militarists had every intention of success after their stunning defeat of the entire russian navy at The Battle of Tsushima. There was the impression among the high ranking admirals that the western colonialist forces could be easily defeated and pushed out of the pacific.

>>513975492
Richard Sorge made sure the Soviets were well aware of the lack of Japanese threat
Sorge who was very obviously a commie spy yet became the leading figure in the German embassy in Tokyo. Another example of the infiltration of the NSDAP by its declared enemies, which was so pervasive and extensive it's more accurate to speak of the the Nazis as a joint Wall Street jews/judeo-bolshevik puppet regime

>>513958126 (OP)
>God I hate commies so fucking much

>>513958126 (OP)
He underestimated Russians , just like the Jew globalist today

>>513958126 (OP)
He was thinking:
Stalin couldn't possibly have 20,000 tanks stockpiled already for his next great invasion of Europe.

>>513975713
Except his armies (HGS) did reach the Caucasus and were well on their way top the Baku oil fields when the puppet Hitler decided to split it up (classic mistake nr. 1) and send its best forces hundreds of kilometers east (classic mistake nr. 2) to a massively fortified stronghold (classic mistake nr. 3) to the utter horror of his competent generals, and the continuing confusion of military historians to this day

>>513959439
Halten Sie! You are making me mad that this plan DID NOT happen. I read a blog a few days ago titled “what is Germany won WWI”. I commented, “Europe would not be the nightmare is it today”. Everybody agreed

>>513958126 (OP)
HE WAS THINKING GOMMIES RRRRRAUS!

RIGHT AFTER THE WAR AMERICA STARTED THINKING THE SAME EXACT THING

>>513975482
WW2 was about control of oil. Oil is the resource that shaped the world we are living in today. It powers economies. The reason America won WW2 and the cold war was it outmaneuvered every other country to hold a monopoly on it. Russia thinks it's hot shit today because it can pump its own oil. It can supply China with oil and gas. Russia thinks it can coerce Saudi Arabia using China and Iran thus wrestling America's control of oil and becoming the dominate power in the world.

That's why Russia invaded Ukraine. So they can secure the "belt and road" to Europe and protect their bases in Crimea(which they stole). Russia, China and Iran are starting to become aggressive again.

>>513958126 (OP)
The Fuhrer believed he was fighting a Holy War against communism.

Russia was under the stranglehold of Jewish Marxist propagandists and perhaps he succeeded in his Holy War at Stalingrad. The Lord God works in mysterious ways. Everything is accounted for.

>>513958126 (OP)
>blockaded by the british navy, cutoff from any and all resources outside of europe
>air force in a death spiral after two consecutive decisive defeats at the hand of the RAF
>not enough resources to fuel your war machine, resources that you do have are vulnerable to enemy attack and under threat of being cut off
>not enough fuel to keep your army operating at full pace for more than a year, only oil source is Romania and under direct threat from british bombing
>no way to knock britain out of the war or meaningfully threaten it as U-boat campaign steadily fails
>faced with the reality of slowly losing a war of attrition against the british empire, besieged in fortress europe until you're starved into submission like in WW1
They needed to do something or they'd just slowly lose the war.
Japan was looking to enter the war but was concerned with the threat posed by the Soviet Union on their Manchurian border, and Germany regarded Japan as their best hope for countering the Royal Navy and potentially forcing the british to terms by threatening India and Australia, so they were strongly incentivized to make war on the Soviets to open up the possibility of Japan entering the war.
The USSR also held all of the resources Germany needed to become self-sufficient, so by defeating them and claiming those resources, they would be able to endure a british blockade indefinitely and win the war by attrition.

In historical hindsight obviously opening a second front and getting themselves Napoleon'd was a terrible idea but history often fails to articulate just how desperate Germany's position in 41' really was.

>>513976247
>WW2 was about control of oil.
This is about right, ultimately oil was the key resource for both fronts, the threat of the USSR taking the Romanian oil fields, the American oil embargo against Japan, the oil fields in the Caucasus, etc.

>>513974391
>it would have been so extremely easy to take usa as an ally,
documents revealed FDR tried to get into the war the entire time

>>513972657
>Stalin would have NEVER done anything more than non-aggression with Hitler, because Hitler ran on an anti-communist and commuism = jews platform
They did though, the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact had a trade agreement in it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_Commercial_Agreement_(1940)

>>513975491
The British were supposed to ally Germany against the soviets. This diplomacy was in the works long before war in Europe started. The British people did not want war with Germany. The ruling classes did. The parliament rather. The king wanted peace with Germany yet was overruled.

And as you know Churchill was appointed by parliament to wage war against Germany on their behalf. Basically "democracy" waged war against Germany.

>>513976472
>Basically "democracy" waged war against Germany.
You can just say the Kikes here, circumcised-anon.

>>513976472
>The British were supposed to ally Germany against the soviets.
This was never in the cards
>. The ruling classes did.
Exactly. There never was a 'peace party vs war party', it was all staged to goad their puppet Hitler into war, to destroy Europe and divide the spoils between wall street jews and judeo-bolsheviks
Pic related, highly recommended

>>513973942
>built on by to make
In fucking English, please?

After the conquest of France and the Low countrys, Hitler thought the war would be over. But Britain refused to make peace with Germany. In Hitlers mind, this meant that Britain was placing their hopes on the Soviets eventually turning on Germany, and breaking the non-aggression pact.
And so, in July of 1940, Hitler asked the OKH to conduct a study of an Eastern campaign against the Soviet Union. He specifically told them that this campaign would have to be finished quickly, otherwise it would place Germany in a prolonged 2 front war.
The OKH completed an initial study based on their best intelligence, and concluded that a quick summer campaign against the Soviets was feasible. Hitler now believed there was a possibility of landing a knockout blow against the USSR in 1941: This would remove an existential threat to Germany, while also eliminating Britains hope for victory.
In the fall and winter of 1940, the Heer underwent an expansion to 180 divisions (plus 20 for the Ersatzheer). This was the size the OKH believed was necessary to conquer the Soviet Union. But they did not understand that the Red Army was undergoing its own expansion at this same time.
By the time war broke out in June of 1941, the Heer had 209 divisions, while the Red Army had 303 divisions. The Germans had not only underestimated the size of the Red Army, but also the mobilisation potential of the Soviet Union.

>>513975293
>New Morocco has opinions
If you know absolutely anything about Barbarossa, you can't help but notice the Soviets were arrayed offensively along the German-Soviet border. The reason so much of the Red Air force was destroyed in the first week of the war was that the airfields were set up so they could fly over Poland and Germany.
Same with tanks and infantry and supplies, everything had been arranged for the strike at Berlin. A defensive deployment has the bulk of your forces and materiel far back, out of range of enemy ground attack aircraft, so when the enemy's frontline units arrive, having suffered attrition and with fuel and food and munitions having to be trucked hundreds of kilometers into your territory, your main force is waiting to smash them. This is the opposite of what the Soviets had done.

>>513975725

Yes his column made huge mistakes on its approaches, until failing terribly at Stalingrad where it spiralled into complete defeat.

