Thread 96099689

Previous Heresy: >>96092840

>HH 3.0 Leaks
https://imgur.com/a/C7NLFxm
https://imgur.com/a/ThwkCe3
https://imgur.com/a/jYokLre
https://imgur.com/a/8EaFmTM
And more you should probably backtrack the last two or so threads.

>New Edition upon us
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)
https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS
>30k TACTICA & TIPS
https://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLp
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/2.0_Tactics/General_Tactics

『Adeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialis』
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/
>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colours
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview
>More lists
https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions
>What size magnets do I need?
5x1mm
>Tactics
https://1d6chan.miraheze.orug/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics

TQ: How do YOU Boycott GW ?

>>96099413
reposting cuz I think AI doomers are wrong

I think the material that AI has been trained off of (essays, scientific journals, tech documentation), leads to AI putting out writing with a lot of superfluous words, uniform sentence structure, and repetition of concepts. The new rulebook is written much differently than anything else GW has put out, with a lot of the "hallmarks" of AI writing. However, these hallmarks, when used by a human, actually lend themselves to internal consistency (rules don't contradict each other) and lack of redundancy (you don't have two different rules that do the same thing). I don't think it's a particularly pleasant kind of writing for the reader, and I think people are feeling that and saying a computer must have written it, even though the biggest indicators of AI, redundancy and lack of consistency, are not present.

>TQ
I’ll stop buying 40K and Horus heresy stuff entirely. From now on I’m an age of sigmar player.

>>96099689 (OP)
why didn't you add the rulebook pdfs you mongo
https://files.catbox.moe/98h6h7.pdf
https://litter.catbox.moe/9zh539zknqu9vqso.pdf

I owe an apology to an anon a couple of threads back. I asked for dubs to decide what legio to paint my titans and the result was Mortis.

Unfortunately Mortis is absolutely gay as fuck and I couldn't think of a way for it not to look boring as sin. So I went for Fureans instead. Sorry anon.

>>96099689 (OP)
Tq
> I don’t claim to cause 99% of the people screaming for a boycott are gonna come crawling back in a month or two. This has literally happened every time gw releases a new edition of anything for the past few years and it’s honestly just boring to hear the same thing over and over again when I’m gonna see them buying some terminator resculpt in a few months

>>96099731
good
FUCK mortis

>>96099731
based and justified. nice kneecap

Post models.

>>96099700
I don't think AI wrote the book
I however 100% am convinced that the writers were "assisted" by AI
And it doesn't help that this is the first edition of any GW game to come out after AI really took off
The timing really makes you think, you must at least admit that

knight leaks when?

>>96099700
>redundancy (you don't have two different rules that do the same thing)
Yeah now the same rule just repeats itself multiple times within its own blurb, and every concept referenced anywhere is re-explained in-full. Much less redundant...

>>96099689 (OP)
boycotting gw is really easy, their games aren't fun to play, most of us have a pile of shame that could last for 5 years to paint and there are plenty of video games that are better social fun with friends. And chess is a better game for mental stimulation as well.

>>96099700
>actually lend themselves to internal consistency
Imperial Fists shoot themselves.
>and lack of redundancy
Cameleoline rules are printed, in full, on three separate pages.
I think these are human fuckups, not AI, but if you think the new rules are consistent or lack redundancy, you're retarded.

>>96099751
Reposting. I dont have anything new on my roll. Might finish a Moritat tonight.

>>96099752
I'm biased because I tried writing my own not-3rd edition earlier this year, without AI assistance, and my "technical rules writing" came up eerily similar in wordiness and Concept Capitalization. part of me just wants to recognize a fellow autist in the writing team.

>>96099777
That's repetition, not redundancy (in my mind). redundancy is Brutal and Destroyer having similar outcomes for their own specific situations, with how they would interact being very unclear. 2.0 Rending and Breaching is another example, where the overlapping effect (AP2) should have been removed so Rending could have a unique effect.

>>96099797
Typos notwithstanding

>>96099700
Its a zero chance AI actually 'wrote' the book.
However IMO its extremely likely that AI was used for editing, assisting, or otherwise writing the wording of specific rules.

>>96099752
I think Anon had it right last thread. >>96099502

>>96099751
>>96099767
Soon...

>>96099810
>Typos notwithstanding
None of those are typos.

>>96099833
Imperial Fists shooting themselves is definitely a typo (not a misspelling, if you're going to be pedantic)

>>96099712
>edition in flames

>>96099851
A typo isn't putting in one word when you mean another. It's hitting the wrong key or two.

>>96099731
I hope you have awful luck forever.

>>96099851
Imperial fists shooting themselves is intentional, just like tartaros not having powerfists despite there being pics of those in the very same rulebook and gorgon terminators not having guns are.

2.0 question for anyone - what's the difference between Reactor Meltdown (Major) and Catastrophic Explosion? Seems to me they both do the same thing.

>>96099881
fine then, human errors notwithstanding, I think it's a ruleset that's largely free of errors and contradictions, even if it's hard to read.

>>96099899
I found it very comprehensible to read actually, but I am legit diagnosed with autism.

>>96099689 (OP)
I've never bought a GW product direct, to only ever bought off 3rd party sellers for the discount
>inb4 that's the same thing
Don't care, the GW minis I like I buy, if it's resin ill get a recast, if i find something better online I'll use my 3d printer but that doesn't happen much as I realized how had most STLs look when actually printed

I have a feeling that routing off the table will be incredibly uncommon

>>96099899
"If you ignore the errors it's free of errors"
Anon come on

>>96099899
>errors notwithstanding, I think it's a ruleset that's largely free of errors
...

>>96099912
>>96099899
A large part of the autismo writing is explaining in excruciating detail what a target is, or exactly who is effected by something, trigger conditions etc.
But if you looks across the rules as a whole, it essentially reexplains the same thing like 500 times, instead of just have one page of definitions at the start of the book then referring to that each time.

Legit half the actually rules are just unneeded word bloat.

>>96099918
>>96099922
you're missing my point. There are a few errors (missing fists, Imperial Fist reaction phrasing) that are clearly mistakes that can be fixed with a simple errata. Regardless of those examples, after a thorough reading, the rules have clear intention, sequencing, and have clean interactions with one another, which is not something I could say about 2.0 or even 40k (or Kill Team, for that matter, which I would hold up as the cleanest GW ruleset I've encountered).

>>96099929
To be fair, how precisely do you convey that a model sets its movement to 12", gains Deep Strike, Bulky (2), and Antigrav in a quick and easily referenceable way?

>>96099915
That's like 1 in every 4 routed units will flee the battle, no? Do take into account that units fall back twice (once immediately after losing combat, once again during your turn), so you might have more units reaching the table edge.
Though I'm not sure which edge (nearest?), and what speed they fall back at (full M"?)

>>96099940
>which is not something I could say about 2.0
I'm sure you can provide examples where the rules lack these things?

>>96099890
I have so far anon, don't worry.

>>96099915
Maybe, but given the 4 turn limit and how scoring works I imagine even running away for a turn or 2 might be enough to make a unit useless.

>>96099950
Fall back is initiative +d6

>>96099940
If you want me to answer what you mean rather than what you say, you should say what you mean

>>96099689 (OP)
why did they remove alchem flamers?

>>96099929
>Removes option "bloat"
>Adds word bloat
Sasuga specialisto gamesu teemu.
>>96099689 (OP)
>TQ
I can't say.

>>96099961
Because an extra page would have been required for the stat block. And they were all out of extra pages.

Still don’t see any examples of this redundancy Bloat.

>>96099950
compared to it being automatic in previous editions

>>96099961
They're creating artificial scarcity, and will hopefully (re)release it later in a DLC.

>>96099975
It's funny how most pages are 3/4 empty
They're really insisting on one unit per page to bulk out the book
Or someone removed things at the last minute

>>96099975
>>96099984
Makes sense.

>>96099952
Just look at the core rulebook errata document for plenty of examples of things that needed clarification. For one - can battlesmith be done alongside a shooting attack if you have Firing Protocols? Can you battlesmith as part of a shooting reaction? At launch, maybe.

>>96099961
2/2 also, the alchem flamers that are in the book (Deathshroud's) no longer cause Gets Hot. Though they also don't have Panic; only Typhon's does.
>>96099975
>They're missing space
No they're not LMAO. Especially egregious when Deathshroud and Iron Circle have the missing equipment, yet the actual armouries themselves do not.
GW knows what this gear should be like, they just choose to not release it

>>96099946
I mean dude, look at the word bloat of >>96099915
>Once all Models in a Unit that includes one or more Models which have entered contact with a Battlefield Edge that is within the Controlling Player's Deployment Zone as part of a Fall Back Move have finished their moves, a Leadership Check must be made for that Unit.

Quite literally the that entire gigantic sentence is redundant. The rule prior to this sentence has already explained the trigger (stop when you hit the board edge), so the entire thing could be replaced with:
>after they have finished their move, take a leadership test

That's it.

>>96099977
You mean automatically stop in previous editions. You brought vexillas, right, anon? :D

>>96099689 (OP)
why are you such a faggot, OP

>>96099998
>don't cause panic
Hand flamers cause panic, otherwise they'd just be better flamers where it really matters. Typhon's does because it's artificer and thus better.

>>96099998
I'm sorry but you are going to wait for 8-9 months so you can pay for a couple of options that you already had, not all of them because we need to drum up hype for 4.0 which is going to bring those back in the libers at the cost of the final 3.0 options. GW demands you clap when they release the journal.

>>96100004
...I was joking. I was making a joke about how they removed Jump packs and put their myriad effects on each model manually, and split those models into different stat blocks or units to do so.

>>96100011
Hand flamers *don't* cause panic

>>96099998
>Especially egregious when Deathshroud and Iron Circle have the missing equipment, yet the actual armouries themselves do not.
Maybe its an active choice, like limiting the escaton power claw for NL (used to be a character option, now locked to contekar alongside chainblades).

>>96100011
>>96100018
Oooh. I looked at DA plasma interemptors not doing Panic and thought
>I guess alternative flamers just don't have the panache of real flames

>>96099976
see>>96100004
The rulebook does this for like every second rule

>>96100020
It's things like that that make me think Tartaros not having power fists is deliberate, and won't be fixed in any upcoming errata or whatever.
OR, NuTartaros are coming. Either is a pity, as current Tartaros are PEAK

>>96100035
Its possible. But I think theres a difference between "maybe some legion specific wargear should be limited to special units for whatever reason (making it feel unique/balance/whatever)" and "basic options in the kit shouldnt be available for tartaros terminators"

>>96100035
People coping that the tartaros thing is a typo are actually delusional.

Both cata and tarty terminators have had their gear changed.
Both tarty squads and tarty command squads are missing the heavy melee weapons, but both specifically have lightning claw as an option. This is already a terminator weapon option, so it shows a deliberate decision to remove access to the full termie weapon options and REPLACE it with the lightning claw option.

>>96100068
Yup
>>96100046
Meanwhile, Apothecaries got Hammers lmao

Why is a lighting claw just a powerfist with claws anyway? Surely it's the same weight. I'd argue it should be slower because you have to aim the blades correctly as opposed to just throwing fists.

>>96099751
I'm excited to use the best tank of the edition

>>96100096
canonically powerfists aren't really for (just) punching, the user simply just tears apart the enemy/vehicles with their giga gripstrength

>>96100096
>Why is a lighting claw just a powerfist with claws anyway?
Because back in the day a lightning claw was power fist+. In 3e they were nerfed into power weapon+, but kept the design.

