Sallying Out Edition

Resources:
WFB: https://pastebin.com/qVGrgwwh
WM: https://pastebin.com/EsDAgeba
WFRP: https://pastebin.com/inbyBsR6
Novels: https://pastebin.com/PFqPDr0H
>Warhammer Chronicles:
https://files (dot) catbox (dot) moe/0xt777 (dot) zip
>Time of Legends:
https://files (dot) catbox (dot) moe/q46ut6 (dot) zip
>The End Times:
https://files (dot) catbox (dot) moe/j7d0t5 (dot) zip
>TOW:
https://gofile.io/d/fxFgXS
https://www.warhammer-community.com/the-old-world-downloads/
>Alternative Models:
https://pastebin.com/xPeM9szL

>Previous Thread:
>>95840831

>Thread Question:
GW have confirmed a new AJ coming after Cathay. What do you think it's going to be? What do you want it to be?

>TQ
>What do you think it's going to be?
chink shit
>What do you want it to be?
non-existent

>>95853497 (OP)

TQ:

Vampire counts could be fun. They could include armies of infamy like the sylvanians (does the timeline permit it?) with a mixture of empire troops and undead, or strigoi with gypsies and ghouls.

>>95853509
Good morning perrynigger

Gonna experiment on this test rank to find a paint scheme I like for my vc project

>>95853517
>(does the timeline permit it?)
We are just past Sylvania getting shrekt by the Vampire Wars. Currently it isn't a province of the Empire and has been absorbed into Stirland. Completely plausible to have bands/pockets of Undead that slipped through and skulk the forests of what used to be Sylvania.

>>95853533
I love the shields on your guys. IDK what period/type of art I am thinking of but it reminds me of that macabre but jovial Euro art that uses a lot of skeleton imagery.

>>95853497 (OP)
>TQ
Probably lizards maybe dark elves
>who would I want
Chorfs or something our of left field like araby or amazons

>>95853497 (OP)
>GW have confirmed a new AJ coming after Cathay. What do you think it's going to be? What do you want it to be?
Neat, though I'm not seeing it. Hopefully its true. I would expect a returning army since that would be easier (assuming they still have the moulds) so probably Skaven or Lizardmen, especially since they did a Skaven refresh in AoS recently iirc and could use the lizard moulds.
What would I personally want it to be though? Either Japan to tie into Cathay, add some tension and give me some goddamn katana and dao arguments OR turkey/arabia with janissaries and big onion hat leaders.

>>95853497 (OP)
>TQ
Kislev. They have hinted it multiple times.

>>95853518
Meds.

>>95853588

The middle eastern/central Asian armour aesthetic is great, would love to see more of it in fantasy.

>>95853517
Seeing as VC are one of the most popular factions in the game and the outright most popular Legacy faction I think they're an inevitability. Probably not Sylvanians though. My guess is Blood Dragons/Mousillon at the least and then who knows. Just not Vampire Coast TWW meme shit please.

>>95853533
wacky undead require lots of reds, off-whites, strong yellows and sickly greens, but the colours should be placed "wrong", like making some skeletons with red bones, the ground itself too should feel under an unnatural glow, with maybe purple tones.

>>95853670
>muh total war
most of their roster was in 6th dickhead

Warmaster would be a cool relaunch. Idk why they thought a HH epic game was a good idea in terms of demand/sales. I can understand if they did a 40K epic, but HH over Warmaster is crazy. It’s total war fantasy.

>>95853497 (OP)
>>Thread Question:
>GW have confirmed a new AJ coming after Cathay. What do you think it's going to be? What do you want it to be?
dogs of war arcane journal that's mainly a collection of all mercenary units that can be taken by most armies, plus one army of infamy to represent a mercenary army

here's the list of all units that I think could and should be presented
>paymaster
>ogre maneater
>tilean crossbows
>tilean phalanx
>tilean leopard company
>tilean birdmen
>estalian pavises
>estalian armored pikes
>estalian conquistadores
>estalian light cannons
>halfling archers
>dwarf pirates
>arabyan raiders
>albion giants (special unit)
>cursed company (special unit)
>mercenary orc boys (existing plastic)
>mercenary goblin wolf riders (existing plastic)
>mercenary knightly orders (existing plastic)
>mercenary wizards (existing models)
>dragon company
>imperial ogres
>badlands ogres

>>95853797

Pretty good list, but duelists were missing .

>>95853797
an even longer shot would include these too
>pirate captain of sartosa
>sartosan vampire with thrall (special character)
and a second army of infamy that doesn't represent mercenaries but pirates limiting some units in exchange for fancier or alternative army rules

>>95853738
One shitty White Dwarf cashing in on Pirates of the Caribbean hype does not a faction make, faggot

>>95853863
copetard

Is bringing a Chaos Lord at 1000 points overkill?

Was going to equip him with

- Daemonic Mount
- Shield
- Chaos Runesword + Daemonic Platemail + Favour of the Gods
- Mark of Khorne

342 points

Inversely there is the Exalted Champion

- Daemonic Mount
- Shield
- Sword of Might, Daemonic Plate, Favour of the Gods
- Mark of Khorne

247 points

>>95853871
The only one coping here is you bitch. Vampire Coast were never anything more than a throwaway meme of total irrelevance and little substance until TWW.

I'm currently working on /mydudes/ and I have this idea of converting a giant into a pseudo ogre, greenstuffing a gutplate and some armor etc.
My idea was that the giant was adopted as a little brother by the tyrant when they were kids and they just think that he's a super big ogre that never stopped growing.
The tyrant is also super doting on the giant because he's stupid and never challenges what he says.
Is that possible? Pic unrelated I just found it funny.

>>95853961
it's a bit of a stretch considering how ogres generally treat giants, but if you have a particularly ogre-like giant and a particularly simpleton tyrant it can be done.

one avenue would be to make the giant his actual half brother, the previous ogrelord might have had a slave harem and fathered half-ogre and full-ogre children from various slaves
which then might have promptly rebelled and eaten the father, greek myth style, with your dude and the half-ogre giant forming a warband of their own

>>95853961
It's /YourDudes/ so yes, but I think /yourDudes/ would be a general exception to normal orge relations with Giants, considering the whole fall of the Skytitans was caused by the orges and most Giants in Orge armies being considered Slaves

>>95853945
>it doesn't count because I said so
>not a cope
lmao, any retard can be a contrarian when it comes to WTW shit, watch this:

>>95853670
>Mousillon
TW meme shit, they aren't even mentioned by name in the 6th ed army book appendix

>>95853670
>Mousillon
hasn't Fallen yet, that happens later in the Timeline

Is there any merit to the errata leaks that were in previous thread? Some of the changes like impetuous being based on leadership seemed smart and intuitive. I would also like for the parry save to be a real thing.

>>95854020
Yes, we got a legit insider on a discord and confirmed most are valid, with some being incomplete or slightly different phrasing.

>>95854020
looks reliable

>>95853997
Which one, the VC 6th ed? They have a magic item called the Cursed Shield of Mousillon that makes Bretonnian knights hate the wielder, and while it doesn't mention Mousillon in the alt army list it still makes the distinction that your Blood Dragon army can be from Bretonnia. The 6th ed Bretonnian book 2 years later goes a bit more into Mousillon but not to a large extent, and funnily enough it doesn't even offer alt army lists in that book. I don't know the extent to which TWW goes into Mousillon as I've never played those games but the potential was there for a long time to make a /yourdudes/ army based on Mousillon.

>>95853997
>>95854068
Oh fuck, I see now you were making an example to that anon. Carry on then, though as >>95854018 said the False Grail debacle happens a little later in TOW's time period, though not too far away. I don't know what they're planning in terms of time progression but if Asavar Kul is hinted to be coming then there's bound to be some time skipping which could lead to the Affair of the False Grail being spotlighted. GW will do as it pleases.

>>95853997
>has never read the 6th ed VC army book

>>95853797
>pike and crossbowmen
>pike and crossbowmen (forma de español)

>>95853491
You're basing this literally on half a sentence. Complete dumbass.

>>95853976
That sounds better and more fitting.
>>95853988
Yeah that was my main concern

Where the fuck are the cool empire minis like nuln ironsides, mananns blades, and the marienburg landship? If they can put the hellblaster volley gun and the helstorm rocket battery in old world why not the other cool shit?

>>95854506
Check out BMM

>>95854528
What's BMM?

>>95854506
TOW is a throwback to WHFB, to capture those sweet nostalgia bux. why are you surprised they'd focus on units from WHFB?

>>95854535
Black market miniatures. Recasters that make better quality sculpts than GW (hence the price) and they have all the minis you mentioned

>>95853750
hopefully not. it's basically the perfect Warhammer game right now, in terms of both rules and minis. nuGW involvement could only fuck it up.

>>95854506
the landship mould was destroyed in an accident.

>>95854544
Cool I'll check them out, thanks

>>95854565
Chat is this real or are you fucking with me right now

>>95853997
>Mousillon
>TW meme shit
the fuck are you smoking. mousillon was a thing back in the 5th ed VC book and the original WHFRP. it's absolutely mentioned in the later VC army books too, and it got a whole supplement to itself for WHFRP 2. and bret vampires have been a thing since the Red Duke and circle of blood. shit's been in the game practically since the undead split.

>>95854576
don't sweat it. all the best landships were original scratchbuilds anyway. or converted from hwg boats.

Thoughts on this list? Got a game next Friday vs dorfs

chyna
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/zscdwwzf/old-world-almanack-a-short-history-of-cathay/

>>95854926
>explicitly benevolent and perfect and the most united awesomest best place
what the fuck

>>95854958
Yeah this sort of just reads as GW sucking the CCP's dick

>>95854926
>Monkey King was "allowed to believe" he was in charge for a time
Gay and lame.
>second Cathay Arcane Journal
Second wave for all factions confirmed?

>>95854171
think about it, if you field both they get competitive and perform better to get paid more than the other nation's mercs!

>>95854926
Yin-Yin sisters...

>>95854926
So "Chinese sensitivity team" translates to "suck our culture's dick, gweilo."
>no body horror
>monkey king only "believed" he was in charge
lmao way to neuter the new faction's nuance.

>>95854958
Just like real life
>>95854984
At least she es mentioned to still be around

>>95854969
I hope Wu Kong gets a mini. Guy was such a problem, the dragon children can't dispose of him.

>>95854926
>These are immortal beings of immeasurable power, but they rule with benevolence over a people united in purpose.
GW chasing those social credit points, I see

What would a mongol themed WoC army look like?

I was thinking some of the AoS chaos legionnaires on horseback might be a start, what with the more lamellar style look

>>95855026
>Guy was such a problem,
Well apparently not so much

>>95854982
Big brain finkin.

>>95855046
I'd imagine it is sort of similar to the actual Wu Kong. Guy was such a bother but too strong to eliminate, the heavenly host placated him with titles and useless ranks to make him feel important.

Also one of the dragon siblings is in an on and off again rivalry and I would assume he is strong enough to the point he can directly engage with the dragon siblings in the first place.

Otherwise he'd be dead..

>>95853497 (OP)
>TQ
Most likely an old faction like skaven or vampire counts. Either one's old ranges can generally be ported to TOW. I doubt lizardmen are popular enough within TOW specifically for that, I think their fanbase has generally made the migration to AoS.

If we're getting any new factions it will just be Kislev with two nuhammer units and the remainder behind based on the old Kislev range but with new sculpts.

>>95854926
>The Monkey King is worth mentioning because he’s an example of how we’ve managed not to retcon anything.
Based, where can I order the miniatures with Manchu clothes and yellow skin???
Oh wait...

Also
>No Burning Wind Nomads or other minor factions and subgroups
>No nuance
>Just five similar-looking banners and no depth
Grim, reads like AoSlop. At the very least they won't take centre-stage in the story and we get to kill Chinamen on our own turf. The comparison with Horus Heresy also forebodes a great evil in the hearts of the designers.

>>95854969
has the Monkey King even taken over Cathay at this point in the timeline?

>>95854984
This is only a map of eastern Cathay anon

>>95855115
Western Cathay* all of Yin Yin lands are on the eastern coastland

>>95855108
>Horus Heresy
Don't forget the mention of primarchs...

>>95855113
Yes his rule was supposed to have came and went by this point

>>95855149
The wiki says his rule lasted until 2380IC, which is a century ahead of where the current TOW timeline is in 2280IC(Empire AJ) so GW 100% retconned shit

>>95855042
desu that'd be the Hung, who aren't that much different in aesthetics from regular chaos marauders

>>95853517
minimalist view.

