Thread 96406570

The /btg/ is dead! Long live the /btg/!

Nice Butte edition

Last Thread: >>96384765

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burdhold

I like how cheap autocannons are in terms of BV.

>>96406684
What you like is wrong

>>96406700
>What you like is wrong
Behold the answer eternal. Right in all situations. Forever and always. Amen.

>>96406700
Counterpoint:

>>96406700
Wrong

What effects did Helm have on lostech prospecting? On the one hand its rosetta stone utility means that someone out there can actually interface with whatever obscure star league data drives they excavate, and that makes things more valuable, but now they're going to start reproducing extinct tech so original models will be worth less.

Man I love Comstar but their leadership keeps making retarded decisions. What could have possibly been their endgame? The plan seems to have been keeping the IS from advancing technologically but every attempt to make good on their advantage has been a train wreck
>facilitating the formation of FedCom
>secretly helping the Clans
>Operation SCORPION
>the Jihad

>>96406969
>What could have possibly been their endgame?
To be the shining light that brings the successor states out of an age of barbarism into a shiny new Star League.

>>96406969
>the Jihad
That was blakists. Comstar was on the other side of that conflict.

>>96406978
Which of course immediately became impossible to do even semi-organically when the successor lords all agreed to stop nuking each other into the stone age. The third succession war not being an ongoing nukefest is what really drove Comstar nutty. Their prophesy wasn't playing out right at all.

>>96406981
The Blakists seem to be the ones that stuck to “Plan A” while secular Comstar gave it up
>>96406978
>>96406989
It does make more sense as a plan that way, but man all of their post-Fourth Succession War attempts to improvise fell flat

>>96406981
Blakists are Comstar Classic. Always have been.

>>96407062
It was falling apart quickly. The blakists went ballistic because their last, final opportunity to at least win on a technicality died with the 2nd star league. If it had remained in place, they would have been able to play word games with the meaning of the prophecy. But it fell apart and they took up a "God helps those who help themselves" approach to saving the galaxy from nuclear obliteration.

>>96407074
Th blakists of the jihad are a the remant fraction of comstar purged of all the secularists, religious moderates, religious conservatives, and religious hardliners. Basically anyone not the most radical of reactionary fundamentalists got purged. Neither Fochtstar or the WOB are Comstar.

>>96407124
>secularists
Fochstar
>religious moderates
Counter Reformists (WoB)
>religious hardliners
True Believers (WoB)
Toyamas (WoB)

I'm surprised no one's ever done a "Comstar was right all along" AU where the third succ went the same way as the first two and they really did blow everything up and now the only people who aren't reduced to roving bandits and primitive survivors are the comstar adepts who were spread out far enough to survive the bombings. The successor states and Comstar's neutrality wouldn't hold up of course, and by the end of it they were probably getting nuked just like everything else. Real madmaxtech stuff.

What was the biggest blunder in the early 3000 that led to the domino effect culminating in the Jihad? Some idiot instigating Anton's rebellion because he was curious about the Dragoons or some other idiot who wanted to keep Helm for himself?

>>96407181
>What was the biggest blunder in the early 2000's that led to the domino effect culminating in the Jihad?
Wizkids, Weisman, and clickytech.

>>96407181
Takashi's super 3000 celebration at his dad's house.

>>96407210
what the hell happened?

>>96406885
>original models will be worth less.
If you can find a hangar full of free mechs you're going to make your money back.

>>96407124
Wrong, the Jihad era blakists have like 6 different factions ranging from fairly liberal moderates to hardcore radicals, but their actual characterization is that it's all the actual old guard comstar folks who are religious about Blakism, and all their new converts from the protectorate, periphery, and FWL.

In terms of actual politics, the Word of Blake pre Second Star League collapse is probably the largest and most religiously diverse Comstar has ever been in terms of number of acolytes. The WOB did however become much more radical across the board when the Second Star League collapse destroyed what they believed religiously was the best hope for humanity.

>>96407181
Blunder?

But no, obviously the actual blunder was that Comstar didn't launch their reconquista before the Helm Core got disseminated, they should have started moving towards that end in the late 2900s and launched some time around 3000 using their warship fleet to reconquer the terran hegemony in full. They could then launch further expansions from there with the full Star League+ level tech base they had, rather than waiting until everyone else had caught up.

>>96407233
>Daddy's boy gets a mega celebration for the start of the 3rd Millennium.
>Child of a peasant whore.
Everything starts with the Dracs. It always does.

>>96406885
>but now they're going to start reproducing extinct tech so original models will be worth less.
Are reproduction firearms worth more than the originals? The collectible of Star League material will never go away. You may have a smaller market to sell too as far dumping weapons as weapons and not collectibles. But there will always be buyers for mechs. Demand seems to always outstrip production in Btech?

>>96407252
Can you elaborate? I really don't understand. Is it about Teddy or something?

>>96407243
I mean more like nobody's going to pay a premium for ancient DHS after brand new ones with the same performance go on the market. When the Helm core is recent, nobody knows how quickly things will ramp up and enter wide distribution. Speculating on an old clapped out "one of a kind" XL engine is rough when they might start churning the exact same model out by the hundred.

>>96406981
The Word of Blake was the real Comstar. The organization that an ISF agent and a Steiner set up was always a pitiful imitation.

How may sources are there to fill "yet another Star League cache"?

The Star League
RWR caches for the coup
Shadow Division caches?
All the mechs hidden in barns and what have you during stoners forced disarmament.
Neo-blakist caches?

>>96407428
Theoretically Terran Alliance, they had to pull out pretty quickly and may have hidden some stuff away if they couldn't load it up in time. Especially with their primitive jumpships and dropshuttles.

>>96407428
Pirate Plunder
Explorer Corps and Minnasota Tribe wreckage
Clan Invasion/Jihad boogaloo bunker
The local Museum

>>96407507
>The local Museum
Gentlemen. Today's job is to steal one of the last remaining functional Mackies. The smithsonian is moving it's Mech Proliferation exhibition to Solaris VII during the championship finals. Unfortunately our bagman Squeekers got nicked last night and we need a replacement in the next 24 hours. Suggestions?

>>96407428
Exodus fleet also left caches, which seem like hybrid star league and RWR and consist of the crap they didn't want weighing them down.

>>96406969
>What could have possibly been their endgame?
They wanted to rule the Inner Sphere. Completely and totally, out in the open, while also being praise for it and seen as saviors.
Comstar had a god complex like no other. People make the phone bill joke, but they're not a phone company. They have complete and total control over all galactic communication. That's a terrible prospect in its own right, but wait, there's more.
The C-bill! We all know it, but sometimes we forget what the "C" stands for. It stands for Comstar. Comstar controls the currency. Yeah the great houses all have their own bills, but it's Comstar that determines their worth in relation to eachother. So they have complete control over both communication and money. How horrifying, but wait... there's even more.
Comstar has a major attitude problem. They believe that humanity can't handle technology, except for Comstart themselves of course. They place themselves above the rest of humanity, classic sin of pride really. They say that they're the only ones that can be responsible with it, but for every minor humanitarian aid you hear of them setting up a water purifier on a backwater system, there's some asshole out there decided to nuke a city and murder over 10 million people to get the legal rights to some land above a star league cache. Or if not that, helping an invading force as they rampage across the galaxy, only to then claim yourself the savior for, not fixing, but plugging a hole, in a problem they they enabled. I'm reminded of a classic line from the old Justice League Unlimited cartoon. "How many of us do you have to kill to protect us?"
Comstar already had absolute power and naturally it corrupted them, absolutely. The wonderful irony of it all is that they had control from the shadows for so long, but they were so desperate to have open control and be worshipped as gods for it, that their downfall was inevitable.

