Thread 513997439

Are there any actual arguments against socialism?

>>513997439 (OP)
it's gay, bro

>>513997439 (OP)
Pro and Contra.

>>513997439 (OP)
No not really.

>>513997439 (OP)
op died in a small fire

>>513997439 (OP)
They have that shit in Europe because they're all subsidized by the US. For crying out loud, Germany literally just announced they can't keep up the funding of their social programs. You're fucking retarded.

>>513997439 (OP)
Yes, you do pay higher taxes for it. Europe needs to start paying their fair share of defense costs, as well. We've been picking up the slack on that for too many decades now.

I wish I could go back to 2021 and invest all my cash into calls on oil prices.

>>513997439 (OP)
>Are there any actual arguments against socialism?
People should be free.

>>513997439 (OP)
There are no valid arguments against national socialism.

>>513997439 (OP)
Yes, its not islamic

>>513997541
The alternative is oligarchy with decreasing resources allowed to the servant class…so yeah I’ll take socialism

>>513997608
>They have that shit in Europe because they're all subsidized by the US.
No, that's not how it works.
Germany just announced they can't keep up the funding
When States tell you they can't "fund" something, they are lying to you. States create money, they can always fund things. Now, it is a bit different in Europe, specifically the countries that use the Euro currency, because they actually ceded control to a supranational central bank (the European Central Bank), so it's not entirely up the member countries. But there is nothing that can stop a central bank from funding something a state wants to accomplish if the resources are there. Whatever they can do, they can afford. They are not dependent on tax revenue or balanced budgets or any of that nonsense.

>>513997439 (OP)
You eventually run out of other peoples money

>>513997439 (OP)
No, just jews viciously seething against the idea of community support for anyone other than themselves.

>>513997439 (OP)
brown people

>>513997904
yes it all burns up in the literal campfire, it's not like it transfers between people for goods and services

>>513997439 (OP)
>we do not pay higher taxes.
are you sure about that?

>>513997608
is that what you call blowing up german pipelines and starting a war in Europe to screw us over?
"subsidizing"?
if anything your shithole has done everything to destroy Europe
jealous jewish nigger

>>513997904
Not how it works.

>>513997608
KEK. Governments only "run out of money" when it comes to helping regular people, they have limitless funds for corporations and jewish interests.

>>513997439 (OP)
Idk it's never been tried

If you tip too far towards socialism or fascism you get an authoritarian state. Its best to have a regulated market where these two extremes can peacefully coexist. We already see the consequences, politicians will shove their hand in the pot if they have any measure of power they will not check their own power.

If you tip too far towards socialism or nationalism you get an authoritarian state. Its best to have a regulated market where these two extremes can peacefully coexist. We already see the consequences, politicians will shove their hand in the pot if they have any measure of power they will not check their own power.

>>513997541
>Turning Point USA
Evangelical heresy. Opinion disregarded.

>>513998012
>pay a healthy able-bodied man 80,000 a year to dig holes and fill them back in
>"this is actually a good thing bro he'll spend the money and stimulate the economy"

>>513997439 (OP)
You have to force everyone at gun point to participate in it

>>513997541
You could say the exact same thing about capitalism. Anyone who thinks capitalism is actually sustainable is a true next level retard. The alternative doesn't have to be socialism or communism, but capitalism for sure will cook humanity. It relies entirely on line going up and if line doesn't go up the entire society dies.

>>513997439 (OP)
No, but as Europe will soon find out in the next few years, the niggers and ragheads will suck you dry. THAT is why you can’t have nice things.

>>513997904
>No one can afford anything in our based capitalist system
What happens to capitalism when you run out of other people's money because it all got sucked upwards to the already wealthy?