>>96098941
>Master Sergeant is limited for a reason
Is it, though? :^)

Would this combi bolter be kosher for a word bearer tattaros command squad? I need left handed combi bolters and I just realized the chaos terminator kit comes with 3 of them

>>96099751
New UM aux detachment demands payment in Optae, I will never be caught empty handed

>>96100131
Do it. Word Bearers are perfectly good for chaos iconography, even in the heresy.

>>96100125
its once per detatchment, so yes.
You can still spam it, but you need twice as many centurions to do so.

>>96100131
Word Bearers are one of the only legions that can get away with it. Do it.

>>96100134
neat.
The fucking powermaul that is larger than the guy carrying it is fucking comical though. Its legit twice as big if not more than the older power mauls.

can one of you gay faggots direct me to or pm me the repository for all the 1.0 rules. I have most of the books but im missing black books 5-8. I'm just trying to set up a repository for my local community on my drive so we can play 1.0

>>96099915
depends what their Leadership is, which makes modifiers and qualifiers more important

Ld02 97/100
Ld03 92/100
Ld04 83/100 (5/6)
Ld05 72/100
Ld06 58/100
Ld07 42/100
Ld08 28/100
Ld09 17/100 (1/6)
Ld10 08/100
Ld11 03/100
Ld12+ 0/100

if there's an Armourbane-style rule that turns an equal-to pass into a less-than fail, that's as good as Fear (1) or whatever

but if all of that stacks - especially given we're not seeing Stubborn or Inexorable any more - then Ld9 is much less useful in many circumstances than it would be in HH2 and you rapidly go from likely to pass to unlikely to pass

How strong are tsons looking?

>>96100109
Imagine vambrace claws were the current profile. What profile would you give the Fist claws without increasing their price and making them Fists+? Gotta do it the same way they did 3.0 Hammers (-1S +1i) and Chainfists (+1S +Shred6 -1A)

I say +2i -2S Shred 6

>>96100160
One of the better legions in 3.0, psychic powers actually looking good.

i have a couple pages of leaked mechanicum stuff, do we got a zrip or pdf of all the mech stuff thats out? me and my buddy want to get in some basic learning games in

>>96100176
https://imgur.com/a/lRaqKSw
This is what I've seen. Guess OP anon missed it lol
>>96099689 (OP)
>>96099689 (OP)
>>96099689 (OP)

>>96100109
>canonically
Now tell me about THs' role

>>96100165
IM (-1) AM (A) SM (+2) AP (3) D (1)
Rending 6+, Breaching (6+), Shred (6+)

>>96100187
Smacking the absolute shit out of some stupid motherfucker that stands in your way.

To anon last thread talking about different fw armour mark sets, I tracked down some info, and yes there really was 2 sets of some (not sure if all) armour marks way back when they first came out.

So the mk.2 sets had one set with extra running poses, but when they consolidated it down they sadly removed these, which is super gayt.

>>96100214
are you talking about the despoiler squads?

>>96100233
No, so in pic related, the top 2 are the original releases (back when bolters came with the grip, which you'd have to chop off to slot into the hand that came with the actual bodies).
The one at the bottom is the later release, which replaced the older 2. In that version, the bolters come with the hands, but there are less poses overall (but more variation in that one set).

>>96100148
The axe is pretty silly too, but the maul is the worst

>>96100259
mk6 was more of a straight upgrade, since it was just one set (with 2 poses) replaced by a new set with 3 poses, including the 2 old ones.

Yes this turbonerd shit excites me, and also makes me sad that even from recasters, this shit is like not available.

>>96100281
My beloved...

>>96100259
at least some of those poses were repurposed into the despoiler sets

>>96100185
blessings of the machine god upon you.

>take tech thralls
>make them T6
>transport them in a +2 hullpoint triaros (thanks macrotek!)
>charge then into combat
>use omega protocols

possibly the most insane way to play mechanicum?

>>96099751
For those wondering how Rhinos can be turned into assault vehicles.

>>96100305
they removed 2 running legs though, which is fucking criminal.

I have a LOT of mk.2 dudes, and always wondered why they have very few running poses vs the other fw armour marks I have, and now I know the answer. RIP.

>>96100320
And, naturally, you have to do the interior.

>>96100259
It's a fucking tragedy that they finally found the perfect bolter hold and they scrapped it to fuck over people who use magnets

>>96100321
Fuck, more running poses they took from us. Why god.

>>96099689 (OP)
Guys i might be retarded, but, in 3.0 does AP2 or 1 even do anything to vehicles?

>>96100259
There are FEWER poses. When you're talking about a quantitative value, you use LESS and when you're talking about a lower, qualitative value, you use FEWER.
There are FEWER loyalists amongst the traitors, but there's LESS wargear to go around.

>>96100367
sculpt me more poses and sell them to me funny man.

>>96100367
Your father had sex with your mother fewer times than I have
You should be less alive for being an anime poster

>>96100367
he is talking about a quantitative value though...
there used to be 10 poses, now there are 5 less

Has anyone gone through and done a check of what vet equivalent units still have AA? I know dawnbreakers and suzerains apparently kept it

>>96100317
i own 30 tech thralls and a triaros.
Whats this combo accomplish?

>>96100406
NTA but this should explain it

>>96100125
Yes, because its still only once per detachment. If you want to take a load of detachments for the sake of the prime benefit then go for it, but thats fucking dumb.

>>96100317
>the most insane way to play mechanicum
The only sane way to play mechanicum. Cool 12, anon

Rolled 5, 4 = 9 (2d6)

>>96100415
Pass you checks, Anons.

>>96100415
>unit of 40 costs 400pts
>33 of them die due to cyberthurgic feedback
>inflict 66 S6 AP5 hits to whatever they're in combat with
>including the 7 tech thralls you have left

400pts to do a nuke? actually insane

>>96100430
Oh no...

Fuck I hate that FW only ever covered pre calty word bearers. Doesn't matter I'd I can get recasts if they're all using the pre heresy symbol and I committed to using the daemon face everywhere

>jet bikes lose hit and run
>bikes get two shooting phases
What a wild ride

>>96100492
A ride as wild as a motorcycle slamming into a tree

>>96100516
So that's why outriders have -1 INT

>>96100492
2x0=0. They don't get any weapons that scratch anything.

>>96100541
Inb4 plasma breaching 6 defense force arrives

>>96100550
Thousand sons corvidae plasma outriders
Best legion wins again

>>96100550
the twin plasmaguns on bikes are breaching 5+ actually, 4+ when overcharged

>>96099700
>>96099810
I work in a field with increasing AIisation. I promise you they are using AI for some of the editing and writing. because quite literally everyone is. most people's beliefs about AI use are at least 6 months out of date, usually over a year.
>>96099822
probably

>>96100574
>>96100569
>>96100550
Anon was talking about Jetbikes, Sky Hunters, not outriders

>>96100593
Ouch
White scars on suicide watch

>>96100593
No he wasnt, since its regular bikes and not jetbikes that get the two shooting phases.

>>96100541
They cost twice as much as a marine and pack twice the firepower (4 bolter shots naked). They fire twice per turn (firestorm) and they get to be much more mobile on top of it. Just about the only weakness they have is their close combat power. You dont even need plasma for them to be nuts.

>bookmarking the rulebook for ease-of-use
Holy fuck, there's only 3 missions total? What a halfass fuckjob of an edition. They probably brainstormed 12 missions and chose their favorite 9 to be separate paper DLC books.

>>96100615
bruh, like a 3rd of the rulebook is just fluff on the fucking legions... even though we have liber books for that.

>>96099805
>Moritat
Sure did. Base is drying. Two overcharged Volkite Serpenta.

>>96100612
>have all the downsides of a basic troop's shooting profile yet none of the upsides of being great at scoring points
Sasauga retard-kun, impressive!
BTW. They don't have twice the firepower of even the basic trooper, tactical marines get a 3rd shot for standing still, bikes don't have Fury of the Legion. So bikes get 4 shots vs 6 shots for 2 tactical marines while also being trash at scoring and dying instantly to dmg2 weapons that tacticals laugh at.

>>96100612
I just love when they keep changing bikes in every edition like they don't know what to do with them.

>>96100642
>tactical marines get a 3rd shot for standing still
Which they wont be doing, because theyre going to be rushing objectives.
So its four shots to four, except the bike fires twice and moves twice as far.

>>96100654
bikes only shoot twice if they're close enough to declare a charge. i.e. within countercharge range.
But yes they can run up to people and spam plasma into their faces

>>96100642
Are you retarded? They have vanguard, they are not meant to sit around holding objectives.
They also shoot 8 times each with firestorm and have outflank and twice the movement. For very similar point they are better than tacticals

>>96100672
>bikes only shoot twice if they're close enough to declare a charge
Yes, 12", a range they will trivially reach with their movement 14.

They then forego the setup move, choose to not roll with their firestorm, and stay where they are while unloading their 2nd volley (or alternatively they actually make the charge into whatever is left of the enemy objective holder)

>>96100622
just checked AOS rulebook to compare
They have ONE fucking mission in the entire book, ahahahaha! GW really knows its customers are fucking losers with no standards.

>>96100682
And potentially move react away, no? You could also have them shoot things you are right on top of for more damage. It's a very flexible unit.

>>96100574
Fuck people on foot i guess lmao

>>96100686
anyone still paying money for rules written by GW are chattel slave mentality consumers

>>96100705
Yup. They can also outflank if you really want them to.

>you can now charge a separate unit than you shot earlier that turn
>you can no longer make multi-charges
BOOO

>>96100615
It's not that - so much scoring has been moved to unit-based rules (Line now boosts objective VP, Vanguard will always generate it) that the amount of control a mission has is super limited.

It's why the three missions are just different numbers of objectives. They've designed themselves into a corner.

>>96100686
AoS releases mission packs every season for its missions, of course they dont have alot of missions in the base book dipshit, they dont expect you to be using it for all your games.

>>96100035
Wow, this is a pretty model. Very nice.

>>96100633
>Neo-Volkite
Ew.

If sprinting troops onto objectives becomes important, I think Custodes will almost certainly be a problem again.

>>96100615
Missions are going to be in pretty much every journal, thats why they dont care so much about the core book. Both 40k and AoS have their missions sold in seasonal packets, so every year or so there is a change in mission rules.

What the fuck.

"yea, I have four units of WE despoilers charging you turn 1, have fun!"

>>96100744
Do despoilers have the Concealed position rule?

>>96100721
>you can now charge a separate unit than you shot earlier that turn
Jesus, the "core rules are fine it's only the libers that are a fuckjob" shills really dropped the ball. There's not a single thing worth saving in HH3 core book. They've fucked up literally every phase of the game.

>>96100721
Wait, they got rid of multicharging? Fucking why?

>>96100754
Its a prime advantage for having a master of descent. A tac or despoiler unit can be concealed.

>>96100233
>>96100259
>>96100281
>>96100305
>>96100346
These old FW kits were my favorite. I remember buying like 30 beakies so I could make an RTB01 throwback vanilla space army with the FW bubble pred and some of the Diemos rhinos for 5th or 6th edition 40k, and I still have bunch of all marks in my firstborn space marine army that hasn't seen the table since before covid.

>>96100769
Reserves, except deep strike are turn 1 I hear too?

>>96100754
They do if you give it to them. Like say with angrons sire of the world eaters special rule that gives you four of these units.

>>96100778
Yes. Still allowed to charge the same turn too.

>>96100781
are reactions still limited to one use per turn?

>>96100781
There's your deep strike buddy

>>96100792
I dont know, I think its just "you can use as many as you want (provided you have enough slots and that each unit can only react once)

>>96100781
>WEaters are the best ambushers
Get fucked RG/AL

>>96100744
>>96100781
Most balanced reaction.