It was the oil, any motive. Germany had almost no sources. Libya they didn't hold long. The Mid East had been discovered/invented yet for the most part. Where else had a minium then? Romania or Hungray? Not enough for his formations. He would've been at Russian prices, they distrusted. Enough yo break the NAP. The Med a source of piracy and opposing Navies.

Fucked up as they did formerly and Napoleon before. Tempted history on gamble and a bad general.

Russia would've wedged. Central command wasn't broken. They took capitals and established. Who knows Except any gamble was a big mistake causing eventual defeat. After that point it completely lacked support to continue any offensive because it was fighting on all fronts.

autism

>>513976452
that's like a handshake on top of a truce

>>513958126 (OP)

correct or not, the Abwehr had intel that the Soviets were planning to attack Germany in 1942 at the earliest. Hitler knew he wasnt ready, but gambled that Germany was in a better position to punch Russia before the Soviets were better armed in 1942.

Source: Herbert Döhring -- Hitlers house manager of the Berghof and personal witness to the planning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNa9X92CmvM

>>513977158
Yes, they had buildup in the West, in response to Germany doing the same. This happens all the time
> Soviets were arrayed offensively along the German-Soviet border
Your only source is a literal GLOWNIGGER, who refused to publish his own sources
The Red Army had trouble with tiny Finland and was in no position to threaten Germany, you retard

>>513977660
>the Abwehr
Lmao, you mean the most compromised arm of a regime already most thoroughly infiltrated and captured by its declared enemies?

>>513974092
>US was trying to get Germany to slip up and give them an excuse to declare war
>So that's why it wasn't retarded to outright declare war on the US
Your brain on copium. Germany and Japan lost because of absolutely retarded strategic decisions. If Germany had focused on the West and honored molotov-ribbentop until they ended their current war, and Japan had not attacked the US like unbelievably stupid retards, the war would have likely ended completely differently.

>>513976911
>In Hitlers mind, this meant that Britain was placing their hopes on the Soviets eventually turning on Germany, and breaking the non-aggression pact
That's what Britain hoped for, indeed. They warned the USSR about the plans, the USSR was aware of existence of Barbarossa since December '40, Dekanozov reported 180+ divisions gathering on the front in June '41, Eden and Churchill warned the USSR of the incoming attack and offered all the needed assistance, but the Soviet (Jewish) ambassador has still written it off as yet another British d&c tactic, demanding recognition of the Baltic states in return for "betterment of relations with Britain."

we now know more about FDRs perspective, in private he said that he lies to the american people
and gave his best to get them into the war

>>513976719
Hitler may have been their puppet in their eyes but to the German people he was sovereign. The Germans actually thought they could win using Blitzkrieg warfare preventing the triple alliance of WW1. This thinking goes back to the days of Fredrick the great and Prussia who of course were the general staff of the Germany army.

Germany was winning wars until WW1. After the fall of the Roman empire they sort of carved up their place as the hegemon of Europe. Of course the old powers did not like this. I think the USA(freemasons) come from that old blood that once ruled Europe from the Roman empire. The form of government and institutions are all similar.

>>513978111
This
>>513975158

>>513978106
did you that british writer horace vachell invented the holocaust during WWI?
they tried to get the chinese into the war with it

the 6million jew thing was anti tsarist ukrainian propaganda fused with it later
even after 10 years on /pol/ I can't pinpoint where the gaschamber thing comes from so far my best guess
is british intelligence and the polish exile government in london given david irving quoting a memo by british intelligence

>>513978362
are you following brian berletic?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fwXBgu6Z5I

>>513977972
It's the truth as America was neutral so Roosevelt was trying to figure out means to drag America into war. Hitler thought America would attack Japan first because of Pearl Harbor but as you know America invaded Europe first then alongside China and the USSR finished off Japan. This prevented a 2 front war for all the allied countries.

The peace treaty with Russia was just a stall tactic to buy Hitler time. It was non binding. The USSR, Wall street(America) and Maos communist China were always in bed together. Had Hitler invaded Britain the USSR would've stabbed Germany in the back. All Hitler did was stab Russia in the back first by not falling for the trap invading Britain. Like i've been saying Britain and Germany were supposed to ally each other against the soviets. Not fight each other.

>>513958126 (OP)
A lot of the time his decisions had to be made with the best intentions but it ended up causing more harm than good

>>513965587
>Stalin's intended plan for Germany was one he eventually executed against Japan
>He would wait until Germans were exhausted and near defeat from fighting other capitalist powers, then would launch massive surprise attack.
>But first Germany had to be weakened, which was not case in 1941.
Precisely.
Stalin fully intended to betray Hitler, but he knew that the Red Army was not ready to confront the Wehrmacht in 1941. The Soviets were industrialising at breakneck pace and modernising the Red Army, but even so, these preparations would not complete until 1943. That was the opinion of Zhukov in his memoirs.

>>513975833
>very obviously a commie spy
Lmao to who? NEETs with the advantage of hindsight?
>>513977820
>Your only source is a literal GLOWNIGGER
The only people who countersignal his work are literally israelis.

>>513978521
Don't know who that is, I was just reading through the pre-Barbarossa Soviet reports when it comes to WW2.
When it comes to the current war, the wildest yet grounded opinion I hear is that the American scenario for Ukraine has changed from Desert Storm-like subjugation of the enemy approach to South Vietnam-style abandonment and blame shifting, with the elected US president swap being used as an excuse.

>>513978176
> to the German people he was sovereign
Yes. They were tragically misled by a judas goat, although Hitler himself may not even have been aware of it
Germans were the real victims of WW2
>The Germans actually thought they could win using Blitzkrieg warfare preventing the triple alliance of WW
It was the Brits paying a deft game of good cop bad cop. Their puppet actually believed they would do nothing in the West while Germany invaded the USSR, so the Blitz was stopped the VERY NIGHT of Hess' mission
And for the longest time, Britain really didn't do much in the West, to the frustration of Stalin. Of course it turned out they were just giving their puppet enough rope to hang himself
>Germany was winning wars until WW1.
Germany, well the Second Empire, was a Rothschild creation from the start, designed to set Europeans against each other to the benefit of their jewish masters

>>513977948
>Lmao, you mean the most compromised arm of a regime already most thoroughly infiltrated and captured by its declared enemies?

Thats a different conversation. The question was Why Hitler chose to attack, and --right or wrong-- Hitler believed Russia was going to attack Germany; so, Hitler chose to invade Russia first.

The merits to the truth to the Abwehr's claim is a different matter.

>>513978711
hitler when he started a german federal state had been seized by jewish communist in a moscow backed illegal coup,
they had declared secession and a soviet republic on german soil
all a year after the red terror slaughtered czar and his family

>>513958126 (OP)
Literally the move that prevented Europe from becoming part of the USSR, even if they lost.