>>96407528
>Suggestions?
First of all, you and me start working at the Smithsonian, doesn't matter what position.
Then we just go there every day, do the work, gain their trust.
They'll deposit the c-bills we need to buy our Mackie into our bank accounts.
Then 30-40 years later after saving up, we walk out like nothing ever happened.

>>96407428
>pirate bases where they all died on a raid and left their stash behind
>shit people hid in the aftermath of the reunification war
>old battlefield before everyone was so salvage-crazy

>>96407656
>old battlefield before everyone was so salvage-crazy
I am a little embarassed I didn't think of that. I guess this would also include dead worlds from the first two succ wars. I imagine there might be some ok salvage in irradiated hellscapes.

>>96407600
Was Comstar really that powerful? Control over the HPG network is pretty damn scary but the only thing they did with it is conspicuously have a blackout whenever one of the Successors had a war

>>96407742
>but the only thing they did with it is conspicuously have a blackout whenever one of the Successors had a war
I imagine they also datamined every message that got sent and built themselves up a huge blackmail list too. All the houses bought into Comstar's neutrality claims and were way too trusting with them.
Even the blackouts though caused issues. Comstar claims to want another Star League to rise. Well how would that happen? One of the great houses has to gain so much power that the others all submit to it and they rule as head of the galaxy. Instead of letting 1 side every get ahead though, they'd always intervene to create stalemates, and as a result, perpetual war. Their actions help to ensure that there will never be another Star League while they exist.
This is of course because Comstar's stated objective of wanting another Star League is a lie, or at least just a half truth. They do want another Star League to rise, but only if they're the ones at the top of it.
>Was Comstar really that powerful?
Look to real life and see how much power and influence banks and credit services have. It's a disgusting amount. Now imagine that there's only a single bank. Now consider how we have real life companies trying to tell us what we can see online. They want to be in control of the information we can see. These companies have the politicians in their pockets. Now again, imagine if there was just a single one of these communication companies. Finally we imagine what it would be like if that single bank and that single service provider, were the same company. Would you even know what was happening to get upset about? If you somehow did learn something they didn't like, you'd be unable to spread the word. You could also wake up to find your bank account suddenly empty and no way to contact anyone about it.
At least to me, yeah, Comstar was pretty darn powerful.

>>96407299
>churning the exact same model out by the hundred.
Production goes to high level house units first. You'll have a large window to sell SLDF mechs to customers that aren't top level house units. After that window closes the Jihad and Dark Ages makes people desperate for anything they can get, so you're still peddling mechs better than the average Joe can get. Then the Republic tries to limit the number of mechs available, but you've got off the books mechs for sale, and they're still pretty good mechs. Then the ilClan happens, and shit is kicking off everywhere, so while you might not get a premium anymore, you're still making money.
So yes, in literally every era it is worth it to raid an SLDF cache if you can find one.

>>96407600
>>96407805
did you forget the existence of house currencies? or banks that aren't ComStar?

>>96407742
They also had a very, very good intelligence and special operations service.

>>96407742
They also have banking and media outfits. They'll have local competition everywhere, but the competition pays standard rates for HPG transmissions while the comstar brands don't. They also have a couple of the most prosperous solar systems in the known galaxy, which generates some pretty hefty GDP.

Why didn't Comstar just take over the IS by the end of the 2nd Succ War when everyone was exhausted and all? "Gotta follow Blake's prophecy?"

>>96407428
here's one that I used for /mydudes/ and was in their case periphery-specific but can really be adapted for use anywhere is
>mech repair depot/parts dump/salvage collection point in a bigass cavern (during the reunification war)
>owners (in my case taurians) had to retreat and blew the entrance, hoping to come back later
>they didn't
>your guys discover it centuries later after obtaining some obscure data
really, this one can cover just about any combination of mechs depending on the war you frame it with

>>96408111
Nobody was that bad off. Comstar found out the hard way in the 1st succ that their interdictions can't actually defeat a successor state. They existed before HPGs and they can exist after then. And if comstar blew their neutrality in the open, then everyone would dogpile them and seize as much of their assets as possible, which is a hell of a lot of assets to lose.

Other than Raimei (for as long as it lasted), what other companies managed to have branches in all Great House Fiefdom/Successor State? I know that both Starcorps Industries and Quicksell Company had branches in all House Fiefdoms/Successor States except for the Draconis Combine but were there companies that did so for all House Fiefdoms/Successor States, Combine included?

>>96408206
I believe Earthwerks was in all five successor states and Terra, but when the succession war broke it out they were split out into five separate corporations along national lines. I'm not sure if any of them other than the FWL and Capcon branches have actually been named or detailed though, and usually when they say "Earthwerks", they mean the FWL one.

Other than the Comstar and maybe IE and MRB, was/is there some kind of guild that works neutrally, independently pan-IS?

>>96408152
Sounds pretty Mary Sue to me

>>96408256
There's no way to justify lostech without sounding a bit like a mary sue to someone, but that's how it's set up for the setting. You just find it.

>>96407428
>>96408152
I don't even bother talking about what mechs /mydudes/ have when writing their descriptions, let alone where they got them. I sort collections/paint schemes according to what mechs are on the sarna "category:list of (faction) battlemechs" and/or what the MUL says is available. That more or less weeds out Mary Sue shit by default, if I bothered to care about that. My mercs have a Timberwolf. Why? How? Because for games past a certain era everyone can have one. Fuck it. Who cares? Your mercs bio should be about why and how they went merc, and what kind of mercs they are and who they will or won't work for. Taking time to explain how they got a super duper special mech is both boring and an obvious excuse.

>>96406879
Anni-chan, my beloved!

>>96406969
>>facilitating the formation of FedCom
I thought they were actually working against that?

>>96407428
>How may sources are there to fill "yet another Star League cache"?
"We've been secretly building this shit out in the Deep Periphery, and you'll keep quiet about that if you know what's good for you!"

>>96407628
>Then 30-40 years later after saving up, we walk out like nothing ever happened.
At that point you might as well sneak it out one piece at a time!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uErKI0zWgjg

>>96408269
I think you can slow your roll to have less miraculous lineups as mercenaries while still getting some toys. Instead of a pile of lostech, consider the following:
- Discover a cache of old beat up mechs: a Comstar Level II, ditched following some kind of disposable black op. You quietly paint over the white (and scrub the red off the seats) and put some old but nice mechs back into service and hope nobody asks any questions.
- Odds and ends salvage ends up giving you a few oddballs; between all the junkyard digging and headhunting, you've pieced back together an SLDF royal variant-- obviously one without lostech ammo that you can't feed it.