>>95854544

Aren't they ruskies? Is it OK to import from them with the war still going on?

>>95855204
I did it back in January with no problems (EU).

>>95854926
>GW buckbroken by Wumao trolls
Is anyone surprised?

>>95855113
No, Monkey king size power only100 years after TOW events.

>>95854926
I don't mind Cathay being at the peak of their power because it contrasts well with the Empire being at a low point but this is just way too much wanking off China I think if they had to deal with Ogre or Chaos invasions it would ground them a bit

>>95855274
It's literally Tau from 40k again. Squeaky clean uber good race introduced and people rage. Further worsened by the anti china sentiment still remaining post covid among some.

>>95853497 (OP)
>TQ
I expect Kislev or ogres. I hope for Delves or Dogs but as changed below.
>>95853797
If they do this, I'd prefer they rename it to either Coastal Alliance or Border Princes instead of dogs of war. That way they can make the different states the specialist armies and leave open a lot of design space for new stuff.

>>95854982
>the chinks have the power of yin and yang
>the meds have that dog of us vs them in them

Would anyone object to me using these as counts-as fell bats in VC?

>>95853588
There was that one anon who talked about Chaos Dwarves coming to AoS and ToW at the same time in October a thread or 2 back

I had probably the best game of TOW so far between my Skaven vs Beastmen

We forgot pictures. Not really, I just didn't want to hear you guys bitching about my opponents half painted Beastmen. But there were a lot of highlights and it ended in a Draw by 1.5 points

o Mino panic check resulted in 17 or so inches of fleeing movement, effectively out of the game, while the other ambushing unit chased a Hellpit that ran away as fast as his 3d6 could take him
o A Cygor ended up trying to pin the Hell Pit only for it to die, but Timberrr'd onto the Hell Pit and crushed it as some rats crawled out of the corpse and continued to run from the Minos
o Gors were stuck fighting Rat Swarms for 6 or 7 combats after said rats ate some dogs
o My Doomwheel did it's best to commit suicide, again, as some Harpies in his rear helped. But the rats inside the machine weren't ready to die and managed to kill the harpies which let him support* the highlight of the game...
o A grueling brawl in the middle of the board between 1000point deathstars of Bestigors vs Stormvermin.
This was two sides desperately trying to get their buffs off while our Warlords slapped each other in challenges.
Skaven ended up breaking the Bestigor after 5ish combats. I chose not to pursue, which may or not have been wise, but the Beastmen General failed to rally and rolled high enough to leave the table. BUT the difficult terrain slowed the fleeing unit by 1 inch and kept them around until the game ended on my turn.

*He dropped the ball a bit and died to some Ungor archers next turn

10/10 Warhammer

>>95855342
They'll definitely be coming to AoS - but with a new aesthetic no doubt.

>>95855354
Sounds like you had fun anon.

>>95855361
They released new stuff for Aos and ToW for Chaos Warriors didn't they?

>>95855374
WoC in TOW only got one new Resin charecter model everything was old kits getting rerealsed

>>95854926
Really liking the models and their implementation of the older lore, but damn as a "just wait, they only seem squeaky clean now, they'll add grit later" Cathay defending it feels like complainers were correct.

>>95855338
they might be a tad small, but otherwise it's fine

>>95855394
Oh maybe I should use em as bat swarm proxies instead

>>95855385
It's going to be like Imperium where it's just getting more heroic and heroic while stuff like Grey Knights sacrificing sisters and sanctifying each of their bullets with the blood of innocent civilians is memoryholed and retconned.

>>95854926
boo! add nuance and stereotypes
What's the goddamn point otherwise?
If lizardmen were done today they wouldn't have been nonhumans and they wouldn't have performed blood sacrifices, but both are nonetheless absolutely vital and cool components and noone whines about those, not even the people who should allegedly feel offended by them, hell they fucking love being represented by a faction as cool as lizardmen.

>>95855405
Especially dumb retcons when its only Cathay getting gussied up and not all factions. Quite literally only them are noble bright.

>What’s rare is for the Dragons to come to the Old World at the head of an army that looks like it could be an invasion fleet – which is what we get into in the second Cathayan Arcane Journal…
>the second Cathayan Arcane Journal
A second AJ is coming then ?

>>95855398
nta
I'd stick with felbats because they look less like swarms
TOW doesn't use true LOS like other GW games.
You can't see through units but you can see over units from Hills or Large Targets or other things

>>95855385
I know anon.
It would be cool if Cathay presented themselves as harmonious and noble, but behind the curtains there are a lot of problems, but at this point it feels like I'm just making up headcanon.

>>95855422
unless this is an article written a long ass time ago and the cathayan journal was meant to be the second one to be released, after kislev.

>>95855438
>it feels like I'm just making up headcanon.
my headcanon is almost as large as canon at this point, I do the same with dark elves where I try to go the opposite route instead: trying to explain why, where and when the population isn't as cartoonishly edgy as malekith and morathi.

>>95855374
Tbh I want them to do a Tzeentch release for AoS purely so they make Tzeentch themed Chaos warriors that i can use as Tzeentch chosen and the leftover bits mixed with the AoS warrior kit for warriors and the WHF warrior kit for Forsaken. It already works really well with the other 3 so Im annoyed that I cant do it for the last one.

>>95855438
Xen Yang's master plan most likely is either moving the planet back away from the sun or teleporting to another universe to escape Chaos, both of which will lead to millions of deaths directly or indirectly.

>>95855422
First one is the expeditionary force with Miao, second is the home defending force with that other one that's in TWW. That's how they get the second wave involving peasants and birdmen to make sense.

>>95855354
>two giant elite units fighting mid field with both generals clashing to achieve victory

Sounds like an absolute baller! As much as some anons shitpost about unpainted minis,I'd be keen to see some pics. Beastmen seem to be a more fun army to face since they are mostly infantry orientated, though I am impressed Skaven overpowered bestigors in melee.

>>95855472
The drug addict one or the boring competent one?

>>95855405
>sacrificing sisters and sanctifying each of their bullets with the blood of innocent civilians is memoryholed and retconned.

Tbh, I'm glad these get retconned because it's full on grimderp instead of grimdark

>>95855478
Hopefully the drug addicted one. Zhao is the only cool dragon kid. Maybe the fire one is cool if they ever reveal him

>>95854926
>Owen: He is definitely of this world – but his consort, Quai Yin, is not. Though she is known as the Moon Dragon and regularly takes on a draconic aspect, she is a shapeshifter who arrived from Manslieb after the Old Ones had appeared. It’s from her that he learns to assume a human form, though the rest of her origins are obscure…
what are our bets? renegade old one? last member of moon people genocided by the frogs? changeling pulling a long ass plan?

Man, I just care for Cathay less and less. It doesn’t even look fun to convert/kitbash with. This is an entirely staggered release for me, and this should have appealed to me.

>>95855478
The drug addict is mostly associated with alchemists and Ogres. The boring one is associated with celestial court mages, crows, and animated statues. He also is kind of associated with cranking out militia troops for quick responses. From a pure roster filling status, the Boring one is probably easier to justify...who knows though. GW can add anyone they want, although not even putting Yin Yin on the map looks grim for her chances.

>>95855501
probably moon people that got killed off either by Old Ones or Chaos(more likely)
If Moonclaw can come from Morrslieb and have ghost pirates sailing it's oceans, then Mannslieb can have an ancient pre-Old One civilisation.

>>95855511
At least you'll have a new army to fight, anon! Always look on the bright side.

>>95854926
>Mention how Cathayans (ambassador / merchants) were a common sight in some parts of the old word during that era
>Mention both how Emperor and Empress rule with benevolence & how they "oppose Chaos without being lily-white in virtue" and Xen Yang reluctantly accepting being the Emperor of human
>Mention the Emperor opposition to the Old Ones as a being living on this planet way before their arrival and shenanigans
>Mention how Kislev was bigger than during K.F era, connecting old world and Cathay
>Mention Yin-Yin being alive but the Cathay map shown to us mysteriously leaves her lands out of the map edges

>>95855474
Well, when I said forgot but not really. I meant I didn't actually take any because I didn't want to share. It literally didn't occur to me until this moment that I could just not post them here, whoops. /wfg/ got in my head too much because god damn are you all tiring with the whining

It was a combination of him getting buffs once and me getting them twice. When I didn't get them I just stopped an inch away because Initiative 5 or higher would let me swing before everything except the Beastlord. The 4+d3+ranks static combat res saved me and let me push him back until he broke. Hitting on 5s, Wounding on 4s/5s is rough.

>>95855556
I wonder if the Morrslieb civilization were rabbit people since rabbits are associated with the moon in Asia...

>>95854033
I'm sorry but what? I was the anon who posted it and I got some doubts on many of those changes myself

>>95855582
>Tells us to go look at the interactive map to see more
>Doesn't update the interactive map for the new stuff

>>95854926
> Character with Pistol sidearm in art
interesting option for the Shugengan Character. Did the Chinese millinery use pistols as often as Western Europeans did?

>>95855582
>>Mention Yin-Yin being alive
literally nothing ever said or suggested she was dead

>>95855494
I rather liked it, it has the same feel as Karl Franz ordering the Reiksguard to massacre the window tax rioters or Custodes presence in a battlefield meaning recording any losses is heresy and planets being lost because of that.

>>95854926
>no skulls or dirt
>no genuine monkey king rule
>no problems under the surface
>no jiangshi undead
fuck that noise

>>95855650
Officialy, nothing.
But some people were memeing her being dead because her flag was not in the big Cathay reveal.

>>95855624
There is a mod in one of the WHF discords who knows his shit. None of the YT BS pricks, he actually knows whats coming and has historically.

>>95855671
I mean there are undead, it's just closer to Nerferata stuff probably and not just vampires hopping around like a pogo stick

>>95855299
>It's literally Tau from 40k again.
It's worse since the Tau were always played off as being a fairly minor power. Cathay is pretty much the most powerful faction.

>>95854926
>GW doing penance for the opium war and other assorted injustices against 1.4 billion Chinese people by making fantasy china the bestest evar and their dad could beat your dad

>>95855671
Jade Vampires are Canon and get a bunch of references in TWW, but outside of that, we don't know anything about them

>>95855676
>>95855624
He did say that various lists were thrown about by GW to test changes and that the wording on some of the changes aren't what he saw. He also says its not the full list and that he's VERY excited by 1.5 (even more than Cathay).

>>95855686
>TOW has no active vampires
>no campaign for Neferata trying to bite Miao or Yin-Yin because she's trying to one up what Abhorash did and also maybe coup Cathay
what a waste

>>95855680
Cathay aren't shown to be the strongest and I 100% doubt they'll stay in the limelight too long. Just like the Tau, squaky clean and its annoying but again, it will take a turn soon.

>>95855675
And because Miao was leading the fleet instead of Yin Yin. It was fun to make aquafags sperg out in /twg/ but I guess that ship has sailed

>>95853497 (OP)
Hello fellow comrades HAIL THE CCP HAIL CATHAY
how much are you all going to spend on Cathay?
1k? 3k? Social credit bonus for 5k in Cathay purchase.

>>95855717
anon they are already getting a second AJ.
Cathay is GW's newest attempt to get some of that Chinese money and as such they will stick with them for a while longer

>>95855717
The are literally called the strongest Empire in the world in the article.

Tau caste system makes them more like India desu, that's why they're rising in importance while the British-coded Imperium is crumbling.

Meanwhile in Fantasy all order factions are collapsing, even the blog says it all went to shit for orderfags after the Great War.

>>95854926
>cathay and the old world lose their contacts by the time of karl franz
good

also supports the idea whatever plan the dragon emperor has isn't about the well being of the planet as a whole, just his own

>>95855671
It's amazing how proud they are of deliberately making a faction that doesn't fit Warhammer's themes and lacks all nuance, conflict and interest.

Like making a bad thing is justified if you did it on purpose.
I'm so fucking done with the world since like 2012. We had a nice brief time in the sun before the moral busybodies took the reigns of society once again.

>>95855735
Just like other exemplay descriptions of the newest army/armies of Warhammer. Blown up to high heaven.