>>513977443
The Soviet Union received the incomplete Admiral Hipper-class naval cruiser Lützow, the plans to the battleship Bismarck, information on German naval testing, "complete machinery for a large destroyer", heavy naval guns, other naval gear, and samples of 30 of Germany's latest warplanes, including the Bf 109 and 110 fighters and Ju 88 and Do 215 bombers.[2]:668–669[3]:105[4]:46 The Soviet Union also received oil and electric equipment, locomotives, turbines, generators, diesel engines, ships, machine-tools, and samples of Germany artillery, tanks, explosives, chemical-warfare equipment, and other items.[2]:668–669

>>513958451
>Hitler wanted to take down Russia quickly like France
so he was retarded?
>He was mostly right since the Russian army was so unprepared.
biggest cope of all time. as soon as the element of surprise stopped working he got his shit pushed in until he had to eat the barrel of a gun even funnier given that at every single opportunity he did the opposite of what his generals suggested. like diverting army group center to help take kiev. otherwise he might have had a real shot as moscow. this midwitted greedy druggie should have been the real leader's PR guy and that's about it. no one can defend Hitler's pathetic constant and irredeemable fuck ups on the eastern front.

>>513978857
>very obviously a commie spy
>Lmao to who? NEETs with the advantage of hindsight?
No, to anyone with two brain cells dumbass
>Half-Russian
>Great-nephew (he said Grandson) of Marx' and Engels' friend and associate Friedrich Adolf Sorge
>Worked as a Communist agitator and recruiter in Kiel, 1918 (Prange, pp11)
>Becomes Communist after WW1
>Member of the KDP, 1919
>Worked as assistant to (half-jewish and Communist) Professor of Sociology Kurt Gerlach
>Married his Professor's jewish wife in 1921
>Recruited by Soviet intelligence in the early 1920s
>Liases between Berlin and Frankfurt KPD, meets prominent jewish-German Communists like Hede Massing
>Becomes bodyguard to visiting Comintern members from the Soviet Union in 1924 (i.a. Otto Kuusinen and Solomon Lozovsky)
>'Impressed with Sorge', they invite him to join the Comintern in Russia (Prange, pp14)
>Moves to Moscow in 1925, joins the 'most secret' department of the Comintern (ILD)
>Becomes a member of the Soviet Communist Party and Soviet citizen
>Turns from propaganda (Comintern) work to intelligence. Keeps in contact with Kuusinen. Dark years (1925-1929) possibly in Germany (Prange pp16)
>1929 joins Red Army military intelligence Department
>1929 Instructed to move to Germany and join NSDAP
>1933 sent to Berlin as journalist
>May 1933 allowed to enter Nazi Germany under his own name despite extensive police dossiers on his Communist activity. "should have been on the watch lists" (Prange, pp36)
>Gains Nazi trust by not drinking at Beer Hall gatherings (kek)
>Joins NSDAP despite obvious Communist past
>"His abstinence from drinking did not make his Nazi companions suspicious. It was an example of his devotion to and absorption in his mission, as he had been a heavy drinker."
>Calls on Journal for Geopolitik, meets Haushofer, gets personal letters of introduction from him. (Haushofer and Hess wrote "Japan and Espionage")
HITLER AND THE NSDAP: LETS MAKE THIS FAGGOT BOSS OF OUR MOST IMPORTANT EMBASSY

>>513966393
theres also the route to consider that it is very typical to do time as a mole and hitler rising with rothschild money isnt debatable. What is debatable is if Hitler was an agent plungering Europe for the same money trust forces or if he was genuinely trying to free mankind from the yolk. Be genuine, it is not solid the latter is gospel

>>513979158
Most retarded take ever quite possibly. How would have the USSR conquered all of Europe without Hitler squandering his armies first? If Hitler wasn't a class A retard, he would have fortified his position after Poland and likely kept all of his gains.

>>513978559
Of course the peace treaty was nonbinding. USSR wasn't planning on backstabbing though. They had undergone extensive purges and were still training up new officers to have a functional military, which would have taken several years. Afterwards, they almost certainly would have prioritized invasions of Turkey, Persia, and Afghanistan.

>Like Ive been saying Britain and Germany were supposed to ally each other against the Soviets. Not fight each other
That might be the dumbest thing you've said in this thread, too. That ship was sailed irrevocably after the occupation of Czechia.
>Inb4 muh central banks, muh jewish influence, blah blah blah
No. Diplomacy between Germany and Britain/France was destroyed after they made a concession in exchange for a promise of no more expansionism, only for Germany to immediately break that promise. At that point Germany was locked into a reputation of an untrustworthy, imperialistic antagonist. WWII starting after Germany invaded a country France and Britain promised to protect was the predictable outcome of Hitler's decisions.

>>513958126 (OP)
Meth... not even once...

>>513975833
Many traitors in Germany especially when they started to lose the war. It was easy to infiltrate Germany when they had so many different nationalities against them. Japan wasn't so easy to infiltrate because of their Asian background. However Japan was code broken by the British who shared this information with America. That's how Japan lost the battle of Midway. The Americans knew the Japanese plan from the beginning so all the forces America could muster was sent to Midway while the feint attack was left alone splitting Japan's forces. This is when Japan started to lose the war.

>>513958652
optimal was still june. April coup delayed barbarossa max 2 weeks.

>>513979419
>LETS MAKE THIS FAGGOT BOSS OF OUR MOST IMPORTANT EMBASSY
That never happened, he was a journalist who never formally held a government position or title. Nice pilpul though. I can see why you're part of the Glantz/Gorodetsky shul of Suvorov haters :^)

>>513979035
Fair enough. I don't think such assessments played much of a role with Hitler, her was always going to attack the USSR in 1941 and he made up reasons why all the time
They may have gained them support from actual high ranking nazis though

>>513958451
The germans were already in a state of quasi war with the USA
Japan attacking pearl harbor only made it formal

>>513979745
Selling weapons vs sending soldiers to amphibiously invade and open up 2 more fronts are completely and entirely different.

>>513979545
USSR seized lithuania against the agreement and demanded more of romania from hitler

>>513958126 (OP)
Lost him the war. If he would've settled for Europe and made peace with the Soviets Europe would a single country right now, and the combined gayness of Germany, Sweden, the UK, and the rest of the faggot-bunch would've created a utopia of bottoms, happily pounded by big soviet cock.

>>513979545
You're wrong on all counts. Stalin had an invasion force prepared to attack Europe if Germany invaded Britain. Britain and Germany were supposed to be allies. That is why Germany invented revenge weapons against Britain because they backstabbed Germany ultimately leading to their defeat. Germany was supposed to be given a free hand in Europe in exchange Britain would retain it's empire.

Britain lost its empire after WW2 because the jews tricked Britain into fighting Germany. Churchill was a jew btw which is why he refused peace with germany at all costs.