>>96100792
One unit can do one reaction per turn, but you can do as many reactions per turn as you have reaction points

>>96100805
Berserker rush turn 1 kekekekekekeke

>>96100812
they're literally just tacticals/despoilers

>>96100828
Oh sure, but its still kinda crazy no? Will absolute win games if the enemy isnt prepared for it.

Say your enemy goes first and advances his main melee thrust one way, but sends some tacticals onto an objective somewhere else Surprise! despoilers! Its not like despoilers are BAD at melee, theyll still anally ream any non-melee unit out there (especially WE ones with 3A), and this way they can basically guarantee they get the charge off (marines make a 3" set up move, SW make the full 5"), so unless your opponent has a melee unit left that can react hes kinda buggered.

>>96100850
is it really a surprise if you have to announce your despoiler squad is concealed?
it also has a very narrow band of deployment where you have to be outside of 5" of enemies but within 6" of what triggered it so you can't exactly hide a huge squad

>>96100850
Take Angry Ron and a Praetor, have 4(+?) reactions per turn and 4 concealed position 20man despoiler squads. When enemy main thrust goes one way, DESPOILER CHARGE, when enemy objective monkes go another way, DESPOILER CHARGE, when enemy reserve moves to support the monkeys, DESPOILER CHARGE...

>>96100862
Can you join HQs to the ambush unit?

>>96100850
You dont get the set up moves on disordered charges. You also dont get the +1 attack from the world eater trait on a disordered charge if I remember correctly

>>96100869
no, the entire unit needs Concealed Positions and you can only get it by being a tactical/despoiler unit with a prime thingy

>>96100862
Only the first model has to be within 6" of the enemy afaik The others just have to be 5" away still and within 6" of the first guy. Which is very reasonable spacing requirements.

>>96100865
Finest RG minds are baffled by how berserkers keep popping out of every trashcan, bush and lamppost

>>96100869
God no, the entire unit needs to have the rule. Angron himself is not walking out of a mob-closet to beat your ass.

>>96100882
>Finest RG minds are baffled by how berserkers keep popping out of every trashcan, bush and lamppost
Jokes on you, half mine are XIX Terran marines in concealed positions

>>96100882
>Angron himself is not walking out of a mob-closet to beat your ass
But imagine how funny it'll be when 12 cataphractii command squad do (there's a retinue prime slot in the apex detachment)

>>96100882
>God no, the entire unit needs to have the rule. Angron himself is not walking out of a mob-closet to beat your ass.
Angron, the true inheritor of Creed

>>96100904
The prime advantage specifically states only tacs or despoilers

>>96100877
Oh, right. Still thats a 55% chance of making the charge. Which is frankly not too bad for something that will win you the game now and then. And if they fail the charge its probably still a pain in the ass for your enemy, since they either have to waste their focus on a despoiler squad or have it contesting an objective now.

>>96100904
Tacticals and despoilers only (thankfully).

>>96100612
>>96100647
I thought bikers were going to be T5 W1. Bikes have always been basically +1T right? I mean, what's done is done though.

The funniest part about interdiction cadre is that it's not even any kind of infiltration or camouflage. They're literally just lying on the ground playing dead. 28000 years of technology and the finest men and machines the emperor can muster foiled by the Trojan horse

>>96100410
thats kinda neat, call back to first ed

>>96100923
So it's the 3.0 trailer with all the IW playing dead

>>96100781
Honestly I think the funnier use for this is to just teleport a unit of tacticals onto an objective. You essentially have 12" + 2x base width to daisy chain onto an objective, so if your opponent ever moves anywhere near one you can snatch it.

>>96100921
Thats how it was in old warhammer yea. I miss my t6 nurgle bikers.
Still, t4 2w seems like a good statline for them.

>>96100923
Oh its literally that thing from the cinematic. IW rising up from the dirt to ambush the sallies.

>Chaplain
>Special Rules: None

>>96100931
That is also very funny.

>>96100935
>Cool 10
>the guy yelling Litanies of Hate make the unit calmer

>>96100935
Thats fine, his point is to improve morale and he does just that by simply having primarch tier mental stats.

>>96100185
>https://imgur.com/a/lRaqKSw
>Magos can now battlesmith/cybertheurgy and still shoot
YES
>Firing protocols (2)
NO

>>96100705
>And potentially move react away
Not everyone's going to bring two Praetors, a Command & Control squad and play UM, anon. You're going to be starved of reaction points due to how many new Stratagems™ there are now.
Force an evade mwahaha AL and then the enemy may no longer afford some other stuff

>>96100735
Archaeoneovolkite

>>96100735
Looted Mars during the civil war

>>96100877
>>96100916

Actually, you always get the extra charges

>>96100642
>have all the downsides of a basic troop's shooting profile yet none of the upsides of being great at scoring points
They have more than double the firepower of a tactical marine, come with a chainsword, have 2 wounds instead of 1 and are twice as fast, and you're paying 20 points per outrider when tacticals are 10 points per body
With vanguard (1), all they have to do is kill Line units which they're perfectly capable of. There's also always utility in having fast as fuck units in general, especially bare bones cheap ones like these.

>>96100923
reminds me of those shitty alpha legion conversions/paintjobs with the decloaking tech

turns out that all just a reddit made thing, the actual alpha legion use a mystical method of disguise known as "paint"

>>96100828
>>96100916
>enemy takes 2 steps forwards
>60 berserkers jump up out of nowhere
>try shoot them, they react to charge you in the shooting phase

Based stealth beserkers

>>96100931
>You essentially have 12" + 2x base width to daisy chain onto an objective, so if your opponent ever moves anywhere near one you can snatch it
You need to blob up when you arrive

>>96100992
Outriders can even come in from a side with Outflank and immediately lock something down in close combat. Better park those HHS waaay from the side now.

>>96101003
>>try shoot them, they react to charge you in the shooting phase
Cant. The unit already reacted to ambush, cant react again with the WE reaction.

>>96101005
Yea, its only like 11" you can go. Still, will be enough to grab a point now and then.

>>96101008
WS making them M16" and either Expendable (2) or master sergeant/vets is sexy as fuck too.

>>96101008
You cant charge from outflank.

>>96100994
The cloaking shit makes 0 fucking sense and I loathed those conversions too
They can just get Sunburst Yellow from space Shermin-Williams to hang out with some fists

>>96100931
>daisy chain
It's for fuckery like this that deepstrikes are dead. It says all models in the ambushing unit must be deployed both in coherence and within 6" of the first model placed.
Whoever falls outside the 6" bubble will perish (the floor is Nocturne)

>>96101024
>radius vs diameter

>>96100931
And then they charge you with a vanguard and steal your points

>>96100935
Special rule: Chaplain
Chaplain:
When a unit with this special rule is deployed, and for the duration of the game, it is affected by the special rule Chaplain
This unit costs the amount of points detailed in the profile for Chaplain and must use the profile for Chaplain as well as any special rules detailed in the Chaplain profile
This unit must be equipped with the wargear detailed in the Chaplain profile
When referring to this unit during all game turns, players must refer to this unit as a Chaplain

>>96100923
I hate to be a party pooper, but this is them using tunnels or hidden bunkers and stuff.

>>96101044
so they're the vietcong?

>>96101053
Yes.

>>96100935
Having a chaplain and an apothecary makes a unit nearly immune to statuses

I'm mentally retarded - what detachments do I take to make an SA Armoured Company?

>>96101053
Hamas
Who's Israel in this?

>>96101062
that unit is taking Ld6 panic checks from a phosphex rapier
doesn't sound very immune to me

>>96101005
First model has to be within 6" of the enemy but outside 5". Given your base is wider than an inch, only part of your base has to be within 6". Same deal with the 6" for your other models. So you get 5.99" + base width + 5.99" + base width to daisy chain with.

>>96100781
Desu was wondering why more people weren't talking about this since it seems fun and fluffy. Personally I'm doing the following
>Saturnine Praetor
>3 Saturnine Disintegrator + Particle Shredder Termi's
>Vigilator
>20 man tactical squad w/ interdiction cadre
>20 seekers split into two teams
>4 Melta tarantulas
Feel like this results in a fluffy little "ambush" force. 1500pts with some bells and whistles, which leaves me room to get some allies or to double down and get even sillier

>>96101038
>Chaplain

>>96101082
panic is cool, they'd be taking it on a 9 (10 - 3 from panic (3) + 2 from apothecary)

>>96101085
>fluffy ambush force
>the heaviest terminator armour ever made

>>96101097
To be fair having dudes suddenly teleport on top of you is kind of an ambush isn't it?

>>96101094
panic is Ld, you doofus

>>96101012
oh wait, I misread it, they don't even need to charge in the shooting phase, they can just immediately do a disordered charge. Fucking wew.

Also RAI faggotry, but the reactions doesn't actually say the reacting unit has to be in reserve to use this reaction.

>>96099689 (OP)
>do not buy a single book
I buy them because I like to collect them.

>>96101112
Thank you, I wasn't actually sure

>>96101127
nevermind, I am in fact retarded. I keep thinking the target unit is referring to the unit moving.

>>96101024
Regardless of how you interpret it, you can get a silly distance away from where the enemy actually ended their move.
>>96101038
Thank you anon, I wouldn't have thought to not do this to a big scary melee unit.

>>96101112
If keeping your cool isn't a response to panic
What does cool do?

>>96101158
Daily reminder actual frothing maniac red butchers have extremely high 'leadership' of 12 because they are tactical geniuses on the battlefield

>>96100781
Honestly I quite like this rule overall its fun and potentially powerful but still balanced. I just wish it came in a real book with like 9-10 more that are just as well designed, a campaign full of fun and narrative missions, and a good 30-50 pages of well written lore like they used too, instead of 1 dollar per page DLC bullshit.

>>96101167
>a campaign full of fun and narrative missions
That'll be $40 in 6mo-1year from now

Learnean rules pls. I heard they got options now but won’t you sit back with a conversion Beamer, or is that not a thing now.

Does anyone have the legion champion consul page?

>>96101202
>new mission
>you get 4 objective circles instead of 3, and place them slightly differently around the L shaped ruins

>>96101226
40k won't breach HH that far
r-right?

Why the fuck is Camba Diaz in the Liber when he doesn't have a fucking model.

>>96101240
You are the problem

>>96101247
When I point out the the rules writers still havbe a clear bias and can't even follow their own design rules when making their books?

>>96101240
Real answer is there is probably a model on the way

>>96101112
GW split leadership into exactly 2 identical stats that don't belong as separate stats and then willpower.

'Leadership' and 'Cool' are literally referencing the identical stat called 'bravery'
Getting hit with a flamethrower? That's a bravery test. Sniper trying to pin your unit? That's a bravery test. Gravity gun making quitters just lay down? That's a bravery test. Outnumbered in combat and losing it? That's a bravery test.

If GW was going to have 3 leadership stats they needed 'Bravery' 'Intelligence' 'Willpower'. Should rarely be used in any status tests unless it's "pass an intelligence test or these illusions/noise-makers distract your unit" or "pass an intelligence test to ignore this alpha legion distraction and React Normally". Take an intelligence test to not shoot at the closest enemy unit. Intelligence tests are for pushing buttons during mission objectives, or for seeing if your concealment stratagem succeeds. Or if you need to scatter during your deepstrike.

