Thread 96078872

40K has good guys, but they're not in the Imperium.

>>96078872 (OP)
Eldar look gay and stupid so they're in the wrong

>>96078872 (OP)
Correct.
The Eldar and Tau are objectively, even by just human moral standards, better than the imperium because their go to policy isn't xenocidal towards humans nor do they persecute their own people to the extend Imperium persecutes humanity.

Humans living on Tau controlled space have objectively better living standards than humans living under the yoke of the imperium do.
Imperiumfags will of course deny all of this because for some reason they are convinced that the imperium is justified in it's actions and outlook.

40k has some objective worst bad guys and they're also Eldar.

>>96078887
>Eldar
Correct but they're not good guys by any means, just not bad guys. The eldar just want to be left on their own but that's not morally good or helping anyone out it's just taking a neutral stance.
>Tau
Common misconception. Humans in tau worlds are just as enslaved as they were in the imperium and being considered a lower caste by a foreigner power in a apartheid state where you will inevitably end up being a factory worker or meat shield is not exactly ideal. Humans living under the tau are also fed way more propaganda and are way further spied upon than in the imperium because due to their smaller size the tau can actually afford reeducation camps and brainwashing, something the imperium can't. Tau are also actually less diverse and welcoming than the imperium, sure the imperium exterminates xenos but there are blatant ethnical and cultural differences between every single planet in it while the whole tau empire works under the same banner, uniform, architecture and government structure. If they could they would even apply that to their xenos allies as seen with the vespid uniform and kindaaaa mind control helm thingies and the more experienced kroot try their hardest to keep the tau at arm's length to not have their freedoms taken. The tau are just as bad as the imperium but they prefer more civilized methods of domination through one sided diplomacy and cultural hegemony, much like government powers in our current world, to straight up genocide. Would you rather be extinct or be enslaved? The whole plight of the tau is that they try to be silver tongued in a galaxy unwilling to listen and it's why stuff like the war of dark revelations or whatever it's called is so fucking funny. They are rational in a irrational world.
>t. raging taufag with 1700 points worth of them having read all the, albeit not very big, list of tau related materials and novels except whatever that slimy fuck Phil Kelly is doing with his slop

>>96079006
I didn't call either the Eldar or the Tau wholly good, I just stated that they are obviously morally better than the Imperium is. And yes, even if the humans living under the Tau still live under a totalitarian & authoritarian state that propagandizes them and controls their daily life, they still objectively have better living standards under the tau than under the imperium.

>>96078872 (OP)
Yes.

>>96078872 (OP)
Eldar are kind of dicks as well. They're turbo-racist and willing to kill billions of innocent humans to save the life one Eldar, which while understandable from their point of view since they view humans as barely sentient animals, isn't exactly a good guy thing to do, and really not all that different from the Inquisition's attitude of "no action done to safeguard the survival of humanity can be evil, because the alternative is much worse". They just don't dress in skulls while doing it.

Good Guys
>Tau without Ethereals
>Votann
>some space marine chapters
>arguibly the eldar

>>96079078
The leagues of Votan are at best amoral. They are willing to planetcrack inhabited planets just to mine their juicy, juicy ores, and at best they may offer to ferry the inhabitants off to some other world for a fee.

>>96078903
*Aeldari*

>>96078872 (OP)
eldar are serial deceivers and slimy backstabbers. Best you can say is that they are neutral, but with very little honor.

they will manipulate a human to destroy one of the few good-noble planets of 5-billion to save even 7 drug addicted eldar pedophiles.

>>96079084
meh, I am biased towards them because of what the Tyrannids did to them.

>>96079078
>Space marines
A bit unrelated but does the irony of the salamanders being the 'good guy' faction while making use of flamethrowers and incendiary weapons known for causing extraordinary pain and suffering to anyone unlucky enough to come near one just fly over people's heads? I feel that detail was added on purpose by the writers.
>Votann
Too soon to tell really. They seem like super jews willing to create tube babies and change their kind entirely for 0.0001% more profit though. I hope they get revealed to also have some really angry berserker type grudges in them.
>Tau without ethereals
Cave people. The ethereals made that fucking place and they are the only ones able to coordinate the others castes effectivly. Without the ethereals they would have been wiped during the damocles crusade!

>>96078872 (OP)
you have to admit “Lord Xenos Baby Head Crusher of the Ordo Genicidius”
is a much more badass name.

>>96079058

You forgot the part where they raped and tortured a chaos god into existence, killing untold billions of sentient lives on the spot.

>>96079058
>They're turbo-racist and willing to kill billions of innocent humans to save the life one Eldar
which is still incredibly soft and resonable when compared to the Imperium.

The imperium doesnt even need the excuse to save a single human life. They dont give a fuck about a single human life, they butcher gorillion Xenos just because they are xenos

>>96078887
>Imperiumfags will of course deny all of this because
because the whole premise of the settings is that there are no good guys in the grim dark future and these faggots added a faction whose sole identity is being the good guys so it's annoying.
Basically they kept repeating "no you can't play as the good guys" for years and then "oh okay now you can but it's just these aliens"

>>96079020
>obviously morally better than the Imperium is.
and you're wrong.
The Space Elfs raped a new god into existence and only lament that it bit them in the butt, not that they did it.
The Space Cows are commies, and better dead than red.

>>96079286
>The Space Elfs raped a new god into existence and only lament that it bit them in the butt
No, the Craftworlds, Harlequins and Exodites turned their entire society around to prevent that from ever happening again

Humanity makes up 95% of mortal chaos fighting forces and the imperium is still the number 1 spawning ground for new chaos cultists, lost and damned and marines going CSM

>>96079286
>commies
No sign of wealth redistribution, openly caste based class system, no sign of equality or any materialist dialetic present in their ideology.
Where the fuck do people get this idea from

>>96079301

Of course they’re 95% of the mortal forces of Chaos - they’re also more than 95% of the mortal population of the galaxy (ignoring races that effectively can’t turn)!

The only good guys are the Orks - every other race, Space Elves and Commie Fish included, are bad guys.

>>96079375

Being too stupid to understand the setting.

>>96079246
The eldar were part of 40k from the get go and they were always morally superior to Humanity. You are just mad that 40k is a setting where humanity are arguably the villains.

>>96079393
Yes

It is, by definition, impossible for any sentient creature other than a human to be "good" save perhaps as a slave because "good" means serves human interests.

>>96078872 (OP)
Imperiumsharts btfo top kek

>>96079437
One extra bar of corpse starch has been added to your rations. Keep up the good work, citizen! Praise the Emperor!

>>96079437
This, but replace Human with Eldar.

>>96079136
>being the 'good guy' faction while making use of flamethrowers and incendiary weapons
That's the joke anon. 40k has always been a satirical medium that highlights the good and evil of warfare.

>>96078887
The only reasons (craftworld) Eldar aren't xenocidal towards humans is because a) they would get deleted if they pissed off Imperium enough to put in an effort, just like the Tau, and b) they like having pawns to hide behind so they aren't murderfucked by Chaos, Necron, Tyranid and Orks.

>>96079227
>The imperium doesnt even need the excuse to save a single human life. They dont give a fuck about a single human life, they butcher gorillion Xenos just because they are xenos
They don't give a fuck about a SINGLE human life, they think in the terms of planets, systems and more.

You faggots must get some kind of bizarre kick out of making the same threads and having the same arguments over and over again.

>>96079649
They don't think at all

>>96079377
The humans (mostly of IMPERIAL origin) also sawed the galaxy in half, brought the Pylon network down and created the single most powerful champions of Chaos to ever exist

Humanity in all its glory.

>>96078887
The imperium commits unspeakable atrocities and rights violation because it has no choice if it wants to survive and anything less risk chaos devouring it from within. The tau would be lucky to last a few centuries if the ruinous powers had access before major sections of it falls into madness like what happened to the Eldar.

Call me insane but I would rather be a imperial guard on the front lines than a civilian living comfortable under xenos. At least I know I would have some chance of dying glorious and it having some meaning.

>>96078887
GW has tried over the years to sully the tau by making them more grimdark with shadowy experimentation and control on their auxillaries and making them more aggressive with planet sieges, but that was not the original intention.

the original point of the tau, before the later grimderp writers of 6th and 7th got a hold of them, was to be a naive, relatively noble race who actually believed a good end was possible, that friendships and cooperation could triumph, and their ideals are met on the other end by the abject horror of the galaxy, between the imperium's meatgrinder theocracy or the chaos armies depraved death cults

they make the grim reality of the galaxy that much more poigniant by their relatively earnest good intentions and attempt to forge a normal society. and the later writers have utterly missed this point, every time they make the tau grimmer and darker it muddies the narrative tool they are meant to represent.

>>96078876
Webm related are why the 40k fanbase hate Eldar. Sentimentality and love have no place in 40k. In the Imperium, they don't love their children, just see them as a resource to be exploited or an obligation, like that one short story where the protagonist uses his own kid as a human shield and quips that he can just make more. That is based and redpilled.

>>96079660
What else is there to do on a zombie board on a zombie website?