>>513980265
you broke a blockade in both wars

>>513977820
>Yes, they had buildup in the West, in response to Germany doing the same. This happens all the time
No, you retarded Turk. The Soviets had built up their forces right on the border, which since the dawn of military history is only what you do when you intend to invade your neigbhor, and specifically very soon, because every day your forces are massed on a border increases the risk of your neighbor striking first and destroying your armies.
That's what Stalin had done. If he was responding to a growing German threat, the Red Army would've had screening units along the border, whose main function is to delay and send the alarm that an invasion is happening, with the main force safely in the rear ready to deliver a counterattack to the invading units, once they'd suffered attrition and had nice long supply lines to interdict. This is how everyone has fought since the invention of warfare. Instead every single asset, from infantry to tanks to aircraft to supplies, were arranged for imminent combat within Poland and then Germany.
There is literally no other explanation other than "well maybe at that precise moment the most cold-blooded calculating sociopath in modern history just went completely insane about this one particular thing and decided to risk almost his entire existing armed forces for absolutely no possible benefit whatsoever"

>>513958126 (OP)
You nipps should have attacked Siberia in 1941 instead of dragging America in to the war you fucking faggots!

>>513977158
>If you know absolutely anything about Barbarossa, you can't help but notice the Soviets were arrayed offensively along the German-Soviet border.
Fascinating. Is that why there were no major engagements b/w Germans and Soviets in Soviet-occupied Poland? You know, the actual German-Soviet border?

>>513979575
>Many traitors in Germany especially when they started to lose the war
NSDAP was literally riddled with traitors, because it was a judeo-masonic project from the start
Most prominently the Abwehr (Canaris, Oster) and the Luftwaffe (Milch, Wilberg) were completely compromised, but Hitler's inner circle was also full of traitors, handlers and other glowniggers like Dr. Thoedore Morell and Martin Bormann
>>513979667
>That never happened
It did, he quickly became the ambassador's right hand man and the Nazi top was well aware of it. Goebbels personally attended his farewell dinner in Berlin ffs

>>513958126 (OP)
Shitler wasn't thinking anon because he is stupid.

>>513980376
>Your only source is a literal GLOWNIGGER, who refused to publish his own sources

>>513979545
>Diplomacy between Germany and Britain/France was destroyed after they made a concession in exchange for a promise of no more expansionism, only for Germany to immediately break that promise.
>le hollywood history
Upon the occupation of the Sudetenland, Slovakia immediately declared independence, then Poland invaded Czechoslovakia and the Slovaks requested German protection

>>513980489
I mean, they let Hitler out of prison for high treason (beer hall putsch) after 9 months. Of course it was a fucking psyop.

Barbarossa was his only mistake.

>>513980339
>Stalin had an invasion force prepared to attack Europe
Which must be why they had nothing but border defense that was completely unprepared when Germany attacked, huh.

>Britain and Germany were supposed to be allies
>They backstabbed Germany
What a clown.

>>513980489
>the ambassador's right hand man
So he was never a government official, got it. Weird how not even the Japs he courted realized he was an obvious spy. Also being a former communist in 1930s Europe isn't very compelling considering that former communists were the majority in several SA brigades and parties like the PNF were founded by disillusioned communists.

>>513980368
>Smuggling is the same as being at war
>>513980282
Cool. That really sucks. Doesn't change the fact that starting a war with a powerful neutral country when you are already at war is retarded.

>>513980597
Exactly
But Hitlertards will tell you a penniless corporal with dubious ancestry and zero education can become the face of nationalist reaction and resistance to Versailles within a year, on pure charisma and eloquence
Their belief in jewish fairytales is actually endearing

>>513980892
breaking a blockade yes that is an act of war, dispense with the fiction that the US was ever neutral in either world war

>>513958126 (OP)
Had to strike first before the soviets did.
He was between rock and a hard place. The soviets were going to invade him like a week after he invaded them.

>>513958126 (OP)
he was expecting japan to attack from the other side

>>513980597
You don't understand Germans. They only sent him to jail because Germany was still under occupation by the allies with military forces. They had to formally jail Hitler even though they really didn't want to.
>>513980699
Look up operation Barbarossa. The amount of material destroyed was astronomical. That was not a defensive force but an offensive one.

Yes Germany and the British King were in negotiations long before war broke out in Europe. Even Chamberlain was an ally of Germany who when was prime minister never dropped a single bomb on Germany. You're purposely being obtuse. The British parliament is the force who was against Germany. And they did not represent the British people at all. They represent financial interests.

>>513980874
>He had to be a government official rather than a fake journalist for a jewish newspaper (FAZ) becoming the most powerful person at the most important embassy for him to be vetted and detected as an obvious spy
Ok. Stay retarded

>>513980594
>Breaking a promise won't destroy the trust of the country you broke the promise with if another country asked you to break the promise first

>>513972657
>Stalin would have NEVER done anything more than non-aggression with Hitler, because Hitler ran on an anti-communist and commuism = jews platform.
Who cares about the ideology in the trying times? The NWO was being built, every single party operated under strategic terms. The problem was the Reich wasn't as centralized as it's usually believed. There were too many different interests involved and multiple important figures had completely opposite views on most of everything.
The diplomatic branch of the Reich, the one that interacted with the Soviets and brokered a deal with them, believed that further cooperation and an alliance are possible. Hitler, thinking that the hardest fights are behind, has reverted to ideology.

Soviets were heavily committed to the pact, because their interests revolved around having an ally in Europe. Ever since 1928 they were paranoid about the "imperialist" coalition ganging up on them and a repeat of the Great war breaking out. That's why they started heavily militarizing in preparations and were afraid to be left alone. By signing the pact that would divide the land by spheres of influence, by having Ribbentrop promise the imperial Russian land being returned to the Soviets, they were relieved enough to drop the anti-fascist propaganda (for about a year and a half), dropped the anti-German coalition talks and started eagerly anticipating. The Poland deal went smoothly, so they proceeded to Finland, only to fail miserably and have France and Britain threaten to involve themselves. This, amidst the Phoney war, led to further paranoia about the war on the western front being fake and the pact with Germany being a trap. But once France was done with the Soviets proceeded to occupy the Baltics.
Ribbentrop wanted to invite the USSR as the fourth member of the Tripartite Pact. Hitler wanted to see the Soviet demands, but had no intent of ever allying them. A month later Barbarossa was signed for implementation.

>>513979296
> real leader
That was Strasser and Hitler killed him.

>>513980559
>only source
Is literally every history book.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Barbarossa#Initial_attacks
> The Luftwaffe reportedly destroyed 1,489 aircraft on the first day of the invasion[222] and over 3,100 during the first three days
>The Germans destroyed the Soviet 3rd and 10th Armies while inflicting serious losses on the 4th, 11th and 13th Armies, and reported to have captured 324,000 Soviet troops, 3,300 tanks, 1,800 artillery pieces
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalin_Line
The Germans reached the Stalin Line, a massive set of defensive fortifications built through the 1920s, in July 1941. The Red Army and Air Force was deployed forward of the Stalin Line, ie offensively.

