Thread 518966862

Beside some morals there is literally nothing worth in Christianity, Bible sounds exactly like human made up stories, not divine revelation, with no proof or transcendent ideas, a non-Christian child could invent similar religion.

Christians can't prove it's truth without spamming the same meaningless quotes or copes like "only God knows" meanwhile Indo-European and Eastern religions contains advanced, scientifically supported ideas about consciousness, racialism, the universe especially multiuniverse, atoms, and medicine long before Christianity existed.

>>518966862 (OP)
Pic related.

>>518966862 (OP)
Also I'm well convinced Christianity works for a while until it falls into deep nihilism, atheism and degeneracy because I was there I used to be a Baptist going every Sunday and Wednesday at at 13-15 already had problems with the Romanian Orthodoxy as they were animalic like who were fighting to kiss some dead corpse and having no respect for the nature or places where they live being exactly in same conditions like pigs, had some deep questions which never got an answer so I became an atheist until I discovered Survive The Jive, Julius Evola, Carl Jung and went down the rabbit hole of Paganism, Indo-European religions like Vedicism, Buddhism and Hermeticism where I did found actual answers.

>>518966862 (OP)
Bump for rare genuine criticism of Christianity. Where are the Christbros to intellectually defend the faith? Christianity can survive kikes lying and slandering Christ, but it cannot survive intellectual, epistemological weakness.

>>518966862 (OP)
Jehovah's Witnesses here, AMA anything.

>>518967215
The Bible is all true because science says so? This isn't a strong argument especially on pol.

>>518967232
>Where are the Christbros to intellectually defend the faith?
no need to defend christianity most of you are going to become one in the last hours of your life anyway

>>518967232
>Where are the Christbros to intellectually defend the faith?

Right here

>but it cannot survive intellectual, epistemological weakness.

Yes it can

>>518967215
>lets just ignore the talking snakes, donkeys, and other supernatural claims that can never be replicated or given evidence for

>>518966862 (OP)
Christianity is the core philosophy of western civilization. You cant be trad without embracing it. You arent conserving anything by abandoning the core of your identity. You want proof? Look at the places where atheists dominate.

>>518966862 (OP)
it doesn't. christianity is the original one jew god one globohomo government ideology

>>518966862 (OP)
“Indo-European” is to pajeets as “Judeo-Christian” is to kikes, a bunch of brown retards trying to carpetbag off the whiteman’s success and say “we’re just like you, let us in!”
Show me where Hinduism contains anything similar to the Iliad/Odyssey in terms of a similar plot, and prove to me that any Indian philosophy existed prior to contact with the Greeks or Chinese, and then I’ll believe your shit and cow worship is worth putting on the level of Plato or Aristotle instead of a mere corrupted derivative

>>518967507
How can Christianity survive intellectual and epistemological inferiority? The former is seen in several of its doctrines lacking coherency and being contrary to human nature. Such as Original Sin and God's Justice, or several textual contradictions, which require inconsistent exegetical principles to be able to explain. Its epistemological weakness comes from its lack of ability to be authenticated as preserved from its original writing, as well as how to explain why some scriptures were included in the Bible and why other were declared as Apocrypha. I've studied with Witnesses and know the standard answers, which are insufficient, so I hope you could address some of these concerns.

>>518967215
The Bible says Earth is circular under a firmament and many of those were already known by others like Greeks like air having weight and Earth floating in space

>>518968086
the term indo-european was created by a German philologist and refers to language, you are colored like dogshit so nobody expects you to even know the 101 of what you are attempting to brownly criticize

>>518966862 (OP)
Hey retard, religion isnt a fashion statement

Nobody picked Christianity because its cool or some other trivial reason. You dont get to tell God what type of God he is.

Christianity is simply the truth, the Bible is the truth, if youre following something else, youre following a lie.

>>518967589
"Magic" is a word used to describe something that is not understood or cannot be rationalized but it is undeniable. Supernatural is subjective. Cryptozoology is considered supernatural.

A lot of "magical" things have rational explanations today. In fact, we speak of gods/demons all the time in a secular educated world. Today we call them aliens. God, angels, demons, and Jesus are spirits. Spirits are extra-dimensional non-corporeal beings made of pure energy. Think of Prophets, Doud, Trelane and Q from Star Trek. Beings beyond not just physical bodies but beyond our three dimensions.

Study Quantum Physics, Laws of Physics, Abiogenesis, Mathematics, Consciousness, String Theory. That explains all the "magic" and supernatural occurences in our world. Almost everything magical and supernatural has a logical explanation to it. The Bible is not a magical book, it is a logical book based on history, archeology and political powers. The supernatural stuff in there has logical explanations.

A good example of "magic" is the Snake talking to Eve. The Bible revealed in Revelations that Satan was the "original serpent" and Jesus called the Jews "Offspring of Vipers" and "You are from your father the devil." Snakes cannot talk, however, if some powerful invisible being were to "puppet" a snake it would appear to talk. What you were reading was an advanced form of puppetry same as how we have cartoons and CGI people in Star Wars now talking where non-existent things interact with humans. It is also a possibility that the snake was not even a snake at all but an illusion created by Satan.

That is how magic is explained logically

>>518968115
>so I hope you could address some of these concerns

Which one do you want to start off with?

>>518966862 (OP)
>Christians can't prove it's truth
What do you even expect us to "give" you as "proof"? What do you even expect the Bible to be in order for you do believe it? You expect the letters to do magic dance in front of you? It was written by men inspired by the Holy Spirit of God. You reject it and say it's all human made. Even if it was literally written by God himself, Jesus Christ writes his own Gospel, would you accept that? No, of course not, you antichrists would just say "nuh uh" as you always do and say a mere human wrote it, as you see Jesus as a mere human.
You people have such an ugly attitude towards God and you literally expect Almight God to show up on your door and perform miracles just for you, in order for you to believe in him. Why should he do that? You are thinking wayyy too high of yourselves. Do you also expect the president of your country to show up on your door and prove to you personally that he is the president? But Almight God has to show up just for you ungrateful unfaithful rebellious morons, yes? It's mindboggling the attitude of you people, and God still allows you to breathe and blaspheme him every day.

There is NOTHING that anyone can say or give to you to ever change your mind towards Christ, maybe God can, but nobody else can. And even if God shows up and performs a magic show for you, I think even then you would outright reject him, as the pharisees did. There are just people in this world that are infested with evil, and I'm saying this to Christians here, you have to understand that not everybody can be or will be saved. There are people in this world who just hate God, that is who they are, and they will invent all kind of mental gymnastics and twisted nonsense about God no matter what. That is the reality of this fallen world. That is how people outside of the truth operate, that is the world of the father of lies.

>>518968224
>OP says “Indo-European and Eastern *religions*”
>I call him out on his blanket Poojeet apologetics
>you: “nuh uh the term OP is misusing to describe religion was actually invented by Germans to describe language, thus you’re the retard here”
Not even defending Christianity btw, I can just tell brown hands typed half the posts on here and it’s my duty as a non-retarded person to call it out

>>518967215
>science
Lol. Lmao even.

>>518967370
70% of the Bible is just history verifiable through non-Biblical testimonies and archeology. 20% is just axiom where there is no 3rd party testimonies nor archeological evidence like Noah and the Flood, Adam and Eve and the Garden of Eden, Jesus miracles, the 10 Plagues etc. These are supported through credibility.

The rest is wisdom, poetry, insight, knowledge, and commandment.

>>518967507
>>518968115
My apologies, I just read your picrel. Is the argument for Biblical authenticity that there is no existing pre-Modern document which has more manuscripts? If so, that just proves it was copied a lot, it doesn't mean those copies are accurate, and secondly it isn't the only pre-Modern text to be majorly copied on a mass scale.

>>518966862 (OP)
Fuck off pajeet sukdeep with your gypsy Hindu shit. This is Apostle Andrew's country.

>>518966862 (OP)
These threads helped to push me towards Christ. Thank you, OP.

>>518968665
>2 Samuel 22:16 - The valleys of the sea were exposed and the foundations of the earth laid bare at the rebuke of the Lord, at the blast of breath from his nostrils.

>Jonah 2:5-6 - 5Waters encircled me clear to [the] soul; the watery deep itself kept enclosing me...6To the bottoms of [the] mountains I went down.

>Job 38:16 - Have you gone to the springs in the sea or walked through the valleys of the ocean depths?

Real Oceanography and mapping of the ocean floors didn't begin until the Challenger Expedition of 1872. Read all those Bible verses. Where did the Jews get that the ocean had mountains and Grand Canyons? Where did they get that underwater had geisers, springs, and volcanoes from?

What Jew stuck his head under water to the deep fathoms of the ocean and mapped out valleys, springs, and canyons? How did a Jew know all stars vibrate at their own frequencies to the point of all being unique individuals from one another? How did a Jew know that life is written in code? All that is impossible for an ancient human. The only default answer is God.

>>518968713
>>518968556
Biblical preservation is a good start. If it cannot be reasonably proven to be written by prophets or people who met prophets, then its claim as the Word of God has no basis.

>>518968086
Modern India is the way it is because it lacks it's ruling class.

>>518967215
>bible says earth is a sphere

>>518966862 (OP)
it shouldnt
being a christian means you are divorced from the earth

>>518968845
There are thousands of copies of ancient manuscripts going back to 200 BC before Jesus was born in the form of scrolls, books, and fragments. All prove the Bible is still the same after 4 thousand years of compiling. There have been attempts of tampering but those were pointed out immediately and modern Bibles point them out. You can see these manuscripts online to this day.

Here are the Dead Sea Scrolls. The oldest known manuscripts of the OT going back 200 years before Christ.
http://www.deadseascrolls.org.il/home

The Dead Sea Scrolls(along with other discovered manuscripts and papyri down the ages) proved the Bible was unchanged the entire time. The DSS were discovered in 1946. By then, hundreds of Bibles going back centuries were already printed. The oldest complete being the Codex Amiatinus(8th Century) and Codex Vaticanus(4th Century).