GW's own system is so retarded they can't even make sense of their own bullshit. It's leadership to not get scared of fire, but it's cool to not get scared of a sniper rifle. They can't even pretend leadership is intelligence between intelligence would be if you're an axemen unit and your trench bursts into flames, getting out of the trench and running towards the enemy would be the intelligent strategy. If they wanted to represent that, they could give Flamethrower(Threat) - take an intelligence test upon receiving a wound from a Threat weapon. If passed, move as far as your initiative in a direction of your choosing. If failed, opponent picks the direction.

>>96101237
Already has, notice everyone sitting around bitching instead of just making their own missions.

>>96101285
>"just do my homework for me, but write me a paycheck" -GW
Your shill tard-ass is exactly why this entire edition is complete trash. GW puts no effort into anything they do precisely because they expect you to redo everything they never bothered to do their job on.

I haven't seen any analysis of leaks wrt Mechanicum, presumably because all the discourse has been about Marines. Does the new Liber suggest what new plastic kits we'll be seeing for the Mechanicum?

>>96101310
I'm not spending a single penny on any rulebooks, but I'll say it again: if you're just going sit on your ass and whine about missions instead of making your own, then HH has already degraded to 40k status.

>>96100781
Imagine a small pile of Stormwing Centurions and Praetors squaring up with their terranic greatswords against a vastly numerically superior force - and when the enemy takes one step forward and suddenly the forest start speaking autistic screeching about loyalty.

Can someone plz provide a link to the HH Audiobooks?

Does anybody know if command squads need to match up (centurion command squad with a centurion/consul, praetorian command squad with praetor etc.)

I assume it works this way but I cant find anything that stipulated it exactly

>>96101451
Nope, just need a retinue slot for each command squad.

Have book in hand. The force org chart is bad. I was optimistic at first, but its a jigsaw puzzle with my collection

>>96101460
Really bizarre but hell works for me

>>96099700
>The new rulebook is written much differently than anything else GW has put out, with a lot of the "hallmarks" of AI writing.
To me, the writing style looks far more reminiscent of modern 40k rulebooks. 10th edition writing has this exact same wordiness and poor formatting. My tinfoil hat theory is that GW shifted game design responsibilities away from SGS to GW actual, because the writing style is noticeably different.

>>96101488
It's so weird that GW is going with fucked up overly complex force orgs for HH and AoS, but over in 40k you can do whatever the fuck you want.

So why is it for Sons of Horus their prime benefit is giving an Elite Duelist's Edge, but their special detachment gives two prime slots to troops?

>>96101507
overly complex force orgs directly preceded "do what ever the fuck you want" in 40k as well

Am I fucking retarded? I can only take one Praetor?

>>96101541
No, you are not retarded. Yes, you can only take one praetor at the current time, and by extension, one apex detachment.

>>96101507
>>96101527
The only thing keeping me from saying this new force org detatchment system is the worst thing ever, is knowing that in 4.0, we'll likely go to the ACTUAL worst thing ever - modern 40k

>>96101541
Why were you taking more than one waacfag

>>96101552
Surprisingly a lot of people like it and see it as one of the positives from 3.0. This absolutely boggles me and actively stops me from army planning cause it’s so shit

>>96101552
Bold of you to assume that we get a HH4 and it isn't abandoned like every other failed cash grab GW does.

One can hope.

>>96101559
Because the models look cool, and I've already paid the chinaman for them.

>>96101568
I genuinely don't get why people would like it.

If you want a structured method of list building, use a force org, with ROWs/other shit modifying as needed.

If you want to just want to go ham, than just don't have any force structure, and limit certain units in their entry as needed.

The 3e method is very halfway house, and I don't really get what the point is, from a game design point of view, considering you can take essentially anything you want, as long as you pay a centurion tax.

>>96101541
I think you can use the "Special Assignment" advantage on a Command slot to bring another praetor

It is both awe-inspiring and terrifying how quickly HH turned to shit the moment GW executive leadership wrapped its greasy claws around it. Holy hell.

>>96101598
Behold the power of constant growth and publicly traded companies.
HH communities all over are basically in full revolt and already are house ruling shit.

>>96101573
Then give them different wargear options and alternate which ones you use in list building. You do take more than whatever the meta nonsense is right?

>>96101598
It’s been shit since its departure from first edition, I dunno if I’d call that quick.

Can ultramarines still be traitors in this edition? Do they get any unique rules for doing so?

>>96101581
>with ROWs/other shit modifying as needed
The whole point is that with this system, you don't need to start waste pages on giving each legion their own forge org modifying shit and instead focus on what's actually unique and flavorful. Unfortunately, like a lot of things in this edition, the problem is that the marine libers were outsourced to the intern while the designers went to go make fun fluffy lists with the mechanicum and solar aux because marketing doesn't care if they give them a bunch of wargear not in the kits or give them all of their flavor without selling it back to them as DLCs, that's what the marine paypiggies are for.

>>96101648
>Can ultramarines still be traitors in this edition?
Probably.
>Do they get any unique rules for doing so?
Probably not.

>>96101527
3rd edition AoS and current TOW have really solid force orgs. They both lent to making armies that looked like armies in the mainline, but also gave options for fun and fluffy skew lists. AoS was that done in a very simple, rules light way, and TOW is that done in a much more crunchy and complex but not confusing way.

GW can do it! They have done it! They are doing it! But sometimes they just choose to be fucking stupid

What does master of the legion do?

>>96101648
Unfortunately yes, fortunately no

>>96101658
How each legion might organise their forces differently (and the related other bonuses and drawbacks of ROW's) ARE what's unique and flavourful.

Instead we get 500 different slop detatchments that will in reality amount to a difference in a list of maybe 1 centurion more or less to fit XYZ units.

>>96101527
Not really, 9th detachments were easy as fuck

>>96101643
Yes, I've decided to use one as a Champion instead.
This new system is a pain in the ass though, I have to take a shit ton of characters if I want a variety of units.

>>96101671
masturbate

>>96101676
>How each legion might organise their forces differently (and the related other bonuses and drawbacks of ROW's) ARE what's unique and flavourful.
Every legion having a pride of the legion variant that let them take their special unit as troops except some got line and extra shit on top (loyalists) and some didn't (traitors) wasn't flavorful it was just shit. I'd rather have one pride of the legion for everyone and then everyone gets extra shit on top.

>>96101441
Is there a SINGLE use for Power Maul ?

>>96101316
>Does the new Liber suggest what new plastic kits we'll be seeing for the Mechanicum?
Maybe? The Tech Priest being separated from his Servo Automata might suggest a new kit for each, but it might also mean they're just being reboxed separately. Hopefully they're getting plastic and new separate boxes.

>>96101717
Yes because every ROW in the game was just pride of the legion.

>>96101719
Cut the Maul's heads off then string them together and BAM; Power Anal-Beads for your local Emperor's Children player.

>>96101719
Take them with a biomancy librarian for budget chain fists on company command squads to glance open a land raider. At least, that's my plan

>>96099751
Here is mine, it's cute & my 1st tank.

>>96101745
Clean your keyboard and foreskin. Nice tank, what legion?

What the fuck is shot selector on kraken bolter

>4 big ass tanks
>one detachment
>1 (uno) dreadnought
>one detachment
fuck you james

>terminators had one wound and get one shot by any failed save
>terminators gain a wound
>most things that were threatening to terminators just instant death them
>instant death goes away, damage stat instead
>most things with ap2 and half the weapons with breaching are 2+ damage anyways
Looking forward to next edition where GW continues chasing their own tail on elite infantry and gives terminators damage modifiers and makes mortal wounds or something that ignores it anyways.

>>96101787
Don't worry, people will complain about tanks and whatever else this edition, and 3 years later tanks will go back in the shitter and dreadnoughts will be good again.

>>96101724
NTA, but for fun I went through every legion in the game and counted which ones actually offered something completely unique and which ones offered something that was just a better version of a generic rite of war or should have just been a generic rite of war, like breachers or Destroyers. My final numbers were 21 unique, 20 derivative, although there were a few that I felt could've gone either way that I ultimately decided by "would you ever use the generic version over this". Interesting outcome, I definitely would've preferred most of the derivative ones going and being baked into the units or becoming prime benefits like justaerin having deep strike without the character reacharound

>>96101779
choice of 3 special rules that mimic special ammo

Is this a good starting point for solar aux? I was thinking about grabbing two of them.

>>96101752
I really should, I don't use my PC all that often unless it's for 3D printing & editing.

>>96101352
bump for this.

Side note, any good books involving mechanicum?
>inb4 mechanicum book

>>96101488
i kind of dig it so far, but it tickles my tisim i think. plus im a mech player. Im digging through my bits bags to start making some tech priests.

>>96101722
nice looking magi

>>96101789
>yeah no bro terminators getting 2 wounds definitely didn't make them absurdly tougher against non instant death weapons
>yeah no bro terminators getting T5 didn't definitely didn't make them absurdly tougher against normal anti infantry guns
You people and your insistence that the only weapons in the game are thunder hammers, power fists, lascannons and meltas will be the doom of us all

>>96101818
>hh1: if you are stuck plinking bolters at termies you're probably fucked
>hh2: if you are stuck plinking bolters at termies you're probably fucked
>hh3: if you are stuck plinking bolters at termies you're probably fucked
I will admit, plasma isn't good against termies anymore, which is big. But plasma is also just not good anymore.

>>96099946
Very funny that this one went over everyone's heads so I can't resist:

Wargear: Jump pack

>>96101752
oops I forgot to put my Legion I'm planning on it being Dusk Raiders & I'm thinking about leaning heavily into Rotor Cannons, Autocannons & Lascannons. because traitors who scoured the trenches to kill their brothers deserve the pain of death.

>technoarcana are basically mech's legion rules
>want to try the new macrotek tank rules
>archmagos has to be macrotek
>means that if I join him to a non-macrotek unit, they suffer stat penalties
>there are no non-vehicle macrotek options besides scyllax and servo automata which are both retinue slots that I can only get by wasting a prime slot
>have to actively gimp myself just to run the basic rules for this faction

>>96100923
>28000 years of technology and the finest men and machines the emperor can muster foiled by the Trojan horse
To be fair, it is a really good horse. There's one time in some RG supplement where they lure some Tau over by playing dead, and to sell the act their hearts are basically stopped and sus-an membrane half active, and they basically will themselves out of a self-induced coma.
Marines are superhuman but in the early Superman way, with a bunch of weird, niche abilities

>>96101802
In 2.0, bear in mind a tercio is three squads. Not inherently bad if you also want transports, their Leman Russ kit is good, and there aren't really any other options for Solar Auxilia discounts.

>>96101273
>If GW was going to have 3 leadership stats they needed 'Bravery' 'Intelligence' 'Willpower'
Discipline (normal Leadership) is neither of that. Meaning Panic should test on Cool, not Ld.
But then Ld would've been needed for when you want the unit to obey, like when anons said 2.0 Reactions could be fixed by taking a Ld test first. If it passed, shots were full BS. If failed, they were going to be snapshots.

>>96101841
>2e halved bolter effectiveness against the vast majority of terminators
>3e further reduces effectiveness by a 3rd

GW is fucking in the head in that they buff elite troops defensively, but its always against smallarms/weaker weapons, while peer weapons/AT weapons (i.e. the biggest threats to termies and such) are completely unaffected.