>>95855729
Ok I can't read, missed the second AJ. Guess they want big sales. I am going to order Miao Ying myself

>>95855744
Doesn't really line up when we have a Cathayan ambassador in Altdorf when Karl Franz was Emperor, but whatever, it's just to justify why we never saw Cathay armies in WFB

>>95855299
Ita not tau at all ffs WHFB isn't grimderp. It's doomed, and there's nasty shit but life is generally ok in most regions of the world and not every second is grim darkness of darkness grim.

>>95855354
> I didn't post my shameful half painted shit
Good
Not reading the rest of your fucking blog

>Cathay gets full release and two AJs before kislev even gets a model reveal

>>95855747
>nuance
>warhammer
Ah yes, nuance, I surely want that when I’m delving into, say, dark elves or brettonia

>>95855422
Got to split the release anon! Got to sell more shitty books to the paypiggie!!!

>>95855042

It would mostly be on horseback and you would have to source most of your models from STLs or historicals, with some Warhammer bits for flourish. The islamic heavy cavalry from victrix for example could pass for marauder horsemen. Wargames Atlantic released Mongol heavy cavalry STLs this month, they are modular and they can also be scaled up in size to have more warhammerish proportions.

>>95855755
Nah, the shit on the Empire a lot in its own journal/books/stories. Cathay has no notable flaws besides getting destroyed in the End Times. They even got floating castles and are more magical than High Elves lmao

>>95855769
Yes

>>95855735
>strongest Empire in the world

I fucking love how my faction already comes with not one but two instances of them dealing major blows to cathay.

>>95855762
Fuck off perryfag

>>95855613
Well I liked your photos. Most I say just stay silent and enjoy the content while the ones who do shitpost, like above, are just bored or got shit talked in another part of the website and need to vent.

>>95855763
Does Kislev have a big titty ice queen or even flat but fat assed ice queen in ToW era? That's what defines interest and sales.

>>95855757
wasn't that a chaos plant?

>>95855769
Yeah people like Nuance even for overall silly factions
It's why Malus Darkblade books were so popular.

>>95855773
Let's see the AJ cause I recall Emoire being glorified in the AJ articles.

>>95855782
/v/ brain

>>95855757
Her predecessor was a cultist and her imperial counterpart in cathay was assassinated.
Her aim in the Empire is to get them to fuck up the Ogres so that Cathay is free to march into the Northern Wastes.

>>95855782
The queen is an old granny but the ice witches can still be cute

>>95855785
That happened in Beast in Velvet.
After the events of that book, Cathay was replaced with another real Ambassador who was legit and wanted to make the Orge Kingdoms go to War with the Empire so Cathay could secure its Western border

>>95855769
6e and WFRP 2e did a good job at injecting contradictions and conflict into Bretonnia. Which GW has recently been working to undo because they fear art.

>>95855777
>Strongest living mage in the Warhammer World
>Oldest and most veteran characters of any army
>Almost all of their fluff is "X faction landed in Lustria, and then we murdered them."
>BTFO's Chaos more than any other faction
>The true inheritors of the world

>>95855782
we have conflicting info
>Vassily Zykov (ca. 2302 IC) - Vassily Zykov was the Tzar of Kislev during the Great War Against Chaos. He fought alongside Count Bernhardt the Brave
>Alexis Romanoff (ca. 2302 IC) - Alexis Romanoff was the Tzar of Kislev during the Great War Against Chaos. He fought and wounded Valnir the Reaper.

but this one would be a very important and likely big tiddy kislev tzarina of the time period
>Kattarin the Bloody (2315 - 2471 IC) - Tzarina Kattarin the Bloody was turned into a Lahmian Vampire late in her reign. She was killed and frozen solid by her son in a block of ice. Her corpse remains in the Bokha Palace as a warning to other Vampires

I'm genuinely curious to see if any anons will actually collect a Cathay army. I very much doubt it!

>>95855813
Not really sure why the Empire would march all the way across the Darklands to screw with the ogres....

>>95855806
>archie needs to just pay greasus pennies and the ogres keep causing enough ruckus that cathay can never spare forces to clear the growing Chaos hordes next to the bastion
Truly he is a Lord of the End Times.

>>95855790
>let's see the AJ
It's possible they do make it grimmer, but this has been said for years.
>oh they're only making Cathay seem amazing in Total Warhammer 3 for pre-release hype, the game version will be more gritty
>oh okay the TW3 one was quite mary-sue-y, but once TOW comes out we'll get a more gritty version since GW is making it
>oh okay so the prerelease articles are making them seem perfect, but that's just marketing! The AJ will surely make them seem more gritty
>you are there ^
>okay so the AJ didnt cover anything of note and Cathay is still pretty perfect, but the second AJ WILL add the grit.

>>95855755
It may be unfair of me to judge Cathay from a warcom article but while it's true that every faction is bigged up in their own fluff they're also presented as having insurmountable problems.
High elves are both super strong and a mix between doggerland and post-Suez Britain that gets invaded by the Irish on a regular basis.

>>95855830
i think it was more to force to Orges to go through the Darklands and invade the Empire or something the goal is rather wide and vague

>>95855741
>Tau caste system makes them more like India desu
But they're intelligent and don't smell bad.

>>95855850
Not to mention, some of them are good pilots

>>95855849
I'd still expect them to go through Kislev for that since Kislev apparently has control of territory on the other side of the mountains of mourne.

>>95855741
>Dungeep crashed the Devilfish

>>95855843
>ulthuan is British
Jesus fucking christ go back to /pol/ or better off outside for a very long time.
High elves are Tolkien elves and ulthuan is Atlantis.

>>95855861
I'm not sure they do by 2512. The Great War does a rather big number of Kislev

>>95855850
>intelligent
>tried to make a deal with dark eldar and green skins, and tyranids

And they already have a stink issue back when death guard visited them.

>>95855671
OMG they are Asur tier.

>>95855850
Didn't Xenology or Uplifting Primer say they are bovine and probably smell of dung?

>>95855850
my trusty imperial infantryman's uplifting primer (damocles gulf edition) says otherwise!

>>95855824
Romanoff is what's given for TOW. Shame, because it's a shit name.

Everyone always forgets that Kislev was ruled by vampires from basically the end of the Great War up until the the 'modern day' (2471 is with the lifetime of all the major human characters).

>>95855886
to be fair, nobody really cares about kislev

>>95855837
I am going to be devils advocate here and while I understand the proposed issue, I am not entirely against a faction being less gritty than the rest. What in principal is wrong with that?

I know some anons still hate china cause /pol/ but besides that

>>95855867
>drawing parallels with the high elves losing their empire and decolonization is /pol/ or something
You're actual fucking idiot.

>>95855892
>What in principal is wrong with that?
The fact it doesn't fit in the world. You could add a race of stormcast living in the Chaos Wastes by that logic. Would it make the setting better?

>>95855892
Because it's warhammer

>>95855894
If the Ulthuani isolation is a reference to British decolonization instead of the retreat of Elves in LotR, that would make the current inhabitants of those old colonies (Empire and Bretonnia) analoguous to Africans and Indians.

>>95855894
You retarded pol secondary it's been stated as such. Read a warhammer book or go fuck off nigger

>>95855812
Kislev will have 2 named characters.
The captain of the Gryphon Legion and an Ungol version of Princess Mononoke.
The two IoA will be Forces of the Ice Court and Ungol nomads.
My source's are the cryptic visions I see in my night terrors

>>95855916
>spoiler
Are you Night Terrors full of Bears and Ice?

>>95854926
I like how Cathay is depicted in Total War (they are miles ahead of Kislev) but this article rubs me the wrong way. Cathay is definitely not squeaky clean in the game. Hoping the AJ goes into that.

>>95855894
It's rather clear that the Dark elves are basically Melnibonians and the High Elves are Tolkien elves + atlantis

>>95855920
I see Warbear riders and sleds, but no giant Ice Bears (yet).

>>95855916
Honestly better that I expect them to get.

>>95855892
It has become apparent that the slippery slope is not actually a fallacy.
It's tragic that they didn't even bother to try making cathay feel like a warhammer faction.

>>95855921
Cathay is unironically your typical WH40k planet that only has to deal with Greenskins on occasion.
It's not a great place to live but unless a Waagh comes by you'll generally be fine..... remember Hive worlds aren't the standard, mechanicum worlds aren't the standard. The standard is boring agriworlds where shits boring till the greenskins show up and you either die or they die. Also the governor is a cunt that can't be bothered to care about you one way or another.

I see the Cathay blogs have yet to address some critical questions.

>>95855757
I don't see how having 1 freshly arrived Cathayan amabassador in Altdorf in the 2500's contradict having a lot of Cathayans merchants in Marienburg in the 2300's

>>95855939
>It's not a great place to live
idk, we know their peasants and commoners are the best off in the entire world. Seems pretty nice? As well as the absence of pretty much all Chaos cults except Tzeentch's

>>95855952
It doesn't, but it does contradict what GW said, there weren't any links between The Empire and Cathay by the time of Karl Franz

>>95855955
Having a nation wide tzeentchian cult seems like a very serious problem.

>>95855955
I'm pretty sure Estalian and Tilean peasants have it better since rice farming is more grueling work and they share the same risks (cultists, occasional Skaven, greenskins, ogres, pirates/dark elf pirates)

>>95855850
>don't smell bad

>>95855983
There's also of course Ulthuan that.... i think they just don't have peasants.

>>95855830

>>95855922
None of the presented motifs are in any way exclusive. I'd frankly argue that the high elves have way more of melnibone in them than you seem to be willing to give them credit for.
>>95855915
Stop making an ass of yourself you hysteric.
>>95855910
That would be the africans and indians in the Southlands and Kuresh.

>>95855892
>What in principal is wrong with that?
Because then it just turns out that everyone else is retarded and being evil for no real reason.

>>95855822
Don't forget
>Strongest dead mage in the world who still doesn't give a fuck that he is dead

>>95855939
Fuck off 40k kiddie
God the roaming secondaries are out in force today. Summer or just these losers see an opening to force their retarded politics into a setting they know little about?

>>95855988
nah, Ulthuan has peasants, but they live rather comfy Arcadia of Ulthuan

>>95856005
So you're saying that most worlds in WH40k are all war all the time hellscapes instead of boring shit holes?

>>95855982
Nah, they got the epic crowmen who uproot every chaos cult they find! (again, GW says they are a nation at peace compared to the Empire).
>>95855983
Estalians and Tileans have to deal with Undead, Chaos, and Ratmen (and occasional TK/DE/Greenskins).

>>95855995
Except Fortress of Dawn, Gates of Calith and Tor Elasor were not abandoned when the colonists were recalled, just the Old World. Tor Elasor was sacked by Lokhir but otherwise they're still there.

The funniest take in this thread is that post 6e brettonia is nuanced.

>>95855996
Survival, instinct, politics, plenty of reasons to be evil.

>>95855973
>JTY: From our point of view, Grand Cathay is connected to the Old World through Kislev – far more than during the Era of Karl Franz, because by then the world has changed.
>Rob: Grand Cathay has more or less given up on the Old World by the time of Karl Franz, and they are too busy defending against Chaos invasions from the north.
It doesn't say they no longer have any contact with the Empire, just less.

>>95855892
>I am not entirely against a faction being less gritty than the rest. What in principal is wrong with that?
Because it's missing the heart and soul of warhammer. China is historically way more grimdark than France and they're just not going to mine any of that gold?

>>95855892
>What in principal is wrong with that?
asymmetrical and atonal worldbuilding

the humans of the old world are characterised in that way specifically because the world is made to be a very dangerous and crooked place, which forces and exacerbates compromises and imperfections, and these issues are also fundamental in supporting a setting where wars, even nonsensical ones by our real world standards, can happen and even happen as often as the needs of the players.
the moment you write up a human nation but in a way that doesn't have similar or equivalent problems, it's the moment you have effectively turned the grimdark worldbuilding into grimderp worldbuilding, because it's no longer a result of necessity but a result of how dumber the people of the old world are compared to this new people.

and mind you, I'm not even against a cleaner aesthetic for models, or for cathay to be characterised as it has been so far, but I want cracks under the face value to be present and explored:
you want to tell me how unanimously harmonious the nation is thanks to its nonhuman leaders? tell me about the inhuman policies they enact to create and mantain consensus
you want to tell me cathay is a more special more magical place than almost anywhere else on the world? tell me why and how, there's a very low hanging plot hook about how the emperor may be hijacking the geomantic web to artificially saturate his land with the magic and climate more akin to the world he was born into, that's a source of conflict with factions (WE, lizards, HE), as well as potentially a matter of unease for the human population that would be living in an environment from before their race came to be
you want everything about cathay to be about not!primarchs? fine, but show me the problems of having a nation where humans are objectively an inferior species unable to rise to any real status
you want a prosperous trade and commerce? give me the rotten side of those away, don't shy away from history

>Asur
Athenians
>Druchii
Spartans
Simple as'

>>95856034
I mean, both countries are renowned for mass peasant/civilian suffering to the point of absurdity. Never mind the usual lay suffering like starvation and such. What could they add to make it a bit more grimey?