Other manuscripts like Alexandrian Codex(400AD), Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus(450AD), Codex Sinaiticus(330AD), Codex Boernerianus(850AD),Codex Claromontanus(550), Codex Augiensis(850AD), Minuscule 365(12th century), Minuscule 442 (12th century), Lectionary 60(1021), Uncial 061(5th century), and more were around and used to make Bibles.

The DSS discovered in the 20th century proved all those manuscripts up above were copied from original unaltered copies when compared to the DSS which predated Christ by 200 years.

>>518967799
Many were the cores of philosophy of the Western civilization yet they're gone, you can still be trad without embracing Christianity, all of those places where atheists dominated ended up like that for a reason Christianity became obsolete and can't no longer work especially because of it's teachings of being tolerant, we're all children of God, God will forgive them and to turn the other cheek.

>>518967799
>Look at the places where atheists dominate.
Czech Republic, Estonia, China, Best Korea, all of which are infinitely less gay and kiked than the majority christian US where you have to at least LARP as a christian to hold most public offices. Huh. Thanks for making me notice.

>>518967254
How does it feel to know that you're not a Christian and will never be considered one?

>>518969021
The manuscripts which predate Christ all have numerous textual variants from one another. Your argument only supports the idea that there was an original Jewish Bible at one point, which I accept, but it does not prove that this original text was preserved. In fact, the textual variants prove it was lost. I do admire that Isaiah is almost the same in the Dead Sea Scrolls as we have it today, but that isn't the case for most of the other parts of the OT.

>>518969127
We are the only true modern day Christians.

>>518969127
Sorry, neither the Orthodox nor Catholic Church can prove Apostolic succession. They can only prove following the Church Fathers (which the Orthodoxy has a stronger argument for)

>>518969277
Dude. Your fake religion was caught mistranslating the bible on purpose to fit your insane doctrine that only popped up in the late 1800s.

>>518969417
KEK. Fuck off. I'm not a Roman Catholic or an Orthobro.

>>518968086
You misunderstood it, it has nothing to do with Pajeets being same people like Europeans, it's all about ancestors of White people being nomad warriors who took control over that region and started to impose themselves, their language Sanskrit and their religion from which Hinduism is based on and there are many similarities like the Vedic Dyaus Pitar, Greek Zeus Pater, and Roman Jupiter all directly descend from the Proto-Indo-European Dyeus Phater or Indra with Thor and Perun

>>518969594
If you don't follow either Church, then how do you justify your interpretation of the Bible being the same as how its authors intended it? How do you prevent anachronistic readings?

>>518966862 (OP)
Christian Nationalism is the only weapon in that can fight against Leftist Atheism.

You're either with us, or against us.

Christ is King.

It shouldn't, but the anti-Christian autism is even more of a problem than "Christian Nationalism". It's all incredibly gay though.

>>518969947
We use the earliest available manuscripts along with reliable historical commentaries and accounts. The reason why I'm Protestant is because I'm value the original Church without the later Roman Catholic and Orthobro additions.

>>518970438
Which available manuscript or commentary can be dated to the time of Jesus or his apostles?

>>518970261
Wrong, there is much more from which we can select than just Christianity which also brought all of those issues upon us especially with the guilt for Colonization, the right take would be a synthesis to create an Western only religion as the Japanese had done with Shintoism and Buddhism

>>518971235
There are no surviving manuscripts from the time of Jesus. Paper documents don't last that long. We do know the approximate dates of all the gospel accounts. And all of those documents date to Jesus and his apostles. We do know that the earliest surviving manuscripts were copied from earlier ones. If you have a problem with that, then you don't know much about how ancient history is studied.

>>518970261
is the kingdom of Jesus Christ of this world? yes or no?

>>518966862 (OP)
Go back to India.

>>518966862 (OP)
Christian nationalism is code for white nationalism

>>518972066
Our father,
Who art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy name,
YOUR KINGDOM COME
YOUR WILL BE DONE
IN EARTH AS IT IS IN HEAVEN

>>518972376
ok, now read Revelation.

>>518972439
KEK.
Read the book in the Bible with the most symbolism over a direct command from Jesus? Which part of Revelation do you want me to read?

>>518966862 (OP)
because right wing politics align with what the bible teaches. law and order, natural love between man and women. why would a christian vote for gay and trans rights? why would a christian vote for a lawless society.

>>518972674
>over a direct command from Jesus
Revelation was given to John by Jesus. you think humans can create the kingdom of God on earth when its clearly done by God himself.

>Which part of Revelation do you want me to read?
Revelation 21
The New Heaven and the New Earth for example

>>518966862 (OP)
Hitler was leftist mussolini and petainna dentist thats the kjv bobble asswipe etsucans and Trojans atlanteams and etc were catholics

>>518972879
Yes, John the revelator was given a great vision of things to come. But many people who only read Revelation, misinterpret it all the time. I do as Jesus commands.
Matthew 28:16-20 ESV
16 Now the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain to which Jesus had directed them.
17 And when they saw him they worshiped him, but some doubted.
18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
19 Go therefore and make disciples of ALL NATIONS, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

>>518973077
nothing wrong with it. Im just saying humans cant create the kingdom of God on earth.
christian nationalism is not biblical, especially when its enforced under one man. thats what Revelation warns about. the whore of babylon masquerading as the Church of Jesus Christ.
the true Church and true Kingdom are not visible by human eyes for now, but will be established in the second coming.

>>518966862 (OP)
Do not fall for glownigger divide & conquer tactics.

Christianity is the definition of "right wing" political ideology:
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left%E2%80%93right_political_spectrum#Origins_in_the_French_Revolution

Christianity has always been a racist religion:
>"Oh, race of Franks, race from across the mountains, race chosen and beloved [...]"
>"the kingdom of the Persians, an accursed race, a race utterly alienated from God [...]"
- https://www2.cbn.com/article/church/pope-urban-iis-speech-calling-first-crusade

The National Socialists used the Celtic cross and gave out iron cross medals for bravery.
The racist and anti-semitic Confederates have always been Christian.

Here's a growing list of Christian political commentators who are racist and anti-semitic:
- https://rentry.org/Deus_Vult
Feel free to reply to this post with others.

Educate boomers irl. If you don't preach to them, the anti-Christian kikes will:
- https://news.antiwar.com/2025/10/06/israel-to-spend-up-to-4-1-million-in-propaganda-campaign-targeting-american-christians/
israeli nationalism ("zionism") is a heresy:
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKlT-hhZXoM&t=658s
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odNoExd8a5U
The "holocaust" (burnt offering) is a lie made up by kikes, both soviet and freemason:
- https://rumble.com/c/ScriptureandTraditionFrJM/videos
Boycott all israeli products:
- https://bdsmovement.net/Guide-to-BDS-Boycott

Common glownigger talking points:
>"jesus is a kike"
The word "kike" comes from the word "kikel", which means circle. The kikes hate the cross so much, they would sign documents with a circle, hence the nickname.
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plus_and_minus_signs#Alternative_plus_sign
>"off topic"
Reminder the pope is the monarch of a country. In fact in many european (white) nations there is no separation between church and state.

>>518969277
completely false, no evidence for such a ludicrous claims exist.
christianity is the most bastardized spiritual communism hippie shit ever existed on planet earth.

>>518966862 (OP)
The bible alone is unsufficient for virtue, which must be embodied in practice and with reference to a community. Hence protestantism fucking everything up. Alasdair MacIntyre is a good starting position for building off Aristotle and the contributions of Aquinas. This is the modern issue. There can be no good without a human telos.

>>518972325
christian nationalism is an oxymoron, no such thing exist and only serves as a pin in the wheel of European people.

>>518973690
Yntil this modern conception of the individual rational agent devoid of context is abandonned no religion will help us.

>>518973384
>Im just saying humans cant create the kingdom of God on earth.
We don't do it ourselves. We do it through the power of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. We only do the good works that were prepared for use to do in advance.

>christian nationalism is not biblical
Not only is it Biblical, it mandatory if you're a Christian. If we are doing are jobs as Christians, then our nations will become Christian as a result. We are here to make things better, and not to make things worse.

>>518973411
> Germanic Symbel
— (ritual drinking ceremony):

- A communal rite of oath-swearing, honor-affirming, and ancestral connection.
- Mead or ale is passed around; participants boast of past deeds, make vows, and call on gods or ancestors as witnesses.
- The ritual builds accountability, tribal cohesion, and personal honor.
- Relationship with the divine is reciprocal: the gods walk with their people, and worth is earned through action.
- Framework revolves around honor vs. shame, with the goal being glory, loyalty, and legacy.


> Christian Mass (Eucharist):
— (commemorates Passover, symbolizing the body and blood of Christ)
— (rooted in Jewish Passover, which celebrates liberation from slavery in Egypt and divine deliverance)

- A ritual of repentance, atonement, and submission.
- Participants receive bread and wine symbolizing the body and blood of Christ—a gift of grace given despite unworthiness.
- Emphasis is on humbling oneself, confessing sin, and seeking forgiveness.
- Relationship with the divine is often hierarchical: God is all-powerful, and humans are flawed and dependent.
- Moral framework revolves around sin vs. salvation, and the goal is eternal life in heaven.

The Germanic Symbel asks you to lift your horn and be heard.
The Christian Mass asks you to bow your head and be forgiven.

> ᛏ Germanic

• Stand tall
• Speak your deeds
• Swear oaths to fulfill your will
• You earn worth through action and loyalty
• Seek honor
• Embody the flesh

> christianity

• Humble yourself
• Confess your sin
• Submit to God's will
• You are unworthy, saved by grace
• Seek forgiveness
• Deny the flesh

> The Germanic Symbel asks you to lift your horn and be heard.
- The Christian Mass asks you to bow your head and be forgiven.
Christians merely copied our traditions, cultures, and rituals outright.