>>96408278
Your call; but the story behind your mechs is sometimes the story behind your command. My dudes (at least in their official time-frame) are deserters from the 5th Donegal on Kentares IV (as a kind of tie-in and nod to getting my start with MW4) that have taken a training command off the reservation to dodge having to do the war-crimes.

As such, their chassis are mostly hand-me-down Steiner fits with Chameleons and Stingers (and some Urbanmechs) over-represented from the mech academy. This is supplemented with some cutting edge mechs stolen from the 5th and salvage from across the FCCW. On to Jihad and beyond, their lineup leans increasingly mercenary.

I agree that any big magical story about one particular mech is silly. Pilots and mechs should at most have one good story out of them, like my command's only cutting edge Assault, a Nightstar-FC called "Mother Goose", so named 'because it's a fairy tale': They'd keep shuffling it around and leaking false intel on where it was being deployed so it could be deployed with as much of an element of surprise as you can get out of a 95 ton mech.

>>96407288
No. Takashi was the only son of the previous Coordinator and was doted on relentlessly by his father before the old man was assassinated. Later eras consider him the quintessential Samurai, but his dad did stuff like throw him a huge celebration in the year 3000.

Why would someone use the Longbow or Yoeman over LRM carriers? Both in and out of setting

>>96408419
Mountainous and/or heavily forested terrain?

>>96408419
Both are infinitely more durable than LRM carriers due to heavier armor and being battlemechs, mildly more versatile in mobility due to being battlemechs, and capable of defending themselves in close combat due to being battlemechs. Those are all applicable in and out of universe.
In universe, the mechs have the additional advantage of only requiring a single person to crew them and all of the aforementioned advantages being effectively multiplied in severity even further.
They're not really meant to do exactly the same thing. The LRM carrier is just a relatively cheap mobile LRM battery.

>>96408449
Got curious; is it possible to make a vehicle that only requires one person to control, via neurohelmet or something? Or what's stopping them from making one?

>>96408514
Somewhat arbitrarily, neurohelmets are compatible with mechs and ASFs, not vehicles.
You could use VDNI, but VDNI is complex, requires a surgical procedure to install and constant use of special drugs, causes certain damage to the vehicle to actually physically seriously injure the pilot, and inevitably always induces lethal neurological degradation after a few years unless removed. It also requires the vehicle to be specifically modified to interface with VDNI individuals, being impossible to control otherwise.
VDNI vehicles more or less never come into use in the inner sphere for the same reason protomechs don't.

>>96408514
There are vehicles that are crewed by one person but they are also on the lighter side of things

yeahy but does your mechforce have it's own soundtrack?

>>96408629

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XC9CmNi0ZY0

>>96408514
Per advanced rules that may be obsolete, vehicles 15 tons and under only have one crew member. The write-up for a very light Clan vehicle notes that it has a single crew member and that the pilots start developing ideas above their station because of it.

>>96408629
for legal reasons I am required to have a certain percentage of CanCon, but I am also designed to be a Rush fan, so it isn't actually a problem, I just blast mostly-obscure 80s rock shit that FASA was probably listing to from the cross-border stations

>>96408538
>Somewhat arbitrarily, neurohelmets are compatible with mechs and ASFs, not vehicles

ASF and Mech neurohelmets are different devices that do different things.

Mechs' are for balance and fine control, ASFs' are for greater battlefield awareness. I guess you could use the latter on a convee, but you don't need it as much when you aren't traveling at thousands of kph and need a full spherical 3D view of your surroundings.

Also IIRC most ASF pilots don't use neurohelmets by 30XX.

>>96408654
Incorrect, neurohelmets are also used in ASFs for control.

>>96408669
My bad, then.

But you don't need that degree of control for convees, which again aren't traveling at thousands of kph in full 3D.

You can look at modern controls. Modern fighter jet control systems are much finer and more sensitive than those for tanks etc.

did superheavy protomech tech ever make it to the IS clans?

>>96408681
I see literally no problem with this.

Billy has a bright future ahead of him. He should mail this to the First Prince, maybe he can get free tuition at Point Barrow or something.

>>96408689
Why is the purple bird angry?

>>96408694
Because he is big fight bird, and he has been in the big fight for centuries, and he's tired and angry of these god damn provinces not helping more with the big fight.

>>96408683
Modern tanks aren't traveling at hundreds of kilometers per hour.

>>96408729
>130
>"hundreds"

>>96408770
>he doesn't know how to use arrows
But anyway there's plenty of hovers moving at 200kp/h and a 50 ton machine moving over 100 is something you'd want fine control over.

>>96407868
>did you forget the existence of house currencies?
>>96407600 >Yeah the great houses all have their own bills,
No and if you had actually read what I wrote you wouldn't have asked that.

>>96408629
Yes. I played around with some ai generated songs and got it to make me one which I liked.

>>96408866
inshallah you will be destroyed

>>96408801
IRL attack helicopters at 300 kph use controls much coarser and more primitive than supersonic fighters have.

>>96408958
IRL attack helicopters actually use very fine controls, no more primitive than contemporary fixed wing aircraft.

>>96406570 (OP)
This thread... It was made for me.

>>96408434
i bring this classic for every monday

>>96408514
>>96408538
>Somewhat arbitrarily, neurohelmets are compatible with mechs and ASFs, not vehicles.
Pretty sure you can actually use Neurohelmets with vehicles, the real issue is that vehicle crews are usually a pro rather than a con when it comes to combat operation.
Something that is really irksome in Planetside 2 was that the Factional Main Battle Tanks had the Driver also controlling the Main Gun.
Besides overshadowing the lighter Lightning Tank (Whose original purpose was being a One man tank), it also caused platforms that separated the duties of Driver and Gunners, like the Sunderer and Harasser, to significantly outperform the more resource costly MBTs.

>Level 45
fucking what?

>>96411704
That's not even that high up honestly. For game purposes if you fell off that you'd be done, but that doesn't even qualify as a mountain irl. There are geographic features we call hills that would be more like 50 levels tall.

>You can expect Gothic to become available on October 1, 2025
Anybody getting one?

>>96411704
That's only 250-ish meters tall. >>96411724 is right, that's barely a hill. The Eiffel Tower is something like 350 meters tall, by comparison. If people wanted real mountains on mapsheets, they'd be level 300+ terrain features.

>>96411882
I'm building a mountaineering lance.

which mechs have 300 jump jets?

>>96411882
You would also need a loooot of mapsheets. Base camp to peak on Mt Everest is like 16 or 17 mapsheets arranged the long way, but that's only if you go in a perfectly straight line. If you wanted to actually map out the climbing routes you'd have to go about as wide, at least. Mechs may be more capable of straight lining it in some spots so you could maybe narrow it down to just three or four mapsheets wide. Go destroy that Blakist facility at the top, I guess.
Even a modest mountain should probably be about 8-10 ish mapsheets long, starting at elevation 0 and ending in the 300s

>>96412070
And that's only if you want to go from one side to the top. If you want to map out the whole mountain you're better off commissioning a custom floor mat with the mapsheet printed right on it, because you're gonna have to step all over it as your game progresses through the weeks/months.