>>513997439 (OP)
at this point i hardly see the difference between government run industry and private profit driven industry. The closest thing to owning the productive and economic output of a company in america is shareholder capitalism which everyone can agree on all sides of the political spectrum is a cancer on our society.
The bankers constantly manipulate the purchasing power of our money to the point that the government no longer controls production or price of our currency.
The government constantly bails out monopolies and borrows hundreds of billions dollars in order to keep industries that they have vested interests in afloat despite their failures. What really is the difference between a government operated industry and one that is profit driven, yet always under the security of a government bail out?
Would corporations be any more woke and anti-white and discriminate against males more if they were government owned? I genuinely cant imagine the government pozzing our fortune 500 harder than vanguard and esg financial tools have in the past decade.
>b-but you run out of other peoples money
meanwhile our "welfare capitalist" country has borrowed 40 trillion dollars so far, promised something like 170 trillion dollars in unfunded liabilities over the next 20 years, and 20% of our economic activity is in financing, insurance, and legal industries (completely unproductive).

>>513997439 (OP)
Europ is falling laughably behind in the race to have the most billionaires tho.

>>513999214
Monetary sovereign's CANNOT run out of money. They can run out things to be -- real resources -- and then you get inflationary pressure. But they can't actually run out of money. They create it.

>>513998906
It needs to be regulated capitalism, but absolute power will not regulate itself. Building towers into the sky only to fall in street is unsustainable. We need to impose caps on CEOs to reinvest back into their corporations while a percentage goes to a trust, because theyre literally sucking up everything and giving nothing back. There should be an allocation for some form of democratic social programs, healthcare, education. But thats if we really cared about the strength and future of this country and we really dont. Just shareholder politicians fucking us every single day

>>513999299
>I genuinely cant imagine the government pozzing our fortune 500 harder than vanguard and esg financial tools have in the past decade.
What a stupid narrative this is. ESG is a tiny bit of performative "wokeness" at most.
It's demonized by the grifters you follow simply because it inevitably transitions us away from Fossil Fuel fortunes, and taxes egregious polluters. Not a single conservative politician gives a single fuck what color or sexual orientation the proles are. They just want to protect Daddy Warbuck's fortunes.

>>513999676
>performative
if it was vanity, they wouldnt sacrifice so much to perpetuate it.

The US is a socialist country. We just have socialism for corporations instead of actual people.

>>513997439 (OP)
>1pbtid

>>513997439 (OP)
>GDP half the size of america's despite having a third more people
>nonexitent birthrates & mass migration
>behind on literally every major new industry over the last 20 years
>no industry or social mobility beyond a guaranteed lower middle class
>constant decline and stagnation, while the US at least economically, still holds it's own
Europe has it's nice pieces. But it is falling behind most major powers. By some metrics even behind fucking Russia, which has an economy weaker than Italy, but still a more developed IT, arms and space industry

>>513997439 (OP)
They have higher taxes and lower wages but hey at least niggers and pakis get free healthcare

>>513999299
>if it doesn't involve sweaty men pounding things with hammers it's heckin unproductive
try starting a business with no finance and no insurance and tell me how far you get

>>514001331
usury and swapping a bunch of assets with other asset holders isnt something I would consider productive

>>513997439 (OP)
Very nice.
Now pay your share for your militray instead of having the US propped you up.

>>514001444
Imagine being a young entrepreneur with a great idea for a business but having to save for 15 years before being able to start it because your based and redpilled benevolent dictator just outlawed loans.

>>513997439 (OP)
And suddenly German imports negroes and can no longer afford the wellfare state. Really makes you think, huh?

>No we do not pay higher taxes
But you do. That is a fact. You pay on average 10-20% more in tax than Americans. sometimes even more than that.

>free college
lol

>>513997439 (OP)
yeah it's for losers. nazis and commies are all losers

>>514001670
imagine your society encourages rent seeking behavior above all other avenues as an economic activity. when i think of productivity i think of things like airplanes and electronics, not paypal skimming money off my transactions or credit card interest rates above 10% or stupid lawsuits that are meant to bankrupt the participants.
btw i got repeating numbers >>513999299
here and>>514001444
here so you have to agree with me.

>imagine being a young entrepreneur and you have to save money or seek equity with existing businesses instead of creating capital out of thin air
thank you benevolent dictator for preventing another series of bubbles, all hail dear leader.
>>513999999

>>513997439 (OP)
The US paid for Europe's defense for 75 years. That's how they afforded it.

>>514002203
>seek equity with existing businesses
what the fuck are you talking about?