>>518973885
Christians merely copied our traditions, cultures, and rituals outright.
The word blessing literally traces back to blood rituals—to the Old Norse blēdsian (blay-d-see-an) -> blót, sacred consecration through sacrifice.

The drinking of wine and bread in Christian mass is mostly aesthetic—a symbolic portrayal of blood sacrifice.
Yet, in Christian doctrine, there can be no real blood sacrifice anymore, therefore no true blessings in the ancient sense.

In the Old World, mead or wine was a sacred medium connecting the blood of sacrifice to the gods.
Through this connection, we swore oaths and sought honor, often boasting of fulfilled vows as a communal sacred act.

> In the Old World, mead or wine was not mere drink, but a "sacred medium" — carrying the "power of the blood sacrifice" to the gods.
- Through this connection, "oaths were sworn", "honor was pursued", and "fulfilled deeds were declared" before kin and gods alike.
> A warrior might lay hand upon the "Sonargöltr" — the sacrificial boar — to swear an oath for future deeds.
> Or raise the "bragarfull", the ceremonial vow-cup, in the act of "heitstrenging", proclaiming his promise before the hall.
- When those vows were fulfilled, they were not hidden — they were "boasted" with pride, witnessed in the sacred "Symbel",
and sealed with the mead horn passed hand to hand.

We are your witness and we have heard your oaths.
We will wait to see you raise your mead horn for toasts/cheers and boasts of fulfilled oath and future oaths.

Honor vs. Guilt
Action vs. Stagnation
Fulfillment vs. Inaction
Deeds bound by sacred oath vs. Passive Faith

honor, witnessed action, and earned pride
Christian doctrine shifted focus to guilt, internal sin, and passive salvation
Legacy vs. Waiting.

>>518973968
> Christianity, by contrast
- acts as an anti-human control mechanism—a perverse mockery of what was once sacred.
It preaches pacifism, passivity, and submission, while stripping away sacrifice, honor, and active engagement with the divine.

Christianity, from its earliest widespread forms, often acted as a tool of social control—imposing strict rules, heavy tithes, and limiting freedoms.
The average Christian was mostly confined to tending small farms under heavy taxation and ecclesiastical authority,
leaving little room for active, honorable engagement with the divine or community beyond what the Church allowed.

It wasn’t just a “modern” phenomenon — passivity, submission, and meekness were systemically encouraged for centuries
as a way to maintain order and church power.

>>518973846
>We do it through the power of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
no, God does it himself.
>We only do the good works that were prepared for use to do in advance.
God does them as well.
>We are here to make things better, and not to make things worse.
the bible doesnt teach that things will get better, it teaches the complete opposite.

you are too human focused. we exist in fallen flesh that is by nature at enmity with God. nothing we can do as human can please God. God is the sovereign that does all things. the works that were prepared for us are not something we do ourselves.

>>518972679
And so do the ancestral religions of White people preach the difference being they do not tolerate and are not easy to be subverted like Christianity and they have blood and soil mentality. Christians literally left Globohomo to take over with all of their teaching, take a look at Japan there is literally not even one single Christian country that achieved their levels of law, order, ecology and traditionalism and you literally can't brainwash those people like Christians.

White people do have a similar religion like Vedicism which unlike Christians they're imposing and not tolerant and in some things are similar to Japanese as Buddhism was influenced by Vedics

>>518973846
to back myself up with scripture

1 Thessalonians 5:3
3 While people are saying, “There is peace and security,” then sudden destruction will come upon them as labor pains come upon a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.

John 16:1-3
16 “I have said all these things to you to keep you from falling away. 2 They will put you out of the synagogues. Indeed, the hour is coming when whoever kills you will think he is offering service to God. 3 And they will do these things because they have not known the Father, nor me.

>>518968709
>70% of the Bible is just history verifiable through non-Biblical testimonies and archeology.
yeah, especially all the kingdoms that the Jews conqured and massacred in the Palestine, while being a shithole village at the time. Armies of 600k jews rising up to fight, only to turn out to be non-existent after 2-3 pages. Then it's 300k armed jews again. Then they're conqured again. Then they marry 1000 princesses of kindgoms no one heard about. Bible doesn't even name pharaons of Egypt it mentions, because that would prove jewish fairytales phony. Totally verifiable history.
> 20% is just axiom where there is no 3rd party testimonies nor archeological evidence
Absence of the geological evidence of the Flood is still evidence, you retard.
>The rest is wisdom, poetry, insight, knowledge, and commandment.

Did you even read the Old Testament? What insights did you meet there, despite many ways of bloodmixing, killing innocent men for their pretty wives, adultery? Do you need knowledge on how jews trick goyim, trick each other and even trick their god? Do you need the wisdom about gods who command to wage wars not sparing a single women, elder or child of the enemy?

>>518971781
And where were those earlier copies copied from? The evidence stops there. There is simply no way to verify the manuscripts as being unchanged, and neither for any sort of commentary as you claimed. Christianity is epistemologically weak.

>>518974178
>no, God does it himself.
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

> it teaches the complete opposite.
No it doesn't. Yes, following Jesus will bring about suffering, but the ultimate goal is to bring the Kingdom.(Lord's Prayer and Great Commision)

>you are too human focused.
I wonder if Jesus would be accused of that? After all, he did take on our flesh and suffer for our transgressions. There must be something to this human condition that is important.

>>518969276
There are only 3 that predate Christ: Dead Sea Scrolls, Kete Hinnom Silver Scrolls, and Nash Papyrus. None vary.

>>518973685
>completely false,
>no evidence for such a ludicrous claims exist

The Bible

>>518973764
False, europe would have been muslim already if it wasnt for the christian buffer countries. Here in the balkans faith kept us united in wars against ottomans and was an amazing population control tool. This is why we still have a high percentage of christians here.

>>518974485

> vedic

shut up gypsy pajeet.

>>518973846
>then our nations

What do you think of what Jesus said?

>(John 18:36) ...“My kingdom is no part of this world. If my kingdom were part of this world, my attendants WOULD HAVE FOUGHT that I should not be delivered up to the Jews. But, as it is, my kingdom is not from this source.”

>>518973384
>the true Church and true Kingdom are not visible by human eyes for now, but will be established in the second coming.

You're half right. The true church is visible right now, but God’s kingdom won't take over until Armageddon.

>>518973411
This is not divide and conquer, I don't want no fight between White Christians or any other White nationalist, I want it to be revaluated and incorporated within a synthesis of religion one which can unite all the White people and keep them away from having any tie with that Gehenna of region of Middle East or any other non-White civilization which has Christianity as main faith and even have closer ties with East Asians as they all along the history had been truly proved they're our greatest allies

>>518974962
Look dude. You obviously are new to the study of the ancient world. I suggest you look into how evidence is collected and what is considered reliable when we are talking about things happening over a millennia ago. The make believe standards that you are holding will end up dismissing all of ancient history as merely unconfirmed conspiracies.

>>518975208
>which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
cool. but its God who initiates the good works. how would you otherwise know what he prepared for you?

>Yes, following Jesus will bring about suffering, but the ultimate goal is to bring the Kingdom.
satan will establish his kingdom first, then the second coming will occur from God in heaven.
the great commission is to disciple the disciples so they are not deceived by doctrines of demons.
thinking humanity can recreate eden on earth is a doctrine of the devil, since it puts man to be God.
>There must be something to this human condition that is important.
to realize we are all sinner, have fallen short of the glory of God, that we need a savior, be humble and yield to his will alone?
apart from that we are nothing but dust that can do nothing.

>>518975227
how is that an evidence for anything ? the most bastardized texts through history on earth, full of foregeries and fake letters of purely political and business purposes

>>518973968
>Christians merely copied our traditions, cultures, and rituals outright.

Correct which is against the Bible. Therefore, they are not Christians.

>(2 Corinthians 6:14-17) Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers. For what fellowship do righteousness and lawlessness have? Or what sharing does light have with darkness? 15 Further, what harmony is there between Christ and Beli·al? Or what portion does a faithful person have with an unbeliever? 16 And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: “I shall reside among them and walk among [them], and I shall be their God, and they will be my people.” 17 “‘Therefore get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take YOU in.’”

>>518975456
>The true church is visible right now
its not. its the same bs that all denomination spout, "we are the true Church of Christ" when its the complete opposite.
there is neither wrinkle or spot on the wedding dress of the Church of Jesus.

>>518975442
Vedics have nothing to do with Pajeets, Vedics migrated from Pontic-Caspian Steppe and took over Pajeet lands imposing their own culture, religion and language there

>>518975586
Here>>518968709>>518967215
>>518969021

>>518969934

This is just we wuz cope for krauts who don't know their own history. Pajeets are actually the most closely related to ancient yamnaya genetically and culturally. Whites are the admixed race and whatever good qualities you have come from the western european hunter gatherer populations.

>>518975676
The Bible determines who the true sect is. Anyone that follows the Bible to a T. The Bible determines who the correct followers are and who are counterfeit. If any "Christianity" believes in:

>Trinity
>Jesus is God
>Hell
>Immortal Soul
>Getting involved in politics
>military services
>voting
>taking office
>Christmas
>Pagan holidays
>Censor Gods name
>refuse to preach
>evolution
>faith without works
>Apostolic Succession
>miracles
>healing
>tithing
>mass
>refuse political neutrality
>predestination

Then they are not Christians. The Bible is against all that. So 99.99% of all sects are counterfeit. Almost all these beliefs originated in Ancient Babylon before the confusion of languages. Once the languages were confused everyone took these beliefs with them around the world.

>>518966862 (OP)
Will you godless kikes please just shit the fuck uo already and kill yourselves?

>>518975731

So the ancient jeets used to live in Armenia. Cool fact, doesn't make them not jeets. Whites are an arctic population (hence hyperborea) that moved south to form the western european hunter gatherer genotype. All the jeetshit culturally and genetically is either cultural diffusion or the result of some mongol-slav style raping.

>>518975775
what do you mean, "here"
get your point across, substantiate a fucking argument on your own if youre even capable without copy pasting pictures and memes as if judaic brainwashing is all that exist in your brain.
Nothing about these predates the well established origins, history and culture of my people.

