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6/13/2025, 2:11:20 AM
>>24437037
Goth is as much about "white"(European) culture and experiences as rap and hip-hop are about the black experience. It just so happens that the European philosophical and romantic ideas of old are not entirely focused around "muh racial uhpreshun". Go figure. So just because Goth kids didn't always walk around with a chip on their shoulder about race or racial politics doesn't mean they weren't participating in a subculture defined by it's relation to European ethnic cultural practices and attitudes. Yours is a very short sighted view that is symptomatic of the cultural rot of American capitalism. Culture as commodity. The lefty kids whining about cultural appropriation sort of have a point in this regard, not to say it shouldn't be allowed necessarily, but that it IS happening, for better or worse. European Paganism, Romanticism, Pessimism, and the poetry and fiction that Goth culture springs forth from are inseparable from their historical roots. These roots have little to nothing to do with Africa or African Americans. The closest example I can think of that would relate in theme would be Voodoo, as it is an often maligned "dark" religious practice born out of resentment for catholic teachings that were forced on slaves. Like some goths, it's practitioners combine traditional Christian/Catholic symbols with their own pagan religious practices until it becomes it's own "outsider" religion, sort of defined by it's relationship to Christianity. That being said, I don't think most people consider Voodoo and Goth to be synonymous subcultures, nor do I think they should, unless of course all goth means is that you are vaguely "spooky". Again, that'd be culture as pure commodity. Someone like Eminem will always be seen as less valid as a hip-hop/rap artist by some black people, and I can't blame them for feeling that way. A random black guy with little connection to hood culture will usually still feel more culturally connected to rap music than a random white guy that had it hard in Detroit. It's like the other anon said, just because Eminem is white doesn't mean rap/hip-hop are separable from black American culture, or the African musical roots that influence them, and the history that goes with that. Same for rock/blues, it's very much associated with white people today, but any college kid will talk your ear off about their black roots. To attempt to see things differently would be an act of willful ignorance. Of course, that doesn't mean that we all need to stay in our own cultural place, never to share our traditions or ideas with the perceived "outsiders", only that we should recognize where these things come from, as we all stand on the shoulders of giants. Unless, of course, you were raised isolated in a hole somewhere, in which case the only cultural baggage you carry is the language you speak, if any at all. Is that enviable? I think not.
Goth is as much about "white"(European) culture and experiences as rap and hip-hop are about the black experience. It just so happens that the European philosophical and romantic ideas of old are not entirely focused around "muh racial uhpreshun". Go figure. So just because Goth kids didn't always walk around with a chip on their shoulder about race or racial politics doesn't mean they weren't participating in a subculture defined by it's relation to European ethnic cultural practices and attitudes. Yours is a very short sighted view that is symptomatic of the cultural rot of American capitalism. Culture as commodity. The lefty kids whining about cultural appropriation sort of have a point in this regard, not to say it shouldn't be allowed necessarily, but that it IS happening, for better or worse. European Paganism, Romanticism, Pessimism, and the poetry and fiction that Goth culture springs forth from are inseparable from their historical roots. These roots have little to nothing to do with Africa or African Americans. The closest example I can think of that would relate in theme would be Voodoo, as it is an often maligned "dark" religious practice born out of resentment for catholic teachings that were forced on slaves. Like some goths, it's practitioners combine traditional Christian/Catholic symbols with their own pagan religious practices until it becomes it's own "outsider" religion, sort of defined by it's relationship to Christianity. That being said, I don't think most people consider Voodoo and Goth to be synonymous subcultures, nor do I think they should, unless of course all goth means is that you are vaguely "spooky". Again, that'd be culture as pure commodity. Someone like Eminem will always be seen as less valid as a hip-hop/rap artist by some black people, and I can't blame them for feeling that way. A random black guy with little connection to hood culture will usually still feel more culturally connected to rap music than a random white guy that had it hard in Detroit. It's like the other anon said, just because Eminem is white doesn't mean rap/hip-hop are separable from black American culture, or the African musical roots that influence them, and the history that goes with that. Same for rock/blues, it's very much associated with white people today, but any college kid will talk your ear off about their black roots. To attempt to see things differently would be an act of willful ignorance. Of course, that doesn't mean that we all need to stay in our own cultural place, never to share our traditions or ideas with the perceived "outsiders", only that we should recognize where these things come from, as we all stand on the shoulders of giants. Unless, of course, you were raised isolated in a hole somewhere, in which case the only cultural baggage you carry is the language you speak, if any at all. Is that enviable? I think not.
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