>>96411963
Most mountains won't be a sheer cliff going all the way from the base to the top.

>>96412126
All mountains are Half Dome as far as I'm concerned.

>>96411876
No. It looks fucking stupid and I'm salty this took resources away from developing actual Battletech stuff.

>>96412177
Well then you're gonna need some LAMs, I guess.

>>96411704
>>96411724
>>96411882
I'd kind of love to see the BT map sheets for the terrain where I live (northern ontario, canada) though people would be screaming, crying pissing ect if they had to play on them, because they would be friendly to literally no unit type except VTOLs and LAMs

this is so hard to photograph well. I swear it looks better irl.

friendship ended with Liquitex naphthol crimson
now
AK fire breath is my best friend

post mechs?

>>96412275
It would go a long way to showing why people use mechs over vees. Mechs *can* work their way up mountains. They might be doing it one hex at a time, but they can do it. A tank is done the moment there's a three level elevation difference.

Wow, this looks equally bullshit too

>>96412630
does say misery on the label

>>96412275
>map is lakes,sheer cliffs, and heavy woods
>nothing else
yeah that'd suck

>>96412630
BA and SRM carriers might be fun on it.

>>96412630
If that's what Misery looks like, I'd wish it would suck more.

>>96412275
>>96412669
>>map is lakes,sheer cliffs
>>96412630
So Misery is Northern Ontario?!

>>96413087
Is there a cgl plastic uziel box floating around?

>>96413107
Not yet, it's announced but mine is a print.

>>96413109
Well just so you know I am extremely jealous.

>>96412630
So this is where Wolf and Tetsuhara fought.

Which one is 'one Hatchetman kills entire Falcon Guard' one?

>>96406570 (OP)
Alright anons
Does this set of mechs seem alright for a first lance
>Marauder
>Warhammer
>Griffin
>Locust

>>96413215
Yeah, that's four classics that would be good in just about any situation.

>>96413215
That's a pretty strong 3rd succ lance.

>>96413215
yes.

>>96413087
I demand better lighting

>>96413215
fell directly out of an 80s sourcebook/10
that's good, it means you are gettting it

how does this lance look
>Mackie
>Marauder
>Griffin
>Panther

>>96413413
Mackie is dog ass

>>96412630
It's more important for map to be realistic than to be """fun""" to play on. First, there's no real definition of fun anyway, and this is a simulation game, so it should simulate a realistic environment.

>>96413203
That's not a picture of Melissa's pussy though.

>>96413413
like y'all got a PPC fetish

>>96413215
For what faction? And it's generally too heavy anyway. Heavy and Assault Mechs are rare, Marauders especially so.
>Warhammer
>Griffin
>Stinger
>Locust

That's a good heavy Battle lance for the 3rd Succwar. To should always have at least 2 bugs in any lance formation, unless you're playing MOC, in which case you should have 4.

>Locust
>Locust
>Stinger
>Wasp
Any lance other than this is mary sue bullshit, all other mechs are rare

>>96413446
Presumably it's the same guy that just said the previous 4 mechs were his 1st lance. That means he probably chose it with the intention of creating a strong lance designed to win.
He does not yet understand the true nature of playing Battletech. He must be taught.

>>96413433
you gon get regulated

>>96413456
Fuctard double wasp or double stinger never double locust. Real armature hours right now.

>96413452
>96413456
you've been at this since 2013, are you not bored by now?

>>96413456
>Atlas
>King Crab
>Marauder II
>Nightstar
Don't be upset anon. Now let's play. :)

>>96413446
I prefer the extendeds myself.

>>96413456
>he's never heard of the archer

>>96413469
I'm only the first guy, and the truth isn't boring. People who load up forces with Mary Sue bullshit are boring. That anon should be corrected immediately.

>>96413479
sometimes I wonder what could have happened if your autistic devotion was focused on something useful

>>96413457
Nah i just got the legendary mw3 box and the goac box and picked 4 I thought looked cool
Those two gave me options enough for me and my buddies to try things out

>>96413498
Ask yourself why you're so angry. Then ask yourself what the real reason you're angry is.

>>96413503
Oh, then I guess the other anon was right. Looks like you have a PPC fetish.

>>96413498
Difficult to say. I could have probably cured cancer, but then liberals would live longer and I don't want a world where that's a thing. Regardless, I accept your concession on the matter of Mech weight. Even the Black Widow company had 2 bugs in their heavy fire lance. 80% of the game should be played with lights and mediums. That's just the way it is.

>>96413505
I'm not even mad, just tired

>>96413515
>Oh, then I guess the other anon was right. Looks like you have a PPC fetish.
Oh lol, then I guess based on the other anons that's probably a good thing

>>96413522
Then take a permanent rest alongside the rest of the 42%. It'll stop you from shooting up a church. Rest assured, you will not be missed.

>>96413544
Do you talk to people in real life like this? Do you talk to people in real life at all?

>>96413544
Stop that.
>>96413522
Hopefully it's the kind of tired sleep can fix.

>>96413505
my mom hates that I'm trans

:c

Finding a SLDF cache is a cliche, but how about finding a SLDF DropShip like an Union or Overlord?
>Is it even possible to hide those in the first place?

>>96413456
Nice Star League lance bro, but we're playing Clan Invasion.

>>96413580
SLDF had underground facilities with DropShip hangers so I'd say yes
the other option is a landed ship that had it's crew toasted by a nuclear attack that the boat survived

>>96413596
Oh, well in that case.
>Wasp
>Wasp
>Stinger
>Stinger
>Hornet
>Locust
>Urbanmech
>MadCat

>>96413556
boy is a server goblin, so I'd say no to both

>>96413628
>Hornet
Get that fukkin unicorn off my god damn table.

>>96413557
>Hopefully it's the kind of tired sleep can fix.
not since 1995

>>96413636
Go for a walk in the sun and eat an apple. Stand in the quiet of nature and let yourself simply be for a moment.

It's not complicated, they should just rebalance the game so there's a reason anyone would ever bring anything other than mostly mediums, heavy mediums, light mediums, the entire game is a fucking bell curve of effectiveness lol

Mechs with three hexes of movement or that are one hit away from losing limbs just never feel worth bringing, and that shouldn't be the case.

>>96413695
I like the way the Marauder looks.

>>96413672
I do all that. for the rest there's sljivovica

>>96413695
It's never worth doing a DFA either, but that isn't going to stop me from doing one and creating an awesome moment.

>>96413560
Let her know that what you are is nothing new and that trans women are just the most evolved form of male. So she should be proud, if anything, that you aren't a buggy Alpha male who isn't ready for release to the public yet.

>>96413705
Gesundheit.

>>96413717
you should hear how the FWL ruling house name should be pronounced

>>96413695
>just rebalance the game
Just play smaller BV games, fag.