>>95856019
I don't give a flying fuck about your 40k head Canon becsuse I'm here to talk about my dudes in fantasy you absolute no games loser.
>where are yours blah blah
I posted mt maiden guard update and am tempted to show my lower effort speed paint glade guard which... I dunno not proud of but certainly not ashamed of. Table top std for certain. Takes 15 minutes a model tho.

>>95855947
it's magic, the clothes aren't her body and they get transformed as well into the dragon's clothes

>>95856021
Cathay has various Tzeentch cults and Beichai especially has them popping up every time after Yin-Yin tries to purge them, as well as Undead, Greenskins, Ogres and Skaven (warpstone desert is supposed to be overrun with them). The southern provinces also get nagas which is more common than Tomb King attacks since Khuresh is bordered by sea in all other directions while Nehekhara has hostile living neighbours in all directions except direct east.

>>95856042
So, essentially: You want substance which gives Cathay more depth and beyond being a two dimensional goody two shoes faction? Yeah, I can agree to that. Wouldn't mind Miao Ying being a de facto pragmatic leader, sacrificing soldiers and peasants, entire villages, for the greater good.

>>95855933
>not actually a fallacy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope
Just FYI, but Slippery Slope was never a true fallacy. It was an "informal" fallacy, but never an actual one. Slippery Slope arguments CAN be good arguments (can also be bad ones) but they're not inherently invalid like Redditards would like you to believe.

>>95856054
All i'm saying is that Cathay is basically the boring parts of Warhammer we never hear about because nothing much happens there instead of it not fitting. As we get more context around Cathay i'm sure stuff will start happening to them and we'll see them as deep in the shit as anyone else. Most notably Ogre Kingdoms if they ever get a release.

>>95856025
In comparison to 5e Stillman Bretonnia? Absolutely.
Nigel Stillman is responsible for some of Warhammer's worst worldbuilding, honestly. I guess it was at least earnest.

Outside le meme 90% taxes or whatever, Knights of the Grail actually put some effort into looking at the contradictions in Bretonnian society, showing that the nobility were attempting to uphold their virtues but fell short. That some were genuinely attempting good, some were just massive hypocrites and everything in between.
It wasn't the best thing they could have done, but it was a good job given what they had to work with.

>>95856052
Lots more slavery, famine and cannibalism. Also having their direct ruler and his children being a bunch of immortal dragons was a bad idea, constant turmoil and civil wars would actually explain why Cathay isn't seen much outside is borders, and be more true to China.

>>95856060
>Cathay has various Tzeentch cults
Which apparently do fucking nothing, since Cathay is a realm at peace according to the designers. If you have a cult and it doesn't do anything, do you really have one?
>warpstone desert is supposed to be overrun with them
ahh yes, the desert where no one lives is filled with monsters. Very grim.
>Nagas to the south
Which haven't really done any damage, again since Cathay is a realm at peace.
1-800-CMON-NOW

>>95856081
GW has said the dragons do civil war when daddy is not home, and when he is like during the reign of Franz, they've got their hands full with local issues.

>>95856063
>more depth
yes
I want a "because" and "but" to every statement

>>95856073
>All i'm saying is that Cathay is basically the boring parts of Warhammer we never hear about because nothing much happens there instead of it not fitting
Anon how DENSE are you? The fact nothing happens there is WHY it doesn't fit. It is W A R hammer. Just stop posting about the setting if you don't understand it, damn man.

>>95856042
This. All of this.

Dragon primarchs was a mistake. Cathay should be ruled by dynasties of mortal men and scheming eunuchs.

Imagine needing peasants to attend your crops.

>>95855892
Nothing people just like to complain and Cathay is the new kid

>>95856093
Boy god help you when you actually read a warhammer book and realize how often high elves are at complete peace

>>95856093
That's the fun thing anon, they are here now
Now we get Ogre Kingdoms in their west, Khuresh to their south, Nippon to their east (they are said to be full of chaos shit) and good ol' chaos to the north. 2 of these things we are almost certain to get, Nippon and Khuresh i'm more doubtful on but maybe.... suffice to say stop being a whiney bitch and except that we'll get more armies going forward and they will fuck up Cathay at their leisure while the army is away.

>>95856086
Cathay is at peace during ToW which is the given reason they can be involved in the Old World in the first place.

>>95856081
>slavery, famine and cannibalism

Slavery isn't getting touched by anyone in the entertainment hemisphere right now. Thank you American Black Obsession!

>famine

Ok, that's cool.

>cannibalism

Never heard of this beyond ghouls of Sylvania and AoS Khorne.

>Bretonnian have Moussillon
>Empire have Sylvania
Cathay have ??

>>95856124
>Boy god help you when you actually read a warhammer book and realize how often high elves are at complete peace
Ah yes the declining race who got their shit kicked in so hard by dwarfs and the DE civil war that they had to abandon their colonies and are dying out. Not even comparable.
>>95856127
Cathay is at peace for 90% of their history apparently, and the 10% they weren't? Well we just learned that it was apparently planned by the Dragon Emperor.

>>95856139
Anything parallel to the great bastion, beastmen. Nippon, ogres, chorfs.

>>95856139
Jade Vampires cults in the central river Basin maybe
Jade Vampires are Canon, but the only place with any info on them is a piece of apocrypha for WFRP that was never official published

>>95855892
While I'm actually inclined to partially agree with the notion of having a "pure" faction, the intent being laid out in the articles themselves that it was only because of a "cultural sensitivity team" breathing down their necks that they're so super good and perfect and invented blackpowder before anyone and only want the best for humanity leaves a bad taste.

>>95856145
The Old World period is not 90% of the time though, also if abandoning the throne and causing a civil war between the kids was part of some plan that just makes the Emperor a dick which is grimdark (see 40k).

>>95856139
Anything under the direct control of Yin Yin

>no skulls=no Warhammer
simple as

>>95856145
They have been at peace in the current setting long time and are mainly doing their own thing
Again, reading a book instead of being assmad based on surface takes might be good for you long term. High elves are more often in peace or at limited war vs dark elves than at war.
And Cathay does decline. TOW is during a chaos wane.

>>95856145
The war of the beard was 4000 years ago and the HE/DE civil was 1000 years before that. Pretty sure even elves consider that a long time.

Assembling the metal warhawk wings was an utterly horrible experience

>>95856160
We live in an age where we have absurd notions like "cultural appropriation" and other ridiculous things, I actually think GW using a sensitivity team was smart. If they had influence over the squeaky clean Chinese presentation, we will find out.

Case in point: Assassins Creed Shadows which completely fucked everything up so hard, it was a catastrophe and offended *everyone*. Even the Japanese!

>>95856187
I dread the day I get warhawk riders myself
Hate those old fiddly flight stands

>>95856177
That's only the Empire, Chaos, Orcs/Goblins and the undead factions.
The Dwarfs, Elves, and other human factions don't really have the Memento Mori obsession like the Empire did

>>95856188
>we will find out.
they literally told us already

>>95856188
Not everyone. Outragetubers made big bucks. It wouldn't be surprising if some developers have backroom deals with them to put outrageous shit in the games and get a cut from the influencers.

>>95855892
Personally the issue is that in a wargame you can have an irredeemable bad guy but you can't have a unsullied good guy. There need to be a legitimate argument for why any particular force would be fighting each other, even within their own faction. IF you don't have any "grit" as it were there is no justification for conflict so it just becomes, the default hero and everyone else who are just wrong. It feel false and pisses every one who is a fan of the other factions off because sure you might not be the "good guy" but at your faction is not [insert factional failing here].

>>95856177
Dwarfs don't have a lot of skulls.

>>95856205
that's one dumb conspiracy theory

>>95856177
>Rob: Importantly, this is a Warhammer take on China. Warhammer is a lot of things, but there are simple tropes that unite it: it’s skulls, it’s death, it’s grimness. But for cultural reasons, many of these signifiers don’t align with a Chinese influence design language, so we had to think about which other levers we could pull to make sure it was Warhammer.

>Owen: Both Creative Assembly and a Chinese sensitivity team were very helpful, providing guidance documents to ensure we understood China and didn’t make the wrong move. There are various symbols to avoid, and referencing skulls or gruesome body horror as part of the Grand Cathay visual language were ones we were keen to avoid.

>Mark: There are certain styles of clothing and hair which signify darker periods in Chinese history. We had to be respectful of those, alongside these other considerations.

It does very much seem like the CCP was breathing down their necks to make sure everything was squeaky clean desu

>>95856186
It's certainly not a time where any normal elves are alive, as the normal lifespan for HE is about 870+, maybe some HE reaching 1000+

>>95856224
This annoys me because Cathay isn't fucking China. Its a fantastical make believe nation that is inspired by China. It shouldn't have to adhere to exact IRL Chinese principles. And let's be honest fucking no one in China is going to be buying this at all and thus no one is going to care. This will be bought by a small cohort of Warhammer playing weeabos in the West.

>>95856224
It's also silly when you have plenty of media created in China that would be considered Grimdark with Body Horror and general Grubbyness, but apparently that only allowed for Chinese-made products

>>95856198
That some people only complain about that now when it's Cathay and not when it's high elves or dwarfs just shows it's the usual suspects.

>>95856181
Not taking suggestions from someone who can't even read the article linked.
>>95856224
Yes only the most delusional GW paypiggies are defending the saccharine take on Cathay

>>95856272
elves and dwarfs are not humans and have their own racial and cultural flaws and issues, so no, it's definitely not the big racist anti-chinese boogeyman, anon.

I hate grimderp faggots so much
>it's summer
No wonder

>>95856281
What about Tilea, Estalia, Brettonia or Kislev then?

>>95856281
Cathay is a kingdom of dragons with humans as pets, but dragons can be very possessive about what they consider theirs.

>>95856252
>And let's be honest fucking no one in China is going to be buying this at all and thus no one is going to care
Doesn't matter one bit. You could have exactly zero interest from the chinese market but China will STILL 100% boycott your product with the might of their government if you make a "wrong" depiction of something that can be assumed to be Chinese. Companies work under this permanent fear.

What saddens me more about this squeaky clean Cathay is that it just makes the whole place more boring. If you're not directly at the two frontlines north and south then pretty much nothing happens. Come on. You have a whole Skaven clan under you scheming and profiting from political conflict, a branch of vampires and necromantic followers, and an infestation of Tzeentch cults to shake things around. Use that.

I can only hope this is just the sales pitch, like a foreigner's look into the nation, and the second AJ introduces all of the inner problems Cathay really suffers from.

>>95856281
Yeah, High Elves have basically given up on the world and are dying out due to apathy and loss of their preeminence. Dwarfs are fighting a losing battle to keep what remains of their holds. Cathay are... the world's strongest empire, a land at peace, and free of most Chaos cults. Very balanced.

>>95856277
You can't even read a warhammer book so thanks for conceding you don't understand the setting. Now post models you at least have those right?

>>95856295
You must be dumb to have missed the grim extremes of their societies.

bretonnians carry around dead knights for fuck's sake.

It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that modern GW is not going to make anything interesting. Especially if it's a non-European culture. They're just not going to do anything that could be risky.

>>95856312
People need to calm down the faction is brand new and not even out, give it some time and we will see more flaws like Tau did in 40k.

Cathay in TWWH3 had some dark bits being completely infiltrated by tzeentch cults and dissenters being sent to secret reeducation camps and chinks still bought the shit out of that game. Although granted it was all fluff text and not front and center

>>95856297
You're not supposed to breed with your pets anon...

>>95856313
You retard they are extremely active in old worlds time frame. They aren't allied with humans yet but are on a renewed push of trade and haven't been reduced further by the great War.
God summer hit this thread all at once

>>95856371
What about your pet's pet?

>>95856372
>You retard they are extremely active in old worlds time frame.
Actively losing their colonies and getting their shit pushed in by TK in the Badlands. HE are an Empire reduced to having watchtowers in random places. Cathay is the world's preeminent Empire who is at peace and has no real negatives. They are not the same and your anger here just proves you know I am right, but do not want to admit it.