>>96079078
>>96079136
I kinda wish there was more lore about how the fire caste and air caste will sometimes butt heads, kinda like how japans army and navy were during ww2 with the navy having tanks and the army having fleet carriers and having messed up logistics due to both trying to act independently of each other.
An ethereal should always be in the room between a Shas'O and Kor'O in order to ensure they know their true priorities. Farsights empire should be an exception where mutual respect for farsight has both navy and ground forces acting in perfect unison.

But then again Tau working in concert and each caste being a well oiled machine makes them more of a threat.

>>96079222
To be fair, the Eldar we're talking about look back on that time with shame.

>>96079712
Anon, the intro to the universe literally tells you that you're just one of countless other humans who will die and be forgotten. There is no glory to be had for the vast majority of humanity.

>>96079712
Well yeah I'd call you insane. Your death as an Imperial Guard would most likely be completely meaningless because choose one--
>your commander can very easily be a Chenkov-tier retard having you bayonet charge a fortified position means your death accomplished fuck all
>you can be fighting rebels (people starved to death by psychotic nobles or governors with literally no other choice) or even your own allies because of some retarded order you just received from a bureaucrat who fucked up or from a commander who has zero idea of what is happening
>your death can in fact ACTIVELY BENEFIT YOUR ENEMIES if you're fighting Dark Eldar (who love your dying screams and love when slaves hurl themselves at their feet waving flashlights around), Chaos (who can easily keep you as a plague zombie or take your soul to Hell) or even Orks (who can take your vehicles and replace any losses with trivial ease) and Tyranids (who will eat you and shit out more Tyranids then you could ever kill by yourself)
The Imperial Guard is the king of meaningless deaths. As a Tau clerk or auxiliary you will fight for something way more often then any Imperial Guard cannon fodder trooper.

>>96079696
>Humanity in all its glory.
>Superhuman slaves endlessly fighting each other
lol

>>96079754
Eldar add something to the setting that is often missing: sadness, melancholy. And with that, a certain beauty and heroism. The "rage against the dying of light" kind of heroism.
I get it that you want everyone just be ugly, angry, stern, cold. Which leaves a setting that is devoid of anything worth fighting for.

>>96079020
>So morally corrupt you shit out a chaos god and fuck up the entire galaxy
>morally better than the imperium
Since the imperium hasn't done that yet, no, they are not.

>>96079865
They literally have. Who made the Astartes who just exploded the Pylons and sawed the galaxy in half? They certainly didn't spring up from the ether.

>>96079741
my tau brother

>>96078872 (OP)
Everyone is a fucking xeno to everyone else. Why the hell does do humans only call others xenos?

>>96078872 (OP)
It's because that Eldar fighting to protect his race is also ready and willing to kill hundreds upon thousands upon millions of innocent men, women, and children of the "lesser races" (which is all of them) in order to protect even a handful of Eldar lives.

Also it's particularly funny that whoever made that image decided to use the Biel-Tan, who are so obsessed with reclaiming the old Eldar empire that they will indiscriminately kill anyone who gets vaguely near old Eldar planets, or even planets that the Eldar never actually colonised but were maybe thinking about getting around to it before the Fall, and happily employ Exterminatus-grade bioweapons that even other Eldar are horrified by to cleanse planets of any and all 'undesirable' life. And all of this slaughter is completely and utterly pointless because the territory of the pre-Fall Eldar empire is such a shitshow that it's literally impossible for Biel-Tan to even make a dent in reclaiming it, and the Eldar as a whole are so few in number that it might not be possible even if every craftworld pooled their resources into making it happen.

>>96079437
>by definition
You're as bad as the woke freaks you hate.

>>96079754
>>96079841
soul

>>96079893
Would you not do the same for your own loved ones? What sort of self-hating mongrel are you?

>>96079754
This.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRD7WJuGlCs

>>96079893
>It's because that Eldar fighting to protect his race is also ready and willing to kill hundreds upon thousands upon millions of innocent men, women, and children of the "lesser races" (which is all of them) in order to protect even a handful of Eldar lives.

Yes and?
I would be willing to make that judgement call if I had that option regarding my own people any day of the week irl. If I had to choose between saving the lives of a handful of Finns even if it cost the lives any number of foreigners, I'd do it.
Hence why I fully understand and approve of the Eldar mindset. It is based.

>>96079872
What the hell are you talking about you retarded schizo?

>>96079754
I like the Old Warrior or what they call the Exarch.

>>96079971
Man the animation is shit in these

>>96079006
>also fed way more propaganda and are way further spied upon than in the imperium
Retard or American?

>>96079754
>let's aid Imperium and bring back one of the primarch, surely nothing wrong can came out of it
>fail to defend the whole Craftworld against one smurf company
Stop self-inserting into the faction/setting
Eldar are too retarded to breath sure, but does not make them good guys

>>96079951
And if you do that too much other powers will grow to hate you, putting your people in more danger than they were ever in before. Which is exactly what the Eldar have done, and they've done it so much that the Imperium often actively seeks out and destroys Eldar enclaves that would otherwise have been completely ignored if they kept to themselves instead of going around geocoding planets.

>>96079741

It was inevitable really. A species wide ignorance in a setting and universe like 40k could never last long and it’s actually surprising how little they’ve gone for it. I made some Slaanesh turned Tau ages ago as a teenager cause I figured if these do-gooders ever have a bad time in the warp than what better God to capture their simple souls then the one of hedonism and sensation? Only the Ethereal’s could be temped by Tzeench. Nurgle seems right out. Might have a bit of a case for Khorne for their vets, some must have a little bloodlust. But the writers keeping them in little contact with Chaos has saved most of their naïveté…..though I haven’t really kept up with Tau lore past 6th so maybe i’m talking out my ass?

Whatever. Fuck all xenos. Kill em, shoot em dead. Humanity are the good guys, traitors can FOAD.

>>96080044
Retard, the Emperor is who instigated the policy of total xenocide against all non humans within the galaxy, which was at the time where the Craftworld Eldar were still establishing themselves after the fall of their civlization, which, if you remember the lore, happened only slightly before the beginning of the Great Crusade as the birth of Slaanesh cleared away the warpstorms that had separated Terra from rest of the galaxy.

The xenocidal attitudes of Imperium towards the Eldar, and other xenos in general, have fucking nothing to do with the behavior of the Craftworld Eldar. It was humanity who started on aggressive footing towards the Eldar and in fact, actively ignored the Eldar attempts at mutual co-operation and actively went out of their way to antagonize the Eldar. It is fucking wild that imperiumfags have the gal to claim that Eldar are the ones that are to blame for how Imperium treats the Eldar when the imperial standpoint has, for 10 thousand years, been "we will not tolerate your existence, filthy xenos".

>>96079741
>the original point of the tau, before the later grimderp writers of 6th and 7th got a hold of them, was to be a naive, relatively noble race who actually believed a good end was possible, that friendships and cooperation could triumph
That could only work if that worldview (galaxyview?) ran face first into horrific reality every time they tried to apply it. Leading to them either changing their approach to suit the shitstack of a world they're actually in while trying to keep the same rhetoric, making them hypocrites and liars at best (basically what seems to have happened to them) - or keep trying to hug Carnifexes and persuade Chaos Daemons to join the Great Good, making them a retarded joke faction that would only survive as long as the creators found them funny.

>>96079893
>kill hundreds upon thousands upon millions of innocent men, women, and children of the "lesser races" (which is all of them)
They actually prefer not to if they can avoid it. Many Eldar have enough moral core in them to hate it or suffer ptsd from it and their leaders understand that shit like this begets deserved retaliation. Not saying the Eldar don't have supremacists or straight-up evil pieces of shit in their ranks, plenty of those.

>>96078876
Eldar are sexy. 40k fans hate sexy characters. Therefor, they hate Eldar.

>>96080097
Usually imperials bring that sort of xenocidal retribution onto themselves.

>>96079898
He's right, faggot. If your 'sense of morality' leads you to betray your own species it's a worthless defective anti-evolutionary morality and you should be killed immediately.

>>96080074
Eldar:

>Maelaeth edged along one wall, looking at the trash and broken possessions that had been dropped in the rubble. Along the wall, under a series of Chaos markings rendered in dark paint, someone had nailed up a series of dolls and other [human] childrens’ toys. Something in Maelaeth’s heart broke as she gazed on the crucified dolls, remembering a world of family and friends and children forever lost to her. Then she realized that not all of the dolls were dolls.

vs

Human:

>The cyborged woman had been thoroughly dismembered. Torn apart not by bladed weaponry but by brute strength. The wounds were rife with aetheric signifiers.

>Alpha-Rho-25 began the process of harvesting her final cognitions, which necessitated sawing through the brain pan and plunging a dataspike into one of her internal cranial connectors. Intriguingly, in all the info-feeds that spilled out in numerical echo of the servitor’s last thoughts, there was nothing identifying her warp-born assailant. She hadn’t been able to make out any visuals of her killer. For all intents and purposes, AL-141-0-CVI-55-(0023) and her cohorts had been firing at nothing.

>There was more -- somehow, the servitor's very last thoughts had been of her human life and the weeping children that had been pulled from her hands as she was hauled away, screaming, on her way to processing for a minor theft she had not committed. Alpha-Rho-25 found the though amusing before discarding the data as irrelevant: a tesiously emotional misfire of a dying, imperfect, and weak biological engine undeserving of the life it had given in his service.