>>96413736
Ok, I'll play a 2000 BV game. And some fag will still put a Stalker on the table against my Phoenix Hawk and pair of bugs, and I'll still lose. The game needs to actively prevent players from taking heavy and assault units. You can have 1 heavy for every 4 other Mechs, and 1 assault for every 4 heavy Mechs. There, done.

>>96413747
Cranky because you don't know how to beat heavy mechs

>>96413747
You can't kill a stalker with a P. Hawk?

>>96413762
In Alpha Strike, a Stalker kills a Phawk every single time.

>>96413710
DFA actually does its job sometimes though, and it's a spur of the moment gamble.
It's not like you're paying BV right at the start for it knowing full well it'll never pay for itself.
>>96413747
I dunno what you're going on about, I just said assault units aren't great either.

>>96413773
>Alpha Strike
Oh, sorry. I didnt know you were disabled.

>>96413747
So you think the left team has an extreme advantage against the right team? I don't know man, I think I'm betting on the Trio team in that fight.

>>96413710
I killed a guy at this year's Adepticon's Solaris thing lmao. It was dope and I got a big pile of money and fame chits.

>>96413747
engage mighty foot

>>96413716
so true queen

>>96408434
yknow, something that just occured to me. In well developed places like contemporary earth the roadway networks are pretty complete and almost every minor river will have some bridge crossing.
90% of worlds aren't going to be settled at even the level of contemporary earth probably. So where tanks wouldn't have trouble getting to and fro because of a dearth of road networks, they will suffer on undeveloped worlds and slow down advances. so maybe a battlemech actually DOES make sense in that context as a superior weapon of maneuverability.

>>96413825
>I killed a guy with a DFA at this year's Adepticon's Solaris thing
jfc I accidentally a words

but yeah, I used two reroll thingies to dunk all 3 of my hit locations into rear CT lololol

>>96413832
conversely, the number of roads present on a planet would result in more skid checks for the battlemech.

>>96413825
Brave of you to confess to murder on the internet. What'd you do with withe body?

>>96413832
>so maybe a battlemech actually DOES make sense in that context as a superior weapon of maneuverability.
Yes. It does. It also works underwater, in a vacuum, and can cross mountain ranges. Then add in the fact that you have to haul this shit through space. You want 12 medium to heavy tanks or 12 heavy to medium mechs?

>>96413747
you just complained that mechs with 3 hexes of movement never feel worth bringing, yet you are now complaining about getting BTFOed by a single stalker. this post is bait. you can all stop responding now.

>>96413874
We always knew it was bait.

>>96413847
tbf that was always retarded. Only in battletech's version of reality would loose sand be more grippy than tarmac.
>>96413874
No, he's just a different guy. I still think mechs with 3 hexes are stinky. He's just jumping into someone else's reply chain to troll you.

>>96413847
Skid checks for running on a road are retarded. Change my mind.

>>96413881
Nascar

>>96413888
Terrible bait.

>>96413874
This should be the first reply in every BTG forever.

Actually, wait, it should be the first reply in every thread on TG, forever.

>>96413880
>>96413881
mech sneakers are lostech

>>96413874
we're here to roleplay as retards.

>>96413924
roleplay?

>>96413747
honestly i blame the phoenix hawk there.
as much as i want to run the super veritech it's not good. also it's your fault for running a scout lance against assaults and being unable to get behind them despite the action bonus,

>>96413881
Because roads don't offer good traction for high speed turns, especially 10+ ton machines trying to make high speed turns. And by "high speed" I mean basically anything above the equivalent of 3 or 4 movement.
Tracked vehicles should also suffer from that penalty, roads are basically a slip and slide for tanks, drivers have to be pretty careful on them. Wheeled vehicles should merely get a bonus to the roll.

>>96413881
Because mechs can sink into terrain to gain traction, but their metal feet on ferrocrete can't so direction changes at high speed are prone to cause their metal feet to slide.

>>96413958
>being unable to get behind them despite the action bonus,
Stalker flips arms, doesn't it? I honestly don't think a 3/5 Stalker (2000BV) is going to lose a game against a (4/4) Pixie (1200BV) and a couple bugs (about 400 each), unless they're playing on totally biased terrain. They might be able to pull it off on a pair of heavy woods maps, but not on anything approaching clear terrain. Each bug gets 1 kick off before being eviscerated, and the MLs in the Stalkers arms are actually a threat to them, and winning initiative and running away with the Pixie just lets the Stalker cool down for when the Pixie tries to jump back in. The light force can't just magically teleport adjacent to the Stalker and all kick the same leg whenever they want to.

>>96414003
>>96413958
Anons, if the Mad Cat vs IS lance games last year taught us anything, it's that single, high BV Mechs will ALWAYS lose against a more numerous enemy, because the enemy's action economy is superior.

>>96414003
Gosh. Sounds like you and a friend shoukd game it out.

>>96414003
If you want a game you can just ask.

>>96414003
I'd play you anon. I'll take that light group. But I'm not playing unless we're in Box canyon or Heavy woods.

>>96414009
>single, high BV Mechs will ALWAYS lose against a more numerous enemy, because the enemy's action economy is superior
Yeah, that's how things work. Why is this even surprising? Being guaranteed to move last is always an advantage.

>>96413215
But have you tried:
>Griffin
>Griffin
>Griffin
>Griffin
This wisdom is the fruit bestowed upon those brave enough to hold the Butte

>>96414003
On most maps the Stalker would have trouble always being more than six hexes away from level 2 terrain. If the lighter side loses initiative, then they just hide behind full cover. If they win, then they're up the Stalker's ass where it can't kick. They never need to remain at range 1 for more than one turn in a row.

>>96414009
>>96414066
Just put some infantry in the corners having a tea party on the side of the single model in any given scenario to balance it out. Whenever it's their go you can just describe them cheering the mech on or playing a game of baseball.

So uh let's go ahead and get it out of the way. How many the Stalker will always win vs the Pixie will always win do we have? Reply to my post and start pairing up. Someone figure out what map we need to use.

Are scans of the rules and/or record sheets from the Gothic box set available anywhere? I've checked the main trove, but not found anything. Elsewhere, I've been able to find the fluff pdf, but not any crunch.

>>96414089
Pixie always wins, and it's not even close. Superiority of action economy is a guaranteed victory outside unsustainable lucky TACs.

>>96414003
>Stalker flips arms, doesn't it?
no that's the rifleman.
i think the stalker cannot fire behind it thanks to the limitations of torso twist and the NO ARMs someone should check me on that though
even if they can, just stay to the back with a bias to the side with the least amount of weapon depending on the variant.
and then since you have the PH, make him unappetizing and use the LL to whittle it down, force the fire split.
wait, you're using a post grugtech PH? 1200 sounds like a refit.

>kicks
DON'T BE IN THE FRONT ARK DUMB ASS
>THE MLS
ARE IN THE ARMS, the arms that shouldn't be able to hit you at this distance but you can stack to be +3/+4, +1 +2, sure eventually he'll hit the 10/11, blowthrough critical but you hit him easier, with more weapons and more often on your own terms.