>>518975953

You worship kike god

>>518975456
Yes, his Kingdom is beyond this world but that doesn't mean that we are not supposed to fulfill the great commision. It's hard to take you seriously knowing what I know about your cult.

>>518975565
>but its God who initiates the good works.
Feels like you are arguing just to argue. This is a very pedantic point.

> ... we are sinners... need a savior... be humble and yield to his will alone?
Amen. But the great commission still looms and we must follow his will alone. So I will “Go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything that I(Jesus) have commanded you."

>>518975869
>>Trinity
>>Jesus is God
>>Hell
>>miracles
>>healing
>>predestination
these are all in the bible.

what sets the true Church apart is the keeping of the commandments. the believers that remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy on the 7th day and not the 1st.

>>518976346
>believers that remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy on the 7th day and not the 1st.
So are you an SDA? Just curious. I used to be one as well.

>>518973846
>>518974564
I don't even mean to be rude or crass towards christian conservatives, because imo most of you do align with right-wing/nationalist sentiment, but the argument you two are having with eachother is like a picture-perfect embodiment of exactly why and how christianity is so fucking subversive towards european interests.
The american christian asserts christian nationalism as the path forward, only to be immediately backstabbed by his christian "brother", and then you both backpedal into an argument over whether "works" in the real world matter or not, while both subliminally agreeing on the actually relevant point, namely that the future of european nations and peoples is fundamentally irrelevant when compared to the ephemeral "kingdom of god" after the supposed end times.

I hate to bring it up since it's such a stupid glowniggery gotcha, but it really just always goes back to ye same olde question:
>White, non-christian europe?
or
>Christion, non-white/mutted europe?
I really have no problem with Christians practicing their faith within their own communities, and in fact I agree with alot of your moral beliefs, but how you truthfully feel about this question is really the only way to determine whether you should be permitted any sort of political power over people's (europeans) affairs outside of your own.
You don't have to answer it btw, just consider the ramifications.

>>518975227
None vary as in they are all textually identical? Do you have a source for that? Brief research indicates they are definitely not identical to the letter, having different ordering of verses and putting different verses into different books.

>>518976177
>that doesn't mean that we are not supposed to fulfill the great commision.

What is that great commission?

>>518976346
>these are all in the bible

No they are not

>>518975505
That's exactly what I'm asserting. Most of ancient history is extremely unverifiable and shaky. So what?

>>518975953
the bible is the only book that has been proven to be historically accurate.

i mean, it's literally the only book that has been proven to be historically accurate.

it's literally the only book that has ever been proven to be historically accurate.

>>518976177
>Feels like you are arguing just to argue.
because one of the great deceptions of satan is that you "must do" something. the best examples is the roman church with all its rituals and pagan practices. doing for the sake of doing but knowing if they do the will of God.
waiting for the Lord is a thing.

when God addressed me, out of his sovereign initiation, I knew instinctively and without a doubt what he wanted me to do. everything after that was one big roller coaster ride.

>So I will “Go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything that I(Jesus) have commanded you."
may God bless you in your works of pulling souls from the clutches of satan.
and remember the sabbath and keep it holy.

>>518975775
What this image fails to mention is that the original manuscript of Acts is in Greek and uses the word kyrios. The JW translation is a theological decision, not a historical one. Historically, Acts used kyrios. This harms the JW claim to truth.

>>518976495
This is a true, unsolvable problem for Christian Nationalists. There literally is no answer. They are ideologically hypocritical.

>>518976495
I think you confuse a minor discussion over details over the overarching fact that we agree with one another.

>>518976546
KHSS is two small rolled-up silver amulets found in Jerusalem. They contain portions of the Priestly Blessing from the Book of Numbers and are considered the oldest surviving biblical texts, dating to the late 7th or early 6th century BCE.

Nash Papyrus containing the Ten Commandments and the Shema prayer dating to the 2nd century BCE.

Sure you might find a misspelled word or missing word, or substituted word here and there but they are exactly the same

>>518966862 (OP)
jews are a core tenant of rightism

>>518976594
>No they are not
not in yours maybe.

>>518967507
>earliest NT copy is 40 years from original
bullshit, who u fooling faggot? all the manuscripts from the second century are tiny fragments. Its only till the third and 4th century do you have enough material to construct full books from the bible(but still not the entire bible)

>>518976953
>Nash Papyrus

>>518976495
>You don't have to answer it btw, just consider the ramifications.
Glad you put this in. because I don't really want to answer this question for the thousandth time. I got a question for you. What is the future of the European nations if there is nothing that binds them together. Because being European alone isn't going to cut it. Don't have to answer. Just something to think about.

>>518976817
The Tosefta, a written collection of oral laws that was completed by about 300 C.E., says with regard to Christian writings that were burned on the Sabbath:
>“The books of the Evangelists and the books of the minim[thought to be Jewish Christians] they do not save from a fire. But they are allowed to burn where they are, they and the references to the Divine Name which are in them.”

This same source quotes Rabbi Yosé the Galilean, who lived at the beginning of the second century C.E., as saying that on other days of the week,

>“one cuts out the references to the Divine Name which are in them [understood to refer to the Christian writings] and stores them away, and the rest burns.”

The Jews admitted that the Jewish Christian not only had their own books between the 1st and 2nd century but those books also had Gods name in it at the time. The Bible was done and collected by the 1st century.

>>518976953
JWanon...that literally means it's a textual variant...and anyway Nash Papyrus is significantly smaller than the Dead Sea Scrolls, so it doesn't confirm the rest of the Scrolls which aren't included in Nash Papyrus

>>518975777
>>518976050
WHG were in southern Europe during the Ice Age and moved northward as the ice retreated not other way, there is no jeetshit because jeets are nothing more than an ancient Brazil and a huge part of their culture was influenced by foreign migrations into the region. Also Mitanni weren't jeets nor anything related to Indo-Europeans, the Indo ain't standing for being jeets it stands for the region they settled in.

>>518976642
Then you just disproved everything the every existed before the time period you deem verifiable. Good luck with that, truth seeking scholar.

You HAVE to send more money to Israel
MORE MONEY MORE MONEY MORE MONEY
DONT THINK GOYIM JUST SEND MORE MONEY

>>518977099
>JWanon...that literally means it's a textual variant...

That's fine. As long as the primary narrative doesn't change it's exactly the same.

>>518977080
The testimony of two Jews, from a century or more later, who were and are notorious for lying and plotting against Jesus, should be trusted about what the Jewish Christians were doing at their time? And so much trusted that their testimony should be the basis of a core tenet of your theology? Is this epistemologically strong?

religion is basically, choose your favorite demon/pokemon and roll with it.

>>518966862 (OP)
It's a redirection of the disillusionment the people now feel. It has been promoted lately to funnel those disillusioned with Civic nationalism into an emotional trap: they have lost loyalty to one abstraction, so they promote love for another; their minds have become sharper, so they attack them from a different angle. It is more insidious, harder to shake, and still serves the ultimate goal of blending the races.

>>518977174
It doesn't disprove those things. But it means there is no proof. Those are two different concepts. Basing your religion on essentially paper-thin proof is dangerously irresponsible.

>>518977258
If only the primary narrative matters, then does it matter if the name Yahweh is changed or not? It's just one word. This question is rhetorical obviously. It's a contradiction in your principles I'd appreciate you to explain to me.

>>518977258
Also, the second half of my post you chose to ignore. The manuscripts predating Jesus also significantly contradict later manuscripts like the Septuagint or the Masoretic Text, which the modern Bible is based on. The point stands that the epistemology of the Christians regarding Biblical authenticity is weak.

>>518977462
It's credible because they slipped in a fact while opposing the Christians.

>>518977616
>It doesn't disprove those things
So you're saying absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Interesting. I thought that was your entire argument against the my paper thin faith. I guess it's time for self-reflection.

>>518977718
In the Bible. It's true that the names were say in English were not the original pronunciations back then. He doesn't care about the pronunciation. Only that you use it, vindicate it, glorify it, and help him fulfill prophecy about his name:

>(Ezekiel 38:23) And I shall certainly magnify myself and sanctify myself and make myself known before the eyes of many nations; and they will have to know that I am Jehovah.’

>(Ezekiel 25:17) And I will execute in them great acts of vengeance, with raging reproofs; and they will have to know that I am Jehovah when I bring my vengeance on them.”’”

>(Ezekiel 36:23) ‘And I shall certainly sanctify my great name, which was being profaned among the nations, which YOU profaned in the midst of them; and the nations will have to know that I am Jehovah,’ is the utterance of the Sovereign Lord Jehovah, ‘when I am sanctified among YOU before their eyes.

Words are to convey thoughts, not to worry about pronunciations. Jehovah is more than just a pronunciation. It is a history, a reputation, a meaning that describes the person of that name. That person will be known to all right before Armageddon. THE Happening of happenings.

>>518976918
Personally I'm still aligned and sympathetic with them. I'm all for them having full sovereignty over their own communities ala Orania or the Amish.
>>518976950
I don't think that it's a minor confusion.
If you truly believe that earthly works do not matter, only the kingdom and word of god, only your internal intuition and connection to god. Then it's inevitable you will not eventually run into a situation where you decide to put your god over your kin, or even your own family.
>>518977012
Before christianity, europeans were bound together by family, blood, soil, and faith in their gods. It worked for all of human history, barring its replacement with christianity for the last 1700 years. Why should it not still work today?

>>518978149
>It worked for all of human history,
It failed. I couldn't stand against Christianity. And yet you think that somehow it will work now?

>>518978149
you put God above everything, doesnt mean you forsake your family or kin. you are to be an example to them, to be a good imager of God for which you were created.