>>96078887
>The Eldar and Tau are objectively, even by just human moral standards, better than the imperium because their go to policy isn't xenocidal towards humans nor do they persecute their own people to the extend Imperium persecutes humanity.
'Man is what he is, a wild animal with the will to survive, and (so far) the ability, against all competition. Unless one accepts that, anything one says about morals, war, politics—you name it—is nonsense. Correct morals arise from knowing what man is—not what do-gooders and well-meaning old Aunt Nellies would like him to be. The universe will let us know—later—whether or not Man has any "right" to expand through it'.

>>96080140
This. By my definition, the Imperium is the most moral society in fiction as it is hyperadapted to survival. Good, evil, these are just concepts at the end of the day. Ensuring the survival of your species, that it all that matters at the end.

>>96079712
>The imperium commits unspeakable atrocities and rights violation because it has no choice if it wants to survive and anything less risk chaos devouring it from within.
>Chaos still devours it from within and without

>>96080062
>I haven’t really kept up with Tau lore past 6th so maybe i’m talking out my ass?
They have a Mommy God now!

>>96080096
Tau were always liars and hypocrites though. The entire point of the Greater Good from the very beginning is propaganda to convince people to accept the Lesser Evil. Which means not just personal sacrifices for the state, but not questioning all the horrible bullshit they're asked to do. The obvious mind control was also obvious even in the first codex, but was made even more obvious in 4th with the vespid miraculously going from reviled enemies to allies even more trusted than the kroot simply by adding a fancy helmet! Curious! And with the all-kroot mercenaries willing to do literally anything to prevent the Tau government from finding out mercenaries even existed, they tried to make it even more obvious but people still didn't get it.

The only real "change" to the Tau over the years is that they have tried to make the dystopia more obvious since it completely went over most people's heads with the first codex. And I say this as a Tau player and fan since that first codex.

>>96080000
Exodite looked great comparatively, but it was only slightly above 30 minutes long (and I've read somewhere that GW actively interfered in the studio's attempts at inserting scenes where the Tau were allowed to be cool). Still, it's one time in Warhammer-related media I can recall where Saim-Hann was allowed to shine for a bit, instead of getting dunked on.

>>96078887
>because their go to policy isn't xenocidal towards humans
Haven't Eldar time and time again killed off entire human worlds just to protect themselves from non-human threats?

>>96080074
Of course the Imperium are a bunch of xenocidal maniacs, but when it comes to those responsible for actually carrying out the xenocide their decisions are always tinged with pragmatism because the Imperium of 40k is nowhere near as capable as the Imperium of the Emperor's time. The Eldar are an incredibly tough foe that Imperial commanders hate tangling with for all sorts of very valid reasons, and most are willing to look the other way if an Eldar presence is uncovered but they're not making enough of a nuisance of themselves to make it worth assembling a large force to go smash them.

Of course there are complete fucksticks like >>96080110 that bring it on themselves, but in the main Eldar tend to skate by under the radar by generally being very hard to kill and much less belligerent than all the other xenos. The antics of the likes of Biel-Tan and particularly bloodthirsty corsairs tip the cost-benefit scales and paint a target on themselves when that's the absolute last thing a dying race like the Eldar want or need.

>>96080195
>Tau were always liars and hypocrites though.
This is why I like the Imperium so much. They're honest about who they are. It's the same reason why craftworlders are so much more hateable than dark eldar. Dark eldar never put on illusions about what they stand for.

>>96079437
You're truly stupid.

>>96080218
Yes, absolutely. They care absolutely nothing for human life. They'd kill us all in an instant if it suited them and if they could. But their goal is not the genocide itself the same way it is with the Imperium. They genocide as a means to preserve Eldar life.

To the Imperium this looks like hair-splitting.

>>96080283
Akshually, the Imperium absolutely lie a lot. So do Dark Eldar. And yes, to themselves too. Like one of the leads of "Path of the Dark Eldar" trilogy honestly believes himself a hero noble trying to topple the tyranny of the usurper Vect to lead the true Eldar into the bright future while being a bog-standard amoral Backstabber McBackstabby Backstabson of the House Backstab.

>>96078876
Eldar are the white man of the setting, they are just stuck in a faggy fad ala 1700s euro dudes wearing tights

>>96080195
>in 4th with the vespid miraculously going from reviled enemies to allies even more trusted than the kroot simply by adding a fancy helmet! Curious! And with the all-kroot mercenaries willing to do literally anything to prevent the Tau government from finding out mercenaries even existed, they tried to make it even more obvious but people still didn't get it.
What's with the lies? The Vespid were never enemies.
4th ED is when the Tau became grimdark. What's funny that recent codexes reversed the grimdarkness in that codex.

The Kroot, according to the latest lore, love the Tau with the majority of them legitimately believing in the Greater Good. The T'au are aware of the Kroot merc work, but they let it slide. In fact, the T'au use the far traveled Kroot tribes as spies and scouts

>>96080398
He's right that the propaganda was pretty front in center.

In the white dwarf that was released i think 1 month after the tau were released they Had three short stories. TWO of them were about propaganda.

>>96080062
>Slaanesh turned Tau
What? But the Tau killed Slaanesh!

Reminder that the Imperium is an objective force of evil that must be destroyed the very same way Chaos has to be for the galaxy to finally know peace.

>>96080468
Only one was straightforward propaganda, which was the Gue'vesa informational broadcast. By the way, the Farsight novel showed that it was based on facts. The T'au didn't lie in it.
The other one was about the making of wartime news coverage. We see a journalist doing her job.

>>96079437
>This guy can vote

>>96080258
The existence of deldar doesn't help. Sure, an Ordo Xenos inquisitor may know the difference, but for a random human survivor, it's pretty hard to tell if their planet was fucked up by deldar, cworlders or corsairs, but they can at least identify it's an eldar, and things go downhill from there.

>humans are responsible for Horus
>humans are responsible for Abaddon the Despoiler
Uhm... Imperiumbros, our response???

>>96080562
The others was about a water caste propaganda team on a battlefield. and the third is the infamous slaanesh story.

>eldar, tau, or humans being the good guys
>retarded wankers, completely brainless subhuman filth
>orkz being the good guys
>bare minimum of the brain function
>tyranids being the good guys
>someone who actually understands the reality of 40k

>>96080706
>The others was about a water caste propaganda team on a battlefield
It's not propaganda per se. It was just a story about them going ahead with their work.
> the third is the infamous slaanesh story.
This wasn't propaganda. It was a report from the T'au commander leading during that battle.

>>96080121
Typical /pol/tranny post. We're talking about fictional characters. Take your meds.

>>96080547
>Reminder that the Imperium is an objective force of evil that must be destroyed the very same way Chaos has to be for the galaxy to finally know peace.
But you can not destroy Chaos!

>>96080754
You can the moment the writers invent some McGuffin that allows them to

>>96080754
You can just kill Chaos. That's not even hope or a dream, it's like dank possibility.

>>96080778
>>96080779
No, Chaos can not be destroy outright, merely... changed...

>>96080356
To be fair to Yllithian, he did come from what used to be a noble house before Vect made everyone conform to the far less prestigious kabal system. On top of that, no one Commorragh likes Vect, they only fear him, which is why Yllithian was able to form an alliance against him in the first place. Summoning El-Uriach was a dumbass plan, however, and the in-fighting between Kraillach and Xelian made everything worse.

>>96080105
I want the cuteanon mandrake girl to scream at my penis

>>96078903
Even Deldar aren't nearly as bad as chaos humans.

>>96079078
>Votann
>good
Zionist detected.

>>96079123
>>96079136
>>96079084
>amoral
They've been explicitly stated to be the bullies of the galactic core. All the native species of the galactic core have been either subjugated, genocided, or driven out by the Votann colonizing the region and no one there fucking likes them. The unironically deserve the orks and tyranids reaming their holds because they've been utter cunts to every other species they've come across. They even have one League that has unironic Genocide Quotas.

>>96079841
Lovely image

>>96080754
>>96080811
Kill yourself ND

>>96080811
>Chaos can not be destroy outright
Guilliman literally wields a "destroy Chaos outright" sword, you blithering retard.

>>96080726
You don't know how to greentext properly, reddit-kun.

This >>96080176 post was made by ND, wasn't it?

>>96078887
>>96078872 (OP)
>Eldar
you mean the guys trying to dodge the consequences after their massive murderfucking, child-enslaving bender of an empire crumbled?
Tau are alright though, actually the most normal faction in 40k, even if they're not immune to propaganda and have a wack-ass utilitarian view of their own lives.

>>96081062
>shitty image
>reddit spacing
>le heckin snarkarino response about mommydommies or transbians
Obviously it's NDslop

>>96079754
It's not based and redpilled to use your child as a human shield you Godless liberal.

>>96081070
In fairness Craftworld Eldar are the ones that explicitly rejected the murderfucking and dedicated themselves to an incredibly strict ascetic life specifically designed to prevent anyone from devolving into a murderfucking hyper-degenerate. Dark Eldar deserve every single bad thing that ever happens to them though.

Why is everyone shitting of Craftworld Eldar for Slaanesh when those were exactly the people who moved away because they disagreed?