>can't teliport
you have a PH, you can stay behind it at Short for the ER-LL and medium to long for stalker, you even have an AMS if it some how can torso twist and hit you with an LRM.
if you're engaging a stalker in a plain you chose the form of your destroyer.
if you're using a veritech force in a normal map just use terrain OR channel jack archer the giant killer.

>>96414114
Stalker has flippy arms

>>96414117
source?

>>96414118
AGOAC rulebook

>>96414117
>>96414118
>>96414122
Also BMM and TW for that matter. Stalker has always had flippy arms, since day 1.

>>96414114
>wait, you're using a post grugtech PH? 1200 sounds like a refit.
1041 BV at 4/4 is something pretty close to 1200, anon

And yes the STK can fire backwards. No/Minimal arms doesn't prevent that, and it lacks LAA and hands in both arms, so they can flip. Also, quirks aren't TW rules, they're optional. And if the STK gets quirks, then it gets its Combat computer, which makes it a LOT more effective.

>>96414129
>>96414122
>>96414135
No citation, not a source

>>96414139
I accept your concession.

>>96414122
>>96414129
yeah i stand corrected on that one.

>>96414139
i got it, it's 105

>>96414109
>Superiority of action economy is a guaranteed victory outside unsustainable lucky TACs.
Hello newfriend. What's your opinion of the MadCat Prime?

>>96414135
why jump on the 4/4?
the PH is already a kind shit body to be running, but base you're running hot if you sneeze in it's cockpit.

>>96414148
What are you doing? Facts are not accepted in arguments here. Do I need to point you to a list of logical fallacies so that you may respond appropriately?

>>96414164
no i think i'll just call you a slur instead.
F A G G O T

>>96414169
Well of course you will anon. Ad hominems are an acceptable response.

Good God, fuck all of you people. Force listings for approximately a 2000 BV2 target game.

Stalker STK- 3F (3/5), 2027 BV
vs
Phoenix Hawk PXH-1 (4/4), 1198 BV
Wasp WSP-1A (4/5), 384 BV
Locust LCT-1V (4/5), 432
>total BV: 2014

>A 4/4 PXH and 3/5 Stalkers are called out in the original post, so aren't changeable.

Play on 1 Classic BattleTech map, 15 turn limit. Stalker chooses deployment edge, scout group deploys opposite: all units must enter the board on their initiative. Quirks and SPAs are not in play as they are optional rules and not Total Warfare standard. If both players agree, each force has a total of 1 point of Edge; Edge may not be spent to reroll a reroll.

>>96414202
>Play on 1 Classic BattleTech map
Not enough woods. Not playing. My light lance refuses to engage and so we win.

>>96414202
I shall park my feet in water and sing the song that ends the earth.

>>96414202
Thanks NEA. I'm not convinced this is anything other than an intentional troll though. I'll play you though if you just need an opponent to make the point.

>>96414202
It never fails to impress me how the moment you post something like this, everyone fighting over it shuts up instead of continuing the argument or immediately going to a game (fair play to >>96414217). BTG is made of nogaemz confirmed.

>>96414202
I think the Stalker will win on its large lasers punching whole sections off lights

>>96414324
I think the Pixie could win through. Its no slam dunk though. I also think I can kill a madcat with a succ war lance so make of that what you will.

>>96414202
Not a fair fight. The lights have fewer BV and they don't get to pick the terrain they engage in. Why don't you just admit your biased?

This will pretty quickly become a problem if the pixie and crew survive long enough.

>>96414202
yo, NEA, as a professional, bourbon or rye for a manhatten?

>>96414340
>I also think I can kill a madcat with a succ war lance
So can I. One Mad Cat always loses on a 1 map sheet game against a lance of Marauder IIs. It's not like it's a hard game.

>>96414356
Bro wtf up with your dot placement

>>96414356
Nothing makes you more guaranteed to hit the arms and legs of your target than jumping behind it.

>>96414373
It's not a problem for me. I have a pair of dice weighted to roll 8s, so I'll hit the rear side torso basically all the time

>>96414371
That's canon dot placement.

>>96414371
It makes it harder to hit.

>>96414101
https://www.reddit.com/r/battletech/comments/1mj2nsv/bt_gothics_abomination_sheets/
https://www.reddit.com/r/battletech/comments/1mindtv/cgls_contribution_to_blazer_week/

>Herb: As to why Abominations didn’t get BV, that came down to limited time and the fact that I just don’t generate Battle Values for anything I create. CGL tends to rely on a select few for that job, and I guess there just wasn’t time to get that done before the set went to print.
Lazy ass

>Sean: Do you think the abomination rules would be possible to be used to represent megafauna like megasaurs in regular BattleTech? Will we see any new abominations added over time, perhaps in Shrapnel?

>Herb: For natural megafauna in BattleTech, in my opinion, the rulesets from Classic BattleTech Companion (MW3rd) or A Time of War Companion (AToW) are more than sufficient to reflect such creatures. However, such unmodified animals are wholly incapable of being much more than a speedbump to most BattleMechs over 20 tons. The Abominations rules are therefore meant to represent hybridized and augmented animals made specifically for the task of fighting armored units on more even terms.
>I can say with some confidence that we probably will see new Abominations in the future, though whether that will be in Shrapnel or some other product specially meant to supplement Gothic is up in the air right now. There was a lot of rules material on Abominations that didn’t make it into the Gothic box set due to time and space constraints, including rules for amphibious Abominations and, of course, the construction system I used to make these creatures. Cat willing, such material will be released in some form or another.

>Sean: I think the idea is not so much fighting dinosaurs or elephants, but kaiju. I’m thinkin’ ’Mechs versus Godzilla, where the Abomination rules would be much closer to a giant armored lizard that can fire lasers and roar AoE attacks.

>Herb: Oh, for those with the magical energy and physical attacks like those, yeah, Abominations are definitely a better fit.
They better release it fast because diy kaiju is the only redeeming feature of this dumb au

>>96414749
They should have just made a "Monster Planet" sourcebook with kaiju construction rules and some movie based scenarios and released a force pack or two of monsters on April Fools and called it a day. They could have put in some old school BT humor into it, set it in a system of planets in the Deep Periphery, and declared it non-canon/so far removed from known space it doesn't matter. A whole ass AU for edgy gothic nonsense is fucking gay.

>>96414749
sure as fuck hope they release the construiction rules, since using them for bootleg pocket pacific rim is literally the only interest I have in the whole thing

>>96414733
>As to why Abominations didn’t get BV, that came down to limited time and the fact that I just don’t generate Battle Values for anything I create. CGL tends to rely on a select few for that job, and I guess there just wasn’t time to get that done before the set went to print.
Good for him. Entitled people can suck it.

>>96407299
Excwpt thise ancient ones work EXACTLY like the brand new ones. MINUS the gremlins of the "new" tech teething problems as they reverse/side -gineer them back from LosTech.

>>96407843
Steiner IIRC shit out quite an embarassing amount of griffins annually.

>>96414791
They still would not be able to write official furry fan-fiction for that.

Although we did get an image of capellans as literal lizardmen and bugmen so some things never change.