>>518977862
The oldest complete Masoretic manuscript is the Leningrad Codex, which dates from 1008/1009 C.E. However, in the middle of the 20th century, some 220 Biblical manuscripts or fragments were discovered among the Dead Sea Scrolls. Those Biblical manuscripts were more than a thousand years older than the Leningrad Codex. A comparison of the Dead Sea Scrolls with the Leningrad Codex confirms a vital point: While the Dead Sea Scrolls contain some variations in wording, none of those variations affect the message itself.

>>518977983
Okay...so one word changed CAN be significant. This contradicts what you said earlier about the Nash Papyrus.

>>518978149
>europeans were bound together by family, blood, soil, and faith in their gods.

Are you kidding? Before Christianity, Europeans were divided by warring tribes. The only reason why it stopped is because of being conquered by the Greek Empire and the Roman Empire.

>>518978149
I agree people should be able to be with people like them...but at least be honest about it and have a consistent philosophy...

>>518978149
>europeans were bound together by family, blood, soil, and faith in their gods
bullshit, we had warring tribes and were split into germanic tribes and its still so to this day to some extent.
ossies, wessis, schwaben, die bayern, norddeutsche, sachsen, berliner, die kölner vs düsseldorfer etc.
now take the BRD away and travel back 2000 years.

>>518975777
> #1Corded Ware
~75%
Central & Northern Europe
Closest European descendant

1. Swedes
2. Lithuanians
3. Estonians
4. Latvians
5. Finns (though with added Siberian influence)
6. Norwegians
7. Icelanders
8. Danes
9. Poles
10. Belarusians
11. Russians (especially in the northwest)
12. Ukrainians
13. Northern Germans

> 35–50% Yamnaya-derived ancestry on average (through the Corded Ware culture)
- The rest is mostly European Neolithic farmer and some Western Hunter-Gatherer

These descend heavily from the Corded Ware culture, which itself is largely a Yamnaya offshoot.
Corded Ware migrants moved rapidly into Scandinavia, the Baltics, and Central Europe around 2900 BCE.
In places like Sweden, this population replaced 70–90% of the earlier Neolithic gene pool in just a few generations.

Kindly stop stealing ancestry, history and culture in your own spiritual crisis, youre acting just like the retarded christians.

>>518966862 (OP)
A lot of christians are untermensch, who would be a lot more dignified as drug addicts or dead. Instead they delude themselves into thinking they matter as much or more than normal people and stick around as bots and slaves.

>>518978367
If you want to claim this is evidence for some general common truth being retained, then I don't disagree with you...but that shows that the letter by letter Bible today is not the direct Word of God, it is only an approximation of the genuine Word. Agreed?

>>518967799
That's exactly why the western civilization is corrupted and not worth saving

>>518977899
Sorry I don't understand your point. The Jews said something you axiomatically assumed, therefore this specific account from them is credible? That can't be the argument.

>>518966862 (OP)
Christianity, or Jesus, is the embodiment of brotherhood and its promotion.
Regardless of whether it gave rise to the Bible or various Christian communities, what was important was the promotion of brotherhood.

That's why Christianity has been so successful.

Brotherhood, or as we would say on /pol, frenhood.

>>518966862 (OP)
> here's why these books I've never read are wrong

>>518978968
Various religions promote common brotherhood with people like yourself. The question is which one is correct.

>>518978367
The oldest Septuagint texts are older than the oldest Dead Sea scrolls.

>>518979057
Each is correct in conveying the brotherhood. They simply do it in different ways, and the story of Jesus is one of the most successful ways of conveying the brotherhood.

>>518978968
false history and make believe, not even worth speculating.

1600 years worth of persecution and still failed to christianize europe even after stealing our culture and rewriting rituals in chiristian names and church figures.
Theres absolutely nothing about brotherhood in christianity since its devoid of honor and glory, such elements was forced in the synthesis of subverting Germanic culture.

Stop trying to destroy history in your own spiritual crisis.

>>518978332
It became dominant because the rulers and elites saw it as a good tool to gain more power, unite people and form ties with others. Now days because everybody knows how to read, write and has a very large source of information and there are already subversive agents within the church Christianity will never ever be the same nor have the same influence as it had once, it's pretty much useless.

>>518979193
The problem with saying each is correct is that it fails to take into account the unfren-lyness between different groups. They teach opposing teachings, and therefore are incompatible with each other.
I agree that a brotherhood is necessary part of a good religion, but it isn't the only part.

>>518966862 (OP)
Glad you admit it's simple and obvious enough for a child to understand it. As God intended

> Matthew 18:3 and said, “Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.

You're of course wrong though about someone coming up with it, because you're utterly ignorant. No one would've dreamed up a religion about worshiping a Jewish peasant who died in the most embarrassing way possible. Also Christian morality completely upheaved western morality. You're simply a fish blind to water. Its won so much it seems like common sense to you.

>>518979345
Brotherhood is the only reason, because it unites us men again. The biggest problem in this world is the conflict between us men, which is fueled by different reasons (women).
Only the brotherhood between us men allows kingdoms to arise.

>>518979421
An angry Jew who hated Jesus would be the exact kind of person to come up with it.

>>518978332
>The collapse and destruction of the most successful
This is not the gotcha you think it is. Its like saying communism is good because it "conquered the Russian Tsar.
>>518978359
And if god tells you to sacrifice your first-born son like he asked Abraham?
I know, it was just a test and he didn't actually go through with it.
But do you realize that, to an outsider like me, the fact you would even have to consider something like this as a moral conundrum, makes it impossible for me to fully trust you?
>>518978638
>>518978609
>we had warring tribes
So? We've been warring tribes under christendom as well. Then warring nations. And although its a somewhat petty argument to make, our wars under christendom have been far more deadly, from the 30-year-war onwards, especially WW1 and WW2. And to top it off, there are still literal warring tribes under christendom in africa, today. And two orthodox christian nations warring in Russia vs Ukraine.

>>518975777
utter falsehoods kys

>>518979308
I mean this in the nice way possible. Cope more. That's all your whining sounds like. The Christian Church still exists after all this time and will continue to. It's almost like it has a divine mandate to stick around. Are there any of those old European cults that are still around with any influence today?

>>518979621
Ah yes I also start religions revolving around the worship people I don't like

>>518979621
>video games isn't anywhere on the list

It's official. Girls love gamers.

>>518979889
A Jew wouldn't like to convince Christians to worship a Jew?

>>518979982
Online-debatebros...we're never gonna make it...

>>518978332
Your argument was that previous values were successful. I gave a powerful counterpoint. Obviously might doesn't make right. But it does when you argument is "blood and soil."

>>518979696
>And if god tells you to sacrifice your first-born son like he asked Abraham?
well, did God sacrifice his Son on the Cross for YOU so your sins can be forgiven?

>>518975290
thats only made up in your own head, it took christians hundreds of years before responding with any kind of efficacy at all and the crusades didnt even end it completely, almost like theyre all collaborating like three parasites sucking the life out of the planet while pretending to be any different.

abrahamic bullshit, germanic people wouldve been quick to respond like we've always been if it even got close to the north even under persecutions lasting 1600 fucking years

>>518980036
Yes if you knew anything about them

>>518980343
The fact that Jews believe when their Messiah comes that the whole world of Goyim will be their slaves? That they perceive non-Jews as beasts? Yah I can see that.

>>518980485
Jews don't want a man being worshipped lol. Christianity has been one of the largest sources of antisemitism in the world, you're just ignorant

>>518980860
Christianity is also one of the biggest creators of Zionists. Many evangelicals quote the Bible to justify unending support of the state of Israel and Jews. It's ignorant to ignore this fact.

>>518966862 (OP)
But it doesn't. It revolves around the sexual whims of you pussy ass Israeli motherfucking pieces of shit. Why lie about it? Oh that's right, I forgot you jews are incapable of telling the truth about anything and that's the world hates your guts.

>>518966862 (OP)
Jesus Christ is the Truth, the Path, and the Way.

>>518981012
That's a recent development of the last few centuries, we're talking about its beginnings 2000 years ago

>>518980181
I don't know what your God did or did not do. I'm not trying to have a theological debate with you. What I'm trying to tell you and the other christian is that by placing the importance of your faith ontologically above that of your family/kin/nation, you must be considered by nationalists as a potential defector, because if push ever truly came to shove, you would place faith above nation.
To be clear, I'm not saying that (you), specifically, are a traitor. But any sort of serious right-wing movement that aims to restore/save our civilization will have to eventually come to terms with the christianity vs nationalism question, and so far, most of the evidence points towards christianity (at large) being a weak link.

>>518981411
It's a cope to call early christianity antisemitic. From the outside all of it was seen as jewish infighting.

>>518981644
newsflash, the fake christian nationalism is the system that is coming.
this whole attack on western civilization was created by the vatican so they can be the good guys and the nations fall back under their control.

>>518978826
Sure

>>518978929
It proves God's name was in the New Testament.

>>518979696
>, our wars under christendom have been far more deadly, from the 30-year-war onwards, especially WW1 and WW2.

Agreed but that proves they were never Christians to begin with. "Love your enemy" remember?

>>518981644
Yes, theres no such thing as christian nationalism, they are the first universalism, judaism and communism.

they are the first greatest problem standing in the way of European sovereignty, the biggest blockade and pin in the wheel in all of history.

>>518968436
cool cope, may we see a talking snake to confirm your claim?

>>518981968
More like Christian globalism.

>>518979421
A child cannot understand whatever the Bible says, a part of them and the core message maybe but the rest no, it's about all the ideas in Bible are made up human horror story like and less helpful explaining you about reality, life, death and after life, if Bible was truly the word of God Bible would've look much more different and better and by now the world would've been much more different especially when you got power hungry narcissist elites who would do anything to gain access into heaven.

>>518981859
The NT speaks a ton about the Jews being false Jews, a synagogue of Satan, about circumcision cutting you off from Christ, about the kingdom of heaven being removed from the Jews and given to the gentiles. The Jews changed their theology to separate from Christianity, etc. They weren't friends

>>518982256
The world does look completely different now if you actually study history. We don't have gladiator games anymore in the West, post birth abortion is gone, the common practice of pederasty is now condemned as pedophilia, humans have rights, slavery was extinguished, hospitals and science were developed, etc.