>>96081049
>Guilliman literally wields a "destroy Chaos outright" sword, you blithering retard.
Yet it didn't delete Nurgle...

>>96080754
They almost killed off Slaanesh in AoS. If the Emperor wasn't a pathetic pussy and could match the power of a few Elves then Chaos would be dead.

>>96081143
Because we haven't hit 40K End Times yet you dumb genocide-endorsing wannabe transbian.

>>96081144
>They almost killed off Slaanesh in AoS.
And yet they didn't.

>>96081167
Chaos also failed to kill off literally anything despite ending the world. Funny how a setting meant to push plastic remains static even when progressing the setting, yet you're too stupid to realize that.

>>96081177
>Funny how a setting meant to push plastic remains static even when progressing the setting, yet you're too stupid to realize that.
I'm not, just having fun with it.

>>96081194
Cope, as expected from a waste of space that should kill himself instead of crying about being born with a penis.

>>96081203
Buddy, you'd call me a secondary because I don't buy your over priced tiny plastic statuettes!
I could tell when dipping my toes into the hobby back in 7th edition that this shit is mostly to milk WAACfaggot Whales.
This is neither a game nor a hobby, it's an addiction!

>>96081225
>you'd call me a secondary
You wish you were a secondary, you're a tertiary at best but most likely a quaternary. Your impression of 40K is based off of memes filtered through redditors filtered through faggoty secondaries like alfabusa. Your opinion is worth less than the greasy pepperoni shit I took this morning.

>>96081099
the great irony is that the craftworlders still exhibit the very egocentrism that caused the collapse of the eldar empire.
I won't deny that they just want to live, but when you peel back the things they do in the name of that cause, they start to resemble their kin who never stopped partying.

>>96080547
Did you really need to use slop for a fucking 40k picture.

>>96081236
Whatever paypiggy, I'm enjoying myself while you cope and seethe.

>>96081263
>I'm enjoying myself
You're literally reviled wherever you go. Meanwhile, I get to enjoy both 40K as a game and discussing it with my friends.

>>96081285
>I get to enjoy both 40K as a game
So what edition are you playing then?

>>96081313
10e. It's kinda mid, but anything is fun with friends. Not that you'd know. Trying to get my buds to try out Infinity, but I have to finish painting up my second army to run some trial games before I can really start shilling the game proper.

What about you? Surely you actually play traditional games instead of just shitting up this board with the most rancid quaternary posts possible.

>>96080283
>Dark eldar never put on illusions about what they stand for.
Is this why everyone on /tg/ seems to only blame the craftworlders for causing Slaanesh while the DEldar are ignored or mentioned as an afterthought?

>>96081332
>10e.
SQUEEL PIGGY SQUEEL!!!

>What about you?
Mostly Battletech these days, but this week they wanted to do Alpha Strike and the guy pushing for it wanted to use the model huffing Wolfnet rules.
I went to golf with my brother and his son, not realizing we were doing the full eight-teen holes.

>>96081373
Its the same reason why people always blame Craftworlds for Slannesh (despite them rejecting everything related to him) and never doing to very same with the chaos marines

>>96081379
>SQUEEL PIGGY SQUEEL!!!
I accept your concession. My orks remain fun regardless of edition so I'm willing to play what my friends want to play. Again, not that you'd know what it's like having friends.
>Mostly Battletech these days
Given how much the btech crowd hates you, pressing [X] to doubt.
>I went to golf with my brother and his son, not realizing we were doing the full eight-teen holes.
>xhe doesn't have enough stamina for fucking golf
lmao

>>96081373
Dark Eldar kinda terminate the whole thought by just saying "yeah that is what I want" when you say they're trying to keep their murderfuck party going while dodging the consequences, unlike the defensive bleating of craftworlders.

>>96081449
Thing is Craftworlders literally self-exiled BEFORE slannytranny popped into existence. It's a bit like blaming the Interex for the Imperium.

>>96081420
Surprised?
I'm a lot different than the caricature you wish I was.
And yeah, I'm out of shape and it was four and a half hours in +80 degree sun.

I dont want to be the good guy. I want to be the smug asshole

>>96081463
>Surprised?
No, I just don't believe you. You're too odious to get along with humans.

>>96081555
>You're too odious to get along with humans.
No, you just assume that because again, you've constructed this caricature in your head, mostly out of schizo bullshit.

I think the main reason people don't like Eldar are that they were OP on the tabletop, they're extremely smug pricks despite never really getting any major wins to back it up, and they make the Imperium look bad morally (same reason Tau are hated). Sure, an Eldar will kill billions to save a handful of their own, but that's still better than the Imperium, who will kill a billion of their own to kill a handful of xenos, even if said xenos don't pose any actual threat. Many Eldar will show some remorse for it too. Finally, I think a lot of fans just don't like the aesthetic. They don't like a bunch of pretty space elves in power rangers gear in their grim and dark space gothic future.

>>96081642
It's ironic too, because elves are extremely beloved in AoS and WfB.

>>96079971
The takedown of the first guy was pretty sick

>>96079712
>The imperium commits unspeakable atrocities and rights violation because it has no choice if it wants to survive
False, many of the evils the Imperium commits are actively detrimental to its own survival. The Imperium commits atrocities because it wants to, and because it hates life more than it values survival.

>>96078872 (OP)
Yep yep, no lies detected. Of course the best course for humanity (and everyone pretty much) is chaos worship, particularly Slannesh. Life in 40k fucking sucks so being driven crazy enough to like getting spikes driven through your balls and inhaling toxic fumes is arguably the best option, because at least you'll be happy while the former happens to you anyway. Maybe you can even get into a heaven of sorts by being tortured in a fun way for eternity!

>>96081648
To be fair High and Dark Elves in WHF are dominant powers, while in 40k Eldar are "muh dying race" that live on big ships because they lost their homes.
Also WHF high Elves keep chaos at bay with Vortex and saved the world multiple times while Eldar are responsible for Slaanesh, Eye of Terror. Elves have huge protagonist energy while Eldar feel like NPC.

>>96078887
Sorry, dude, but since psykers and Chaos exist tau are objectively incorrect and human tau make no in universe sense

>She emerges from the light like the spirit of vengeance made manifest. Her armour is powder white, coiled tight around her lithe musculature. Ivy iconography slides and twists over the plates like living smoke. From her shoulders trail banners of flowing vermilion silk like blood-drenched wings, matching the crested mane of her screaming war helm. She bears a crackling power glaive, its crystalline blade singing as it carves the air. She soars towards Magyar, at the altar’s apex.
>Togin is a Mortifactor without peer, having served for a century in Magyar’s elite guard. In Posul’s last nights, Togin slaughtered over a thousand of the Leviathan swarm, allowing the surviving companies to withdraw.
>Althanax bears the Chapter banner. He has carried it through every crusade of the Mortifactors’ First Company for the last two centuries. The skulls of every race and wicked bastion of Mankind’s enemies clatter from his plate on dense black chains.
>These are the warriors at Magyar’s side as the war maiden descends. These are the warriors she kills before touching the ground. Their bifurcated remains crash to the flagstones like tolling bells. The Chapter banner falls, its fabric drinking the blood of champions that empties onto the stone.
>The eldar exarch tilts her head, regarding Magyar, before whipping blood from her glaive. The Chapter Master stoops, gathering the fallen banner and lashing it to his armour like a cloak. He activates his massive war scythe with a hiss of coruscating lightning, and the two clash.

>>96081846
>...
>I turn my head to see Magyar duel the exarch above the melee. He attacks in blurring combinations, martial prowess alloyed with volcanic fury. The exarch flows around his attacks like quicksilver.
>Magyar slashes low, a disembowelling strike the exarch evades with a flourishing backflip. Landing in a crouch, she counters with an upward slash, severing Magyar’s scythe in two, barely missing the Chapter Master’s head with a horizontal reverse strike.
>Magyar drops the smoking halves of his scythe, reaching for the gladius at his hip. But his grip falters, and the weapon falls away. My eyes widen as bright blood sheets down from his gorget.
>She had not missed. With a sound like a Titan falling, Magyar drops to his knees. His head trembles, and rolls off his shoulders. His body pitches forward, and his blood joins that of his champions in pulsing sprays.
>‘No!’ I scream.
>The exarch strides to the altar’s edge and raises her arm. Clutched in her fist is Magyar’s head, shedding the last of its lifeblood from severed arteries. She holds it aloft for all to see, and releases it. It tumbles down, bouncing against the timeworn steps before disappearing from sight.

>>96081771
>>96081648
>>96081642
Sometime around 2E, Craftworlders became a parody of elves, embodying all of their worse aspects. So the arrogance, fey-like qualities, and the "self-pitying dying race of pansy poetry writers never allowed to win" got turned up to 11. HElves in Fantasy have a little bit of that too, but unlike CEldar, they have nuance and are badass. Since then, they've tried to tone it down, but CEldar are still very much elf parodies.

>>96079006
Tau are hands down better to live under than the imperium, are you fucking high?

>>96079712
The vast majority of modern chaos is caused directly by the imperium being bumfuck retarded.

>>96080161
>>96080140
By these definitions, tyranids are in fact the good guys, as they do this far better than the imperium.

>>96081094
of course it is, think of the children is the constant cry of those wanting to use their children as shields to get their political way.