>>513997439 (OP)
Black and trans people might benefit from it. That’s their only argument.

>>513997439 (OP)
>Europe is paradise on Earth
>Europe is a racist shit hole and needs infinity migrants to save it
Will these people ever tell us which is it?

>>513997439 (OP)
>gimme free stuff

>>513997439 (OP)
They have all of that crap but their society is extremely weak and terminally decadent. Is it really worth it? Will they have any of that 50 years from now, sans some incredible development in automation?
I dont think so.

Only one group (white men) pay for all the services, yet they benefit the least from them. Socialism only works in a white ethnostate, otherwise it's grossly exploitive.

>>513997439 (OP)
yeah, people like owning shit

Europe has occasional wars that kill millions because of socialism. Socialism is a great way to learn Russian and work for Putin.

>>513997439 (OP)
>for now
Europe won't have any of that soon. Even the ultra liberals in Germany are talking about cutting welfare because they can't afford it. And with millions of unemployed foreigners leeching off the system it will be dead in no time.
>>513998906
>capitalism isn't sustainable
>outlived socialism by 400 years

I dont understand how people can argue for socialism. Every institution and group of humans who do anything always end up corrupt and abusive. From religious institutions thousands of years old to today's governments and corporations. Most socialists dont trust the government but yet want to give it power over all or most of the wealth in society because its going to work out well this time. Its really a special kind of stupid.

>>513997439 (OP)
Humanity is naturally a hierarchical species. Nature is hierarchical.
Socialism in theory aims to be anti-hierarchical. But the problem is that it works against nature and ends up having to embrace hierarchy and multiple levels, simply reinforcing a more authoritarian version of what it supposedly opposed in the first place.
Throw in a bad understanding of economics ("capitalism" is a bogeyman that doesn't exist, there is simply good economic policy and bad economic policies) and socialism invariably turns into a shit show.
Incidentally, all socialist societies end up falling back on the "capitalist" economic principles they reject. It's not because the revolution was betrayed; it's because reality requires that society operate according to reality.
You don't have to be a socialist to support solid governance. You don't have to be a socialist to support publicly-owned infrastructure, public education, or even public health care. You don't have to be a socialist to support strong safety nets. Socialism boils down to the idea that the working class ought to own society - but, unfortunately, that is not an idea that has ever worked in practice.

>>514003795
The core idea behind socialism is popular power. Ie. allowing people to have direct influence over the decision-making of the government institutions. That is what "soviet" means.

>>514003795
because the socialist always imagines himself in power, running the show, rather than what would most likely happen, that the socialist would be the first one up against the wall

>>513997439 (OP)
Does the European Union trade in gold or fiat?

>>513998050
>Be 20th century European industrialized colonial powers
>Eat each other alive until nothing remains
>England loads up backup save file
Literally not my fault. America is retarded because it runs in the family

>>513997439 (OP)
Yes, lots.

>>513997439 (OP)
Lol. Dude euro taxes are INSANE. Lol. NOTHING is free

>>513997439 (OP)
it's shilled by bots who don't respond to their own threads, so i don't like it

>>513997439 (OP)
>Europe
Europe is being invaded by low-IQ third-worlders that get free welfare while native citizens suffer.

>>513998050
The fuck Timo gon do?

>>513997439 (OP)
If the govt is your caretaker, you’re in trouble.

>>513997893
>Germany just announced they can't keep up the funding of white people
funds are endless for shitskins

>>514008717
yes.

>>513998906
All positive outcomes rely on the line going up. Horizontal or downward line implies a dystopian society.

>>513997439 (OP)
>supervirus
>billions will die
>jooos
kek

>>513997439 (OP)
It feels great to have more things than others

>>513997439 (OP)
Yes. You will have to become a 1PBTID mandatory.

>>513997439 (OP)
Yes.
You end up running out of other people's money.

>>513997439 (OP)
yes, their socialism is funded by outsourcing their defense to the US and never paying for it. As they begin to fund their armies to 'ward off russia' and import legions of functionally useless foreigners, their dole will dry up and they will be left in a state of shock and then fight one another for scraps. Such is the way of the 'enlightened' euro.