>>96101884
fuck I just realized it's even more retarded because all my magi have to be attached to the servo automata which means all my scoring is going to be on the backs of a bunch of these little shrimps

>>96099712
Made that silly pic ages ago in Paint in 1.0. Thanks for including it, anon :D

>>96101944
No they dont? You can attach them to any Automata or infantry unit, tech priests don't come either servo Automata anymore (and it's in fact actively bad to include them because they now take a retinue slot and their sole role is ablation wounds and a poor man's battlesmith, meanwhile a machinator array is 20 points, doesn't take a slot, and gives you 2 bsttlesmiths a turn if you don't shoot

>>96101581
>I genuinely don't get why people would like it.
1. People disliked paying tax troops, and RoWs gave them ways to avoid that. Now the tax is HQ (GW is shilling them), but it's less. And Prime slots are carrots on a stick urging you forwards, instead of tax beating sticks needing to be overcome before you can start bringing what you want.
2. It's literally pic related. A minigame of fitting pieces in their places. What goes where, how many can you fit. Accounting, 30k, Diablo; I keep finding myself playing Fit the Pieces. Maybe it's an autism thing

>>96102017
Can I put the triangle in the square hole

>>96102027
I have a hole for you to shove things in.

>>96101441
Line (1) is actually wild, though it does make trading into them with other terminators more of a win for your opponent. However, not like they can't take a punch and return it in kind with WS5 and T5

At 55 points a pop with power fists they're not cheap by any means

>>96101964
the techno arcana is the army's [Legion] equivalent
the same way you can't just shove a Raven Guard centurion into your IF primary detachment, the same way you can't shove a Myrmidax Magos into your Macrotek primary detachment
everyone has to be Macrotek, and the only way to get a Macrotek unit for your characters to join is to use Scyllax or Servo Automata or a Moirax

>try to make a list
>it takes at least an hour to fudge around the slots
wow I actually really hate this, it's needlessly complicated for literally no reason

>>96102063
How are you finding it complicated
Take your praetor, assume you're taking two centurions
That's a crusade primary detachment + 1 apex detachment + 2-4 auxiliary detachments right there without even having to consider anything else
If you can't fit 3000 points of whatever you want into that, you need more wrinkles in your brain

>>96102055
Anons models in the primary detachment don't have to match techno Arcana. The whole system would fall apart otherwise.

Is new recruit updated yet

>>96101719
Mauls trade -1i for +2S, so if you can survive the swords, you'll hit the other guy harder, and can also hurt non-Marine stuff, niche as that may be. I suppose it also hits 3+ save axe-wielders harder than they hit you.
I would have liked power weapons to be (breaching 6+ on all of them)
>Sword: +1A
>Maul: -1i +2S (as is)
>Axe: -1i +1S AP2
>Spear: +1i. No Precision 6
I just think, once again, swords have nothing to go for them when spears are basically the same thing but faster.
Also, swords are the only melee weapon that is balanced and can parry, so that's why I'd give them +1A.

>>96102077
I do not have this page in my leaks, my mistake
This doesn't really solve my problem of not having anywhere good to put my Macrotek archmagos though

What the fuck does the shield trait do?

>>96102089
+1T in shield wall, but -1 to focus rolls

>>96102089
Lets you use "Reaction: +1T". It's testudo time, brother.

>>96099998
Still 100% more weapon options than Word Bearers got.
>Gutted edition if you were not a favorite

>>96102086
Okay you know what you've got a point, everyone in the book has an assigned arcana trait except for tech priests, magi, and the retinues, and your only options are to give up your apex for 3 retinue slots or use prime benefits to slide them in
At the very least there's an aux detachment with 4 troop slots, 1 prime, to let you get additional logistical benefits pretty easily if you've got the slots, which is not hard considering you almost certainly need at least 3 magos just to handle the difficulty 3 or 4 cybertheurgies

>>96101954
that picture is amazing anon, well done

>>96102063
you'd believe a 6 BILLION dollar company could have an intern cook an app for people to make their list in a week end, but no.

>>96102100
You have to burn a reaction for it?

If teleportariums are found on most Legiones Astartes ships, then why can't Terminators teleport normally, instead of needing some Prime or whatever?

>>96102017
'Tax' troops is part of the games balance. Pride of the legion lists had severe restrictions as the price to pay for 2 scoring elite units. So you are locking yourself out of many other options.

3e is just 'pay centurion tax' then take whatever you want. No other pros, or cons, other than a tired set of prime(tm) bonuses on random slots.

>>96102137
I am not upset that you should take more than a single praetor, and I like that both basic bitch centurions and tactical marines have actual uses

>>96102134
They don't do them piece meal, but in full teleport assaults that are most of an army.

>>96102145
Do we have that in 3.0?

>>96102137
Oh it is herohammer, no discussing it. I'm still eyeing up the stuff, but in 2.0 there were two ways of building an army:
1. Commander + specialists + army
2. Bare bones budget MotL, so you could spend more on the army
This edition is banking on option one; I want to see if option 2 is viable. I hope it is.

>>96102116
I just find it lame to be putting an Archmagos in a babysitting squad, I might just put him with some automata since they're at least immune to statuses so the Cl/Ld debuff isn't as awful

>>96102164
Where would you put him if unrestricted, Macrotek anon?

>>96102175
very uninspired but probably an honor guard of myrmidons now that they've been toned down
the giant axes call to me

>>96102195
>the giant axes call to me
Ironic, considering that they've been returned to their 1.0 status of just power axes.

>>96102136
Damn that's ass. Or at least very niche.

>>96100097
That looks swell anon, puts my Kratos to shame

>>96102143
It's not about spamming multiple praetors (if anything it about running just 1 centurion/delegatus so you can run more lads).

The game should revolve around the dudes, the normal ones, not 500 centurions.

>saved money on not buying the rulebook
>used saved money to help go to e-reader
>now I never have to buy a rulebook ever again when I need rules for games.
Thank you leaker anon.

>>96102219
You still need a scout squad. Corvus armour, naturally.

I hate the look of the Saturnine dread. theres something about it that screams that it is not a 30k design but a 40k design modified to be 30k

like the legs are too long and spindly, the torso juts out too far, the weapons look wrong whoever designed it didn't seem to learn take any inspiration from the titanicus weapons, the waist is too thin.

it's a mess

>>96102418
>It's a mess
Yeah, this whole edition

>>96101316
So are all Scyllax cute anime maid girls before they get servitor lobotomized?

how many thallax do you other archmagi have? with both them and castellax getting way cheaper im actually going to finish building my backlog of 20 some odd extra thallax. Might need to re-enforce my castellax, i only have 12 of those

>>96099751
Some of the lads before they go out for a night of fun and slaughter.

>>96101316
Does anyone have the rules for Scyllax and servo automata?
Did they really lose ALL their options?

>>96102418
It looks like a marine'd telemon.
If anything looks like a 40k model it's the saturnine praetor.

How long until they dump the legacies docs?

>>96102219
Any progress on choosing a super heavy?

>>96102455
Can I ask you what colors/Pigments you used for your bases? They Look fantastic. I like the contrast between the grey and Red.

None can outwit the Hydra

Thoughts on the digitigrade mod for the deredo?

>>96102533
Not only does it kick ass, if I'm not mistaken it was pioneered by our very own barbarian traitor White Scars anon

>>96102533
Looks very cool, reminds me of the old chaos dreadnought

>>96099712
You included my edition in flames edit, I feel honoured

>>96102439
>20 fucking Thallax
What loadouts? I think multi melta will be a popular one

>>96102533
I think they look cool as fuck.
the ones in your pic seem a bit too thin for the top-heavy deredeo
I'd like them more if they were shorter and thicker but then again, I'm a huge fan of the reverse joint legs in armored core, so I could be retarded

>>96102517
>Some people think they can outsmart me
>Maybe, maybe
>I've yet to meet one who can outsmart chainsword

>>96102478
Launch day
>>96102533
Are those sentinel leg bits?

>>96102547
>pic
the truest and most accurate depiction of the current state of hh3

>>96102547
The pic is at least on two 1d6chan pages currently as well.

>>96102547
You've created an iconic piece of wargaming history

How are the Grav Rapiers looking? Thinking I want my IW to stop anyone getting near

>>96102533
Looks great, but if it was chunkier it would be even better

Am i getting it right?:
Storm Eagle starts in aerial reserves, comes out on turn 1 with Deploy Mission, deploys a melee unit, the melee unit makes a disembark move (equal to their movement, but doesn't move later in that movement phase), and then they may shoot in the shooting phase.

Storm Eagle shoots a bit with its defensive weapons in the shooting phase and flies away at the end of it back to reserves.

The melee unit can make a setup move—charge in the charge phase without penalty—because Storm Eagle is an assault vehicle.

So we can charge from reverses or what?

> army selection rules
> 1. Set points limit
> 2. Select mission
> 3-6. Complete army roster

So fuck pickup games and fuck all-comer lists right?

>>96102668
Seems that is correct anon, but early in the edition to truly understand the rules interactions.

>>96102643
>Grav Rapiers
They are 36' S8 AP3 D1 and D2 when stationary; 6+ breaching; 3' blasts, and the blasts no longer scatter with LoS; they also apply statuses. In short, they are busted. Other options are strong as well.

>>96102668
Yea, in this case. Deepstrike doesn't let you charge, for example.
Also have in mind that the Stormeagle comes in from your border so it's movement + the unit's is not gonna take you to the enemies deployment zone or anything like that
And a land raider can also drop troops 17" into no mans land
The storm eagle also doesn't come in on T1 automatically, I'm pretty sure you have to roll a 3+ for it

>>96102685
There are mission that don't have reserves. If you don't have any units that are mandatory to start in reserve it's not a problem

What's looking good/broken/wasted points for ranged loadouts on Contemptors currently? Want to make sure what I own isn't bullshit in one direction or the other

>>96102699
I guess they just want a certain legion to deploy in a certain way and buy more flyers or something.

>>96102668
Maybe melee isn't dead.

>>96102513
Thanks anon, rock is just drybrushed up to a light grey using 3 or 4 layers out to the edges.
The dust I am still experimenting with is painted with 3 layers of rust coloured pigment, A.MIG-3008, A.MIG-3005 then A.MIG-3006.

>>96102707
I don't think any loadout should be broken anymore. Autocannon or melta would be my pick.

>>96102699
It's a shame storm eagles are so ugly.

Should I start a Death Guard army or a World Eater army? Will mostly be playing non-3.0 with them so ignore those rules. Mostly comes down to what other people would like to see and if I like 20 man tactical squads or despoiler squads more.
>pic unrelated

>>96102685
That's how it worked last edition as well anon lol

>>96102775
Seems like DG lost a lot more in terms of options than WE did. WEs are sort of affected by the profile change of chainaxes, I think chainaxes still have a place, but unfortunately not the straight upgrade they once were. Rampagers look like power armour blenders with vanguard(3), and Red Butchers look serviceable and quite fun.

>>96102775
What's going to be the most fun to paint for you?

>>96102720
Cool thank you!

>>96102775
I love world eaters, you need loads of chainaxes though.

Where are the audiobooks though

Is it better to just ignore statuses if a bunch of legions have rules mitigating them?

mech detachments
>most of them have a prime advantage benefit on most (if not all) of the slots
>most are consistent with the slot taken, usually multiples of the same slot, although restrictions in what can be taken
>prime advantages include things like 5++ invun thallax, paragon of metal, +2S +1W ursarax, +2 hullpoint/+1 AV tanks etc

marine detachments
>prime advantage on one slot
>mix of units, no consistency
>half the time the legion prime advantage is either something boring, only benefits a generic unit, or cant be taken with the detachment as it only benefits a command slot

mech operate on a different level to marines

>>96102893
What are those legions?

>>96102894
Would you say that Liber Mechanicum is well written? I am not read up on if it has any compromises made

When making an army in 2e, how do you treat units in an allied detachment, that is the same faction as the primary detachment?
Do you just treat the units the same, save for things like rites of war and other abilities that specificly call out detachment?
Like they can all get in each others transports and join each others units?