>>96081420
>I accept your concession. My orks remain fun regardless of edition so I'm willing to play what my friends want to play. Again, not that you'd know what it's like having friends.
1. post your orks
2. you do not have taste. i have a saying that kicking godturds would be fun with friends, playing 10e isn't much better.

>>96081885
So much better until your neighbor develops psyker abilities and that "harmless" local group of guys in funny robes who meet on Thursdays open a portal in his backyard and literal hell spews forth

>>96082017
This will literally happen faster under the imperium than under the tau.
It is hands down better to be a tau man than an imperial, any disadvantage you argue is worse in the imperium.

>>96081976
Kill yourself ND

>ND
>Eldar coomers
>HFY-tards
Truly the worst of the threads.

>>96082049
post your orks NOW

>>96082049
>ND
The fuck is an ND?

>>96078872 (OP)
>irretrievably fuck the entire galaxy
>good guys
nah

>>96082248
But enough about Necrons and the Imperium.

>>96081373
The Dark Eldar weren't the ones who birthed Slaanesh, as they were hiding out in the Webway when that happened. The ones who were actually responsible were all consumed. Granted, my beautiful edgy space elves saw nothing wrong with all of the murderfucking and gleefully continued such a rich tradition, but they're technically innocent of the whole "spawning a fourth Chaos God" thing.

>>96082235
Negligent Discharge, you see it over on /k/ all the time.

>>96078872 (OP)
>I would sacrifice ten thousand human babies for a single Eldar fingernail
>Shit, I'd sacrifice ten thousand human babies just for the giggles honestly
Who created Slaanesh again?

>>96078872 (OP)
You're right in the gestalt, but on the wrong side of the War in Heaven.

>>96082407
>I'd sacrfice ten thousand human babies to ensure ten billion human babies die in an easily preventable chaos invasion!
Not like the imperium is much better.

This all could've been prevented if the Old Ones just shared the secrets of immortality with the Necrontyr.

>>96082464
Necrons were assholes, giving them immortality was a bad idea, Just ask the C'tan

>>96082473
Quit shitposting and get back in the pokeball, Deceiver.

>>96082464
Necrontyr probably should've just moved planet

>>96082407
imperifags have one response for their inability to handle the fact that the eldar carry on just fine without smashing newborns flat with hammers because its totally necessary

>>96081885
Nonsense, the Imperium is far better to live in if you are a nobleman. Nobody is interested in the opinion of the plebs.

>>96082875
I'm going on averages, and there's far more torture worlds than pleasure planets in the imperium.

>>96082464
>gibsmedatsfofree!
>we wuz phaerons and shieeet!
More like Negrontyr

>>96082464
Old Ones should just destroy Necrontyr instead.
Still main problem were C'tan who upgraded necrontyrs and then carried them hard during war.

>>96078872 (OP)
It never ceases to amaze me how easily people fall for this specific kind of bait.

>>96082925
>Old Ones should just destroy Necrontyr instead.
Oh, they tried!

>>96082464
The triarch didn't want their people to be immortal, they wanted their people to shut up and serve drinks. They started the war to force the necrontyr to unite under their leadership. The war started because a trio of tumorous retards wanted to increase their job approval rating from other, even more tumorous retards.

>>96079649
>a) they would get deleted if they pissed off Imperium enough to put in an effort

You are aware that the Imperium's forces are spread so thinly that they would still have bigger targets to prioritize if the craftworlders "pissed them off enough," right? It's the main reason the tau still exist.

"But for all their multitudes, they are barely enough to hold off the ever-present threat from aliens, heretics, mutants - and worse."

This isn't a HFY setting, tourist.

>>96082017
The Imperium is literally the only civilization in the galaxy whose people are fucked in the head enough to listen to Gorerape the Skullfucker when he shows up preaching about the gods of murder, drugs, schizophrenia and suffering in hell forever.
Daemonic fuckery is infinitely more likely to happen in the Imperium then in any other place

>>96078872 (OP)
It's true. The only good guy in all of 40k is Commander Farsight. He's the only one trying to build an interstellar nation that isn't batshit insane.

>>96083601
Exodites literally just want to be left alone and live humble lives of honest work. Minding your own damn business is the greatest good of all.

>>96081648
AoS have no elves.
Only Eldar-like pajeets

>>96083601
Correct!!!

>>96082017
Except it has been noted in the lore that such things really don't happen among humans populations living under Tau rule.

Face it chud, the Imperium is just straight up dogshit. Every problem you use as evidence that the Imperium is justified in being the way it is is caused specifically because the Imperium is the way it is.

I fucking hate Eldar. Why can't all xenos factions be made non-playable?? Like make them AI-directed NPC minis that can appear in battles between marines and Chaos, the actual factions that matter.

>>96083663
what, have Chat-GPT run the minis?

>>96083620
Exodites aren't a playable army though. We are talking about playable factions. Anyone playing any army other than Farsight Enclaves is playing the villain.

The only hero in 40k is Da Red Gobbo

>>96083677
NTA, but xenos shouldn't be their own armies. They should be something akin to "mercenaries" that either the Imperium or Chaos can "hire" to be part of their armies.

>>96080283
>They're honest about who they are
Eh, not really. The Imperium lies all the time about how hostile the galaxy is.

>>96083679
>We are talking about playable factions
Nope, anon said said "in all of 40k" which encompasses more than just the table top, sorry.

>>96079087
Why are you correcting him? It's been Eldar longer than it has been Aeldari? Both aren't incorrect, if anything he's pulling rank on you and you're showing yourself as a newer 40K fan.
>>96079058
>their point of view since they view humans as barely sentient animals
The vast majority don't. Even Alaitoc have a lot of moral conflict over killing humans, and view their aspect warriors as murderers with a mixture of fear and disdain towards them.

Saim-Hann outright pull out of alliances with Biel-Tan if they feel like they're going too far in killing humans. Eldrad at one point claimed to be friends with the Emperor of Mankind, even after everything. The Eldar have also sacrificed a lot of their own to save humans, like with the Ynnari. Or Asurmen going onto human hiveworlds to basically give alms to the poor and weary, just to be nice.

Even Biel-Tan respect the men of Tallarn, despite their genocidal attitudes towards humans.

Or that corsair planet the Blood Angels purged with Dante, back when he was a sergeant, where humans, Eldar, and xenos lived peacefully.

Some of the most unambiguous villains in this setting are Eldar, they're Drukhari. But it's absolutely inaccurate to say Eldar unilaterally view humanity as barely sentient pests.

>>96079375
4Chan, Discord, memes. It's been a meme. A lot of 40K fans know fuck all for the lore, especially if it's for factions they don't like. I say this as a fan since 2008 or 2009.

>>96083718
>Even Alaitoc have a lot of moral conflict over killing humans
Source? Please do not say Path of the Eldar, because the protagonist was more sickened by the fact that she enjoyed killing humans than the act itself.

>>96083694
Are you retarded?

>>96083714
Every xeno we see is hostile as fuck, not to mention that there wasn't a single xeno who didn't stab humanity in the back during the age of strife.

>>96083734
Give me one good reason why GW should continue supporting a bunch of armies and model lines that hardly anyone buys? Like it or not, Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines are what the overwhelming majority of 40k customers want. Why do you think HH became as popular as it did?

>>96079393
Humanity are humanity. They are good and bad. It's more about keeping your humanity in an inherently inhumane universe.

>>96079649
That's not a deterrent for ones like Biel-Tan. It's that most just don't care enough to do so. Biel-Tan have next to no reservations. The others at a similar size could do what Biel-Tan is doing, and ironically, they're one of the only major craftworlds that's actually succeeding to a degree. The only major craftworld that genuinely worships Khaine is also the one that's faring the best out of the major ones. If Eldar wanted to unite and murder humanity out of existence, they would. Most just don't care enough to crusade or go to war, they're already pretty averse to warfare with how negatively they view their aspect warriors.

>>96083746
>Every xeno we see is hostile as fuck
Because the Imperium keeps shooting the friendly ones.

>not to mention that there wasn't a single xeno who didn't stab humanity in the back during the age of strife.
There were several, the Imperium stabbed them in the back for protecting humans.

>>96083746
>Every xeno we see is hostile as fuck

See picrel.

>>96083748
>hardly anyone buys

Are you retarded???

>>96083950
No one buys xenos. If they did, GW would focus more on them. All available data shows Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines are the two most popular armies to purchase by a significant margin.

>>96083950
He's a Marine player, so yes.

In elemental council the tau mention making plans to attack ultramar, basically blue on blue.

I'd want the tau to go in, get wrecked by guilliman and need to get saved by farsight again, just so i could see the codex verses the mirror codex.

>>96084247
I'm actually hoping they have the Tau win and conquer Ultramar. And make it so it's not even close either. Make like the US invading Iraq back in 1991. The sheer amount of seethe from marinefags AND imperiumfags would be worth it.

>>96084263
If I were to eyeball a way for that to happen, I'd say the best way would be to outmaneuver Guilliman. He's a genius, but also only a single person, so they manage to get him stuck into a battle and a spaceborne engagement makes it incredibly risky for him to get out for some time. Maybe even have him think he has more time, but it gets revealed the T'au have managed to crack proper Warp Travel in some way and this lets them pin him down longer and ultimately push way further.