>>518981862
I don't disagree with you there. I don't want to be ruled by the vatican either.

>>518981899
>you see, they weren't "real" christians, therefore it doesnt count
Do you realize how this is almost one to one the exact same pipul/cope employed by marxists and communists?

>>518981968
>they are the first universalism, judaism and communism
I think Platonism was arguably the first. Though I suppose that's why Platonism and Judaism/Christianity are so closely linked.

>>518981644
I already made my mine. Nationalism, far-right Nazi bullshit has no place in Christianity.
Dues vult

>>518982710
youre already under vatican rule. try doing your shopping on the SUNday. :^)

>>518982299
referring to biblical sources as evidence for fucking anything, what a retard

>>518982165
>may we see a talking snake to confirm your claim?

Here
https://youtu.be/H_VoI4LWiDI?si=J-Juai1NYztwG_ws

>>518982710
>Do you realize how this is almost one to one the exact same pipul/cope employed by marxists and communists?

Yes but Christianity has proof

>(Matthew 5:44) However, I say to YOU: Continue to love YOUR enemies and to pray for those persecuting YOU;

>(Matthew 26:52) Then Jesus said to him: “Return your sword to its place, for all those who take the sword will perish by the sword.

>(John 18:36) Jesus answered: “My kingdom is no part of this world. If my kingdom were part of this world, MY ATTENDANTS WOULD HAVE FOUGHT THAT I SHOULD NOT BE DELIVERED UP TO THE JEWS. But, as it is, my kingdom is not from this source.”

>(Romans 12:17-19) Return evil for evil to no one. Provide fine things in the sight of all men. 18If possible, as far as it depends upon YOU, be peaceable with all men. 19Do not avenge yourselves, beloved, but yield place to the wrath; for it is written: “Vengeance is mine; I will repay, says Jehovah.”

>(Romans 12:20) But, “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by doing this you will heap fiery coals upon his head.”

>(Proverbs 25:21) If the one hating you is hungry, give him bread to eat; and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink.

>(Proverbs 24:17) When your enemy falls, do not rejoice; and when he is caused to stumble, may your heart not be joyful,

Any so-called Christian that raises a fist or sword towards his enemy is not a Christian.

>>518982848
Retard if you wanna know what the earliest Christians believed you read the earliest sources. Insane how dumb you are

>>518978332
>They invade the nervous system of the host species, driving it slowly insane. After achieving total control and compelling the host to climb to a great height, they commit a murder-suicide, killing both the host and themselves. This results in a massive release of spores, a diaspora that seeks new hosts to infect. The spores replicate inside these hosts and, once more, eventually kill both host and parasite to produce new fruiting bodies, continuing the cycle of infection and destruction. What am I describing? Cordyceps, or jews?

>>518981899
The testimony of two Jews over a century later is not at all strong enough evidence to conclusively claim YHWH was in the Bible. If Jews were an authority you'd have to reject Jesus and believe he is burning in Hell per the Talmud. And many more than two Jews believe that.

>>518982539
Sodom and Gomorrah were erased for being homos, our world is way more worse than them in terms of degeneracy and blasphemy yet nothing happens and we've been like that for hundreds of years, Vatican ain't doing nothing to change that and nobody from the rich and power even dares to raise up even though this could bring them even way more power and a ticket to heaven yet again nothing because they know it well Christianity is and was a tool of control not the truth.

>>518981899
>Sure
So you agree there is no evidence for the JW doctrine of Providential Preservation? If so, this has cascading implications for Christianity. If not, then where is the evidence?

>>518966862 (OP)
>Why should Right Wing revolve around Christianity Anonymous
To serve Jew of course.

>>518982816
>youre already under vatican rule
I'm very aware, I live in bavaria, lmao.

>>518982918
That's all well and good for you, anon. But if your kingdom is truly not of this world, I need you to stay the fuck out of politics and to not undermine european sovereignty. That is all I ask.

>>518982768
You need to go back, jeet.

>>518983399
While minor textual variations (scribal differences in spelling, word order, etc.) exist across the thousands of ancient manuscripts, the doctrine affirms that these do not compromise the essential integrity, reliability, or doctrines of the Scriptures.

>>518983229
The sexual revolution is just a recent blip in history reverting to prechristian practices. For the longest time its been way better. It'll get ironed out in the coming centuries since they don't reproduce as much as the religious who condemn such practices.

>>518967799
>Look at the places where atheists dominate.
Like Brazil or Mexico?
USA woudl literally die because of Mexican Christians immigration.
Sentenced to death by Christianity.

>>518983640
>need you to stay the fuck out of politics and to not undermine european sovereignty. That is all I ask.

That's exactly what JW are known for. It's a sin for us to get involved in politics, voting, protest, revolution, war and riots. That's actually a core tenant of Christianity THAT IS NOT PRACTICED by "Christians."

>>518981411
>That's a recent development of the last few centuries, we're talking about its beginnings 2000 years ago
>sells you into debt slavery to Jews
>chops of your head if you dare to say one word against

Keep talking shit and God will send me to clean this shit up

>>518983640
>I live in bavaria
pretty comfy compared to NRW

>>518983701
It's not just that...complete books are missing or added. Verses appearing in one book appear in another. Words missing or added. All it takes is a one word difference to change the meaning of a religion. There are many many more differences between the manuscripts of the Bible. You are seriously underestimating the differences. You have failed to give any compelling evidence for the authenticity of the Bible, which you also admitted is not the exact Word of God.

Wouldn't you prefer the original Hebrew Bible as given to Moses? What about another Scripture given to a different prophet? Why follow the Bible if you had access to those things?

>>518966862 (OP)
Christcucks lack critical thinking skills. If they didn't, they'd find their way out of the religion over time having been faced with contradiction after contradiction where they're told very weak cope to try and get around them. Since they can't recognize this clearly isn't the word of God via this self evident dynamic, they are convinced they will go to hell is they denounce it. They're irrational low IQ people. Whites just have to ignore them and tolerate the ones that are at least redpilled on the JQ.

>>518984505
>Christians lack critical thinking skills. If they didn't, they'd find their way out of the religion over time having been faced with contradiction after contradiction where they're told very weak cope to try and get around them
like what?
help me break free from my chains!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy8kmNEo1i8

>>518984461
>NRW
Ouch. Stay safe out there, mein Bruder.

>>518984660
>like what?

>>518966862 (OP)
Each people creates their God in their own image.
Shit people = shit God

>>518985058
God dying in place of you for your sins so you are not judged by God for your sins is the entire point.

>>518985058
>armchair psychology (i would've done it like xyz instead of the way God did)
that's worthless.
do you have any actual arguments and not cartoons?
help me break free from the shackles of Christianity!!!

>>518985243
Why does God have to die? Can't He just...change the rules? Why is this the greatest good for how to set morality and justice in the universe?

>>518984660
>like what?
Like I said, you have flimsy cope for all Biblical contradictions. But for anyone else reading, here is an example.
>Jesus: No jot or tiddle of torah law will be invalidated until heaven and earth pass away; until all is fulfilled (all would include end times, of course). He who teaches to not keep even the least of the law is in sin and will be call least in the kingdom. Matthew 5:18
>Paul: You don't have to have your foreskin circumcised anymore (literally the number one cornerstone law in torah law) Galatians 5:2-6 and 1 Corinthians 7:18-19
>Jesus: You know what fuck the law, eye for an eye is over with. And divorce law is now different. Matthew 5:38–39 and Matthew 5:31–32

>>518985364
i'm sure german anon will give you a whole Biblical based spiel, but the thing is, "¯\_(ツ)_/¯" also defeats your attack.
try harderrrrr!
c'mon man.
maybe something like the evidentiary argument from gratuitous animal suffering.

>>518984255
says the mutt who gets the yamnaya ancestry wrong

>>518985364
sin results in death. its either all humans that have to die or God that dies for his creation.
>Can't He just...change the rules?
he doesnt change. sin results in death. Jesus had to die and he knew it.
>Why is this the greatest good for how to set morality and justice in the universe?
we might give our life for good and righteous people, God gave his life for sinners, and all humans are sinners.

>>518985058
Not a very good example. Get rid of that cause it makes christcucks look good. Use good examples. This one is easily explained as God following his own rules because he's just. Understand the lore of the ransom in the crucifixion before trying to use it as fodder. Much better examples to go with.

>>518985467
Jesus said the Law stands until fulfilled, He fulfilled it.
paul teaches the implications of that fulfillment.
that's not a contradiction!

please try harder so i can be an atheist!!

>>518985243
Sounds pretty dumb to me. Why does God need to die to forgive the mistakes I made.

Why do I need a God to forgive me for my mistakes in the first place?
>>518985337
>do you have any actual arguments
See above

>>518985644
>Not a very good example
I thinks it's a very good example of God fucking up and being a victim of causality like the rest of us.

>>518985765
“fulfill” (plēroō in Greek) means “to bring to fullness,” “to complete,” or “to properly interpret.” He was saying he came to live it perfectly. In his next sentence he said it will be in place until heaven and earth pass away, until all is completed. Which of course includes end times. That's why he was using the parallel timescale of heaven and earth lasting the same amount of time. He was not telling people about the eternal nature of torah law and how not one jot or tiddle will pass away for two more weeks until he gets crucified. That's absurd.

>>518986127
>I thinks it's a very good example of God fucking up and being a victim of causality like the rest of us.
It's a good example if you're 17. You may think it's a ridiculous story, and it is, but it's not a contradiction. So you're illustrating to christcucks you can't find a contradiction, just a part you think is goofy.

>>518985337
>help me break free from the shackles of Christianity!!!
Why? Follow what you like.

>>518967215
>earth is a sphere Isiah 40:22
Why are you lying? You know that’s not what it says and yet you still lie? Post nose.