>>95856410
Lol those happened way before the current timeline lorelet
Fucking secondaries man

>>95856410
>the world's preeminent Empire
Is, has been and will always be the Under-Empire yes-yes

>>95856410
>empire reduced
They are literally everywhere in the world but mainland old world (and per their AJ do often send expeditions) because of the peace treaty with dwarves. They aren't implied to even realize they are dying until after the great war iirc when the was some lore blurb about then realizing their halls and towns are more and more empty. At this point high elves are still the top in regards to influence accross the globe.

>>95856424
>Lol those happened way before the current timeline
No Anon, Tor Anrok falls to the Tomb King in 2278 at the start of TOW, that's the event that anon is referencing

>>95856424
... one of the AJ covers one of their towers getting destroyed. C'mon man, it's clear your projecting your wiki knowledge onto others if you can't even bother reading the newest stuff.
>>95856442
>They are literally everywhere in the world
On small islands or watchtowers. They used to have vast colonies and actually settled places. HE are MUCH reduced from their Golden age at this point, c'mon now. You can't be serious.

>>95856448
>1 city is lost
>world wide empire is no more
lol no the fucker is trying to say high elves are reduced at this point when in their lore they were very active across the world still.

>secondaries fighting
>no models posted
I now hate cathay for the nogames it brought to ruin this thread. any of you fucks want to post your work? or a batrep you did? I'd almost welcome greytide at this point.

>>95856461
It wasn't even a city, it was just a Watchtower with a Garrison force

>>95856461
No, you just have really bad reading comprehension (ESL?). They're reduced greatly from their Golden Era/Highest Point. That doesn't mean they don't have any watchtowers left.

>>95856470
Well here is the speedpaint wood elf. God these models are...I dunno what exactly is wrong but they don't exude grace. Maybe the faces or their poses being squat but it feels off.
Anyways let me know when some actual fantasy occurs instead of kids arguing about shit they watched in a YouTube video.

>>95856474
>Long ago, the Elves suffered a great loss at the hands of the Dwarfs during the War of the Beard and got pushed out of their colonies on the mainland. They agreed not to return to the land they knew as Elthin Arvan, but that didn't mean they had to go too far. They withdrew to the islands, and that is what allows them to maintain their position as a global naval superpower. Control of the seas is what matters to the Elves, because from there they can control the lands – even if the Dwarfs might dispute their ‘control’ of the Old World…
superpower is a word certainly used to describe weak nations.

>>95856508
>N A V A L superpower.
Read anon, read! They have the best navy. And that's literally it. You really are ESL, huh.

>>95856508
it can definitely get used when the nation remains somewhat influential despite its objectively significant loss of power and presence

>>95854926
>There's vampires in Cathay but no body horror because that's not warhammer haha :) also the CCP heavily censors stuff like that
I'm genuinely disgusted at all involved

>286 comments
>2 model pics posted
>0 batreps
I hope all of your are molested by your teachers upon your return to school in a few months, useless faggots

>>95856552
>inb4 instead of actual undead the jade blooded vampires have kiddie friendly jade zombies from kung fu panda

>>95855908
So high elves and dwarves don't fit into the warhammer world?

Is bretonnian exiles the best list if I want to wield a low fantasy army that can participate in all phases of the game and have black powder weapons? No Pegasus knights of course.

>>95856626
HE have been reduced to a fraction of their former power and glory, have had the northwest half of their island sunken, and are dying out due to no babies. Dwarfs are getting their shit pushed in and have lost their ancestral holds and are barely scraping by.

Mind explaining how these are the same as Cathay?

>>95855822
Based rocks enjoyer

>>95856042
>the humans of the old world are characterised in that way specifically because the world is made to be a very dangerous and crooked place,

I don't see why that has to be something true about humans generally, seems arbitrary to say "well it's fine if elves or dwarves are like this but humans need to be grimdark because other humans are"

>>95856638
you're not going to get to use your historicals but no, its still going to use magic and monsters
>>95856643
You've been called out several times already and no point in further arguing. models btw?

>>95856354
>give it some time
we have had articles, descriptions and more for almost 4 years now, and the elements people have asked for have been exclusively headcanon, speculation and wishes for the future.

have a /v/erminous meme chosen exclusively to fuel anon's paranoia about secondaries or tourists that just so happens to flare up whenever there's any sort of negativity, because justified negativity surely cannot possibly exist.

>>95856086
>this one article didn't cover it so it's impossible for it to be happening

>>95856281
Asserting that all human factions have to have the same themes is a bit silly.

>>95855684
If they think that will make the current CCP forget the shit they did in Hong Kong they are solely mistaken

>>95855780
> Perryfag schizo
Seek help (ie a noose)

>>95856655
>You've been called out several times already and no point in further arguing.
Stop getting mad an address the point. What does Cathay have that is comparable? What's that, you can't answer?
>exclusively headcanon, speculation and wishes for the future.
This is what annoys me the most. You ask where the grimness is, they INSIST its there, and when you ask for proof they go "well uhhh its implied that", no, fuck off.
>>95856687
It didn't happen anywhere, anon. And as the other poster above me pointed out, its been YEARS and it still hasn't.

>>95856552
>why no Body horror
Anon this isn't 40k, the only factions with body horror are the "evil" factions

>>95856713
What did GW do in Hong Kong?

Cathay is more powerful at sea than High Elves because High Elves named their dragonships as tribute to Yin-Yin.

>>95855892
Because you can't have one faction playing it straight it makes everyone else seem retarded

>>95856647
>well it's fine if elves or dwarves are like this
elves or dwarfs are like this because these problems have been traded for others, such as kingdoms long past their prime and destructive flaws in their respective mentalities, and they are allowed to be better than humans because they're races characterized by being better than humans, they're more intelligent, long lived, with a stronger aptitude/resistance to magic, and more skilled in many if not most things, it's a necessary part of making them elves and dwarfs and not just humans (atlantis) and humans (short).
humans (eastern) instead are meant to be still just humans and should be flawed and characterised as humans are, or if their problems are traded for others then there must be an exploration of how that is.
It would be one thing if the entire race of cathayans was dragon blooded and so inherently inhuman, but that's not the case.

>>95856643
So it's not an issue of themeing you're just ass mad at the idea the new kid is stronger then /yourguys/?

>>95856732
Tell that to Karl Franz's mutant son he hides in his basement.

>>95856728
>It didn't happen anywhere, anon. And as the other poster above me pointed out, its been YEARS and it still hasn't.

>why does new faction not have years worth of lore made for it?????????

>>95856042
Tileans and Estalians are stereotypical Mediterraneans, there's nothing about them that's more gritty than we know Cathay to be.

>>95856754
That got retconned
His son is now just a chubby chaser.

>>95856728
ill bother responding once you post your dudes. can't argue in good faith vs those with no investment.

>>95856761
>>why does new faction not have years worth of lore made for it?????????
You don't need years of lore anon, but we have an entire video game and now official studio discussions about Cathay being the bestest, greatest, most peaceful Empire in the world. We don't need years of stuff, we need anything. The one thing we did have that made them look troubled (Monkey King seizing the throne) turned out to be just part of the Dragon Emperor's plan, so even THAT didn't reflect poorly on them in the end.

>>95856748
>It would be one thing if the entire race of cathayans was dragon blooded and so inherently inhuman, but that's not the case.

They're governed by the dragon blooded, should dark elves be just like the human factions because most of their population is human slaves?

>>95856749
No, I just want things to fit into the setting. Mary Sue Cathay does not. But enjoy your floating castles (lmao). Straight out of Age of Sigmar, that.
>>95856773
>won't bother responding because he can't
>still responds anyways
I hope you realize how mad and wrong you look to the anons here.

>>95856754
Cool anon, how does that affect the game? Is Karl Francis mutant son a unit choice in the empire army list?

>>95856666
There are a grand total of 6 articles on GWs website that mention Cathay and 2 of those are WH3 stuff.

>>95856698
The question is what warhammer themes it has at all.
What actually makes it a faction for warhammer instead of another game?

Even AoS does a better job of utilising existing motifs.

>>95856754
>>95856771
KF's son war never a mutant, that was his nephew.

Luitpold's been a thicc appreciator since 1991.

>>95856779
>You don't need years of lore anon, but we have an entire video game

Whose lore completely contradicts your point lol.

>>95856796
If he isn't Empire is being mary sue AoSwashed

>>95856796
It's a central plot point of one of the most famous rpg campaigns ever written, but don't let interrupt that your dumb crusade.
The RPG exists and is a game that people play.

>>95856794
why would someone out themselves as a nogame this badly?

>>95856736
What the British did?
Deliberately destabilized HK, in spite of a treaty they signed agreeing not to do the same, during the final few years of British HK control.
To say the central government was pissed was a severe understatement

>>95856828
Yeah, and Franz's Nephew is no longer a horrible Mutant in the most recent version of TEW that got retconned

>>95856794
AAHHHHH I'M LOSING MY MIND WARHAMMER MAN

>>95856741
>Cathay is more powerful at se-

>>95856835
Okay, but what did GW have to do with Hong Kong outside of being a UK company?

>>95856804
>The question is what warhammer themes it has at all

It's a fantasy nation directly based on a historic culture.

>>95856794
>Floating castles straight out of Age of Sigmar
oh so you are a baby secondary

>>95856771
>His son is now just a chubby chaser.
Based

>>95856828
>rpg lore

Lol #1 hallmark of a secondary

>>95856835
We were so based once...

>>95856821
>Whose lore completely contradicts your point lol.
No, nothing in the TW3 events/faction stuff makes Cathay look bad. Please point some out, if they're so obvious.
>>95856834
Still not answering the question anon.
>>95856841
Notice how those flying towers never actually appeared in game or had lore for them?
Almost like GW realized they were shitty ideas...
>>95856855
Show me those floating castles outside of that one image that never appeared anywhere else anon. We're waiting.

>>95856876
anon your shoulden't have asked
>https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Fozzrik%27s_Flying_Fortress

>>95856876
I'm on your side when it comes to thinking Cathay is mary sue and gay as fuck, but the entire Blood in the Badlands campaign was based around trying to seize Fozzrik's Flying Fortress

>>95856785
That's the most disingenuous false equivalence you could possibly conjure, do I really have to explain to you why the characterisation of citizens and the characterisation of slaves and cattles are very different things when talking about a nation?

>>95856849
That's enough for the CCP to be looking for a reason to fuck them over

>>95856139
the entirety of the warpstone desert

>>95856886
Anon I am begging you to read the things you linked. That was a single fortress noted for its utter uniqueness and not the thing in the image linked earlier. You're so damn hungry for a win you're not even realizing what you're arguing at this point.

>>95856839
Depends on when we're talking.

>>95856852
Not enough, and even then only just.

>>95856852
>tfw you have been running a warhammer rpg almost every week for the last 15 years
It's true, anon. Only you 'play' 'games'.

>>95856889
The images I referred to weren't Fozzrik's Fortress, anon. It's strawman argument.

>>95856876
>doesn't know floating castles
also fwiw realm of chaos has some examples
>the humiliation of the secondary continues
this could all be prevented by posting your dudes. I guess you will have to suffice as an example of the retardation being a secondary brings to hobby spaces

>>95856766
Tileans and Estalians make no attempt to pretend they don't have any of the issues normal humans in the empire face, and they already trade prominence in the grand scheme of things for either a near absence of worldbuilding or comical infighting.
But, hell, even then their primacies and survival are explained directly in their armybook.

>>95856904
https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Drifting_Castle

Here's another one

>>95856779
The Monkey King retcon is complete bullshit and pretty much guarantees we'll never get him on the table top, it's a real shame since he's one of the most intriguing Cathay characters despite having like two lines of text about him

>>95856927
Counter point
the time that the Monkey king takes over in lore hasn't actually happened yet.

>>95856927
They keep mentioning him, and GW is very aware that China loves the Monkey King, so I disagree with you here and think GW will make a model of him at some point, maybe not in this release or the next release, but at some point

>>95856916
>>95856924
It's literally a product of a hell dimension from the chaos wastes. Far different than a regular city filled with regular humans living normal lives.
Same reason soul grinders fit the setting since they're from figurative hell but the Empire producing its own version of them would be retarded.