Perhaps their capture of Ultramar coincides with him breaking out. Guilliman would probably retake Ultramar, but the T'au basically enacted a threat on par with what Nurgle did with that plague to try and pin Guilliman to Ultramar (and would have gone further than even Mortarian's recent war did). May have even kept a chunk of the 500 worlds for their own. And doing it in a way that emphasizes the whole Rising Empire and Falling Empire theme that the T'au and Imperium have.

>>96078872 (OP)
Literally the same.

>>96084263
I just lowkey want a team up where guilliman realizes that farsight might be one of his greatest pupils. Just because of the amount of time farsight has spent to reverse engineer even just a portion of the codex astartes. I mean when they fight directly its a chess match where both sides stay relatively whole as its all about positional warfare rather than blindly trading units, and then when they team up against the inevitable chaos threat they fight in concert despite not directly being in communication. Guilliman is so impressed he even limits himself so he doesn't show more of the codex.

>>96081073
All it is missing is him talking about wanting to become a cow woman lesbian and talking about his attempted murder of his own mother, who he dropped heavy furniture on. Or his weird comments about his nieces and nephews.

>>96084263
The Psychic Awakening book where the Tau invade a Cardinal world at the same time as Genestealer cults and Chaos was their Iraq.

>>96082388
>The ones who were actually responsible were all consumed
Not true. Most were, but there were survivors on the core worlds and many of them fled into the webway, ending up in Commorragh.

Imagine getting into Warhammer and deciding to play an NPC faction like Eldar or Tau, and then having gal to act like they not only matter but are the good guys. Absolutely retarded.

Everyone is a bad guy in Warhammer, even your precious elven femboi losers and naive vagina faced fish weebs. Some bad guys are just cooler than the others. Please go back to your anime now.

>>96084639
Its a feature not a bug that my factions propaganda is so effective that retards believe it. Truly an insidious faction.

>>96079741
Such a naive species shouldn't be able to compete in such a brutal galaxy. That's the problem.

>ELDAR AND TAU ARE CRINGE! THERE ARE NO GOOD GUYS IN 40k!

>except my guardsmen. They're just fighting a war.
>and my commissar he's just keeping my guardsmen alive (even though he just killed greg for cowardness)
>And the emperor he just wanted what was best for humanity
>and my favorite primarchs even though they're all genocidal warlords especially my not conniving opportunist robutte guilliman
>and my 5 man team of space marines.
>and the salamanders
>and the ultramarines
>and my custodes that did a brutality because a space marine talked back
>and my imperial book protagonist
>and my "honorary loyalist" le complicated chaos space marine

Portraying the imperium as good guys only to say there isn't any good guys the MINUTE tau or eldar is brought up is like that guy who lifts the most in your friend group and brags about it, only to say "it's not about how much you lift" when they meet a heavier lifter.

If they really believed in the "no good guys in 40k" bit they would walk the walk and not flip around and support whoever genocidal maniac they identify with. I'm tired of the shameless double standards and """"exceptions"""""".

>>96083849
This is the worst fucking image edit I've ever seen.

>>96083827
40k is the only realpolitik mainstream fictional setting. There are no friendly aliens waiting to join our glorious liberal democracy. This isn't Star Trek or Mass Effect. A galaxy of little Tau empires would eat the Imperium piecemeal.

>>96084639
>Please go back to your anime now.
And he did it by posting on anime forum.

>>96084867
Xeno races helped humanity to deal with Men of Iron clusterfuck and durring Great Crusade Imperium destroyed all remaining DAoT human-xeno states.

>>96084639
Space Marines are only cool if you stopped maturing at age 14. I can understand them being what gets someone into the setting, but continuing to venerate them into adulthood is insane. "Big knights who fuck their hundred brothers" is what a literal child wants to see in a hero.

>>96081642

No, it's specifically *because* they're morally superior to the Imperium that people don't like them. Same reason they dislike Tau. They hate the implication that the Imperium is not the unironic good guys for being babykilling psychopaths.

>>96083849
Not true. After the war against the man of Iron the aliens invaded enslaved/ate humans like the world where Mortarion fell. There was not one single good xeno. In 40k, peace cannot exist. Different races are simply too different and can never understand. Different species will instinctually hate each other and put aside everything to hurt and kill others. If they approach with a smile it is only to stab you in the back later. That is the central idea of 40k, that the differences between people are simply unbridgeable and there can only be peace when one side genocided everyone else. Why do you think people on here like 40k so much?

>>96085067
People don't understand that 40k a relic of the nihilistic darkness of British 80s Punk. Punk believed that a better future was impossible, that hope was a delusion, that life was pointless suffering, and that things would have been better had the first fish never crawled onto land. 40k takes a lot of that, and runs with it.

>>96081099
>In fairness Craftworld Eldar are the ones that explicitly rejected the murderfucking and dedicated themselves to an incredibly strict ascetic life
No, they "course-corrected" (a.k.a. grew a conscience) at the very last minute before Slaanesh was murderfucked into existence and were forced to eat humble pie in the aftermath. The ones you're thinking of are actually the Exodites, who started leaving the degenerate mainstream Eldar culture centuries if not millennia before Slaanesh was created, because they foresaw where that lifestyle would lead.

>>96085084

>Punk believed that a better future was impossible, that hope was a delusion, that life was pointless suffering, and that things would have been better had the first fish never crawled onto land.

No. Punk is not inherently nihilistic. It's just cynical about traditionalism, but traditionalists and conservatives have trouble distinguishing between those two ideas.

>>96085087
Modern punk, sure, but Gen-X (80s and 90s) style punk really was a
>I wouldn't care if the world was destroyed tommorrow
type.

>>96081462
>Thing is Craftworlders literally self-exiled BEFORE slannytranny popped into existence.
Yeah, literally 5 minutes before that happened. EXODITES are the only ones who deserve any credit for being reasonable, having told the mainstream Eldar to go fuck themselves into oblivion (whey did practically did) and left to seclude themselves on the various maiden worlds, WAY LONG BEFORE the Craftworlders eventually grew a conscience as a side effect of Slaanesh's birth contractions (ergo, way too late).

>>96085105

Sounds like you're referring to post-punk, really. Dead Kennedys are like iconic 80's punk and they were not as you describe.

Also rotate that logo 90 degrees and what do you see?

>>96078872 (OP)
Look, I love my Racist Elves. But Craft World Elves would gladly murder humans for shit and giggles THAN blame the humans for making them do it.

"No, you don't understand. That harmless human settlement had to die because a human said hi to me! ME!"

But sexy space nuns with guns can't be bad.

>>96079006
>They hated him because he told the truth

>>96079741
T'au were always bad since their introduction in, what, 2004?
They were naive, yes, in the sense that they don't realize they're to be as bad as the rest.

>>96085249
They are. They're losing their men to Tau and Eldar Women. They have to step it up for the Emperor.

>>96078872 (OP)
tall helmets always looks stupid

thats what stopped me from collecting eldar or rather "Ledar"

talked with buds that I played with, they're all ork, marine and such players, hating the tall horns of chaos stuff and handlebar helmets(bunny ear boys)

we're just against branch tapping helmets that make them look like they won't fit inside their transport

its just stupid and dumb

>>96085375
it is stupid and dumb, and completely unprecedented

>>96085396
i didnt say people didnt do it

>>96085340
Canonically, human men are losing human women to eldar men.

>>96085405
90% of men dying in the wars means lots of women to have

just like real life, right now

>>96083849
You don't actually believe in Christ, so why do you invoke his name?

>>96085405
Nah, that's only if you're a female Inquisitor.

>>96085396
>unprecedented
Bruh

>>96085565
まじ?

>>96085405
>Canonically, human women are also losing human men to eldar men.

>>96085085
they didn’t ‘course-correct’ you fucking retard, the craftworlds spent almost all of their time away from the rest of the eldar and were some of the only sane ones as a result

>>96085249
>insane religious fanatics who will burn you alive for not believing in their god hard enough
They're the Imperium in a nutshell.

>>96085405
>>96085616
Now we know why imperiumfags and hfy fags hate eldar men

>>96080105
THIS is his you introduce diversity GW!

>>96081523
Fortunately the Eldar are also the good guys

>>96085680
Elves with fat cocks do not exist. How does one say "pencil dick" to an elf in Imperial?

>>96085067
Overlords of Mortarion's homeworld were mutants who themselves didn't know if they were human before or some human-ish xenos (capable of breeding with humans), and Chaos worshippers at that.
>not a single good xeno
Actually plenty of those. But that clashes with viewing Emperor's abomination as good and absolutely necessary so you disregard those. At least you can be content with knowing that the modern Imperium is very awoken and regressive and that along with fat bastars condemning millions and billions of people to unnecessary deaths there are also manjawed lesbians doing the same.

>>96078872 (OP)
Why would I care? I'm playing a wargame, why would I want to play as the victim?

>>96085375
You fucking plebian, you utterly tasteless fuckwit, you philistine, the tall helmets are literally the BEST part about the Eldar aesthetic. Fucking kill yourself. Fuck you.