>>96414806
But rules are boring, they just want to write edgy fiction but know absolutely no one would read it if did not have Battletech name on it.

>>96414361
>manhatten
manhattan, you philistine. SHAMEFUR DISPRAY.

I'm so scared of the next AU

>>96415340
I think this and all next AU will have a lot less substance to it, now that Herb blew his pent up furry load on gothic.

>>96415184
Maybe it's plural. One manhattan, two manhatten.

>>96415371
I'm pretty sure it's one manhattan, two menhattan.

>>96415184
I'd had five at that point, give me a break

>>96414361
Not NEA, but all else being equal (or even reasonably close)? Rye, no question. I lean toward rye over bourbon even when we're talking unsweetened whiskey (whether that means neat, on the rocks, straight up, whiskey and soda, or whiskey and a splash of water), but I can certainly be in a mood for bourbon there. But throwing in a bunch of additional sugar heavily tips the balance even further in rye's favor, as does the need to compete with the strong botanical flavors of a good red vermouth.
But between a robust and interesting bourbon and a dull, 51%-and-no-more-and-also-just-didn't-give-a-shit rye, (or worse, a blended """rye""" from Canada)? Bourbon, definitely.

>>96414361
not NEA, but I say a high-rye, high proof bourbon is the way to go, I like Old Granddad 114

I have done a game of Stalker vs. Phoenix Hawk, Wasp, Stinger. Here are the results.

The Stalker was able to get some higher ground early. Team Pixie managed to move in and hide behind high ground to avoid LOS. At this point, the Stalker was already dug in and Team Pixie had to rush the Stalker. This was dangerous as there would be no cover for the 2 turns needed to close the gap on the Stalker. Stalker stayed still and fired cooly on turn 1, missing everything at long range, as Team Pixie all did jump 6s to max their TMM. The 2nd turn for the charge, Team Pixie again maxed all their TMM, except for the Wasp which was able to do a Run for 3 TMM. At this point however, everyone was in medium range. The Stalker fired on the Wasp and got enough hits to core the CT on its opening volley. Wasp down.

The Stinger and Pixie managed to get behind the Stalker and start unloading into its rear. The 1st turn this happened, Stalker missed a bunch of attacks, while P&S ate away at the rear armor. Due to elevation however, the Stalker was above them, so they couldn't do any kicking. The 2nd turn of this, the Stalker again didn't move. It simply did the arm flip, and completely cored the Stinger.
Stinger down.

The Pixie then jumped to maximize its TMM and shed some heat. Next turn, it jumped in again to fire. At this point I need to address an issue, crits. The rear of the Stalker was opened up, but twice the dice failed to roll any crits on it. The Stalker on the other hand, was lucking out with it's own rolls, getting TAC that rolled for a double crit, it hit both the engine and gyro. Amazingly, the Pixie didn't fall over from the Gyro hit, but the engine hit pretty much guaranteed that the game was going to slow down a lot as the Pixie would need to cool for multiple turns now before leaping into attack. However it was good for 1 more turn of getting right up the Stalkers ass without shooting penalties, and it did just that.

1/2

>>96417092
sounds like you're bad at maneuvering lights and you picked a map weighted towards the stalker

what mapsheet were you playing on?

>>96417092
Con't

Failed crit rolls combined with arm and leg hits led to an unimpressive turn for the Pixie. The Stalker meanwhile, was once again able to just stand there and arm flip for easy high power shots. Low and behold, another TAC, this time hitting the MG ammo in the CT of the Pixie.
Phoenix Hawk down.
Game goes to the Stalker.

It's impossible not to acknowledge how the Stalker was rolling super hot on its crits all game. I didn't mention it before, but it also got a double crit on the Stinger's CT, again hitting the engine and gyro, it's just that it destroyed the Stinger's CT outright in that same turn. It even got a random hit on the Stinger's LA shoulder, not that it mattered. Meanwhile, Team PSW, got to roll for crits a few times, but never got even one. In this regard, the dice decided that this would be a game of Battletech to make the Stalker look unstoppable; fairness be damned.

Tactics wise, it does seem to favor the Stalker. Once it found its spot, it just stayed there. The only time it got to shoot penalties for movement, was when it had to stand up after being knocked down, but even that didn't do any lasting damage. Team PSW had to stay moving to maximize their TMM and take advantage of the terrain. Meanwhile, Stalker just didn't care. It didn't need to move, letting the enemy come to it and getting very easy shots as a result. It had the armor to eat the enemy shots and couldn't generate the TMM anyway, so it had no reason to move.

In terms of winning initiative, Team PSW really felt it the turns they lost the initiative, while Stalker didn't really care about losing it. Team PSW needed it to plan their attack, but Stalker didn't. Stalker simply sat and shat, to great effect.
2/2

>>96417169
Maybe you could try to not be a condescending prick and wait to comment until after I'm done discussing the results. If you had, you would have been able to read about the insane crit roll luck the Stalker got. It got 3 CT crits on the P-Hawk without ever putting a single point of damage on its structure.

>>96417092
>>96417202
Not how MegaMek gives the odds; Team PSW wins around 99.5%.

>>96417304
And we all know that MegaMek never does anything wrong.

>>96417241
nah, you just proved that you're a retard nogaems secondary and you don't know how to play, and that you did indeed pick a map that favours the stalker. the stalker's luck on the pixie is just incidental and compounds the previously stated problem(s) (you being stupid). the lucky shots should have made you throw out the test results because team PSW got Battletech'd.

how about you be less of a lil bitch?

do better next time.

>>96417551
cont.

like fucking seriously dude, you left bugmechs out in the open on turn 1 versus a stalker on a map with a decent amount of level 2 to hide behind. team PSW should've taken multiple turns to close the distance carefully instead of running out into the open like lemmings.

you're a fucking retard.

I've 1v1'd Marauders, Warhammers and Black Knights in a Nightsky (picrel). Breddy easy if you have a brain.

>>96417809
I wouldn't call it easy, but I agree that in all my limited experience on the tabletop, the only time you blitz out with the lights is on the turn they're actually opening up unless you actively have no other way to close distance.

You get close enough to push into opposite arcs at once or get behind them and you stay out of optimal. The very idea of parking in the Stalker's medium range on the way to attacking it is antithetical to the most basic tactics.

>>96417809
See that’s cool and all, but that anon actually bothered to game it out on the table, so unless you want to do the same his word is automatically worth more than yours.

>>96406969
> What could have possibly been their endgame?
To get the great houses to bomb themselves back to the Stone Age. Thus wiping the political board clean so they could swoop in, bestow all the lost Star League technology to the surviving masses, and establish themselves as the one, true rulers of all humanity in a new Star League, one free of the intrigue and posturing of the nobility, which they blame for the first Star League’s collapse.

After Tukayyid, some among their numbers started thinking about shifting directions and maybe reevaluating some of their original goals, leading to the jihad.

do not praise weakness,
failure to grasp victory,
is chalcas, dezgra.