>>95856950
>there's no floating castles in warhammer
>uhh those don't count
Also lizards have a few iirc. Just admit you're a tourist and move onto whatever next board you'll shit up

>>95856968
lizards aren't humans.

>>95856950
>capital city of the moon dragon and oldest magic dragon
>a regular city filled with regular humans living normal lives

>>95856968
There are no floating castles participating in large scale battles on the regular, yes. They are EXTREMELY RARE and products of foul magics. You'd love the Mortal Realms, I think.

>>95856470
From before but the Dwarfs fought on a hill for a Heroic Last stand. However the Chaos overwhelmed and butchered them to a dwarf. Was fun too, as my opponent was using a dwarf which counted all areas within 9" as dangerous terrain, so we imagined it was like a ditch.

I really hope they don't make kislev with the tww designs they're so bad

>>95856977
there are floating islands and towers all over cathay, it's not just the capital

>>95856977
Regular humans do live there, anon. Try, try again.
I think, also, you need to realize that GW sometimes adds retarded shit to the setting. Are you going to defend End Times as being good and Warhammer-y since GW made it? (Who am I kidding, of course you would).

>>95856999

>>95856999
ok? so what's the big deal? It's a land filled with magic, of course magic stuff happens

>>95856968
Isn't one of the Pyramids in Khemri a flying city effectively?

>>95857001
regular humans live there because the magic dragon said so.

>>95856999
The anon you're responding to hasn't played TW3 to actually realize how High Fantasy Cathay are. I don't hate them but you could slot them in AoS's Mortal Realms with basically no issue.

>>95857006

>>95857010
The black Pyramid?
that can fly but stays on the ground for 99% of history and only starts flying in the End Times as Negashs base

fuck GW
fuck The Old World
fuck China
fuck 30mm bases
only the 6th edition for me

>>95857014
And that's gay and retarded and doesn't fit the setting and will continue to not fit until GW adds some grit to make it fit the rest of the factions.

>>95857021
Such historical fantasy. Much wow. Flying buildings so COOL. Gonna say my Stormcast are residents of that fortress.

>>95857032
pretty much, the more popular WH is in china the more likely they'll be able to get away with stuff i think, getting your foot in the door is the hard part as we saw with WoW

>>95856979
No because the models are gay. I actually like painting TOW. You...you don't know that feeling do you.. owning and playing...
>>95857010
I'm not sure on that desu but I'm having Mandela effect when you mentioned it
>model
When rushing got a pinch of green ink not dried mixed in and..well camera isn't the best but kind of works to add a slight hint of green to the hippies
I still think the guy making these models was on crack tho

>>95857008
>ok? so what's the big deal? It's a land filled with magic
the rest of the world, even the lands with a lot of magic like ulthuan, are not like this

if you want to worldbuild cathay as uncharacteristically full of magic compared to the rest of the world, and not just that but full of magic that just so happens to make mountains float instead of having any other kind of corrupting influence, which magic in warhammer normally does as a core tenet, then I expect the causes to be explained

it is a big deal because it flies in the face of expectations, and so far the only reason we're given for anything is "we've worked with a chinese sensitivity team to not make them as you expect them"

>>95857032
it may not fit the setting but it fits for a fantasy china place. numerous "china" with floating islands, like in Wow, avatar or that disney movie. Type "china floating islands" and you have it.
I guess it's just an easy trop, like dwarfs drinking beers, elves being arrogants or vikings attacking coastal towns

>>95857073
I feel i should point out that Ulthuan isn't so much an island as it is a giant floatation device.

>>95857008
Floating castles are supposed to be rare to the point that whole armies are mustered to try and sieze them and their goodies, kinda ruins it when cathay comes along and says shit like
>Nah mate, got loads of em back home, me dad has a flying house actually

>>95857099
How does the Volcano in Calador work then?

>>95855777
Checked. As written in the Great Plan

>>95856904
>That was a single fortress noted for its utter uniqueness
You know there's more than one, right?

>>95857110
>world dragon barfs
>lava comes out

>>95857108
>Floating castles are supposed to be rare
in the old world. Which doesn't includes Cathay or Lustria or the chaos wastes

早上好国泰
现在我有冰淇淋
我很喜欢冰淇淋
但是《战锤:旧世界》比冰淇淋

>>95857110
Aqshy shenanigans.

>>95857082
>it may not fit the setting
Yeah, and that's all the argument was about, in the end. Yes, they made a fantasy China. No, it is not Warhammer.

>>95856996
>9 inch bubble of dangerous terrain
Some rune I suppose? Rune of floor is lava?

If we all agree that current cathay sucks then why are we fighting each other anyway?

>>95857120
One sentence that has never been touched on or returned to again. The designers of TOW also claim there were hundreds of steam tanks but even their own AJ contradict that. One random sentence not backed up by anything else is not very convincing.

Back in 2003, people would have bitched on this very thread that fantasy egypt and mongolia don't fit the setting

>>95857128
They are still somewhat rare in Lustria, with maybe three canon examples found on the entire continent(The Great Confluance, The Floating Gardens of Bahb-Elonn and the Floating Gardens of Lost Xholankha)

>>95857157
>this guy doesn't know what lore is

>>95857149
No clue, it was the Arcane Journal character supposedly. I wasn't gonna argue, made for a fun concept and only the strong survive! Ironically no one died through running through.

>>95857159
Autism had not hit such critical mass in the early 2000s so I'd question that.

>>95857162
There's a 'floating village' in the badlands.
The little illustration on the map (6e O&G, I think?) made it clear the village was floating in a swamp. But as of TOW, the village is flying.

Perfect example of high magic creep, I'd say.

>>95857208
>as of TOW, the village is flying.
What gives you that impression?
I don't think it's had new lore in TOW outside of just showing up on the map

>>95857166
I guess we agree that Karl Franz has a mutant son, The Dragon Emperor is a human, Bretonnia is Pre-revolutionary France, and half-elves exist.
>>95857159
In fairness a lot of people did bitch about TK, which is why it sold so poorly.

>>95857208
is it? You'd think the location on the interactive map would have an option to click on the village if it was actually flying but it's just on the edge of the Marsh of madness.

You guys can (partly) thank this guy for the current Cathay architecture and even geography.

https://www.artstation.com/jimification

>>95857222
No, but we can agree your goalposts need to be tied down given how much they move around in this thread.

>>95857208
Yeah, even 8e started with that garbage really. Which makes sense since the people responsible also brought us AoS.

>>95857235
the rural buildings and the Empire buildings he designed seem alright

>>95857220
>>95857234
It's in a sidebar in the rulebook if I remember.

>>95857247
Could you provide a page extract or at least a page number?
This is starting to ring a bell for me as well

>>95857159
I don't care if the Han sensitivity team wants flying castles. I do care if their Confucian autism requires that all be right under heaven in fantasy Chyna where jovial peasants cultivate the land under the paternal gaze of wise scholar-bureaucrats while the rest of the world is populated by men who wear rats as hats and think Savonarola was a bleeding heart liberal and elves who sit around in partially submerged manors and think about how great everything was before they fucked it.

>>95857255
p117 of the main rulebook

>>95856944
I hope I'm proven wrong but even if they did a lot of the magic is gone now. He's not some monkey man who managed to swindle an entire empire from under the noses of celestial beings now, he's just an idiot who was played. There's no threat or agency there

>>95857267
Yeah, its such a retarded, pointless retcon. Adds nothing and makes Monkey King useless. Yipee?

>>95857264
not in the core TOW rulebook at least

The ravening horde or the forces of fantasy book?

>>95857273
Fuck's sake. It's p171.
This is what I get for phoneposting on the train. I'm shitting typos all over the place today.

>>95857289
Yeah, I just found it after speed reading the boo,k you're correct
But this may have been something from Blood in the Badlands originally there than new lore

>>95855780
I have a 3k narrative game on Saturday.
I will provide pictures from it even though my opponent will also have unpainted Daemons

>>95857431
So the 2nd Cathay AJ is apparently about an Invasion Fleet (as compared to the current Expeditionary fleet)...
Who are they invading?

>>95857455
Yin yin attempted to invade either the Southern Kingdoms or the Southlands at one point.

>>95857431
>>95857455
Sorry, did not mean to link your post.

>>95857455
Can someone point me to some decent dark riders sculptors/aftermarket stores?
Theyve been oos forever and the second hand market is getting ridiculous

>>95857463
Hmm... Southern Kingdoms as in the Southern Realms? Could tie in to the rumored Dogs of War release.

>>95857455
>>95857482
Whoops didnt mean to reply

1500pts battle between wood elves and ogres this saturday, set in the forest of Lorelorn, featuring this little guy

>>95857493
Maybe would be nice.

>>95857506
Looks great anon. Good luck vs the ogres!

>>95857506
That is a nice model anon, still I'd be terrified I'd snap some branches every time I took him off the shelf.

>>95857431
Enjoy brother. If you're the same skaven guy who agreed to not use magic vs the guy with a bloodthirster, be sure to fuck him up hard this time.

>>95857493
>A grand invasion force headed by an ageless dragon gets defeated by a rag tag bunch of scum who are only there so they can pay for another night of debauchery in the local tavern
That's our Yin Yin

>>95857542
he's quite sturdy. I'm more afraid for the metal models I'm assembling to reach 2000pts

>>95857455
Are they invading or being invaded?

>>95857624
I think invading since its their fleet.
>>95857555
That was my first guess but she doesn't have a banner so I figured she wouldn't be coming.
Also FIRST LOOK AT CATHAY MODELS IRL

>>95857652
Are people already showing off their Cathay models?

>>95857652
>Also FIRST LOOK AT CATHAY MODELS IRL
fake news
that's probably some 3D printed model based on reveal pics.

>>95854926
>genuinely good guys
>not lily white in virtue
What does that even mean?

>>95857727
they got some fucked up skeletons or whatever is acceptable to CCP in their closet.

>>95857727
that there's stuff behind the door, but they won't tell us what

>>95855299
Tau were better when they were completely good but naive aliens because while they completely stood out relative to all other races, they were also explicitly an insignificant power in the grand scheme of the setting.

>>95855299
>>95857797
You retards, tau had mind control baked into their faction since day one
DAY ONE

the only idiots who think the tau were flawless at any point are the kind of marinefags who couldn't tell an eldar from an ork

>>95857797
They were better when 40k fag's discussed 40k in one of the 40k generals faggot

>>95855420
Bretonnia is closer to their noblebright 5th edition rendition in TOW than their 6th edition mudcore grimdark rendition.

>>95857727
It means they're good, i.e. oppose chaos and want to keep their realm in order, but like Bretonnia or the Empire are still flawed realms.
Which when you are led by immortal dragons and their half-human progeny they keep making whom don't actually care about your life will lead to a lot of oppression.

>>95855777
What's the second fuck up? the second hurricane?

>>95857906
>Which when you are led by immortal dragons and their half-human progeny they keep making whom don't actually care about your life will lead to a lot of oppression.
Which isn't actually stated anywhere.

I can imagine Cathay being generally peaceful and orderly, but as soon as the siblings starts bickering it turns into
>Zhao Ming angers Li Dao over being served lukewarm tea
>256 million perish

>>95857965
Sad thing is, this is quite reminiscent of actual Chinese history...

Do the high elf gates ever send their forces abroad? Like would the garrison commanders send a party to the new world or would a noble request them to escort? Just rereading all these schemes for High Elves and wondering if any gate force would show up to an old world setting.

>>95857990
>China has a civil war large enough that outsiders actually notice it's happening, barely
>More dead than WW1

>>95857993
there's probably a lot of politicking about sending forces around, mostly as signs of good intentions between regions and nobles than for real military necessities

>>95857990
that's the joke

hey anons, playing my first game of mordheim tonight, making a mercenary band but not decided on a nation yet (thinking Marienburg because the extra gold sounds neat). Any general tips for stuff to pick or avoid?

>>95857727
I just wish they’d tell us what this is because every piece of lore we’re given just wanks them off and sounds like GW not wanting to piss off the CCP
>the best technology
>all peaceful and holding off chaos
>the monarchy are literally divine
>they have dragons
OC donut steel

>>95856057
Prove it. Show me where it says in the lore that her clothes aren't torn apart by her rapidly expanding breasts. Give me a source.