>>96078872 (OP)
The human fight for survival is exactly the same as the Eldar's, and both groups are equally callous and pragmatic in this pursuit. In the case of the Imperium their genocidal attitude is wholly rational. Every prior attempt to take a more friendly posture towards aliens has result in human enslavement and extermination. In the case of the Eldar, they have no qualms whatsoever about sacrificing trillions of Non-Eldar to ensure their own safety.

>>96078887
>even by just human moral standards
Human is as human does, not as human claims to be. It is not possible for something nonhuman to excel beyond a human in human morality, because morality is the philosophy of acting correctly. "Correctly" in the human milieu invariably means acting for human survival.

>>96085051
It's actually because they're all genocidal sociopathic empires, but some of them get a pass because they're not human.

That's the actual reason. If a group of humans acted like the Tau they would be called gay race communists (which they are) and everyone would hate them. Because they are blue aliens they are victim coded, which means they can't actually be guilty of the insane shit they are objectively guilty of, like the extermination at Nimbosa.

Eldar are pretty cool, I'm not sure why GW are so hellbent on earasing their existence in the newer stuff.

>>96085803
>but some of them get a pass because they're not human
On /tg/, it's the opposite.
Every atrocity is okay, as long as they are committed by humans.

>>96085067
>what is the diasporex???
>what is the tau empire??

>>96085809
Blocky spehs dudes shouting angrily at other blocky spehs dudes sell more.
Buy the new and cool blocky spehs dudes. They shoot guns and have gay drama with other blocky spehs dudes.

>>96078872 (OP)
What an absolutely moronic and boring take. The Eldar have killed entire planets to ensure their survival and the Tau should have been wiped out by the Orks or Tyranids and only survived cause plot armour.

>>96085820
>plot armour
I want to abolish this asinine term.

>>96085820
They survived because they utilize modern-day war tactics, not plot armor.

>>96085828
Bullshit. No matter what space wizardry they could dream up the Tau should have been wiped out on on first contact with Tyranids, but GW once again ignores scale. The Tau only occupied a handful of worlds when hive fleet Kraken invaded, the nids could drown them billions of times over with sheer biomass.

>>96085803
>get a pass because they're not human.
They get a pass because they are being compared next to the Imperium. People talk about how Tau in any other setting would be the antagonist all the time. But they're in 40k and are objectively better than the Imperium, at the very least because they aren't personally fueling and supplying the Chaos hordes.

>>96085757
>Elves with fat cocks do not exist.

>>96081885
Only because it suits tau interest currently
>>96080018
The imperial creed is a more logical and apt belief system than the greater good because it has an actual ideological basis. The greater good is nothing but propagansa slogans being thrown back and forth to the point no one can agree on what it actually means, that's one of the reasons Farsight ventured off to begin with. The imperial creed has at least religious institutions that even if they can be incredibly divergent in their beliefs align under central values and have actual written texts explaining what the imperial truth is about
>>96085265
Pretty much but Phil Kelly is fucking up the faction's direction again
Also there was a small discussion about chaos in the tau empire and yes it is real and Nurgle is making great efforts on that front including even death guard raids. Humans are still an underclass and the god of stagnation coming to help people who's social condition didn't really get that much better is quite fitting.
Also I have yet to see a canon source that shows drastic changes upon living in the tau empire like free healthcare or education for the gue'la. Some outright say they worked twice as much

>>96085843
The tau are actually a hard matchup agains't tyranids due to their ways of warfare. Tyranids are not nearly as unpredictable as orkz or humans and earth caste scientists did their absolute best to uncover parts about their nature and instincts. The main thing was that tau leadership lacked adaptability skills specially after the whole 'lets make everyone puretide' debacle but they learned that to survive the galaxy they needed to rapidly adapt their strategies. Them being able to develop technology at a faster rate than anyone else in the setting makes it so the tyranids are at a constant war for adaptability agains't a opponent that comes at closer to that particular skill of their than any other in the galaxy.
One of the few reasonable faction matchups the tau have in lore and people are out here complaining about plot armor. Bitch in Damocles Cato Sicarius took down half the fire caste battle force by himself and people just turn a blind eye to that apparently.
The tau just can't handle fighting space marines, orkz, anything chaos, necrons, eldar, dark eldar and at moat have a good matchup agains't guard regiments and bugs. Hell they have a constant fear of civil war and unrest since it's deeply taboo in their society so genestealer cults are very well a high level threat, specially since some have been confirmed to exist within tau space.

>>96085820
>plot armour.
You mean what the imperium has?

>>96078872 (OP)
dark eldar are still eldar, you do not get to sweep that under the rug and pretend its a different unrelated race

>>96085852
They aren't objectively better, they have the same capacity for evil but are smaller and weaker and younger.

They get a pass because they are weak, I.E. victims.

>>96085887
By that logic chaos is still the imperium thus the imperium is super duper turbo mega bad now

>>96078872 (OP)
>40K has good guys
Not on a race/faction-wide level, but an individual one. And only a majority of those.
>but they're not in the Imperium.
They are. Nearly each faction and race have their own good guys that are morally upright but are forced to be pragmatic at best due to the setting.
There are even Chaos Marines who are Byronic Heroes at worst and Anti-Heroes at best. Those are however a rarity and even rarer are the times when they gain redemption.

>>96085892
>THEY'RE WORSE BECAUSE THEY COULD POSSIBLY MAYBE DO THE SAME GIVEN THE CHANCE
You are on levels of cope not seen outside of US foreign policy.

Arguing over who's the good guys in warhammer is the gayest shit, when you should be arguing over who's the most evil (and that's a good thing)

>>96085932
As a Dark Eldar fan, I can sit back and watch these arguments play out, a smile on my face, secure in the knowledge that my favorite faction are just the absolute worst. No scruples or mental gymnastics here, just pure villainy.

>>96085966
Beckjann was the best eldar fanartist. Too bad he stopped. I love the way he portrayed the look of the Eldar.

>>96086004
>stopped
Bro he literally died.

>>96086004
i havent heard that name in like a decade, what ever happened??

>>96086015
oh.

>>96085966
Sorry, bro. Dark Eldar are capable of love, forming unbreakable bonds and families which puts them much higher than Chaos who at most get a forever moping Aaron Dembski Bowden protag still doing inhumane shit but who has platonic feelings of love for some human woman and his monstrously evil "brothers" whom he still considers his sussy bakas.

>>96078872 (OP)
To illustrate the point, I suppose it could be said that the craftworlders generally have some notion of what war crimes are and what the principle of proportionality in warfare is, and for what little it's worth, it's more than can be said of most other factions in the game.

>>96086004
He really nailed how they're supposed to be aliens while keeping the otherworldly elvish features intact. I like how there's a slight Japanese influence as well. Far too many artists fall into the trap of "human cosplayers with pointy ears."
>>96086016
It's agreed upon that he passed away, though I've never seen any confirmation from a reliable source. If that's truly the case, then it's a real shame. I'm still looking for someone as dedicated as he was to depicting the DE.
>>96086022
>Dark Eldar are capable of love, forming unbreakable bonds and families
The closest a Dark Eldar can get to expressing "love" is a twisted form of fascination bordering on obsession with some BDSM thrown in for good measure.
>which puts them much higher than Chaos who at most get a forever moping Aaron Dembski Bowden protag still doing inhumane shit but who has platonic feelings of love for some human woman and his monstrously evil "brothers" whom he still considers his sussy bakas.
This is vile Talos slander. Not really, since you're not wrong. I just don't like the way you said it.

>>96086071
Beckjann was one of my first introductions to the Eldar when I got into 40k many years ago. I’d actually largely forgotten about him and his work, so seeing the name mentioned snapped me back to being a stupid teenager just getting into 40k.

I hope he’s alive and well, and simply just moved on from art.

>>96086015
I didn't know that, what a shame.

>>96086110
People don't really move on from art. Best case scenario he just stopped posting his shit online.

>>96086174
Can only hope they’re still around then
>>96078872 (OP)
Seems like the creator of the image found this thread lmao

>>96079136
>pedo artist

>>96086202
>the image I made
Imagine claiming ownership of a meme lmao

>>96086236
i dont think theyre claiming ownership outside of saying they made it to say x, i just think its funny that theyre getting mad over it

>>96079375
In one of the Ciaphis Cain stories, it’s brought up that the Tau aligned secret conspiracy has the hired help and the nobles hanging out together, basically as equals. It’s quite clear that the Tau use the Imperium‘s own internal class divisions to create fifth columns. It seems like that would be hard if they were a less egalitarian society than the Imperium (admittedly not hard).

>>96086229
Where the fuck do you think you are?

>>96084867
>There are no friendly aliens waiting to join our glorious liberal democracy.
There were.

Then the Imperium killed them.

>>96085859
>The imperial creed is a more logical
Wrong. Simply because Creed was never meant to be logical. It's just smoke screen to cover Emperor\s lust for power.
>The greater good is nothing but propagansa
And Creed isn't even good propaganda

>>96085859
>and have actual written texts explaining what the imperial truth is about
You mean texts which were based on writtings of Chaos Demon Prince?

>>96079136
>salamanders being the 'good guy' faction
Anybody who thinks this learned everything they know about 40k exclusively through memes.