>>518986189
>It's a good example if you're 17
I'm 40 and its still a good example
>but it's not a contradiction
It contradicts a supposed omniscient being

>>518986127
>Why does God need to die to forgive the mistakes I made.
>Why do I need a God to forgive me for my mistakes in the first place?
what can you offer to remedy the damage that was done?

>>518986274
>It contradicts a supposed omniscient being
No it doesn't. God can choose to follow his own rules. That's why the example is weak.

>>518986285
>what can you offer to remedy the damage that was done?
What damage?.

If I make mistake, I own up to them. Make amends, leave from them and move on.

No existential crisis needed

>>518986138
"fulfill" means completion, not perpetuation.
Jesus did fulfill the Law, hence the veil tearing, the new covenant, and paul's teachings.
heaven and earth remain, but the Law's role changed.

>>518986388
>>It contradicts a supposed omniscient being
>No it doesn't
It does or he wouldn't have to send Jesus/Himself to fix a rule he made because he chose shitty people

Here is the biggest reason one should disregard the Bible as being the word of God. According to it, Jesus said he'd be back during the lifetimes of some alive back then with his army of angels and rewards to establish the millennial kingdom on earth. There was no disputing it. Paul believed it so much, he taught others how to act if they were one of the ones still alive when it happened.
>For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.”
Matthew 16:27-28

Christcucks will have to lean on ridiculous "interpretations" like he meant the crucifixion, the transfiguration, or the destruction of the temple. All of which are laughably easy to illustrate is wrong.

>>518986553
>It does or he wouldn't have to
what makes you think He had to? just because He did?

>>518986445
you have nothing to make amends with. and you rack up quite a list of mistakes or sins over your entire life. what happens when you are confronted with all of them once you pass from your material existence?
if you break the law and you are persecuted dont you get yourself a lawyer?

>>518967228
ESL slop. Jesus is King

>>518984488
That's why we look at thousands of manuscripts, papyri to get a general idea of what the primary message is in each verse in the Bible. The best Bibles are based on hundreds of sources. The worst Bibles are based on one.

You are special pleading and moving the goal post.

>>518985364
>Why does God have to die?

God can't die. Jesus died. Jesus and God are not the same person.

>>518986658
>what makes you think He had to?
Because the bible said so

>>518986660
>you have nothing to make amends with
Sure I do, if I wrong someone then it's them I make amends to and then there is myself

>>518986914
cool, how do you make amends with God for all the times you broke his laws?

>>518986623
>Matthew 16:27-28
that was in regards to the transfiguration, which happens a few verses later, not the second coming and end of the world.

>Christians will have to lean on ridiculous "interpretations" like [...] the transfiguration
see 2 Peter 1:16-18

>>518986914
>Because the bible said [God was forced into doing something]
chapter and verse?

>>518986972
That sounds like a personal problem for you.

>>518966862 (OP)
>why does a scam ideology revolve around magical thinkers
You answered your own question

>>518985364
>>518986895
Easy. That's because you don't understand God’s nature. God cannot break his own rules. That's why his name is Jehovah. It means "He Causes to Become." Anything that he says will happen WILL HAPPEN and nothing can or will stop it. That also means he is the fulfiller of all promises made and nothing will stop those promises from coming true.

Why didn't God just destroy Adam, Eve, and Satan and just start all over? Because he told Adam and Eve before they sinned:

>(Genesis 1:28)“Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving upon the earth.”

Even though Adam and Eve sinned his commandment on top HAD TO GO THROUGH. He could not reverse his way out of it. He cannot break his own commandments nor break his own promises nor reverse his own sayings.

>(Isaiah 55:11) so my word that goes forth from my mouth will prove to be. It will not return to me without results, but it will certainly do that in which I have delighted, and it will have certain success in that for which I have sent it.

Because God told Adam and Eve that if they eat the fruit they will positively die they HAD TO DIE. The problem is the rest of us INHERITED that original sin from Adam. The only way for God to get around his own word is by covering that original sin with payment. The problem with that is that God's justice is strict.

>(Exodus 21:23-25) But if a fatal accident should occur, then you must give soul for soul, 24eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25branding for branding, wound for wound, blow for blow.

Since the crime was committed by a PERFECT man then another perfect man had to die to cover that sin.

>(1 Timothy 2:5, 6) For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, 6WHO GAVE HIMSELF A CORRESPONDING RANSOM FOR ALL is what is to be witnessed to at its own

>>518987024
do you think you are not under God?
he is your God, if you like it or not is not up for debate. you dont get to chose.

>>518987013
Galatians 4:4-5 states that God sent his Son, born of a woman and under the law, when the "fullness of time" arrived. This was so Jesus could redeem those under the law and, through him, believers could receive adoption as sons of God

Seems like he had to

>>518986530
Very silly argument, of course, because Jesus wasn't talking about the eternal nature of the law just to cancel it in literally two weeks. But let's go with that. Even if I submit that you're right, and he really was telling everyone about how the law lasts as long as heaven and earth but really he meant it's not relevant anymore in two weeks, he still didn't die on the cross yet when he changed divorce law and changed eye for an eye.

>>518966862 (OP)
The proof is in the pattern.

arguments for atheism:
>the universe is like.. really big, man. if god was real why'd he make the universe so big?
>there's like... 5000 different religions, man. if god was real why'd he make it so hard to find the right one man?
>there's like... lots of suffering and shit. if god was real why'd he allow it?
arguments against atheism:
>preconditions for logic
>causation
>preconditions for science
>ontological grounding for morality
>divine revelation in history

>>518987103
>do you think you are not under God?
Who's God? The one you adopted from someone else?

>>518986973
>Jesus told a crowd of people that some there will live long enough to see him coming with his army of angels and rewards to establish the prophecized millennial kingdom on earth.. but what he REALLY meant is that he was going to immediately turn around in a week to head up a mountain with his three best friends to give them a vision of it.

Like it said. All they have are flimsy copes like these.

>>518987142
>arguments for atheism:
I lack belief in God or gods

It's that simple

>>518987144
the God that made himself known by his Word and his sacrifice for me on the cross.
and I never even had any say in it.

>>518986623
This was fulfilled through the transfiguration of Jesus in the mountain when he took some of the disciples with him. This was just a vision.

>(Matthew 16:28) Truly I say to YOU that there are some of those standing here that will not taste death at all until first they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.”

6 days later...

>(Matthew 17:1, 2) Six days later Jesus took Peter and James and John his brother along and brought them up into a lofty mountain by themselves. 2And he was transfigured before them, and his face shone as the sun, and his outer garments became brilliant as the light.

Both Mark and Luke also linked Jesus’ comment about the Kingdom with the account of the transfiguration. (Mark 9:1-8; Luke 9:27-36) Jesus’ coming in Kingdom power was demonstrated in his transfiguration, his appearing in glory in the presence of the three apostles.

Peter verifies this understanding by speaking of “the power and presence of our Lord Jesus Christ” with regard to his witnessing Jesus’ transfiguration.

>(2 Peter 1:16-18) No, it was not by following artfully contrived false stories that we acquainted YOU with the power and presence of our Lord Jesus Christ, but it was by having become eyewitnesses of his magnificence. 17For he received from God the Father honor and glory, when words such as these were borne to him by the magnificent glory: “This is my son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.” 18Yes, these words we heard borne from heaven while we were with him in the holy mountain.

It was fulfilled in the mountain through the transfiguration

>>518987209
that's not an argument, it's a statement of ignorance.

>>518987279
>for me
Right, the one someone told you about

>>518966862 (OP)
>Bible sounds exactly like human made up stories
"Deny yourself", "pick up your cross and suffer" and "God condescended to us and allowed Himself the worst death for our sake because He just loves us that much" sound like typical stories from those times to you?
Really?

>>518987314
>that's not an argument, it's a statement
It's both
>of ignorance
What ignorance exactly?

>>518987200
>flimsy
>mental gymnastics
>pilpul
all this kind of shit does for me is make it seem like you're saying "okay, that works and can't argue otherwise, but i'm mad about it"

If the Right wants to keep shooting itself in the foot by being christianity, let it. But I don't care any longer if that is the case. Let it crash and burn.

>>518986274
It is. He's just a disingenuous niggerfaggot who doesn't actually care for the truth or intellectual honesty. None of them do. They just like top pretend they do. But only if you instantly agree with them and never, however slight, criticise their beliefs.

>>518986502
It's very simple: national socialism BUT BUT BUT there is no christianity. Countless of people have told you disingenuous niggerfaggots this, yet you curiously keep posting this pic.

So much for "muh troof," I suppose.

>>518987408
Apply this response to
>>518987209

>>518987325
God told me about himself.

>>518987491
Agreed

>>518987517
Cool. Why should I believe you?

>>518985364
>can’t he just change the rules?
>im 8 years old and ive never thought about anything other than material world
You’re a child

>>518987382
>It's both
an argument is a set of premises offered in support of a conclusion.
your statement "i lack belief" is just a conclusion. it's the claim itself, presented without any supporting structure.
to call this an argument is like saying the sentence "i am correct" is a compelling justification for your position.
it's a textbook example of begging the question, it simply asserts the conclusion of what an argument for atheism would be (therefore, i lack belief) without providing reasons for it.

so no, it's not an argument, it's your personal testimony. the "ignorance" is the absence of any justifying reasons for your conclusion.

>>518987566
so you dont want to know your creator?
slave away for 50 years in a decaying body is the height of your existence?

>>518966862 (OP)
they are the only ones having child sorry fedora lord lmao start having kids and maybe you will have a say in the future

>>518987705
>an argument is a set of premises offered in support of a conclusion
I did that
>your statement "i lack belief" is just a conclusion.
It's both

>>518987755
>so you dont want to know your creator?
He's supposed all powerful, he can come to le if he really wants to

>>518987566
>miniature Satan
>checks out
Your nose just came through my screen

>>518987988
>he can come to le if he really wants to
he is kind enough to knock and not kick the door in. better open up as long as you still can. the human body is fragile, shit can go fast.