>>95858087
yeah iirc they do so within ulthuan, but wwasnt sure if they ever are sent far away from their posts. I figured they might rotate some troops to "active" areas for experience a la real life but wanted to make sure its at least not stated they dont in lore before I started painting

>>95858176
I've not played Mordheim, though I'd like too, but I hope you have fun anon
I do know that Slings are very good

>>95857965
Where's the "__ peasants eaten" image when you need it?

>>95858259
>best tech
How do you figure, Steam tank blows anything they have out of the water and even something like outrider pistoliers is way beyond the muskets we see cathay use in WH3

How many peasants does Bretonnia have anyway?

>>95858448
as many as the plot requires

>>95858329
Look, if she rips off her clothes with her transformation it means she couldn't reappear with clothes once going from dragon to human, but she does that
and also if her clothes rip off on their own then it means I can't be the one doing it myself, hell, it robs me of the experience of stealthily fucking her in her dragon form when noone is looking only for her to reappear as a normal clothed human a moment later to deal with political matters while trying to hide her still aroused state

you can't do that to me, I have my rights

>>95858448
Fantasy was more retarded with its logistics than even 40K so go with whatever

>>95858259
>their monarchy is literally divine
>unique to fantasy
Are Kurnous and Isha a joke to you? I suppose it's moreso Orion and Ariel are equivalent to the dragon children in relation to their gods bur Athel Loren is itself pretty unique in power and what it is.

>>95858626
orion is pretty much an elective title

>>95858709
So is being the Phoenix King

>>95858626
Yeah but nobody cares about wood elves so who really cares.

>>95858709
But Orion once he emerges is the avatar of kurnous. He is divine whatever that counts for.
>>95858721
Fair enough

>>95858329
WFRP rules (Winds of Magic p150) are that clothes are destroyed unless you're wearing robes infused with Ghur (Amber wizard robes, for instance), in which case they change with you.
The dragons probably have enchanted clothes.
This is a serious topic for serious people.

So what are the odds Kislev is going to be shit now that we know how Cathay is treated with kids gloves?

Is regular Goblin heavy Troll Horde viable or are Orcs mandatory for the leadership?

>>95854926
This is really reading like a fanfic take on WHFB. Like chaos was never a thing until this present moment in the canon.

>>95854926
>The Dragon Emperor is a long-established concept in Cathayan lore, but there was no particular mention that he was a dragon – we had his title, but not his species. However, it’s well known that dragons lived on the planet even before the Old Ones turned up, and we quickly came to understand him as one of the original inhabitants of the world. This weaves him into the setting, and sets him up in opposition to the Old Ones.
They could've just stepped back from the video game age of sigmar shit that's antithetical to Warhammer?

Reminder that the TOW intro articles originally divided all the factions into GOOD and EVIL before fan backlash made them change it. The TOW designers have a childish understanding of the setting.

>>95858259
>>the best technology
Incorrect
>>all peaceful and holding off chaos
Just like the other "good" factions sans the empire and lizardmen
>>the monarchy are literally divine
Chaos warriors are lead by the divine champion chaos, beastmen are led by morghur who is arguably divine, Setra is the chosen of the Nehekaran gods and can utilize their divine power, welves have Ariel and Orion, helves have the phoenix king.

Also it's debatable whether or not the dragon emperor is actually "divine" in the warhammer sense since he and his kin are very much flesh and blood creatures of natural origin, albeit very old powerful.

>>95855511
It’s kinda like the initial Kislev stuff they previewed with magic ice archers etc. if they had just shown off the models I’d still be hype, but the faction doesn’t feel like it fits at all. Even the high elves don’t have everyday magic and a floating magic city.

>>95855646
Absolutely not, Chinese warfare didn't use gunpowder beyond primitive clay pot bombs regardless of what the CCP say. It's the Arabs and Europeans who really used it as cannons and pistols

>>95859103
The emperor of cathay has been stated to be an immortal who is actually a dragon since at least 7th edition anon

>>95859103
GW developed Cathay for CA.

>>95859151
They did use Cannons, but they would objectively worse than anything found in Europe and the Middle East due to China's poor metallurgy and adding too much sulfur to the Gunpowder.

>>95859192
There's no real archaeological evidence for anything beyond primitive fireworks. I doubt Arabs/Europe even learnt of it from China

>>95856132
There are plenty of other wargames that have slaves. It’s just GW. Fucking hyperlib project Trench Crusade has slave-soldiers.

>>95859148
Anon the entire land mass of Ulthuan is a floating magic continent

>>95859225
That’s because trench crusade is utterly irrelevant. Muslims can’t even bomb or threaten them because they don’t have an office.

>>95856272
The high elves and dwarves are explicitly broken as civilisations, declining and on their way out. The only members of their races prospering are the ones who have embraced darkness and the pursuit of power. The failing of their idealistic civilisations is literally part of the dying of the light of the grimdark setting.

>>95859215
We're talking about the late 15th to early 17th century here, where there is at least some proof China had cannon, but China probably learnt to make cannons from European and Arab traders
if Kora had Cannons by this Time it stands to reason the Ming Dynasty had Cannons

>>95856741
That really made me laugh. If a fan had written that line people would mock it.

I don't even see the point from GW to insist that Cathay is "clean", i mean it's not like it's the 1st faction to be like this:
>lot of skull or "body horror" tier
Empire
Greenskins
Vampire Counts
Warriors of Chaos
Beastmen
Dark Elves
Skaven
Tomb Kings
Daemons
Chaos Dwarfs
Ogre Kingdoms
>Somehow there is one skeleton unit in the faction tier
Bretonnia
Lizardmen
>No skulls or "body horror " tier
Dwarfs
Wood Elves
High Elves
Kislev

Is there unironically a wu mao ITT?

>>95857965
They’re never, ever going to dig into the negatives anon.

>>95858176
I almost always roll Marienburg as mercs because an extra 100gc starting is sweet and the rare items search bonus is undervalued. Just stick to the regular Mordheim rules: armor isn’t worth it, max your number of heroes, boys before toys, and aim for a good rout break point (so either 9 or 13 models as Marienburg, most likely). If you want to be a bit flash with your extra gold blunderbusses, unlike most other gunpowder weapons, are actually good and a set of your duelling pistols on your captain is not a bad investment (regular pistols are pretty strictly a close combat weapon in Mordheim).

>Cathay announced.
>thread swarmed with pol talking about China and no games bemoaning Cathay as not warhammer.
>they fuck off like 2 threads later as they have nothing to contribute.
>thread returns to actual warhammer discussion and hobbying.
>yesterday more Cathay lore is released.
Secondaries and pol tards come to spam their inane bullshit once more.
To the few anons riding out the wave of retardation, I look forward to some batreps or model progress this weekend when I check back in

>>95859346
next thread will be fine unless C7 release that new High elf book tommow

>>95859013
Kislev will be like it is in TWW3.
They'll might downplay the Gospodar/Ungol divide and call stuff like Ungol horse archers "Kislevite horse archers."

Way too many posts about it to bother giving all of them a (you), but I'm seeing accusations thrown around of people being "40k secondaries" while the obsession with skulls (compared to previous usage) and überdeath are literally later imports from 40k.

I completely agree that Cathay is boring, but there's a difference between a fun setting with conflicts and edgy depression porn for guys that never got out of their faux-goth phase at high school. Fantasy generally didn't have stories about Childkiller McRape the Great Genocider going around the Empire killing 40% of its population every 6 months, at that point this setting becomes a completely ridiculous. Generally, if you create a setting in which killing yourself and your entire family is preferable over living one more day for the majority of the population then you stray into clown territory. Some serious mishaps by GW happened in the last few years culminating in the End Times slopfest, but let's not actually strive for that.

As a rule, instead of half the villages in the entirety of Middenland being completely rapegenocided every week, imagine the setting more as occasionally a peasant being lost to a local infestation of swamp trolls, or travelers and trading caravans being wiped off the map by the ocassional goblin or beastman band, with the town-wiping events being a big escalation that /yourdudes/ have to deal with (or alternatively, /yourdudes/ causing said escalations).

Anyways, fuck Cathay every "Cathayan" that crosses the border is target practice.

>>95858259
>"the best technology"
I'd like to see them compete against imperial steam tanks
>"all peaceful and holding off chaos"
Chink propaganda
>"the monarchy are literally divine"
Yet they can be killed by an imperial cannonball? Curious...
>"they have dragons"
We have gryphons, and more than five of them

>Be a divine dragon from the dawn of time, millions look upon you with awe believing you're a living god
>You hear of a chaos incursion into your territory and ride out with your men to put a stop to it
>Half way through the battle a little pot bellied goat man shits in its own hand and beans you with it
How do you respond without sounding mad?

>>95859112
Is this why Khemri is fucking evil now? That's the laziest fucking excuse to make.

>>95859559
thats annoying as fuck because I always saw Khermi as benevolent but totalitarian "step out of line and die but tow the line and everything is actually pretty alright" kinda shit

>>95859446
Well said, to many kids don't know WHFB is fantasy, often dark fantasy, but that doesn't mean always bad all the time shit.

>>95859559
Khemri is the same sort of moral alignment that Cathay should have. Neutral and self interested.

It’s just the fans running the asylum shit again.

>>95859618
thats been the case with WFB since 6th edition

>>95859630
Fuck off perryfag

>>95859346
I probably go into hermit mode for the remaining summer and work on my backlog, I'm just too old to deal with summer children anymore.
>>95859446
I appreciate your post anon but it's probably useless to correct those midwits.

>>95859575
>>95859611
They're infantry are the only undead that chose to be undead! They literally had new recruits joining! A guy could join the Khemri army for their border town by swearing fealty to the tomb king/prince in the area and be added to the enchantment. And unlike basically any undead force in almost any media period the Tomb Kings could only raise their own soldiers, not whoever they wished.

>>95859651
Sorry I don’t approve of literal CCP control of my fucking hobby wargame I guess. Your lack of moral courage actually disgusts me.

>>95859651
It's fun to point out how retarded they are but yeah, better use of time. I know I'll be trying to get my wood elf trade lot with many rescues table top ready by fall.

>>95859657
Control of lore is only possible when you have no models or games to create your own lore with anon

>>95859294
>wood elves
definitely have skulls and body horror.
have you literally never seen their models?

>>95859651
>I appreciate your post anon but it's probably useless to correct those midwits.
I get what you mean, but I wanted to have my say about it anyways.

>>95859657
>literal CCP control
Whoa look out Frank Burns, there's a Red under your bed!

I genuinely don't think the communists are out to specifically ruin a relatively niche middle aged white guy hobby. Also, >>95859731. You do have /yourdudes/, right anon?

>>95854926
>no jiangshi
On one hand I get it, we already have a bunch of vampires and people are also asking for the vampire pirates
On the other hand gaaaayyyyy where's my hsien-ko

>>95859809
Other anon, but it's not commies infiltration, it's just GW being proactive and affraid of CCP using the censorship hammer if/when they'll expand into chinese market.

There are few example, like Blizzard sanitizing WoW by removing skelleton when the game was published in China.

>>95853810
Why do people (not you anon) always mix these up and think the model on the left is also a vampire

>>95859858
This. Really this is just the usual GW being 10 years behind the rest of the corporate world. They still think there’s a big market for them in China when 90% of companies have spent the last 5 years detaching from China. On the bright side 5-10 years from now when they realize China will never be a major market, maybe we will get a gritty kino Cathay and not this wumao nationalist glazing Cathay.

>>95860091
In the other, they seem to be doing very well in Japan (I live there), and they are planning to open ~40 additional stores here.
They are also in the process of opening stores in Korea. I only know the situation in Japan, and it's a perfect market for them, as there are a lot of people here who spend a lot on their hobbies.
They are also in the process of opening stores in Korea. I only know the situation in Japan, and it's a perfect market for them, as there are a lot of people here who spend a lot on their hobbies.

Concerning Cathay, I'm a bit mad that they seem to wrap themselves in their virtue by being "sensitive" to not "mix different cultures," while other factions (Kislev...) are a glorious mishmash of totally different cultures. In addition to the faction being too Mary Sue for my taste, there is also too much parallelism between Cathay and China.

>>>95854640
The group I play with is (mostly) English-speaking, so it's (mostly) foreigners, but there is also at least one other group I'm aware of that is (mostly) Japanese players in Tokyo.

You also have more than a few people playing Warhammer Renaissance, which I want to try. Overall, as I said earlier in my post, the GW hobby in Japan is growing a lot recently.

>CHIN- I MEAN CATHAY NUMBER ONE! STRONGER THAN THE EMPIRE, THE OLD ONES AND CHAOS....COMBINED!

ahem..
ENTER.