>>96086110
>Beckjann was one of my first introductions to the Eldar when I got into 40k many years ago.
Me too. His art played a big role in me becoming such a die-hard Dark Eldar fanboy. I'm fond of Adrian Smith's depiction of them as well.

>>96085757
>Elves with fat cocks do not exist.
Picrel fucked dozens of the Old World ladies
And he was considered unattractive for elven chicks

>>96085120
>Also rotate that logo 90 degrees and what do you see?
Man I was just arguing with someone the other day whether Khorne was nihilistic or not.

>>96085340
"Let the Galaxy MOTORBOAT!!!"

>>96085892
>They aren't objectively better, they have the same capacity for evil but are smaller and weaker and younger.
So "Evil" is a capacity of Strength?

>>96078872 (OP)
>>96078887
The craftworld eldar barely distance themselves from the drukhari. They're very sympathetic to them, because they are literally the same, except the craftworld are just currently on a different ideology, it can shift at any time, because in their nature they are weird, incomprehensible sadists who do not champion values that humanity would consider to be good.

This is why eldar remain evil and gay. The tau are just a cop out for the setting. Doesn't make any sense for the rest of the aliens to be truly alien for humanity but for this one faction to just be humans with benign beliefs and blue skin.

>>96080018
>Europeons again proving how stupid you all are
The Tau are a surveillance state on the level that would make the Imperium blush. EVERY DEVICE is a monitor, and the Tau have AI's to monitor and track everything. Propaganda? Motherfucker when Farsight and his troops encountered "they're totally xenos" Chaos Daemons the Ethereals start blamming them which led him to dip out and form the Farsight Enclaves. The testing of a new Tau Warp Drive went so wrong and created a warp rift on live TV, and anyone who saw it was required to get their memories wiped. The Tau who survived being thrown through the warp? Well when the mainline Tau found them, they were going Total Xenos Death and would even fire on uniformed auxiliaries.

>>96086202
Since when do we give a shit what the creator of a meme intended?

>>96081001
>Votann are Jewish
WOT

>>96083849
What in the fuck kind of brainrot is this!?

>>96084446
>dropping heavy furniture on
Oh god I remember that, how the fuck is he not in prison?

>>96079741
>they make the grim reality of the galaxy that much more poigniant by their relatively earnest good intentions
In 40k this is made as an example in a paragraph of another faction's codex moments before they get invaded and annihilated by said faction. Literal BL short story-tier faction, doesn't make any sense for them to be made into a main playable faction.

The original Mon-Keigh were cruel cannibalistic subhumans who enslaved the Eldar before a great hero freed them and the space elves eradicated the ((Mon-Keigh)).

>>96087232
>enslaved the Eldar
The only time that could have happened is before the Old Ones uplifted them, because after they were pretty much untouchable.

>>96087169
Because it was a furniture moving accident that I was actually very afraid WOULD happen...
You make ONE off-colored joke and you never hear the end of it...

>>96087295
>haha wouldn't it be funny if i dropped this on the only woman who loves me haha
That's not off color you retard, that's the equivalent of showing up to your local school with a rifle and ammunition and then call saying you're going to shoot it up.

>>96087407
Context dumbass; I was complaining about how overbearing my mother was being, someone of course jokes about murdering her, I quip that I dropped a cabinet on her and she walked it off.
I don't think I've ever told you that I base my interpretations of Slaanesh AND Khorne off of my Mother.

>>96087496
You're really not helping your case, I'd shut the fuck up if I were you.

>>96087295
>>96087496
Wait, so you literally attempted to kill your mother in a "heavy furniture accident" and then brag about it online? What the fuck is wrong with you?

>>96087521
No, my mother had a heavy furniture accident when she told me to "let it go" as we were moving a hundred pounds of cabinetry, that subsequently bulldozed her down a flight of steps.
As this was the exact worse case scenario I had feared would happen, I was rather glad that she was only stunned for a bit before being able to get up and walk to the ambulance on her own.

>>96087055
Craftworld eldar openly revile the dark eldar and only ally with them when things are truly desperate. The only major exception is Il-Kaithe, but they will ally with pretty much anybody if it means fighting chaos.

If you have a better alternative to imperial society the imperial fanboys get upset.

Bretonnia used to be a better altrnative to imperial life, but that made the imperial fanboys insecure so they GW had to GRIMDARKIFY them.

>>96087093
>>Europeons again proving how stupid you all are
So amerimutt. Sorry, I thought you was a first worlder with proper education, but nevermind.
>The Tau are a surveillance state on the level that would make the Imperium blush
Yeah especially Inquisition.
More or less it's not case of Imperium's respect towards common folk and their routine business, but rather issue of imperial incompetence, which opens way for Chaos and Genestealers cults to flourish.
>Motherfucker when Farsight and his troops encountered "they're totally xenos" Chaos Daemons the Ethereals start blamming them which led him to dip out and form the Farsight Enclaves.
And BIG SHOCK it didn'\t caused as much amount of damage to Tau as it did with Imperium durring Great Crusade.
>The testing of a new Tau Warp Drive went so wrong and created a warp rift on live TV, and anyone who saw it was required to get their memories wiped. The Tau who survived being thrown through the warp? Well when the mainline Tau found them, they were going Total Xenos Death and would even fire on uniformed auxiliaries.
This was only the 4th Expansion case. Shadowsun did much better job.

>>96087588
is this really true since the existence of the Ynnari? Kind of proves it doesn't take that much for the craftworld eldar to just change their minds in the future and embrace their true nature

>>96088218
>is this really true since the existence of the Ynnari?
Always been
>Kind of proves it doesn't take that much for the craftworld eldar to just change their minds in the future and embrace their true nature
At least Eldar are still governed by Eldar, unlike Imperium.

>>96087661
Wasn't OG Bretonnia really dark, with all the feudal oppression and none of the chivalric charm?

>>96088218
>doesn’t take much
It takes joining a cult and the birth of a new god. A new god that takes away the Dark Eldar’s need to feed on the suffering of others. Also, there are plenty of Eldar that don’t like the Ynnari, they are a fringe death cult that don’t represent the beliefs of all Craftworld or Dark Eldar.

>>96088218
>to just change their minds in the future and embrace their true nature
>Ynnari
But Ynnari are unironically Imperium's sidekicks

>>96085624
>the craftworlds spent almost all of their time away from the rest of the eldar and were some of the only sane ones as a result
Yes, the craftworlds used to be primarily part luxury cruisers and part merchant ships back then, but most of their current population are the descendants of the last-minute "repenters" from before Slaanesh was murderfucked into existence, after they flooded them as refugees from the (soon-to-be) Eye of Terror.

>>96085791
>and both groups are equally callous and pragmatic in this pursuit.
Not quite

The Eldar would gladly sacrifice a billion human lives to save a single Eldar

The Imperium would gladly sacrifice a billion human lives to kill a single Eldar

>>96085265

This is Gav Thorpe, who purposefully writes the Eldar as failures and wrote the elf side of end times for WHF. He's almost as bad as Kelly.

>>96089155
I'll just say that for all his faults Thorpe never wrote a story where three bum marines with no equipment fail to use makeshift explosives to take the Eldar by surprise STILL take the Eldar by surprise and kill 40 of them, including a Farseer, 6 members of the seer council, assorted Aspect Warriors and at least one Exarch with 0 casualties before running away from a bigger Eldar army on a barely working Thunderhawk (because they are bum marines). But some guy did.

>>96088517
OG Bretonnia was over the top L'Ancien Regime. 5th ed retconned it to be medieval knights in shining armor, 6th ed tweaked that to be a bit more grim dark in line with the rest of the setting. Either way, the 4th ed retcon was bullshit and the Bretonnia we ended up with is shit.

>>96090309
No, but he did write a story where a major Craftworld is successfully invaded by a single, c-list successor chapter and some no-name guardsmen. The invasion only ends after the Eldar pull some talk no justu bullshit and the Marines just go home.

>>96090881
Was Alaitoc even established as a major craftworld before Thorpe's trilogy or did it become one of the big five because of it? I don't remember anything in the trilogy pointing towards its significance. And then there's a question of what a normal/major craftworld could do by itself back then. In the campaign of Rites of War (1999) you control the army of Iyanden clearly before the Tyranids wrecked it and the game says that the Eldar don't even bother trying to reclaim the Maiden World where the action takes place from the Imperium and instead focus on gathering important legacy like artifacts instead because thet are too few in number to try shit like a conquering a whole planet.

>>96091359
Alaitoc was in the 4th edition codex, which came out maybe 5 years or so before Path of the Eldar did.

>>96085859
it's in the imperium's best interest to treat their people like the tau do: This would cause significantly fewer rebellions and chaos incursions.

The imperium is just retarded.

>>96091809
Go back one edition. They first appear in third and even get special army rules.

>>96088349
>unlike Imperium.
are you implying that chaos already rules the imperium or something

>>96092261
Technically the Emperor is mostly a chaos entity.

>>96092261
I am implying Imperium is ruled by anyone but not humans

>>96086202
Hey Jyggalagg, you're a fag

>>96086202
hi jyggadyke, your lesbianism is a direct contributor to male loneliness. If you were truly a good person, you would let all your followers gangbang you

Jyg sucks!

>>96095206
So true!

>>96094795
she already plans and hosts gangbangs with her "private X community" that probably consist of minors