Either Stalin was planning to attack Germany, and had moved massive amounts of men, aircraft, tanks, guns etc into position to do so, or he had gone completely wacko bonkers and decided to respond to a German buildup in the area by putting his armies outside of the massive defensive fortifications against invasion that he himself had built

>>513981117
>Germany was still under occupation by the allies with military force
No it wasn't unless you mean the Ruhr, which is far away from Bayern and was only occupied 1923-1925

>>513958126 (OP)
and in winter, i wished he wasnt so ambicious so he finished the job

>>513981306
interesting

>>513978106
Right. The Soviets were hoping that the Germans and the British would exhaust each other in prolonged fighting over the course of many years. Then when the Red Army had finished its modernisation in 1943, they could launch a surprise attack on a weakened Germany.
From July 1940 to May 1941, the greatest fear of the Soviets was that Britain would make peace with Germany. This would expose Russia to the full might of the Wehrmacht. Stalin became paranoid after that weird incident with Rudolf Hess landing in Scotland, when there were rumors of the British making peace with the Germans.

>>513980947
Hitler was an agent sent by the Germany army to infiltrate the NSDAP to spy on them. He adopted their ideology and became it's leader thus influencing the military creating the SS and becoming leader of the German nation. He won the elections then dissolved democracy.

Yes the leaders of Germany were uneducated men and chicken farmers. That's why Hitler is the stuff of dreams.

>>513981155
>Breaking a promise won't destroy the trust of the country you broke the promise with if another country asked you to break the promise first
Czechoslovakia ceased to exist and then was invaded, unprovoked, by Poland who unilaterally annexed a bunch of Czech/Slovak territory they wanted. The breakaway new Slovak Republic, which was being invaded by Poland and attacked by Czech units, requested German protection and got it.
Even then, Germany didn't annex the remains of Czechoslovakia into Germany, but made it an independent protectorate

Strangely, the minute the Soviets weren't forcing the Slovaks to live in a combined Czech-Slovak state, they once again immediately declared independence

>>513981306
Hardly anyone doubts they caught Stalin by surprise dumbass (although I can and sometimes do)
NONE of that proves 'Stalin was planning to attack Germany', and that would have been utterly and completely retarded anyway, which is why only certified retards actually believe it

>>513981143
>fake journalist for a jewish newspaper (FAZ)
That's another lie. It's funny watching all the red herrings and strawmen as you get BTFO on one point and have to try to recover some semblance of dignity. You're a yahwist aren't you?

>>513958126 (OP)
During WWI, Russia capitulated quickly and left the war, ending the action on Germany's Eastern Front, while France kept fighting.
This was, of course, due to the Bolshevik Revolution in 1917.
In WWII, German air forces simply overflew the "impenetrable" Maginot Line and bombed France into submission, resulting in their quick surrender, so Hitler thought Russia would also be quick to capitulate, opening access to all the resources he needed to continue his Blitzkrieg.
He was mistaken, and Soviet forces fought him to a standstill at great human cost.

>>513981526

Stalin's War by Sean McMeekin is a great book and really the first original work on the subject of WW2 since the early 90s. Dunno if it's legal in Germany because it does contradict The Official History Of World War II (1945 Allies-Approved Edition) in several places

>>513981530
Had Germany invaded Britain the USSR would've taken over the entire continent of Europe and won the cold war against America. Moscow would be the center of the earth right now.

>>513981040
Obviously the US was never truly neutral. Selling arms is still not the same as being at war.

If in WWI, German diplomats to the US had swallowed their pride and attempted to appease us and hadn't sent a retarded offer to Mexico, American intervention would probably have stayed limited to arms deals and Germany very well may have won the war.

If, in WWII, Japan hadn't attacked Pearl Harbor, US intervention would have stayed limited to an oil embargo and Japan may have won the war. Germany would probably have still lost against the Soviet Union, but that goes back to operation Barbarossa being foolish, almost as foolish as trusting Italians to hold their flanks.

>>513981648
It's actually only jews like Glantz and Gorodetsky who try to gatekeep this information, Eastern Europeans (the non jewish kind) and Russians are generally supportive of his overall thesis.

>>513979035
No. Hitler wanted it since he wanted lebensraum and he hated communism. 90% of slavs were to be executed during barbarossa.

> soviets would attack Germany
Incredibly unlikely and with all the anti communist partisan activity in eastern Europe + overstretched lines they would have lost very badly.

>>513981563
Funny you neglected to mention the part where Germany invaded and directly occupied Czechia. You won't weasel your way out of this one, fag. Germany broke its promise, and lost the trust of the countries it broke its promise to. No amount of flagellating will change that.

>>513981873
The slavs were to be given a state to live in Siberia who the Germans would nuke occasionally to keep them down.

>>513981553
>Hitler was an agent sent by the Germany army to infiltrate the NSDAP to spy on them
This is a meme
In reality, the DAP was the political vehicle of the (judeo-masonic) Thule Gesellschaft, and Hitler's direct superior who ordered him to attend that first DAP meeting was Captain Karl Mayr, who was also a Thulist (picrel a rare photo - notice anything?)
See Othmar Ploeckinger, Unter Soldaten und Agitatoren
Hitler was obviously purposely recruited to lead the political party of the Thule Gesellschaft, i.e. the wealthiest and most influential secret society of post-WW1 Germany

>>513981648
>NONE of that proves 'Stalin was planning to attack Germany
It actually does, and the fact that you don't understand how it does means you are really, really stupid
They were massed for an imminent invasion of Germany, well forward of the massive defensive fortifications that Stalin had built. It is impossible they were there for any other reason, which is such a staggering amount of men, aircraft, tanks, guns etc were annihilated in the first week of the invasion. They weren't in defensive fortifications in defensible terrain, which Stalin had gone to great time and expense to build, they were out in the open right up against the border with airfields there to provide the deepest possible coverage into Poland and Germany.
> that would have been utterly and completely retarded anyway
One day look at a map of the German-Soviet border in 1941. With the sort of manpower/tanks/aircraft Stalin had amassed for the invasion, he could well have smashed his way through to Berlin

>>513981904
>Czechia
Third Worlder identified. Here in countries that aren't post-Soviet shitholes it's called the Czech Republic, when anybody gives a shit enough to even think about it, which is rarely.
Germany "invaded" after the Slovaks declared independence, and then Poland invaded "Czechia," and then the Slovaks requested German protection. There's only one way to Slovakia from Germany and that "invasion" was over in days.
Even then, """Czechia""" wasn't annexed into Germany but just made a protectorate to be dealt with after the war.
I know a big part of your national myth is the evil invasion and heroic resistance but you were just an impossible non-country made of two peoples who hated each other, that collapsed the minute Prague was exposed as powerless.
I mean you got invaded by POLAND

>>513958126 (OP)
Reminder that the Germans did defeat the Russians in WW1. Lebensraum was not some imaginary concept conceived out of nowhere but a restoration and extension of the Russian capitulation at the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk.

>>513981530
Yeah, Soviets wanted to find out about what the deal with Hess was about. Their ministry of propaganda at the time has already resumed their anti-fascist rhetoric and, moreover, was ideologically preparing the military for a sharp victory over them through the power of communism or some other bullshit.
What you're saying makes sense, but it's hard for me to answer this egg or chicken question with my pool of knowledge: Was their comprehensive preparation for war with Germany a response to Barbarossa or was it something they planned to commit to all along?