>>96102972
definitely better written than marines

Finally made the choice to cancel my 30k pre-orders

>>96102973
Units in allied detachments have to be a different faction

>>96103006
Unless you're a macrotek archmagos

>>96102972
Liber Mechanicum seem like they're killier than marines but their objective control is reliant on tech priest wranglers for their automata.

Snipe the tech priests and they can't control objectives anymore.

>>96103006
Not any place I can see.

>>96103006
Each space marine legion is a separate faction (page 158). Just like before.

Can I use the regular Sky-Hunter jetbikes to make Golden Keshig, even if it's technically a different mark of jetbike? Does it matter?

>>96103047
>2e
fuck i cant read

>>96099689 (OP)

So, do these have ANY use at all ?

>>96103051
You absolutely could, but I'd recommend making them super unique and kitbash them right up

>>96102894
>>96102972


One is a complete product, the other is a complete product that had parts of it surgically removed so that it can be sold every 3 months for the next 3 Years at 30€ each.

>>96102155
Thing is like GW you're ignoring a third issue - smaller point value games. In 1.0 and even 2.0(although that had different issues), a specialist could also *be* a commander. In 3.0 if you take a Praevian or whatever to lead your fluffy 1k ZM force you're gimping yourself with inferior mental stats. Literally the only interesting part of the shitty Daddy Issues: The Movie novel series is all the fishes out of water rando characters thrust into positions of authority by horror and circumstance and rising to the occasion, but in the supposedly "herohammer" edition that's not really on the cards because the nostalgia-addled senile poofters running SGS have a ridiculous hardon for Rogue Trader, a system that was considered clunky and unfun enough to replace almost *40 years ago*.

>>96103003
Based.

If I'm committing to running 20 man squads of tactical marines, should I have vexillas, nuncio voxes, and augury scanners to get the most out of a big squad? Or am I better off just having a vexilla and saving the points.

>>96103003
King

>>96103070
>Do my bs5 snipers that can freely choose between having (effectively) AP2 or handing out status effects from outside many units retaliatory range have any use??????
Idk you tell me

>>96103070
>do these guys with 30" range who can force Snap Shots and Rout units much more easily have a use? I'm trying to understand how a unit with a gun that lets them choose who's wounded 60% of the time and resolve those wounds at AP2 50% of the time could have some kind of battlefield use, please help my family are starving

>>96102975
Oh I think that goes without saying. I get the impression that the core rules for 3.0 are whatever but the libers are bad, especially for marines which is strange considering that's practically the target audience.

>>96103070
Seems to be competing with Veteran Tacticals as shooty elites. If the Kraken Bolters aren't good, then I assume it would be down to whether having a sneaky squad of Combi-weapon users still has any real use.

>red butchers - elite
>rampagers - heavy assault
huh?
>detach states that you can only take rampagers in heavy assault slots.
gw pls

>>96103109
>>96103112

18 points per model. Even breaching 4+ doesn't make it good.

>>96103070
It's okay tier, but probably not as good as other support units.

>>96102137
The hero tax is to facilitate challenges and gambits

>>96102437
No no no, Scyllax are just random people. Part of the process is making them think they are cute anime girls

>>96103152
Unplayable slop?

>>96103152
I have issues with those decisions, but what exactly is the issue here? that image seems reasonably consistent?

>>96103152
What are you not understanding. It's so you can't take that detachment and include some other heavy assault unit

>>96103178
>>96103152

Its internally consistent because GW got Red Butchers and Rampagers mixed up.

>>96103185
Oh, no, I think it's intentional. If they'd used more abstract icons, things wouldn't be so bad.

Turns out, when you give a force org slot the Terminator silhouette, people will assume all terminators have it and that all examples are terminators. Same with making Veterans a PA silhouette.

>>96103178
>>96103184
I just assumed that Rampages are elites like they always used to be and Redbutchers (i.e., heavy assault terminator units) are heavy assault units.

In that case they switched places. I don't think this is intentional; I think it's a mistake.

>>96103109
>>96103112
true AL patriots

>>96103197
That does seem like a fuckup

>>96103197
No, it's intentional. They've muddied the water between the two - Heavy Assault overlaps a lot with the old conception of elites, and vice verse. Both Rampagers and Red Butchers would be highly valid for both roles, but since it's GW, I assume the most confusing outcome (the one they went with) is intended.

>>96102685
Every other game besides GW ones have moved to that, calm down
Out of everything to complain about this ain't it

>>96103210
>since it's GW, I assume the most confusing outcome (the one they went with) is intended.
Well, they can't change the book, and they are trying to make as few changes to unit profiles in books as possible. So I guess this is how it is now.

>>96103197
>>96103223
Also, look at it this way - the main difference between heavy assault and elite is that elites are more limited. Rampagers don't need to be that limited, so they're heavy assault. Red butchers they want to limit a bit more, so elite.

>>96102439
I've got 30, considering picking up another 6 so I can have 6 photon thrusters, 6 multi meltas, and 12 lightning guns, and maybe another 6 ursarax as well for 18 of those for the laecrymata detachment

Could someone repost the Lorgar pages please? I tried going through the archive but the generals had a lot of activity since the leaks dropped.

>>96103259
use these pdfs >>96099712 litterbox - LA, catbox - rulebook

>>96103274
>Manowar, the power of thy word

>>96101097
They can releport there, so that still checks out imo.

>>96101085
Yea, it does seem really cool. Probably wont be INSANE in the marine matchup since any army with its own melee units can whallop them, but might fuck up SA or admech. "I moved my thallax and some khorne berserkers are now beating them up" might be unpleasant.

>>96101094
The +2 from apothecaries isnt vs the test itself, its to remove the status. So you would test vs whatever as normal, but for the check to remove the status at the end of your turn you add +2.

>>96103269
>>96103274
Thanks.

>>96101787
it is a bit silly that the tactical benefit prime advantage and the aux detachment give the same number of dreadnought slots Should probably be two slots in there, same as for most units.

>>96103255
Lemmie see some closeups of that there Archmagos. He looks cute.

>>96101789
Terminators didnt gain T5 to make them tougher vs the guns that kill them, they gained T5 because now that damage is separate from strength vs toughness they can gain it while explicitly still being weak to those D2 things.

>>96101916
Its almost like the goal isnt actually to have terminators be invincible, but to have them have a specialist profile that is very durable vs certain kinds of threats while being relatively vulnerable vs others, or something. The goal is never to make terminators resist thunder hammers, its to give terminators a distinction from "dude in AA with shield"

>>96102017
>Now the tax is HQ (GW is shilling them)
Its not really a big increase.

Before you had everyone take 3HQ because consuls were mega-nuts and you needed a master of the legion. Now youre going to have everyone take 4HQ, with a large number as generic centurions.

>>96103070
You mean aside from the 30" status inflicting guns or the 9" infiltrating meltaguns with BS5?

>>96103290
>at the end of your turn
Narthecium allows to do that in the Moral SUB phases.

>>96102894
>mech detachments
>apex
>marine detachments
>auxiliary

Wow, are you telling me the 1/army detachment provides a bigger benefit than the one you can spam endlessly?
Marine apex detachments also (often) provide serious benefits. Atramentar hunt gives them all prime slot benefits.

>>96103070
Are you retarded or something

>>96103197
Heavy assault and elites both generally cover the conception of "elites" that previously existed. But elites seems reserved for the actual super special elements of a given legion, while heavy assault is basically "heavy shock troops"

>>96103312
He is my favorite and probably best painted archmagos, even though he's the one whose probably had the worst in game performance lol. Losing the ability to take jetpacks is probably a good thing because it means I stop trying to jump him forward to punch a Dreadnought and plant melta bombs with his thallax retinue because I think "come on, surely even on a 5+ it can be that hard to kill one rght" and then getting stuck there for 2 turns until the enemy warlord comes in and knocks his lights out

I like Terminators and tonks
I want an army of pure Terminators and tonks
I want to print them
I do not care if I play 2.0 or 3.0

Is this likely to gain me a reputation as a cunt?

>>96103420
No one cares if you print minis or you want a themed army.

>>96103274
So his first special rule is that he can give a prime buff to four additional squads? Am I getting that correctly?

>>96103420
>Is this likely to gain me a reputation as a cunt?
In 2.0? No.
In 3.0? Yet to be seen, but I think both have the potential to be absurd to kill.

>>96103452
No, just the 3 non-Prime troops in the Primary Force

I like the overseer (in concept and because he makes use of the auxilia box I got for my birthday) and I'm curious: is there a reverse for militia and auxilia? A way to bring in a handful of marines or just a special consul?

>>96103452
One of them already has it but yes
All primarchs are like this. If the troops are filled with specific units it grants them prime

>>96103420
Your reputation isn't your responsibility.
People will think of you what they want, Only a fragment of the population actually cares to know you.

You don't have to care about people who don't care about you in the first place.

>>96103476
The allied detachment?

>>96103476
That's called an allied detachment. And it's even a good way to use an overseer, considering his role is basically a chaplain for mortals

>>96103480
Ah, and here I thought he was weaker on melee but better at buffing than other Primarchs.

>>96103488
>>96103489
I meant some special rule like his.

>>96103496
To do what? Let your SA officers join a marine unit? That's not a thing afaik but I don't think we've seen the whole SA liber

>>96103496
You can just take an overseer as an allied detachment afaik

>>96103486
>Your reputation isn't your responsibility.
this is the worst legal advice you can be given

>>96103512
I said what in the first post? And I'm asking for 2.0, guess I should've specified, my bad.

>>96103530
Sure but that's not what I'm asking. If it's not clear I'm not looking for a way to ally marines into auxilia and I'm planning to, I'm asking purely out of curiosity if there's some special unit or rule that works like the overseer in reverse.

>>96103561
A little angry human cracking his whip at some Night Lords

>>96103541
Nah it's the best advice when nagivating through life.

>someone makes shit up about you
>somehow it's your responsability
It's not, and you should stop giving a fuck
Your business is suffering because of lies, sue them, but this ain't about reputation

>>96103491
Have a look at his hammer. You see that "damage 3" and the "critical strike 5+"? That means if he ever hits another primarch hes damage 4, which is enough to do two wounds to everyone except big horus, vulkan and mortarion.

Add the finishing strike gambit and he becomes damage 5, which deals 3 wounds to a primarch. Half their HP. He has 5 attacks, if he goes first he has 6 attacks. So he gets near enough 2 crits every time he fights, so he kills most of his brothers over two or so rounds of combat.
Lorgar being weak in melee requires overlooking his weapons being stupid good in the various editions (it was nuts last ed too).

Lorgar beats corax in a fight.

(no seriously)

Corax has 8 attacks, +d3 from the gambit hes likely to pick (flurry of blows) so lets say +2 to bring him to 10. He probably goes first if lorgar does finishing strike. So 11 attacks total.
Hell lets give him 12 because were nice and it makes the maths easier.
He hits on 3s and crits on 6s. So 8 hits, of them 2 crits + 6 going to the wound roll for 3. 5 saves into lorgars 4++ or anywhere between 2 and 3 wounds (average 2.5, but rounds one way or the other)


Lorgar has 5 attacks, hitting on 3s so lets also be nice to him and round up to two hits. They will be crits. Corax then has two 4+ saves and takes 3 wounds out of his 6.

Round two:
Corax attacks again, lets give him 12A again because fuck it makes my life easier.
Two crits again, 6 other hits again, this time wounding on 5s because he is now S5 (his whole unit is also S-1, bad news for any dark furies with him as they fight what is probably gal vorbak). So 4 saves total, two wounds, lorgar lives!.
Lorgar swings back and does around three wounds like last turn. Killing corax. He then scores +6W for combat resolution and has his unit safely dismantle the now -1S enemy unit because those dark furies are now S3 and wound the GVB on 6s.