>>96417551
Why are you such a whiny bitch all the time? All you ever do is whine and complain and throw temper tantrums like a 4 year old.
>>96417809
>you left bugmechs out in the open on turn 1
Literally didn't happen. Now show me the pathway you would have taken to move your guys from the top left to the bottom right with just a single jump 6 move. Right, you can't. Now get off the internet and go take your meds Manic.
>>96417895
Well you understand, but he doesn't want to do the same. He just wants to throw his temper tantrums and call people names. If the results were that Team PSW won, I guarantee you he'd be calling me a retard for not being able to take down some bug mechs with a Stalker and he'd say I don't know how to use Assault mechs properly and that the map I chose favored Team PSW.
He's a miserable waste of air and seeks only to make others as miserable as he is.

>>96417850
>You get close enough to push into opposite arcs at once or get behind them and you stay out of optimal.
Yeah, didn't seem like Anon did anything to really make the Stalker choose its targets, keeping the lighter mechs in the same arc so they could be focused fired.

That's kind of the problem with only one person "playing out" the scenario; Their biases will subconsciously affect their decision making for the Op For.
That's why I went with MegaMechs new odds calculator; It's probably only running Princess V Princess, so until I learn how to run a Bot on Bot match, that's a much more even breakdown of the odds.
And yeah, the odds are really against the Stalker.

>>96418265
Against a Stalker it doesn't really matter which arc you go in, it can either twist and bring two mlas, a llas, and SRM on you (and maybe an LRM if you aren't point blank) or it can flip and dump four mlas. The most foolish play is to be directly in front of it where it can shoot everything freely, but there are no safe angles.

>>96417850
>The very idea of parking in the Stalker's medium range on the way to attacking it is antithetical to the most basic tactics.
Oh do go on about how you'd get some bug mechs with max attack range of 9 into distance of an enemy with a max range of 21, without getting shot at.

>>96417850
Given how that map is set up, the options are to be in partial cover on your way in, or to not be in partial cover on your way in. There's no real way to avoid getting shot at for at least one turn. Your choice is to cluster over to the left so you get partial cover at range 6 or 7, or going out in the open down the middle at range 6, 7, or 8. Anything else will let it shoot at you for more than one turn and you'll still have to be in the sweet spot for one of them.

I really hate this "argument" is happening on memorial day weekend. I have zero time to do a game of this.

>>96418285
>Against a Stalker it doesn't really matter which arc you go in,
You get it. The only way they had to avoid attacks, was to hide behind terrain, which meant that they also weren't getting to attack. The Stalker has range advantage, so it's able to just sprint to a decent spot and dig in, leaving it to the lighter mechs to try and root it out.
Once the Stalker stops moving, it starts doing a great job of hitting its targets. 4G+3TMM=7s to hit @ short range. Medium range is still 9s. You want the Stalker at long range so it needs 11s? Yeah, it'll miss a bunch of shots at that range, but the bugs literally won't be able to fight back. Eventually they'll take some damage and still have to close in the end. The P-Hawk has a single LL for long range fighting and would still need to keep moving. It'll heat up way faster than the Stalker will, while putting out less firepower. The Stalker benefits way more from a prolonged long range fight. It goes on long enough and it'll even be able to use up its LRM ammo, making it no longer having to worry about an ammo explosion, which again, would only benefit the Stalker.
They also seem to be forgetting just how fragile the bug mechs are. 12 total health on the CT. That's 2MLs and a single SRM to kill it. That's not that much at all.
I did my testing of the scenario without any biases for one side coming out on top. If people have a problem with the results, that's on them. Hypothesis are meant to be tested multiple times. Well I provided data point number 1.

>>96417202
Did you play both sides, fight princess, or fight a player?

>>96418436
>I really hate this "argument" is happening on memorial day weekend
>memorial day weekend

>>96418449
Both sides. It's the only way to make the player a constant and not a variable.

>>96418449
I'll also note that I just left all the pilots as 4/5s for convenience. This made the BV 1,559(Stalker) vs. 1,784(Team PSW). So the team even had the BV advantage. If the Stalker is bumped up to a gunnery of 3, it'd be even more sickening.

>>96418310
Not the guy you replied to but, with any light mech the trick is usually to move as fast as you can, and try to stay out of the fire arcs of other mechs as much as you can. Going fast may help to make the TMM unreasonably high, but it’s still not a guarantee of safety. So skirting the outside of the front fire lanes is going to be critical, as well as making sure to give your opponent something more pressing to draw his attention, he’s unlikely to give too much attention to a Locust if there’s also a Battlemaster also bearing down on him.

But none of these armchair tactics are going to be sure fire things. And you can’t ever truly force your opponent’s hand. As they say: “no plan survives contact with the enemy” so remember that the ability to think on your feet and willingness to adapt to new situations is just as critical as any pre-game planned tactic.

>>96418521
Yes and under normal circumstances, this is good advice. It seems like the others are forgetting the circumstances of this scenario. Deathfight, 1v3. The mechs are pre-determined for it. Stalker vs. P-Hawk & 2 bugs. I choose a Wasp & Stinger so that the 3 could all move together. There is no Battlemaster coming to distract the enemy away from the bugs. Their biggest mech is the P-Hawk, and while more durable than the bugs, it will only be able to take a few volleys from a Stalker before being brought down. The Wasp and Stinger both can deal a max of 9 damage per turn. That is so little and most of the time they won't even be getting that. Maybe a single ML each turn if they're lucky. People are getting so caught up in the numbers game that they're forgetting just how dangerous a Stalker is, and just how quickly a Stalker can even out those numbers.

>>96418624
It's also a very small battlefield, in normal circumstances if two bugs and a pixie are approaching a Stalker, it'll be part of a larger battle on multiple mapsheets and there's a good chance the Stalker won't be able to guard its flank approaches with a map corner.

>Anon does a "test"
>Map is set up with terrain favouring one side
>Anon plays the other side poorly
>The side with an advantage rolls 3 separate TACs

Yeah good test everyone, results conclusive, case adjourned.

>>96418261
You're a lil whiney piss baby and you know that isn't true.

I just like light mechs, wasps and stingers in particular.

>>96418727
I see a Wasp, Stinger, and Locust. Find a Phoenix Hawk and Stalker kicking around whatever bucket you keep your mechs in and play a few rounds.

>>96418518
That is a very important note for the results.

>>96418727
Post your results then.

The Stalker is a 3/5 up against a partial lance of 6/9s and 5/8s with jumps. If it 'got the high ground early' its because you GAVE it the high ground.

At least the autistic "Timber Wolf can solo a lance" tests are talking about a mech that is fast enough to partially dictate where it fights.

>>96418727
>you know that isn't true.
The results of my test didn't come out the way you wanted them to, so you call me a liar who rigged the test.
Again, take your meds Manic.

>>96418896
3/5 is fast enough to ascend two levels in a single turn.

>>96418727
He also mentioned here
>>96418518
That the Stalker wasn’t even a 3/5 pilot like the initial scenario proposed, so even without the fortunate crits it would still kill the bugs just as fast because it would be hitting way more often. You’re just mad because the fight didn’t go the way you insisted it would.

anybody else going to battletech on the battleship next month?