>>513981526
You need to listen to this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNa9X92CmvM

>>513981723
>That's another lie.
Where's the lie? Literally every biography mentions the Frankfurter as his journalistic cover, as does the source I provided (Gordon Prange, Target Tokyo)
You're reduced to slinging shit and see what sticks now, like a desperate kike rat

>>513982400
No, I really don't care that much about NS germany.

>>513980420
Fucking this. There was no decent co ordination between the Axis powers. If Barbarossa had a push from Japan it would have been over by 1942.

>biggest cope of all time
Everything we know of mechanized warfare comes from the Nazis. And it is Operation Barbarossa, not the war until 1945.
The technology gap alone made Barbarossa feasible.

The 2 extra months would have secured Leningrad and Moscow. Churchhill was being raped by U boats so hard he was sleeping on a couch in the White House trying to get the U.S. involved to save them.

El Duce literally lost ships because he did not warn them to leave port and they were captured without a fight. Italian troops lost Egypt, lost Greece, lost Yugoslavia, lost the flanks that led to the encirclement at Stalingrad.

The situation on June 21 1941 was drastically different than by Dec 23 1941. Just like in 2025 drones have replaced most of the mechanized it can change in 2 years again.

Hindsight is 20/20. Hitler and his boys stole and cheated to get the army to do Barbarossa via Polish gold and MEFO bills they had to act to stay in power.

>>513971048
>>513971439
>Hitler saviour of the white race
>D&C'd and called Meds lower than Germanics and despised Slavs
Always some faggot mutt simping for him, not to mention he kept breaking deals prior to WW2 and annexing lands that had no Germans at all, like inner Bohemia, despite only asking for Sudetenland initially.
What a great leader that killed millions of white.
And yes I denounce the Torah before you call me a jew for not wanting to be part of a foreign nation with a 1984 cult around a midwit d&c'ing faggot.

>>513982367
>picrel
None of that makes sense. The Soviets were well aware the Blitz ended the very night Hess flew over. Six weeks later Barbarossa started, and hardly anything happened in the West for three full years. They must have known at some point the whole psyop was meant to lure Hitler into Barbarossa

>>513982270
I'm not Czech. Calling something "The X Republic" is retarded. Do you call Russia "The Russian Federation" or China "The People's Republic of China"? Anyways, as I said thats a lot of flagellation but none of it changes the fact that Germany broke its promises and other countries viewed them as untrustworthy as a result. Even after that, if he had refrained from invading a country that Britain and France explicitly said they would defend, WWII wouldn't have happened, and Germany wouldn't have lost another war.

You seem to be obsessed with making excuses for why Hitler's actions were justified, or why allied responses were unfair. I'm sorry to break it to you, but the world isn't fair. National leaders have the duty to do what will result in the best outcome for their nation. Sometimes, that outcome is bitter or unfair. Rejecting bitter best outcomes in favor of "just responses" that will predictably result in worse outcomes is childish, and Hitler doing that makes him responsible for the current state of kiked Germany.

>>513982367
Per "Stalin's War" and "Icebreaker" and simple logic it was something they were planning for from the beginning
Stalin wanted Germany split up and tired after fighting the Western powers and then he was going to invade, and he'd put a very large force on the border to do just that.

>>513983095
>and hardly anything happened in the West for three full years
To be fair, Maysky was recalled as an ambassador (and later arrested, awaiting death sentence) because he couldn't stop pestering Churchill about the invasion from the west.

>>513980536
HE WAS THINKING TCD AND HE WAS ENTIRELY RIGHT

>>513958126 (OP)
He was saying the Russians were enemies of the West well before anyone else in power, citing their westward expansions and funding of Marxist separatists movements within other nations west of themselves (the fact that these events were widely published in newspapers all throughout the 20s and 30s was part of what the British saw as a challenge of getting their own people behind allying with the Soviets). It was the German WW1 problem all over again, except this time, unlike in WW1, Germany was able to secure their western border to focus their forces in the east. I guess he really didn't expect everyone to back the Soviets, since every Western power was dealing with their own marxist problems in years prior to that and were, up until then, very anti-Marxism.

>>513958126 (OP)
Hitler hated slavs with a passion. He literally had outlined a plan to displace all slavs into siberia, throw then into concentration camps and kill off the big majority in the same way they did with the jews.
This was recorded in a secret meeting that the Nazi high command had.
>what was he thinking
he wanted to kill all slavs and take over the territory for Germans/aryans to occupy.
Anyone who denies this is a complete fucking retard.

>>513983118
>Germany broke its promises and other countries viewed them as untrustworthy as a result
This is Kiddie Hollywood History where the kindly trusting maybe TOO trusting allies were just betrayed endlessly by the evil mean Nazis and finally they said THAT'S IT!!!!! and decided to stand up for peace and democracy etc

1. Germany annexed the Sudetenland per the agreeement, with those territories becoming Germany again.
2. The Slovaks declared independence.
3. Poland invaded """"Czechia""""" and the new Slovak Republic.
4. The Slovaks requested German protection because they had no armed forces and were being invaded.
5. The Germans obliged. They didn't annex the rest of """"""""""Czechia"""""""""" but just made it a protectorate pending much bigger issues that had to be solved, like say Poland's bizarre aggression against its neighbors at the time (like the Polish invasion of Lithuania).

>>513983118
>You seem to be obsessed with making excuses for why Hitler's actions were justified, or why allied responses were unfair.
Anon, this is standard Hitlertard MO
>>513983270
>Maysky was recalled as an ambassador because he couldn't stop pestering Churchill about the invasion from the west.
That's what he said himself, that it was because he failed to obtain a second front. But he was a jew so his own words are immaterial
He was at Yalta and Potsdam afterwards so I'm not aware of any death sentence

>>513958126 (OP)
The western front was a joke, that's all

>>513983667
>Hitler hated slavs with a passion
So why did he have quite a few slavs among his top ranking officials (e.g. Globocnik, Seyss-Inquart)

>>513981767
So, securing support from a regional power in the event of a nation declaring war on you is inflammatory, but that nation supplying your enemies isn't?

America wasn't going to let Germany win in either war, because a German victory in both would have meant the U.S. wasn't going to get anything back on their loans to Germany's enemies; the U.S. would have found any reason to get involved, even if they were not provided one.

>>513983845
Nazi ideology is full of contradictions everywhere.
It has Himmler who promoted him.
The broader stance to the slavic people was that they were subhumans.
Both of the people you mention were born within the Austrian empire.
they believed in "honorary aryans" or germanized blood.

>>513979516
The USSR had plans in place for the invasion of Europe back in the 20s. Hitler knew this, so he did what he could to prevent it.
Just look at the aftermath of WW2, all Eastern Europe was taken by the communists. You think they would've stopped there wasnt it for the Germans? They would've steamrolled Europe

>>513958126 (OP)
High on some nigger's fantasy book about how Germany had to expand east to thrive. You get what you fucking deserve. Spare anglos, get raped from all sides, forever.