Its not a clean win, but lorgar CAN beat his brothers in a fight.

>>96103568
>mommy

>>96103542
The answer is still an allied detachment.
If you are playing SA and want a handful of marines you ae going to need to ally them in

>>96103568
>NL lotara sarin

>>96103476
No but someone might have homebrewed it for rogue traders I imagine.

>>96103575
Lorgar is also one of the best infantry killers among the primarchs, he kills normal models in one hit reliably (damage 3), has no issues wounding, and has both reaping blow for more attacks and the phage(S) to provide buffs to his unit (essentially).
Lorgar is actually kinda scary.

>>96103575
>>96103616
And inb4 "corax is the worst primarch!" He also beats khan.

Khan gets 10 attacks hitting on 3s so lets say 7 hits, he has s6 vs t6 so he gets lets say 4 wounds through, 2 after saves.
Lorgar does the same damage back as he does vs corax.
Khan then gets another 10 attacks, 7 hits, wounding on 5s now (so 2 wounds or so) for a further 1 unsaved wound. Lorgar then hits him again and probably kills him.

>>96103579
It's not since that wasn't the question but nevermind, it doesn't matter.

So, just to confirm I've got this right, if I want to get some vorax and thallax in to help muh muhreens: I take an allied detachment and a commander to unlock two auxiliary detachments if it's a magos, and this leaves me with no units he can reasonably join, so I need to take another commander to unlock more units who can't be retinues (scyllax, echidnax) or elites (domitar, myrmidon) because those aren't available to allies, so mech allies actually basically have to take castellax/thanatar and are outright locked out of domitar (despite previously being literally a Legion choice)?

>>96103688
>We’ve also noticed that some of you are concerned that certain units in your existing armies might not be usable in the new edition, especially if they don’t feature in the Liber book for that faction.

>Hopefully this article will reassure you that those Tartaros Terminators with power fists, Destroyers with jump packs and lovingly converted White Scars Champions on bikes won’t be resigned to a life on the shelf.
TARTAROS LOSING FISTS WAS NOT A TYPO, REPEAT:TARTAROS LOSING FISTS WAS NOT A TYPO

>>96103653
Other primarchs Lorgar will beat/has decent odds against:
Fulgrim
Dorn
Angron(!)
Guilliman
Sanguinius
Probably curze and alpharius

Stuff like the lion, Ferrus, Vulkan, Mortarion and Horus (pertruabo too, I think) will very much stomp him. But he can absolutely fight most of his brothers.

>>96103688
While I am annoyed this even had to happen, I'm glad they didn't just bury their heads in the sand

We might just be back, after all

>>96103688
Not enough/too late.

>>96103700
>the options are meant to reflect the kits
>tartaros have fists in kit
What

>>96103688
>Hopefully this article will reassure you that those Tartaros Terminators with power fists, Destroyers with jump packs and lovingly converted White Scars Champions on bikes won’t be resigned to a life on the shelf. The upcoming Legacies of the Age of Darkness PDF is a huge document which will allow you to continue to use the vast majority of miniatures you’ve amassed over the last decade of collecting. Alongside the digital support for the likes of the Talons of the Emperor, Imperial Army and Ruinstorm Daemons, players with existing Horus Heresy collections will be able to keep fielding older miniatures in their games.

So, only pretending to be retarded

>>96103700
Whaaat? But I was told, several times, with great confidence, that it was!

>>96103688
Below is a list of the units that will have playable rules and unit datasheets in the upcoming Legacies of the Age of Darkness PDF:
Legiones Astartes

Veteran Breacher Squad

Veteran Heavy Support Squad

Tartaros Terminator Siege Squad

Indomitus Terminator Squad

Mortalis Destroyer Squad

Destroyer Assault Squad

Castra Ferrum Dreadnought

Land Raider Achilles

Caestus Assault Ram

Attack Bike Squadron

Scout Squad

Legion Basilisk

Legion Medusa

Thunderhawk Transporter

Praetorian Command Squad on Scimitar Jetbikes

Praetorian Command Squad on Outrider Bikes

Warmonger Consul

Forge Lord

Primus Medicae

Pathfinder

Delegatus

Armistos

Mortificator


In addition to the units, the PDF will include options to equip many characters with more exotic wargear including bikes, jump packs and Terminator armour.

>>96103693
You can use a prime benefit to get a scyllax or echindax retinue, or just join one of the units away and deal with the penalty. Or just sit him on a backfield objective and use him as sniper bait if you really just don't want to have anything to do with him.

>>96103688
>Raven Guard: Falcon's Claws
As much as I'd like some funky scouts, wasn't that a WS unit last edition?

>>96103688
>>96103715
Dark Angels

Cataphractii Terminator Deathwing Companions

Tartaros Terminator Deathwing Companions

Inner Circle Knights Cenobium – Order of the Broken Claws

Excindio Battle-Automata

Firewing Enigmatus Cabal

Paladin of the Hekatonystika in Terminator Armour

Additional Legion Armoury options

Emperor’s Children

Sun Killer Squad

Rylanor the Unyielding

Palatine Blade Aquilae Squad

Additional Legion Armoury options

Iron Warriors

Dominator Cohort

Nârik Dreygur

Iron Havocs

The Tormentor

Additional Legion Armoury options

>>96103729
Bro, if you're just copy-pasting, at least remove the reddit spacing.

CHUDS WON CHUDS WON
DISCORD TROONS ON SUICIDE WATCH
> PDF is delayed
AS THEY FRANTICALLY EDIT IT
REPEAT CHUDS WON

>>96103688
>>96103715
White Scars

Dark Sons of Death

Space Wolves

Jorlund Hunter Pack

Fenrisian Wolf Pack

Speaker of the Dead

Imperial Fists

Huscarls

Ætos Dios

Additional Legion Armoury options

Night Lords

Atramentar Flay-Clade

Additional Legion Armoury options

Blood Angels

Ofanim Court

Ofanim Court with Jump Packs

Illiastus Support Squad

Iron Hands

Morlock Terminator Squad

Additional Legion Armoury options

World Eaters

Red Hand Destroyer Mortalis Squad

Red Hand Destroyer Assault Squad

>>96103715
>Veteran Breacher Squad
>Veteran Heavy Support Squad
>Tartaros Terminator Siege Squad
wut

>World Eaters
>Red Hand Destroyer Mortalis Squad
>Red Hand Destroyer Assault Squad

I don't see Jump Pack Rampagers

>>96103688
>The upcoming Legacies of the Age of Darkness PDF is a huge document
I like how they try to pass this off as a good thing. Yeah it's big because of all the content you removed, you fucking fucks.

>Why were these rules not in the Liber books?
>The army lists in the Liber books are a reflection of the current range of miniatures.
And why is this suddenly an issue, chucklefucks? It was perfectly fine for 1.0 and 2.0, now it's an issue? We aren't stupid, we know GW wants to cut down on kitbashing.

>>96103688
>>96103715
Ultramarines

Locutarus Storm Squad

Nemesis Destroyer Squad

Honoured Telemechrus

Fulmentarus Terminator Squad

Death Guard

Mortus Poisoner Squad

Additional Legion Armoury options

Thousand Sons

Numerologist Cabal

Ammitara Occult Intercession Cabal

Additional Legion Armoury options

Sons of Horus

Chieftain Squad

Reaver Aggressor Squad

Word Bearers

Procurators

Procurators with Jump Packs

Additional Legion Armoury options

So not even opening up terminator options for my caster of runes and I bet the speaker of the dead doesn't have it either.

I feel worse not better

>>96103743

Breachers w Volkite
???
Tartaros w Power Fists

>>96103688
>>96103715
Salamanders

Adherent Squad

Sanctifier Squad

Cassian Dracos Reborn

Raven Guard

Deliverers

Falcon's Claws

Alpha Legion

Autilon Skorr

Effrit Disruption Cadre

Additional Legion Armoury options

Knights-Errant

Nathaniel Garro

Tylos Rubio

>>96103743
First two are new veteran squads that they don't have models for.
The latter is just Tartaros with fists/more heavy weapons?

>>96103744
You thought you were getting options on existing units? We don't do that here.

>>96103688
They mention some legion armories being expanded, and some of them make sense. But what are night lords getting? Preysight? The contekar weapons available to everyone? What?

Also
>atramentar flay clade
So, theres an atramentar primary benefit, contekar (who are a special formation within the atramentar) and now a separate atramentar unit? Isnt that a bit much? How big was the first company? How much are we riding this gimmick into the ground? What are we the deathwing?

>>96103688
I'm glad there's confirmation that most things are in there but if you are gonna put 90% of the content on a pdf you might as well just have digital rules ffs

The liber=model shit also doesn't add up. Centurions and Praetors have access to the officer list but the other consuls don't even tho there's no miniatures for the first ones.

>>96103688
>>96103715
And lastly
Mechanicum Taghmata

Tech-thrall Defense Covenant

Macrocarid Explorator

Mechanicum Termite Assault Drill

Mechanicum Tarantula Sentry Gun Battery

Solar Auxilia

Surgeon-Prime Aevos Jovan

Expeditionary Navigator

Davinite Lodge Priest

Medicae Section

Cyclops Demolition Vehicle

Aurox Transport

Tarantula Section

Carnodon Strike Tank

Avenger Strike Fighter

Destroyer Tank Hunter

Thunderer Siege Tank

Minotaur Artillery Tank

Macharius Heavy Tank

Praetor Armoured Assault Launcher

Crassus Armoured Assault Launcher

Baneblade Super-Heavy Battle Tank

Hellhammer Super-Heavy Battle Tank

Banehammer Super-Heavy Assault Tank

Stormlord Super-Heavy Assault Tank

Stormblade Super-Heavy Tank

Shadowsword Super-Heavy Tank Destroyer

Stormsword Super-Heavy Siege Tank

Marauder Bomber

Marauder Destroyer

Mech lost Land Raiders and Vindicators?

>>96103784
Welcome to unit sheet bloat: The edition.
No options, only new units.

>>96103688
>https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/p0y6yx4s/legacies-of-the-age-of-darkness-what-you-need-to-know/

>They are written to reflect the contents of boxed units, so new players can build armies without feeling the need to buy multiple kits just to make one unit.
sounds like cope. do you faggots not want to sell extra kits?

>no nullificators
>no reductor siege tanks
bros...
my fucking armies...

>>96102584
>>96102596
>>96102609
thanks frens, makes me wonder what I should paint next, maybe something Death Guard instead

>>96103796
Also one of the most fun aspects of this hobby is converting.

Go play a board game if you want to use stock kits

>>96103794
Anon atramentar were a unit last edition too (actually I think they were published twice, once in exemplary battles and once in legacies). My point is that I would have expected the atramentar prime benefit to make the unit pointless and thus removable.

>>96103706
>Edition isn't out yet
>Too late
What

>>96103709
New kit won't have them, I guess.

>>96103775
>First two are new veteran squads that they don't have models for.
They don't have models for any of the veteran squads. The 'Veterans' on the starter box are just tactical with a cross on the right pad. That can apply to any units...

>>96103744
>Rampagers
emm i think you forgot that they are heavy assault now, can't fly if you are that heavy! >>96103152

>>96099751
Having fun with magnets.

>>96103807
I personally would've scrapped the dumb prime benefit and kept the unit with all options.
But I suspect they did the opposite, realised how pissed people were, and backtracked.