>>518988180
Bearing a false witness is a sin

>>518988219
>he is kind enough to knock
Cool. I'll be waiting

>>518968436
Nice mental gymnastics, bro
>it's magic!
LOL

>>518987988
you are dumber than shit.
my respect for /pol/ atheists actually went up a smidgen this thread since another one you guys (BhycLOhF) actually bothered to point that out earlier.

>>518966862 (OP)
bible is not a moral book
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opaT5qPgFbA

everything good in christianity was stolen from european pagan culture
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5kHKjuUhrw

christians destroyed the classical world
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5m0-2aoC9I

celsus was right about christians
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTilTcdVAb8

jesus is not a good role model
he was a hippie who hung out with 12 men, never married, never had kids, never invented anything, never cut his hair, never won any battles, never went to the gym, never saved anyone, didn't even check on his mum, stepdad or "gf" after ressurecting
he just scammed people and ruined their lives by telling them to be weak and poor
why should anyone devote their life to such a weak charlatan?

>>518988296
>Cool. I'll be waiting
sounds retarded. but whatever. your problem.

>>518986732
>sticks fingers in ears and yells LALALALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU
convincing anon

>>518967441
>appeal to Pascal's Wager
weak

>>518988381
Like clock work. The leftist side comes out.

>>518988439
>sounds retarded
You're welcome to your personal feelings and opinions

>>518988403
>shills book by a woman
simp
>>518988587
i'm a leftist because i think you're a fucking idiot who doesn't understand basic philosophy, logic, or the english language?

>>518987756
judaism, islam, hinduism all have far higher birthrates, so are they the future?
is the mark of a good religion only it's ability to multiply like a virus and waste natural resources just so you can have 16 children mumbling about the bible when robots and ai are already here

I'm not going to pretend to believe in a fairytale just to have a family
economic factors and crazy women are the main reason nobody is having kids, not religion

>>518988665
>i'm a leftist because
You're emotionally motivated and stunted like one

>>518966862 (OP)
The right wing doesn't revolve around Christianity. There's a relationship but it's compicated. That's why Trump comes off as mostly agnostic and the majority of Republicans politicians aren't going to quote the Bible when giving political speeches. Left wing politicians invoke Christianity as well. It has everything to do with their constituents.

>>518968709
>These are supported through credibility.
LMAO
You christfags put up some impressive window dressing for your nonsense

>>518988685
>economic factors and crazy women are the main reason nobody is having kids, not religion
you know what reins in crazy women?
a meaningful moral framework that's more binding than atheism's "do as thou wilt."

>>518967799
>Christianity is the core philosophy of western civilization.
Wrong.

>>518988947
>atheism's "do as thou wilt."
No such thing as this doesn't exist.

I wish I could do what I want sometimes though

Notice how all your responses are leftist tier fallacies?

>>518968709
None of that is supported by anything other than the fucking book ffs. Your clowns are masters at circular reasoning, which is a fucking fallacy btw.

>>518989082
>No such thing as this doesn't exist.
i agree.
atheism necessarily entails moral nihilism.

>>518988947
nah, there's no fixing 100 years of feminism through religion
only the media can do it by reprogramming them, and laws against being single if over 25

christianity is retarded
I'm not wasting my sundays reading about joos in the desert
I'd rather read greek myths

>>518989252
> atheism necessarily entails moral nihilism.

Says who? You?

>>518989252
>atheism necessarily entails moral nihilism.
Right back to
>>518989082
>Notice how all your responses are leftist tier fallacies?
You can add contradiction to the growing list, next ad hom and strawman

>>518989318
>nah, there's no fixing 100 years of feminism through religion
Christianity's fixed much crazier shit than allowing women to be in charge of things.
my celtic ancestors were eating eachother before given the good news.
>I'm not wasting my sundays reading about joos in the desert
your infinite loss.

>>518988296
Literally you

>>518989545
Its funny how you goons think and act the same
>>518989082
>Notice how all your responses are leftist tier fallacies?
Lol

>>518989377
*fart noise*
>>518989345
>Says who? You?
yeah i said it, but that's not my justification for making the claim, allow me to explain.

p1: if atheism is true, then the universe is a product of non-conscious, purposeless physical processes.
p2: a universe that is a product of non-concious, purposeless processes has no inherent telos (purpose, goal or design) for its inhabitants
p3: objective moral values and duties (a right and wrong way to live) are grounded in and derive their authority from a telos for human beings
c1: therefore, if atheism is true, there are no objective moral values and duties
p4: we have good reason to believe objective moral values and duties do exist
c2: therefore, atheism is false

good luck dismantling this, stinky dogfucking gaytheists

>>518989801
>leftistism intensifies
>>518989801
>if atheism is true
Yoi don't seem to understand. Atheism is just an opinion about God.

You dummies strawman it into something it isn't

>then the universe is a product of non-conscious, purposeless physical processes
Why does any if this require a "God", let alone your favorite one?

>>518968292
>the Bible is the truth
Then why are there so many versions of it?

>>518990022
i was using the academic definition of atheism, not reddit's

educate yourself, you dullard, you ignoramus, you nincompoop.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/

>>518990340
>i was using the academic definition of atheism
Which is a disbelief or lack of belief in God or gods.

Which breaks down into an opinion and a response to a claim.

>educate yourself
The irony coming from a 1 dimensional leftist

>>518988403
>bible is not a moral book
It is, but it's a lot of things other than that too. It's contradictive. But it does steal greek philosophy and sprinkles jewish subversion between it. The jewish subversion works both ways if you end up denouncing the greek philosophy principles it commandeered.

>>518990468
>Which is a disbelief or lack of belief in God or gods.
no.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/
https://iep.utm.edu/atheism/

>>518990695
Yup

1. Definitions of “Atheism”
The word “atheism” is polysemous—it has multiple related meanings

Kek.

>>518990695
>>518990812
Also
>This generates the following definition: atheism is the psychological state of lacking the belief that God exists.

I enjoy watching a Dunning Kruger fail so hard lolol

>>518966862 (OP)
It is our misfortune the Right does revolve around Christianity.

>>518989510
>my celtic ancestors were eating eachother before given the good news.
all you needed was a roman education, an aquaduct and bread from the granary
caesar is king!

>your infinite loss.
sunday is mine
if I will worship anything on a sunday, it'll be the sun, which gives me warmth, lights my day and makes all life possible
I won't worship some weakling

>>518966862 (OP)
>Christianity
It doesn't; everyone knows by now it revolves around satanic jewishness

Slave of all
>So Jesus called them together and said, “You know that those regarded as rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their superiors exercise authority over them. But it shall not be this way among you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, and whoever wants to be first must be the slave of all. For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life as a ransom for many.”
Mark 10:42-45

>>518991263
christianity is "how to be a doormat 101"
I will never ever be a christian
I'd rather follow a fictional god like crom who is strong
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=it_SJXr5fdM

>>518989144
History and archeology support the Bible.

>>518989801
>gaytheists ignored my syllogism and instead started blathering on about pope washing nigger feet
pathetic

>>518991584
>ignored my syllogism
See
>>518990022
>Why does any if this require a "God", let alone your favorite one?

>>518990812
>The word “atheism” is polysemous—it has multiple related meanings
>Kek.
yes, it has multiple meanings and i was using the academic form of the word instead of the reddit one.
address the premises of the argument or shut your stupid fucking mouth.

>>518991769
>instead of the reddit one
No such thing

Why is lying do easy for you?

>address the premises of the argument
You never made one ma'am.

>>518991705
>Why does any if this require a "God"
you're very confused, the argument is about atheism being false, not theism being true.

threads going to 404 soon but i guess i should save that into a notepad doc.
seems to make you losers sweat buckets.

>>518991769
>i was using the academic form of the word
Which is what exactly and how does it differ from the ones quoted from your source?

>>518991923
>the argument is about atheism being false, not theism being true.
That's not true either

>threads going to 404 soon
Imagine looking like a dummy the whole thread. I almost feel sorry for you

>>518992044
>the argument is about atheism being false, not theism being true.
>That's not true either
fucking idiot, read c2.
your mom must've chugged tylenol when she was pregnant.

>>518992156
>fucking idiot,
Again, your misunderstanding of atheism leads you to make claims that your personal feelings are correct.

Why are they?

You won't answer this because you are intellectually stunted and a coward

>>518992271
atheism is the hatred of the one God you know exists, typically stemming from the desire to have a dick in your butt.

>>518992347
>You won't answer this because you are intellectually stunted and a coward
Concession accepted

>>518989801
I just wanted to let you know that p2 is a false assertion, based upon the false understanding/translation of "telos". Telos is "end, completion, goal, fulfillment" which could also be called purpose. Aka, the thing is what it does.
Not to be confused with purpose in the sense you implied, which is "aim, intention, intent".
Purely logically speaking, the universe being a product of non-conscious physical processes does not inhibit/prevent it from having intrinsic telos. Telos is objective, regardless if its due to god or physics.
This linguistic mistake is often used as a purposeful subversion used by those purporting moral relativism. Or made by those like yourself who wish to support the claim that deontology is the only solution to moral relativism.

>tldr read Aristotle

>>518989801
>>518992555
It's also false because she assumes that anything without her flavor of god has no purpose.

Which is demonstrably false

from what people come the greatest evils? and who are the greatest enemies of that people?

>>518992555
you're right that in aristotelian terms, telos can refer to the natural end or funciton of a thing, what it is by nature
however, my argument is concerened not merely with functional ends but with normative ends that carry prescriptive force.

in other words, for objective moral values and duties to exist, there must be a "right' way for humans to live, not just descriptively (what we tend to do) but prescriptively (what we ought to do)
that kind of normativity seems to require a grounding beyond mere physical function, a moral telos, which is as far as i can tell impossible to account for ina purely naturalistic framework.
>>518992682
shut the fuck up retard.

>>518993370
>shut the fuck up retard
Look at this leftist lady getting pissy

>>518993370
>objective moral values
Is it always bad to murder children?

>>518993580
ask your rabbi