>>513984726
THE THREAT TO GERMONEY WAS THE RUSSO GOMMUNISTS

STILL IS

THE CURRENT WAR IN EVROPA IS CLAIMED TO BE ABOUT DENAZIFICATION

>>513959014
What's fucked up is Germany hadn't even declared a state of imminent danger when the Russians were mobilized at their border, and telegraphed the British to tell Russia to back down to avoid the situation from blowing up beyond Austria-Hungary and Serbia, and Britain just kind of shrugged when Russia refused. The Germans were trying to keep it a regional conflict at the most, while the Russians were deliberately spreading disinformation among Serbia's and Austria-Hungary's governments to inflame it into an armed conflict.

>>513983918
>Inflammatory
I'm sorry to break it to you anon, but it doesn't really matter what is inflammatory or not. What matters is doing what is best for your country, even if it isn't fair.

The Zimmermann telegram was retarded. Mexico was never going to agree. They had just been through a civil war and wouldn't agree to go to war with a country that was already stronger than them when they weren't in recovery. The correct decision would have been to do whatever it took to prevent the US from joining the war, and do nothing that could be used as an excuse for war.

He tried so hard to avoid making the mistakes of Napoleon that he didn't realize that Napoleon didn't make any tactical mistakes. Napoleon made logistical mistakes. If Hitler followed Napoleons "just go to Moscow" battle plan with his modern supply line, the war would have been over (or at the very least the Soviets would have been on their back foot for 5 years before they could mount any real efforts to take back Moscow)

>>513976911
Because they didn't know the U.S. had been supplying Soviet industrialization at the same time the U.S. was engaging in commerce with the Germans (the U.S. has always been a bunch of ferengi in making money from anyone, but also there was the foreign policy belief that if you help enrich a nation with a hostile ideology, they would eventually come around to rejecting it and/or at least being friendlier with you and less staunch in their ideology).

>>513958126 (OP)
Your zipperhead mom

>>513983687
Congratulations anon, you managed to repeat your prior statements, just in a more obnoxious way. I'm not willing to put in that much effort though, so I'll just direct you to my prior (you) >>513983118

>>513984972
I agree with you entirely, I'm speaking more to your responses to that Germanon to somehow absolve the U.S. of anything that would have led to war, and placing it almost entirely at the feet of the people our government was operating against. We were already taking various actions against one side while benefiting their enemies and even taking antagonistic actions, to say our actions didn't meet some arbitrary threshold to justify their response is a bit disingenuous. We would have created another USS Maine event if they didn't give us one (it's part of why the Vice Admiral over Pearl Harbor, who was dismissed prior to the attack for not moving the naval fleets to a vulnerable position, was critical of the government and claimed the U.S. was wanting it attacked to justify a war).

>>513958126 (OP)
he knew the soviets were being influenced and on track to betray him and create a second front
his mistake was assuming he could force them to surrender in time, but you can't beat someone who gets shit tons of resources and money for free and basically just has to supply warm bodies

>>513958126 (OP)
>What the fuck was Hitler thinking here?
ww1 operative tried to get back home after his Chemical Warfare operation called Volkswagon

Remember how he sneaked away in WW1 after his "chemical poisoning accident" to fuck the Berlin Widdows?

Hmmm looks like he was thinking that since Russia took half of Poland, he should push towards the obvious Russia cities, since those were the likely logistics routes.

>>513966055
It’s because Russians were way more merciful and didn’t genocide German/hungarian/romanian/italian ans other axis civilians on the scale hitler troops did. If russia chose to do it, your collective axis body count would have been greater.

>>513986410
I haven't been absolving the US. I never once mentioned whether the German response was justified, and in fact I have consistently said from the beginning it doesn't matter if it was justified. Justified or not, the German response was stupid. Germany should have done whatever it took to win the war, even if that meant making concessions. In the case of WWI, the US was obviously looking for an excuse for war. Honestly if Germany hadn't admitted the Zimmermann telegram was real, I'd probably think it was a British fabrication.

You could make an argument that Germany would have been justified in attacking the US in retaliation for arming its enemy, but that doesn't really matter. What matters is that the US joining the war (for real, not the Krauts claim that selling arms means they were already at war), was what turned a very winnable war into a hopeless destruction. Germany should have done whatever it took to prevent that from happening. You think it was inevitable for the US to join, but I disagree. Germany offered lost territory to Mexico, but what did it offer to the US? It should have made concessions to the US, be it a guarantee of enforced loan repayment in the event of German victory, a guarantee to side with the US in its own hypothetical ambitions, a huge bribe, or even the ambassador's ass to closet fags in congress. "Justification" doesn't matter. What mattered was winning, and that required not having American soldiers fighting German ones.

In the case of WWII, Japan's actions are frankly even less rational. The US hadn't even started its oil embargo until Japan attacked the French Indochina, which was itself unnecessary.

>>513985851

And you've done a great job of remember what your $35k a year public school teacher told you when you were 13, and maybe even saw a History Channel thing on youtube or something.

It just isn't true.

>>513987702
Except that what you said essentially agreed with me, you just worded it in a way to attempt to justify it.

>>513982500
>Where's the lie
That it was a jewish newspaper you pathetic fag

>>513958126 (OP)
That's not a coincidence a failed priest on one side and failed artist on the other side were leading the forces of young boys and girls to murder each other. The worse as warlords they were the better they served that genocidal end.

>>513958532
It’s understandable because Hitler was under the influence of meth. Stalin on the other hand made just as retarded decisions as Hitler but he was on no drugs at all.

>>513970046
It was the same thing even prior to WW1. Germany wrecked France to become the dominant land force in Western Europe, and were on their way to become the dominant naval power by way of their naval technology (despite having fewer vessels than the British, theirs were better armed and armoured, and more powerful, and is the reason the world revised how the naval power of a nation is measured). Unfortunately, Wilhelm II was a naval autist and didn't listen to those around him telling him to chill on Germany's naval advancements so they wouldn't make the Brits feel threatened (which is probably why the Brits and the French sat on their hands and allowed Russia to inflame the situation on Germany's doorstep, despite the Germans asking the Brits to rein in their eastern ally).

Complete conspiracy theory, but Hitler was dumping the Nazis. Fascist leaders are not themselves nationalists, they just use them, call them special, then dispose of them. Then fled, faking his death

>>513958126 (OP)
He had the right idea, execution and adaptability issues.

>>513987819
>Except that what you said essentially agreed with me, you just worded it in a way to attempt to justify it.

No, it's opposite.
Your public school teacher:
>in 1938 Hitler promised extra hard to not invade Czechoslovakia and then he did, and thus everyone realized he was mean and had to be stopped!
Reality:
The Munich agreement was signed September 30, 1938. Poland then immediately, on the same day, demanded large chunks of territory that the Czechs had conquered in the 1920 Czech-Polish war, and then invaded October 1, 1938. Hungary then invaded October 5, 1938. Poland began a November, 1938 campaign in Slovakia, invading and annexing territories. This was all hammered out in the Vienna Award on November 2, 1938, an international conference which awarded big chunks of the country to Poland, Hungary, and Romania but not Germany.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Vienna_Award
Czechoslovakia had thus been invaded by 3 countries that weren't Germany.
Hungary then began making noises about annexing ALL of Slovakia, which until 1919 had been part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. On March 14, 1939, nearly 6 months after Munich and 4 months after Vienna, Slovakia declared independence and requested German protection, which the Germans agreed to. There wasn't even resistance to the Germans as they walked through

The Germans actually did their best to keep Czechoslovakia alive after Munich, but by March 1939 it did not exist as a country and all of its other neighbors had been openly carving it up ever since Prague was revealed to be toothless. You have to be careful when you're reading the history of a runup to a war, because the commonly accepted narrative is actually the winner's justification for getting into it. If it weren't for the internet textbooks would talk about Saddam's nuclear program.