>>96103809
Atremantar still are pointless though, literally FFS just stop this nonsense and let command squads take chain glaives too and no one would care

>>96103807
probably because you can't equip the entire squad with chainglaives so they had to roll out an entire new profile just for that

>>96103784
the "expanded" armories are just the old options you dork

"wait for the legacies PDF" sisters... We won...

>>96103817
Oh yeah, and HSS weapons are about.

The fuck?

>>96103822
Wrong.

>>96103828
Yeah I don't get what HSS veterans could be? All heavy desintegrator?

Well, I called the "veteran (volkite) breachers"
But what could heavy support vets be? The old gun/pistol/melee vets? Or the HSS with chainswords?

>>96103827
no you did not lol, If you have even half a brain you will know this was a complete oh shit moment where they had to add a fuck ton because there is no way that they had all of this shit in the PDF ready to go.
Atop of that, anyone whos fucking played 40k in 7th knows full well that PDF legacy is just Hospice care where things go to do.

FFS they even lie in that article.
They say the libras are for current model ranges, well thats fucking bullshit becuase tartaros are the current range and guess what, they come with fists, and they dont have fists in the libra.

Dont be stupid anon, dont buy into this slop .

>>96103835
Might be as simple as "HSS, BS5, 2W."

>>96103827
Doombots already coping hard lmao. Yet more proof the doomers were nothing more than nomodel tourists that weren't around with the 2.0 launch.

>>96103688
>It also means that these rulebooks can still be compact enough to transport to your games.
That's the dumbest fucking lie they could have ever told us, it's full of almost empty pages in the libers. Does adding more ink on a page make it suddenly swell to twice it's size? Not to mention we are getting full on 40k tier retardation where a guy on a bike requires a different page from the same guy without the bike. FUCK THESE "PEOPLE". Maybe next time don't fucking turn wargear into units.

>>96103826
What old options are NL missing you berk. Chainblades? The ones that are both still technically in the book and mechanically identical to chainglaives? The escaton power claw? NL have never had a big wargear section and they didnt lose much of anything in the edition transition (the things missing that were options in 2.0 are: preysight, which is pointless since theres no night fighting, bloody murder (the option that gave units with the rule +1A and +1" to charge pinned units) and the two weapons mentioned previously)

This isnt WB where tainted weapons were just gone now. We had all our relevant shit. SO what are we getting? The inductii knives? harrower boltguns? what?

>>96103827
Damn, did the legacies PDF unfuck the core rules?

>>96103688
>Shortly after launch
GW folded like a lawn chair and is still working on adding things they never intended to
>Wargear back
Doubters btfod

>>96103827
I'm gonna be honest even of this makes things good this whole systems seems pointless. Why the split? If you're gonna need a gigantic pdf why sell the books? Why not split the liber into two/three books so they ate more usable? Like, one for all the generic units, one or two for the legion stuff.

>>96103809
>been gasing up the new edition for a while
>kept talking how it will all be fine and nothing about the units will change
>didn't give a heads up before or moment the leaks dropped, only after people found out and had the time to get angry
This should've been mentioned either as soon as they revealed the new edition or they should've been faster to react to the leaks.

>>96103848
We stayed the course anons. Doomfags are seething and we won

>>96103843
>Moving the goalposts
Can't take the L huh, fucking loser. Top kek.

>>96103715
This 'To reflect the contents of the boxes' thing is absolutely retarded and doesn't apply consistently to anything
They made the basic units have fuck all and you need to buy special, heavy and melee weapons as separate kits to make half the units
All the Veterans they are introducing have no models at all, it's just a normal marine with a fancy decal.
Both terminator units don't have what is in the box either
I bet half these units are going to be rushed into the pdf bc they were not in originally
The fuck is a tartaros siege squad?
Don't tell me they made a whole new entry to give them actual melee weapons instead of saying it was an errata in the main book?

>>96103855
Core rules are fine (except heavy, should still be snapshots if you moved)

>>96103831
Please explain to me what makes the atramentar in the lord different from a legion elite command squad other than deep strike and night lord weapons. Genuinely curious because no one has been able to actually explain it to me.

>>96103859
>>didn't give a heads up before or moment the leaks dropped
The leaks came out last week/over the weekend. It is now wednesday.

Oof

>>96103725
Got fixed, it's gone from RG

>>96103843
>you did not lol, If you have even half a brain you will know this was a complete oh shit moment where they had to add a fuck ton because there is no way that they had all of this shit in the PDF ready to go.
If you don't think this was the plan from the get go I have some lovely beachfront property you might be interested in
>Atop of that, anyone whos fucking played 40k in 7th knows full well that PDF legacy is just Hospice care where things go to do.
Yeah that's why fulmentarus, huscarls, locutarus, the castraferrum, and havocs were all unplayable garbage right?
>They say the libras are for current model ranges, well thats fucking bullshit becuase tartaros are the current range and guess what, they come with fists, and they dont have fists in the libra.
I'm going to laugh at you for a week straight when we get the new fistless tartaros kit revealed I'm two days

>>96103859
Maybe, but they weren't planning for the leaks.

>>96103859
Corporations have a release timeline locked in usually months or even over a year in advance. Unless there is legitimate reason to pivot, they aren't going to adjust just because some retarded nerds are having a temper tantrum.

>>96103864
I have not moved the goal post ever, i have been saying this shit since the the moment i saw them cut the option. i knew they would get added in a PDF but this is exactly what they did to 40k, they do this to lul you into a false sense of security and then toss your models into the bin in 3 years just watch

>>96103868
heavy didn't do that before either?

>pay for our expensive books new edition piggies?
>editing mistakes? missing options?
>who cares, we'll put out some pdfs later
Why pay for something they put no effort into?

>>96103874
>Autism tactics viewerbase is 98% 40kfags
I'm not shocked

First the doombros won.
Now the "wait for the PDF" bros won.

Everybody won!

Except the GW staff who now have their summer holidays cancelled to add shit back asap, lol :D

>>96103868
Core rules are fine (except basically everything they changed)

>>96103881
are you fucking retarded?

>>96103796
It's a fake tagline, it's really boxlock and direct upgrade kits to compete with third parties.

>>96103688
>It also means that these rulebooks can still be compact enough to transport to your games.
Maybe if you didn't intentionally fuck your formatting, you could've fit it in. It fit in in 2.0.

>>96103876
>I'm going to laugh at you for a week straight when we get the new fistless tartaros kit revealed I'm two days
Imagine laughing at some one for being against getting a new kit with less options and costs more and is not compatible with the decade worth of bits.

>>96103874
>69%
Nice.

>>96103857
>Why the split? If you're gonna need a gigantic pdf
because they don't want to print another 70-100 pages. it's money

>>96103881
That's what it did in 2.0...

>>96103688
The leaker anon proves to be a hero once again, forcing their hand. Truly a victory against James.

Fuck Pardo by the way.

>>96103880
When 4.0 launches you'll still be saying "wait 3 years and see"

>>96103892
Then all the rules should be digital. This half ass just devalues the printed rules so even less people will buy them. At that point just cut the investment earlier.

>>96103890
>Moving goalposts again
Just take the L

>>96103856
>Doubters btfod
Forgive me if I wait and see rather than taking GW's word for it.

>>96103895
was thinking heavy sub-type

>>96103820
>Unknown Terminator squad assaults rad furnace during siege of ++REDACTED++

>>96103822
They were pointless last edition too.
The actual issue is that contekar were a mistake back in 1e, at least with their current lore. 3.0 tries to make it mesh better, but its still very clunky and silly.

>>96103869
There isnt, there also probably shouldnt be. The atramentar are just the first company terminator elite, terminators with the buff the prime benefit provides (deep strike, the way the atramentar like to fight, and impact(I) representing their skill in shock assaults/acting as a link to night raptors with the same rule, are enough to represent this in an effective way while also leaving them fully customizable and shit.

They dont have access to our legion weapons, but our legion weapons kinda suck, or arent terminator grade anyways.

Leaker anon is a hero. Praise.

>>96103796
>Hammerfall bunker
It's pretty insulting this is in the pdf when there's still units missing desu

>>96103688
>Introduce new disintegrator weapons
>Remove Nullificators
Thanks GW

>>96103869
>Genuinely curious because no one has been able to actually explain it to me.
Aren't they getting deep strike and +1i on a charge, which makes them basically into EC command squad termies with hammers? If they are charging, most of their opponents will die.

>>96103843
>We got what we wanted!
>Only after gw folded though!
>Great, we still got what we wanted!
>It wouldn't have happened-
>We got what we wanted!
A win is a win. I don't care if it was an act of God that a lightning bolt hit their head drives and the had to redo it anyway.

>>96103910
I actually made the same kind of joke to my friends when sending the picture. Great minds think alike.

>>96103902
>Then all the rules should be digital.
They can't be digiatl only because selling books is money too.

>>96103796
> Which is why thallax can't be built with every model having every special weapon out of the book, and Tartaros don't have power fists
Fuck their copium and attempt to re write history

>>96103869
>What makes them different other than the things that make them different.
Ignoring the retarded premise, and assuming 2.0 (since we don't have full 3.0 rules):
- Min 5 max 20, compared to min 3 max 5
- Deep Strike
- Cloaked in Murder
- Fear
- Can be made troops
- no mandatory banner
- can take heavy weapons
- lower WS

>>96103876
>Yeah that's why fulmentarus, huscarls, locutarus, the castraferrum, and havocs were all unplayable garbage right?
The fulmentarus were literally the single most broken thing at the start of the edition by a significant margin, everyone made a very big deal of it, and most other Ultramarine Legacies were high on the list. Yes, Legacies get even less thought than the usual dogshit writing.

>>96103880
Tartantula sentry guns used to be legacies. Now they have plastic models, and rules in the libers.
Fucking tarantula sentry guns, of all things.

Stay in 40k you fucking tourist, you're just embarrassing yourself. Clown.

>shit sandwich posters get BTFO
Lol

>>96103875
Jesus fuck, we're losing units again!

>>96103827
Trannies like you always lose

>>96103930
>We got what we wanted.
Whos this fucking WE?! shit?
I did not get what i wanted at all. I wanted a 2.0 update with a addressing of problem child rules and issues, not a complete fucking new edition with all sorts of changes.

>>96103843
Macca on suicide watch, go back to bed already

>>96103946
>STILL moving goalposts

>>96103947
If you think this is not GW panicing to try and save face then you are retarded.
>Tartaros Siege Squad
Yeah thats totally not made the fuck up on the spot.

>>96103688
Still not making the jump into 3.0. GW can eat my ass.

>>96103892
>because they don't want to print another 70-100 pages
Maybe if instead of splitting all these things into their own sheets you could have options on each sheet. Would really condense things.

>>96103883
That's the new editions intended audience though.
They WANT the 40kek players and WANT to drive the old players out.
40kek players are retarded cash cows. They buy anything and don't question shit

>>96103952
Psst, there can be different groups of people on tg. We got what we wanted. You were living in denial before not reading the writing on the wall. Editions churn, that's the new business model.

>>96103884
If you think you can crunch out such a long list of units within half a week I got a bridge to sell you.
The legacies rules were finished long before the launch was even announced. The HH team is working on whatever will be in tactica journal 4 or 5 at this point. You don't have the slightest idea how production timelines work, do you, little retard?

>>96103956
It's easier to say that than address the arguments, yes.

Arquitor model: Dogshit Resin Nightmare or Tolerable Assembly Process?

>>96103930
>>We got what we wanted!
>>Units that are only notably more fucked than they were before, but not entirely deleted!
>>Even poorer core rules than 2.0!
>>Proof that layout can actually get worse!
>>Full commitment to the worst experimental results of recent years!
KYS troonshill