>>95856771
What?

>not grimdark enough
>they're not giving all the details away in the second article about the faction
>muh lore
Who cares, I think the chinamen look pretty cool so I'm gonna get some from my LGS and paint em. The models are the most important part at the end of the day

>>95859798
Yes i have
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/ozijmoha/old-world-almanack-the-awakening-of-the-wood-elves/
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/thbon3tc/defend-or-defile-the-wood-elf-realms-and-beastman-brayherds-battle-for-the-forests-of-the-old-world/

>>95854926
>>95858259
>>95859294
>>95859346
>>95860220
You're all a bunch of whiny cry babies bitching about a planet that is set to be Thanos Snapped in 300 years. I would like to remind everyone that Warhammer The Old World is a prequel spin-off game of Warhammer Age of Sigmar. Whether or not Cathay ends up being "Mary Sue" faction doesn't really fucking matter. Why? Because they fucking lose in the end and get erased from existence! During the End Times, they are put in a quadruple threat match between them, the Chorfs, Grimgor's Waaagh with what's left of the Ogre Kingdoms, and the Skaven. The entire world blows up and they are never seen or heard again in AOS, not even as a footnote. At least the other Order aligned WHFB factions came back as Cities of Sigmar, Lumineth Realm Lords, Fyreslayers, Sylvaneth, Daughters of Khaine, and the Seraphon.

>>95860414
eh, the way cities of sigmar are written they could well currently exist as part of some yet un-spotlighted city. each city has its own unique culture, even the freeguild have fully changed aesthetics, things come and go, there are entire cities with cultures like the priests of morrda that are almost entirely unrepresented in the model range.

this is one of sigmars strengths over the old world. because the setting is so much more expansive and the maps less filled in, the timeline less historical and concrete, there is room for random bullshit like suddenly having a yourdudes cathay resurgence

>>95860446
Where's Bretonnia or Tomb Kings in AoS then?

>>95860414
Nice bait, now let's see your dudes faggot.

>>95860215
It’s also growing like crazy in Poland too. There used to be no stores. Then one opened in the capital, and in the last few months they expanded to krakow and Gdańsk. I’m a bit worried because Poland always had a thriving third party FLGS system and I don’t think official GW presence will make things better for the average wargamer here.

>>95860487
>Where's Bretonnia or Tomb Kings in AoS then?

where indeed? thats the whole point. the setting has left enough empty space and fog of war throughout its maps and worldbuilding that you can just add them back in if you have the models. they added entire cities in 4th edition that were previously unmentioned or only hinted at, new shit like cities or whole regions or continents gets added to the game all the time and it doesnt disrupt the setting, so if you actually want brettonia in aos you can literally just do that.

>>95860446
AoS is too corporate of a setting. It isn’t tied to the old world/world that was at all. Look at cities of sigmar having all their names chars be black women when black people didn’t even exist in any way barring vague southlander references. AoS is wide open because GW wanted a setting they could mould and copywrite at will. The problem was it never took off like they expected it to so now they have to focus on specialist games to retain or bring in customers that AoS failed to attract.

>>95860573
That’s exactly the point. Nothing matters in AoS because nothing actually concretely exists. Who cares about a city being destroyed or saved when they just write in 100 new important cities in a previously undescribed part of the map. Who can care when the stakes in AoS are non existent.

>>95860574
>his problem is the black people

predictable

>>95860574
>l. Look at cities of sigmar having all their names chars be black women when black people didn’t even exist in any way barring vague southlander references
Ahem...

>>95860581
>nothing actually concretely exists.

this part is wrong. there are things that concretely exist. hammerhal, barak nar, the eight points, there are established locations in the setting for them to anchor the narrative around. they just also have a map that allows you to add new locations, unlike whfb's map which has been more or less filled in without having to leave to a new hemisphere like cathay, which is apparently a bridge too far for some hard liners.

>>95860487
>brets
I’m pretty sure they are the inbreds that are flesh eater courts that honestly don’t stray off too far from them, at least aesthetically.
>tomb kings
Fuck if I know, and I’ve only bothered looking into the realm of shyish whenever I played soulbound.

>>95860600
I hear they exist even moreso in your actual thread faggot.

>>95860574
AoS is still doing a lot better than expected. Old World didn't even make it in the Top 10 list in Q4 2024. It's just full of anons complaining about the fluff of a new miniature line they had plans on purchasing to begin with.

>>95860608
you would probably have to homebrew your own tomb kings faction, but they are starting to add undead and necromancers of the serpent cult of nulahmia. i havent read up on it so i dont know the full extend of the connection but there is at least some connective tissue there

>>95860613
cathay is about to exist en force in the old world, you better get used to it. i wouldnt be surprised to see cathay armies outnumber all other armies combined, given that its the first new plastic army whfb has gotten in 20 years. better get damn used to seeing chinamen on your table, its gonna be a chinese century in old world

Why are sigtrannies flooding us. Can’t they go revive their dead general? Also please buy the limited time only Skaventide set! It’s selling fast (second best selling set of all time according to whitefang LMAO)

>>95860628
Lot of faith in a company that doesn’t know how to spell Catalyst

>>95860671
My 2cts it will be really cheap to start a cathay army in ~6months, when most of the new player will give up and resell their mini.

A TOW army is quite a daunting task to paint compared to 40k/AOS.

>>95860683
can you filter a different country other than Canada you leaf. It triggers me.

>>95860691
Can you not just blurt that out. I don’t want the mouth breathers to get the same idea.

alright boys I've got some chaos ideas and I need chaos answers to my chaos questions
Got my hands on a new in box regiment of 1997 warriors that happened to come with a mutation sprue for an exceptional price. It got me thinking that I could make some forsaken if I put my mind to it. Are undivided forsaken fun? I know slaanesh and khorne ones were meta for a while, but I'm looking to diversify my core units. Alternatively, should I just save the mutation sprue for another project and make these 12 dudes halberdiers? I haven't had a good time with my tzeentch halberd warriors, but I think that's mostly because the mark of tzeentch is god-awful and not because halberds are bad. Plus, I've already got a bunch of these 1997 warriors with hand weapons and shields, so some variety would be nice. I've also got ~30 of these warriors that have already been built waiting to be stripped of paint, some of which have mutations. So I could do both, I suppose. My question is, should I make a lot of forsaken, a lot of halberd-wielding chaos warriors, or a bit of both?

>>95860671
Our most popular army is like 12% of the playerbase dipshit. Youd know WHFB is all over the place unlike 40k if you actually played any TOW games kid.

>>95860689

Does the Minotaur list for beastmen just make them better ogres?

>>95860788
yeah maybe you're right. maybe the community is just going to sleep on the first new thing for them to buy since most of them were in highschool

>>95860797
The Minotaur list makes them worse ogres and isn’t even the best way to run Minotaur heavy. Maybe the Wizard Doombull has some play but I doubt it. If Impetous is changed to being a LD test then they will be better than they currently are,but currently they are bad in blood herd.

>>95860801
I don’t think they will sleep but I think Cathay isn’t going to be as popular as a lot of people think it is. Chinamen just don’t have mass appeal in the same way Euros do.
In Warhammer 3 Kislev was the most popular faction in every region except Asia (Cathay) and Oceania (Empire) from data from CA.

>>95860801
Will it show up? Yeah. But unlike you kid most of us are in our 30s to 50s and the allure is being able to dust off our collections, buy or print some stuff we missed before and throw dice. I'm sure some will but this "omg Cathay everywhere" isn't a big deal and I'll be lucky to even see it.

>>95860818
A minotaur getting an assailant spell for nearly free goes a long way.

>>95860832
idk why you're insisting on using this "kid" line like everyone in here isnt at least in their 30s. i was a Sr in highschool when ogres were released. i bought them at the gamesday 2005 in chicago, i remember exactly how long its been since we had anything new to eat in warhammer fantasy

make your arguments but that kid insult isnt landing, it doesnt apply

I have no interest in Cathay because it’s both chinamen and a bit too sanitary for my tastes. That being said I hope it’s a success so that GW gives the team more resources. Will I buy it? No, because it doesn’t feel very fantasy to me, but I hope others do.

>>95860905
Where are your ogres?

>>95860913
This is finally a reasonable and realistic take. I personally don't really care but hope it grows. Rising tides raise all ships.

>>95860922
I sold them years ago to fund another project, though I did keep the gorger as a keepsake

>>95861034
Nice. I kept a few beastmen after end times and realizing AoS ain't it for me.
Well I lived through chaos being split lizardmen, undead into VC/TK and ogres plus all the various refreshes of factions. Never once did my meta nor really any outside of "competitve" events really get rocked. Unlike 40k which definetly does choose FOTNlM often fantasy players stick to what they have- each new option might entice a few players to start a 2nd side project but generally outside a few new players over the years nothing really changes. Nothing about Cathay seems to be changing that, and my table will be chaos empire, dwarfs, high elves mainly as it ever was.
Hell the craziest thing I've seen personally is my buddies doing that cult of slaanesh list I guess someone wrote up for use in old world.

>>95861099
>FOTNIM
meant FOTM that's what I get for walking drinking and phone posting all at once.

>>95859294
>Kislev
kislev does have skulls, as well as body horror in the ghosts, old hags and their gurish elementals and things from the woods

>>95861229
None of that is body horror anon wtf are you talking about. Body horror is the human form being twisted into the unnatural not just someone looking scary or ugly

>>95861241
the things from the woods were once human

>>95857945
remember that time the slann lord quex did a minor adjustment to the continents?
>the time of mad stars, as late sources would call it, refers to the combination of events that happened in -1500IC:
by this time almost one hundred years passed after the first rise of nagash and many more hundreds of years before his second rise and the ritual of undeath, yet his black pyramid had an eruption of power for reasons unknown (the one event of relevancy nearby would have been the rise of vampires with neferata's recreation of the elixir of undeath in -1520 or some of nagash's first heavy experiments with warpstone for construction purposes), anyway the eruption of magic from the pyramid altered the alignment of the planet with the stars above; the slann lord quex takes up the window of opportunity created by this new alignment to enact ritual that would fix better the position of certain continents and strengthen the wardings of the world, much to the opposition of some other slann which considered the decision too hasty (for a slann) given they couldn't account for all hidden chaotic variables, in fact despite the calculations there were things that couldn't be accounted for, which altered this otherwise painless ordeal: the tremors of the realignment caused a catastrophic malfunction in the great device built by the ratmen in skavenblight; the shockwaves of this explosion met with the waves of energy from nagashizzar and the tremors of the slann right under the world edge's mountains, resulting into an all too destructive mix.
the earthquakes that followed were the start of the age of woes, the end of the second golden age of dwarfkind, with many holds crippled by the earthquakes and the opening of new paths for greenskinned hordes which would become a greater threat for them due to this for centuries to come

>>95861286
even if the dwarfs had to pay a heavy price for it, the slann that initially opposed lord quex got buried under rubbles in one of the earthquakes and the at the time unknown skaven went through a social crisis that would see the emergence of the council of thirteen and grey council, lord quex was nonetheless satisfied by the ritual: the continents were realigned according to the plaques and the warding was strengthened.
he ate a flower and went back to sleep.

anyway, in all of that, one of the earthquakes tore a hole into the great bastion of cathay, allowing a large chaos horde to pour through and invade.
on top of that we now know that the great wall of cathay is spiritually linked with the very life essence of the celestial dragon emperor, meaning that such a catastrophic damage must have been perceived as a near fatal blow to the dragon emperor himself.

>>95861279
Would

>>95861336

>>95861373
if you have to shamelessly post smut at least be courteous enough to not use bot slop

baked a new thread
>>95861389
>>95861389
>>95861389

>>95857993
I don't know much high elf lore, but it seems doubtful they would leave much. I would personally not paint my army that scheme because it would seem silly for them to get out and fight so much shit in a narrative sense. That being said, 90% of people wont care or even recognize what the scheme is or the lore behind it. Plus you can always make up some contrived bullshit as to excuse their expeditions.

New
>>95861385
>>95861385
>>95861385

>>95858448
Based on how the RPG counted pops, I'd say that hamlet there houses about 56 peasants.

>>95861290
I love the salt god bless you froganon
>>95861396
Yeah this was my fear, I'll probably settle for cothique or trianoc. Both can be mixed a pinch to represent the fleeing colonists from the old world anyways.

>>95854129
missed the point, retard