>>513987696
No one would believe an enforced loan repayment. Wars are expensive for everyone, especially losers but even for winners, and create debt; it's a greater guarantee for those who created the most debt to win and you to be allied with them, than for their enemies to win and for you to place your trust in them paying out a debt they don't even owe you, much less have a reason to, since it's debt that existed to arm their enemies. Our own nation was in debt for many years after the revolution and was part of the reason we told France to fuck off when they asked for our debts to them to be repaid. Debts to other nations create guarantees, and Germany had vastly less than the allies, but they would have still had debts of their own, nevermind the debts nations like England would have owed, since everyone's economies in Europe prior to the war were pretty much in the shitter (and keep in mind, prior to the US entering, the Brits already bombed the fuck out of German cities, which prompted the German blitz over Britain, and that would have been additional debt for reconstruction on top of the money spent for military hardware that was wasted in war). I would also think offering to be the shield against Marxism spreading westward and pushing it back east with a giant buffer zone, considering everyone went through a series of their own red scares prior to the war, would have been a pretty good offer for everyone. You understand practical geopolitics, but you don't understand the power of debt in them. There was nothing the Germans could have offered the U.S. that would have made the U.S. not go to war with them. If anything, their relative self-sufficiency without tons of debt from the U.S. and their performance in being a real challenge for a collection of nations was a guarantee the U.S. would not have wanted such a threat to maintain nor grow.

>>513989279
Congratulations! You made a moderately less obnoxious repeat of what I said. Allow me to reiterate.

>Germany demanded land from Czechoslovakia.
>France and Britain agreed to give the land in an exchange for a guarantee that Germany wouldn't take any more land.
>Germany promptly takes more land

By the way
>Lead up to war
This has only a small relation to the leadup to war. I was replying to another anon's ridiculous delusion that Britain somehow betrayed Germany by not allying with them against the USSR. It was Germany's betrayal of its promises that killed any chance of an alliance.

In terms of the actual cause of WWII, it was Hitlers direct and explicit decision. After Hitler killed any chance of diplomacy with France and Britain, they promised to protect Poland. Hitler invaded Poland, fully knowing that it would start another world war.
>Inb4 it was justified because Danzig free city, Polish mistreatments of Germans, blah blah blah blah
None of that shit matters. Hitler directly and intentionally started the war that he lost, leading to the effective destruction of the German people.

>>513987696
>>513990187
Also, the Japanese were given permission by the Vichy government to occupy French Indochina to blockade the Chinese from gaining supplies; it was part of their war effort in China.

>>513958126 (OP)
That Germany was able to defeat Russia in the First World War, but not France but in the Second had defeated France in only six weeks and the USSR had shown its army to be corrupt and incompetant when it failed to conquer Finland.

>>513985423
>Because they didn't know the U.S. had been supplying Soviet industrialization at the same time the U.S. was engaging in commerce with the Germans
Everyone knew this. It was widely reported on in newspapers in every major country through the 20s and 30s, including Germany. Why make up headcannon that can't stand up to a 5 second google search?

>>513988497
>were on their way to become the dominant naval power
The Anglo-German naval arms race ended in 1912 in the Germans backing down because the British could out-build them anytime they wanted if they got serious about it.

>>513958326
Both Shitler and Lenin were Germans, anon.

>>513982614
Well you should, its the most significant event to happen in Europe since the napoleonic era. The mythos surrounding it litterally fabricated the ethos of the entire civilized world. Its the reason you AND us are taught to hate ourselves, its the mechanism of (((their))) control. If you care at all about Germany or the german people's future, you should study the past.

>>513970144
>He was correctly thinking they needed to take Leningrad to get access to the Soviet rail system for further operations, and to take the Caucasian oilfields in the south to deprive the Red Army of its fuel supply, with a just strong enough center force to hold back Soviet counteroffensives
Nice headcannon. I scrolled up to read your other posts after your claim that Germany tried to keep Czechoslovakia together (LMAO).

Let's look at the actual facts. Hitler ordered the siege of Leningrad from the get-go and the shift in offensive towards the oil fields was after the first year, when the plan to quickly take Moscow before winter failed. This happened in part because Hitler decided to go OCD on taking Kiev, and diverted Army Group Center's panzer force there, while delaying the offensive. This did allow the infantry of army group center to catch up, Kiev was taken, and the panzers were brought back up north. But by then winter was setting in and the offensive died in its tracks.

So you're trying to pass of the campaigns of 1942 as part of Operation Barbarossa (which concluded in Decmber of 41) and Hitler's original plan, when it was nothing of the sort. No wonder you think Germany "tried to keep Czechoslovakia together."

It was a preventive war
the soviets had millions of soldiers and tens of thousands of tanks on the german border
Hitler talks about this in his talk with Mannerheim

>>513990187
>Debt
That's why I offered other, increasngly hyperbolic options besides an unenforcable debt option. I don't think it was inevitable for the US to join the war on the side of Britain. People may assume fixed alliances because for the past century alliances have mostly been the same, but if you look at history, countries betray each other and switch alliances all the time. If Germany offered something sufficiently valuable, with sufficient guarantees, America may never have switched sides, but could probably have been kept from directly joining the war.

>>513991058
They were given permission because the Vichy government was a puppet, and the Japanese offer was tantamount to "Give it willingly or we'll take it anyways". It served minimal strategic value beyond having rubber which the Japanese could have just bought from France. In terms of invasion into China, it was useless. That terrain is jungle into mountains, and the Northern route that Japan had already taken was much closer to the few Chinese industrial centers. They should have predicted it would cause international outrage with disastrous results, and held off. All Japan had to do was not take European holdings, and the Japanese Empire might still contain China and Korea today.

More importantly, the attack on Pearl Harbor served virtually no practical benefit. It turned a much stronger country from a possible enemy into a direct one, with no route towards actually gaining anything from it. Anyone with knowledge of the comparable resource access, populations, and industrial capacity between Japan and America knows that Japan had no hope of victory over America, even with initial successes. Even in a fantastical scenario where Japan managed to thoroughly defeat the American navy for good, they still wouldn't have any American oil. An invasion of continental US for american oil fields would be hopeless.

>>513981306
no shit there were soviet forces positioned forward of the stalin line. because they had territory forward of the stalin line. this in no way implies an invasion force. on the other hand, no major battles were fought forward of the line. the presence of forces in soviet home and occupied territory in no way implies an offensive buildup.